Generic Sevco / Rangers meltdown thread

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Originally Posted by blackpoolhibs

Absolutely ridiculous. the rules are already in place, we know exactly what should happen but we have to wait even longer? Do these clowns not know their own rules?

Also Dundee should now be preparing for next season in the SPL, but the SPL big wigs are hindering their preparation for the coming season, without giving a toss about them.

The rules are already written, all you clowns have to do is apply them.

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:agree: Yep.

The critreria is laid out. The rules are clear. SevCo DONT meet them.

There is no need for a vote to be taken by anyone. They dont get in. They should be applying for whatever league will have them, NOT the SPL.

From the Record ..

"EBTs may not have been the cause of their undoing – that one rests with Sir David Murray’s decision to hand the keys to Craig Whyte"

Seriously????

Does SDM still have the media eating out of his hand, even now the HMRC are talking about hauling him to court for £6.3m in EBT payments?

These papers are unbelievable.

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Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

The rules say that there's a 14-day notice period, so that rule is being applied.

As for the application itself, it will be considered on its merits, which is also in the rules.

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I dont understand CWG, a 14 day notice period for what? I thought there is no rangers anymore, and the new rangers do not fill ANY of the criteria any new club needs to apply to any of the Scottish leagues?

There's also no rule for any new club to apply to join the top league, any new club can apply to join, but must apply to join at the bottom?????

Surely thats enough to apply the rules now, and Dundee should be preparing for life in the SPL today?

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Originally Posted by blackpoolhibs

I dont understand CWG, a 14 day notice period for what? I thought there is no rangers anymore, and the new rangers do not fill ANY of the criteria any new club needs to apply to any of the Scottish leagues?

There's also no rule for any new club to apply to join the top league, any new club can apply to join, but must apply to join at the bottom?????

Surely thats enough to apply the rules now, and Dundee should be preparing for life in the SPL today?

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The meeting to consider the application has to have 14 days notice.....like any meeting, the notice period is intended to give people the chance to make their own arrangements to attend that meeting. That's just normal practice in any organisation.

As I understand it, the last SPL meeting decided to amend their rules to consider "any" new application. This is such an application. It's irrelevant what we think on here, or what the rules appear to be, that application will have to be considered by that meeting.

I may have missed it but has an explanation been given as to why the majority in favour of transferring the Dead Hun SPL share to the New Hun Club is to be 8:4 in favour at the meeting ?

Rule 38 of the SPL Articles of Association the allotment of a share requires 83% or 10:2 in favour to be passed.

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Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

The meeting to consider the application has to have 14 days notice.....like any meeting, the notice period is intended to give people the chance to make their own arrangements to attend that meeting. That's just normal practice in any organisation.

As I understand it, the last SPL meeting decided to amend their rules to consider "any" new application. This is such an application. It's irrelevant what we think on here, or what the rules appear to be, that application will have to be considered by that meeting.

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Amazing :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by greenginger

I may have missed it but has an explanation been given as to why the majority in favour of transferring the Dead Hun SPL share to the New Hun Club is to be 8:4 in favour at the meeting ?

Rule 38 of the SPL Articles of Association the allotment of a share requires 83% or 10:2 in favour to be passed.

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I think that was decided by the clubs at the last meeting, or the one before that.

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Originally Posted by blackpoolhibs

Amazing :rolleyes:

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This has to be done by the book, otherwise the Huns will go screaming off to the Courts again.

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Originally Posted by greenginger

Rule 38 of the SPL Articles of Association the allotment of a share requires 83% or 10:2 in favour to be passed.

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That's interesting. :hmmm:

Also ..
this is a vote for transfer of share .. not for entry to SPL .. dead-hun could be relegated/suspended/expelled by that time based on pending EBT/Dual Contract/Appellant Tribunal/Court of Session punishments. :wink:

Personally I'd suspend deadhun for a year at appellate tribunal (following CoS decision to overturn transfer embargo), relegate for dual contracts and strip them of trophies collected during EBT years.

Lets see if Green/Smith/whoever still wants their SPL share after that little lot is bundled in with it!

:wink:

Jim McColl will submit a £6m offer to buy Rangers on Monday from Charles Green and his consortium. (The Herald)

There is money in the muck.

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Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

Did they?

Hearts are indeed under HMRC investigation, but there is no confirmation that it's about EBTs.

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No there's no confirmation, just as there was no confirmation Rangers were doing anything wrong 2 years ago

It is mere conjecture

I wonder where they dug that story up from?

Jezzo ..firstly someone wi sticky fingers ..now somebody wi green fingers ..:greengrin

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Originally Posted by Caversham Green

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/footbal...6908-23897491/

Pretty much wraps up the SPL's investigation for them.

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I see the record is still using its "big boy did it and ran away" approach.

Rangers should already be dead and buried.

The fact that they are not leads me to believe that by whatever means, they will be playing in the SPL next season.


It is the whole game in this country that is about to die.


:boo hoo:

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Originally Posted by johnrebus

Rangers should already be dead and buried.

The fact that they are not leads me to believe that by whatever means, they will be playing in the SPL next season.


It is the whole game in this country that is about to die.


:boo hoo:

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Courage, mon brave.

If they are to be killed off, it has to be done the right way. Process and procedures p us all off, but they have to be gone through.

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Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

Courage, mon brave.

If they are to be killed off, it has to be done the right way. Process and procedures p us all off, but they have to be gone through.

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:not worthOoh, staop it Croppers, you just gave me a wee Duff and Phelps in mah troosers man !!:greengrin

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Originally Posted by TrickyNicky

:not worthOoh, staop it Croppers, you just gave me a wee Duff and Phelps in mah troosers man !!:greengrin

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Um.... glad to be of service.... I think.... :wink:

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Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

Courage, mon brave.

If they are to be killed off, it has to be done the right way. Process and procedures p us all off, but they have to be gone through.

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Lets say BDO forensic investigation finds that there was a strategy in place to evade taxes via EBTs and then to evade their payment plus penalties once rumbled by going into administration and resurrecting as a newco. That would seem to be fraud, but what impact would it have on newco's status?

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Originally Posted by bythecringe

Lets say BDO forensic investigation finds that there was a strategy in place to evade taxes via EBTs and then to evade their payment plus penalties once rumbled by going into administration and resurrecting as a newco. That would seem to be fraud, but what impact would it have on newco's status?

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That would be fraud on the part of the old owners, for sure. However, unless it could be proven that the new owners were part of the strategy, I can't see that anything could be attached to them.

The worst that could happen, IMO, would be that the sale could be reversed, on the grounds that creditors had been defrauded. However, given the length of time that would have elapsed between the sale and BDO's conclusion in your scenario, I would think that very unlikely.

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Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

Um.... glad to be of service.... I think.... :wink:

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It was a cold blooded financial assassins words, whispered to The Huns as the final bullet leaves the chamber!





"Courage, mon brave.

If they are to be killed off, it has to be done the right way. Process and procedures p us all off, but they have to be gone through".... courtesy of CWG:cb

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Originally Posted by blackpoolhibs

I dont understand CWG, a 14 day notice period for what? I thought there is no rangers anymore, and the new rangers do not fill ANY of the criteria any new club needs to apply to any of the Scottish leagues?

There's also no rule for any new club to apply to join the top league, any new club can apply to join, but must apply to join at the bottom?????

Surely thats enough to apply the rules now, and Dundee should be preparing for life in the SPL today?

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Just on this could the likes of Spartans who have applied before for an SFL Place not apply for any available space ?

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Originally Posted by cocopops1875

Just on this could the likes of Spartans who have applied before for an SFL Place not apply for any available space ?

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I'd imagine they could, there is a space right now but for some reason it appears the authorities are completely ignoring their own rules?

They should be inviting applications for a space in the 3rd division, and applying the laws already in place regarding teams fitting the application criteria.

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Originally Posted by blackpoolhibs

I'd imagine they could, there is a space right now but for some reason it appears the authorities are completely ignoring their own rules?

They should be inviting applications for a space in the 3rd division, and applying the laws already in place regarding teams fitting the application criteria.

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What rules you on about? There is currently no space. SFL hasn't got a vacancy until Dundee get an invite from SPL.

At the moment old Rangers exist with an SPL share.

I'm not aware of any rules around their share being taken off them in current circumstances. The SPL is also aware there will be a request for a transfer of that share.

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Originally Posted by Andy74

What rules you on about? There is currently no space. SFL hasn't got a vacancy until Dundee get an invite from SPL.

At the moment old Rangers exist with an SPL share.

I'm not aware of any rules around their share being taken off them in current circumstances. The SPL is also aware there will be a request for a transfer of that share.

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Rangers are dead, The Rangers are applying to enter the SPL, they fit NONE of the criteria to even apply to the SFL. We are one team short, no matter how you dress it up.

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Originally Posted by blackpoolhibs

Rangers are dead, The Rangers are applying to enter the SPL, they fit NONE of the criteria to even apply to the SFL. We are one team short, no matter how you dress it up.

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Technically rangers are not dead yet. They are still a company with an SPL share.

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Originally Posted by bernz

Technically rangers are not dead yet. They are still a company with an SPL share.

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But with no ground and no players.

That must be against the rules?

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Originally Posted by blackpoolhibs

Rangers are dead, The Rangers are applying to enter the SPL, they fit NONE of the criteria to even apply to the SFL. We are one team short, no matter how you dress it up.

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Well almost dead, the OldCo hasnt quite given up the ghost and it's them that hold the licence at the minute that they are proposing to transfer to another i.e SevCo.

CWG is absolutely right, they have to be killed off within the rules so they can have no recourse. Frustrating but the correct way to do it. That things seem to be happening this way actually fills me with confidence we are really going to see justice done here :agree:

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Originally Posted by johnbc70

Kenny Shiels should be embarrassed with his comments about the Rangers situation being like a death in the family. I am sure plenty reading that who may have lost a loved one recently would wholeheartedly disagree that the situation and feelings you have will be the same. He should apologise for his insensitive remarks.

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I agree entirely but I couldn't help remembering a post on FF a couple of weeks ago. - "I lost both my mum and dad a few months ago but what is happening to my club puts that in the shade.". Hunbelievable!!!

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Originally Posted by jgl07

But with no ground and no players.

That must be against the rules?

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Have these been 100% confirmed?

If, and hopefully when, the New Huns are refused the SPL share will the meeting approve the share transfer to A N other like Dundee or will that require a further meeting with a further 14 days notice ?

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Originally Posted by bernz

Have these been 100% confirmed?

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I would have thought that a ground was essential. Also the ground must have at least 6,000 seats.

Falkirk got knocked back from promotion or promotion play-offs more than once because Brockville was deemed inadequate.

Ross County had to make groundshare provisions with Inverness because their own upgrades were not completed by the March deadline.

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Originally Posted by jgl07

But with no ground and no players.

That must be against the rules?

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... and add some mud in terms of who owns the stadium, and who has the players' contracts. :stirrer:

Lovely.

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Originally Posted by blackpoolhibs

Rangers are dead, The Rangers are applying to enter the SPL, they fit NONE of the criteria to even apply to the SFL. We are one team short, no matter how you dress it up.

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All in good time. Old Rangers are still here with a share.

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Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

... and add some mud in terms of who owns the stadium, and who has the players' contracts. :stirrer:

Lovely.

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I really don't think that rules and contracts etc. will matter at the conclusion of all this.

I believe that the major decisions will be taken away from the clubs - maybe even the SFA/SPL. They - the Hun - are too big, there are too many of them and that influence will be brought to bear in some form or other - I don't know what exactly - in sticking them straight back into the SPL.

And I really do believe that the fans will vote with their feet and that the SPL will consist mainly of part-time clubs before long.

Yes, I admit this is a defeatist view, but the whole country is ingrained with this Rangers/Celtic - Catholic/Protestant cancer. The real solution would be to see that Rangers cease to exist completely, then we would be on the road to recovery, Sadly that is not going to happen.

This goes way beyond football IMHO.


:boo hoo:

There seems to be an assumption that Dundee would fill Team 12s shoes. I presume they would be invited and can therefore decide not to take up the offer? Maybe they (and the SFL2 & 3 teams in a similar position) don't want to rush into a promotion they may not be ready for and therefore be prime relegation candidates.

It might be a double whammy for the 3 div team that is promoted - miss out on TRFC visits boosting their coffers and pass them by should they be relegated and TRFC promoted next season.

I wonder if Dundee have sold any season tickets yet that would presumably be a lot cheaper than if they knew they were in the SPL?

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Originally Posted by Caversham Green

It crossed my mind that one way Hector could go after the employees is if he could show that the EBT arrangement was contrived with the employees' full knowledge - i.e. they knew it was illegal but went ahead with it anyway. Maybe Dodds, Ogilvie and Boumsong have been advised to go public with an 'I was duped' stance.

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Yup indeed - also very quick to say 'iwas not sure didn't want to sign' my advisers said it was ok....... That seemed a bit rehearsed to me....- hope these advisors have good prof indemnity insurance :)

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Originally Posted by Newry Hibs

There seems to be an assumption that Dundee would fill Team 12s shoes. I presume they would be invited and can therefore decide not to take up the offer? Maybe they (and the SFL2 & 3 teams in a similar position) don't want to rush into a promotion they may not be ready for and therefore be prime relegation candidates.

It might be a double whammy for the 3 div team that is promoted - miss out on TRFC visits boosting their coffers and pass them by should they be relegated and TRFC promoted next season.

I wonder if Dundee have sold any season tickets yet that would presumably be a lot cheaper than if they knew they were in the SPL?

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I don't see why there is this assumption that the place will go to Dundee. Natural justice dictates that it should go to Dunfermline, the team relegated during the season that another club cheated its way to 2nd spot. I'm sure John Yorkston must be making representations to this effect and I hope that our Rod supports him.

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Originally Posted by Seveno

I don't see why there is this assumption that the place will go to Dundee. Natural justice dictates that it should go to Dunfermline, the team relegated during the season that another club cheated its way to 2nd spot. I'm sure John Yorkston must be making representations to this effect and I hope that our Rod supports him.

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:agree:

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Originally Posted by jgl07

I would have thought that a ground was essential. Also the ground must have at least 6,000 seats.

Falkirk got knocked back from promotion or promotion play-offs more than once because Brockville was deemed inadequate.

Ross County had to make groundshare provisions with Inverness because their own upgrades were not completed by the March deadline.

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I meant has it been 100% confirmed that they no longer own the stadium or the players contracts?

Certainly seems a grey area to me.

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Originally Posted by Seveno

I don't see why there is this assumption that the place will go to Dundee. Natural justice dictates that it should go to Dunfermline, the team relegated during the season that another club cheated its way to 2nd spot. I'm sure John Yorkston must be making representations to this effect and I hope that our Rod supports him.

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Due to it already being in the SPL rules. If it happens after a team already relegated then they stay down and. Next team in SFL gets the invite.

Why would it be justice to get them back in? They've shown they weren't good enough to stay in.

What a total mess, only in Scotland.

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Originally Posted by johnbc70

What a total mess, only in Scotland.

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Yes.

And lets remember that Spartans were kicked out of the Scottish Cup for missing a signature on a registration form........,


:fuming:

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Originally Posted by Seveno

I don't see why there is this assumption that the place will go to Dundee. Natural justice dictates that it should go to Dunfermline, the team relegated during the season that another club cheated its way to 2nd spot. I'm sure John Yorkston must be making representations to this effect and I hope that our Rod supports him.

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My point was that whichever club is invited - could they decline it for the reasons outlined, what then? Offer the 3rd, 4th, 5th place until one accepts?

I wonder how much an SFL3 team could make with 2 TRFC visits? You hear about this sort of thing in cups where it makes a whole season for them. Would a team risk missing out by 'volunteering' to be promoted.

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Originally Posted by bernz

I meant has it been 100% confirmed that they no longer own the stadium or the players contracts?

Certainly seems a grey area to me.

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The jury is still out on the stadium etc. Popular culture has it that they were sold on. I'm not popular, though :greengrin

On the players, the default position is that they are not yet transferred. They can be, but don't have to be if the player doesn't want. Naturally, the players will be waiting to see the outcomes of the various decisions.

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Originally Posted by johnrebus

I really don't think that rules and contracts etc. will matter at the conclusion of all this.

I believe that the major decisions will be taken away from the clubs - maybe even the SFA/SPL. They - the Hun - are too big, there are too many of them and that influence will be brought to bear in some form or other - I don't know what exactly - in sticking them straight back into the SPL.

And I really do believe that the fans will vote with their feet and that the SPL will consist mainly of part-time clubs before long.

Yes, I admit this is a defeatist view, but the whole country is ingrained with this Rangers/Celtic - Catholic/Protestant cancer. The real solution would be to see that Rangers cease to exist completely, then we would be on the road to recovery, Sadly that is not going to happen.

This goes way beyond football IMHO.


:boo hoo:

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Nah :no way:

If not certain already Kilmarnock's opening fixture against club 12 will guarantee that Killie will vote yes to a newco. That's most of their August transfer budget right there, in fact wouldn't surprise me if they put word out they can have 3 stands.:rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by johnrebus

Yes.

And lets remember that Spartans were kicked out of the Scottish Cup for missing a signature on a registration form........,


:fuming:

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It was actually a missing date that Spartans got chucked out for - the document had to be dated in two places and they had only dated it once.

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Originally Posted by Caversham Green

It was actually a missing date that Spartans got chucked out for - the document had to be dated in two places and they had only dated it once.

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I stand corrected.


:not worth

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Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

The jury is still out on the stadium etc. Popular culture has it that they were sold on. I'm not popular, though :greengrin

On the players, the default position is that they are not yet transferred. They can be, but don't have to be if the player doesn't want. Naturally, the players will be waiting to see the outcomes of the various decisions.

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Is this not just the media making assumptions?

Has anything official been seen/published regarding the stadium? Do property sales not need to be registered somewhere?

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Originally Posted by Andy74

At the moment old Rangers exist with an SPL share.

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At the moment old Rangers dont meet the criteria for an SPL share (no stadium etc.) so the share HAS to be passed on elsewhere. Whether this goes to NewCo, Dundee, Dunfermline or is passed back to the SPL is what needs to be decided.

My gut feeling is that if it is passed to NewCo then there could be objections and potential court cases from Dundee/Dunfermline (especially given the number of rule breaks that this would incur).

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Originally Posted by bernz

Is this not just the media making assumptions?

Has anything official been seen/published regarding the stadium? Do property sales not need to be registered somewhere?

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Probably.

No.

Yes.... and it's that that might scupper my conspiracy theory :greengrin

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Originally Posted by Caversham Green

It was actually a missing date that Spartans got chucked out for - the document had to be dated in two places and they had only dated it once.

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Oh well in that case they deserve every punishment coming to them!

This is a small point, but why are Charles Green and his consortium all wearing the same corporate ties as the old Rangers Football Club PLC - the dark blue with thin red stripe on white as favoured by Moonbeams and Uncle Watty?

A little visual signifier to all that it's "business as usual folks, see you in the SPL again soon"? Damn them all!

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Originally Posted by johnrebus

I really don't think that rules and contracts etc. will matter at the conclusion of all this.

I believe that the major decisions will be taken away from the clubs - maybe even the SFA/SPL. They - the Hun - are too big, there are too many of them and that influence will be brought to bear in some form or other - I don't know what exactly - in sticking them straight back into the SPL.

And I really do believe that the fans will vote with their feet and that the SPL will consist mainly of part-time clubs before long.

Yes, I admit this is a defeatist view, but the whole country is ingrained with this Rangers/Celtic - Catholic/Protestant cancer. The real solution would be to see that Rangers cease to exist completely, then we would be on the road to recovery, Sadly that is not going to happen.

This goes way beyond football IMHO.


:boo hoo:

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I agree, to a certain extent, but football can only deal with the footballing issues per ce and hope, indeed expect that politicians are sage enough to address the societal issues. Unfortunately, many of our politicians, of all major parties have fallen over themselves to appear friendly to the Dark forces. As we cannot wave a magic wand, the footballing authorities must apply the rules" without fear or favour". This is the defining issue in Scottish football and it's handling will to a large extent decide the future of the game. As you rightly say if the powers that be soft peddle on this issue, it will offer a startlingly negative perspective on the ability of Scottish society to deal with an issue that should have been addressed years ago. Namely that thousands of football supporters think it is acceptable to congregate and hurl sectarian abuse at their fellow citizens without anyone condemning their practices. Indeed, they seem to think it is their right!

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Originally Posted by Col2

I can't be the only person is sick and tired of the whole saga.

Yes Rangers are no more and they are replaced by The Rangers. This will run and run and run.

The thing that gets me in all of this and is rarely mentioned on here, by pundits, the media etc etc..... Is.....Rangers FC CAUSED this, they are FULLY ACCOUNTABLE for the mess and the disruption to the league, the other clubs, supporters and the image of Scottish Football.

Despite all this I have seen ZERO humility shown by anyone with any kind of association with RFC. David Murray, Craig Whyte, Charles Green, Ally McCoist, Sandy Jardine, Gordon Smith, Rangers Supporters Assxociations and every single rangers fan I have spoken to.

At best you get a 'I know we were in the wrong BUT *insert 101 excuse and blame of someone else*.

The irony for us is that we have run a tight ship for last 7 years or so much to the pain on the park. Now we need to rebuild our squad and I can't think anything other than Fenlons budget will be restricted by those fans including me who refuse to renew for next season while this rumbles on.

Really sad sad state of affairs when only two people who fans are giving credit to over last 4 months is Channel 4 journalist and blogger and BBC Panarama journalist.

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Every day you read somebody else claim they've been "punished enough".

Everyday similar people tell us Sky will pull out/the game will collapse in Scotland if Rangers are punished further.

Everyday we are told that TRFC's history is intact.

Fact is the assets of the Club were purchased by Green. Currently that Club has no license or place in the League.

So how can their "history" be "intact" if they've not got anywhere to play currently?

Why would a more competitive League collapse without them?

What have they been punished for and by whom?

For the doom-mongers - nicked fae KDS as I don't have the time...

"Just want to take a minute to reflect on the fact that as of today, June 18, 2012, the old huns are dead and the new huns (1) are owned by a shady operator named, of all things, "Green"; (2) have no players, (3) have no staff, but seem likely to end up with Ally "Fat Dick" McCoist as their manager, and (4) have no league to play in.

Their support is forced to look at a effing placeholding number on the proposed fixture list and hope -- hope! -- that they'll be allowed to play in the SPL, but by god it doesn't look likely."

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Originally Posted by bernz

Technically rangers are not dead yet. They are still a company with an SPL share.

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They are also a company with a UEFA club licence, without which a club cannot compete in the SPL. Nor can a UEFA club licence be transferred "between one legal entity and another" so Newhun cannot compete in the SPL.

There is no way round this.

SPL board meeting breaking up shortly according to the Beeb's Chris McLaughlin.

https://twitter.com/bbcchrismclaug/s...15948568023042

What was being discussed today if the vote on the Hun's SPL share isn't being voted on for another 2 weeks?

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Originally Posted by green glory

SPL board meeting breaking up shortly according to the Beeb's Chris McLaughlin.

https://twitter.com/bbcchrismclaug/s...15948568023042

What was being discussed today if the vote on the Hun's SPL share isn't being voted on for another 2 weeks?

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The Board isn't the clubs. It's the clubs that are voting in 2 weeks.

This may be just a regular Board meeting..... or may not be. :greengrin

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Originally Posted by CropleyWasGod

The Board isn't the clubs. It's the clubs that are voting in 2 weeks.

This may be just a regular Board meeting..... or may not be. :greengrin

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Maybe Neal Doncaster's tendering his resignation? We can hope.

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Originally Posted by Kaiser1962

They are also a company with a UEFA club licence, without which a club cannot compete in the SPL. Nor can a UEFA club licence be transferred "between one legal entity and another" so Newhun cannot compete in the SPL.

There is no way round this.

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Did you mean without a UEFA Club license? :confused:

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Originally Posted by Cropley10

Did you mean without a UEFA Club license? :confused:

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They can't hold a UEFA license let alone hold an SFA license. Statement due from SPL board soon.

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Originally Posted by The Wee Hibby

They can't hold a UEFA license let alone hold an SFA license. Statement due from SPL board soon.

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So, they don't have a license and it can't be transferred from one Legal Entity to another but the "history" is intact.

Huns will tell you that it's just the name over the door that's changed!

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Originally Posted by Cropley10

Did you mean without a UEFA Club license? :confused:

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At the moment, as well as the SPL share, Oldhun have the UEFA club licence which, under SFA rules, cannot be transferred. Therefore without the UEFA club licence Newhun cannot compete in the SPL.

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Originally Posted by The Wee Hibby

They can't hold a UEFA license let alone hold an SFA license. Statement due from SPL board soon.

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About the UEFA club license?

This should be good as the matter is as clear cut as it gets.

July the 4th, date for your diaries! http://www.scotprem.com/content/defa...2&newsid=11440

Press Statement ~ Rangers FC
At its meeting earlier today, the SPL Board considered a number of issues relating to Rangers FC.

EBT Investigation

The SPL Board heard a report from its solicitors following the investigation into payments to, or for the benefit of, players allegedly made by Rangers FC outside of contract.

The delay in concluding the investigation was caused by an initial lack of co-operation from Rangers FC.

The investigation has now been completed and, in the view of the SPL, there is a prima facie case to answer in respect of its Rules.

Disciplinary charges will be brought when the future status of Rangers FC is clarified and prior to the start of season 2012/13.

General Meeting

An application for registration of transfer of Rangers’ SPL share has been received. Consideration of the application will depend on receipt by the SPL Board of all required documentation and verification.

A general meeting of all 12 member clubs has been convened for 10am on Wednesday 4 July 2012 for members to decide whether to approve the transfer.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Kaiser1962

At the moment, as well as the SPL share, Oldhun have the UEFA club licence which, under SFA rules, cannot be transferred. Therefore without the UEFA club licence Newhun cannot compete in the SPL.

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No doubt this was another rule that was changed at the last meeting

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Gingertosser

Press Statement ~ Rangers FC
At its meeting earlier today, the SPL Board considered a number of issues relating to Rangers FC.

EBT Investigation

The SPL Board heard a report from its solicitors following the investigation into payments to, or for the benefit of, players allegedly made by Rangers FC outside of contract.

The delay in concluding the investigation was caused by an initial lack of co-operation from Rangers FC.

The investigation has now been completed and, in the view of the SPL, there is a prima facie case to answer in respect of its Rules.

Disciplinary charges will be brought when the future status of Rangers FC is clarified and prior to the start of season 2012/13.

General Meeting

An application for registration of transfer of Rangers’ SPL share has been received. Consideration of the application will depend on receipt by the SPL Board of all required documentation and verification.

A general meeting of all 12 member clubs has been convened for 10am on Wednesday 4 July 2012 for members to decide whether to approve the transfer.

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Excellent :aok:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Kaiser1962

At the moment, as well as the SPL share, Oldhun have the UEFA club licence which, under SFA rules, cannot be transferred. Therefore without the UEFA club licence Newhun cannot compete in the SPL.

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Aye but these are Scottish rules, not really applicable it seems when Rangers are involved. Any other country and the team that were 2nd in the division below would be promoted as soon as old huns were liquidated. There is no rule AT ALL that lets a newco into the top league in Scotland, in fact i'd imagine thats the case all over the world?

This is a shambles, and brought on by Rangers initially, but those at the top of the SPL have been trying their hardest to find some way of letting them continue in the premier division, when in any other league in the world they'd be nowhere near it, and demoted weeks ago.

Their own rules will see the huns demoted, thats the only outcome if football is to survive in Scotland.

Anything else and it will become apparent to the rest of the world, the inmates are running the asylum we call Scottish Football.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Salt & Sauzee

July the 4th, date for your diaries! http://www.scotprem.com/content/defa...2&newsid=11440

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Independence Day too, oh the irony. It's the SPL's very own independence day, prove we are not dependant on Rangers and in general the Old Firm!

Indeed totally agree. The sectarian cancer goes all the way to the top of the tree. Let us not forget that in 1997 when Tony Blair was elected as Prime Minister he could not be sworn into office until he went to a Protestant Church of England and denounced the Pope of Rome and the Roman Catholic Church and was re-Christened into the CofE. Disgusting, sectarian and pathetic that he had to go through with that charade. When that is what a Prime Minister has to go through then what chance has anyone else got? Please note my illustration above is to show the ridiculousness of the institutionalised system and is not meant to suggest either version of Christianity is superior to the other :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by calmac12000

I agree, to a certain extent, but football can only deal with the footballing issues per ce and hope, indeed expect that politicians are sage enough to address the societal issues. Unfortunately, many of our politicians, of all major parties have fallen over themselves to appear friendly to the Dark forces. As we cannot wave a magic wand, the footballing authorities must apply the rules" without fear or favour". This is the defining issue in Scottish football and it's handling will to a large extent decide the future of the game. As you rightly say if the powers that be soft peddle on this issue, it will offer a startlingly negative perspective on the ability of Scottish society to deal with an issue that should have been addressed years ago. Namely that thousands of football supporters think it is acceptable to congregate and hurl sectarian abuse at their fellow citizens without anyone condemning their practices. Indeed, they seem to think it is their right!

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How can there even be a vote? The New club known as Sevco 5088 (trading as The Rangers Football Club - TRFC) does not have 3 years of audited accounts, as such it is incapable of holding an SFA license which is a requirement to play in the SPL. Licenses cannot be transferred between two clubs so really the fact that it has been decided that a vote on the situation is required is beyond ridiculous - one set of rules for them, one set for everyone else. With regards to the vote does anyone know if it will be an 8-4 job or an 11-1 (which it should be) but that of course assumes that RFC (IA) are capable of voting - which they aren't as they have no ground, no players and no youth policy and as such do not meet the criteria set out by the league as to what constitutes an SPL club.

I would counter G that the authorities are treading very carefully and methodically towards the conclusion that Sevco 5088 cant compete in the SPL. They are giving them every opportunity to present a case but, nonetheless, seem to be inching towards exclusion. Once the process is complete Sevco 5088 will run out of time and space and may well find themself excluded, as they should be, from the national leagues.

If the above is NOT the case then I hope Dundee's lawyers are watching and take legal action in the civil courts as precedent has already been set.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by blackpoolhibs

Aye but these are Scottish rules, not really applicable it seems when Rangers are involved. Any other country and the team that were 2nd in the division below would be promoted as soon as old huns were liquidated. There is no rule AT ALL that lets a newco into the top league in Scotland, in fact i'd imagine thats the case all over the world?

This is a shambles, and brought on by Rangers initially, but those at the top of the SPL have been trying their hardest to find some way of letting them continue in the premier division, when in any other league in the world they'd be nowhere near it, and demoted weeks ago.

Their own rules will see the huns demoted, thats the only outcome if football is to survive in Scotland.

Anything else and it will become apparent to the rest of the world, the inmates are running the asylum we call Scottish Football.

---

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lungo--Drom

Indeed totally agree. The sectarian cancer goes all the way to the top of the tree. Let us not forget that in 1997 when Tony Blair was elected as Prime Minister he could not be sworn into office until he went to a Protestant Church of England and denounced the Pope of Rome and the Roman Catholic Church and was re-Christened into the CofE. Disgusting, sectarian and pathetic that he had to go through with that charade. When that is what a Prime Minister has to go through then what chance has anyone else got? Please note my illustration above is to show the ridiculousness of the institutionalised system and is not meant to suggest either version of Christianity is superior to the other :)

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Um without going too far off topic - that's rubbish. Blair converted to Catholicism after leaving office. He frequently attended RC services with his missus while PM. There's enough nonsense taked about sectarianism without making stuff up.

Newco vote - 4th of July.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Kaiser1962

I would counter G that the authorities are treading very carefully and methodically towards the conclusion that Sevco 5088 cant compete in the SPL. They are giving them every opportunity to present a case but, nonetheless, seem to be inching towards exclusion. Once the process is complete Sevco 5088 will run out of time and space and may well find themself excluded, as they should be, from the national leagues.

If the above is NOT the case then I hope Dundee's lawyers are watching and take legal action in the civil courts as precedent has already been set.

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I understand that, but the rules are very clear in my opinion, the newco does not meet any of the criteria needed for ANY club to apply for the SFL, never mind the SPL.

This is making it more difficult for Dundee to prepare for the division they surely must be in next season, another case of the huns not caring who they trod on.

The SPL will have lawyers, and those lawyers surely must be telling them its an open and shut case?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by blackpoolhibs

I understand that, but the rules are very clear in my opinion, the newco does not meet any of the criteria needed for ANY club to apply for the SFL, never mind the SPL.

This is making it more difficult for Dundee to prepare for the division they surely must be in next season, another case of the huns not caring who they trod on.

The SPL will have lawyers, and those lawyers surely must be telling them its an open and shut case?

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.. and if that is correct, due process will be followed.

We are all impatient here but, again, it has to be done the right way.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mainboy19

Newco vote - 4th of July.

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Independence day!

If they've been found guilty in the dual contract investigation, then stripped titles it is. The SPL just need clarification on who to apply the punishments to, hence the time being given to provide relevant documentation etc.

I think it's unlikely the Hun is going to have their own 'big' house in order in time.

What a ****ing mess ha ha!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jgl07

Independence day!

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:thumbsup:

Shame i will be away on holiday. It could be a great day :cb

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Liberal Hibby

Um without going too far off topic - that's rubbish. Blair converted to Catholicism after leaving office. He frequently attended RC services with his missus while PM. There's enough nonsense taked about sectarianism without making stuff up.

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...to help him cope with the considerable guilt he ought to be living with.

The Scottish Premier League says Rangers have "a prima facie case to answer in respect of [league] rules" over payments to players.

Rangers were investigated over alleged player payments outside of contract.
"Disciplinary charges will be brought when the future status of Rangers FC is clarified and prior to the start of season 2012/13," said an SPL spokesman.

“The delay in concluding the investigation was caused by an initial lack of co-operation from Rangers FC”

SPL spokesman

Meanwhile, SPL member clubs will vote on whether a newco Rangers should be admitted to the league on 4 July.
Rangers' attempts to exit administration via a company voluntary arrangement failed after major creditor HM Revenue and Customs turned down the proposal and the club's assets have been transferred to a new company, The Rangers Football Club, while Rangers Football Club plc is liquidated.
The club's new chief executive Charles Green has made an official request to transfer Rangers FC plc's share in the SPL to the new company to allow top flight football to continue at Ibrox.
However, the issue has to be voted on by all 12 members - including Rangers - and Green needs at least eight clubs to vote in favour of the request.
If five or more clubs vote against it, Rangers are likely to apply for the vacancy that would be created in the Scottish Football League with the intention of starting next season in Division Three.
With uncertainty over whether Rangers will be in the top flight for season 2012/13, their name has been replaced by "Club 12" in the SPL fixture list released on Monday morning.
"An application for registration of transfer of Rangers' SPL share has been received," said the league's spokesman.

• The company which had run Rangers until 14 June 2012 will shortly be liquidated
• A new company (newco) has bought Rangers' assets, including Ibrox Stadium
• The newco wants to replace the old company in the Scottish Premier League
• An 8-to-4 majority of SPL member clubs, including Rangers, is required for the newco to be admitted
• If 5 or more clubs vote no, Rangers will need to apply to be admitted to Scottish Football League Division Three

"Consideration of the application will depend on receipt by the SPL Board of all required documentation and verification.
"A general meeting of all 12 member clubs has been convened for 10am on Wednesday 4 July 2012 for members to decide whether to approve the transfer."
Rangers' use of employee benefits trusts during a decade-long period was the subject of a long-running tax tribunal, which concluded in January but has yet to return a verdict.
The SPL began its own investigation into whether Rangers had broken its rules after the tribunal concluded.
"The SPL board heard a report from its solicitors following the investigation into payments to, or for the benefit of, players allegedly made by Rangers FC outside of contract," added the spokesman.
"The delay in concluding the investigation was caused by an initial lack of co-operation from Rangers FC.
"The investigation has now been completed and, in the view of the SPL, there is a prima facie case to answer in respect of its rules."

I like the bits in bold...so there is still documentation and verification required :greengrin

Can't believe Rangers are even being considered by SFA until all the investors are known. (By the sounds of it Green doesn't even know who the investors are.) How can the SFA know that these people are "fit and proper" if they don't even know who they are? The Rangers could turn into Notts County who turned out to be a shadowey group of people who were in it just to make money. We would then require another 10,000 page thread saying we told you so.

Just wish SFA had the gonads to stand up to Rangers and tell them to stop wasting everyone's time and go forth and multiply.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Caversham Green

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/footbal...6908-23897491/

Pretty much wraps up the SPL's investigation for them.

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Mildly interesting story about Boumsong that might have further ramifications for Club 12 and Souness. JAB was playing for Auxerre and his agent was touting him. Bobby Robson (then of NUFC) went to look at him with the chief scout on a couple of occasions and jointly decided he was no better than we had and left it. JAB signed for Club 12, Robson got the sack, and Souness, new NUFC 'manager', then paid £8m for the bombscare a few months later.

It's a transfer that's been looked at before, and almost certainly will be again...

This gets more mental by the day, a crack squad of Columbo, Kojak, Jessica Fletcher, Puncharello, Quincy, Van Der Valk, Michael Knight, The A Team, Magnum, Ironside, Father Dowling, Poirot and Sherlock Holmes couldn't get to the bottom of this mess

So the long and short of it now is (correct me if i'm wrong):

4th July - 5 Clubs say no and they're oot???


Between now and then the campaign and the pressure on the clubs from their own fans has to be cranked up to the maximum!!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by sambajustice

So the long and short of it now is (correct me if i'm wrong):

4th July - 5 Clubs say no and they're oot???


Between now and then the campaign and the pressure on the clubs from their own fans has to be cranked up to the maximum!!

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Close but not quite....

Sevco 5088 are not IN any structure...so all the 'kicking them out' guff from media is wrong...5 clubs could prevent them GETTING IN...but before that they have a bunch of hurdles to jump in getting verification paperwork to SPL (like ownership of ground etc etc)

Attitudes hardening. Latest from St Mirren Board:

http://www.saintmirren.net/pages/?p=13244

Seems clear to me Rangers and The Rangers are stuffed.

Any transfer of SPL share will have to include transfer of sanctions for Rangers. This must be expulsion due to ongoing re-appeal and now dual contracts.

Therefore to avoid Rangers sanctions The Rangers will need to apply to SFL.


First time we have seen confirmation that The Rangers have indeed the property of Rangers. Therefore surely now Rangers are no longer fit to hold an SPL license so this should be returned immediately to the SPL.

Will take a while to get there I'm sure but the outcome looks certain, there is simply not enough wriggle room. So at least 3 years without Rangers in the SPL and it's looking pretty grim for them to even be playing football next year..how long will the SFL give them to apply and will they even be in a fit and proper state to do so...Spartans and the like have applied previously so I'm sure could pull together a proper applicaiton quite quickly...The Rangers might not even have any players when they need to apply to the SFL and of course the SFL clubs might well just tell them to bolt! :greengrin

4th July. Hundepence day!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Offside Trap

Attitudes hardening. Latest from St Mirren Board:

http://www.saintmirren.net/pages/?p=13244

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Like a valid sfa and uefa licence which they don't have and which can't be transferred according to the rules
bye bye currant buns :na na::na na::na na:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SiMar

Seems clear to me Rangers and The Rangers are stuffed.

Any transfer of SPL share will have to include transfer of sanctions for Rangers. This must be expulsion due to ongoing re-appeal and now dual contracts.

Therefore to avoid Rangers sanctions The Rangers will need to apply to SFL.


First time we have seen confirmation that The Rangers have indeed the property of Rangers. Therefore surely now Rangers are no longer fit to hold an SPL license so this should be returned immediately to the SPL.

Will take a while to get there I'm sure but the outcome looks certain, there is simply not enough wriggle room. So at least 3 years without Rangers in the SPL and it's looking pretty grim for them to even be playing football next year..how long will the SFL give them to apply and will they even be in a fit and proper state to do so...Spartans and the like have applied previously so I'm sure could pull together a proper applicaiton quite quickly...The Rangers might not even have any players when they need to apply to the SFL and of course the SFL clubs might well just tell them to bolt! :greengrin

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Never said this before, but.... SOURCE? :greengrin

There's only 2 teams called Rangers - and they're both going to die

ha ha ha ha ha

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Offside Trap

Attitudes hardening. Latest from St Mirren Board:

http://www.saintmirren.net/pages/?p=13244

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Are you sure...lots about doing whats best for St Mirren...but nothing about voting for integrity...so could be taken either way

Quote:

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Originally Posted by magpie1892

Mildly interesting story about Boumsong that might have further ramifications for Club 12 and Souness. JAB was playing for Auxerre and his agent was touting him. Bobby Robson (then of NUFC) went to look at him with the chief scout on a couple of occasions and jointly decided he was no better than we had and left it. JAB signed for Club 12, Robson got the sack, and Souness, new NUFC 'manager', then paid £8m for the bombscare a few months later.

It's a transfer that's been looked at before, and almost certainly will be again...

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By coincidence around the time that all happened Graeme Souness received a loan from an employee benefit trust set up by his former employers.

Nothing at all dodgy there.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by down-the-slope

Are you sure...lots about doing whats best for St Mirren...but nothing about voting for integrity...so could be taken either way

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Agreed - and no I'm not sure! :greengrin

But the extract below sure provides a stick to beat the St Mirren Board with if they allow SevCo in.

"The Board of Directors as well as all other St Mirren supporters totally understands the sense of injustice felt at this time instigated by the way in which another club in our League has conducted their affairs."

Sending pretty strong smoke signals IMHO.....

Quote:

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Originally Posted by down-the-slope

Are you sure...lots about doing whats best for St Mirren...but nothing about voting for integrity...so could be taken either way

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Yep, I read that as st mirren getting the excuses in...

Who's going to replace them? I thought the SPL rules suggested that it was the 2nd team in Division 1, but noises seem to be getting made about Dundee? Bit unfair on both these teams if they have to wait until 4th July to know which division they are playing in!