Share Transfers Agreed/Cooling off period

Come gather round jambos
Wherever you roam
And admit that the waters around you have grown,
And accept it that soon you'll be drenched to the bone,
If your club to you is worth saving,
Then you better start swimming or you'll sink like a stone,
Coz the times they are a-chaaaaaangin!!




If/when they drop onto div1, they will not be able to service those debts. Does that mean they themselves will have to file for insolvency, create a newco and start anew just like rangers in the div3?

Serious question!

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Originally Posted by matty_f

It's like cheering because the executioner has forgotten his rope and has had to pop home for it.

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Or he's forgotten his axe so he's going to use his penknife instead.

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Originally Posted by matty_f

It's like cheering because the executioner has forgotten his rope and has had to pop home for it.

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Its like finding a tenner in the middle of the road just before an eighteen wheeler smashes right into you.

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Originally Posted by clerriehibs

I don't really think they have even thought.

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Fixed that for you there.

http://www.scotcourts.gov.uk/rolls/s.../edi130527.htm

I see Hearts are still pursuing one of their supporters for a hospitality package from a few years back. I hope they did'nt send a begging letter to Mr Ramez Daher looking for a pledge.

Course they will be begging everyone else to forgive their debts.

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Originally Posted by matty_f

It's like cheering because the executioner has forgotten his rope and has had to pop home for it.

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Originally Posted by Kato

This is all getting too much for a couple of Jambos I know and is really akin to Bear Baiting. Either pull the plug now or make it legal to pen them up and sell pointy sticks at the side.

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:greengrin

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Originally Posted by Bajillions

So to clarify, is the possibility now that the person who said that UBIG were insolvent may not have been authorised to do so?

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Yes. So if it turns out that as at the 16 May they WERE authorised (or had the power) to make that statement, then the SPL rule is triggered. And as the date of that "insolvency event" was before the end of the season they could still get the points deduction and be relegated. Or am I missing something?

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Originally Posted by Treadstone

Its like finding a tenner in the middle of the road just before an eighteen wheeler smashes right into you.

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It's like meeting the man of your dreams.....and then meeting his beautiful wife.

Yours,

Alanis

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Originally Posted by Bajillions

So to clarify, is the possibility now that the person who said that UBIG were insolvent may not have been authorised to do so?

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It appears UBIG had no directors, so arguably no-one has the authority to voluntarily list them as insolvent.

If that is the case it's also true that no-one had the authority to sanction the finance that UBIG provided to HoMFC in March - a company without directors can't function legally. It looks like someone has acted fraudulently in providing that finance, and given that HoMFC's directors were also the directors that removed themselves from UBIG's board, the finger is pointing in the direction of Gorgie.

Of course that loan also gives the lie to the idea that HoMFC were independent of UBIG. They were insolvent until that finance was provided two months ago - by a company that had no-one to authorise it.

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Originally Posted by Caversham Green

It appears UBIG had no directors, so arguably no-one has the authority to voluntarily list them as insolvent.

If that is the case it's also true that no-one had the authority to sanction the finance that UBIG provided to HoMFC in March - a company without directors can't function legally. It looks like someone has acted fraudulently in providing that finance, and given that HoMFC's directors were also the directors that removed themselves from UBIG's board, the finger is pointing in the direction of Gorgie.

Of course that loan also gives the lie to the idea that HoMFC were independent of UBIG. They were insolvent until that finance was provided two months ago - by a company that had no-one to authorise it.

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What are the details of UBIG financing Hearts in March?

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Originally Posted by desantos0773

What are the details of UBIG financing Hearts in March?

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The note in the accounts says:

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The amounts owed to ...[UBIG]....fell due for repayment on various dates between 31 July 2012 and 31 December 2012. In March 2013, [UBIG] extended the maturity of the debt until at least March 2015, with repayments of £20,000 per month commencing from April 2013.

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UBIG had no directors in March 2013 and so were in no position to authorise that refinancing.

£20,000 a month for how many years? 80?

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Originally Posted by Greendrongo

£20,000 a month for how many years? 80?

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Two.

Doesn't work, does it?

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Originally Posted by Caversham Green

The note in the accounts says:



UBIG had no directors in March 2013 and so were in no position to authorise that refinancing.

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So how are they still trading ? That alone should be enough to finnish them ! Or am i missing something !

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Originally Posted by Caversham Green

Two.

Doesn't work, does it?

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Well i don't get it.Must be too complex for me.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Caversham Green

It appears UBIG had no directors, so arguably no-one has the authority to voluntarily list them as insolvent.

If that is the case it's also true that no-one had the authority to sanction the finance that UBIG provided to HoMFC in March - a company without directors can't function legally. It looks like someone has acted fraudulently in providing that finance, and given that HoMFC's directors were also the directors that removed themselves from UBIG's board, the finger is pointing in the direction of Gorgie.

Of course that loan also gives the lie to the idea that HoMFC were independent of UBIG. They were insolvent until that finance was provided two months ago - by a company that had no-one to authorise it.

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When did the directors resign though, was it not april?

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Originally Posted by Caversham Green

The note in the accounts says:



UBIG had no directors in March 2013 and so were in no position to authorise that refinancing.

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That was an extension of the loan's maturity not fresh financing. Agree there was no elected directors to authorise it. Don't when the loan was originally going to be due for re-payment but clearly Hearts are not able to at any time. The £15 million loan to Ukio Bankas due this summer that they have a claim of Tynecastle on. Another £40.8 million lent to UBIG that was lent to Hearts (£22 million UBIG converted to equity by and £8.8 million forgiven by the Panama company),

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Originally Posted by bighairyfaeleith

When did the directors resign though, was it not april?

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February, this article dated in March said they resigned the previous week. (Feb 27)

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-0...s-reports.html

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Originally Posted by desantos0773

That was an extension of the loan's maturity not fresh financing. Agree there was no elected directors to authorise it. Don't when the loan was originally going to be due for re-payment but clearly Hearts are not able to at any time. The £15 million loan to Ukio Bankas due this summer that they have a claim of Tynecastle on. Another £40.8 million lent to UBIG that was lent to Hearts (£22 million UBIG converted to equity by and £8.8 million forgiven by the Panama company),

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They call it an extension in the accounts, but of the £25m that was due, £15m was fobbed off on a soon to be bankrupt bank, the interest rates were changed, new terms of repayment were agreed and the maturity date was changed - for all practical purposes it was a new loan. But either way we are agreed that UBIG was not in a position to legally make such a transaction.

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Originally Posted by Caversham Green

Two.

Doesn't work, does it?

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#allverycomplex

Simple really. UB is goosed, UBIG is having their feathers attached and as we speak a large beak and a downie straight-jacket is being prepared for HMFC. (Sorry for talking financial jargon).

Being a simple chap i have to be honest and say that it seems like a whole lot of smoke and mirrors from the PBS mob and it looks like its been bought by the Scottish Football folks...

To me, with a bit of digging (by the right folk on here), all the information is there and the authorities in Scotland just seem to be happy, as per the BBC etc, to beleive what ever level of pants the PBS lot spout.....

Hopefully they will feel the real pain they deserve soon!

Will Ubig and Ukio have the same administrators?

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Originally Posted by Ozyhibby

Will Ubig and Ukio have the same administrators?

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Ukio Bankas's administrator once the appeal is lost will call in UBIG's loans which are much bigger than those loaned on to Hearts and when they fail to pay which they have declared anyway by their insolvency declaration, ask for them to be made bankrupt by a court.

If the information on this thread is so easy to obtain, then why have SPL not acted as they should be able to get same information IF they choose to. Someone should be pointing Dundee's lawyers towards this info.
SOMETHING SMELLS VERY FISHY!!!!!
Crooked B*****ds.

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Originally Posted by Platinum Scotty

Being a simple chap i have to be honest and say that it seems like a whole lot of smoke and mirrors from the PBS mob and it looks like its been bought by the Scottish Football folks...

To me, with a bit of digging (by the right folk on here), all the information is there and the authorities in Scotland just seem to be happy, as per the BBC etc, to beleive what ever level of pants the PBS lot spout.....

Hopefully they will feel the real pain they deserve soon!

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One day soon the way they are behaving Hearts will cease to exist. Sheriff's officers will change the locks and chain up Tynecastle with the players and staff locked out and the SPL one team short!

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Originally Posted by Platinum Scotty

Being a simple chap i have to be honest and say that it seems like a whole lot of smoke and mirrors from the PBS mob and it looks like its been bought by the Scottish Football folks...

To me, with a bit of digging (by the right folk on here), all the information is there and the authorities in Scotland just seem to be happy, as per the BBC etc, to beleive what ever level of pants the PBS lot spout.....

Hopefully they will feel the real pain they deserve soon!

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:agree: That's probably true, but to be fair you can sort of understand why they're not falling over themselves to have another major insolvency event on their hands and are keen not to be seen to be putting the boot in to the Yams gratuitously - I think we can rest assured though that they are merely delaying the inevitable.

So the stadium and the club will become separated early in the process. The stadium under the control of Ukio admins and the club with Ubig admins.
Does that sound right?

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Originally Posted by Ozyhibby

So the stadium and the club will become separated early in the process. The stadium under the control of Ukio admins and the club with Ubig admins.
Does that sound right?

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Both under Ukio Bankas administrator's control - Tynecastle is a claim for HMFC debt of £15 million to the bank and Ukio Bankas hold 79% of HMFC shares as claim against £22 million loan to UBIG that was lent to HMFC that UBIG converted to shares ( this loan was originally used to pay off overdraft to Bank of Scotland when Romanov took over)

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Originally Posted by basehibby

:agree: That's probably true, but to be fair you can sort of understand why they're not falling over themselves to have another major insolvency event on their hands and are keen not to be seen to be putting the boot in to the Yams gratuitously - I think we can rest assured though that they are merely delaying the inevitable.

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:agree:

Why take a borderline decision when future events will probably overtake and make it a sentence rather than a judgement.

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Originally Posted by basehibby

:agree: That's probably true, but to be fair you can sort of understand why they're not falling over themselves to have another major insolvency event on their hands and are keen not to be seen to be putting the boot in to the Yams gratuitously - I think we can rest assured though that they are merely delaying the inevitable.

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I agree with that, I think they probably made the decision to let natural selection takes it's course. The legalities/courts etc will finish Hearts and there will be no blame attached to the football authorities in Scotland

Hearts are not the first and wont be the last to go bust.
Bigger clubs them them have died.
It's touch and go if they come back though.
It'll take years.Through some sort of phoenix club obviously.
They'd have to enter at the bottom of the pyramid.IF they are allowed.
Probably have to spend the first few years renting a pitch in the gyle park before groundsharing with Lothian thistle.
This will probably take around 10 years.
Perhaps another 10 to make it to the league and get a ground of there own ,hopefully out currie/balerno way.
By this time there'll be few of them left.Gates of 500 as Edinburghs third team behind Spartans and Hibs whose gates have almost doubled since their demise.

Well.That's the best case scenario for them.

Zombie Hearts.Thats what they are now.

Even if hearts somehow kick a ball next season, their team is so denuded from the cheating allisbarry years that their crowds will hit 7k after new year

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Originally Posted by Springbank

Even if hearts somehow kick a ball next season, their team is so denuded from the cheating allisbarry years that their crowds will hit 7k after new year

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Jeezo, don't start hinting at a team of naked youngsters in that place. Crowds will rocket.

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Originally Posted by Springbank

Even if hearts somehow kick a ball next season, their team is so denuded from the cheating allisbarry years that their crowds will hit 7k after new year

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As disappointed as I am in yesterday's decision, part of me equally wants to see us play that Hearts team again next year.....

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Originally Posted by The Green Goblin

As disappointed as I am in yesterday's decision, part of me equally wants to see us play that Hearts team again next year.....

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Or the even weaker version of next season (not including Goodwillie and Boyd :faf:)

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Originally Posted by The Green Goblin

As disappointed as I am in yesterday's decision, part of me equally wants to see us play that Hearts team again next year.....

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Most definitely. If they manage to stagger their way into next season (seems unlikely to me though), then I'd be delighted for us to hammer their even weaker side 3 times and extend our unbeaten run against them to 8 before relegation / liquidation takes them.

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Originally Posted by The Green Goblin

As disappointed as I am in yesterday's decision, part of me equally wants to see us play that Hearts team again next year.....

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Probably only get 1 Derby in the league at ER next season, new year game, as we'll be in the Top 6 and they won't

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Originally Posted by Treadstone

Or the even weaker version of next season (not including Goodwillie and Boyd :faf:)

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...................and Berra who many think is desperate to come back.

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Originally Posted by Springbank

Even if hearts somehow kick a ball next season, their team is so denuded from the cheating allisbarry years that their crowds will hit 7k after new year

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Their average attendance was down slightly on last season, whilst our was up by around 500, this despite no game against Oldco.

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Originally Posted by MB62

Their average attendance was down slightly on last season, whilst our was up by around 500, this despite no game against Oldco.

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Despite getting a crowd boost by declaring some games could be their "last ever". :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by JeMeSouviens

Despite getting a crowd boost by declaring some games could be their "last ever". :rolleyes:

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And the free tickets they gave away...

Anyway, another one bites the dust..

http://www.heartsfc.co.uk/articles/2...241384_3186420

Guess which game gets a mention too !

Just been looking through some of the comments from Hearts fans on the Scotsman (something I don't do often as it's full of complete loonies) anyway the general opinion of Hearts fans is that there is some White Knight about to rescue them by buying the club before some 30 day rule which means no penalty points next season and because of this they will start next season debt free and without any points deduction.

Are they really that deluded are just living in the land of make believe. :ostrich: :titanic:

Some of their comments below

The Source - For the hard of thinking that read these posts, let me explain a few things. Hearts will be bought by a group, not an individual. Hearts will be sold for c£5m, possibly up to as much as £7m, but no more than that. The purchase will take place within the 30 day period UBIG have to withdraw their insolvency application. (meaning no penalty points for Hearts). UBIG will liquidate after that time. Assuming the price is £5m (for easy maths), it means the creditors of Ubig will secure 20p in the £ for the debt currently being carried by UBIG/Ukio Bankas.

Under normal administration/liquidation, the figure would be around 5 to 10p in the £. This represents an excellent opportunity for UBIG's creditors to salvage some return on their debt. These discussions are already at an advanced stage, and, will be concluded within the next fortnight/three weeks. Hearts will then be debt free, and start next season in the SPL in the strongest position they have been in for over 30 years. There may be some negotiating over the terms of the sale of Tynecastle, but, worst case scenario is a lease/buy back arrangement spread over an extended period of time.

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Milky Bar Kid - UKIO Bankas is bankrupt. UBIG is insolvent and its assets are frozen.

A formal offer for the Romanov-controlled 94% shares has been made to the Lithuanian administrators, Valnetas UAB. (including Julija Goncaruk's 15%)

Hearts FC will have new owners as soon as the legals have been formalised and a due diligence inspection of the management accounts has been carried out.

Hearts FC will continue to trade as a going concern, with NO debt.

Hearts FC will rent Tynecastle Stadium for at least the next three seasons until a new 25,000 capacity stadium is built in the west of the city.

Hearts will NOT enter into administration and will meet its HMRC debt in full. Hearts were respected citizens for 132 years before Romanov arrived.

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Look to the North, the Norwegians are coming over the hill.

They will take over the club, minus the debt which will be gone along with UBIG, they will purchase Tynie from UKIO and the Liths will out.

Simples, Hearts will start the season in the SPL, debt free and without any point deduction

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I'm not sure about the new stadium as that won't happen. But Hearts will have new owners soon, be in the SPL with no points deduction.

Liquidation or administration is just people on here wishful thinking.

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Originally Posted by Steve20

I'm not sure about the new stadium as that won't happen. But Hearts will have new owners soon, be in the SPL with no points deduction.

Liquidation or administration is just people on here wishful thinking.

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Okay, I'll bite....:greengrin

How so?

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Originally Posted by YehButNo But

Just been looking through some of the comments from Hearts fans on the Scotsman

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That is fantastic, absolutely fantastic!

They've made up a complete fantasy scenario and because some of it doesn't make sense they've made up fictional rules to plug the holes in their story. I honestly LOL'ed reading that.

Barry Anderson will have it written up and on the front page of tomorrows paper no doubt.

Oh ma sides, ye'll need to excuse me, I'm away to change ma kecks.

Sounds too good to be true.............. :rolleyes:

Which means it probably is. :agree:

Are the ideas that they would be bought for £5-7m nonsense due to the shares currently being frozen?

Would Lith admins get much more than that if they broke the club up and sold it all off?

I do like how the second fantasy contradicts itself.

UBIG's assets are frozen. Hearts will be sold within this 30 day period (now 25 days) from the filing with the Lithuanian Govt. Only problem being that one of UBIG's (frozen) assets is Hearts.

The situation will rumble on for the next few weeks, but there is no miracle escape option. They're way past the point where that could have happened (if Romanov had just decided to give them away pre-insolvency).

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Steve20

I'm not sure about the new stadium as that won't happen. But Hearts will have new owners soon, be in the SPL with no points deduction.

Liquidation or administration is just people on here wishful thinking.

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:troll:

If they're going to rent Tiny, why on earth would someone pay £5-7M for something worth less than 5-7p?

Another one bites the dust.

Mehdi Taouil will leave Hearts at the end of the season.

The Moroccan midfielder has been told he will not be given a contract for next season. Taouil joined Hearts from Kilmarnock in 2011 on what was announced as a three year deal.

However the 30-year-old will now leave Tynecastle after the club said his contract expires at the end of May. Taouil made 68 appearances at Hearts, scoring twice.

His four years at Kilmarnock yielded five goals from 107 run outs.

http://sport.stv.tv/football/clubs/h...medium=twitter

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Originally Posted by 7062

Are the ideas that they would be bought for £5-7m nonsense due to the shares currently being frozen?

Would Lith admins get much more than that if they broke the club up and sold it all off?

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Given that all they are buying is the reputation and goodwill, 5-7 million is an outrageously high amount.

I'd like to know what the Zombie Yams will do about players and a ground. I suppose they'll just borrow more money. Because they have learned nothing, other than that they are untouchable.

The whole problem here is thar only one set of fans want them to die. With OLDCO everybody hated them. Despite their best efforts, most sets of fans have just treated Yam delusions as the uttering a if fantasists.

Basically, they will escape because they are a diddly club like everyone else. Otherwise they would have been terminated on Monday. Still, they will insist it is because they are special.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by YehButNo But

Another one bites the dust.

Mehdi Taouil will leave Hearts at the end of the season.

The Moroccan midfielder has been told he will not be given a contract for next season. Taouil joined Hearts from Kilmarnock in 2011 on what was announced as a three year deal.

However the 30-year-old will now leave Tynecastle after the club said his contract expires at the end of May. Taouil made 68 appearances at Hearts, scoring twice.

His four years at Kilmarnock yielded five goals from 107 run outs.

http://sport.stv.tv/football/clubs/h...medium=twitter

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How does a 3 year deal end after 2 years?

Someone's going to pay up to £7m for an almost worthless entity (as they're not buying the PBS I assume, given they say it'll be rented for 3 years), then they'll have to spend to build a team, then build a 25k seater stadium (having bought the land too)?

Really?

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Originally Posted by PatHead

How does a 3 year deal end after 2 years?

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Impressive maths there, clear to see why they dont feel they are in trouble.........they cannae count

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Steve20

I'm not sure about the new stadium as that won't happen. But Hearts will have new owners soon, be in the SPL with no points deduction.

Liquidation or administration is just people on here wishful thinking.

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If anyone can be arsed, have a trawl back through the old Hun threads. That was all wishful thinking too. :wink:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by YehButNo But

Another one bites the dust.

Mehdi Taouil will leave Hearts at the end of the season.

The Moroccan midfielder has been told he will not be given a contract for next season. Taouil joined Hearts from Kilmarnock in 2011 on what was announced as a three year deal.

However the 30-year-old will now leave Tynecastle after the club said his contract expires at the end of May. Taouil made 68 appearances at Hearts, scoring twice.

His four years at Kilmarnock yielded five goals from 107 run outs.

http://sport.stv.tv/football/clubs/h...medium=twitter

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Thought he was here another year ?

According to this site he was contracted to 2014 -

http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/en/he...verein_43.html

The yams seem happy he's leaving...

I'm happy as although he hasn't fired on all cylinders since joining them - was a tricky player and liked to pass the ball and try get involved.

So far that's Grainger, Barr, Smith, Prychynenko and Zaliukas, Ngoo, Wilson, Novikovas all gone - 8 players

Would expect Webster to go soon also making it 9 in total.

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Originally Posted by PatHead

How does a 3 year deal end after 2 years?

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That's a very good point there Sherlock... More crazy under the table stuff happening down at the PBS !

Quote:

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Originally Posted by YehButNo But

Just been looking through some of the comments from Hearts fans on the Scotsman (something I don't do often as it's full of complete loonies) anyway the general opinion of Hearts fans is that there is some White Knight about to rescue them by buying the club before some 30 day rule which means no penalty points next season and because of this they will start next season debt free and without any points deduction.

Are they really that deluded are just living in the land of make believe. :ostrich: :titanic:

Some of their comments below

The Source - For the hard of thinking that read these posts, let me explain a few things. Hearts will be bought by a group, not an individual. Hearts will be sold for c£5m, possibly up to as much as £7m, but no more than that. The purchase will take place within the 30 day period UBIG have to withdraw their insolvency application. (meaning no penalty points for Hearts). UBIG will liquidate after that time. Assuming the price is £5m (for easy maths), it means the creditors of Ubig will secure 20p in the £ for the debt currently being carried by UBIG/Ukio Bankas.

Under normal administration/liquidation, the figure would be around 5 to 10p in the £. This represents an excellent opportunity for UBIG's creditors to salvage some return on their debt. These discussions are already at an advanced stage, and, will be concluded within the next fortnight/three weeks. Hearts will then be debt free, and start next season in the SPL in the strongest position they have been in for over 30 years. There may be some negotiating over the terms of the sale of Tynecastle, but, worst case scenario is a lease/buy back arrangement spread over an extended period of time.

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Milky Bar Kid - UKIO Bankas is bankrupt. UBIG is insolvent and its assets are frozen.

A formal offer for the Romanov-controlled 94% shares has been made to the Lithuanian administrators, Valnetas UAB. (including Julija Goncaruk's 15%)

Hearts FC will have new owners as soon as the legals have been formalised and a due diligence inspection of the management accounts has been carried out.

Hearts FC will continue to trade as a going concern, with NO debt.

Hearts FC will rent Tynecastle Stadium for at least the next three seasons until a new 25,000 capacity stadium is built in the west of the city.

Hearts will NOT enter into administration and will meet its HMRC debt in full. Hearts were respected citizens for 132 years before Romanov arrived.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Look to the North, the Norwegians are coming over the hill.

They will take over the club, minus the debt which will be gone along with UBIG, they will purchase Tynie from UKIO and the Liths will out.

Simples, Hearts will start the season in the SPL, debt free and without any point deduction

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

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Ukio Bankas are down £55 million because of Hearts and will shortly call in claims on Tynecastle and HMFC. The administrators are going to maximise the sale if those claims to recoup as much of the loss as possible given they have a £300 million black hole to fill from guaranteeing the depositors of Ukio Bankas. Shows how far off these loonies are!

Their accounting reminds me of.......


"There are 3 types of people in the world, those that can count and those that can't" :greengrin

Quote:

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Originally Posted by desantos0773

Ukio Bankas are down £55 million because of Hearts and will shortly call in claims on Tynecastle and HMFC. The administrators are going to maximise the sale if those claims to recoup as much of the loss as possible given they have a £300 million black hole to fill from guaranteeing the depositors of Ukio Bankas. Shows how far off these loonies are!

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Well if they got £5-7m for the brand without any stadium (or players over the age of 18 the way things are heading) the administrators have played a blinder.:cb

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Steve20

I'm not sure about the new stadium as that won't happen. But Hearts will have new owners soon, be in the SPL with no points deduction.

Liquidation or administration is just people on here wishful thinking.

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Total and utter b*llsh*t. Sorry Steve but as much as you think liquidation or administration is wishful thinking by some on here, your own thoughts on the subject are as far removed from reality as the deranged warblings by the likes of "The Source" on the Scotsmans comments section.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 7062

Just had a wee look back at previous SPL tables to see what points the teams finishing bottom had. Average was 28.(Lowest was 18, highest was 37.)

If they end up starting on -15 next season it's not just 15 points they need to make up, they need to catch the team sitting 2nd bottom (obviously) so they'll potentially need about 43 points just to draw level.

Assuming they'll be worse next season, this makes me happy.

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If reconstruction doesn't take place till next season, they could decide, as they have previously, not to have promotion and relegation. The Jambos could get out of jail for very little cost. I hope of course that I'm wrong.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jim44

If reconstruction doesn't take place till next season, they could decide, as they have previously, not to have promotion and relegation. The Jambos could get out of jail for very little cost. I hope of course that I'm wrong.

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What reconstruction? 12-10 splitting to 8-8-8 was the only compromise in town and it's gone.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Puzzle

Total and utter b*llsh*t. Sorry Steve but as much as you think liquidation or administration is wishful thinking by some on here, your own thoughts on the subject are as far removed from reality as the deranged warblings by the likes of "The Source" on the Scotsmans comments section.

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'The Source' is probably a Hibby throwing a line that he knows will hook a few. Fully expect this to be the chinese whisper of choice at the AGM.

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Originally Posted by PatHead

How does a 3 year deal end after 2 years?

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Might have been two years plus a club option.

Has Zaliukas got a new club yet? not sayin' we should sign him. Just interested.

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Originally Posted by Caversham Green

They call it an extension in the accounts, but of the £25m that was due, £15m was fobbed off on a soon to be bankrupt bank, the interest rates were changed, new terms of repayment were agreed and the maturity date was changed - for all practical purposes it was a new loan. But either way we are agreed that UBIG was not in a position to legally make such a transaction.

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I have a nagging doubt that somehow this has been carefully engineered to suit Hearts as the board left by the back door of UBIG, just as the cops were coming in the front. I cant see where but nonetheless I am intrigued by their manouvering/shenanigans.

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Originally Posted by YehButNo But

Just been looking through some of the comments from Hearts fans on the Scotsman (something I don't do often as it's full of complete loonies) anyway the general opinion of Hearts fans is that there is some White Knight about to rescue them by buying the club before some 30 day rule which means no penalty points next season and because of this they will start next season debt free and without any points deduction.

Are they really that deluded are just living in the land of make believe. :ostrich: :titanic:

Some of their comments below

The Source - For the hard of thinking that read these posts, let me explain a few things. Hearts will be bought by a group, not an individual. Hearts will be sold for c£5m, possibly up to as much as £7m, but no more than that. The purchase will take place within the 30 day period UBIG have to withdraw their insolvency application. (meaning no penalty points for Hearts). UBIG will liquidate after that time. Assuming the price is £5m (for easy maths), it means the creditors of Ubig will secure 20p in the £ for the debt currently being carried by UBIG/Ukio Bankas.

Under normal administration/liquidation, the figure would be around 5 to 10p in the £. This represents an excellent opportunity for UBIG's creditors to salvage some return on their debt. These discussions are already at an advanced stage, and, will be concluded within the next fortnight/three weeks. Hearts will then be debt free, and start next season in the SPL in the strongest position they have been in for over 30 years. There may be some negotiating over the terms of the sale of Tynecastle, but, worst case scenario is a lease/buy back arrangement spread over an extended period of time.

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Milky Bar Kid - UKIO Bankas is bankrupt. UBIG is insolvent and its assets are frozen.

A formal offer for the Romanov-controlled 94% shares has been made to the Lithuanian administrators, Valnetas UAB. (including Julija Goncaruk's 15%)

Hearts FC will have new owners as soon as the legals have been formalised and a due diligence inspection of the management accounts has been carried out.

Hearts FC will continue to trade as a going concern, with NO debt.

Hearts FC will rent Tynecastle Stadium for at least the next three seasons until a new 25,000 capacity stadium is built in the west of the city.

Hearts will NOT enter into administration and will meet its HMRC debt in full. Hearts were respected citizens for 132 years before Romanov arrived.

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Look to the North, the Norwegians are coming over the hill.

They will take over the club, minus the debt which will be gone along with UBIG, they will purchase Tynie from UKIO and the Liths will out.

Simples, Hearts will start the season in the SPL, debt free and without any point deduction

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Originally Posted by PatHead

How does a 3 year deal end after 2 years?

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maybe he wants paid for once?

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Originally Posted by Puzzle

Total and utter b*llsh*t. Sorry Steve but as much as you think liquidation or administration is wishful thinking by some on here, your own thoughts on the subject are as far removed from reality as the deranged warblings by the likes of "The Source" on the Scotsmans comments section.

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He's a fud alright that Source followed closely by Rolland who must think the answer to every single problem at the PBS is 1-5 1902 wee team

You really must read some of the utter garbage they come out with, they don't get it all they're own way of course, plenty Hibbies giving them it tight :wink:

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Originally Posted by matty_f

Someone's going to pay up to £7m for an almost worthless entity (as they're not buying the PBS I assume, given they say it'll be rented for 3 years), then they'll have to spend to build a team, then build a 25k seater stadium (having bought the land too)?

Really?

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The cooncil is waiting in the wings.

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Originally Posted by The Falcon

I have a nagging doubt that somehow this has been carefully engineered to suit Hearts as the board left by the back door of UBIG, just as the cops were coming in the front. I cant see where but nonetheless I am intrigued by their manouvering/shenanigans.

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This UBIG insolvency has been carefully choreographed by one of Fedetovas' chums. I'm sure they could easily have applied for an insolvency ages ago but have held out as long as they possibly could as a wee favour to old Feddy. He will be managing every loophole and financial piece of skullduggery that is still within his power.

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Originally Posted by clerriehibs

The cooncil is waiting in the wings.

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There is not a chance in hell the council will build the Yams a stadium. It would never get funding and even if it did (it won't) it would need to be multipurpose and that means a running track around it.

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Originally Posted by clerriehibs

The cooncil is waiting in the wings.

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Yup me thinks so. And this will not go away until they or the council build a new wongadome in partnership or in another part of he green belt cleared to help the yams. **** the council and **** councillors.

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Originally Posted by Bajillions

There is not a chance in hell the council will build the Yams a stadium. It would never get funding and even if it did (it won't) it would need to be multipurpose and that means a running track around it.

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Think they have gone to the council with a proposal to jointly build a stadium, renting Meadowbank as an interim solution realising administrator will take and sell Tynecastle. Have sources inside council who confirmed talks have been held. Although council unlikely to progress.

I really can't see how anyone will be able to buy the club, well, certainly the legal / corporate identity, anytime soon.

Hearts are at the heart (ugh) of a web of dodgy dealing and criminal activity. I'd imagine the Lithuanian state will be keen to unpick this mess, find where all the money came from and went to, to ensure they can nail the Mad one firmly to the wall.

All that will take time, years even. Hearts are frozen along with the rest of UBIGs assets and will surely stay that way. I can see the Admins / Liquidators selling off the stuff that can be sold from this mess, so in Hearts case the ground, but surely the club / company will remain frozen, as a central part of the investigation to come?


This being the case, at best FOH or whoever will be able to try and bid for the ground, maybe a few other things, but the dead husk of the club will remain frozen till the investigation ends. At best years from now whatever name the Yam newco, say AFC Hearts, takes might be able to bid to buy the name, as Florentina Viola eventually managed to get hold of the right to name itself Fiorentia a couple years after they went bust. All that will mean unlike The Rangers, there will be no chance of them claiming to be the same club, no argument about continuation or history...

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Originally Posted by Bajillions

There is not a chance in hell the council will build the Yams a stadium. It would never get funding and even if it did (it won't) it would need to be multipurpose and that means a running track around it.

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:agree:

Nae danger. If a stadium was to be built Edinburgh rugby would have as much claim as the Yams. Couldn't justify it and would get slapped back down as soon as capacity was mentioned.

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Originally Posted by VivaPalmeiras

Yup me thinks so. And this will not go away until they or the council build a new wongadome in partnership or in another part of he green belt cleared to help the yams. **** the council and **** councillors.

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Like Bajillions I don't think there is a snowballs hope in hell of the council helping out in any way. The cuffufle over Porty over green space and the reaction to their last attempt sees that as a non starter.

I'm sure that there wou be all hell to pay for the councillors who even mention it.

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Originally Posted by desantos0773

Think they have gone to the council with a proposal to jointly build a stadium, renting Meadowbank as an interim solution realising administrator will take and sell Tynecastle. Have sources inside council who confirmed talks have been held. Although council unlikely to progress.

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So 2 skint entities are planning on building a stadium together?

Meadowbank only holds 7500 so that would reduce Hearts income significantly (~43% lower attendances) and they need to give a certain number over to away fans (not sure if this is a % or a fixed number someone else may be able to answer that) I also don't think Meadowbank has undersoil heating, so that's a no go as far as SPL rules are concerned.

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Originally Posted by Spike Mandela

This UBIG insolvency has been carefully choreographed by one of Fedetovas' chums. I'm sure they could easily have applied for an insolvency ages ago but have held out as long as they possibly could as a wee favour to old Feddy. He will be managing every loophole and financial piece of skullduggery that is still within his power.

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One loophole he can't escape is the Wrongful Trading legislation in the UK.

Any debts run up by HMFC since their own insolvency was established (and that date can be argued so many different ways. For me, it is when UBIG stopped supporting them; for others, it could be prior to then) become the personal debts of the Board. So, not only is there a potential financial liability for them, there is also prosecution.

That said, those considerations look like small beer compared to the Lith allegations.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bajillions

So 2 skint entities are planning on building a stadium together?

Meadowbank only holds 7500 so that would reduce Hearts income significantly (~43% lower attendances) and they need to give a certain number over to away fans (not sure if this is a % or a fixed number someone else may be able to answer that) I also don't think Meadowbank has undersoil heating, so that's a no go as far as SPL rules are concerned.

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If they end up homeless they only really have three options, none of them good:

Murrayfield, too big, expensive.

Easter Road, I doubt their fans could stomach that, or us for that matter. We'd probably charge them through the nose as well to cover the damage they'd undoubtedly do during every game.

Livingston, probably the only one they could afford, but reduced capacity and distance would hurt them.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bajillions

So 2 skint entities are planning on building a stadium together?

Meadowbank only holds 7500 so that would reduce Hearts income significantly (~43% lower attendances) and they need to give a certain number over to away fans (not sure if this is a % or a fixed number someone else may be able to answer that) I also don't think Meadowbank has undersoil heating, so that's a no go as far as SPL rules are concerned.

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Except that the chances of them remaining in the SPL and attracting a crowd of even 57% of their current attendance are next to negligible.

(That's "next to" on the unlikely side of negligible).

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bajillions

So 2 skint entities are planning on building a stadium together?

Meadowbank only holds 7500 so that would reduce Hearts income significantly (~43% lower attendances) and they need to give a certain number over to away fans (not sure if this is a % or a fixed number someone else may be able to answer that) I also don't think Meadowbank has undersoil heating, so that's a no go as far as SPL rules are concerned.

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Yes the council has a great record of not being conned out of money for joint projects. The trams comes to mind.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bajillions

So 2 skint entities are planning on building a stadium together?

Meadowbank only holds 7500 so that would reduce Hearts income significantly (~43% lower attendances) and they need to give a certain number over to away fans (not sure if this is a % or a fixed number someone else may be able to answer that) I also don't think Meadowbank has undersoil heating, so that's a no go as far as SPL rules are concerned.

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SPL rules?! Things they might abide by?

:faf:

oh stop it! My sides aree hurting! I usually look forward to your posts too!!!

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Originally Posted by desantos0773

Think they have gone to the council with a proposal to jointly build a stadium, renting Meadowbank as an interim solution realising administrator will take and sell Tynecastle. Have sources inside council who confirmed talks have been held. Although council unlikely to progress.

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There was a Council report from about 18 months ago on meetings and proposals for a Community Stadium and a land swop, the PBS for 15 acres or so at Sighthill.

It kind of got dropped like a hot potatoe when it turned out the independent report was written by a Yam shareholder. :wink:

I think Hearts said they would continue their quest for a new home themselves.

re: the possibility of the Council building a new Yam stadium, there is an interesting stushie developing in Northern Ireland. Crusaders FC is complaining that the proposed redevelopment of Windsor Park (funded by the NI Government) breaches competition law because it would be effectively state aid to Linfield.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/22616193

This is in light of investigations started by the European Commission into similar aid for some Dutch clubs, including PSV.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-22024669

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Originally Posted by greenginger

There was a Council report from about 18 months ago on meetings and proposals for a Community Stadium and a land swop, the PBS for 15 acres or so at Sighthill.

It kind of got dropped like a hot potatoe when it turned out the independent report was written by a Yam shareholder. :wink:

I think Hearts said they would continue their quest for a new home themselves.

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They had a meeting in April with the council on a new proposal.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Part/Time Supporter

re: the possibility of the Council building a new Yam stadium, there is an interesting stushie developing in Northern Ireland. Crusaders FC is complaining that the proposed redevelopment of Windsor Park (funded by the NI Government) breaches competition law because it would be effectively state aid to Linfield.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/22616193

This is in light of investigations started by the European Commission into similar aid for some Dutch clubs, including PSV.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-22024669

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Wasn't there something like this in Spain recently with Real Madrid involved?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by greenginger

There was a Council report from about 18 months ago on meetings and proposals for a Community Stadium and a land swop, the PBS for 15 acres or so at Sighthill.

It kind of got dropped like a hot potatoe when it turned out the independent report was written by a Yam shareholder. :wink:

I think Hearts said they would continue their quest for a new home themselves.

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And 18 months ago the council thought Hertz owned the PBS.

It roughly costs £1 million per 1000 seats and that excludes the land costs. Never going to happen.

http://local.stv.tv/edinburgh/103034...clubs-stadium/


I think that is a report on the latest survey/proposal/delusion. Just remembered Council are not allowed to enter joint projects with any organisation whose financial viability is not Triple A rated. I don't think 6 out of a 100 cuts it. :greengrin

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Originally Posted by Hot Shot Hamish

And 18 months ago the council thought Hertz owned the PBS.

It roughly costs £1 million per 1000 seats and that excludes the land costs. Never going to happen.

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Pedantically, they do. Albeit, it's the most negative of negative-equity situations..... :greengrin

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Originally Posted by Mikey

Wasn't there something like this in Spain recently with Real Madrid involved?

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:agree:

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/f...d-8557550.html

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mikey

Wasn't there something like this in Spain recently with Real Madrid involved?

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Real Madrid and Barcelona had special tax deals for years allowing foreign superstars to pay the minimum of tax.

This had to end with all the austerity measures in the country. Also Madrid got a present from Franco back in the day, of about 100 acres of parkland near the city centre which was used as training grounds and practice pitches.

However since the 70's, when finances get tight they just hive off a dozen or so acres to the estate agents.

Now that's what is really meant by an establishment Club ! :greengrin

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Originally Posted by greenginger

http://local.stv.tv/edinburgh/103034...clubs-stadium/


I think that is a report on the latest survey/proposal/delusion. Just remembered Council are not allowed to enter joint projects with any organisation whose financial viability is not Triple A rated. I don't think 6 out of a 100 cuts it. :greengrin

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I'm sure last time this surfaced, no-one was talking about a joint venture. The council would be building an arena, because they need one, allegedly, and the hertz spin on it was that they would rent it, but provide their requirements on the stadium's format.

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Originally Posted by clerriehibs

I'm sure last time this surfaced, no-one was talking about a joint venture. The council would be building an arena, because they need one, allegedly, and the hertz spin on it was that they would rent it, but provide their requirements on the stadium's format.

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Not in my life that would happen, if it did I would be proud to be cheerleader at a massive protest up the High Street

They can GTF, their arrogance is breathtaking.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jack

Like Bajillions I don't think there is a snowballs hope in hell of the council helping out in any way. The cuffufle over Porty over green space and the reaction to their last attempt sees that as a non starter.

I'm sure that there wou be all hell to pay for the councillors who even mention it.

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Not even for combined with Edinburgh Rugby and some athletics venue?

I hope so Jack - they've proved themselves incapable of managing any infrastructure/capital spending project - you still cruising?

May'be the Yams could have a 3 - way share here. :greengrin


http://www.scotsman.com/edinburgh-ev...urgh-1-2938171

Quote:

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Originally Posted by greenginger

http://local.stv.tv/edinburgh/103034...clubs-stadium/


I think that is a report on the latest survey/proposal/delusion. Just remembered Council are not allowed to enter joint projects with any organisation whose financial viability is not Triple A rated. I don't think 6 out of a 100 cuts it. :greengrin

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Surely there's ways around that - the Norwegians come in and build a half Ikea/half multiparty stadium and lease it to the dafties...

Stadiums?
Where the yams are going city park would meet requirements.

Is Meadowbank not due to be demolished?