Hamas attack on Israel

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Originally Posted by jamie_1875

Great, so when you see him saying "death to every single IDF soldier" what do you think he means?

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As I said I can see what you see as important by what you are posting and here you are again.

Given the history of sloganeering I'm tended to think he meant....


"We are not for the death of Jews, Arabs, or any other race or group of people, We are for the dismantling of a violent military machine — a machine whose own soldiers were told to use ‘unnecessary lethal force’ against innocent civilians waiting for aid. A machine that has destroyed much of Gaza.”


Are you aware of The Situationists concept of "The Spectacle"?

It's a theory which in general means what is delivered to us via the mass media is very different to real life.

IE

The troubles in Ireland started in real life as a civil rights issue around housing, discrimanatory employment restrictions and suffrage. The Spectacle insisted it was portrayed as merely "sectarian" - eg "what can we do it's a mindless religious tiff".

...and...

Look at the reported rape statistics for England and Wales this century.

https://www.statista.com/graphic/1/2...-and-wales.jpg


.....yet The Spectacle would have us believe that males presenting themselves as female is a vastly bigger problem than males pretending to be men.

You're either so sucked into the Spectacle you can't see it, or are intent on pushing it to the fore.

Bob Vylann isn't the real story here but I know you think it's very, very important.

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Originally Posted by Ozyhibby

We still talking about the rap guy?


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It's very very important.

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Originally Posted by Kato

It's very very important.

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Got to make sure support for the Palestinian people is cut off before Starmer and the pro-Israeli lobby are embarrassed

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Originally Posted by Kato

It's very very important.

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The most important thing for people unwilling to criticise the genocide. Watched an investigation into the October 7th attack and seems as if many of the claims of loads of babies being killed and mass sexual assaults reported worldwide weren’t backed up by any proof.

How very Labour to make much fuss about a comment while at the same time pay little to no attention to the daily murder of innocent civilians.

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Originally Posted by JimBHibees

The most important thing for people unwilling to criticise the genocide. Watched an investigation into the October 7th attack and seems as if many of the claims of loads of babies being killed and mass sexual assaults reported worldwide weren’t backed up by any proof.

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What happened on Oct 7th was horrendous and in no way am I going to support men of violence.

We also have to remember what is the first casualty of any war.

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Originally Posted by Ozyhibby

We still talking about the rap guy?

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Obviously, What some pr1ck of a rapper said is clearly the biggest issue of the day.

I see the IDF have now killed the only remaining medic from Gaza city hospital (along with a large number of family members).

IDF's press release called it 'a targeted attack on a terrorist'.


https://www.theguardian.com/global-development/2025/jul/02/shock-and-grief-as-senior-doctor-killed-in-israeli-airstrike-in-gaza

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Originally Posted by JimBHibees

The most important thing for people unwilling to criticise the genocide. Watched an investigation into the October 7th attack and seems as if many of the claims of loads of babies being killed and mass sexual assaults reported worldwide weren’t backed up by any proof.

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I'm sure it was an objective 'investigation'.

October 7th was horrific. There's no two ways about that. It just doesn't suit the narrative of those who seem hard wired to condemn only violence by Israel to acknowledge there's another violent organisation at play here.

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Originally Posted by He's here!

I'm sure it was an objective 'investigation'.

October 7th was horrific. There's no two ways about that. It just doesn't suit the narrative of those who seem hard wired to condemn only violence by Israel to acknowledge there's another violent organisation at play here.

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I don't think anyone is a cheerleader for or has been downplaying Hamas' involvement on here.

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Originally Posted by Kato

Pay attention.

It'll endure until the Kingdom of God's Chosen People encompasses all the land their holy book tells them they are entitled to. Maybe give the Babylonians a revenge kicking too.

Then Jesus will come back, defeat The Beast and we'll have a battle at Armageddon then the "The Rapture".

Sounds like superstitious claptrap eh, but this is the language of those in power.

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Blondie were playing on 6 Music's Huey show as I read your post (not Rapture but X Offender...still a good 'un to lift the spirits on a Saturday morning).

Yes, the whole mess is often attributed solely to the establishment of modern day Israel, but it's a conflict with Biblical roots. And hard line/settler Israelis will cite that as evidence the land was theirs in the first place.

I can still remember most of the lyrics from my primary school production of the Lloyd Webber musical Joseph. I had no idea what I was singing about back then but the song Close Every Door to Me touches on the whole Jewish narrative of persecution and resilience (...children of Israel are never alone, for we have been promised a land of our own...just give me a number and forget my name etc). Not sure if Sir Andrew is Jewish himself.

To extend my Biblical ramble a bit further...when we moved back to Edinburgh we rented a flat for a few months in Falcon Road and came upon a lot of surrounding streets with names like Canaan Lane, Nile Grove, Jordan Lane, Egypt Mews and Eden Lane. Clearly a theme there but the origins seem hard to establish.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c0k7n6kd8yxo

This is what gets the Labour govt hackles up in regard to Gaza. [emoji849]


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Originally Posted by jamie_1875

Yep, a single post to say actually he did mean death and not dismantle or reform and make the IDF kinder and nicer as was the story many on here spun.

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while i don't think he meant 'death' to mean 'reform', i also very much doubt that if you asked him 'would you like every member of the IDF to be executed' he would say yes. i think it was mainly intended as a maximally polemic statement in support of Palestine, primarily motivated by two things - anger at what the IDF have been doing, which is indeed beyond reproach (as is the way western governments and media outlets have enabled them), and the fact that 'F' and 'death', unfortunately (and technically only partially), rhyme. i'm not saying this was a constructive thing to say, at all - i just think everyone projects whatever they feel onto such statements.

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Originally Posted by He's here!

To extend my Biblical ramble a bit further...when we moved back to Edinburgh we rented a flat for a few months in Falcon Road and came upon a lot of surrounding streets with names like Canaan Lane, Nile Grove, Jordan Lane, Egypt Mews and Eden Lane. Clearly a theme there but the origins seem hard to establish.

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Back in the 1580's, there was an "Egypt Farm" in the area known as "Little Egypt".

Interesting story in this article
https://threadinburgh.scot/2022/10/0...ts-bible-belt/

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Originally Posted by Ozyhibby

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c0k7n6kd8yxo

This is what gets the Labour govt hackles up in regard to Gaza. [emoji849]


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.

And it’s Lisa Nandy doing the whining. Best ignored

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Originally Posted by speedy_gonzales

Back in the 1580's, there was an "Egypt Farm" in the area known as "Little Egypt".

Interesting story in this article
https://threadinburgh.scot/2022/10/0...ts-bible-belt/

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I think the area was also known as the Land of Canaan.

A bit further afield you'll find what was for a long time Scotland's only Jewish cemetery, just off Causewayside. It's tiny but you get a powerful vibe of olden times when you pass it. What's left of the area's wee fire station can also still be seen opposite. Historically Newington was home to quite big Jewish community, trading in textiles.

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Originally Posted by Kato

What happened on Oct 7th was horrendous and in no way am I going to support men of violence.

We also have to remember what is the first casualty of any war.

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Often overlooked in the haste to present propaganda as fact.

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Originally Posted by Hibspur

Often overlooked in the haste to present propaganda as fact.

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I know.

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Originally Posted by He's here!

I'm sure it was an objective 'investigation'.

October 7th was horrific. There's no two ways about that. It just doesn't suit the narrative of those who seem hard wired to condemn only violence by Israel to acknowledge there's another violent organisation at play here.

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I’m pretty sure I’m yet to hear anyone, anywhere attempt to justify or condone the attacks on October 7th.

It simply hasn’t happened, anywhere.

It’s perfectly possible for a sensible person to rigorously condemn and abhor those actions and then similarly be appalled when the response appears too severe. In fact, from where I’m looking, that’s exactly the opinion of every single sensible person.

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Originally Posted by Hibspur

I think the area was also known as the Land of Canaan.

A bit further afield you'll find what was for a long time Scotland's only Jewish cemetery, just off Causewayside. It's tiny but you get a powerful vibe of olden times when you pass it. What's left of the area's wee fire station can also still be seen opposite. Historically Newington was home to quite big Jewish community, trading in textiles.

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something I found very interesting is that Scotland actually has its own dialect of Yiddish - i would love to learn it! I've intermittently been learning on duolingo, as it's a truly amazing language and culture. (I've got a hot take on why it genuinely ought to be Europe's international language, but peoples' eyes tend to glaze over!)

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Originally Posted by Smartie

I’m pretty sure I’m yet to hear anyone, anywhere attempt to justify or condone the attacks on October 7th.

It simply hasn’t happened, anywhere.

It’s perfectly possible for a sensible person to rigorously condemn and abhor those actions and then similarly be appalled when the response appears too severe. In fact, from where I’m looking, that’s exactly the opinion of every single sensible person.

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I'd like to agree but I do pick up on insinuations to the effect that October 7th 'wasn't that bad'. Hint of anti-Semitism about it coupled by ignorance of the wider context in the Middle East. Celebs like Dawn French have been guilty of that:

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cgmjdpme470o

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Originally Posted by He's here!

I'd like to agree but I do pick up on insinuations to the effect that October 7th 'wasn't that bad'. Hint of anti-Semitism about it coupled by ignorance of the wider context in the Middle East. Celebs like Dawn French have been guilty of that:

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cgmjdpme470o

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Oct 7th was horrific and every day since then have also been horrific.


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Originally Posted by He's here!

I'd like to agree but I do pick up on insinuations to the effect that October 7th 'wasn't that bad'. Hint of anti-Semitism about it coupled by ignorance of the wider context in the Middle East. Celebs like Dawn French have been guilty of that:

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cgmjdpme470o

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An article where she calls it a “brutal, unthinkable, unforgivable, savage attack”?

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Originally Posted by He's here!

I'd like to agree but I do pick up on insinuations to the effect that October 7th 'wasn't that bad'. Hint of anti-Semitism about it coupled by ignorance of the wider context in the Middle East. Celebs like Dawn French have been guilty of that:

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cgmjdpme470o

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Does Dawn French post on here? Hiya Dawn...

It's this thread that was being discussed and you drag the BBC into it, again.

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Originally Posted by He's here!

I'm sure it was an objective 'investigation'.

October 7th was horrific. There's no two ways about that. It just doesn't suit the narrative of those who seem hard wired to condemn only violence by Israel to acknowledge there's another violent organisation at play here.

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No one says it wasn’t horrific. Summary of an investigation carried out by New York Times.

https://prospect.org/world/2024-03-2...-on-october-7/

I see that David Draiman - he of signing Israeli shells fame - played in the Black Sabbath farewell yesterday, to absolutely no opposition from the Labour Govt at all.

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Originally Posted by DaveF

I see that David Draiman - he of signing Israeli shells fame - played in the Black Sabbath farewell yesterday, to absolutely no opposition from the Labour Govt at all.

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No surprise there.

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Originally Posted by DaveF

I see that David Draiman - he of signing Israeli shells fame - played in the Black Sabbath farewell yesterday, to absolutely no opposition from the Labour Govt at all.

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The crowd at least mostly let them know what they thought of him!

Cancelling musicians is so haphazard - Kneecap not allowed to play TRNSMT but of course Chris Brown, repeated violent domestic abuser, headlines Hampden last week. Different crimes I hear you cry? Absolutely, but Marilyn Manson, accused of the same crimes as Chris Brown (don’t think he’s been legally charged, albeit repeatedly accused) had his gig in Brighton pulled last week after concerns raised by local councillors.

The entire cancel culture of artists is so inconsistent. It’s bull****.

I wouldn’t want to see Disturbed being banned from playing gigs: but i absolutely would never go see them again.

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Originally Posted by Sylar

The crowd at least mostly let them know what they thought of him!

Cancelling musicians is so haphazard - Kneecap not allowed to play TRNSMT but of course Chris Brown, repeated violent domestic abuser, headlines Hampden last week. Different crimes I hear you cry? Absolutely, but Marilyn Manson, accused of the same crimes as Chris Brown (don’t think he’s been legally charged, albeit repeatedly accused) had his gig in Brighton pulled last week after concerns raised by local councillors.

The entire cancel culture of artists is so inconsistent. It’s bull****.

I wouldn’t want to see Disturbed being banned from playing gigs: but i absolutely would never go see them again.

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Good to read that the crowd gave it to the prick.

Was going to mention Manson last week but I suppose that's for a whole new thread and I don't want to deflect away from Starmer and co's selective amnesia when it comes to cancelling bands.

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Originally Posted by cabbageandribs1875

138 Palestinians killed the previous 24 hours, slaughtered

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Some of the videos on social media are horrific, kids shot while they played on their bikes in the streets, so sad.

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Originally Posted by Smartie

An article where she calls it a “brutal, unthinkable, unforgivable, savage attack”?

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That's her apology for the video she released. In the video itself it was the whiny baby-like tone she adopted in relation to October the 7th which got people's hackles up. Just made her look pretty ignorant.