Share Transfers Agreed/Cooling off period

Printable View

Show 100 post(s) from this thread on one page

22-01-2014, 08:00 PM
Craig_in_Prague

Quote:

Originally Posted by SmashinGlass

No definitive date. My feeling, as with many others here, is that if they do not exit admin prior to the end of this season, they won't be around to start next season. In that case, it's largely a moot point

yup, feel something has to give by season end.
Folks often mention ST prices "depending on which league"... but No league is a possibility!
22-01-2014, 08:02 PM
Craig_in_Prague

Quote:

Originally Posted by QMU-1875

Wouldn't worry about, I kind of agree with you. They certainly are not close to liquidation and the folk on here giving people grief about having another point of view are as bad as the yams who don't realise their club will never be as it was!

They have to be as close to Liquidation, as one could be ??
22-01-2014, 08:16 PM
Aldo

Quote:

Originally Posted by Craig_in_Prague

They have to be as close to Liquidation, as one could be ??

Agree and the next 4 or so weeks without a home game is gonnae hurt them bad. No income.
22-01-2014, 08:22 PM
Zondervan

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Falcon

This would be the self same group who are in so much danger of being burnt out and coming to permanent physical and psychological harm it is a health and safety issue.

Yet when the opportunity arises to run down a suspension they slip an extra game in there, because it suits them to do so, with little thought to the brave wee soldiers well being.

Liars as well as cheats. It the Hearts way.

Hopefully they will get a couple of players sent off for violent conduct in the rearranged St Mirren game. Which would be nice.
22-01-2014, 08:23 PM
Deek9

Quote:

Originally Posted by Craig_in_Prague

yup, feel something has to give by season end.
Folks often mention ST prices "depending on which league"... but No league is a possibility!

Aye, but if they get through the semi they may make it to season end. Really think rules need to be clear on this otherwise the league will interpret as they wish.
22-01-2014, 08:25 PM
Craig_in_Prague

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aldo

Agree and the next 4 or so weeks without a home game is gonnae hurt them bad. No income.

Its really the shares and the situation in Lithuania, which to me could see them Liquidated. Its out of there hands and time is not on their side (yet, seems not to matter a jot with that lot).
I can see 400,000 blank faces in a while, wondering why theres now a new Tesco near the wonderful Robbos bar.
22-01-2014, 08:27 PM
Hibbyradge

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deek9

Aye, but if they get through the semi they may make it to season end. Really think rules need to be clear on this otherwise the league will interpret as they wish.

What rule isn't clear?
22-01-2014, 08:32 PM
oconnors_strip

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aldo

Agree and the next 4 or so weeks without a home game is gonnae hurt them bad. No income.

They have got a home game next Wednesday against st mirren
22-01-2014, 08:34 PM
clerriehibs

Quote:

Originally Posted by SmashinGlass

I think I've quoted the wrong post here, but I believe you previously said there was no evidence of them being at risk of liquidation. I counter you by suggesting the evidence is staring you in the face. They are currently subject to an insolvency event (admin). That's all the evidence you need that they're in danger of going into liquidation.

Take it from me, having worked in the insolvency profession for 12 years, I saw many an admin in that time and only ever witnessed 1 cva. They don't happen often and the vast vast majority of admins end in a newco with subsequent liquidation. Look what happened to the currant buns for evidence of that scenario.

But fitba's different - or so we keep getting told. Christ knows why it should be; a ***** business is a ***** business, after all
22-01-2014, 08:35 PM
Aldo

Quote:

Originally Posted by oconnors_strip

They have got a home game next Wednesday against st mirren

Aaah forgot bout that silly me.
22-01-2014, 08:37 PM
clerriehibs

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caversham Green

Just to add to this, The administrators are duty-bound to maintain the club as a going concern, if they can't do that they will have no choice but to liquidate. Using next year's income to finance this year's operations is strong evidence that they are not a going concern.

The money from season tickets sold last year has lasted this far, but by their own admission it is now running out. If that happens before they can exit administration BDO's options are very limited.

BDO have their own agenda, maybe not bound by professional standards.
The Murray and Souther goings on, as an example
22-01-2014, 08:43 PM
Andy74

Quote:

Originally Posted by clerriehibs

BDO have their own agenda, maybe not bound by professional standards.
The Murray and Souther goings on, as an example

I think the BDO chaps enjoy running football clubs for a bit. Probably have their eyes on careers on that front in due course. Not exactly the point of court appointed administrators.
22-01-2014, 08:58 PM
Deek9

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hibbyradge

What rule isn't clear?

Sorry, omitted previous quote. The date they need to be out of admin to avoid another points deduction next season?
22-01-2014, 09:04 PM
SmashinGlass

Quote:

Originally Posted by QMU-1875

Wouldn't worry about, I kind of agree with you. They certainly are not close to liquidation and the folk on here giving people grief about having another point of view are as bad as the yams who don't realise their club will never be as it was!

Ask yourself this. If they are not close to Liquidation, why are they listed on Companies House as being subject to Administration which, incidentally, is governed by the Insolvency (Scotland) Act 1986. As I stated previously I have a wealth of experience in these matters, indeed I actually even used to work for BDO's very own Bryan Jackson. If you can't believe me, or any one of a number of people qualified to make such statements on the matter then I don't know what can be suggested to you in order to make you look at the situation from an alternative angle. Nobody is giving anyone who thinks the yams won't be liquidated grief, we're simply giving a realistic (arguably more realistic) point of view. :agree:
22-01-2014, 09:05 PM
CyberSauzee

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caversham Green

Just to add to this, The administrators are duty-bound to maintain the club as a going concern, if they can't do that they will have no choice but to liquidate. Using next year's income to finance this year's operations is strong evidence that they are not a going concern.

The money from season tickets sold last year has lasted this far, but by their own admission it is now running out. If that happens before they can exit administration BDO's options are very limited.

I do love a Cav Green post: succinct, concise, easy to understand and thought provoking.

Banderson take note: try and stick to facts like above rather than your vermicular and unqualified prose.
22-01-2014, 09:07 PM
clerriehibs

Quote:

Originally Posted by SmashinGlass

Ask yourself this. If they are not close to Liquidation, why are they listed on Companies House as being subject to Administration which, incidentally, is governed by the Insolvency (Scotland) Act 1986. As I stated previously I have a wealth of experience in these matters, indeed I actually even used to work for BDO's very own Bryan Jackson. If you can't believe me, or any one of a number of people qualified to make such statements on the matter then I don't know what can be suggested to you in order to make you look at the situation from an alternative angle. Nobody is giving anyone who thinks the yams won't be liquidated grief, we're simply giving a realistic (arguably more realistic) point of view. :agree:

Do the bookies offer odds on liquidation or succesful cva in these situations?

Is Bryan Jackson a fud?
22-01-2014, 09:16 PM
Ronniekirk

Quote:

Originally Posted by SmashinGlass

I think I've quoted the wrong post here, but I believe you previously said there was no evidence of them being at risk of liquidation. I counter you by suggesting the evidence is staring you in the face. They are currently subject to an insolvency event (admin). That's all the evidence you need that they're in danger of going into liquidation.

Take it from me, having worked in the insolvency profession for 12 years, I saw many an admin in that time and only ever witnessed 1 cva. They don't happen often and the vast vast majority of admins end in a newco with subsequent liquidation. Look what happened to the currant buns for evidence of that scenario.

What makes this one so complicated is the Lithuanian connection and the legal machinations out there. Does everything just take longer or is there disagreement between parties that we are unaware of .With the current buns it was fairly obvious even to someone like me that Craig Whyte s job was to take them into liquidation as the debts were so huge and big tax case was too risky in the west coast the whole scenario was on the news constantly and almost the sole topic of debate .So like it or not you got more than a basic understanding of some issues .This one gets no coverage at all and you kind of just assume it's a forgone conclusion that at some point before end of March time the will get some sort of deal done via cva If liquidation was in the offing would there not be a bigger story brewing and some journalist would be on to it .? maybe that's why for so long there has been complacency with the yams .
22-01-2014, 09:18 PM
Ronniekirk

Quote:

Originally Posted by clerriehibs

Do the bookies offer odds on liquidation or succesful cva in these situations?

Is Bryan Jackson a fud?

Dont think you would get any decent odds at bookies on your second question
22-01-2014, 09:26 PM
Hibernia Na Eir

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aldo

Agree and the next 4 or so weeks without a home game is gonnae hurt them bad. No income.

.....and quite possibly without a league point either :-)
22-01-2014, 09:27 PM
Hibernia Na Eir

Their entire season/future now boils down to reaching the small cup final.
22-01-2014, 09:29 PM
jacomo

Brian Jackson said on arrival at Hearts it was the worst position he'd ever seen. The company had no cash and big outgoings, even after trimming the squad back.

After hawking the club to possible buyers, he flushed out three interested parties: one had nearly destroyed Livingston after a string of broken promises, one was deemed to have zero credibility, and the winner was FoH who have an unproven business model and could only rustle up £2.5m - widely accepted to be a lot lower than the land value of Tynecastle. No one else would touch it with a barge pole.

Meanwhile, they are caught up in an international criminal investigation, which means the shares they need to buy to come out of admin are frozen by the Lithuanian courts, and there is no confirmed timescale for their release.

Oh, and they don't have enough cash to last the season.

People said Rangers couldn't be liquidated. Can Hearts really avoid the same fate?
22-01-2014, 09:34 PM
Caversham Green

Quote:

Originally Posted by clerriehibs

But fitba's different - or so we keep getting told. Christ knows why it should be; a ***** business is a ***** business, after all

There's some truth in that tbf. For example no other business would have got away with taking money for 'shares' with the stated purpose of just staying in business and then failing to actually issue those shares. From a professional point of view I don't think HoMFC should have got away with it either - it was almost certainly fraudulent - but the utter stupidity of football fans in general and yams in particular means they have got away with it.

I include myself in that point about fans by the way, I said at the time that I would have bought shares if it had been Hibs in that position. I would have been kicking up hell in the summer though.

Quote:

Originally Posted by clerriehibs

BDO have their own agenda, maybe not bound by professional standards.
The Murray and Souther goings on, as an example

BDO's agenda now is to deliver HoMFC to its prospective owners in a condition that means they can carry on business for the future. That would be the same for any administrator at this stage of the game and they are still bound by professional and legal standards. However there are still a number of obstacles in their way - the passage of time being a major one - and whether they can overcome them all remains to be seen. If they can't then liquidation appears to be the only alternative.
22-01-2014, 09:34 PM
Saorsa

Quote:

Originally Posted by jacomoseven

Brian Jackson said on arrival at Hearts it was the worst position he'd ever seen. The company had no cash and big outgoings, even after trimming the squad back.

After hawking the club to possible buyers, he flushed out three interested parties: one had nearly destroyed Livingston after a string of broken promises, one was deemed to have zero credibility, and the winner was FoH who have an unproven business model and could only rustle up £2.5m - widely accepted to be a lot lower than the land value of Tynecastle. No one else would touch it with a barge pole.

Meanwhile, they are caught up in an international criminal investigation, which means the shares they need to buy to come out of admin are frozen by the Lithuanian courts, and there is no confirmed timescale for their release.

Oh, and they don't have enough cash to last the season.

People said Rangers couldn't be liquidated. Can Hearts really avoid the same fate?

You clearly havnae read the expert opinion at the top of the page. "They certainly are not close to liquidation" :agree::greengrin
22-01-2014, 09:43 PM
jacomo

Quote:

Originally Posted by Desperate Dan

You clearly havnae read the expert opinion at the top of the page. "They certainly are not close to liquidation" :agree::greengrin

They certainly are not close to be saved, that's for sure.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/25846992

If this is correct, they can't hope to have the CVA approved before the end of Feb. Given it took Dunfermline 5 months from that point to come out of admin, they will be doing amazingly well to do that before the summer. That would mean starting the next season in the Championship on -15.

Ouch. And this looks like the best possible outcome for them.
22-01-2014, 09:53 PM
SmashinGlass

Quote:

Originally Posted by clerriehibs

Do the bookies offer odds on liquidation or succesful cva in these situations?

Is Bryan Jackson a fud?

First question, I honestly don't know.

Second question, no, he's actually a really sound guy. I never worked with him too intimately, but the limited contact I had with the guy he was pretty decent and down to earth.
22-01-2014, 09:58 PM
DC_Hibs

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aldo

Aaah forgot bout that silly me.

No worries, 1000-2000 walk ups is hardly going to save them once their expenses are deducted - police, stewarding, electricity, child porn etc.
Assuming these are being paid by the fraudulent f(_)kdogs.
22-01-2014, 10:07 PM
clerriehibs

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caversham Green

There's some truth in that tbf. For example no other business would have got away with taking money for 'shares' with the stated purpose of just staying in business and then failing to actually issue those shares. From a professional point of view I don't think HoMFC should have got away with it either - it was almost certainly fraudulent - but the utter stupidity of football fans in general and yams in particular means they have got away with it.

I include myself in that point about fans by the way, I said at the time that I would have bought shares if it had been Hibs in that position. I would have been kicking up hell in the summer though.

BDO's agenda now is to deliver HoMFC to its prospective owners in a condition that means they can carry on business for the future. That would be the same for any administrator at this stage of the game and they are still bound by professional and legal standards. However there are still a number of obstacles in their way - the passage of time being a major one - and whether they can overcome them all remains to be seen. If they can't then liquidation appears to be the only alternative.

Like others, I like reading your objective analyses. But what's this about the yam fans being particularly stupid (unless you meant "case in point")? Much as any hibby would love it to be true, I don't think anyone can seriously claim they're significantly thicker, as a group, than the average football fan?

Or are they ...
22-01-2014, 10:10 PM
Jonnyboy

Quote:

Originally Posted by clerriehibs

Like others, I like reading your objective analyses. But what's this about the yam fans being particularly stupid (unless you meant "case in point")? Much as any hibby would love it to be true, I don't think anyone can seriously claim they're significantly thicker, as a group, than the average football fan?

Or are they ...

They're certainly a lot more gullible :greengrin
22-01-2014, 10:21 PM
CropleyWasGod

Quote:

Originally Posted by clerriehibs

Do the bookies offer odds on liquidation or succesful cva in these situations?

Is Bryan Jackson a fud?

Probably not and definitely no.
22-01-2014, 10:41 PM
Ronniekirk

Quote:

Originally Posted by oconnors_strip

They have got a home game next Wednesday against st mirren

Mid week against st mirren before cup game that will be test for the support .if they get over 10 000 then some one there canne count

Show 100 post(s) from this thread on one page

All times are GMT. The time now is 01:46 PM.