SNP are lying b******s as well !

Good article on the nurses perspective

https://www.nursingtimes.net/news/wo...%20above%20the

Nurses are working one out of every five days for free because of a decade of real terms pay cuts, new analysis has revealed

The new analysis shows that given the currently very high rates of inflation, nurses at the top of Band 5 in England, Wales and Northern Ireland would need a pay rise of 45% over the next two years to achieve the same real earnings as they had in 2010-11, while nurses in Scotland would need a pay rise of 39% above the June 2022 pay offer.

In addition, it found a clear relationship between declining nurse salaries and the rate at which nurses are leaving the NHS workforce.

The total number of nurses leaving the NHS every year rose from 27,000 in 2010-11 to 38,000 in 2021-22, according to the report.

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Originally Posted by Stairway 2 7

That's Good, I doubt they will get it but the offer of 5% is a p take. They have had bellow inflation rises for 13 years. Its a much much lower paid job than it was a decade ago and with high inflation its at breaking point.

Starmer for example should be pushing for it. If he can't see the parallel between saying this week that not enough British people are becoming nurses and the fact their wages have been more than decimated, then he's dafter than I thought

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What public sector service doesn't deserve 17% then? Police? fire Service? Prison Service? What about the armed forces?

If the general consensus is that they all deserve 17%, had anyone done calculations on what that would cost and how it would actually be paid.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Since90+2

What public sector service doesn't deserve 17% then? Police? fire Service? Prison Service? What about the armed forces?

If the general consensus is that they all deserve 17%, had anyone done calculations on what that would cost and how it would actually be paid.

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None of the above have had the reductions of nurses so that's not the general consensus. It's got to breaking point. As the article says it would take a 40% rise over the next 2 years, just for them to be paid the same as they were just over a decade ago.

How did the governments let this happen, I'm sure your as furious as me that it has.

All of the above should be pushing for near inflation rises if they have a union worth their salt. And the fact is this is obviously a starting point for negotiations, the counter offer was 5%. In reality I bet they settle with bellow inflation and the problem get deeper, until eventually nursing is a job that struggles to pay the bills

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Stairway 2 7

None of the above have had the reductions of nurses so that's not the general consensus. It's got to breaking point. As the article says it would take a 40% rise over the next 2 years, just for them to be paid the same as they were just over a decade ago.

How did the governments let this happen, I'm sure your as furious as me that it has.

All of the above should be pushing for near inflation rises if they have a union worth their salt. And the fact is this is obviously a starting point for negotiations, the counter offer was 5%. In reality I bet they settle with bellow inflation and the problem get deeper, until eventually nursing is a job that struggles to pay the bills

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Your first sentence, are you absolutely sure about that? In Scotland for instance it equates to an average 8% rise this year alone.

How do their wage increases over the last decade compare with the prison service for example?

If you think all the unions should be pushing for above inflation, where do you think the money should come from?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Since90+2

Your first sentence, are you absolutely sure about that? In Scotland for instance it equates to an average 8% rise this year alone.

How do their wage increases over the last decade compare with the prison service for example?

If you think all the unions should be pushing for above inflation, where do you think the money should come from?

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Your right prison Service workers were actually one of the ones with a bigger drop than nurses. It's a disgrace seeing the hard job they do. They badly need a strong union, the train drivers show what can be done. A labour party isn't a labour party in my opinion if they don't think the erosion of public service wages need reversed.

What the tories want you to do is what your doing, what about this job or that. They pushed that during the train drivers strike. The fact is all jobs should fight not to get their wages greatly reduced and striking although a last resort is needed sometimes

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Since90+2

Your first sentence, are you absolutely sure about that? In Scotland for instance it equates to an average 8% rise this year alone.

How do their wage increases over the last decade compare with the prison service for example?

If you think all the unions should be pushing for above inflation, where do you think the money should come from?

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As for the other tory line, where does the money come from.

All governments have a budget. Imagine a pie chart with 100 slices that need put in. If wages need to go up the slices get bigger but they simply need put in first. You then add the slices starting from most important to least until you make harder decisions on the less important, for example new roads or culture. They are still important to a nation but you only do what you can once the main bills are paid, any competent government can and is tasked to do this

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Stairway 2 7

Your right prison Service workers were actually one of the ones with a bigger drop than nurses. It's a disgrace seeing the hard job they do. They badly need a strong union, the train drivers show what can be done. A labour party isn't a labour party in my opinion if they don't think the erosion of public service wages need reversed.

What the tories want you to do is what your doing, what about this job or that. They pushed that during the train drivers strike. The fact is all jobs should fight not to get their wages greatly reduced and striking although a last resort is needed sometimes

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So you were wrong on prison service. You absolutely sure with the others?

And please stop with the Tory line, it's a lazy arguement someone trots out when they have posted something incorrect and need to fall back on it.

You have no idea if I support the nurses or not, my question was simply is the general consensus that all public services should get 17% and if so, how do we propose it is paid for.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Stairway 2 7

As for the other tory line, where does the money come from.

All governments have a budget. Imagine a pie chart with 100 slices that need put in. If wages need to go up the slices get bigger but they simply need put in first. You then add the slices starting from most important to least until you make harder decisions on the less important, for example new roads or culture. They are still important to a nation but you only do what you can once the main bills are paid, any competent government can and is tasked to do this

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Thanks for that terribly condensing second paragraph, but for someone who just a post or two ago posted something factually incorrect, I'd hang back on the lectures.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Since90+2

So you were wrong on prison service. You absolutely sure with the others?

And please stop with the Tory line, it's a lazy arguement someone trots out when they have posted something incorrect and need to fall back on it.

You have no idea if I support the nurses or not, my question was simply is the general consensus that all public services should get 17% and if so, how do we propose it is paid for.

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I won't say tory, I will say right wing attitude to compare jobs and have them competing.

I'll admit I was wrong I don't know the percentage dropped by every single public service. It completely doesn't matter if someone is getting shafted more than the nurse's, that's up to their union. Of course every public service should not get pay cuts and I've answered how it should be paid for, from the budget. It's literally the government's job and any left wing government should priorities workers rights and wages

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Since90+2

Thanks for that terribly condensing second paragraph, but for someone who just a post or two ago posted something factually incorrect, I'd hang back on the lectures.

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So do you think nurses and other public services should get effective pay cuts? You've no really said, I assume you do as your saying where does the money come from on repeat.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Since90+2

What public sector service doesn't deserve 17% then? Police? fire Service? Prison Service? What about the armed forces?

If the general consensus is that they all deserve 17%, had anyone done calculations on what that would cost and how it would actually be paid.

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Any group of workers who have seen their wages eroded over the years are perfectly entitled to push for that to be rectified. The bosses will of course try and portray their demands as being unreasonable and tell them the pot is empty. And inevitably they will try and pit one group of workers against another in terms of who is the most deserving. I have zero sympathy for them no matter who they are, there’s only one side to be on in my book.
People were happy to clap for the public sector workers. Time to give them what they are worth and if that means taxes go up so be it. There was plenty of money found to protect businesses etc during Covid. Surely protecting the NHS is just as important, if the will is there then the money will be found.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by marinello59

Any group of workers who have seen their wages eroded over the years are perfectly entitled to push for that to be rectified. The bosses will of course try and portray their demands as being unreasonable and tell them the pot is empty. And inevitably they will try and pit one group of workers against another in terms of who is the most deserving. I have zero sympathy for them no matter who they are, there’s only one side to be on in my book.
People were happy to clap for the public sector workers. Time to give them what they are worth and if that means taxes go up so be it. There was plenty of money found to protect businesses etc during Covid. Surely protecting the NHS is just as important, if the will is there then the money will be found.

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So taxes need to go up to pay for it?

So hypothetically, someone who has received a 5% increase should pay more in tax so someone who has been offered a 8% rise can receive a 17% wage rise?

Despite what people say on here, there isn't an easy fix to this. I suspect nurses will end up sometime close to 10%, which the majority will be happy enough with.

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Originally Posted by Since90+2

So taxes need to go up to pay for it?

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Where else do you think the money will come from? It's not as if NHS Trusts are making profits ...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by grunt

Where else do you think the money will come from? It's not as if NHS Trusts are making profits ...

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That's the point isn't is.

As my point above says, that proposition essentially means you'd have workers who have received absolutely no wage rise or a minimal one like 3-4%, need to have less disposable income so a workforce offered 8% can be given a 17% increase.

That's not putting people against one another, it's the reality of the situation.

Personally, I think Nurses deserve a good increase but they won't get 17%, otherwise the floodgates will open and every public sector workers will ask for the same.

Something around the rate of inflation, 11 or 12% is probably correct IMO.

For context, my wife is a Nurse for the NHS.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Since90+2

So taxes need to go up to pay for it?

So hypothetically, someone who has received a 5% increase should pay more in tax so someone who has been offered a 8% rise can receive a 17% wage rise?

Despite what people say on here, there isn't an easy fix to this. I suspect nurses will end up sometime close to 10%, which the majority will be happy enough with

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I said if taxes have to go up then so be it. If. I think the money can and will be found if the politicians want to find it. The NHS is facing a staffing crisis largely down to pay and conditions. That has to be fixed.

If the nurses do get 10% and they are happy with it then that would be a considerable victory for them in the face of those trying to portray their demands as unreasonable and unrealistic.

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Originally Posted by grunt

Where else do you think the money will come from? It's not as if NHS Trusts are making profits ...

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This will only accelerate the privatisation of the nhs and people will be more accepting of it.

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Originally Posted by Zambernardi1875

This will only accelerate the privatisation of the nhs and people will be more accepting of it.

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I don't think people in the UK ever accept the wholesale privatisation of the NHS.

If it is to happen, it'll be done piecemeal and by stealth.

Public Sector wages have dropped on average 6% in the last decade, private sector 2%. Private sector workers should unionise too to prevent that.

Nurses have dropped 8% on average but grade 5 Nurses have dropped 20% in a decade, how is that acceptable. We should be fighting against that, thankfully the union are finally doing something about it. There is an obvious correlation between their wages being hammered and the staffing crisis they have.

They will find the funds in the budget. But if the question was would you pay more tax for better services I'm sure most would say yes

Enough is Enough
@eiecampaign
·

Why are nurses striking?

💵 Real pay down £4,300 since 2010

🧣 1 in 3 struggling to afford food and heating

🥫 1 in 8 forced to use foodbanks in last year

🏥 40,000 nurse shortfall means brutal hours

🤕 3 in 4 Trusts report mental health crisis

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Since90+2

So taxes need to go up to pay for it?

So hypothetically, someone who has received a 5% increase should pay more in tax so someone who has been offered a 8% rise can receive a 17% wage rise?

Despite what people say on here, there isn't an easy fix to this. I suspect nurses will end up sometime close to 10%, which the majority will be happy enough with.

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Hypothetically there are many more tax income streams for the government other than income tax.

Why are F***wit SNP MSP’s wearing white poppies with Yes badge in the middle, bad enough the white poppy brigade hijack remembrance without money raised selling their poppies going to poppy Scotland charities. But this is disgusting ��

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Originally Posted by Berwickhibby

Why are F***wit SNP MSP’s wearing white poppies with Yes badge in the middle, bad enough the white poppy brigade hijack remembrance without money raised selling their poppies going to poppy Scotland charities. But this is disgusting ��

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I could counter by asking why unionists and loyalist have hijacked remembrance to push their own agendas and try to shame anyone who doesn't kow tow to wearing a poppy but I wont. Remembrance used to be a week or two at most and pretty dignified but it's now a year round thing and just look at Ibrox last night and then talk about hijacking!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Berwickhibby

Why are F***wit SNP MSP’s wearing white poppies with Yes badge in the middle, bad enough the white poppy brigade hijack remembrance without money raised selling their poppies going to poppy Scotland charities. But this is disgusting ��

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Is this standard practice among SNP MSPs? I saw a story about Michelle Thomson doing so but thought it was just her. Pretty tacky stuff nevertheless.

I was actually more surprised to see she's back in the SNP. I thought she got kicked out a few years back.

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Originally Posted by Berwickhibby

Why are F***wit SNP MSP’s wearing white poppies with Yes badge in the middle, bad enough the white poppy brigade hijack remembrance without money raised selling their poppies going to poppy Scotland charities. But this is disgusting ��

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Why would the PPU give their money to the charities that the BL support?

They support different causes.

No one is hijacking anything, wear whatever poppy you want.

I am against war so wear a white poppy. I could wear no poppy but I want to respect the people who have died to give us what we have.

I never think I am hijacking the red poppy cause. I disagree with the red poppy.

I’ve not seen the SNP yes white poppies, any idea where I could get one? ;-)

I won’t be buying one of them, for clarity.

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Originally Posted by He's here!

Is this standard practice among SNP MSPs? I saw a story about Michelle Thomson doing so but thought it was just her. Pretty tacky stuff nevertheless.

I was actually more surprised to see she's back in the SNP. I thought she got kicked out a few years back.

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What should be standard practice for poppy wearing? Mandatory for all? Must be a red one? Minimum donation level. Its pathetic, every single year the poppy police get on their high horses and try to cone over as all superior. And for the record I do contribute to the poppy fund but very rarely actually wear a poppy

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Originally Posted by weecounty hibby

What should be standard practice for poppy wearing? Mandatory for all? Must be a red one? Minimum donation level. Its pathetic, every single year the poppy police get on their high horses and try to cone over as all superior. And for the record I do contribute to the poppy fund but very rarely actually wear a poppy

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I meant the Yes badge tacked on to hers. Seemed unnecessarily political.

Aside from that I've never really got why folk get so worked up about poppy wearing these days. If you don't want to wear one then don't.

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Originally Posted by weecounty hibby

I could counter by asking why unionists and loyalist have hijacked remembrance to push their own agendas and try to shame anyone who doesn't kow tow to wearing a poppy but I wont. Remembrance used to be a week or two at most and pretty dignified but it's now a year round thing and just look at Ibrox last night and then talk about hijacking!

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There it is the Whataboutary…defend the SNP with look over there defence…speaking myself as a former NCO in the Army and a member of the Royal British Legion the poppy is apolitical and there for raising funds for veterans charities and to remember those who gave their lives in combat. I abhor the white poppy brigade, they have all year to sell their stuff but choose to use rememberance to sell their poppys, now any and I do mean any political party who use a poppy to promote their political point of view are ****.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Berwickhibby

There it is the Whataboutary…defend the SNP with look over there defence…speaking myself as a former NCO in the Army and a member of the Royal British Legion the poppy is apolitical and there for raising funds for veterans charities and to remember those who gave their lives in combat. I abhor the white poppy brigade, they have all year to sell their stuff but choose to use rememberance to sell their poppys, now any and I do mean any political party who use a poppy to promote their political point of view are ****.

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But those who wear a white poppy probably wouldn't wear a red one. So I don't think either are taking away funding in that respect

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Originally Posted by Berwickhibby

There it is the Whataboutary…defend the SNP with look over there defence…speaking myself as a former NCO in the Army and a member of the Royal British Legion the poppy is apolitical and there for raising funds for veterans charities and to remember those who gave their lives in combat. I abhor the white poppy brigade, they have all year to sell their stuff but choose to use rememberance to sell their poppys, now any and I do mean any political party who use a poppy to promote their political point of view are ****.

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Where did I defend them? I just can't stand the I'm better than you cos I wear a red poppy brigade. Every ****ing year without fail. You may not want to hear it but the poppy has been taken over as a signal for loyalists and unionism and has become very political. And actually some of the merchandise is as tacky as **** and imo diisrespects the fallen more than someone wearing a white poppy in remembrance of ALL deaths due to war. As I say I always make a contribution but very seldom wear a poppy, I don't need to make that particular statement to show my respects

A white poppy is a remembrance for all those who have died in war and a commitment towards peace.

Anyone who has an objection to that probably needs to take a look at themselves.

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Originally Posted by Since90+2

A white poppy is a remembrance for all those who have died in war and a commitment towards peace.

Anyone who has an objection to that probably needs to take a look at themselves.

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It's also been around for almost 90 years.

White, red or none, I don’t care. I do what I do and am happy to leave others to do the same.
The MSP in question didn’t set out to offend anybody , there really is nothing here to get worked up about.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Berwickhibby

Why are F***wit SNP MSP’s wearing white poppies with Yes badge in the middle, bad enough the white poppy brigade hijack remembrance without money raised selling their poppies going to poppy Scotland charities. But this is disgusting ��

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As a former squaddie do you not want peace? I assume you know that the white poppy is a symbol of peace.


https://www.ppu.org.uk/remembrance-white-poppies


Been worn for 90 years.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Berwickhibby

Why are F***wit SNP MSP’s wearing white poppies with Yes badge in the middle, bad enough the white poppy brigade hijack remembrance without money raised selling their poppies going to poppy Scotland charities. But this is disgusting ��

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Oh here we ****ing go, it's started late this year but I guess it was inevitable. I used to wear my poppy in a show of respect for those who paid the ultimate price for my freedom, now I'm almost ashamed to wear it because it is now a source of conflict rather than a symbol of peace. The right have hijacked it and turned it into a competition to see who can virtue signal the loudest and use it as a weapon to beat political opponents with. Just **** off with your poppy wars.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Berwickhibby

There it is the Whataboutary…defend the SNP with look over there defence…speaking myself as a former NCO in the Army and a member of the Royal British Legion the poppy is apolitical and there for raising funds for veterans charities and to remember those who gave their lives in combat. I abhor the white poppy brigade, they have all year to sell their stuff but choose to use rememberance to sell their poppys, now any and I do mean any political party who use a poppy to promote their political point of view are ****.

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my grandad always wore a white poppy as he was a conscientious objector after WWII - i.e. it wasn't that he was refusing to go to war, it had finished, he was refusing to do military service in peace time so did a stint in jail instead.

The army is in principle an apolitical entity, but in reality, it's use is always tied in with empire, whether that's in aggression or in defence - in the UK's case, the former far, far more than the latter. You could make the case for the troubles being defensive, but there is still a debate to be had there, and it's certainly the legacy of empire. WWII was essentially a horrific hangover of the previous war between competing empires...I know you don't need a history lesson...I just think it's entirely valid to want to check out of the entire practice and indeed protest against it (peacefully) is one's perspective is that the whole remembrance thing in some way glorifies the deaths of poor people fighting rich peoples' wars. It certainly isn't a dig at the people who have died and are being remembered, though.

The other element is that it is a complete disgrace that veterans charities need to exist - if the state is going to send people off to war, surely it is the state's responsibility to look after them properly when they return, should they require support? The whole remembrance thing seems to be an exercise in pawning off responsibility on that front.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Since90+2

A white poppy is a remembrance for all those who have died in war and a commitment towards peace.

Anyone who has an objection to that probably needs to take a look at themselves.

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Which is what the RBL started out to pursue.

Peace that is.

I don’t think they honoured all who fell in war.

They pursue peace whilst also supporting armed forces day which is a day to sell the idea of joining the forces. It is contradictory.

Of course the work the RBL does with vets should be applauded.

The PPU wants no vets.

As for the PPU ‘using’ remembrance day as a way to ‘advertise’.

I’m not entirely sure when else someone would expect that people would wear a white poppy.

You can purchase a white poppy all year round if you should want to.

Both red and white poppies have been hijacked, by right wing and stop the war pacifists. Wonder if when the last of the world war veterans pass people will stop using war to score points.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Berwickhibby

There it is the Whataboutary…defend the SNP with look over there defence…speaking myself as a former NCO in the Army and a member of the Royal British Legion the poppy is apolitical and there for raising funds for veterans charities and to remember those who gave their lives in combat. I abhor the white poppy brigade, they have all year to sell their stuff but choose to use rememberance to sell their poppys, now any and I do mean any political party who use a poppy to promote their political point of view are ****.

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It's only whataboutery because it's something you yourself care so much about, which you are entitled to do. From other people's point of view its sowhataboutery. People are allowed to donate to what they want. For what it's worth the "yes" in the middle is pretty shan, whether they are trying to be provocative or countering the doolally edge of "poppy enforcers" or just think it looks good they look crappy imo. Then again, so what?

Sent from my SM-A528B using Tapatalk

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Stairway 2 7

Both red and white poppies have been hijacked, by right wing and stop the war pacifists. Wonder if when the last of the world war veterans pass people will stop using war to score points.

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The white poppy is the symbol of the peace pledge union.

I’m not sure who you would expect to wear it, other than those who want wars to stop?

The "yes" on Thomson's poppy is extremely crass. She's definitely someone I'd rather was an Alba member.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Alex Trager

The white poppy is the symbol of the peace pledge union.

I’m not sure who you would expect to wear it, other than those who want wars to stop?

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Agreed, not sure being a "stop the war pacifist" could be deemed anything other than a good thing. I'd be quite happy if people who wanted to stop wars hijacked things, but maybe that's just me.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Alex Trager

The white poppy is the symbol of the peace pledge union.

I’m not sure who you would expect to wear it, other than those who want wars to stop?

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To be fair those who have fought in them and are wearing the red poppy are just as likely to want wars to stop.

‘War is sweet to those who have not experienced it.’ (Erasmus)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Alex Trager

The white poppy is the symbol of the peace pledge union.

I’m not sure who you would expect to wear it, other than those who want wars to stop?

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I mean the actual stop the war coalition. They have pushed it heavily. They want to stop unjust wars they say but pick and choose. They are too divisive, like not attacking assad in Syria.

While I disagree with the peace pledge Union at least they are consistent in opposing all wars.

Pacifism is fine until an aggressor attacks you or someone else unjustly.

I also think the red poppy is for all victims of war, although its got beyond ridiculous and lost all original meaning

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Stairway 2 7

Pacifism is fine until an aggressor attacks you or someone else unjustly.

I also think the red poppy is for all victims of war, although its got beyond ridiculous and lost all original meaning

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How can the RBL be pro peace whilst sponsoring armed forces day? It makes no sense.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Alex Trager

How can the RBL be pro peace whilst sponsoring armed forces day? It makes no sense.

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I didn't say they were pro peace?

SNP to open up new route for people smuggling.

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/scotland-now/new-ferry-route-between-scotland-28436043

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

SNP to open up new route for people smuggling.

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/scotland-now/new-ferry-route-between-scotland-28436043

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Put it on the holiday thread. I like the idea but since read its 20 hours so 2 days of your holiday. Might be good for trucks not wanting the mess at the channel, hopefully kicks on

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc...d-63572743.amp

Teachers in Scotland will stage a 24-hour walkout on 24 November after voting overwhelmingly to strike in a dispute over pay.

Members of the EIS union rejected a 5% pay offer, saying they wanted 10%.

EIS general secretary Andrea Bradley said they had become "increasingly angry over their treatment" by employers and the Scottish government.

Deputy First Minister John Swinney previously said there was no more money to fund public sector pay rises.

The move comes after Scotland's largest nursing union voted to go on strike for the first time ever in a dispute over pay.

The EIS said 96% of its members backed a teachers' strike on a 71% turnout

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

SNP to open up new route for people smuggling.

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/scotla...tland-28436043

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We’ve had a ferry on that route before but the problem is it will probably be cheaper and quicker just to drive to England and travel from there.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Hibrandenburg

Oh here we ****ing go, it's started late this year but I guess it was inevitable. I used to wear my poppy in a show of respect for those who paid the ultimate price for my freedom, now I'm almost ashamed to wear it because it is now a source of conflict rather than a symbol of peace. The right have hijacked it and turned it into a competition to see who can virtue signal the loudest and use it as a weapon to beat political opponents with. Just **** off with your poppy wars.

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:top marks

As someone who has worn a white poppy, they come with a bit of wire to put through a buttonhole and I have fixed in place with the safety pin.

Assuming Michelle Thomson doesn't have a buttonhole in her lapel then fixing the poppy with a pin badge seems sensible. Unfortunately opponents only see the badge and get all offended.

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Originally Posted by Stairway 2 7

Put it on the holiday thread. I like the idea but since read its 20 hours so 2 days of your holiday. Might be good for trucks not wanting the mess at the channel, hopefully kicks on

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2 Days on a boat...Till ye reach yer destination.....Wi Fid n' Drink... Fae Edinburgh or theraboots...?
Where dae a sign up Sir! :greengrin

Saor Alba

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Berwickhibby

There it is the Whataboutary…defend the SNP with look over there defence…speaking myself as a former NCO in the Army and a member of the Royal British Legion the poppy is apolitical and there for raising funds for veterans charities and to remember those who gave their lives in combat. I abhor the white poppy brigade, they have all year to sell their stuff but choose to use rememberance to sell their poppys, now any and I do mean any political party who use a poppy to promote their political point of view are ****.

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How do you feel about the other veteran charities who use this time of year to concentrate their fund raising activities on the back of the poppy?

Personally I'm a bit saddened by it as I feel it's taking money that would have gone to the poppy appeal.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

SNP to open up new route for people smuggling.

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/scotland-now/new-ferry-route-between-scotland-28436043

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I've seen this in a few media outlets recently.

I'm not asking you personally but this was originally announced back in June! Why the fuss now?

I've got a red poppy on the door of my fridge.

I long considered myself a pacifist, but I bought this after living in Ypres for a while (work contract) and visiting the many museums that went into great detail on the death and suffering of the millions of young men sacrificed by their 'betters' in WW1 (the war to end all wars).

One of the museums I visited was particularly poignant as the building itself was used as a hospital during the war. There were photographs of those poor young guys alongside letters they sent to their parents. It was pretty moving stuff.


How anybody, like the Right-wingers and their Loyalist/Rangers counterparts, can politicize that disgusts me to a level that I couldn't possibly put into words.


Putting a political slogan... even one I agree with... on a poppy on Remembrance Day? Sorry, but that's just plain wrong.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Keith_M

I've got a red poppy on the door of my fridge.

I long considered myself a pacifist, but I bought this after living in Ypres for a while (work contract) and visiting the many museums that went into great detail on the death and suffering of the millions of young men sacrificed by their 'betters' in WW1 (the war to end all wars).

One of the museums I visited was particularly poignant as the building itself was used as a hospital during the war. There were photographs of those poor young guys alongside letters they sent to their parents. It was pretty moving stuff.


How anybody, like the Right-wingers and their Loyalist/Rangers counterparts, can politicize that disgusts me to a level that I couldn't possibly put into words.


Putting a political slogan... even one I agree with... on a poppy on Remembrance Day? Sorry, but that's just plain wrong.

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I couldn’t agree more. Another thing that is jarring with me is these enamelled pin badges with a poppy and a football club. Is there any real need for it. I think it sums up the need to seen doing it type of thing. I also recoiled at the poppy wreath produced with the Hibs badge in the middle. Same type of thing.
I myself do not wear one but give very generously to the poppy appeal. I pay my respects and remember. That’s enough for me .
Possibly the wrong thread for this

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/e...-end-n2stldn63

Yada yada Euan McColm, right wing commentator etc etc...but he makes some good points.

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Originally Posted by He's here!

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/e...-end-n2stldn63

Yada yada Euan McColm, right wing commentator etc etc...but he makes some good points.

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Could only see the first two paragraphs but every single word of those paragraphs was complete bollocks. Perhaps it improves later on.

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Originally Posted by grunt

Could only see the first two paragraphs but every single word of those paragraphs was complete bollocks. Perhaps it improves later on.

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It won't.

It's an opinion piece written from an anti Sturgeon position. There's no objectivity.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by He's here!

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/e...-end-n2stldn63

Yada yada Euan McColm, right wing commentator etc etc...but he makes some good points.

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Behind a paywall. What are the good points the right wing commentator expresses?

Sent from my SM-A528B using Tapatalk

Some clown has torched the War Memorial at the City Chambers. Nae need for that nonsense.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by greenlex

I couldn’t agree more. Another thing that is jarring with me is these enamelled pin badges with a poppy and a football club. Is there any real need for it. I think it sums up the need to seen doing it type of thing. I also recoiled at the poppy wreath produced with the Hibs badge in the middle. Same type of thing.
I myself do not wear one but give very generously to the poppy appeal. I pay my respects and remember. That’s enough for me .
Possibly the wrong thread for this

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TBF that wreath was laid by Hibernian FC on behalf of players and fans who have died in war.

Seems fitting that we as a club put our club crest in the wreath.

J

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Originally Posted by Bristolhibby

TBF that wreath was laid by Hibernian FC on behalf of players and fans who have died in war.

Seems fitting that we as a club put our club crest in the wreath.

J

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I see it that way as well... on the other hand, those wee metal badges etc are a different matter... they might be officially sanctioned by the Lady Haig guys and get money from them tho? :dunno:

Ps still think it's a bit "off" ....

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Betty Boop

Some clown has torched the War Memorial at the City Chambers. Nae need for that nonsense.

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Set fire to the wreaths on the high Street and someone also destroyed the poppy display beside the Scott monument, brain dead

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Betty Boop

Some clown has torched the War Memorial at the City Chambers. Nae need for that nonsense.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Stairway 2 7

Set fire to the wreaths on the high Street and someone also destroyed the poppy display beside the Scott monument, brain dead

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Was it SNP supporters that did it?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

Was it SNP supporters that did it?

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F***ing morons whoever it was but yes this is for a new thread.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

Was it SNP supporters that did it?

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Well there was a conversation about wreaths remembrance so I assume that's why bb brought it up. If no threads went in any tangents this forum would have about a quarter of the posts.

It's clearly nothing to do with the snp and just some nutter and I'm sure everyone clearly knows that

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Stairway 2 7

Well there was a conversation about wreaths remembrance so I assume that's why bb brought it up. If no threads went in any tangents this forum would have about a quarter of the posts.

It's clearly nothing to do with the snp and just some nutter and I'm sure everyone clearly knows that

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Cool.

I saw some Twatters suggesting/assuming it was, and thought I'd maybe missed something.

Sturgeon's days are surely numbered now.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/n...cats-l775bx33n

Ps. That's a dog in the photo, not a cat.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

Sturgeon's days are surely numbered now.

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The Times. A once renowned newspaper.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

Sturgeon's days are surely numbered now.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/n...cats-l775bx33n

Ps. That's a dog in the photo, not a cat.

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Had to look and the Priti Patel doll is pure evil 😈

Proceeds of crime hearing against Natalie McGarry to seize money that she stole. Suggests that she owns a property or has funds in an account.

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Originally Posted by Berwickhibby

Proceeds of crime hearing against Natalie McGarry to seize money that she stole. Suggests that she owns a property or has funds in an account.

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I saw that.

They are chasing her for £162k, when she "only" stole £25k. Why so much more?

If she managed to make over £135k from a £25k investment, I want her IFA :greengrin

Edit. The legal costs for the prosecution were over £122k, so that may be the reason. Didn't know that came under the definition of POC. Does that mean that every convicted person can be done for thelr legal costs as well?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

I saw that.

They are chasing her for £162k, when she "only" stole £25k. Why so much more?

If she managed to make over £135k from a £25k investment, I want her IFA :greengrin

Edit. The legal costs for the prosecution were over £122k, so that may be the reason. Didn't know that came under the definition of POC. Does that mean that every convicted person can be done for thelr legal costs as well?

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Could it be that she has a property and this initial figure makes no allowance for any mortgage there may be on it? If that makes sense.:greengrin

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Originally Posted by marinello59

Could it be that she has a property and this initial figure makes no allowance for any mortgage there may be on it? If that makes sense.:greengrin

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Not sure I do understand? I was thinking the sum they are looking to reclaim maybe was to cover legal costs with the additional costs of the retrial? Whatever, I still don't believe she should have been jailed. Really feel for her daughter in all this.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by marinello59

Could it be that she has a property and this initial figure makes no allowance for any mortgage there may be on it? If that makes sense.:greengrin

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I wondered that, too.

But.... if they recover £162k from the property sale, who pays off the mortgage? In that scenario, she loses the property and still has the mortgage to pay.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

I wondered that, too.

But.... if they recover £162k from the property sale, who pays off the mortgage? In that scenario, she loses the property and still has the mortgage to pay.

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According to the Herald the "criminal benefit" amount is £131K.

Quote:

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How is criminal benefit defined?

Criminal benefit is defined as the income and revenue generated and those taxes and fees avoid by the unlawful, criminal activity that the individual or organisation have been found guilty of committing.

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Could be she used the money towards a house purchase with her new husband the Tory councillor? And £131K is the equity they've built up in the meantime?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JeMeSouviens

According to the Herald the "criminal benefit" amount is £131K.



Could be she used the money towards a house purchase with her new husband the Tory councillor? And £131K is the equity they've built up in the meantime?

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Possibly.

3 things:-

1. she was broke, and had a lot of debt. I thought that was the main reason for the theft.

2. it would only be her share of the increase.

3. that's some jump in equity. Again, I want her adviser :greengrin

Maybe she put the £25k on Hibs to win in 2016?

Turns our that the Crown are going after "unexplained wealth". Sounds like it will be up to her to prove its source.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

Turns our that the Crown are going after "unexplained wealth". Sounds like it will be up to her to prove its source.

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Ah. That makes sense.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

Turns our that the Crown are going after "unexplained wealth". Sounds like it will be up to her to prove its source.

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For her sake, I hope she does better than we've managed. :greengrin

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JeMeSouviens

For her sake, I hope she does better than we've managed. :greengrin

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:)))

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

Turns our that the Crown are going after "unexplained wealth". Sounds like it will be up to her to prove its source.

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I'd imagine there will be a more than a few tory wives watching this with interest!

Oh.

https://archive.ph/hX1Yt

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Unions reacted with fury today after the Tories “betrayed” British workers by handing a £1.6billion shipbuilding contract to a Spanish-led bid.

A senior Labour MP accused Defence Secretary Ben Wallace of “stabbing” UK industry “in the back” after he confirmed the deal to build three Fleet Solid Support ships would be given to the Team Resolute consortium, spearheaded by Madrid-based Navantia.

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by grunt

Oh.

https://archive.ph/hX1Yt

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But are they complex ships? 😉

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Originally Posted by Jack

But are they complex ships? [emoji6]

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At £1.6bn they are not rowing boats.[emoji23]


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jack

But are they complex ships? 😉

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No - as explained why here: https://ukdefencejournal.org.uk/woul...t-left-the-uk/ !

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Originally Posted by archie

No - as explained why here: https://ukdefencejournal.org.uk/woul...t-left-the-uk/ !

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It seems there's plenty opportunities to build non complex ships then!

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Originally Posted by Jack

It seems there's plenty opportunities to build non complex ships then!

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Opportunities to bid for the work anyway.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by archie

Opportunities to bid for the work anyway.

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Bid? Looks like contract awarded...

Quote:

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A senior Labour MP accused Defence Secretary Ben Wallace of “stabbing” UK industry “in the back” after he confirmed the deal to build three Fleet Solid Support ships would be given to the Team Resolute consortium, spearheaded by Madrid-based Navantia.

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Surprised no thread. All Edinburgh schools closed on Thursday due to strikes, term time school nurseries too.

https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.c...oppage-3921286

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Originally Posted by Stairway 2 7

Surprised no thread. All Edinburgh schools closed on Thursday due to strikes, term time school nurseries too.

https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.c...oppage-3921286

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Think it's national. Mind reading Glasgow planning 12 days over Nov/Dec. Not just a pay issue for them, something else which for the life of me I now can't remember.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Stairway 2 7

Surprised no thread. All Edinburgh schools closed on Thursday due to strikes, term time school nurseries too.

https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.c...oppage-3921286

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My kids who are still at school are delighted!

Two further strikes announced for next year:

Two more Scottish school strike days announced - BBC News

See the SNP want to restrict alcohol advertising.

https://consult.gov.scot/alcohol-pol...2Yk98F9FksVA0c

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SteveHFC

See the SNP want to restrict alcohol advertising.

https://consult.gov.scot/alcohol-pol...2Yk98F9FksVA0c

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Recommended by the WHO, and implemented by other European nations.

What's not to like?

An alcohol ad ban in Scottish sport could have 'grave' financial consequences for football and cost the country any chance of hosting future major events, the SFA and SPFL have warned.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by grunt

An alcohol ad ban in Scottish sport could have 'grave' financial consequences for football and cost the country any chance of hosting future major events, the SFA and SPFL have warned.

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Not sure I'd want to use the SFA and SPFL as my moral compass. :greengrin

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

Not sure I'd want to use the SFA and SPFL as my moral compass. :greengrin

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And FIFA seem OK with it at the World Cup!


Edit not UEFA!