Scotrail

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Originally Posted by Sylar

I definitely don't blame them for what's gone before JMS and I don't necessarily blame them entirely here either. But the fact of the matter is that the service is as bad as it's ever been right now, and I don't see any plans or suggestions that it's going to improve under the SG ownership model (so far!).

You're spot on that previous failure in investment and a lack of ownership over the actual infrastructure are massive barriers to what can realistically be done within cost, but they've downgraded the service with those same constraints compared to the previous owners by quite some margin.

I'm not using this as any kind of hammer to beat the Government for political argument - this is an area I'd really like them to succeed in, because their climate change ambitions are great and I want to see them achieve those goals. It would also be great for me on a personal level to be able to get from my home town into and out of work/the city without it costing me more than fuel (although that's debatable in recent months), and without fear that I'm going to get stranded due to ongoing issues.

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Sorry, I didn't mean to personalise that. I just can't see how it can be made to work practically and therefore I think it's daft politically. It's just going to end up a larger version of the ferries and Prestwick. :dunno:

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Originally Posted by JeMeSouviens

Sorry, I didn't mean to personalise that. I just can't see how it can be made to work practically and therefore I think it's daft politically. It's just going to end up a larger version of the ferries and Prestwick. :dunno:

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We got 500 million extra through Barnet for crossrail and 270 million for hs2. Although that could have been used for more important social things, but money was given

Thought the Alcohol ban was to help with Covid?

https://twitter.com/scotrail/status/...RtaiBaCZzmv5Eg

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Originally Posted by SteveHFC

Thought the Alcohol ban was to help with Covid?

https://twitter.com/scotrail/status/...RtaiBaCZzmv5Eg

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If the government are now more involved in this decision making then there would seem to be less chance of it changing. Either way, sounds like it's here to stay.

Although I imagine in the right train environment you'll get away with it.

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Originally Posted by danhibees1875

If the government are now more involved in this decision making then there would seem to be less chance of it changing. Either way, sounds like it's here to stay.

Although I imagine in the right train environment you'll get away with it.

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Ridiculous, and totally disproportionate.

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Originally Posted by SteveHFC

Thought the Alcohol ban was to help with Covid?

https://twitter.com/scotrail/status/...RtaiBaCZzmv5Eg

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Aye they are talking pish it was a temporary covid measure. Said at the time gov will try to cling onto some restrictions as long as possible. If people or businesses are still using covid to behave now, then they will never get back to normal

ScotRail
@ScotRail
· Nov 15, 2020
From tomorrow, alcohol will be banned in all ScotRail stations and on all of our trains. This is a temporary measure to help ensure physical distancing while you’re travelling with us throughout COVID-19.

No-one getting even more drunk on trains any more? Gutted.

Deal done with drivers. 5%


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Originally Posted by Ozyhibby

Deal done with drivers. 5%


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As mentioned already on this thread the Scottish Government have made a rod for their own back taking the railways back into public hands. Every single other public sector industry will ask for 5% and I can't see how the SG can turn that request down.

How long do we reckon until all trains are driverless. More and more countries are increasing the amount of driverless tracks covered. London is planning to have all its underground sections of its network underground. Glasgows subway will be driverless soon with testing begun.

A decade or so?

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Originally Posted by Diclonius

No-one getting even more drunk on trains any more? Gutted.

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Agreed. Personally quite happy with that but appreciate others will feel differently.

Everyone still drinks on the train and quite openly, like Mhairi Black

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Originally Posted by Since90+2

As mentioned already on this thread the Scottish Government have made a rod for their own back taking the railways back into public hands. Every single other public sector industry will ask for 5% and I can't see how the SG can turn that request down.

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EIS threatening strike action unless they get 10%....and so it begins. They should just give them the 5% now, I think kids have suffered enough disruption in the past 2 years.

https://www.eis.org.uk/Latest-News/President2022

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Originally Posted by Stairway 2 7

How long do we reckon until all trains are driverless. More and more countries are increasing the amount of driverless tracks covered. London is planning to have all its underground sections of its network underground. Glasgows subway will be driverless soon with testing begun.

A decade or so?

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Probably a bit more than that, which is part of the issue. Let's say it takes 15 years, I would imagine that takes a fair old chunk of the drivers into retirement age or very close to it, a very sizeable pension will also have been built up in that timescale. In other words, I don't think that will be a particular concern for the drivers.

If we were talking the next 5 years or so then maybe things would be different, but that's never going to happen.

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Originally Posted by Since90+2

Probably a bit more than that, which is part of the issue. Let's say it takes 15 years, I would imagine that takes a fair old chunk of the drivers into retirement age or very close to it, a very sizeable pension will also have been built up in that timescale. In other words, I don't think that will be a particular concern for the drivers.

If we were talking the next 5 years or so then maybe things would be different, but that's never going to happen.

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It's still a worry, then 10 years after that all the car and busses driving jobs

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Originally Posted by Stairway 2 7

Everyone still drinks on the train and quite openly, like Mhairi Black

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It’s the unopened bit I take issue with. Before we moved in together, I was getting the train to my partner’s old place for the weekend and got a bottle of wine on way to Waverley. My bag was full so I put the wine in the water bottle pouch on the side of my backpack and the ticket conductor told me I’d have to leave the train after Haymarket because of it… I was getting off at South Gyle anyway but it was a piece of absolute nonsense. What harm is an unopened bottle of wine in a backpack pouch doing?

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Originally Posted by Stairway 2 7

It's still a worry, then 10 years after that all the car and busses driving jobs

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You should look at it as freeing those people up to do other more productive work.


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Originally Posted by overdrive

It’s the unopened bit I take issue with. Before we moved in together, I was getting the train to my partner’s old place for the weekend and got a bottle of wine on way to Waverley. My bag was full so I put the wine in the water bottle pouch on the side of my backpack and the ticket conductor told me I’d have to leave the train after Haymarket because of it… I was getting off at South Gyle anyway but it was a piece of absolute nonsense. What harm is an unopened bottle of wine in a backpack pouch doing?

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That's ridiculous and would stop anyone coming back with duty free then using Prestwicks trains. ******g jobsworth

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Originally Posted by danhibees1875

If the government are now more involved in this decision making then there would seem to be less chance of it changing. Either way, sounds like it's here to stay.

Although I imagine in the right train environment you'll get away with it.

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Is this a Scotrail rule only?

I’ve been on LNER to London loads since this was introduced and people have been drinking before we’ve even left Waverley every time.

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Originally Posted by Santa Cruz

EIS threatening strike action unless they get 10%....and so it begins. They should just give them the 5% now, I think kids have suffered enough disruption in the past 2 years.

https://www.eis.org.uk/Latest-News/President2022

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Weren’t they given 13.5% (over a three year period) the last time they threatened to strike, about three years ago?

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Originally Posted by Stubbsy90+2

Is this a Scotrail rule only?

I’ve been on LNER to London loads since this was introduced and people have been drinking before we’ve even left Waverley every time.

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I think it is although my brother's lot are heading down to Berwick on LNER tomorrow and it's been designated a dry train between Aberdeen and Newcastle.

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Originally Posted by HUTCHYHIBBY

I think it is although my brother's lot are heading down to Berwick on LNER tomorrow and it's been designated a dry train between Aberdeen and Newcastle.

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I’ve never had a drink on these trains so I’ve never looked into whether these were dry or not. If they were then there was certainly nobody enforcing it.

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Originally Posted by HUTCHYHIBBY

I think it is although my brother's lot are heading down to Berwick on LNER tomorrow and it's been designated a dry train between Aberdeen and Newcastle.

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There has been dry trains on a Friday between Aberdeen and Newcastle for a long time.

When I used to travel down from Aberdeen regularly, I always made sure I wasn't on one.

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Originally Posted by Lendo

Weren’t they given 13.5% (over a three year period) the last time they threatened to strike, about three years ago?

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No idea, maybe that deal expired and this is new negotiations? Doesn't matter anyway Unison to ballot 25,000 school support staff on Friday to begin (targeted I think - would need to read the article again) industrial action after summer. GMB and Unite plan to do the same. Their offer was also 2%.

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Originally Posted by SteveHFC

Thought the Alcohol ban was to help with Covid?

https://twitter.com/scotrail/status/...RtaiBaCZzmv5Eg

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I don't think this should come as any surprise to anyone.

I think it's completely wrong how this has come about of course as it was clearly publicised as a temporary measure back in November 2020 and was supposed to be "reviewed continuously as government guidelines change."

The law on wearing a face covering on public transport was lifted nearly 8 weeks ago so I'm not too sure what government guidelines they are still referring to.

The fact they are having to resort to lying to people on social media is not a good look at all. I understand that people are saying there's no big deal in banning alcohol on trains but to me it goes deeper than that. It's something which was brought in to deal with a very specific emergency situation, an emergency situation which no longer exists and therefore I strongly believe all pandemic related emergency measures should be lifted immediately.

I suspect this has always been something which has been on the cards and the pandemic was just the convenient opportunity they needed to implement it.

In my opinion there's no chance that this will be lifted now Scotrail is under Scottish Government control. I think we've seen over the last two years that treating people as adults is not too high on their priority list.

We already had "dry" trains on routes where there was the possibility of alcohol related trouble taking place and also a ban on drinking alcohol before and after certain times of the day. I don't see why there is any need to go further.

The people who are inclined to get drunk and cause trouble are not likely to be put off by an alcohol ban. It's the people who are on a day out from Edinburgh up to Inverness etc who just want to relax for a few hours and have a couple of drinks with their friends who will be the ones who will stop drinking.

The whole thing stinks.

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Originally Posted by Sir David Gray

I don't think this should come as any surprise to anyone.

I think it's completely wrong how this has come about of course as it was clearly publicised as a temporary measure back in November 2020 and was supposed to be "reviewed continuously as government guidelines change."

The law on wearing a face covering on public transport was lifted nearly 8 weeks ago so I'm not too sure what government guidelines they are still referring to.

The fact they are having to resort to lying to people on social media is not a good look at all. I understand that people are saying there's no big deal in banning alcohol on trains but to me it goes deeper than that. It's something which was brought in to deal with a very specific emergency situation, an emergency situation which no longer exists and therefore I strongly believe all pandemic related emergency measures should be lifted immediately.

I suspect this has always been something which has been on the cards and the pandemic was just the convenient opportunity they needed to implement it.

In my opinion there's no chance that this will be lifted now Scotrail is under Scottish Government control. I think we've seen over the last two years that treating people as adults is not too high on their priority list.

We already had "dry" trains on routes where there was the possibility of alcohol related trouble taking place and also a ban on drinking alcohol before and after certain times of the day. I don't see why there is any need to go further.

The people who are inclined to get drunk and cause trouble are not likely to be put off by an alcohol ban. It's the people who are on a day out from Edinburgh up to Inverness etc who just want to relax for a few hours and have a couple of drinks with their friends who will be the ones who will stop drinking.

The whole thing stinks.

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Sent them a message on Twitter about the tweet and the fact this was only to be a temporary measure to help with the pandemic and they came back with

‘Anything that helps create a safe environment for everyone to travel in has to be a good thing so we're keeping the ban for now but will keep it under review.’

Like you said the pandemic was the perfect opportunity they needed to ban it.

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Originally Posted by Ozyhibby

Deal done with drivers. 5%


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Oooofffft that a fair increase. I look forward to my fare going up now and still not getting a seat at peak times.

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Originally Posted by neil7908

Oooofffft that a fair increase. I look forward to my fare going up now and still not getting a seat at peak times.

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Or a drink.[emoji23]


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Originally Posted by SteveHFC

Sent them a message on Twitter about the tweet and the fact this was only to be a temporary measure to help with the pandemic and they came back with

‘Anything that helps create a safe environment for everyone to travel in has to be a good thing so we're keeping the ban for now but will keep it under review.’

Like you said the pandemic was the perfect opportunity they needed to ban it.

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:agree: Pathetic.

I've always thought since living overseas that having alcohol on public transport was mad (where I lived it was banned)

However it's came about I agree with banning it here

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