Coz they ken they will be getting it aff the managers associates if they dinnaeQuote:
Originally Posted by MWHIBBIES
That's what we need
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Coz they ken they will be getting it aff the managers associates if they dinnaeQuote:
Originally Posted by MWHIBBIES
That's what we need
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I really don't see it mate.Quote:
Originally Posted by Callum_62
After the loss at ER to them, it was still not bad because we had top six and they had relegation to still fight.
Season finished early, bottom six, it was still no over reaction to another poor season because they got relegated.
Semi final, you can never over react to a Scottish Cup Semi loss to our Championship neighbors in they circumstances. Especially having been hammered in the Semi and Final off them before, at least then there was major excuses and this time was chance for revenge. We blew it.
Now we are being horsed at home to guff. I want to at least see our team fight if we are being outplayed and there's not even been that at times and at times it's been shambolic.
I want a few brilliant performances and a big win or two per season where we over perform. It's not too much to ask. Liverpool may have lost 7-2 but they still won many big games, gave their support memorable matches and won the league. We haven't had any of that at Easter Road especially since when? Aberdeen over a year ago and even then it's only Aberdeen. The last time we won a match a derby or the old firm at Easter Road, the place 14,000 plus pay for season cards was Celtic in December 2018. That's really worth whinging about imo.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MWHIBBIES
They won 7 in a row, we are playing *****, they have just hammered us under their new manager and have two games in hand. Just like there was little doubt they would win yesterday, they play as an actual football side playing for each other and their manager. We are playing as a team of individuals kicking about chewing the fat.
What was the score when we last played them?Quote:
Originally Posted by Hermit Crab
Right, so again, its basically just them having a great run and us having a bad week. If it was a 7 game season, I'd agree with you. Its not, though.Quote:
Originally Posted by The 90+2
Absolutely this. We are on well on course for Europe thus far, clearer in that respect than I can ever remember us.Quote:
Originally Posted by Callum_62
Also worth mentioning that the prize on offer for 3rd and 4th in terms of round of competition we enter is exactly the same.
A few disappointing results along the way in amongst generally a great consistency in winning games and a great chance to win a cup - that is what the manager has delivered. He's done a cracking job IMO.
It is draining coming on here to defend things constantly - the reaction and general feeling at times on here is as if we were drifting around aimlessly in the bottom 6.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MWHIBBIES
They are in much better form and look a much better side under their new manager. They are going one way and we are going the other way. They have just caught 9 points up over us in the last 3 games also, I don't see how that trend doesn't continue.
If it was the other way and we had won 7 on the bounce under a new manager, hammered them yesterday and 9 points behind with two games in hand would you not be extremely confident of catching them? I know I would especially if they where on a slide before said pumping.
Yes, I'd be confident of catching them.Quote:
Originally Posted by The 90+2
Its quite clear how the trend doesn't continue. They get a couple injuries, lose some of the harder fixtures, we sign a couple players etc. We were 18 points clear of them a week ago. They've hit a good patch, we have it a bad one. Martindale has been in charge for years, he isn't really new. He'll hit a bad patch soon and have no one to blame it on. If you don't think form will switch back around, Livi will finish second and we'll be relegated. But neither of those is doing to happen.
Seriously mate, we've had a shocker this week, no doubt. We're not suddenly a pub team. I remember similar hysteria about them finishing above us before Hecky came in. We finished 10 ahead.
Hermit Crap.Quote:
Originally Posted by Baader
That answers your question then :greengrinQuote:
Originally Posted by MWHIBBIES
I agree with the rest that anything can happen. Lets wait and see. :aok:
I'd mainly be confident because we'd have much better players. Thats also why I'm confident we'll find our form and theirs will fall off.Quote:
Originally Posted by The 90+2
Our form in general always tails off after the new year. They finished ahead of us despite us having better players but they play as a better well drilled, hungry team.Quote:
Originally Posted by MWHIBBIES
I hope we do find our form again. I can't see it this month though and with the Semi coming up it's really concerning. Come Monday evening its extremely realistic than we will only be 6 ahead of them with them having 2 games in hand, we will have lost 4 on the bounce and them won 8.
If he had done a cracking job, a large chunk of the support wouldnt be seriously unhappy with him. There was a post on here after the ross county game defending Ross, and yesterday the guy who posted it admitted he did not watch the livi game........Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobby's Cinema
Thats the problem, too many people who "check the result, but dont actually watch" cast judgements and tell you everything is fine, they aint watching and dont really know how bad the tactics, game plan and general style is.
After the game the Livi manager said he'd watched us a fair bit and had a plan to beat us, Ross was out schooled yesterday. He double/triple manned and played a high press high energy game, our players just cannot play with that, they need far too much time on the ball, we've been sussed and there's no plan B.Quote:
Originally Posted by The 90+2
I’m not happy with the past two results, they have been dire. Ross has to look at himself and ask as to the wisdom of signing Murphy, Magennis and S McGinn. Three wages, they have barely contributed and now the squad looks particularly threadbare.
Tbh, I have no idea how the next half of the season will pan out. The team confound me, just when you think you’ve seen enough to know we will be fine, then bang.
If you take the away Rangers, Celtic and Aberdeen, all of whom are consistently performing at a level commensurate with investment etc, the rest of the sides have all had good and bad runs. In reality there’s not too much to choose between any of them at any one time. Over the course of the season the less dire will be separated. To me that says our league is just varying degrees of dross.
That all said, I have to laugh at the predictions of doom, Livi will overtake us. No, I very much doubt it. If they do, then Martindale should be the next Hibs manager. Ridiculous but probably more likely than Livi finishing above us.
Exactly. People are acting like Livingston are Barcelona, they’re a decent hard working team, but we wouldn’t swap many of our players for theirs. Hibs on the other hand are a decent team on a bad run and we don’t have enough fit players to change things up when others aren’t performing. The one thing that did worry me was quite a few players looked out on their feet in the last two games, fitness looked poor compared to the teams we were playing.Quote:
Originally Posted by MWHIBBIES
Quote:
Originally Posted by J-C
Yeah I heard that, he made it sound so simple also. Turn up at a ground who have better players and have a plan to win the game having studied them. You can bet Yogi and JC have done the same plenty times this season before he took over up North and got a similar result. The rest is spot on too. Pressed we panic and there's literally no plan B.
Hiya pal! That’s me you’re talking about! What you don’t seem to realise is that I did watch the 5 games in the build up to the County game as well as watching a large chunk of games this season. So with respect, I think my opinion is as valid as anyone’s else’s.Quote:
Originally Posted by #2 Double Tap
Also, if you actually read the thread it was not a thread defending Jack Ross, it was a thread asking for posters to have a bit more of a wide angle viewpoint rather than having a total meltdown after one game which is what was happening.
My take on this season is that we have won well, won badly, lost well, lost badly and drawn both deservedly and undeservedly. Pretty much like every season we’ve had in my 27 of Hibs supporting.
So the people who agree with you must be watching the games whereas anyone who disagrees with you isn’t watching the game.Quote:
Originally Posted by #2 Double Tap
I’ve watched every single minute of hibs this season yet I’m not pissing myself with rage like half the posters on here.
If you watched all the games you surely cant be encouraged by our style of play. What about our summer signings.....how many years have we needed a central midfield, why have we still not got one?Quote:
Originally Posted by 660
They signed 3 players to play there this year and we still dont have a CM.
Jones28, yes it was you, and fair play to you, but if you had watched all those games how can you be encouraged by what you have seen?
Have we progressed from last year? I will give you the 4th position looks better, but in regards to playing style or game management? What about the managers best starting 11, do you think he knows what it is yet?
The best 11 thing does my head in. If we had a manager that rigidly stuck to his best 11 he’d be getting stick on here. Every game requires a different approach and sometimes that means different personnel, we can’t play the same way against the huns at ibrox as we’d play at home to Hamilton. Add in suspensions, injuries and players out of form and it’s just a sound byte. His best 11 could change throughout the season.Quote:
Originally Posted by #2 Double Tap
That is a bloody joke, should be in for extra training.Quote:
Originally Posted by Since452
Only if you want extra injuries.Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe6-2
You are right about the starting 11 changing, yet we all know every team has a best 11, maybe its tweaked for a couple of formations or the player role is altered inside a system but everyone has "their best team".Quote:
Originally Posted by lord bunberry
take our best right back, clearly Mcginn. yet who is the best left back? What about CM?
I appreciate what you are saying, but feel we still have too many questions with regard to this team.
The levels of fitness now far exceed what they were in the past, I agree it is now imperative to have at least a strong 14 for a game with the aim to use utilise that number in every match, rotation now plays a bigger part than it previously did, you cannot get the maximum performance even from your best players in a tight fixture schedule, in fact I see it as a leveller.Quote:
Originally Posted by lord bunberry
How about the squad and coaches in East Mains reviewing the film of yesterday's match and Jack Ross using that time coaching the team while watching the film to improve them.Quote:
Originally Posted by MWHIBBIES
The team to me look absolutely knackered, mentally and physically. Whether or not you think that's acceptable is not really important, they look like they need a rest and a few days away from their jobs.
Having a few days off is probably the best thing right now.
Well we were relegation candidates up until JR took over so yes, we have improved drastically. I don’t know by what measure we haven’t improved and I you and I are on totally different planets if you can’t see that.Quote:
Originally Posted by #2 Double Tap
How can the manage know the best starting 11 when we have to chop and change constantly? Injuries haven’t been bad but they have kept various players out for a week or two here and there. IMO the team that started against Rangers should have been the team that started against RC.
I really don’t see how 3 and 4 nil away from home to Motherwell and Accies respectively can have negatives. We were also unbeaten in 9 before the Rangers game I believe, it isn’t as bad as what is being made out. It’s proven by the league table. Style, well I give you some concessions there because the balance of the midfield isn’t quite right, we desperately need a McGinn type in there to tie things together.
Why would they be knackered and in need of a break more than the Livingston or Ross County players?Quote:
Originally Posted by Since90+2
Think we’ve played something like 15 games since 31st Oct. That’s going to take it’s toll.Quote:
Originally Posted by Since90+2
Not sure how that compares to other teams, i know Livi had a break last midweek as their game was cancelled.
Maybe our squad isn’t as fit as theirs or maybe they’ve managed to rotate their squads better. I don’t like it either, but the players looked in dire need of a break and having them back doing double sessions like some have suggested would be counterproductive. Maybe the coaching team can be at work looking at ways to improve the fitness of the squad.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfred E Newman
Livi have played 12 games including yesterday since 31st Oct to our 15.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfred E Newman
Ross Co have played 14 in that period.
We don't know the individual circumstances of our players verses other squads.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfred E Newman
We do however know one of our main players suffered a family tragedy a day or two before our biggest game of the season for instance and has played pretty much non stop since. Doidge has spoken previously about living alone and away from his family. I know a few of the players have had children fairly recently and the added stresses that brings even without covid. I'm sure there will be other things we aren't aware of.
I just think the players look like they need a break. People need to realise that they are human beings too and the past year has been very difficult for everyone, professional football players included.
The idea to get them back in to do double sessions as some sort of punishment would achieve nothing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jones28
We can defo agree on the midfield! this is a good start. haha
In terms of improvement, I mean since JR took over, the signings he has made, our style, how we see out games.......these have not improved this year imo.
sure those lanarkshire wins are defo positives, just like the livi away game was and how we came back against the huns at ER........but what about the other games......early in the season that game at united we won 1-0, that was dreadful, the collapse in the last 10 mins against celtic, hamilton coming back at us at easter road- scoring 2 in the last 15mins although we did win.......motherwell 0-0 at home, we got bossed that day......the st johnston game the week after was almost as dire as the united game......
I suppose you are right when you say up and down like results, but it feels like there are more downs and the signs that we are headed in the right direction are few and far between.........
We could improve so much, but after watching us sign or loan 12 CMers over the last few years we still cant field 2 that most people feel confident about. That is a sad state of affairs.
May I suggest that we're feeling bored because football is actually quite boring once you take away the social side of it?Quote:
Originally Posted by #2 Double Tap
You can suggest all you like, but thats not why its boring.....its boring because the play is so slow and predictable.......the players look unhappy, no one is enjoying themselves playing right now.Quote:
Originally Posted by HFCEighteen75
Check out mallan, his body lanuage and facial expressions look like alfredo morales's, remember when he first signed and was scoring all those goals, grinning from ear to ear, nisbet looks unhappy as well just now.......for a team that is not boring and doing really well (as some poster allude to) why do some of the players appear as if the have no confidence or drive?
Frank Lampard is doing worse than Jack Ross
If anyone doenst think we are in a better place that when Ross walked in the door is surely on the wind up
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Maybe they’re feeling a bit down because of the current situation? They have kids and families after all. They’re not paid to run around with a smile on their face for 90 minutes.Quote:
Originally Posted by #2 Double Tap
Quote:
Originally Posted by Callum_62
I don't think anyone has suggested that.
We could and should be in a better place though.
Don’t think anybody has said that have they?Quote:
Originally Posted by Callum_62
No but there paid to have us challenging for top 4 and into the later rounds of the cupQuote:
Originally Posted by hibsbollah
Oh.
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I believe #2 double tap is suggesting thatQuote:
Originally Posted by bingo70
4th place "looks better" but but but
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Maybe they should look into a different profession then?Quote:
Originally Posted by hibsbollah
They really don't know how lucky they are.
Fair enough.Quote:
Originally Posted by Callum_62
Clearly we are miles better than we were under Heckingbottom but more still needed IMO.
I think people want excitement, not slow and steady progress.
Tbf, I think I kind of agree. Watching football alone on the telly doesn’t do much for me in terms of whiling away an evening. Like many things, when you step back a bit from it, football is ultimately ridiculous.Quote:
Originally Posted by HFCEighteen75
Are you saying they need to look happy? Smiling?Quote:
Originally Posted by Coco Bryce
Souness snarled through games. I don’t think looking like they’ve just knocked back some MDMA at kickoff would do much for their ‘enforcer hard man’ status.
Also, the players Union might get involved. You can’t be getting sacked for looking miserable at work. There’d be nobody working in financial services otherwise.
I think the direction of the criticism has gone a bit bonkers to be honest.
I would be happier with slow, steady, continual progress. We need to get away from the boom to bust trend that we have seen for decades. Let's get ourselves to a level that we SHOULD be at and stick there. We should be no lower than 5th and competing at the latter stages of the cups pretty much every year. How many times do we do ok for a couple of seasons and then spend the next few struggling?Quote:
Originally Posted by bingo70
Fair point 😂Quote:
Originally Posted by hibsbollah
They should always have an urge to win though surely.
Substitute Ross for any Hibs Manager over the last 30 odd years and there is not one person on this board who would disagree, these are frequently aired complaints about every one of them (Ross included)Quote:
Originally Posted by thebausburst
I am not convinced by Ross, but there are signs of a bandwagon forming here with all sorts of justifications for replacing him, just as surely as a similar bandwagon will form for his successor and the ones after that.
Given the choice between watching Ross look contemplatively at his team's shortcomings and the baboon like behaviour of Hughes & Lennon on the touchline, to name but two, I would choose Ross.
The time he resorts to the selection bingo of those two clowns is when it will be time for him to go.
In amongst a long-lasting litany of utter tripe and anti-Hibs posts from you over many years that is a new low even for you.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hermit Crab
I don't believe for a minute you are a Jambo, but you certainly behave like one and exhibit the same lack of intellect and a total absence of self-awareness.
Bad performances but still getting wins is a good thing though?Quote:
Originally Posted by #2 Double Tap
I’m not pretending we have been swashbuckling this season, but there have only been a few times in the last 2 decades where we could say the football has been sublime and the results have matched the quality. With JR the football has been probably just above average in terms of quality but very positive on the whole with regards to results. This season was dealt a really bad hand, but we are a couple of players away from challenging for third and pushing Celtic.
Your post above is just SOOOO HOACHING with negativity it's hard to pick anything out in particular - just the whole middle paragraph is a determined campaign to try to make positives into negatives but WHY??? We have two big fat genuine negatives in the last two pishy results - so why the urge to invent more where they do not exist?Quote:
Originally Posted by #2 Double Tap
The knack we had found earlier this season of "finding a way to win" even when not playing well is a massive positive for any team. If you refuse to see it that way then it's no surprise that you're failing to see anything else positive about Jack Ross' reign so far. For my money he's not the messiah but is more than decent as a manager and has more than earned the wriggle room to navigate out of the recent patch of rocky form.
Where we were in Jack Ross took over us notthe barrometer. Neither is an EPL manager.Quote:
Originally Posted by Callum_62
Needless post.Quote:
Originally Posted by BSEJVT
How is where we were when Jack Ross took over not relevant?Quote:
Originally Posted by Allez Hibs
Do you think you only need a window or 2 to totally revamp a totally underperforming team?
Interesting post match discussion started by Lampard right now.... Almost seems relevant to us
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Because we are Hibs. That is reason alone to challenge the ambition of the club and the leadership of Jack Ross. Hibs are massive in a Scottish Football context and we are now staring not winning a league Cup with a semi final against St Johnstone where the other semi final is St Mirren v Livingston Square in the face under Jack Ross. Is that really good enough? (please don't say ah well it's happened before)Quote:
Originally Posted by Callum_62
That's just waffle thoughQuote:
Originally Posted by Allez Hibs
Ofcourse the state of the side when a new manager takes over directly influences how quickly thing tend to improve
We are Hibs, there's always a chance we can lose a semi final to anybody
I watched us lose a league cup final to Ross County not so long ago and Livi many moons before that
If you think "because we are Hibs" means we can't lose to other teams in this league your going to be in a constant state of disappointment
We have every chance of winning the semi final.
I don't think there's a form table around that puts us below St Johnstone
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Quote:
Originally Posted by matty_f
So an admin is allowed to name call now? :confused:
Quote:
Originally Posted by matty_f
At Parkhead? 3-0 and we never had a shot on target that day. At Easter rd 2-2 another Hanlon screw up cost us 2 points but you already knew that anyway.
Might be best to read people's posts properly before replying with such a Hibs blinkered point of view. We have fans with a more pragmatic point of view too.Quote:
Originally Posted by Callum_62
If you post attention seeking nonsense then you get attention.Quote:
Originally Posted by Allez Hibs
Your surley no greetin about that after the Jack Dross/Jack Loss rubbish you've been postingQuote:
Originally Posted by Hermit Crab
I may be assuming too much here but I don't believe for a second your actual name is Hermit Crab
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Are you really upset at that? I’ll delete it and apologise if you want but if you don’t like it then maybe think about the dreadful Jack Loss patter.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hermit Crab
LOLQuote:
Originally Posted by BSEJVT
How about Jack Dross at home then because thats what it is.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hermit Crab
I don't think Matty in any way was being serious at all.
Show me any form table that puts St Johnstone above usQuote:
Originally Posted by Allez Hibs
It makes your post about on the edge of blowing a cup by losing to St Johnstone seem reactionary over the top rubbish
Ofcourse, we could lose that semi but then, we could lose any match we play against an spl side
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Quote:
Originally Posted by matty_f
No I'm not, I'm a big boy.
Since, after so many years of virtual silence you're now all over the board like a rash, you can maybe answer my question about your other user name(s).Quote:
Originally Posted by Allez Hibs
So just faux outrage then?Quote:
Originally Posted by Hermit Crab
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jones28
I agree with you, playing **** and winning is a positive, but imo it requires a greater degree of luck
more often than not. If we are serious about making that push for third then we really need to get those
2 or 3 players in and start turning in better performances.
Perhaps I am just overly negative about jack ross, as basehibby stated in his post above. It stems from the derby defeats
I think and its hard to see how fellow supporters can be positive when basic stuff like the CM has still not been fixed, even
though the manager has signed 3 players who play there.
You turned up at the Scottish Cup parade and started supporting Hibs from then didn't you?Quote:
Originally Posted by Allez Hibs
Bragging aswell?Quote:
Originally Posted by Hermit Crab
To be serious, Jack needs Jan to bolster the team, if we still havent improved or held 4th then his position needs to be looked at, we already had a decent amount spent on players recently,and how much time do we have to give him with the budget he has had.
Derby defeats are ***** mate, we all know that.Quote:
Originally Posted by #2 Double Tap
But that shouldn’t change the fact that there have been circumstances around Jack Ross’s time in charge at Hibs that have never been seen before and hopefully never will be again. If we are basing our opinions on managers on derby results then we wil struggle to find anyone bar Stubbs and McLeish that have an above average record in them, and that’s been the case for as long as I’ve been a Hibs fan.
I’m not asking for him not to be scrutinised, but for the board to explode the way it has over the last 2 games has been ridiculous.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jones28
Its not just the last 2 games though is it. You know that though, someone posted on here earlier stating that under JR we have only won 2 of 14 of what Hibs fans call big games, some of the defeats in those big games have been by a shocking scoreline as well. 1-3 at home to Hearts for example.
Are we going to bring that game up every time he loses? He is basically doomed if we're still holding that against him.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hermit Crab
Yes, certain people will. Then the next manager gets the same treatment and so on.Quote:
Originally Posted by MWHIBBIES
Still, some people have been able to fill the last couple of days with some time on here when we usually get the odd comment towards the end of games.
I’m sure they are highly successful people in their own right given their meticulous standards.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MWHIBBIES
Are we just going to ignore these games then? Losing derbies is never acceptable but the manner in which we've lost them and other big games is shocking. This is something that needs to improve quickly.
What's the point? We probably won't play them again this season.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hermit Crab
"Losing derbies is never acceptable"? :confused:Quote:
Originally Posted by Hermit Crab
It's going to happen. We will lose derbies. Even if we had a good derby record it would happen. You are being petulant in the extreme if you can't accept losing a derby now and then. Not that the two Ross lost were acceptable by the way. But just making a general point.
No, but you cannot rag on a manager forever for a bad result. They have to be forgotton at some point.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hermit Crab
No one is saying it is acceptable. I'm yet to see what not accepting a result actually does, though? Are you just going to stay mad about it forever? Do you expect him to back sacked for a result that happened a year ago?
I think Ross knows it needs to improve, I don't think he is sitting about doing nothing. Everyone at the club works every day to improve things.
Should Jack Ross go? No
Am I happy with Jack Ross? No, the team don't create enough because of his tactics and his recruitment is a tad iffy
Is Jack Ross the long term solution? On the evidence so far I would say no
It is unrealistic to expect the board sack him when we are fourth and in a semi, but I don't like watching us play under Jack Ross
If we lose our next 2 games then he’s in real trouble. I’m not expecting a win away to Celtic. Actually, they’ve picked up a bit and I expect us to get hammering. They rarely lose two games in a row.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bright_Hibee
Kilmarnock at home is a game I’d normally expect us to win but going by the last 2 home games we are in no form to expect anything like a win.
Then it’s the semi final we need a bit of form going into that game.
Hermit is being petulant if he can’t accept a derby defeat now and again but the last two derby defeats weren’t acceptable to you ?Quote:
Originally Posted by HFCEighteen75
Why’s he being petulant and you’re not??!!
:agree:Quote:
Originally Posted by WhileTheChief..
Folk are tying themselves in knots to try and suggest Jack Ross doesn’t actually have a bad record in big games.
Hibs manager remit..
Finish as high up league as possible - currently in 4th - strong start but form dipping. No Hearts in the league makes 4th an easier achievement compared to when they are in league.
(1st and 2nd would be exceptional - 3rd very good considering Aberdeen more established as a team).
Cups - latter stages (semi finals) - yes to Scottish cup but followed by a disappointing loss to main rivals and yes to league cup though a tricky opponent awaits and if we manage to win that Ross is 1 game away from a Hibs manager we will talk about for years to come. Struggled in league cup group stages - limited squad but was unbeaten - Alloa a struggle but also a win in the end.
Derbies - played 3 - won 1 - lost 2. The win was a good performance away from home. The loss at home was unacceptable and the semi final was a serious missed opportunity to play a woeful Celtic team in final.
Beating Aberdeen - played them x3 - won once 3-0 (Aberdeen awful - Hibs good at ER). Other games didn’t have Gogic available at ER due to Covid this season and away from home.
Old Firm - not managed a win yet - better results that Hecky managed against them especially at home - though probably should have beaten Celtic at home. Last time Hibs beat old firm was Dec 2018 ! (2v0 Celtic).
Beating the teams with less resources - his record here has been pretty consistent- especially away from home. Not only won games but scored a few goals in the process. Hibs home record has suffered though dropping points this season from winning positions and losing 2-0 and 3-0 this past week to bottom of the league and local rivals Livi.
This is the first time Ross has lost 3 in a row as Hibs manager - could easily be 4 with Celtic next.
A lot of people said when he got the job he drew too many games at Sunderland - he has definitely increased his win ratio at Hibs...
What he does need to do is start doing better in all areas still though considering the circumstances and it’s not all about stats.
An Old Firm win occasionally- rare to do but possible
Beating Aberdeen occasionally / ideally more regularly - Lennon and Hecky struggled with this and our record against Aberdeen is worse than Hearts in recent times. Needs to be seriously addressed. Lost x2 of the 4 games against them already this season.
Winning derbies - hard when they aren’t in same league !! Would be interesting to see how they got on if we played again (Scottish Cup draw?!) but wins in derbies give you credit in bank for upset performances (Ross county loss etc).
Beating the rest - with the resources we have should be happening more often than not - especially at home.
Cups...win the cup and will give the club a massive boost. Fail here and he will split the support even further.
Ross managerial record from Soccer base website.
TEAM FROM TO GAMES WON DRAWN LOST
Hibernian 15 Nov, 2019 Present 51 26 11 14
Sunderland 25 May, 2018 08 Oct, 2019 76 39 27 10
St Mirren 10 Oct, 2016 08 Jun, 2018 80 42 13 25
Alloa 15 Dec, 2015 11 Oct, 2016 35 14 8 13
I think the point is that no one likes defeat in the derby but most people get over it. They don’t harbour a grudge and refer to it constantly, even when the team is in good form and they don’t emerge from the shadows all triumphant and revel in posting pish when the team are going through a period of bad form. See the difference there?Quote:
Originally Posted by WhileTheChief..
I think the manner of defeat is sometimes forgotten - stats and results don’t always show the bulk perspective.Quote:
Originally Posted by superfurryhibby
The past week the performances were woeful - but not the derby.
The ER derby was woeful.
The semi final was so so..not woeful but not great.
If Hearts had won the cup the pressure on him would be far greater right now. Celtic did us and him a favour by winning that cup as the consequences aren’t worth thinking about.
Instead they maintained Hearts long long wait to win the league cup! Haha!
If it was an isolated poor result I’m sure people would have been over it by now. It’s not though and that’s why it constantly gets dragged up. It was a poor result to go alongside the home defeat last season - a game which we could have lost by 4 or 5 and had no complaints, the Aberdeen games this season where we have been woeful, our inability to beat either of the OF.Quote:
Originally Posted by superfurryhibby
In the big games under JR we’ve been really poor over the piece.
Check the difference between "a derby defeat now and again" and "losing a derby is never acceptable". Pathetic attempt at a gotcha. :rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by WhileTheChief..
Yes, the manner of a defeat is a factor. You’re right, the horrible performance at ER was as poor a derby as I remember and it rankled a lot. The Hampden one was a better performance. We weren’t as bad, but we all know we should have done better.Quote:
Originally Posted by GreenCastle
A few general points. This is Ross’s 4th managerial job. He been in the managerial business since December 2015. It probably says more about the modern game that someone could be in this position so quickly. Two successful jobs in his first three seasons, the onto two much bigger clubs.
Do we expect Ross to still be learning the job at this stage? Does that actually matter in terms of him understanding how he wants a team to play and how best to use the resources in terms of who he signs and how he deploys and man manages them (am I still allowed to use that term, lol)?
Do we stick by a manager and give them time to build or are the pressures so great that we ditch them like we did with Heckingbottom? He initially had a game plan, then it went to pot. He seemed hapless and out of his depth by the end.
Ross has two transfer windows. Most accept that this isn’t enough, albeit it depends where the baseline was set when you take over. Hibs were pretty dire in my view. He moved guys on and brought people in and has continued to do so. We are in a reasonable place at the moment, although we’re having a blip ( lets hope that’s what it is). So, do we stick with him for the next couple of windows and see if he can maintain improvement and get us to where we want to be? That in my view is pretty universally endorsed on here and we pretty much all agree on what that would look like.
P. W. D. L
Alloa Athletic- 34 13 8 13
St Mirren- 80 42 13 25
Sunderland- 75 38 27 10
Hibernian- 51 26 11 14
Hertz were bottom of the league when they came to ER and could not buy a win yet totally destroyed us, it was no fluke result on the night!Quote:
Originally Posted by HFCEighteen75
So it was not a fluke and you then have to ask what went wrong? Manager tactics, manager not got his team ready/up for it etc, I think JR has to take quite a bit of the blame along with the pathetic performances from most of our players.
Derby's ARE more important than most games and need to be treated as such, as they are across the road.
HC is not alone in keeping the result and performance that night in his mind, I know I do.
The semi performance seems worse than it was because we lost. We were by and large the best team. As the conditions got worse it became a lottery. They scored a penalty and we didn't. First half in particular it was one way traffic at times. The last two performances have been really poor. The three or four before that pretty good. I'm not panicking yet.
I thought we played ok in the semi but poor finishing let us down and Hearts took their chance when it came. The league defeat was a different story and very similar to the last two horror shows where the defence imploded.Quote:
Originally Posted by hibeerealist
We were led to believe the defensive weakness had been addressed in the summer and early results this season suggested that ,but last weeks shockers show that the same old weakness exists.
:agree:Quote:
Originally Posted by Since452
The last two games were horrendous, there isn't really any other way of putting it. I honestly think those two games in isolation were as bad as anything we saw under Butcher.
Bigger picture though, I think we remain well placed for a good season. We have a great chance of silverware with the league cup, and then a Scottish Cup campaign to get underway later in the year.
We are also well placed for European football through our league spot.
Usually 4th place and a semi final would be seen as a decent to good season for us, we're on track for that and have a chance of bettering it.
I think we're the third highest scorers in the league and (IIRC) we have scored 3 or more goals every 4 or 5 matches, on average, this season (I am using stats quoted to me from my son, and haven't fact checked them personally).
Yup. Also the first time we've lost back to back league games under Ross. The huge meltdown shows how accustomed we've become to picking up results under him. I. No way am I defending Saturday but we'll still pick up more points than most between now and the end of the season.Quote:
Originally Posted by matty_f
The semi performance could only be considered worse if Hearts had won the cup.Quote:
Originally Posted by Since452
The performance wasn’t exactly great and a lot of the game I was thinking come on Hibs we can play better and Hearts are here for the taking.
Of course the game could have gone either way and closer than some derbies but at the same time we severely missed an opportunity to beat our rivals, at Hampden for the 1st ever time and reach a final with the financial incentives and chance to win the cup again.
I posted this before but if we were to play Hearts again in a few weeks - would you be confident ? Personally I don’t think this team has the mentality / quality to beat them. I don’t rate Hearts but they have a few experienced pros who know how to get the job done dragging others with them.
It's a good point. I was impressed with the fight Hearts showed in the final and second half and against us and I definitely think we're lacking when things become a battle. Biggest thing that needs addressed for me.Quote:
Originally Posted by GreenCastle
Agree entirelyQuote:
Originally Posted by Since452
Not an accusation that could have been levelled against the cup winning team
Just goes to show the character of signings is nearly as important as their abilities
It’s all very well signing a team of bright young things but they need a robust gallusness about them to grab games by the throat when required
The cup winning team that lost a final a few weeks earlier to Ross County and lost to Falkirk in the play offs?Quote:
Originally Posted by BSEJVT