KP - Hibs Voting Intentions

Some of the comments and input on this thread depress the hell out of me, not just as a Hibs fan or a fitba fan, but as a human being.

Folk are going on about Hibs being 'soft' if they miss this chance to relegate Hearts, saying all this talk about 'this is our city' is hogwash if we don't make ensuring Hearts are relegated our number one priority. Whatever happened to there being 'class, first class and Hibs class' ..... how much nonsense will that be if the club like half the fans on here make ensuring Hearts go down through a situation that's probably as close to the Zombie apocalypse as we will ever see our number one priority, when the future of our whole game is at stake.

Then you have the ... Hearts wouldn't think twice if the shoe was on the other foot folk ... The whole point is we aren't Hearts, the whole point is that what Hearts would do should never be a factor in how we think and how we act as a club ... or a support for that matter. If we genuinely think that Hearts would delight in taking advantage of what is nothing short of the biggest natural disaster to hit humanity since the 1919 flu pandemic which killed millions to put the boot into Hibs then Hibs doing the same thing would to me make us no better than them.

Then you have the I wont renew brigade, including some posters on here I have a great deal of respect for normally. I've seen comments from some folk saying this is like the Sevco situation and fans of other clubs will join the outrage if any decision made saves Hearts. Well I've got news for them, no it isn't ... to fans of other teams Hearts are just another club, probably not a very popular one for sure if comments I've seen from other fans over the years are to be believed, but to them in this situation just another club ... they will be thinking of their own clubs and hopefully how to ensure football continues with as little damage as possible to every club .... If any decision saves Hearts it wont be anywhere near as big a deal to them as it appears to be to a lot of us .... and to think otherwise is having an inflated idea of our own importance that would do credit to our city neighbours.

If you seriously are talking about damaging Hibs by consciously not renewing your season ticket over this issue then your hatred of Hearts truly does outweigh your love of Hibs. Something we delight in accusing Hearts fans of in reverse all the time .. and yet here we are doing exactly the same thing.

I have on many occasions stated that what Hearts did during the Mercer era was possibly the most disgusting act any football club anywhere could have ever undertaken ... To try and end another club, and even worse a direct rival, by killing them off the pitch should have made Hearts very name a swear word in football, a byword for disgusting underhanded behaviour, even to fans who previously had no thought for them either way, if at all.

In my opinion raving at our club to vote a certain way in an overall decision for Scottish football which will affect not just us, not just Hearts, but the whole future of our game based on no other consideration than how much damage it can do to Hearts, be that deserved payback, karma or whatever when the club in question were in a position where relegation through their efforts on the pitch was a long way from certain is in the same ballpark .... not the same, but the same ballpark ... as what Hearts tried to do to us all those years ago.

The ****ing Yams have always been unbearable with their inflated sense of self importance and entitlement ... nobody least of all me would deny that ... they truly think they are God's gift to the beautiful game. The thought of ramping that up to 11 by handing them the chance to play the martyr as well is a far worse outcome to this situation than any idea of a decision Hibs make keeping them in the premiership.

Rant over GGTTH.

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Originally Posted by Caversham Green

I've edited my post to cover that point. My view is that we deserve to be in 6th place at the moment because that is what we achieved playing football, we're unbeaten against the other team with a claim to sixth and their game in hand was very unlikely to produce the result required for them to pass us.

Why do you think we deserve to be seventh?

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If it goes on average points then we will be 7th. Whether you think it's deserved or not is a matter of opinion.

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Originally Posted by 90+2

The best interests of the Hibernian support is to relegate they ****s though or do the fans not count?

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Fans spiteful emotions don't count when it comes to running a successful football club, no. The best possible Hibs team is what I want, if we have a good team then the support will be happy.

You happy to vote for a horrendous solution to this problem that massively hurts Hibs as long as Hearts go down and we can banter them off a bit on twitter?

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Originally Posted by blackpoolhibs

:agree: She cant be seen to want them relegated, as much as i'd like her to say so. :greengrin She's just playing the waiting game until such times as there is no other option, and that will be the only option soon enough. :greengrin

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Totally agree.

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Originally Posted by Peevemor

Purely to illustrate why the league will be wary of overpaying teams.

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It's a very problematic outcome - but we're in the proverbial rock and hard place at the moment.

Let's be honest, everyone here just wants Hearts down. Fine, I get that but it's a rubbish outcome. And has there been any chat about the Scottish Cup? Are we talking about giving up our chances of a semi final?

Quite honestly I couldn't give a toss. This virus business has confirmed to me how fed up I am with football these days. Beam me up, Scotty!

I'm going to trust somebody with the experience and track record of Leeann to make the best choice possible.

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Originally Posted by DaveF

If it goes on average points then we will be 7th. Whether you think it's deserved or not is a matter of opinion.

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Average points based on a different number of games played therefore not comparable. You're right though (for the only time in this wee debate :wink:) it's a matter of opinion and we're unlikely to agree on this so I'll stop here.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/52227551


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If I thought that if our positions were reversed that Budge would vote to save Hibs then I might have some sympathy. Given all the underhanded snipes she's aimed at us in statements/interviews over the past few years I think I can safely say there's no chance she would.

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Originally Posted by MWHIBBIES

Fans spiteful emotions don't count when it comes to running a successful football club, no. The best possible Hibs team is what I want, if we have a good team then the support will be happy.

You happy to vote for a horrendous solution to this problem that massively hurts Hibs as long as Hearts go down and we can banter them off a bit on twitter?

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Spiteful may be correct. There is a significant amount of bad blood in Scottish football that stems from the actions of Hearts and Rangers.
Hibs decision to look the other way then means they are not being given much leeway from fans now. You can call it spiteful if you like but it’s not without foundation.


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So when I started this poll, I put votes yes and relegate hearts. I maybe should’ve put vote yes and relegate the bottom team instead. I genuinely believe ending the season as it stands allows a clean slate for the start of next season.

I may be in favour of reconstruction if it was a permanent solution, and it benefited all of Scottish football and allows us to create a better product on the park and better players. A prime example would be summer football where we go into Europe in the middle of our season and we don’t get pumped by Maltese minnows because they are up to speed.

I would save hearts if that was a serious and lasting proposal.

The reconstruction idea as it stands is a half *rsed compromise in order to save the bottom club and keep the peace. Two wrongs don’t make a right and if it was St Mirren, Hamilton or anyone else I would argue the same.

The fact is, it is hearts, and they would have no hesitation in relegating us and taking great delight with their already inflated egos and grandeur.

For those who talk about loss of income. A few points. First we will benefit from the new tv deal sooner. Extra cash.

Secondly- imagine young kids at school wondering what team to support. If hearts are championship and hibs are premier league then we may win hundreds of new fans. Also applies to the many new residents of Edinburgh. Potential for bigger fan base.

There are many positives form Hearts demise that I won’t list but we would have the opportunity to become the undoubted dominate club in Edinburgh.

As far as I’m concerned there is only one option, vote yes and send them down.

LD should have a read of Kickback before making any decision.

The abuse that she has taken from them along with all of them calling us vermin etc should make it easy for her to make the right decision.

Even now, their talk is all about threats and boycotts. Not one bit of humility or an acceptance that they need a favour.

Originally I thought it would be unfair to see them relegated. Now I think it’s fully deserved.

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Originally Posted by WhileTheChief..

LD should have a read of Kickback before making any decision.

The abuse that she has taken from them along with all of them calling us vermin etc should make it easy for her to make the right decision.

Even now, their talk is all about threats and boycotts. Not one bit of humility or an acceptance that they need a favour.

Originally I thought it would be unfair to see them relegated. Now I think it’s fully deserved.

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Thankfully Hibs will make their decision on the issues they face without reference to a few baw bags on a football fans' internet forum.

Vote yes and give those horrible maroon ballbags the relegation they deserve. That club and their FTB ex owner tried to wipe our club off the face of the earth and that should NEVER be forgotten.

Get them to ****.

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Originally Posted by Sioux

Thankfully Hibs will make their decision on the issues they face without reference to a few baw bags on a football fans' internet forum.

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Exactly. This decision is about reason, not emotion.

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Originally Posted by Peevemor

Says who? Maybe some would prefer them to stay up and struggle so we can play/beat them 3 times next season?

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You think the majority of the support want to keep hearts up? Seriously?

Some, a handful will. The rest will want them to get what they deserve.

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Originally Posted by MWHIBBIES

Fans spiteful emotions don't count when it comes to running a successful football club, no. The best possible Hibs team is what I want, if we have a good team then the support will be happy.

You happy to vote for a horrendous solution to this problem that massively hurts Hibs as long as Hearts go down and we can banter them off a bit on twitter?

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I will it massively hurt Hibs? Them in the championship goosed for money will be incredibly beneficial to us long term.

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Originally Posted by WhileTheChief..

LD should have a read of Kickback before making any decision.

The abuse that she has taken from them along with all of them calling us vermin etc should make it easy for her to make the right decision.

Even now, their talk is all about threats and boycotts. Not one bit of humility or an acceptance that they need a favour.

Originally I thought it would be unfair to see them relegated. Now I think it’s fully deserved.

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LOL - she absolutely should not. I think this thread illustrates perfectly why supporters should not have any input into the running of a football club.

Hibs is a football team - but it's also a business employing a large number of people. As such, I'm sure that the Board will make the decision based on what is best for the club - and not just to score a point against another team

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Originally Posted by 90+2

You think the majority of the support want to keep hearts up? Seriously?

Some, a handful will. The rest will want them to get what they deserve.

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Not true.

A few will want to keep Hearts up. Some will want them to go down regardless of how much it hurts Hibs. The rest - the vast majority IMO - will want what's best for the club they support and will have little or no regard for any club they don't support. I'm firmly in the third category.

The heart says: send 'em down and into administration!











The head says: send 'em down and liquidate 'em!

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Originally Posted by Caversham Green

Not true.

A few will want to keep Hearts up. Some will want them to go down regardless of how much it hurts Hibs. The rest - the vast majority IMO - will want what's best for the club they support and will have little or no regard for any club they don't support. I'm firmly in the third category.

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And what’s best for the club? Surely it’s to vote for the proposal taking hearts out the equation.

Or do you mean some will back the clubs decision blindly and ask no questions believing it’s in the best interests?

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Originally Posted by Peevemor

So what are folk's views on Partick being relegated? Is that fair?

For what it's worth, I don't think so.

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Yes.

They are bottom of the table just like hertz Stranraer & Brechin.

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Originally Posted by 90+2

And what’s best for the club? Surely it’s to vote for the proposal taking hearts out the equation.

Or do you mean some will back the clubs decision blindly and ask no questions believing it’s in the best interests?

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Putting trust in our qualified, experienced and reputable CEO to make a better decision than a bunch of fans on an online forum isn't blind loyalty, it's rational.

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Originally Posted by Hibs4185

LD does seem to like having a good working relationship with Budge which is admirable, but Budge takes great delight in taking sly digs at every opportunity. I can’t be bothered listing them all but we all know the examples.

The big question for me is whether if the scenario was reversed and we were bottom, would Budge save us?

Not a hope in hell.

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It is only good as it suits her for now, IF she were put in our position Hibs would be down end of.

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Originally Posted by Caversham Green

Not true.

A few will want to keep Hearts up. Some will want them to go down regardless of how much it hurts Hibs. The rest - the vast majority IMO - will want what's best for the club they support and will have little or no regard for any club they don't support. I'm firmly in the third category.

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90% would say your wrong .

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Originally Posted by King Arthur

If Dundee Utd, Liverpool, Newcastle, Sheff Wed, Bristol City etc voted to send their local rivals down when they were just 4 pts adrift with 8 games left, I'd think they were an absolute disgrace.

Think about it.

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You think about it, its not about voting them to get relegated they have done that themselves!!

Are you prepared to risk NEXT season and the new TV deal, if so you are a disgrace?

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Originally Posted by 1875STEVE

Id be ok with league reconstruction, as long as it's not just to 14, and as i read somewhere else, only for a season to even things out.

It has to be a 16, 18 or even 20 top flight.

id prefer 18.

3 up and 3 down.

Im not sure about keeping the split either, ive never been the biggest fan.

If it saves Hearts, then so be it.

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18 teams, and NOT for one season only, then I would support that anything else is no good. However, the TV companies will not agree to it sadly.

If we were in Hearts position (which could easily have happened) we'd be going daft.

However, I do think Hearts should be relegated, but I don't think Partick Thistle should.

I've no idea how I would vote this week if it was down to me.

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Originally Posted by Caversham Green

Not true.

A few will want to keep Hearts up. Some will want them to go down regardless of how much it hurts Hibs. The rest - the vast majority IMO - will want what's best for the club they support and will have little or no regard for any club they don't support. I'm firmly in the third category.

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This board is far from the voice of Hibs but I think it is a reasonable indicator of grassroots opinion. Looking at the figures in this poll, 90% would prefer to see Hearts relegated. Now that’s not as definitive as you might think, as folk on here tend to be vocal and forthright, but I think it’s a fair stretch of the imagination to say that “the vast majority will want what's best for the club they support and will have little or no regard for any club they don't support.” I think a fairly big majority will hold the opposite view.

Robbed us of potential league places over the years with their shameful overspending. Their attitude during, and since, their administration has been disgusting and embarrassing. Send them down and let them rot.

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Originally Posted by NAE NOOKIE

A reasonable reply mate. From my POV it's not just about Hearts as a club, who without a doubt have been so badly run they can't complain about the position they find themselves in. I'm purely looking at this from two angles:

Firstly I just can't in all honesty see the fairness in relegating a club, even them with their history, in circumstances which are so unbelievably unique and with so much of the season still to play, nor can I see how it would be fair on any club's supporters, even theirs .. said through gritted teeth I assure you.

Secondly, The only way I can see which will satisfy as many clubs fans as possible, never mind the clubs themselves, is for a league set up next season which includes the top two in the championship .... it's no secret that ICT are teetering on the brink and a season in the premiership will probably save them from going under ... folk don't even seem to be thinking about them ... in all honesty beaten to the championship title by a club whose spending is no less excessive than Hearts for the league they are in.

Can anybody in all honesty, hand on heart, say they would have seen any fairness in Hibs being relegated if we had been bottom of the league when play stopped in these circumstances ... I sure as hell couldn't.

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The justification is in your post - UNIQUE, unprecedented there really is no other way of calling an end to this season, so they go down.

Your idea of running into next year, eh and risk the TV deal why would ANY of the SPL clubs support that?

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Originally Posted by Sioux

Thankfully Hibs will make their decision on the issues they face without reference to a few baw bags on a football fans' internet forum.

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It's not just on a fans forum, the only ground where she doesn't take her seat in the directors box and decides to sit/stand with Hibs fans in the away end during derbies at the farm, because she knows what kind of abuse she would get sitting in the directors box.

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Originally Posted by Peevemor

What she says is in line with the SPFL's statement yesterday, ie. wait for further news on when there will be matches before making a decision. Therefore we're obviously going to accept the proposition.

She's also right to say that 40 minutes of conference call isn't enough - especially if there are 12-20 participants. That's probably the equivalent of a 15-20 'normal' minute meeting.

Speaking about never going back if Hibs vote to save Hearts is nonsense IMO. How Hibs vote further down the line will be in accordance with what the board think is right 1. for Hibs and 2. for the SPFL going forward. Whether this eventually saves or relegates Hearts will be an afterthough, which is how it should be.

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How would a 14 team league be better for Hibs, it seems its that, call as is or void season - i am all ears???

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Originally Posted by NAE NOOKIE

Some of the comments and input on this thread depress the hell out of me, not just as a Hibs fan or a fitba fan, but as a human being.

Folk are going on about Hibs being 'soft' if they miss this chance to relegate Hearts, saying all this talk about 'this is our city' is hogwash if we don't make ensuring Hearts are relegated our number one priority. Whatever happened to there being 'class, first class and Hibs class' ..... how much nonsense will that be if the club like half the fans on here make ensuring Hearts go down through a situation that's probably as close to the Zombie apocalypse as we will ever see our number one priority, when the future of our whole game is at stake.

Then you have the ... Hearts wouldn't think twice if the shoe was on the other foot folk ... The whole point is we aren't Hearts, the whole point is that what Hearts would do should never be a factor in how we think and how we act as a club ... or a support for that matter. If we genuinely think that Hearts would delight in taking advantage of what is nothing short of the biggest natural disaster to hit humanity since the 1919 flu pandemic which killed millions to put the boot into Hibs then Hibs doing the same thing would to me make us no better than them.

Then you have the I wont renew brigade, including some posters on here I have a great deal of respect for normally. I've seen comments from some folk saying this is like the Sevco situation and fans of other clubs will join the outrage if any decision made saves Hearts. Well I've got news for them, no it isn't ... to fans of other teams Hearts are just another club, probably not a very popular one for sure if comments I've seen from other fans over the years are to be believed, but to them in this situation just another club ... they will be thinking of their own clubs and hopefully how to ensure football continues with as little damage as possible to every club .... If any decision saves Hearts it wont be anywhere near as big a deal to them as it appears to be to a lot of us .... and to think otherwise is having an inflated idea of our own importance that would do credit to our city neighbours.

If you seriously are talking about damaging Hibs by consciously not renewing your season ticket over this issue then your hatred of Hearts truly does outweigh your love of Hibs. Something we delight in accusing Hearts fans of in reverse all the time .. and yet here we are doing exactly the same thing.

I have on many occasions stated that what Hearts did during the Mercer era was possibly the most disgusting act any football club anywhere could have ever undertaken ... To try and end another club, and even worse a direct rival, by killing them off the pitch should have made Hearts very name a swear word in football, a byword for disgusting underhanded behaviour, even to fans who previously had no thought for them either way, if at all.

In my opinion raving at our club to vote a certain way in an overall decision for Scottish football which will affect not just us, not just Hearts, but the whole future of our game based on no other consideration than how much damage it can do to Hearts, be that deserved payback, karma or whatever when the club in question were in a position where relegation through their efforts on the pitch was a long way from certain is in the same ballpark .... not the same, but the same ballpark ... as what Hearts tried to do to us all those years ago.

The ****ing Yams have always been unbearable with their inflated sense of self importance and entitlement ... nobody least of all me would deny that ... they truly think they are God's gift to the beautiful game. The thought of ramping that up to 11 by handing them the chance to play the martyr as well is a far worse outcome to this situation than any idea of a decision Hibs make keeping them in the premiership.

Rant over GGTTH.

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Although I tend to agree with much that you say, the highlighted part above is wrong - what Mercer tried to do was to exterminate not relegate and those two outcomes are about as far apart as you can get on the same planet never mind a ballpark.

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Originally Posted by Big_Franck

Whether or not we renew our STs hinges on this vote. Vote to save them and they can shove it.

I also can't understand why she thinks starting the games again in Aug/Sep is an appropriate solution as that would mean the current season would finish in what, November? What a farce that would be.

Call it and move on to next season Hibs.

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She would have been best advised to say nowt Franck, that way there would have been none of this speculation as to what she MIGHT be saying!

Let Chemical Annie do all the spouting as she is doing a great job turning folk against them.

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Originally Posted by Vault Boy

Putting trust in our qualified, experienced and reputable CEO to make a better decision than a bunch of fans on an online forum isn't blind loyalty, it's rational.

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Yup. There's a hilarious irony here in us tearing into Hearts and Sevco for pandering to their fans and failing to behave professionally.

And our solution? Let's pander to our support who just want to see our neighbours suffer.

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Originally Posted by hibeerealist

How would a 14 team league be better for Hibs, it seems its that, call as is or void season - i am all ears???

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I never said it would be, and neither did Leeann Dempster.

People should stop getting so uptight over speculation.

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Originally Posted by hibeerealist

She would have been best advised to say nowt Franck, that way there would have been none of this speculation as to what she MIGHT be saying!

Let Chemical Annie do all the spouting as she is doing a great job turning folk against them.

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Why can't you (and others) just accept what she's saying at face value - ie. the goalposts are shifitng all the time and there's no way a decision should be made right now?

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Originally Posted by Vault Boy

Putting trust in our qualified, experienced and reputable CEO to make a better decision than a bunch of fans on an online forum isn't blind loyalty, it's rational.

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Even if the decision is ultimately the wrong one? There’s no be no questioning just blind faith it’s for the best regardless of what the support want?

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Originally Posted by Yorkshire HFC

LOL - she absolutely should not. I think this thread illustrates perfectly why supporters should not have any input into the running of a football club.

Hibs is a football team - but it's also a business employing a large number of people. As such, I'm sure that the Board will make the decision based on what is best for the club - and not just to score a point against another team

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Of course fans views need to be taken into account ! These are just 2 extremes where in reality the proper approach will often lie somewhere in between. Sometimes decisions need to made to protect sporting integrity or to ensure the game does not get brought into disrepute. Not everything needs to be or should be driven by short term finances.

Was it right to put Sevco into the 3rd tier when they went bust and everyone as screaming Armageddon? Absolutely. If money was the pure driver for all decisions, then we might as well have rules that no big club can be relegated or go out of business. Let's give Hearts a bunch of "get out of Jail" cards, interest-free loans. Throw games if their Prem position looks precarious or reconstruct the league so bad things don't happen.

Hearts put themselves in this position, no one else. Hibs tried their best to help them on the field, and it STILL wasn't good enough. No one can save them from themselves ! Their financial mismanagement, awful football, dreadful management decisions are the reason they find themselves in danger. We did nothing to put them there, so have no obligation to dig them out of a hole.

Hibs decision needs to balanced - finance (long & short term), sporting fairness, integrity of the league, expectation of fans incl value for money, other club behaviours and prudence, pragmatism all need to be weighed up. How fans feel about things absolutely MUST be part of that.

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Originally Posted by 90+2

Even if the decision is ultimately the wrong one? There’s no be no questioning just blind faith it’s for the best regardless of what the support want?

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Leeann Dempster is better qualified than you or any other supporter who just wants to end the season now because Hearts happen to be bottom.

Leeann might vote in line with what you want, she might not, but either way she's in a much better position to make that judgement call. That's my point. She won't (and shouldn't) make a decision based on pandering to the emotional reaction of our support.

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Originally Posted by 90+2

And what’s best for the club? Surely it’s to vote for the proposal taking hearts out the equation.

Or do you mean some will back the clubs decision blindly and ask no questions believing it’s in the best interests?

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I think some believe that Leeann Dempster and the board are in a better position to judge what's best for the club than some random internet nutters with an agenda.

Voting for the proposal that's currently on the table that also takes Hearts out of the equation costs us at least £130k. Hearts staying in the league costs us nothing but may benefit us from increased revenues from Derbies. It's not all about money but in these times money has to play a huge part. I don't see any material gain for Hibs arising purely from Hearts being relegated.

For the record I would love to see Hearts get what they deserve but the situation we are in now is far too serious to let petty local rivalries get in the way of getting the big decisions right. That's why I think LD is right in suggesting we take a step back. If she's also suggesting restructuring the league purely to accommodate Hearts then I think she is very wrong.

Do you really think that Hearts should be relegated regardless of the damage that does to Hibs?

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Originally Posted by Ozyhibby

If the cash gets shared before the vote then the vote will never happen and we’ll be talking about this all summer.


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Probably


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the league badly needs reconstruction IMO. I don't care if it lets them off the hook, it'll benefit everyone in the long run.

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Originally Posted by erin go bragh

90% would say your wrong .

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If the poll was anything like rational you'd have a point. In truth the question is hugely biased towards the vote that's been achieved. If the question was 'Do you want Hearts to be relegated' I would certainly have voted yes. If it was do you want the club to concede 6th place to St Johnstone and give them £130k I would say the outcome would be very different.

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Originally Posted by green day

https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.c...y-calm-2533749

I dont think LD says anything particularly controversial in this article.

If anything, the underlying tone is - lets see what happens next in the lockdown and make a decision on this and next season.

For me, that seems to mean that (when, not if) the UK and Scottish govts tell us that we are effectively in lockdown for another X weeks that football and Hibs will make a decision then.

She is fairly clear that she doesnt see voiding the season as an option and has told Budge that.

I should say that I want Hearts relegated, they deserve to be relegated and I would hate it to be Hibs that saved them.

This issue doesnt really impact on the ST renewal as I dont have the cash (and am self emp with zero income) to get one right now.

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Everything she says in this acticle makes sense.

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Originally Posted by CMurdoch

Everything she says in this acticle makes sense.

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Makes complete sense some hysteria on the back of sensible comments imo.

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Originally Posted by Caversham Green

I think some believe that Leeann Dempster and the board are in a better position to judge what's best for the club than some random internet nutters with an agenda.

Voting for the proposal that's currently on the table that also takes Hearts out of the equation costs us at least £130k. Hearts staying in the league costs us nothing but may benefit us from increased revenues from Derbies. It's not all about money but in these times money has to play a huge part. I don't see any material gain for Hibs arising purely from Hearts being relegated.

For the record I would love to see Hearts get what they deserve but the situation we are in now is far too serious to let petty local rivalries get in the way of getting the big decisions right. That's why I think LD is right in suggesting we take a step back. If she's also suggesting restructuring the league purely to accommodate Hearts then I think she is very wrong.

Do you really think that Hearts should be relegated regardless of the damage that does to Hibs?

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For Hearts to remain in the SPL - Assuming that Dundee Utd are coming up then the only option is allowing 2 up to balance the League.

So we lose £130 k Derby revenue if they are relegated

If they stay up with 1 other we lose £600k per year for the next 5 years....

Th New Sky Sports deal with only The SPL to show 48 Premier league fixtures is worth £150 MILLION over 5 years. This is only for SPL - Money for SPL Teams .Cup games Is BT and BBC is separate and this starts in August.

Aberdeen chairman in Sportsound at weekend spoke about this deal and reason he believed no reconstruction would go ahead as every SPL team stood to Lose£600 K per year if two more teams were added.

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Originally Posted by Power

Thanks for the sample poll and feedback, fantastic insight - genuinely appreciate all of them, very helpful. It is always difficult to represent every view and I would never state we (the collective) are X or Y exclusively. The aim of the role is there is a “supporter voice” on the Board and I’ll pass these comments on as verbatim/as is.

I don’t want to give a politician answer about making decisions remembering the legal and financial responsibilities to the club, I want to give more than that - Hibs will do what is right thing to do and what is right for us (club and support). I’ve not seen anything that would make me doubt they would.

Still a long way to go - this week isn’t the end game on this, still too many moving parts. The club taking the lead to ask for clarity, understand all specifics and call for purposeful conversations to make big decisions is sensible but doesn’t nail their colours to any decision.

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I suspect if you put the sample poll across the overall fanbase the results would be similar. Perhaps other forums and social media could run a poll.

I agree with others, I won't be renewing if Hibs vote saves Hearts from relegation.

Having had a look at the statement from LD online it's pretty bland stuff to be honest, I find the Aberdeen chairman's comments more telling about every club losing £600k if we let 2 more teams in the league, and if that is this indeed the case I suspect there's only one way Hibs and the majority of the SPL will be voting as regards league reconstruction.

What I would say about this thread though, is that those with blind faith in our Board to make the "right or morally correct decision" is not a healthy stance to take, and an internet forum is the standard vehicle these days to take an opposite view or share your opinion.

If that filters back to the Board, then all well and good as that's healthy and democratic - just think if we'd let a previous administration have their way and move us to Straiton, then we might well have been playing if front of sub-7k crowds, and praying for league reconstruction ourselves.

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Originally Posted by steviehibsleith

For Hearts to remain in the SPL - Assuming that Dundee Utd are coming up then the only option is allowing 2 up to balance the League.

So we lose £130 k Derby revenue if they are relegated

If they stay up with 1 other we lose £600k per year for the next 5 years....

Th New Sky Sports deal with only The SPL to show 48 Premier league fixtures is worth £150 MILLION over 5 years. This is only for SPL - Money for SPL Teams .Cup games Is BT and BBC is separate and this starts in August.

Aberdeen chairman in Sportsound at weekend spoke about this deal and reason he believed no reconstruction would go ahead as every SPL team stood to Lose£600 K per year if two more teams were added.

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I said voting for the proposal that's on the table would cost us £130k - there are other options that don't seem to have been explored. I would simply go for taking the table as it currently stands and relegate Hearts while Hibs retain the position they've achieved on the field but that option doesn't seem to be available and I'm probably biased there anyway. Alternatively I would look at a model that either predicts results of the fixtures that won't be played or allocates points based on previous results. For example we were due to play St Johnstone next and we've previously won one drawn one with them so we get (say) 2.5 points for the fixture and they get 0.5 (please don't get hung up on the maths here a different allocation might well be fairer).

My view is that a 14 club Premiership next season does not solve any of the problems that the current situation presents and should not be up for consideration.

Livi will be voting in favour.

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Originally Posted by Vault Boy

Leeann Dempster is better qualified than you or any other supporter who just wants to end the season now because Hearts happen to be bottom.

Leeann might vote in line with what you want, she might not, but either way she's in a much better position to make that judgement call. That's my point. She won't (and shouldn't) make a decision based on pandering to the emotional reaction of our support.

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Did I say otherwise? I wouldn’t just blindly accept what she votes without any reasoning though. Which seems to be a line trotted by some with the “club knows best” motto.

Livingston confirm they are voting in favour.

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Originally Posted by Peevemor

Why can't you (and others) just accept what she's saying at face value - ie. the goalposts are shifitng all the time and there's no way a decision should be made right now?

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It needs to be made by 5pm tomorrow in order to save a number of clubs.

Why delay? There will be no football before July / August then you need to get the players fit to play and of course we have to take into account the new season with the new TV deal which is due to start in August!

As a director of HFC she will know much more than we do however, it is NOT realistic to finish the season nor void it therefore it needs to be called.

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Originally Posted by Caversham Green

I think some believe that Leeann Dempster and the board are in a better position to judge what's best for the club than some random internet nutters with an agenda.

Voting for the proposal that's currently on the table that also takes Hearts out of the equation costs us at least £130k. Hearts staying in the league costs us nothing but may benefit us from increased revenues from Derbies. It's not all about money but in these times money has to play a huge part. I don't see any material gain for Hibs arising purely from Hearts being relegated.

For the record I would love to see Hearts get what they deserve but the situation we are in now is far too serious to let petty local rivalries get in the way of getting the big decisions right. That's why I think LD is right in suggesting we take a step back. If she's also suggesting restructuring the league purely to accommodate Hearts then I think she is very wrong.

Do you really think that Hearts should be relegated regardless of the damage that does to Hibs?

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They are yes. But I wouldn’t just back the board blindly against voting against what happens should the Premier League have to end.

Voting for the proposal doesn’t cost us anything - it isn’t a vote on the top league at all. It’s a vote on the lower leagues with the extension to the premiership if the league cannot get complete at a later date.

I think Hearts should be relegated if the season has to end and they find themselves bottom, of course, it’s the fairest way. Losing a derby is the price to pay then that’s that. We try our best to sell out the Dundee Utd home games.

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Originally Posted by Dazzling Doidge

Livingston confirm they are voting in favour.

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Big Marv is a legend. Clearly has a big say on things at Livingston!!!

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Originally Posted by Vault Boy

Exactly. This decision is about reason, not emotion.

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Take the emotion away and we’re left with nothing.

My point is that if Hearts has approached this is a different manner they might have had some sympathy from other clubs.

They chose to speak about lawyers from the get go. Threats of legal action by Budge as well as the nonsense spoken on Kickback.

If you want to focus on reason though, how is it in Hibs best interest for Hearts to stay in the league when they continue to spend money they don’t have to improve their chances of qualifying for Europe?

Livingston using common sense

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Originally Posted by Since452

Livingston using common sense

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Boycotts from the maroon and blue £ all round then.

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Originally Posted by Caversham Green

I think some believe that Leeann Dempster and the board are in a better position to judge what's best for the club than some random internet nutters with an agenda.

Voting for the proposal that's currently on the table that also takes Hearts out of the equation costs us at least £130k. Hearts staying in the league costs us nothing but may benefit us from increased revenues from Derbies. It's not all about money but in these times money has to play a huge part. I don't see any material gain for Hibs arising purely from Hearts being relegated.

For the record I would love to see Hearts get what they deserve but the situation we are in now is far too serious to let petty local rivalries get in the way of getting the big decisions right. That's why I think LD is right in suggesting we take a step back. If she's also suggesting restructuring the league purely to accommodate Hearts then I think she is very wrong.

Do you really think that Hearts should be relegated regardless of the damage that does to Hibs?

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At the recent AGM our chairman made it clear that he wants Hibs to be the biggest sporting institution in the city, he said it was very important.
It will be a lot easier to take the 1st steps of that ambition if Hearts are playing in a lower division. I think Hibs will vote in favour, look out for themselves and not worry about the consequences of Hearts financial difficulties and sporting failure.

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Originally Posted by WhileTheChief..

Take the emotion away and we’re left with nothing.

My point is that if Hearts has approached this is a different manner they might have had some sympathy from other clubs.

They chose to speak about lawyers from the get go. Threats of legal action by Budge as well as the nonsense spoken on Kickback.

If you want to focus on reason though, how is it in Hibs best interest for Hearts to stay in the league when they continue to spend money they don’t have to improve their chances of qualifying for Europe?

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Exactly and the bottom bits a great point, they stay up they will spend money they don’t have to beat us to players as per usual. I can’t see why that would be in our clubs best interests? A weakened Hearts would be great news for the club.

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Originally Posted by WhileTheChief..

Take the emotion away and we’re left with nothing.

My point is that if Hearts has approached this is a different manner they might have had some sympathy from other clubs.

They chose to speak about lawyers from the get go. Threats of legal action by Budge as well as the nonsense spoken on Kickback.

If you want to focus on reason though, how is it in Hibs best interest for Hearts to stay in the league when they continue to spend money they don’t have to improve their chances of qualifying for Europe?

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Take emotion away and you have reason.

I'm not saying Hearts staying up IS in Hibs best interest, I've not said anything like that. I've said Leeann is in a much better position to weigh up the options than any fan is. The decision won't be made lightly and it'll be made with the best intentions for the club.

There are plenty of pros and cons for any potential outcome, it's not reasonable to act as if there's only one option just because it's Hearts.

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Originally Posted by Vault Boy

Leeann Dempster is better qualified than you or any other supporter who just wants to end the season now because Hearts happen to be bottom.

Leeann might vote in line with what you want, she might not, but either way she's in a much better position to make that judgement call. That's my point. She won't (and shouldn't) make a decision based on pandering to the emotional reaction of our support.<

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She really should. If the support don't support her, she is finished...

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Originally Posted by c31

She really should. If the support don't support her, she is finished...

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No she shouldn't. The fans aren't experts on running a professional football club, Leeann is.

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Originally Posted by 90+2

They are yes. But I wouldn’t just back the board blindly against voting against what happens should the Premier League have to end.

Voting for the proposal doesn’t cost us anything - it isn’t a vote on the top league at all. It’s a vote on the lower leagues with the extension to the premiership if the league cannot get complete at a later date.

I think Hearts should be relegated if the season has to end and they find themselves bottom, of course, it’s the fairest way. Losing a derby is the price to pay then that’s that. We try our best to sell out the Dundee Utd home games.

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If you agree that the board are in a better position than you to judge the best course of action then why would you not back them? I could see your point if they wanted to award the league to "Rangers" but in a position where there is no perfect answer but they have better information why go against them?

While it's not a vote for the Premiership it's going to have a significant effect on what happens when a decision has to be made for it.

I also think Hearts should be relegated, but only on the fairest possible basis so they can have no real complaints.

Usual 'Hibs can do no wrong' users out in force in this thread I see.

You are all aware that it's the board and not just Leeann who'll decide how we vote?

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Originally Posted by Dazzling Doidge

Usual 'Hibs can do no wrong' users out in force in this thread I see.

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Why does that surprise you, it being a Hibs supporters' forum?

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Originally Posted by Peevemor

Why does that surprise you, it being a Hibs supporters' forum?

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I never said it surprised me.

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Originally Posted by Dazzling Doidge

Usual 'Hibs can do no wrong' users out in force in this thread I see.

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What are Hibs doing wrong here?

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Originally Posted by Dazzling Doidge

Usual 'Hibs can do no wrong' users out in force in this thread I see.

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Yeah, imagine not disavowing the club just because they potentially won't act in the exact way you want them to.

Happily the business and emotional responses line up nicely here. We'd be mad to vote against this either way.

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Originally Posted by Dazzling Doidge

I never said it surprised me.

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Why comment on it then?

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Originally Posted by Peevemor

You are all aware that it's the board and not just Leeann who'll decide how we vote?

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Hope so 👍

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Originally Posted by Caversham Green

What are Hibs doing wrong here?

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Nothing so far that I can see. I never said Hibs were doing anything wrong.

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Originally Posted by Caversham Green

If you agree that the board are in a better position than you to judge the best course of action then why would you not back them? I could see your point if they wanted to award the league to "Rangers" but in a position where there is no perfect answer but they have better information why go against them?

While it's not a vote for the Premiership it's going to have a significant effect on what happens when a decision has to be made for it.

I also think Hearts should be relegated, but only on the fairest possible basis so they can have no real complaints.

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I wouldn’t back them until they’ve gave justification as to why they would reject the vote (if they do) and even then I just wouldn’t blindly agree with it just because it’s the Hibernian board.

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Originally Posted by 007

If I thought that if our positions were reversed that Budge would vote to save Hibs then I might have some sympathy. Given all the underhanded snipes she's aimed at us in statements/interviews over the past few years I think I can safely say there's no chance she would.

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So you want Hibs to vote for Hearts to get relegated just because that’s what they would do to us? You’re probably right but let’s not lower ourselves to their level - we do what’s best for Hibs and don’t even think about who’s currently bottom of the league.

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Originally Posted by Dazzling Doidge

Nothing so far that I can see. I never said Hibs were doing anything wrong.

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In that case I don't understand the point of your op.

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Originally Posted by Vault Boy

Yeah, imagine not disavowing the club just because they potentially won't act in the exact way you want them to.

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It wouldn't just be me going by some of the posts in this thread and other posts on social media platforms.

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Originally Posted by Peevemor

Why comment on it then?

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Because I wanted to. That ok? It is a forum after all.

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Originally Posted by 90+2

I wouldn’t back them until they’ve gave justification as to why they would reject the vote (if they do) and even then I just wouldn’t blindly agree with it just because it’s the Hibernian board.

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I agree.

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Originally Posted by 90+2

I wouldn’t back them until they’ve gave justification as to why they would reject the vote (if they do) and even then I just wouldn’t blindly agree with it just because it’s the Hibernian board.

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I think LD expresses her views very clearly in the article. She makes no comment on whether Hearts should be relegated or whether there should be a 14 team Premiership next season. I agree with the views she expresses but would disagree with the views some on here think she's expressing.

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Originally Posted by Caversham Green

I think LD expresses her views very clearly in the article. She makes no comment on whether Hearts should be relegated or whether there should be a 14 team Premiership next season. I agree with the views she expresses but would disagree with the views some on here think she's expressing.

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Fair do’s. It’s a case of wait and see.

The 14 team scenario is completely separate from tomorrow’s vote also.

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Originally Posted by hibeerealist

The justification is in your post - UNIQUE, unprecedented there really is no other way of calling an end to this season, so they go down.

Your idea of running into next year, eh and risk the TV deal why would ANY of the SPL clubs support that?

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Where in that post did I say run into next year? As far as I'm concerned they can end the season now and hand out the prize money. This is about what happens next season for me ... this season is done.

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Originally Posted by Since452

Livingston using common sense

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They have their house in order, sensible playing budget, and made a year end profit

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Originally Posted by Billy Whizz

They have their house in order, sensible playing budget, and made a year end profit

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Shame about the pitch!

Just vote yes Hibs. It makes Business, Football and emotional sense. Once it’s done we can all move on, safe in the knowledge that our close rivals are taking a £3m hit to their finances over and above whatever CV-19 does. And all their players are still on full pay.


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Not read anything about the second European place: presumably it will be awarded on league placing as the cup is not likely to be completed in time.

(assuming that there is European competition next season)


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God forbid that we ever get to the day whereby Hibs are run by fan power and polls like this one. What a load of Tom Kite.
I trust LD and the Board to vote in whichever way means the best balanced outcome for both Hibs and for the game.
I don't buy this theoretical parking of self-interest and votes being cast solely on what is best for the game overall. Fine in theory but it just doesn't work when it comes down to it. So an outcome that gives some balance for Hibs will be what LD votes for. She certainly will not be voting based on some on here threatening not to come back if her vote ends up in Hertz not going down. Wake up R Soles.

If it wasn’t for Hearts potentially getting relegated we would all be pushing fir League reconstruction of 14/16 teams imho

Just a thought but rather than declare season void or as it is now have the TV money paid to each club as it stands. However, for sporting integrity and all that 2 weeks before the new/next season play the remaining 3 league games up to the split with league positions final. Games would be played sat/midweek/sat plus sevco playing St johnstone game in hand either Thursday before or 2 midweek inbetween. Gives Celtic a chance to mathematically win the league or forever have an asterisk next to this seasons title. Gives Hearts a chance to avoid relegation which would be very unlikely since they were due to play livi and aberdeen away. Lower leagues can play one leg play offs during this with all leagues starting following weekend. TV deal surely wouldn't be effected as would give an extra sevco v celtic match and they could show the last hearts game live for us to watch them go down!

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Originally Posted by galahibee

Just a thought but rather than declare season void or as it is now have the TV money paid to each club as it stands. However, for sporting integrity and all that 2 weeks before the new/next season play the remaining 3 league games up to the split with league positions final. Games would be played sat/midweek/sat plus sevco playing St johnstone game in hand either Thursday before or 2 midweek inbetween. Gives Celtic a chance to mathematically win the league or forever have an asterisk next to this seasons title. Gives Hearts a chance to avoid relegation which would be very unlikely since they were due to play livi and aberdeen away. Lower leagues can play one leg play offs during this with all leagues starting following weekend. TV deal surely wouldn't be effected as would give an extra sevco v celtic match and they could show the last hearts game live for us to watch them go down!

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Pmsl 2 weeks before your having a giraffe mate

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Originally Posted by Greenworld

Pmsl 2 weeks before your having a giraffe mate

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Why not? Season tickets for all teams gonna sell or not sell regardless

Not reading ten pages, so apologies if I'm repeating waht anyone has said.

I want Hibs to do the right thiing for Scottish football, not to save or relegate Hearts.

With today's announcement that everything is suspended until at least 10 June, it has become impossible to complete the current season.

There are too many players out of contract on 31 May and they can't be forced to continue those contracts beyond that date, so it only takes a few refusals and it is no longer the same competition due to changes in the playing squads. Worse, the clubs affected won't be able to sign replacements.

Even assuming that it is possible to resume training on 10 June, the need for a pre-season means that there will be no competitive games until July. There are then a minimum of nine fixture dates to be fitted in for league matches, plus a few days gap to sort out the post split fixtures, plus two dates for the Scottish Cup, plus a game day for Sevco to finish their European campaign (potentially, if unrealistically, more). So that's July and most of August to finish this season.

That means not being able to start next season until early/mid September and trying to cram all the games in before the European Championships next summer. Assuming of course that the new TV deal for next season can be delayed without jeopardising the much needed money.

Add in that too many clubs need the prize money from this season just to keep their heads above water and it is very clear that the good of Scottish football means foregoing our chances of finishing third in the league, foregoing our chances of reclaiming our Scottish Cup, foregoing our chances of European football and foregoing at least one financially lucrative full house home derby because the bottom club in the top flight will have to be relegated so that the runaway leaders of the second tier can get their deserved promotion.

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Originally Posted by Radium

Not read anything about the second European place: presumably it will be awarded on league placing as the cup is not likely to be completed in time.

(assuming that there is European competition next season)


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Give it Aberdeen. Next year we have 5 spots, so the Cup Winners from this year can get a spot.
Anybody think with 5 Euro spots, the LC Winners should have a spot??

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Originally Posted by galahibee

Just a thought but rather than declare season void or as it is now have the TV money paid to each club as it stands. However, for sporting integrity and all that 2 weeks before the new/next season play the remaining 3 league games up to the split with league positions final. Games would be played sat/midweek/sat plus sevco playing St johnstone game in hand either Thursday before or 2 midweek inbetween. Gives Celtic a chance to mathematically win the league or forever have an asterisk next to this seasons title. Gives Hearts a chance to avoid relegation which would be very unlikely since they were due to play livi and aberdeen away. Lower leagues can play one leg play offs during this with all leagues starting following weekend. TV deal surely wouldn't be effected as would give an extra sevco v celtic match and they could show the last hearts game live for us to watch them go down!

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Don't think you realise how long it takes to draw up a fixture list for the new season.

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Originally Posted by Eyrie

Not reading ten pages, so apologies if I'm repeating waht anyone has said.

I want Hibs to do the right thiing for Scottish football, not to save or relegate Hearts.

With today's announcement that everything is suspended until at least 10 June, it has become impossible to complete the current season.

There are too many players out of contract on 31 May and they can't be forced to continue those contracts beyond that date, so it only takes a few refusals and it is no longer the same competition due to changes in the playing squads. Worse, the clubs affected won't be able to sign replacements.

Even assuming that it is possible to resume training on 10 June, the need for a pre-season means that there will be no competitive games until July. There are then a minimum of nine fixture dates to be fitted in for league matches, plus a few days gap to sort out the post split fixtures, plus two dates for the Scottish Cup, plus a game day for Sevco to finish their European campaign (potentially, if unrealistically, more). So that's July and most of August to finish this season.

That means not being able to start next season until early/mid September and trying to cram all the games in before the European Championships next summer. Assuming of course that the new TV deal for next season can be delayed without jeopardising the much needed money.

Add in that too many clubs need the prize money from this season just to keep their heads above water and it is very clear that the good of Scottish football means foregoing our chances of finishing third in the league, foregoing our chances of reclaiming our Scottish Cup, foregoing our chances of European football and foregoing at least one financially lucrative full house home derby because the bottom club in the top flight will have to be relegated so that the runaway leaders of the second tier can get their deserved promotion.

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Agree..however the Scottish cup is meant to be finished early in the new season so we could be first to win 2 Scottish cups in 1 season lol

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Originally Posted by SJNB Hibby

Give it Aberdeen. Next year we have 5 spots, so the Cup Winners from this year can get a spot.
Anybody think with 5 Euro spots, the LC Winners should have a spot??

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No. Scottish only then league places.


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Originally Posted by Ozyhibby

No. Scottish only then league places.


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Why?? Livi are 5th with a LOSING record---give it to a team who won something.
LC winners in England go into Europe