Quote:
Originally Posted by blueisthecolour
Make sure you pay cash, there's nae mair credit for the likes of you.
Oh aye, and don't offer 8p in the pound for it either. Like your former rivals, that just won't wash any more :greengrin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blueisthecolour
Make sure you pay cash, there's nae mair credit for the likes of you.
Oh aye, and don't offer 8p in the pound for it either. Like your former rivals, that just won't wash any more :greengrin
[QUOTE=CentreLine;3295158]Do you know what, ive had a little banter tonight, hopfully some haven't taken much offence, but that is a really good post you have posted and thanks for your good wishes.Quote:
Originally Posted by blueisthecolour
Look at you, complimenting yourself on your own posts :greengrinQuote:
Originally Posted by blueisthecolour
[QUOTE=blueisthecolour;3295169]Being pisted would probably account for the melancholy tripe in his post....night night.Quote:
Originally Posted by CentreLine
Is that just like a Noncer:greengrinQuote:
Originally Posted by blueisthecolour
Sponsor ya prat.
[QUOTE=Hamilton Handling;3295174]So would being fisted....:greengrinQuote:
Originally Posted by blueisthecolour
[QUOTE=CropleyWasGod;3295181]Hey, steady, that would bring tears to the eyes and there has not been too much to cry about this weekendQuote:
Originally Posted by Hamilton Handling
Stevie.............Stevie................Stevie... .............Quote:
Originally Posted by blueisthecolour
Oh flower of Scotland, when will we see, the huns again....Quote:
Originally Posted by blackpoolhibs
:faf:
Quote:
Originally Posted by blackpoolhibs
You wanted it when you knew thats the best you would get.Quote:
Originally Posted by blueisthecolour
Your silence recently speaks volumes
Sent from my GT-I9001 using Tapatalk 2
"I hope they do because I think they will bring with them a strong lobby for a return to "safe" standing areas in grounds as well as a greater respect for the "smaller" clubs. It really could be a healthy thingi for the game. "
Rangers and their fans never had and never will have any respect for 'smaller' clubs.
Good post - and I hope you're right that the genuine football fans among the Rangers support get the upper hand on their journey.Quote:
Originally Posted by CentreLine
Let's just remember that Hibs have been liquidated before - and we still consider our history from 1875.
no we haven'tQuote:
Originally Posted by Liberal Hibby
OK - 'ceased to exist'Quote:
Originally Posted by bighairyfaeleith
we have never ceased to exist, a dodgy person, I believe our company secretary took a load of cash from our account and ****** off, we then did the decent thing and took a years break from the league while we sorted ourself out financially.Quote:
Originally Posted by Liberal Hibby
We didn't
- Borrow ****loads of cash
- Buy players we couldn't afford
- not pay our taxes
- break SFA rules to keep winning
Anyone want to confirm the hard facts on this wee lie the huns like to push.
Aye right.Quote:
Originally Posted by bighairyfaeleith
sorry maybe sounded wrong, no calling you a hun, but heard a few huns come out with this nowQuote:
Originally Posted by Liberal Hibby
Cheers. The cases are completely different - we were stuffed by the other half of the OF stealing our players and weakening the club to a point of uncompetitiveness (the Hibs cup winning side teamsheet of 1887 and Celtc's founding teamsheet in 1888 make interesting reading).Quote:
Originally Posted by bighairyfaeleith
The 'oldco' folded in 1891 and we were readmitted to Scottish football on a non-sectarian basis in 1893. We still count our 1887 Scottish cup as 50% of that trophy's wins.
But the similarity is - that in 1888 (when professionalism was officially banned) one half of the OF were happy to break the rules by bribing supposedly amateur players. Different century. Different form of cheating. Different arsecheek.
Same Old Firm.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bighairyfaeleith
Mismanagement over the next few years led to the club becoming homeless and it ceased operating during 1891.[9] A reformed club was established and they acquired a lease on a site in late 1892 that was to become known as Easter Road. Hibernian played its first match at Easter Road on 4 February 1893.[22] Despite this interruption, the club today views the period since 1875 as one continued history and therefore counts the honours won between 1875 and 1891, including the 1887 Scottish Cup.[23][24] The club were admitted to the Scottish Football League in 1893, although they had to win the Second Division twice before being elected into the First Division in 1895.[9]
scotch corner......scotch corner......scotch corner..........Quote:
Originally Posted by blackpoolhibs
Well I came on here tonight and wondered why 5 pages had appeared all of a sudden. Then I saw bluewasthecolour had been contributing. Hilarious stuff!!
Met a guy wae a rangers top on tonight, I thought, how retro !!
http://www.scotsman.com/sport/footba...down-1-2412833
Great read here. :agree:
42 clubs. Should have been split into 3 leagues of 14. Rangers back where they belong in two seasons. 14 clubs in each league - play each other twice then split into top 6 bottom 8 (play each other twice again top six playing total 36 games bottom 8 playing total 40 games for much needed extra revenue). All clubs play each other equal home and away.
How can anyone argue with that?:agree:
[QUOTE=blueisthecolour;3295169]Are you not forgetting it will not be any adventure as your disgusting colleagues are going to boycott all away games? It is the town councils of these teams who should be thanking you for not turning up and wrecking their towns. Will be interesting to see if your manky mob stick to their boycott. By the way and that I also am firmly in the gtf category when it comes to you.Quote:
Originally Posted by CentreLine
Yip. A bit like when a bird knocks you back (not that I know anything about that) and you tell your mates "I didnae fancy her anyway. Just asked her for a laugh"Quote:
Originally Posted by bighairyfaeleith
When inside you are seething.
That how all the Huns are feeling right now! And with the running costs of Ibrox and Murray Park around £20m a year I think its only going to get better.
Enjoy.
It would only result in the Huns being back in 2 seasons if (a) they win the leagues or play-offs, and (b) they were able to implement it in the next couple of weeks. Seems like a good set-up, mind. If there had been a bit more leadership from the Governing bodies before now, it may well have been the solution. Instead they fannied around trying desperately to be seen to be doing something whilst in reality pushing for the status quo.Quote:
Originally Posted by SkintHibby
I notice that although quick to dump Dunfrmline from SPL pages and also to add Ross County to the same. We still have articles and 'rangers' as one of the list4d teams. how long will the denial last?
Tough for some SPL teams. In recent years we've seen the likes of St Mirren, Killie, St Johnstone and ICT become established SPL clubs with decent teams.Quote:
Originally Posted by Emerald
That hasn't been achieved by sustainable spending based on income from their support coming in.
If we have a period of adjustment then it's much needed.
what would be the impact on game if by 5pm monday newco where back in spl or in div 1?
Because if all the 'erchiehole's' were launched it would be a very sparsely poulated place indeed :wink:Quote:
Originally Posted by TQM
Armageddon. A quick death for Scottish football.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dalkeith
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dalkeith
I suspect that Rangers could sue, if they were so inclined. A number of their players, with substantial market value, have walked away on the grounds that they were demoted. I am sure they could evidence others that have not been signed.
Just saying, likes.
http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/footbal...6908-23908629/
Quote:
DUNDEE UNITED and Hearts last night insisted Rangers newco stand NO chance of being admitted to the SPL or an SPL2 tomorrow. A conference call of the SPL board took place on Friday, outlining the options available following the SFL’s decision to put Gers in the Third Division. And further informal calls between other club chiefs have since taken place ahead of tomorrow’s SPL agm.
United chairman Stephen Thompson, who jetted in today from a family holiday in the USA, told MailSport last night the SPL can’t make a mockery of democracy. He said: “Both scenarios are total non-starters. They have NO chance of happening.” Hearts managing director David Southern also fired out a similar message last night.
It’s understood Aberdeen, St Johnstone, Motherwell, Celtic and Hibs are just as unequivocal on their original decision to refuse the newco a place in the top flight.
Interesting comments from St. Mirren! I wonder who the five clubs are? Killie, Motherwell, ICT, St Mirren look like the obvious ones, but who else? When will our 'leaders' start talking up the Scottish game though? Well said Hertz and Dundee Utd.Quote:
Originally Posted by Emerald
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scotsman Website
No matter if Sevco play in div 3 or are suspended by the SFA the result will be the same as if the SFL hat votied them in to div 1.
The year long propaganda, scaremongering and no doubt a genuine administration victim or two will ensure Sevco are back in any reconstructed top flight next season and probably without any further sanction.
The chances of a 3 or 4 year delay to a top flight return I would suggest are very near nil.
Unless we hold strong:wink:
When are the Hibs board going to release a statement to let people know where they stand? :confused:
I don't like the silence at all.
Well not only were we struggling we had to compete with more clubs overspending, well I have no sympathy for st mirren and ict. Now we know why they could compete In the top flight. Rangers on a smaller scale. IMO its time to bring in rules to stop this kind of irresponsibility.
Not sure if it's already been suggested, but a worry for me is that clubs like Killiemarnock who now need more punters coming through the gates might attempt to acquire some former Rangers fans by starting to present themselves as a Protestant football club. And so Protestant bile, which has traditionally attached itself to just one big club might, with the demise of that focus, become attached to several smaller ones. This would not be good.
Haven't killie already had an element of this before?Quote:
Originally Posted by reallapsedhibee
I doubt the people on the killie board are saying "Lets become bigots and hopefully we can attract some desperate huns".
It's more likely that ex-Rangers fans will just turn up for games, dragging their bile along with them.
Every club has to cut back, will we now try and attract more catholics? :confused: Clubs will try to attract more fans from every faith, and nationality.Quote:
Originally Posted by reallapsedhibee
This is the best thing that could ever happen to Scottish fitba. We're a tiny nation of 5 million who stupidly based their whole footballing model on that off the most heavily invested (and most debt-ridden leagues) on the planet. If we now find our league being the equivalent of the Irish and Croatian so be it. That's our level. Let those who are "fortunate" enough to be supporting a club in England, France, Germany, Spain and Italy continue to chase European glory and let us just get back to basics and back to football. If Sky f*** off (PLEASE DO!!!!) and we all need to cut back so be it.... Bring it on.
When Petrie's finished his croissants and logged online to see his name has been mentioned in a leaked email. I'd expect something tomorrow...Quote:
Originally Posted by wee_hibee
They will struggle seeing as ROD is part of the corruption going on at the SFAQuote:
Originally Posted by wee_hibee
Quote:
Originally Posted by theonlywayisup
I think Killie are the only obvious one. The usual suspects would have been Hearts but Vlad has been throwing money at them lately. The only other one might be Aberdeen but Stewart Milne would have to withdraw his backing, or get pissed off with the amount of abuse his stewardship gets. Same could be said for STF I suppose. United are in a better position this year than last, following the sales last year, although they are more reliant on TV money than some of the others. ICT, St.Mirren and St.J all have little or no debt to carry and Celtic, although they now have the largest debt outside Hearts, are in a good position and can carry it easily.
Excellent postQuote:
Originally Posted by Antifa Hibs
Banish the big earners, keep 3-4 experienced pros and let the young boys flourish
Couldn't agree more. :agree:Quote:
Originally Posted by Antifa Hibs
Besides, if most clubs in the SPL can only attract an average of 5000 (0.001%) of the Scottish population to their grounds, then its clear that we're not doing enough to promote our game.
Any proof to back that statement up Stuart? :confused:Quote:
Originally Posted by stuart7-0
I don't actually know how many DodoHun fans were catholics, but I feel confident that there won't be 50,000 people attending SevcoHuns D3 matches, and that many of those who won't be attending will have enjoyed the sound of the loyal folk songs. Is all I'm saying.Quote:
Originally Posted by blackpoolhibs
If Hibs went pop tomorrow, would you go and watch Hearts, i imagine they are your nearest club?Quote:
Originally Posted by reallapsedhibee
I think you are needlessly worrying about nothing here. :wink:
Also if they enjoy the loyal folk songs so much , why would they go somewhere where they are not sung?Quote:
Originally Posted by reallapsedhibee
That would never happen.Quote:
Originally Posted by blackpoolhibs
As Hearts aren't our closest club.
The fanbase of Leith Athletics would take a sudden upturn though. :wink:
Quote:
Originally Posted by stuart7-0
Wait and see.
:greengrin I'd forgotten about them.Quote:
Originally Posted by wee_hibee
I'm hoping your right and knowing our ROD he'll put the necessary spin on it to save his neck !Quote:
Originally Posted by The Falcon
I would be tempted to watch Hearts if they adopted enough of the things I like about Hibs - for example, if they abandoned their disgusting strips and adopted green tops with white sleeves.Quote:
Originally Posted by blackpoolhibs
Fitba is an attractive game. If the Huns do actually go pop, 50 thousand people will not disappear.
I'm not really that worried - it's just there's possibly an argument for keeping poison in one place until an effective antidote is invented. :wink:
Quote:
Originally Posted by crewetollhibee
:greengrin
It depends Stuart. If Petrie was actually behind it then his position is untenable, given his public utterances.Quote:
Originally Posted by stuart7-0
I suspect something more political though, and I further suspect that Rod is exactly where he wants to be, having played his part (from the inside) in engineering this situation to end up in a place of his choosing.
No votes have went Rangers way have they? Are Rangers in a better position than what we wanted them to be (other than die altogether that is)?
I think if you had asked Rod at the start of all this what the end result should be this would not be far away from his, or our, desired outcome.
Your Maths are wrong. It's about 0.1% of the national population.Quote:
Originally Posted by wee_hibee
It's also an irrelevant statistic. Per capita, Scottish football is one of the best attended leagues in the world. As a percentage of population, the only valid figure is local support, which is very high. Hibs have unfortunately the lowest percentage local attending support of any spl team, around 2%. Most clubs attract at least 5% on a match day.
As I said - for Hibs sake I hope yer right mateQuote:
Originally Posted by The Falcon
I can remember reading years ago that for a club to thrive they needed to attract 10% of the local population on a regular basis, IIRC that was in the mid 70's and may have related to Engurlund. AFAIK didn't RP say that we needed an average of 11k to break even does that figure still stand.Quote:
Originally Posted by Twa Cairpets
Tommo's latest blog
http://blogs.channel4.com/alex-thoms...ked-email/2305
WTF has Petrie been up to?
Apologies I’ve not been able to get this out in full til now but here’s the email leaked to Channel 4 News last Thursday the details of which I blogged on Friday.
Some club chairmen say that Mr Regan should now resign as a result of what’s going on here, back on June 23rd. That is a matter for them.
The email of June 23 is to:
Scottish Premier League chief exec Neil Doncaster; Scottish Football League boss David Longmuir, SFL President Jim Ballantyne, SFA vice-president Alan McRae, Hibernian FC chief exec Rod Petrie and SPL chairman Ralph Topping.
It seems to me the key points revealed are:
1. SR talks about RFC being “relegated” which isn’t possible since it’s liquidated, not relegated
2. He’s setting up a secret back channel to brief the Ibrox Newco and C Green via Mr Petrie to avoid ‘surprises’
3. The timetable laid out appears to show a catastrophic mis-reading of the mood of both SPL and SFL who clearly called his bluff on all key votes.
4. Dundee into SPL as a fait accompli. Hardly likely to please rival candidates
5. Green must accept the transfer embargo even though this has been ruled unlawful.
Stewart Regan’s email:
”Dear all,
Many thanks for your contribution and support over the last two weeks in trying to deliver a programme of change that will move Scottish football forward whilst addressing the need to deal with the Rangers matter with integrity and in line with our own values as an organisation.
I was hugely encouraged with where we got to last night on a long and tiring phone call and I thank all of you for your efforts to move this issue forward.
I thought it would be helpful if I summarised where I think we are:
1. The Rangers Football Club will be relegated to the 1st Division of the SFL with immediate effect and will be replaced in the SPL by Dundee FC.
2. The television rights for Rangers FC matches in the SFL will be purchased by the SPL for the sum of £1m as a one-off fee for the season 2012/2013.
3. The two leagues will merge into a single league body – The Scottish Professional Football League – effective season 2013/14 – with a working party set up immediately involving representatives from the SPL, SFL and (if required) the Scottish FA to plan the integration of the two bodies – people, rules, rebranding, commercial considerations and so on.
4. A new Board of Directors will be appointed to govern the single league. The make up of this Board will consist of an Independent Chairman, CEO, 3 representatives from the Premier League, 2 representatives from the Championship/Leagues 1 & 2 and 2 Independent Non-Executive Directors.
5. Play-offs will be introduced immediately with the first matches taking place at the end of the coming season 2012/2013.
6. Enhanced parachute payments will be implemented from the end of the season 2012/2013 to soften the landing for club(s) relegated from the Premier League.
7. A revised all-through distribution model will be put in place to provide: a) An all-through distribution model for clubs 1-22 and a minimum guarantee for 20 clubs in Leagues 1 & 2, equivalent to what they would earn under the current settlement agreement.
8. A Pyramid System will be put in place which open up the bottom of League 2 effective from the end of season 2013/2014 with the first opportunity for promoted clubs to enter the league being 2014/15 thus allowing for licensing to take place.
9. Consolidation below the Third Division to take place to create a Lowland & Highland League structure effective 2014/15 with appropriate play-offs and promotion/relegation to be put in place. Clubs to be briefed that the previous season 2013/2014 will involve the opportunity to enter play-offs for the first time.
In terms of actions/timings I think the following needs to happen in this coming week:
A) A joint statement today from all 3 bodies confirming that productive discussions have taken place on a new blueprint for Scottish football. Consultation will continue over the next two weeks with a view to clubs getting together week commencing 2nd July to try and agree the way forward. (D Broadfoot to provide this and circulate to DL/ND for approval)
B) Rod P / Jim B to finalise the all-through financial model by Wednesday this week latest.
C) Neil / David to finalise the detail on Governance, Commercials and Play-Offs (ideally Monday/Tuesday) and incorporate these, plus the financials in B) above into a legally binding Heads of Terms ‘draft’ for presentation to each league body w/c 2nd July.
D) DL to organise SFL Board Meeting w/c 25th June to gain buy-in to the plan and also arrange an all club meeting w/c 2nd July
E) ND to gain support from SPL Clubs 28th June
F) SFL Clubs Meeting to be planned for 3rd July
G) SPL Club Meeting to be planned for 4th July
H) Scottish FA Board to sign off on the final plan post 4th July. Subject to approval all bodies (including Newco) to sign legal documentation.
I) Agree joint communication strategy
J) In parallel to A-D above, could Rod Petrie please brief Charles Green confidentially on the discussions from a Scottish FA perspective so that there are ‘no surprises’ and there is a general acceptance of the plan plus all of the other conditions discussed e.g. transfer embargo, fines, repayment of football debt, waiving rights to legal challenge, acceptance of relegation and so on.
K) Andrew to ensure our check list of disclosures relating to Newco and Fit & Proper Person criteria are delivered by 2nd july. The Board will need these plus the Heads of Terms above in order to complete this plan.
The Scottish FA Board have agreed to provide a one-off restructuring budget of £1m on condition the above plan is delivered.
I hope this covers everything.
Speak soon….now off to the airport!
Regards
Stewart”
:tub4:Quote:
Originally Posted by stuart7-0
Caley now holding emergency board meeting to discuss consequences of Rangers in Div 3. Details on BBC web page.
So now some SPL clubs are coming out and crying foul over this.
Pathetic.
It would appear to me from this that, at least some of them, were assuming we were all stitched up the back. Making noises about integrity, but hoping that the SFL clubs would simply bend over and screw their own fans in the process, having their cake and eating it too, as it where. At least Killie's Chairman has had the balls to be open about his views throughout, I respect that more than the St Mirrens and ICT's stances in all honesty.
Perhaps if there had been more spine in our game, and this had all been sorted out months ago, there'd have been more time for clubs to adjust, rather than leaving it till the last possible minute. Hell at this point even if Rangers are let back into the SPL on Monday, I can't see them producing a squad that would be a stick on for Top 6 football.
Some folk at the upper end of our game really need to wake up.
St Mirren and ICT are just panicing because they know that with their lack of finances, they are far more likely to face the fear of relegation at the end of the season.Quote:
Originally Posted by ScottB
The way I see it..... if you can't survive in the SPL, except relegation and let the next team in.
No clubs will be going bust if they don't spend more than what they can afford. Simples.
:agree: Clubs will just have to live within their means, in every other walk of life that is what you do. Why does football think its any different?Quote:
Originally Posted by wee_hibee
No club should run their business relying on 1 or 2 visits a season from one club
Great article on STV site regarding QOS statement.
Queen of the South claim SPL 'has failed its clubs and Scottish football’
Queen of the South have attacked Scottish football’s governing bodies over their handling of which league a Rangers newco will play in this season.
In a statement explaining why they votes yes to Charles Green’s new company playing in the First Division, the Second Division side accused senior members of the SFA and SPL of "focusing on and exaggerating the possible 'Armageddon' rather than rallying and actively trying to find solutions" to the issue. The Palmerston side said they feared that the opportunity of introducing league reconstruction would be lost, claiming “the message from the governing bodies was that, even with a 'no' vote, they would continue to pursue the newco Rangers playing in one of the top two tiers next season”.
Dundee United and Hearts have moved to quash speculation that discussions over an SPL2 could be held during Monday’s SPL AGM.
Queen of the South have called on the three bodies running the game to introduce "badly needed" reconstruction measures such as play-offs between the top tier and First Division.
In a statement on their official website, the club said: “Scottish football is badly in need of reconstruction.
“The SPL has failed. It has failed as an organisation to attract the level of sponsorship, TV deals etc, that were the very reason for its creation. It has failed its clubs and Scottish football as a whole, not least in its handling of this situation.
“Three governing bodies are too many and Scottish football should be reorganised under one governing body that can represent and be responsible for all of the clubs. “The real risk, therefore, was that we would end up with Rangers newco not in Division Three anyway but with none of the benefits of league reconstruction or additional revenue for the SFL: the vote, in effect, becoming 'Newco in Division One with benefits' v 'Newco in top two tiers with no benefits'. “We felt that if there was any chance of getting league reconstruction, and the other overall benefits to the game, that we had to vote 'yes'.
“These changes are long overdue and we urge the governing bodies to continue working towards these proposals, even on the back of the 'no' vote. The fact is these proposals should have been proposed and considered separately from the Rangers issue in the first place.”
Governing bodies
In recent days the pressure has increased on SFA chief executive Stewart Regan and his SPL counterpart Neil Doncaster.
Regan has spoken of a "slow, lingering death" for Scottish football should a newco play in the bottom tier of the game.
While praising the role of SFL chief executive David Longmuir, the Dumfries-based side criticised both Regan and Doncaster for their conduct.
They said: “We have been incredibly disappointed and angry at the actions and leadership of the senior members of the SFA and SPL throughout this whole saga. There have been statements, both public and private, that have amounted to little more than threats.
“The dialogue has been negative, focusing on and exaggerating the possible 'armageddon' rather than rallying and actively trying to find solutions that all clubs and, more importantly, supporters would feel comfortable supporting.
“Instead we were presented with a set of proposals that no-one was happy with. More importantly, the message from the governing bodies was that, even with a 'no' vote, they would continue to pursue the newco Rangers playing in one of the top two tiers next season.”
http://sport.stv.tv/football/clubs/q...medium=twitter
100% correct.Quote:
Originally Posted by wee_hibee
If some teams have to pay the price for their spending policies, so be it. Teams have went into admin before and emerged just fine, it only becomes a problem if you're stupid enough to owe all your money to the Revenue!
I firmly expect the league to expand at the end of the season to save the SPL clubs from relegation anyway...
I think Sevco United (or whatever they call themselves) and their followers might have something to say about that.Quote:
Originally Posted by ScottB
They will not have much of an input into this as they will not even get a vote in the SFL!Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Ed
I think enlargement will be on the agenda to get Sevco back in the top league within two years.
If you want a laugh newsnow.co.uk are no longer showing rangers in the list of teams under SPL !
Http://newsnow.co.uk/h/Sport/Football/SPL
Quote:
Originally Posted by CyberSauzee
This is as good as Regan's letter of resignation. And IMHO, this email would not have become public had it been leaked to the usual Scottish media. We really need to keep guys like Alex Thomson (C4 News) in Scottish Football. He more than anyone has got under the skin of the under-hand, murky dealings of the SFA, SPL and OF over the last few months.
yep then hearts are next
Normally I'd completely agree with you, but actually in this case the Telegraph published the email before Thomson did. He's been talking about the email for some days, but he was second in this particular race.Quote:
Originally Posted by Onion
Probably because he didn't want to come out with it until he was 100% certain that the email was genuine.Quote:
Originally Posted by grunt
Papers on the other hand will release anything, regardless of whether its conformed facts or not.
SFA asked to respond to FIFA re Rangers players' transfers
http://www1.skysports.com/football/n...ts-SFA-answers
Quote:
The Scottish Football Association has been asked to provide information by FIFA about why former Rangers players have been blocked from continuing their careers elsewhere. The SFA has been unable to process international clearance for the likes of Steven Naismith and Steven Davis, who exercised their right to leave the club under employment law when Sevco Scotland bought the assets of Rangers, following an objection from those in charge at Ibrox.
The matter is now in the hands of FIFA, who have written to Scotland's governing body seeking information. One of the players, Kyle Lafferty, had been expected to make his competitive debut for Sion on Sunday but the Swiss club did not include him in their squad for their victory over Grasshoppers.
Lawyer Margaret Gribbon, who represents seven of the players, has asked the SFA to move quickly to ensure they are able to relaunch their careers. Gribbon said: "Following the refusal of the SFA to issue players registrations, the new clubs have all referred the matter to FIFA. "FIFA have now written to the SFA in each case requesting reasons why the players' registrations were blocked. "It remains entirely unclear the facts and matters upon which Rangers oldco and Rangers newco rely in order to support their position that the players acted in breach of contract. "Presumably they have made their reasons known to the SFA and if so, these have not been shared with my law firm, Bridge Litigation, who represent the majority of the players. "FIFA have given the SFA seven days to respond but it is hoped that given the straightforward nature of the request the SFA will be in a position to reply sooner. "We remain confident that FIFA will grant ITC (International Transfer Clearance) enabling the players to continue playing football with their new clubs."
Sevco chief executive Charles Green has argued that the players were in breach of contract when they joined other clubs but PFA Scotland believe their members were free agents.
Among the players to leave Rangers this summer, Naismith has linked up with Everton, Davis has gone to Southampton, Steven Whittaker has signed for Norwich and Jamie Ness has joined Stoke. As well as Davis, Ness and Lafferty, Gribbon represents Allan McGregor, Rhys McCabe, Sone Aluko, and John Fleck.
Could somebody PLEASE tell me when Duff and Duffer are finished and BDO take over?????
Thanks in advance.
Just been sent this not sure if it real or not tho
Mr John Paul Clark/ Mr David John Whitehouse
Duff & Phelps
43-45PORTMAN SQUARE WH1 6LY
LONDON
15th July 2012
Dear Sirs
THE RANGERS FOOTBALL CLUB PLC (IN ADMINISTRATION)
I refer to our telephone conversation on the 9th July 2012, letter of 11th July 2012 and my letter of same regarding the above. I refer also to my telephone conversation on the 11th July 2012 at 11.02pm to which I still await a response.
I now am pleased to confirm that on the 14th July 2012 I became a shareholder in the above company by way of a private sale. My share certificate number is C0697808442.
The Rangers Football Club PLC is still de facto an active company and only de jure in administration still permitting the company to trade. I am aware that the assets of the company were sold and I have now received a full report on the per se liabilities and contingent liabilities.
I have to say that prima facia in February 2012 based upon the balance sheet that I have seen I am somewhat surprised that Craig Whyte deemed the ‘company’ insolvent. I now require immediate answers to questions regarding the state of the company both before Administration and to date.
In order that there are no misunderstandings I submit that at the time of Administration namely St. Valentine’s Day (14th February) 2012 the said company was not ‘insolvent’ and that the assets exceeded the liabilities.
I also submit that since May 2011 a sum in the region of £50 million was at worst stolen at best misappropriated from the company with the knowledge of many that at the time were involved in the company including but not limited to bankers, lawyers, accountants, and other professionals.
I submit that Messrs’ Lloyds Bank PLC permitted in excess of £30 million that should have been paid to The Rangers Football Club PLC was actually deposited and paid into the account of The Rangers FC Ltd (formerly known as Wavetower Ltd) and that Wavetower Limited changed its name solely for the purposes of ensuring any payments made to The Rangers Football PLC be deposited into the account of The Rangers FC Ltd hoping the bank would either inadvertently/negligently (at best) purposefully (at worst) would permit such. Since the amounts are by no means small it is clear that as Administrators you have taken no steps to deal with this.
I also submit that although your firm “considered the ethical guidelines within the IPA” your appointment per se contravenes s.994 of The Companies Act 2006:
(1)A member of a company may apply to the court by petition for an order under this Part on the ground—
(a) that the company’s affairs are being or have been conducted in a manner that is unfairly prejudicial to the interests of members generally or of some part of its members (including at least himself), or
(b) that an actual or proposed act or omission of the company (including an act or omission on its behalf) is or would be so prejudicial.
Your firm acquired MCR BC which advised Craig Whyte on the acquisition of the majority shareholding from Sir David Murray. It was further retained, by your own admissions and documents we have seen, to advise on structural matters post acquisition.
I am not convinced that representations you made to HMRC regarding the level of involvement in the pre-Administration era were necessary the whole truth. Notwithstanding that you have cited officially that HMRC ‘were aware’ of your involvement and did not object to your appointment you have produced no document to substantiate such a claim.
As you are supposedly experienced insolvency practitioners you will of course be aware the meaning of the word ‘insolvent’ and its legal ramifications.
On the 14th February 2012 the company held in its bank account in cleared funds (cash) £3,373,170 yet according to reports leaked to the media the company was unable to pay its contribution to HMRC of less than £300,000. I note that on the 14th February 2012 at 13.07pm the said amount was transferred from the company’s account with the Bank of Scotland to your account.
According to information that has been supplied to me since February 2012 to date your firm has received nearly £20,000,000 in fees together with over £5,000,000 in fees to lawyers engaged by your firm. £2.7 million in fees was also paid by Charles Green as a condition of your firm selling the assets of the company to his company Sevco 5088 Ltd which in fact is now Sevco Scotland Ltd even though negotiations had previously been with Sevco 5088 Ltd.
All in all none of those companies have produced accounts or a business plan capable of proper scrutiny and review yet a commodity such as Ibrox Park and Murray Park was sold for £5.5 million with the condition that over half the same amount was also paid in legal fees.
Substantial monies were also paid to Lambert Smith who provided supposedly a valuation and other monies were paid to other agents and advisors.
Between 14th February 2012 and 20th March 2012 the company received just over one million pounds in revenue (£1,055,870) and it appears that money has been used for the costs of administration. The same story it can be said in the months of April and May.
I also note that the company was at one time a member or an associate member of the FSA via registration through a company called Origen Financial Services Ltd that started its life as Bondco 767 Ltd on the 10th March 2000 then changed its name to Momentum Financial Services Ltd on the 2nd March 2005 and ultimately became Origen trading from Farnborough in Hampshire.
Although your firm made an application to the Court of Session on the 19th March 2012 the order granting validity to your appointment was founded upon (a) truthful and accurate statements made to the Court and (b) that the costs of the application would be borne by your firm and not from the Administration.
Part 2
In order to make clear again I contend that neither was complied with and further if that contention is correct the validity of your appointment per se is further in doubt and a nullity.
I require a full explanation and supporting documents with regard to the shares the Company held in Arsenal Holdings PLC. The company owned historically 16 shares and sold such using the services of an FSA broker Pritchard which was a company ‘owned’ by Craig Whyte although he appeared solely as a company secretary. The amount involved was slightly under £250,000. What actions/steps have you taken to secure the return of those monies that are held in an account that is subject to injunction? According to information received an agreement was reached in May of this year yet I now seek full disclosure.
I need not remind you that your firm are under a Statutory Duty to investigate the affairs of the company in accordance with the Insolvency Act 1986. Transactions that were carried out at undervalue as per s.238; fraudulent preferences as per s.239 and of course transactions to defraud creditors as per s.423. The difficulties in all of the three above are that your firm was involved at all levels of day to day management during the Craig Whyte regime making it impossible to effectively and with transparency undertake such a Statutory Duty. In simple words you would effectively be conducting an investigation into your own conduct.
I also seek sight of the Collyer Bristow Solicitors files especially as million seemed to have ‘gone through’ their client account. I shall be filing a notice with the Law Society since it would appear that whilst all of the dramatis personae are busy suing each other no one seems to have bothered making a report to the Law Society into the manner upon which the said esteemed law firm was able to handle millions without having carried out the Statutory Guidelines imposed by legislation and by the Law Society in money laundering.
In May 2011 approximately (I am awaiting documentation at the time of writing) £26,000,000 was paid to Collyer Bristow Solicitors by Ticketus as an advance fee on season ticket sales for the following three seasons but of which only £19,700,000 would be due to The Rangers Football Club PLC the difference of course in professional fees.
The reason the amount was paid to Collyer Bristow Solicitors was in order that any sums due to the Rangers Football Club PLC would only be paid once Craig Whyte had completed his acquisition of the club. Ticketus were thus relying on Craig Whyte completing his acquisition and I now understand that Sir David Murray was seriously misled into believing Craig Whyte had the financial resources by showing a letter from Collyer Bristow Solicitors evidencing proof of funds.
Of course your firm would have known that since it was your firm that advised Craig Whyte on this matter and of course Collyer Bristow Solicitors would also have known such. The letter from Collyer Bristow Solicitors is facsimile to the ‘letters of comfort’ that Roberto Calvi held from the Vatican Bank which permitted him to extend his fraud in Italy and fool the Italian Central Bank.
In June 2011 your firm duly advised Craig Whyte to pay Ticketus £3,000,000 and a further £5,000,000 in September 2011 and your fees and legal fees of such were in the region of £1,000,000. The said sums were not due to Ticketus since they had advanced monies on ticket sales for the following three years and incidentally on a rate of interest that would qualify as usury. I understand also that Ticketus was in fact introduced by MCR BC which in itself would be a serious conflict of interest.
In September 2011 a day after The Rangers Football Club PLC paid £5,000,000 to Ticketus supposedly in repayment of its obligation under the advance made Ticketus paid the same amount of £5,000,000 as a further advance at exorbitant interest rate to the client account of Collyer Bristow Solicitors. This payment lacks common sense and suggest an open scheme of money laundering and adds to the fuel of allegations that Craig Whyte was being effectively induced at best blackmailed at worst into taking decisions he would not normally.
I fail to comprehend the manner upon which you have failed so openly in your statutory duties to a Company that should never have been in this position.
On the 5th February 2012 the SFA opened an investigation into monies due to Dundee United Football Club over a competition match that was played on 5th February 2012. Yet at the time the amount The Rangers Football Club PLC held in its account was in excess of £4 million. Of course Craig Whyte was well aware that professional fees were due and he invariable considered those to be more priorities than paying for tickets that as I understand are always paid late by clubs but nonetheless paid.
A complaint was then made against Rangers Football Club PLC to the SFA that frankly made little sense other than to ensure that Craig Whyte would be blamed for all wrongs and torts and the professional advisors would seem to be the ‘save what one can’ brigade. The complaints made, not properly explained by whom amount to the following which the SFA claim to be violations of the disciplinary code: (i) failure to disclose that Craig Whyte had previously been a disqualified director (ii) failure to ensure that Craig Whyte acted in accordance with the disciplinary code as per previous (iii) suffering an insolvent event (iv) bringing the game into disrepute (v) failure to pay ticket monies to Dunfermline.
The obligations of disclosure fell upon Craig Whyte and not Rangers Football Club PLC. The company was not insolvent and if anyone has brought the game per se into disrepute it has been the bankers, lawyers and insolvency practitioners. The failure to pay ticket monies to Dunfermline could easily have been remedied since on 12th February 2012 there was over £3m in the company’s bank account and the SFA hearing was rescheduled to a date when your firm were (unfortunately) administrators and could have paid that.
At all material times you were aware that Craig Whyte had been a disqualified director even though his disqualification period ended in 2007. There was per se nothing unlawful in him participating in the management of any company yet his fear of exposure induced him into taking actions that he would not normally have taken.
Whyte however, was made to believe that if the said information came to light he would face ‘serious consequences’ and possible ‘criminal sanctions’ according to an email that I have seen from MCR BC to Mr Whyte. As I have stated publicly fear is the fuel of blackmailers and directly and/or indirectly Mr Whyte was placed in a position whereby he feared exposure. When Mr Whyte was no longer prepared to ‘pay the exorbitant professional fees,’ in exchange for his antecedents not being revealed, a member of MCR BC ‘tipped off’ the BBC into his antecedents which permitted the BBC to film the expose on Mr Whyte.
Mr Whyte was also persuaded into appointing your firm as administrators in order to (according to an email) ‘soften the blow’ and allow him to escape any potential penal sanctions. Since this debacle has tentacles at the very pillar of Scottish society financial, professional and political only if your firm obtained the appointment could much of what was known to many be not exposed.
The rest is history.
I submit that Rangers Football Club PLC has (i) been subjected to a deliberate perpetrated fraud in excess of £50,000,000 (ii) never insolvent as it held almost £3.5 million cash in the bank as of February 2012 (iii) your appointment is seriously unfair and prejudicial to the shareholders and as a consequence as a shareholder I reserve the right to make an application in my own name to the Court under s.994 of the Companies Act 2006 evidencing the above and other material.
You will appreciate that if my contentions are correct as they are then Rangers Football Club PLC should never have faced any disciplinary from the SFA, never received a points deduction, never been made subject to Administration, never been expelled from the SPL and any other sanction that it has been subject to.
The damages to the Company and the club are recoverable from your firm, your insurers, and any third party that has acted as a result of the Administration.
I seek the return of all the monies obtained by your firm, legal fees, and any other professional fees which on a conservative estimate are in the region of £25,000,000 to be placed into an account at either the Court of Session or The High Court of Justice and that any further prejudicial or unfair acts in disposing of assets cease forthwith.
It causes no joy or satisfaction at having to submit this letter since the contents demonstrate a failure in the control systems that Parliament and the legislators have drafted and re-drafted
for the last 30 years. The tentacles of corruption here have extended even into ensuring the Parliament in Westminster adjourn/vacate the enquiry into the state of Scottish Football and the Rangers Affair sine die simply because its findings would be an alarm to the faithful supporters and those who believe in fairness and non-discrimination.
In light of the content of this letter I will be sending a copy to the SFA/SPL/SFL.
It follows that time is of the essence and I urge upon you an immediate response.
I look forward to hearing from you.
Yours sincerely
Giovanni Di Stefano
According to their report the other day, there are some things that D &P have still to finalise, before they can start the liquidation process and hand over to BDO.Quote:
Originally Posted by keekaboo
Like ordering new shredding machines :greengrin
I think there is the problem, him being sincere i just dont believe it. :wink:Quote:
Originally Posted by Brando7
I have no idea if this is correct or not, but if this is a real letter it can only drag this whole fiasco on even longer. And in my book thats to the detriment of sevco, i'm all for that. :wink:
Harold Shipman, Saddam Hussein, chemical Ali, Gary Glitter, Ian Brady, Van Hugstratton and now Rangers
You have to agree De Stefano is pretty consistent in the kind of people he defends Haha what a mentalist
Quote:
Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod
Thanks for the reply.
I'm still confused though. How long exactly are they allowed to put off leaving and, presumably, somehow still making money from this? Surely The Liquidators should now be in place? :dunno:
There will be administrative things still to be done..... one of which was the report they issued the other day. IIRC, they had to wait 30 days from the CVA before they could start putting it to bed.Quote:
Originally Posted by keekaboo
I reckon BDO will be in within the next few weeks.
Make any excuses you want or bury your head in the sand, but Petrie is a ****ing disgrace. I don't believe a word that cretin utters and the sooner he's gone from our club the better.
Thanks, Fife. :wink:Quote:
Originally Posted by sh00byd00
On Giovanni.... Sounds like good stuff. The more complicated and mired in court action the hun situation gets the more likely the whole rotten mob and its Sevco reincarnation might snuff it for good. Would be too good to be true!
TBH, all the stuff that letter mentions should be reviewed by the Liquidators anyway.Quote:
Originally Posted by FalkirkHibby
They do say "your enemy's enemy is your friend", but I'm not yet ready to call Di Stefano my mate....:greengrin
Unfortunately that isn't the way things work in this country.Quote:
Originally Posted by FalkirkHibby
As soon as something becomes too complicated, everybody simply turns a blind eye to it.
People don't want to have to think too hard about anything, thats the problem.
This whole mess is one mega mind tangle and it wouldn't surprise me if it was soon just brushed aside only to be forgotton about at the top.
That's quite a slur on BDO, and they're not even in post yet.Quote:
Originally Posted by wee_hibee
:rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by sh00byd00
To be honest Di Stefanos email probably just got deleted, he is no longer allowed to act in England, Scotland or Italy
i recall the courts asked him for his legal qualification when trying to represent someone recently and he couldn't provide them, his response was along the lines of i don't need them
Qualified or not, I think Mr Di Stefano(?) has summed up the whole affair pretty accurately and it is going to take a Philadelphia lawyer to sort it all out.
When is it the new season starts? A week on Saturday?
Looks like this thread has a long time to run unless a new thread is started - Rangers in Liquidation'. That one will run for years!!!
The letter, though, was written in "his" capacity as a shareholder in RFC, albeit with the benefit of the knowledge that "he" has.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mon Dieu4
Meanwhile over on Sevco Media the trogs think they are about to be invited back in to save the SPL. Satan will ice skate to work first!
Same on FF and also that they would accept the invitation as long as it was without any sanctions af all. What planet are they on?Quote:
Originally Posted by FalkirkHibby
If that was to happen, this and every site, would go down into meltdownQuote:
Originally Posted by Jim44