He can’t remove whip as not his party.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stairway 2 7
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He can’t remove whip as not his party.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stairway 2 7
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
In order to accommodate the unsubstantiated beliefs of 1% of the population, we must change everyone else's lives, as those beliefs demand the participation of everyone else.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kato
And I think the athlete he was referring to was Caster Semenya, who has admitted having internal testes and is indeed male and should have been competing in that category.
We should not legislate according to a tiny minorities belief systems, particularly those which fly in the face of measurable and definable reality. I know I'm repeating myself but for reasons already outlined, it's a disaster.
You have a point. I don't know much about the specific cases you mention and don't really have any quibbles.Quote:
Originally Posted by 500miles
There is also way more pressing matters among the general population, I agree. The courts have made their decision so maybe the far more prevalent concern of male violence against women could be addressed by those new activists for women's rights who have been energised the last few years.
What I took from the clip was the idea that society is in a state of flux with the matter and sober discussion towards a solution, which will take time, is required - rather than point scoring and rigid positions.
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Yes obviously, I thought it didn't need saying that it's the greens that can remove the whip, obviously they won't because they probably think it's acceptable to say the court is bigoted.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozyhibby
He can whip his MSPs in the committee to back the Conservative motion to have her removed from deputy of the equalities committee. It then goes for a majority in parliament to agree if he whips it then she's out. She obviously should get booted if he's moving in from her rhetoric, but the greens won't be happy with him. It's going to be a clear side taking and I'm interested how it'll go next week
Britain's supreme court rules that women legally exist and trans activists have a temper tantrum, women's washrooms and changing areas being protected areas for women only is like the rise of the fourth reich for trans activists, placards that read "The only good TERF is a dead one, are aimed at Lesbians who don't accept that men who identify as women into their dating pool and women who want protected single sex spaces. Its deeply misogynistic.Quote:
Originally Posted by lapsedhibee
Lucky we have your balanced viewpoint.[emoji23]Quote:
Originally Posted by 147lothian
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Its more balanced than Maggie Chapman and Patrick Harvie's, the green tail is no longer wagging the SNP dog but we still don't know where Brian Sweeney is on the issue.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozyhibby
To be fair, the only difference between the people holding placards about killing TERFs and me is the the clothes they wear. You can bet if I was marching about the city centre with a sign saying "Feminists can suck my xxxx", there wouldn't be a "Well what it actually means....." type reaction.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ozyhibby
People are giving their own tribes an incredible amount of leeway here. Everything within their bubble has an excuse and everyone outside is a facist, or on the opposing end a communist.
https://www.libdems.org.uk/news/arti...-scotland-case
The Liberal Democrats response.
Perhaps the Lib Dems could elaborate on what they would do, rather than just state the obvious?Quote:
Originally Posted by Moulin Yarns
... whatever it takes to get them into Government? :rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by superfurryhibby
I think they are clear in what they are asking for.Quote:
Originally Posted by superfurryhibby
However, given what she said, I am sure that she will agree with me that that should not come at the cost of the human rights and the security of another vulnerable group in society, which is what this ruling threatens to bring about. Could she explain where transgender people fleeing violence can now go for refuge, if they are to be completely excluded from refuges?
"For years, we have had this intolerable debate, in which two vulnerable groups have been pitted against each other. Those two groups are afraid of the same thing—violence, mostly from men.*
"The challenge for this Labour Government is to live up to the spirit of perhaps one of the proudest achievements of a previous Labour Government—the Equality Act—and protect everyone. If this Government are not able to do that, does the Minister think it would be acceptable to see trans women forced into men’s toilets, to face goodness knows what sort of aggression, and potentially violence, there? Will she confirm what she says about protecting trans rights?*
They are asking for protection of transgender people. Something that wasn't included in the Supreme Court judgment.
Mr Ed returning to government again in an alliance with Badenoch this time?[emoji16]Quote:
Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod
Principles? What principles? Is their motto.
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What she is missing is that the EA provides for exclusion "where it is proportionate". In other words, it's not set in stone that trans women (pre or post-surgery) will be excluded. It will be up to those who use that space to make the judgement.Quote:
Originally Posted by Moulin Yarns
It's not ideal, of course, but neither is it as bleak as what is being suggested.
I'd prefer making a gender neutral toilet the norm, have trans female sections of male hostels, prisons and support groups in each UK country where needed
Hopefully it's the end of trans females being in female sports, prisons and hostels it's been utterly bizarre. I genuinely can't believe we've had a period where a professional biological male UFC fighters have fought women and male pre-op trans female rapists were going to put in female prisons, to protect them as a vulnerable group of biological males
The problem with gender neutral toilets is that there has been a judgement this week against borders Council because that's what they provided in a new primary school!Quote:
Originally Posted by Stairway 2 7
No they only had gender neutral toilets, females should have their own space away from biological males. There is no problem with having 3 toilets male, female, neutralQuote:
Originally Posted by Moulin Yarns
It's a primary school for goodness sake!!!Quote:
Originally Posted by Stairway 2 7
Here's how daft the Supreme Court ruling is....
A mother can no longer take her toddler son into the female toilets and a father can't take his toddler daughters into the male toilets!
There been a lot of trouble with boys kissing girls by force in my daughters primary. With easy access to **** like Andrew Tate nowadays I'd not be happy if she didn't have a space away from boys up to 12.Quote:
Originally Posted by Moulin Yarns
It hasn't stopped dads bringing there wee girls into the toilet that would come under where appropriate
Would you suggest the same provision for trans-males (pre or post Op)?Quote:
Originally Posted by Stairway 2 7
I'm genuinely not being facetious but if this latest ruling by the supreme court has the aim to protect biological women, then this genuinely needs to be considered.
No as I've said in the thread previously, when 99% of sexual assaults are committed by males we have a collective guilt to be kept away from biological females safe spaces. There is no increased threat to biological males from biological females being in their spaces. It's also why there isn't a debate around trans males joining in male sports, due to no physical advantage.Quote:
Originally Posted by speedy_gonzales
Everybody seems to imagine that Trans Culture is a relatively modern thing but I just found this photo of two soldiers in WWII...
Attachment 28734
So your comfortable with trans-males using male hostels and being sent to male prisons?Quote:
Originally Posted by Stairway 2 7
Like I said, this judgment was to protect biological females, an unintended "reciprocal" consequence is trans-males being allowed/having to use womens single sex spaces.
I've already seen a backlash on social media, and I'm fairly sure it was staged but a large framed person with facial hair walks in to a female public convenience and although filmed from the outside you could clearly see the bewildered reaction from those coming out.
Collective guilt is a tricky road to be going down?[emoji51]Quote:
Originally Posted by Stairway 2 7
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Eh trans males would obviously be sent to female prisons and vice versa as that is the law and obviously the correct thing. This is obviously to protect females hard gotten rights and freedoms. Toilets is used to belittle the real issues like intimate care, hostels and prisons. They should definitely be separated by biological sex, but if the need is there separate sections within that could comeQuote:
Originally Posted by speedy_gonzales
Trans women could use whatever toilet they wanted and no one will know or care, it's a manufactured problem.
I think you'll find that's the RAF Nō2 dress uniform.Quote:
Originally Posted by Keith_M
I don't think it is when it comes to sex. It's pretty simple sexual assault is a male problem so that means you and me who wouldn't hurt anyone, shouldn't be in a female hostel. I don't know why any male would be offended by that. As I said before the Gisele Pelicot case shows there is males in every layer of society that would take advantage of a vulnerable femaleQuote:
Originally Posted by Ozyhibby
That would have been my understanding but when you wroteQuote:
Originally Posted by Stairway 2 7
I askedQuote:
Originally Posted by Stairway 2 7
You repliedQuote:
Originally Posted by speedy_gonzales
I'm asking, do we segregate trans in general or is it just trans-women (as this whole debate seems to be solely focused on). I'm also wondering where my trans-male friends would go (if imprisoned for whatever reason). HMP Ratho House, general population? Considering they present very much like a hirsute male and are attracted to the female form I think this too could cause issues.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stairway 2 7
I couldn't agree more, this is way beyond whether we stand or squat to take a leak (or actually, maybe this is exactly what it's all about 🤔).Quote:
Originally Posted by Stairway 2 7
There would be no problem sending a trans male to a female prison, lesbian relationships are hardly unusual in female prisons, but I would segregate them if they wanted it personally. The female prisoners wouldn't care, but they would if a biological male was there. The issue is biological males getting into female spaces because as I say a proportion of males are horrid. Ask any female you know if they have had a male act inappropriate to them, it will be very little amount that say neverQuote:
Originally Posted by speedy_gonzales
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hibrandenburg
Thanks for clarifying
:greengrin