Coronavirus

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Originally Posted by Barney McGrew

Alastair Campbell is doing a fantastic interview on Sky at the moment, pointing out the article written by Cummings wife about their ‘London Lockdown’ when it appears they weren’t even in London at the time.

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He has made a good point about who else knew that Cummings had broken lockdown. They have questions to answer as well.

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Originally Posted by marinello59

Whilst the other knowingly put the health of her family and locals near her holiday home at risk. This really isn’t a case of who behaved worse. They both behaved deplorably and showed utter contempt for the rest of us. Why are people using this to try and downplay what Calderwood did?

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He was carrying the virus and he knew it. I can't understand how you don't see the difference. In principle the difference is similar to that of robbery and armed robbery.

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Originally Posted by marinello59

He has made a good point about who else knew that Cummings had broken lockdown. They have questions to answer as well.

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And I think we all know they won’t answer them, but we’ll get some bluster and avoidance when they’re asked.

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Originally Posted by Hibrandenburg

He was carrying the virus and he knew it. I can't understand how you don't see the difference. In principle the difference is similar to that of robbery and armed robbery.

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The question wasn’t who behaved worse. It was why one was “hounded” out and why Cummings should be sacked. Saying Calderwood was hounded out suggests she hadn’t really done anything wrong.

This whole story has come at a very convenient time for Johnson, given the current lack of test and trace being in place when it was promised by, the huge pushback from schools on opening in England on June 1st, the Jennifer Arcuri story and the ongoing disappearance of the PM.

As Cummings isn’t well liked within the Tory party by all accounts, the leak will have come from within I reckon.

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Originally Posted by Barney McGrew

And I think we all know they won’t answer them, but we’ll get some bluster and avoidance when they’re asked.

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I think it will be complete avoidance.

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Originally Posted by marinello59

Whilst the other knowingly put the health of her family and locals near her holiday home at risk. This really isn’t a case of who behaved worse. They both behaved deplorably and showed utter contempt for the rest of us. Why are people using this to try and downplay what Calderwood did?

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Maybe both are bad but one is worse than the other? This is reflected in the punishment for each. As a member of the public with no family members showing coronavirus symptoms Calderwood was supposed to follow the lockdown rules she was promoting, she breached these and rightly lost her job. As a member of the public who was symptomatic, Cummings was supposed to follow the guidelines with regards to quarantining and self isolation at home, he clearly did not. I’d say the difference in the severity of these breaches are reflected in the range of fines for each.

Range of fines for breaking lockdown £60-960
Range of fines for breaking quarantine £1,000-10,000

Looking forward to see which sacrificial lamb is put out to slaughter in todays briefing.

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Originally Posted by CapitalGreen

Maybe both are bad but one is worse than the other? This is reflected in the punishment for each. As a member of the public with no family members showing coronavirus symptoms Calderwood was supposed to follow the lockdown rules she was promoting, she breached these and rightly lost her job. As a member of the public who was symptomatic, Cummings was supposed to follow the guidelines with regards to quarantining and self isolation at home, he clearly did not. I’d say the difference in the severity of these breaches are reflected in the range of fines for each.

Range of fines for breaking lockdown £60-960
Range of fines for breaking quarantine £1,000-10,000

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Exactly.

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Originally Posted by Hibrandenburg

Looking forward to see which sacrificial lamb is put out to slaughter in todays briefing.

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Next man up, Ian Cathro.
I would love it, love it, if he was a Govt spokesman.

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Originally Posted by hibsbollah

Next man up, Ian Cathro.
I would love it, love it, if he was a Govt spokesman.

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You could bet your bottom dollar that you'd get new slides every day.

It will be Hancock for today's briefing. He's so obviously marked as the fall guy and he has a gaffe in him at the best of times.

Stick him out, hope he says something stupid and diverts attention from the de facto PM.

Statement from Number 10 saying Cummings journey was ‘in line with Coronavirus guidelines’

They're going to try and tough it out.

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Originally Posted by SideBurns

I can't remember exactly who said what when the Calderwood story broke. However, it was revealed on the Sunday morning, and by the evening she'd resigned. Whatever occurred in the conversation between the CMO and FM which apparently led to an arrival at the decision her position was untenable, she had left her post within 24 hours. This is dragging on, and still no statement from the PM.

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Ian Blackford has waited approximately 12 hours before saying what he's said, it's not even been a full 24 hours yet since the story broke. Maybe Boris Johnson will sack Cummings by tonight, I doubt it but he might.

All I was questioning was, did Ian Blackford put similar public pressure on Nicola Sturgeon to sack Catherine Calderwood in the hours leading up to the decision that evening? I don't believe he did.

I'm just sick and tired of politicians in this country, of every persuasion, sticking their oar in when it suits them but then either turning a blind eye to, or defending, exactly the same behaviour when it suits them.

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Originally Posted by Sir David Gray

Cases/deaths in the past 7 days:

Germany - 4490/419
Spain - 7537/1169
Italy - 4773/1006

That's the figures available to me from here https://virusncov.com/ hopefully it's accurate.

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Thanks for this. Presumably those figures don't represent a steep rise in cases/ deaths from the weeks prior to lifting measures, or we'd be hearing more about it.

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Originally Posted by Barney McGrew

This whole story has come at a very convenient time for Johnson, given the current lack of test and trace being in place when it was promised by, the huge pushback from schools on opening in England on June 1st, the Jennifer Arcuri story and the ongoing disappearance of the PM.

As Cummings isn’t well liked within the Tory party by all accounts, the leak will have come from within I reckon.

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:agree: This is very likely. It’s also worth remembering that the original Telegraph expose of Neil Ferguson, who had his girlfriend round to his house and who was starting to irritate Tory ministers, came out 5 weeks after the actual offence. The Telegraph held on to the story for all that time and released the story the same day as U.K. overtook Italy for most deaths. :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by ronaldo7

You could bet your bottom dollar that you'd get new slides every day.

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:faf:

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Originally Posted by Barney McGrew

Statement from Number 10 saying Cummings journey was ‘in line with Coronavirus guidelines’

They're going to try and tough it out.

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Unbelievable. Even by Westminster’s standards.

One thing that interests me is that that during the Calderwood affair there was mitigation put forward that she was 'non political' so it wasn't a matter for the FM to address. Given the role she was playing I think that was nonsense and the decision to remove her was ultimately at least partly political in nature.

In the case of Cummings his position is indisputably political, he is a senior advisor to the PM. Johnson must have been aware he had pissed off to Durham for a few days. That being the case there should be questions asked as to why he didn't deal with it.

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Originally Posted by SideBurns

Thanks for this. Presumably those figures don't represent a steep rise in cases/ deaths from the weeks prior to lifting measures, or we'd be hearing more about it.

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According to Worldmeter Spain saw a big jump in deaths and infections yesterday, relative to what they had been in the preceding couple of weeks. I assume that is an anomaly based on change in calculations rather than anything sinister though.

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Originally Posted by Pretty Boy

That being the case there should be questions asked as to why he didn't deal with it.

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Since Parliament is now off for a fortnight and BoJo doesn’t lower himself to take the daily briefings, when will anyone get the chance to actually ask him though

Again, the timing of the story is very lucky for him :hmmm:

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Originally Posted by marinello59

He has made a good point about who else knew that Cummings had broken lockdown. They have questions to answer as well.

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Absolutely all the top ministers in the government will have known imo given his powerful position you would have thought

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Originally Posted by marinello59

The question wasn’t who behaved worse. It was why one was “hounded” out and why Cummings should be sacked. Saying Calderwood was hounded out suggests she hadn’t really done anything wrong.

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Not at all hounded out by all press and political opponents having a go similar to what is happening now with Cummings we will see if the same outcome happens. She deserved to go for sure.

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Originally Posted by Beefster

Fair point. Given that a lot of folk are asymptomatic though, I’m not sure that that explains the complete 180 between how each is viewed in the comment I quoted.

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I think it is because Senior Ministers did actively demand resignations of the other two...Hancock actually said he would support police getting involved...neither of those were confirmed with covid at the time. There is a big difference in their reaction to this one...bearing in mind it occurred around the same time.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

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Originally Posted by Barney McGrew

Since Parliament is now off for a fortnight and BoJo doesn’t lower himself to take the daily briefings, when will anyone get the chance to actually ask him though

Again, the timing of the story is very lucky for him :hmmm:

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Did this happen 6 weeks ago ? Astounding this hasn't come out previously.

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Originally Posted by marinello59

The question wasn’t who behaved worse. It was why one was “hounded” out and why Cummings should be sacked. Saying Calderwood was hounded out suggests she hadn’t really done anything wrong.

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Hmm appears to me that you are wondering why the hounding of Cummings isn’t being paralleled to a crucifixion, confirmation of why his atonement for his digression isn’t the focus and, in the end of the day, if PM thinks he is the best man for the job in these difficult times then that’s the most important thing?

If so I think you could be waiting for some time for anything similar to be posted here this time around.... ;-)

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Originally Posted by Pretty Boy

According to Worldmeter Spain saw a big jump in deaths and infections yesterday, relative to what they had been in the preceding couple of weeks. I assume that is an anomaly based on change in calculations rather than anything sinister though.

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Cheers; let's hope so.

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Originally Posted by Sir David Gray

Ian Blackford has waited approximately 12 hours before saying what he's said, it's not even been a full 24 hours yet since the story broke. Maybe Boris Johnson will sack Cummings by tonight, I doubt it but he might.

All I was questioning was, did Ian Blackford put similar public pressure on Nicola Sturgeon to sack Catherine Calderwood in the hours leading up to the decision that evening? I don't believe he did.

I'm just sick and tired of politicians in this country, of every persuasion, sticking their oar in when it suits them but then either turning a blind eye to, or defending, exactly the same behaviour when it suits them.

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That’s people isn’t it?

We are prejudiced and partisan. I’ll defend my children and my family and friends. I’ll attack those who I don’t like.

In the modern snappy sound bite world, we will have moved into something else by this time next week.

The Tories have 4.5 years before the next election. They are invulnerable.

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Originally Posted by Barney McGrew

Statement from Number 10 saying Cummings journey was ‘in line with Coronavirus guidelines’

They're going to try and tough it out.

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Shameless but expect nothing else.

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Originally Posted by Sir David Gray

Cases/deaths in the past 7 days:

Germany - 4490/419
Spain - 7537/1169
Italy - 4773/1006

That's the figures available to me from here https://virusncov.com/ hopefully it's accurate.

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Useful information here https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/d...-7-day-average.