Weight Lifting

[HarpOnHibee]

Sorry, wasn't sure where else to post this. But interested in finding out what other Hibees are into the gym and lifting weights?

I've been going to the gym for several months now and really starting to enjoy it. Was certainly a slog for the first few months or so, but really getting into the routine of it now. It's not my first attempt at the gym, I gave it a go several years ago before the lockdown situation. I didn't do too well first time round as I was making the mistake of trying to lift too heavy instead of focusing on proper form, which of course led to injury and me not wanting to go back again. But glad I've learnt that lesson for this time round. (Ego lifting is a big NO!)

I'm focusing mainly on upper body at the moment (biceps, triceps, delts, upper back and chest). Although I really need to start work on the abs and core at some point as they're clearly my weakest areas and as they say, you're only as strong as your weakest link.

Would be great to hear from other lifters. Perhaps some of the more long term/experienced lifters can share some advice and tips for us noobs and beginners. Could be a really useful/helpful thread for those happy to contribute.

Cheers!

https://i.ibb.co/wLN3J5D/greenliftingcropped.gif

[Jones28]

Ah nice one! Good thread :aok:

I've been lifting weights on and off, to various degrees of commitment since I was about 15 so been doing it a long time. I was a gym goer but invested in a Mirafit home gym set up this year and it's the best thing I've done for my weigh training. It's now in the garage.

My biggest problem over this time was consistency. I'd be great for 3/4 weeks, going to the gym 3 or 4 times and really getting in to it then something would happen and I would fall out of habit for a week or 2 and find it so hard to go back to it.

My tips would be:

Stay consistent - its easy to make excuses sometimes but often the best sessions are the ones you feel worse about doing.

Record what you're doing - makes it easy to see progress and know the areas you need to improve on. Even the little things like weight increments. For example say you're doing tricep push downs and you get 12 reps instead of the 10 you were planning on, record it and increase the weight until 10 is as many as you can do.

Working as close to failure as you can go. Theres a term called "Reps in Reserve", which is how many you've got left in the tank after you finish the set, try to get to 1 or 2 RIR on your sets.

Spotting for lifts like a bench press are great, gives you more confidence to try heavier weights or go for more reps - it helps you get closer to failure.

If you're bench pressing alone don't put collars on the bar to stop the weights from sliding off - I've been stuck under bars a few times and it can be very awkward! You can slide the weights off the bar if you get stuck and there's no one around to help.

For your chest using dumbbells is really good for flat or incline bench pressing, especially if you don't have someone to spot for you - it's much safer.

Don't be afraid of the small plates. They are there to be used! If you need 500gm plates to progress then use them.

Theres plenty more to focus on, and loads of really good stuff on youtube for tips and tricks - Renaissance Periodization is one of my favourites but I'd recommend looking at Sean Nalewanyj first.

[Pretty Boy]

As said above consistency is key. Don't ego lift, focus on getting good technique and if that means dropping a weight or 2 then do it (although you already seem to have learned this).

I focus on one body area one day each week. Monday is chest and core, Tuesday back, Wednesday legs and Thursday is arms and shoulders. I get my cardio through cycling and running.

Best advice I would give is ignore almost all of the social media noise from influencers. 'Arnie utilised a rear delt trapeze press mixed with an anterior shoulder overhead barbell swing all whilst standing on his head and here's why you should to'. **** off. He had been working his whole life towards near perfection in his physique and was trying to squeeze out a 0.1% gain that was potentially the difference between being Mr Universe again or not. For most people lifting weights is about feeling and looking a wee bit better and keeping the weight off. If you want to grow your arms do some shoulder presses and bicep curls, if you want to grow your chest do some bench and incline presses. The guy who trained Brad Pitt for his roles in Fight Club and Troy (both of which saw him in different but equally impeccable shapes) was very much in this no bull**** school of thought.

A decent Pt can certainty help with technique and understanding of how different muscle groups grow; they will also keep you accountable. Ultimately though having a core group of 3-5 exercises per body are and targeting them consistently and increasing reps and weight as and when you are ready coupled with relatively clean eating will see you make gains pretty quickly.

[HarpOnHibee]

Ah nice one! Good thread :aok:

I've been lifting weights on and off, to various degrees of commitment since I was about 15 so been doing it a long time. I was a gym goer but invested in a Mirafit home gym set up this year and it's the best thing I've done for my weigh training. It's now in the garage.

My biggest problem over this time was consistency. I'd be great for 3/4 weeks, going to the gym 3 or 4 times and really getting in to it then something would happen and I would fall out of habit for a week or 2 and find it so hard to go back to it.

My tips would be:

Stay consistent - its easy to make excuses sometimes but often the best sessions are the ones you feel worse about doing.

Record what you're doing - makes it easy to see progress and know the areas you need to improve on. Even the little things like weight increments. For example say you're doing tricep push downs and you get 12 reps instead of the 10 you were planning on, record it and increase the weight until 10 is as many as you can do.

Working as close to failure as you can go. Theres a term called "Reps in Reserve", which is how many you've got left in the tank after you finish the set, try to get to 1 or 2 RIR on your sets.

Spotting for lifts like a bench press are great, gives you more confidence to try heavier weights or go for more reps - it helps you get closer to failure.

If you're bench pressing alone don't put collars on the bar to stop the weights from sliding off - I've been stuck under bars a few times and it can be very awkward! You can slide the weights off the bar if you get stuck and there's no one around to help.

For your chest using dumbbells is really good for flat or incline bench pressing, especially if you don't have someone to spot for you - it's much safer.

Don't be afraid of the small plates. They are there to be used! If you need 500gm plates to progress then use them.

Theres plenty more to focus on, and loads of really good stuff on youtube for tips and tricks - Renaissance Periodization is one of my favourites but I'd recommend looking at Sean Nalewanyj first.

Hey, thanks for the great advice, particularly about keeping the collars off the bar when training alone. I wondered why I seen some people doing this and thought I might get into some bother if I was caught doing the same thing. I haven't done any barbell bench pressing as of yet though. I've been doing a combination of dumbbell flys and the chest press machine. I go for 6 sets per exercise and aim for 10 reps per set, lowering the weight slightly after each 2-3 sets when muscle fatigue really starts to kick in. I seem to get a good stimulus with this approach, but it could also just be the benefit of beginners gains playing a part and I may need to switch things up at some point as I progress.

What are your thoughts on deloading every several weeks? I've heard this is a common practice and is more effective for long term muscle growth and preventing the build up of physical and systemic fatigue by allowing the muscles an extended period of recovery, while allowing gains to be maintained using lower weights during the deload period.


As said above consistency is key. Don't ego lift, focus on getting good technique and if that means dropping a weight or 2 then do it (although you already seem to have learned this).

I focus on one body area one day each week. Monday is chest and core, Tuesday back, Wednesday legs and Thursday is arms and shoulders. I get my cardio through cycling and running.

Best advice I would give is ignore almost all of the social media noise from influencers. 'Arnie utilised a rear delt trapeze press mixed with an anterior shoulder overhead barbell swing all whilst standing on his head and here's why you should to'. **** off. He had been working his whole life towards near perfection in his physique and was trying to squeeze out a 0.1% gain that was potentially the difference between being Mr Universe again or not. For most people lifting weights is about feeling and looking a wee bit better and keeping the weight off. If you want to grow your arms do some shoulder presses and bicep curls, if you want to grow your chest do some bench and incline presses. The guy who trained Brad Pitt for his roles in Fight Club and Troy (both of which saw him in different but equally impeccable shapes) was very much in this no bull**** school of thought.

A decent Pt can certainty help with technique and understanding of how different muscle groups grow; they will also keep you accountable. Ultimately though having a core group of 3-5 exercises per body are and targeting them consistently and increasing reps and weight as and when you are ready coupled with relatively clean eating will see you make gains pretty quickly.

Hey, thanks for your post. Do you find that working a muscle group once per week is enough to stimulate enough hypertrophy? I've heard it takes 2-3 sessions per week on each muscle group to see consistent growth. But this of course may be wrong or depend on an individuals genetics.

[Jones28]

Hey, thanks for the great advice, particularly about keeping the collars off the bar when training alone. I wondered why I seen some people doing this and thought I might get into some bother if I was caught doing the same thing. I haven't done any barbell bench pressing as of yet though. I've been doing a combination of dumbbell flys and the chest press machine. I go for 6 sets per exercise and aim for 10 reps per set, lowering the weight slightly after each 2-3 sets when muscle fatigue really starts to kick in. I seem to get a good stimulus with this approach, but it could also just be the benefit of beginners gains playing a part and I may need to switch things up at some point as I progress.

What are your thoughts on deloading every several weeks? I've heard this is a common practice and is more effective for long term muscle growth and preventing the build up of physical and systemic fatigue by allowing the muscles an extended period of recovery, while allowing gains to be maintained using lower weights during the deload period.



Hey, thanks for your post. Do you find that working a muscle group once per week is enough to stimulate enough hypertrophy? I've heard it takes 2-3 sessions per week on each muscle group to see consistent growth. But this of course may be wrong or depend on an individuals genetics.

No worries at all.

Re your training etc, you will be seeing big improvements at the moment - beginner gains are a real thing but if you get it right you can ride that wave for a pretty long time. Theres nothing wrong with not benching at all, it would be an interesting experiment for you to see how you get on with a flat bench press, either a dumb-bell or bar. Dumb-bells in particular if done with lots of control and a really deep stretch are great for chest development.

One thing you could do is keep your current excercises and do 3 x 10/12 of deficit push ups to finish. You need to do push ups with your feet on the ground, but your hands slightly elevated to allow you to get really deep. They are killer for the end of a chest session. Think nose-to-the-floor and stretching really deep at the bottom of the press up.

I would say you could afford to drop back a couple of your sets but trying to maintain a higher weight for all of them, or next time you're in the gym try and set the machine higher and get 4 sets of 10 at that weight. Slowing your reps down and trying to get really deep stretches for each rep and you can achieve the same training stimulus for fewer sets. Then you could try an all out failure set, and when you can't do a full rep try a couple of half reps to finish things off, but that will probably be of more benefit when you've been training a bit longer.

I do tend to do deloads sometimes, but these usually happen organically. Quite often I will do some German Volumetric Training, which is where you do 10 sets of 10 with about a minute rest between sets. I do this on feeling rather than as part of a plan, usually when I'm feeling quite intense fatigue or if its a friday night and I want to do a quick session. I do this for bench press, barbell rows and sometimes do 10x4 or 5 on pull ups with another excercise while resting.

These are based on my circumstances though, I don't have a busy gym to contend with.

Listen to your body and if recovery times between sessions are starting to get longer then it's worth looking at either deloading or taking a few days or even a week off altogether, that can be really beneficial as it allows you to fully recover. Theres no harm in banging out some press ups etc during this time to keep moving. It can be useful for getting more cardio in if you do any.

[Pretty Boy]

Hey, thanks for the great advice, particularly about keeping the collars off the bar when training alone. I wondered why I seen some people doing this and thought I might get into some bother if I was caught doing the same thing. I haven't done any barbell bench pressing as of yet though. I've been doing a combination of dumbbell flys and the chest press machine. I go for 6 sets per exercise and aim for 10 reps per set, lowering the weight slightly after each 2-3 sets when muscle fatigue really starts to kick in. I seem to get a good stimulus with this approach, but it could also just be the benefit of beginners gains playing a part and I may need to switch things up at some point as I progress.

What are your thoughts on deloading every several weeks? I've heard this is a common practice and is more effective for long term muscle growth and preventing the build up of physical and systemic fatigue by allowing the muscles an extended period of recovery, while allowing gains to be maintained using lower weights during the deload period.



Hey, thanks for your post. Do you find that working a muscle group once per week is enough to stimulate enough hypertrophy? I've heard it takes 2-3 sessions per week on each muscle group to see consistent growth. But this of course may be wrong or depend on an individuals genetics.

It works for me but my goal isn't really to get big, I'm really only wanting lean muscle for running performance (if I can ever be bothered to put together a solid running training block again). I work the targeted muscle group to exhaustion on the day I train it, pretty much every set is to failure, so it's not really possible to train it again for at least 4-5 days after.

What is right for me might not be right for your goals and body type though; there are loads of schools of thoughts on this. It all comes back to doing whatever your doing with consistency and structure and you'll figure it out.

[Onceinawhile]

I've been lifting on and off for about 8 years and I'm currently about three months into being back onto it (having been off it for a long time).

I'm currently trying to figure out the best split for me, but it's not proving easy.

At the moment, I'm trying to focus on the bigger, compound exercises (Squats, deadlifts, overhead press, bench, barbell row) and then supplementing each of those exercises with some back and arms work.

I tend to do three sets of lower numbers and try and move bigger weights when I'm doing it. It is probably partially ego lifting, but it also saves time and i usually only manage when I'm on a lunch break, so time is something I'm trying to save.

Has anyone successfully managed to do a barbell good morning without feeling stupid?

[HarpOnHibee]

No worries at all.

Re your training etc, you will be seeing big improvements at the moment - beginner gains are a real thing but if you get it right you can ride that wave for a pretty long time. Theres nothing wrong with not benching at all, it would be an interesting experiment for you to see how you get on with a flat bench press, either a dumb-bell or bar. Dumb-bells in particular if done with lots of control and a really deep stretch are great for chest development.

One thing you could do is keep your current excercises and do 3 x 10/12 of deficit push ups to finish. You need to do push ups with your feet on the ground, but your hands slightly elevated to allow you to get really deep. They are killer for the end of a chest session. Think nose-to-the-floor and stretching really deep at the bottom of the press up.

I would say you could afford to drop back a couple of your sets but trying to maintain a higher weight for all of them, or next time you're in the gym try and set the machine higher and get 4 sets of 10 at that weight. Slowing your reps down and trying to get really deep stretches for each rep and you can achieve the same training stimulus for fewer sets. Then you could try an all out failure set, and when you can't do a full rep try a couple of half reps to finish things off, but that will probably be of more benefit when you've been training a bit longer.

I do tend to do deloads sometimes, but these usually happen organically. Quite often I will do some German Volumetric Training, which is where you do 10 sets of 10 with about a minute rest between sets. I do this on feeling rather than as part of a plan, usually when I'm feeling quite intense fatigue or if its a friday night and I want to do a quick session. I do this for bench press, barbell rows and sometimes do 10x4 or 5 on pull ups with another excercise while resting.

These are based on my circumstances though, I don't have a busy gym to contend with.

Listen to your body and if recovery times between sessions are starting to get longer then it's worth looking at either deloading or taking a few days or even a week off altogether, that can be really beneficial as it allows you to fully recover. Theres no harm in banging out some press ups etc during this time to keep moving. It can be useful for getting more cardio in if you do any.

Thanks for the excellent advice, i'll certainly be considering taking much of it on board. :aok:


It works for me but my goal isn't really to get big, I'm really only wanting lean muscle for running performance (if I can ever be bothered to put together a solid running training block again). I work the targeted muscle group to exhaustion on the day I train it, pretty much every set is to failure, so it's not really possible to train it again for at least 4-5 days after.

What is right for me might not be right for your goals and body type though; there are loads of schools of thoughts on this. It all comes back to doing whatever your doing with consistency and structure and you'll figure it out.

That makes sense. I guess people come to the gym with different aims and goals. Some lift for pure strength while others for muscle mass, then there's those who train to improve overall endurance for high intensity sports. Your workout plan sounds ideal for endurance.

Do you generally go higher rep with lower weight to improve your overall lean muscle mass and endurance or do you prefer to go heavier with a more limited repetition range?


I've been lifting on and off for about 8 years and I'm currently about three months into being back onto it (having been off it for a long time).

I'm currently trying to figure out the best split for me, but it's not proving easy.

At the moment, I'm trying to focus on the bigger, compound exercises (Squats, deadlifts, overhead press, bench, barbell row) and then supplementing each of those exercises with some back and arms work.

I tend to do three sets of lower numbers and try and move bigger weights when I'm doing it. It is probably partially ego lifting, but it also saves time and i usually only manage when I'm on a lunch break, so time is something I'm trying to save.

Has anyone successfully managed to do a barbell good morning without feeling stupid?

I think focusing on the bigger basic compound exercises is a great idea for building overall body muscle mass, particularly if you already have previous experience in the gym. I can see how it could easily overwhelm somebody who is brand new to the gym though as the technique has to be spot on for them to be truly effective and to avoid injury.

I wouldn't say lower rep numbers and higher weights are ego lifting at all, not if you're maintaining proper form and successfully completing reps with proper extension. It's a highly effective way to train and also saves a fair bit of time.

When I see an ego lifter, I see somebody lifting a heavy weight, simply because they can. But they're swinging it about like a mad person or barely getting any extension on the repetitions, because they can't lift it correctly. Much like myself at the gym a few years prior. :greengrin

[Jones28]

I've been lifting on and off for about 8 years and I'm currently about three months into being back onto it (having been off it for a long time).

I'm currently trying to figure out the best split for me, but it's not proving easy.

At the moment, I'm trying to focus on the bigger, compound exercises (Squats, deadlifts, overhead press, bench, barbell row) and then supplementing each of those exercises with some back and arms work.

I tend to do three sets of lower numbers and try and move bigger weights when I'm doing it. It is probably partially ego lifting, but it also saves time and i usually only manage when I'm on a lunch break, so time is something I'm trying to save.

Has anyone successfully managed to do a barbell good morning without feeling stupid?

Barbell good mornings are horrid, I’ve never liked them. Romanian/stiff legged Deadlifts are my hamstring go-to.

[Allant1981]

Sorry, wasn't sure where else to post this. But interested in finding out what other Hibees are into the gym and lifting weights?

I've been going to the gym for several months now and really starting to enjoy it. Was certainly a slog for the first few months or so, but really getting into the routine of it now. It's not my first attempt at the gym, I gave it a go several years ago before the lockdown situation. I didn't do too well first time round as I was making the mistake of trying to lift too heavy instead of focusing on proper form, which of course led to injury and me not wanting to go back again. But glad I've learnt that lesson for this time round. (Ego lifting is a big NO!)

I'm focusing mainly on upper body at the moment (biceps, triceps, delts, upper back and chest). Although I really need to start work on the abs and core at some point as they're clearly my weakest areas and as they say, you're only as strong as your weakest link.

Would be great to hear from other lifters. Perhaps some of the more long term/experienced lifters can share some advice and tips for us noobs and beginners. Could be a really useful/helpful thread for those happy to contribute.

Cheers!

https://i.ibb.co/wLN3J5D/greenliftingcropped.gif

I'm actually doing the level 2 gym instructing course at the minute, will likely do the level 3 at some point but after going to the gym for the best part of 20 years now and always interested in the training side of it decided to take the leap so happy to help with any questions. Have you got a training plan or just deciding on the day what you are going to do? I know it's an old cliche but food is just as important, I know so many people who start training but stick to their normal diet which doesn't really help at all. As I say happy to answer any questions. I'm sure there is a poster on here who was a professional body builder(J-C) possibly so he might be worth a shout also

[HarpOnHibee]

I'm actually doing the level 2 gym instructing course at the minute, will likely do the level 3 at some point but after going to the gym for the best part of 20 years now and always interested in the training side of it decided to take the leap so happy to help with any questions. Have you got a training plan or just deciding on the day what you are going to do? I know it's an old cliche but food is just as important, I know so many people who start training but stick to their normal diet which doesn't really help at all. As I say happy to answer any questions. I'm sure there is a poster on here who was a professional body builder(J-C) possibly so he might be worth a shout also

Terrific, hope that's going well for you. :aok:

I have a plan, albeit a very simple one. Because I'm only working upper body at the moment, I only go to the gym 3 times per week and follow the same workout routine with a day of recovery in-between each session. I also do some cardio on the side such as jogging and cycling, although this is less planned out and I try to avoid doing cardio in excess.

You're absolutely spot on about the diet side of things of course. I make sure I get the right amount of protein each day for my body weight with a healthy variety of fruit, vegetables and whole grains. Admittedly my diet isn't always consistent and I do cheat every once in a while. But this helps me to keep going overall.

I'd like to incorporate more into my workouts, but it doesn't seem to take very much for me to burnout. I can just about manage what I'm doing at the moment.

[Jones28]

Terrific, hope that's going well for you. :aok:

I have a plan, albeit a very simple one. Because I'm only working upper body at the moment, I only go to the gym 3 times per week and follow the same workout routine with a day of recovery in-between each session. I also do some cardio on the side such as jogging and cycling, although this is less planned out and I try to avoid doing cardio in excess.

You're absolutely spot on about the diet side of things of course. I make sure I get the right amount of protein each day for my body weight with a healthy variety of fruit, vegetables and whole grains. Admittedly my diet isn't always consistent and I do cheat every once in a while. But this helps me to keep going overall.

I'd like to incorporate more into my workouts, but it doesn't seem to take very much for me to burnout. I can just about manage what I'm doing at the moment.

Any particular reason you’re not doing any legs mate?

[HarpOnHibee]

Any particular reason you’re not doing any legs mate?

I wouldn't want to do legs on the same day as upper body and because I do upper body 3 times per week, i'd be looking at going to the gym 5 days a week to get legs in. I just don't think I have it in me at the moment. I have a decent bit of lean muscle on my legs already from the cardio I do, but I'll certainly look into getting leg workouts in there as my upper body develops more.

Besides, does anybody really ever relish leg day in the gym? :greengrin

[Willis1875]

Sorry, wasn't sure where else to post this. But interested in finding out what other Hibees are into the gym and lifting weights?

I've been going to the gym for several months now and really starting to enjoy it. Was certainly a slog for the first few months or so, but really getting into the routine of it now. It's not my first attempt at the gym, I gave it a go several years ago before the lockdown situation. I didn't do too well first time round as I was making the mistake of trying to lift too heavy instead of focusing on proper form, which of course led to injury and me not wanting to go back again. But glad I've learnt that lesson for this time round. (Ego lifting is a big NO!)

I'm focusing mainly on upper body at the moment (biceps, triceps, delts, upper back and chest). Although I really need to start work on the abs and core at some point as they're clearly my weakest areas and as they say, you're only as strong as your weakest link.

Would be great to hear from other lifters. Perhaps some of the more long term/experienced lifters can share some advice and tips for us noobs and beginners. Could be a really useful/helpful thread for those happy to contribute.

Cheers!

https://i.ibb.co/wLN3J5D/greenliftingcropped.gif

I’ve recently started going to the Gym after too many years of inactivity.

I have been following this 4 week plan on Muscle and Fitness which I’m enjoying so far.
I usually throw in 10/15 cardio at the start to warm up then get cracking with the plan
https://www.muscleandfitness.com/workout-plan/workouts/workout-routines/complete-mf-beginners-training-guide-plan/

[Jones28]

I wouldn't want to do legs on the same day as upper body and because I do upper body 3 times per week, i'd be looking at going to the gym 5 days a week to get legs in. I just don't think I have it in me at the moment. I have a decent bit of lean muscle on my legs already from the cardio I do, but I'll certainly look into getting leg workouts in there as my upper body develops more.

Besides, does anybody really ever relish leg day in the gym? :greengrin

Totally agree with you. Leg day isn’t something I’ve ever done, I tend to do a leg focussed day along with other upper body stuff then do a couple of leg excercises with each session.

I really feel my workouts 2 days after doing them so try and time them to have a rest day for that when I’ve done leg stuff. I run 3/4 times a week and have found that to be fine once your body adjusts to it.

It can be daunting though.

[Onceinawhile]

I wouldn't want to do legs on the same day as upper body and because I do upper body 3 times per week, i'd be looking at going to the gym 5 days a week to get legs in. I just don't think I have it in me at the moment. I have a decent bit of lean muscle on my legs already from the cardio I do, but I'll certainly look into getting leg workouts in there as my upper body develops more.

Besides, does anybody really ever relish leg day in the gym? :greengrin

Leg days my favourite. Squats, deadlifts, leg press and calf raises. What's not to love?

[Jones28]

Leg days my favourite. Squats, deadlifts, leg press and calf raises. What's not to love?

Ooh ya, squat and deadlift on the same day? :no way:

I did deadlifts last night and I'm really feeling it today. 5 working sets of 5 reps with pull ups in between. Haven't deadlifted for a while but the Mrs wanted to give them a go and I'd forgotten how much they take it out of you.

[Dmas]

Got myself some dumbells for the house recently got 20s and 15s as I was a little over ambitious going straight in at 20kg, got a plan worked out with ChatGPT for in the house just need to find that oomph to get going also need a smaller weight for Lat raises etc as 15kg to heavy to hold out extended.

Not really done much lifting to be honest was cardio daft before laziness struck at now I’m needing to shift some beef

[HarpOnHibee]

Got myself some dumbells for the house recently got 20s and 15s as I was a little over ambitious going straight in at 20kg, got a plan worked out with ChatGPT for in the house just need to find that oomph to get going also need a smaller weight for Lat raises etc as 15kg to heavy to hold out extended.

Not really done much lifting to be honest was cardio daft before laziness struck at now I’m needing to shift some beef

I wouldn't recommend starting with 15kg dumbbells either, not if you're new to lifting or haven't done so in a really long time. Always best to start light (even something like 5kgs will do). Watching yourself in the mirror while you use them to ensure your form is correct. Then gradually increasing the weight over several months, maintaining true to that form. Not only will it be far more effective for muscle growth in the long run, it will help you to avoid any potential injuries that could set you back weeks or even months. Not to mention physical and mental burnout which is a trap that most people fall into when they first start out. Ease your way into it, your body and your mind will thank you for it.

[MagicSwirlingShip]

Been hoping someone would start a gym thread in here for a while, after seeing the Running thread

I Try to get to the gym every second day. I schedule Legs over 2 days, always quads on a Sunday/Monday. The resulting endorphins is a great way to kick off the week. I use FitNotes app to track my lifts, pretty basic but does the job for tracking weekly progress & overall volume.

I stay away from deadlifts, though enjoy an RDL & SLDL.

The gym I go to is loaded with some of the best machines, so I rotate between Barbell and the equivalent machines every 12 weeks or so, with a de-load week in between cycles.

The biggest challenges for me has been getting adequate protein & enough sleep to recover properly. I’d highly recommend de-load weeks to stave away accumulated central nervous system fatigue

I’ve pretty much self learned through YouTube, and would recommend Dr Mike, Joe Delaney, Jeff Nippard and Evan Holmes channels

[Onceinawhile]

The biggest challenges for me has been getting adequate protein & enough sleep to recover properly. I’d highly recommend de-load weeks to stave away accumulated central nervous system fatigue

I’ve pretty much self learned through YouTube, and would recommend Dr Mike, Joe Delaney, Jeff Nippard and Evan Holmes channels

The protein thing is a nightmare. I’m currently aiming for about 1.2-1.5g per kg of body weight, but it’s difficult to do that and keep calories down.

Agree about dr Mike and Jeff nippard, don’t know the others though.

What is “accumulated central nervous system fatigue”?

[HarpOnHibee]

The protein thing is a nightmare. I’m currently aiming for about 1.2-1.5g per kg of body weight, but it’s difficult to do that and keep calories down.

Agree about dr Mike and Jeff nippard, don’t know the others though.

What is “accumulated central nervous system fatigue”?

On the protein thing, people tend to over estimate how much they actually need. Generally 1.6 to 1.8 grams per kilo of body weight is enough for most lifters. I get at least 50 grams of my total daily intake from a low fat protein shake (around 300 calories). Which at my current weight, leaves about 75 grams more that I need to get through food. Sticking to lean sources of protein such as Chicken, Turkey, Fish and lean cuts of red meat makes it relatively easy to obtain enough protein within a 1000 calorie window, leaving enough calories in reserve for wholegrains, fiber and healthy fats.

If you're on a bulk, then it makes it even easier to get enough protein in there. If you're on a cut, it's a bit more of a challenge. But even if you do reach your protein requirements while on a cut, it's still common for some strength to be lost in the gym. Getting leaner can come at the cost of some strength gains.

When you're constantly pushing yourself hard at the gym, you're not just breaking down muscle fibers but are training the mind muscle connection. This can lead to mental fatigue if the mind (just like the body) isn't given enough adequate down time to recuperate. De-load periods allow lifters to maintain their current gains, while giving both their body and mind the chance to fully recover.

[MagicSwirlingShip]

💯 above!

All the same exercises, half the reps, half the weight, half the sets during a de-load week as per Dr Mikes instructions 😁

Gives your body a chance to fully recover whilst keeping active and blood flowing.

You’ll come back the next week recharged and ready to go. Give it a shot every 12 weeks or so

[Dmas]

I wouldn't recommend starting with 15kg dumbbells either, not if you're new to lifting or haven't done so in a really long time. Always best to start light (even something like 5kgs will do). Watching yourself in the mirror while you use them to ensure your form is correct. Then gradually increasing the weight over several months, maintaining true to that form. Not only will it be far more effective for muscle growth in the long run, it will help you to avoid any potential injuries that could set you back weeks or even months. Not to mention physical and mental burnout which is a trap that most people fall into when they first start out. Ease your way into it, your body and your mind will thank you for it.

Thanks for this I’m planning a set of 10s either payday or Christmas so will take this on board

[Jones28]

I find the psychology around lifting weights really interesting, particularly if you have a target in mind.

My aim for a really long time was to Bench 100kg, and I can do singles at that weight but they're a really grind to get through.

95kg feels about 20 kilos lighter and I can fly through sets of 3-5 at that weight. I'm certain that because I built up the idea of hitting 100kg so much in my head, even though I have the strength to do it, and should be able to manage it without many issues it still seems like theres some sort of block there.

[HarpOnHibee]

I find the psychology around lifting weights really interesting, particularly if you have a target in mind.

My aim for a really long time was to Bench 100kg, and I can do singles at that weight but they're a really grind to get through.

95kg feels about 20 kilos lighter and I can fly through sets of 3-5 at that weight. I'm certain that because I built up the idea of hitting 100kg so much in my head, even though I have the strength to do it, and should be able to manage it without many issues it still seems like theres some sort of block there.

Aim for 150kgs then and 100kgs will feel a ton lighter. :greengrin

In terms of how heavy weights feel. Do any of you have what feels like "high gravity" days, where the weights just feel that bit heavier than they normally do? Sometimes I think I'm going crazy and regressing rather than progressing, but then in my next session, they'll feel lighter again.

[Jones28]

Aim for 150kgs then and 100kgs will feel a ton lighter. :greengrin

In terms of how heavy weights feel. Do any of you have what feels like "high gravity" days, where the weights just feel that bit heavier than they normally do? Sometimes I think I'm going crazy and regressing rather than progressing, but then in my next session, they'll feel lighter again.

:greengrin that would be nice.

It's a plateau that I've broken but barely seem to be able to get past it. Think I need to do a lot more heavy sessions rather than going for higher volume - what would say?

Yepp, feels like someone turned up the gravity some days.

[HarpOnHibee]

:greengrin that would be nice.

It's a plateau that I've broken but barely seem to be able to get past it. Think I need to do a lot more heavy sessions rather than going for higher volume - what would say?

Yepp, feels like someone turned up the gravity some days.

As somebody who is still very much a beginner, I would be far from the best person to offer advice to somebody like yourself who is far further along than I am.

I have however heard some experienced lifters say that when they hit a plateau with a particular work out set, they find that either altering the variation of the set for a while or switching to alternative exercises that hit the same muscle groups can help them to break past a plateau. It could be that leaving the bench press for a few months and doing an alternative workout plan may see you break beyond the plateau when you return back to it after a few months. A de-load period may be beneficial as well if you haven't de-loaded for at least several months.

[Dmas]

As somebody who is still very much a beginner, I would be far from the best person to offer advice to somebody like yourself who is far further along than I am.

I have however heard some experienced lifters say that when they hit a plateau with a particular work out set, they find that either altering the variation of the set for a while or switching to alternative exercises that hit the same muscle groups can help them to break past a plateau. It could be that leaving the bench press for a few months and doing an alternative workout plan may see you break beyond the plateau when you return back to it after a few months. A de-load period may be beneficial as well if you haven't de-loaded for at least several months.

De load is something I’ve never heard before since reading here, further up a post says around about 12 week stage how long would that be for? Just a week or longer than that?

[HarpOnHibee]

De load is something I’ve never heard before since reading here, further up a post says around about 12 week stage how long would that be for? Just a week or longer than that?

There's no definitive answer as every individual is different. Some lifters never de-load and continue to progress without hitting any long term plateaus. Other lifters may find that they need to de-load for 1 or 2 weeks every 3 to 6 months. Generally a de-load period can be beneficial if a lifter has stopped progressing or is experiencing intense physical or mental burnout. Some lifters benefit from skipping the gym entirely for a week or two if the burnout is severe enough, which may result in a minor loss of strength temporarily, but allow them to break through plateaus in the long run.

Progress often isn't linear and can be more like a squiggly line and sometimes it's necessary to take a step or two or even three backwards in order to move two, three or four steps forward.

[MagicSwirlingShip]

The main man Dr Mike on de-load weeks: https://youtu.be/Yxx-j3J7N6c?si=-oOMM_D7f5f3DlzS

[Allant1981]

I usually reload every 6 weeks(ish) if I've been properly going for it, usually in the build up to summer but I think a reload should be a listen to the body type thing,you will know of you need it. A mate who is a bodybuilder often speaks about over training syndrome where the body just doesnt want to perform,so it gives a chance to rest but still getting a workout in.

[HarpOnHibee]

I usually reload every 6 weeks(ish) if I've been properly going for it, usually in the build up to summer but I think a reload should be a listen to the body type thing,you will know of you need it. A mate who is a bodybuilder often speaks about over training syndrome where the body just doesnt want to perform,so it gives a chance to rest but still getting a workout in.

Great point. Listening to the body is crucial as well as the mind. When it reaches the point where you just don't feel like going anymore, then something has to change in order to sustain long term progression. People burnout by effectively forcing themselves to follow the same strict routine indefinitely rather than changing things up when the indicators to do so are there.

[Onceinawhile]

Had a bit of a nightmare this morning- wonder if anyone has had the same / knows what happened...

Got about 2/3rds of the way through my session and just totally lost the ability to hold a weight. By that I mean, it was physically sore in my hands. Don't know if it's a soft hand issue, where I need to wear gloves, or something else entirely. I had a slight niggle in the middle of my back, so might have been that.

[HarpOnHibee]

Had a bit of a nightmare this morning- wonder if anyone has had the same / knows what happened...

Got about 2/3rds of the way through my session and just totally lost the ability to hold a weight. By that I mean, it was physically sore in my hands. Don't know if it's a soft hand issue, where I need to wear gloves, or something else entirely. I had a slight niggle in the middle of my back, so might have been that.

Yep, absolutely. I had a bit of a nightmare last week when doing dumbbell presses. Couldn't get a good pump in the pecs at all, as my arms just seemed to give way before I could overload the chest. But after several days of rest, I did much better at my next attempt. It happens sometimes and nothing to be concerned about. As you say, it could have just been a niggly injury that perhaps required a bit more time than usual to fully recover. Take things easy over the weekend and if you're feeling good next week take another go at it and I'm sure you'll do better.

[Jones28]

Had a bit of a nightmare this morning- wonder if anyone has had the same / knows what happened...

Got about 2/3rds of the way through my session and just totally lost the ability to hold a weight. By that I mean, it was physically sore in my hands. Don't know if it's a soft hand issue, where I need to wear gloves, or something else entirely. I had a slight niggle in the middle of my back, so might have been that.

Might be a bit of the systemic fatigue that other guys have mentioned if you've been hitting it hard.

[Jones28]

As somebody who is still very much a beginner, I would be far from the best person to offer advice to somebody like yourself who is far further along than I am.

I have however heard some experienced lifters say that when they hit a plateau with a particular work out set, they find that either altering the variation of the set for a while or switching to alternative exercises that hit the same muscle groups can help them to break past a plateau. It could be that leaving the bench press for a few months and doing an alternative workout plan may see you break beyond the plateau when you return back to it after a few months. A de-load period may be beneficial as well if you haven't de-loaded for at least several months.

Cheers, thats a good point in fairness.

I'm limited with kit because I've got a home gym so changing exercises isn't practical in certain cases.

I had a really good bench session on Wednesday which I'm still feeling today. I think I've maybe not been pushing as hard as I should have been to see better progression.

I did 6 sets at 6-8 really hard reps for bench so I'm going to try that for the next few weeks and see if I can see some progress doing that.

[HarpOnHibee]

Cheers, thats a good point in fairness.

I'm limited with kit because I've got a home gym so changing exercises isn't practical in certain cases.

I had a really good bench session on Wednesday which I'm still feeling today. I think I've maybe not been pushing as hard as I should have been to see better progression.

I did 6 sets at 6-8 really hard reps for bench so I'm going to try that for the next few weeks and see if I can see some progress doing that.

Ah, fair point. I should have taken the kit limitation into consideration. :aok:

Keep us up to date on your progress.

[MagicSwirlingShip]

Had a bit of a nightmare this morning- wonder if anyone has had the same / knows what happened...

Got about 2/3rds of the way through my session and just totally lost the ability to hold a weight. By that I mean, it was physically sore in my hands. Don't know if it's a soft hand issue, where I need to wear gloves, or something else entirely. I had a slight niggle in the middle of my back, so might have been that.

The muscles that help with grip have a failure point, just like your other muscles.. in an ideal world your target muscle (triceps, biceps, lats) would reach failure before your grip. I use lifting straps (Versa grips) for all pull movements for this reason. I target grip strength seperately with exercises like dead hangs and farmers walks which have their own additional benefits too

[Onceinawhile]

The muscles that help with grip have a failure point, just like your other muscles.. in an ideal world your target muscle (triceps, biceps, lats) would reach failure before your grip. I use lifting straps (Versa grips) for all pull movements for this reason. I target grip strength seperately with exercises like dead hangs and farmers walks which have their own additional benefits too

I was thinking about straps, but I honestly don't know if I need them. Will probably incorporate some farmers walks into my routine and try and improve my grip.

I took a week off there and the extra energy I had was ridiculous, felt much better not waking up and being some sort of sore every day! Went back yesterday for a light legs day, then this morning for everything else. Going to rest tomorrow then start a proper split again on Monday.

Does anyone have a protein powder they'd recommend? I currently use a cookie flavoured one (20g of protein ,c100 kcal) which tastes nice if I make a flapjack/cookies, but which is minging in a shake.

[MagicSwirlingShip]

I was thinking about straps, but I honestly don't know if I need them. Will probably incorporate some farmers walks into my routine and try and improve my grip.

I took a week off there and the extra energy I had was ridiculous, felt much better not waking up and being some sort of sore every day! Went back yesterday for a light legs day, then this morning for everything else. Going to rest tomorrow then start a proper split again on Monday.

Does anyone have a protein powder they'd recommend? I currently use a cookie flavoured one (20g of protein ,c100 kcal) which tastes nice if I make a flapjack/cookies, but which is minging in a shake.

That’s a good plan. Try dead hangs too! Just aim to add 5-10 seconds on every week.

I use Bulk for protein out of habit more than anything. They usually have deals on and there’s loads of flavours to choose from.

[Jones28]

We're doing a little challenge of a weight session every day in the run up to Christmas, it chest/back/legs and shoulders on repeat until Christmas eve, trying to get back in the way of things after a very interrupted few weeks.

Been out of our routine over the last few weeks due to various ailments but hoping this will be beneficial in the short term.

[Pedantic_Hibee]

We're doing a little challenge of a weight session every day in the run up to Christmas, it chest/back/legs and shoulders on repeat until Christmas eve, trying to get back in the way of things after a very interrupted few weeks.

Been out of our routine over the last few weeks due to various ailments but hoping this will be beneficial in the short term.

I’ve been doing arms one day and chest and back the next day on repeat about 4/5 days a week at the gym for the past six weeks (augmented with 100 push ups a day using perfect push up pads at home) and I’m probably in the best shape of my life. Legs may come one day, but I’ve skipped leg day every day for the last 42 years so I’m happy to wait a bit longer.

[Jones28]

I’ve been doing arms one day and chest and back the next day on repeat about 4/5 days a week at the gym for the past six weeks (augmented with 100 push ups a day using perfect push up pads at home) and I’m probably in the best shape of my life. Legs may come one day, but I’ve skipped leg day every day for the last 42 years so I’m happy to wait a bit longer.

The training is fine, if you're using a big gym with machines starting on leg raises and presses is a good way to ease in to it.

Great effort mate, keep it up!

[HarpOnHibee]

Started my 4 day a week gym routine a few weeks back. Lower body on the Monday followed by upper on the Tuesday. Wednesday off, then repeat on the Thursday and Friday. Last couple of weeks have been a bit of a struggle since tearing cartilage under my rib from the leg press machine. Hopefully a break over the festive season will take care of it, with a few wee drams to erm "numb the pain".

[Onceinawhile]

Busiest time of the year work wise for the wife and I, so had to cut right down. Can only manage three times a week for about 1.5 hrs at a time.

Have decided to cover the main parts (chest, back, arms, biceps, triceps, shoulders and abs) with one exercise each time and switch the exercise each time.

Not going to grow much, or gain much strength, but hopefully keep ticking over til I can increase my time spent again.

Does anyone have any thoughts on fuel post work out? I've read you should have protein within half an hour, within two hours, or it doesn't matter as long as you have enough during the day. Seems difficult to cut through the bs!

[Jones28]

Busiest time of the year work wise for the wife and I, so had to cut right down. Can only manage three times a week for about 1.5 hrs at a time.

Have decided to cover the main parts (chest, back, arms, biceps, triceps, shoulders and abs) with one exercise each time and switch the exercise each time.

Not going to grow much, or gain much strength, but hopefully keep ticking over til I can increase my time spent again.

Does anyone have any thoughts on fuel post work out? I've read you should have protein within half an hour, within two hours, or it doesn't matter as long as you have enough during the day. Seems difficult to cut through the bs!

The anabolic window (eg within 30 mins of finishing a work out) has been quite widely discussed and mostly debunked.

Getting enough dietry protein (1.5gms per kg of bodyweight per day is what I work off) spread throughout the day is perfectly fine.

Are you spending 1.5 hours in the gym every session? Does that include some cardio as well?

[Onceinawhile]

The anabolic window (eg within 30 mins of finishing a work out) has been quite widely discussed and mostly debunked.

Getting enough dietry protein (1.5gms per kg of bodyweight per day is what I work off) spread throughout the day is perfectly fine.

Are you spending 1.5 hours in the gym every session? Does that include some cardio as well?

That's what I'd seen most recently so thanks.

Last night was about 75 minutes - no cardio

I did a warm up set and 3 working sets for everything listed:

Deadlifts
Bench
Hammer curls
Calve raises
V bar row
Lateral raises
Overhead tricep extension
Abs machine

[Jones28]

That's what I'd seen most recently so thanks.

Last night was about 75 minutes - no cardio

I did a warm up set and 3 working sets for everything listed:

Deadlifts
Bench
Hammer curls
Calve raises
V bar row
Lateral raises
Overhead tricep extension
Abs machine

Nice, good split.

If you want to save a bit of time you could superset some of these - I almost always do supersets to save a bit of time, the garage is ****ing cold at the moment so it keeps me warmer!

Deadlifts I'd do on their own, then do the following:

Bench with hammer curls
Calve raises with Lat Raises
V bar row with overhead extensions
Ab machine, you could always do another set of tricep work in there, high volume drop sets are great at the end of a session for a pump.

Purely speculative as it might not be practical for the layout of your gym.

[MagicSwirlingShip]

I’d concentrate on getting carbs into muscles after a workout more than protein. Having that spread throughout the day is fine.

Glycogen stores within your muscles are drained after heavy lifting and carbs replenish these, especially if you are doing Deadlifts and 1.5hr sessions then carbs & electrolytes during & post workout will help with your general energy levels and readiness for your next workout.

[Onceinawhile]

Nice, good split.

If you want to save a bit of time you could superset some of these - I almost always do supersets to save a bit of time, the garage is ****ing cold at the moment so it keeps me warmer!

Deadlifts I'd do on their own, then do the following:

Bench with hammer curls
Calve raises with Lat Raises
V bar row with overhead extensions
Ab machine, you could always do another set of tricep work in there, high volume drop sets are great at the end of a session for a pump.

Purely speculative as it might not be practical for the layout of your gym.

All of them should be possible, I do about half the exercises with dumbells so can do them pretty much wherever. Thanks for taking the time with that.

[Jones28]

All of them should be possible, I do about half the exercises with dumbells so can do them pretty much wherever. Thanks for taking the time with that.

No bother at all, I find spending an hour plus in the gym a bit stiffling so would do anything I can do cut the time and still get an efficient session in.

[Jones28]

Came a cropper tonight in our weight lifting challenge until Christmas, tonight was a leg night but we are both still crippled from Tuesday! Weighted split squats are brutal.

[Allant1981]

The anabolic window (eg within 30 mins of finishing a work out) has been quite widely discussed and mostly debunked.

Getting enough dietry protein (1.5gms per kg of bodyweight per day is what I work off) spread throughout the day is perfectly fine.

Are you spending 1.5 hours in the gym every session? Does that include some cardio as well?

Yip agree, most folk thought for a long time you had to get it in as soon as you finished a work out, now it's pretty much agreed that as long as you still get it in at some point then it's fine, I usually dont eat until about an hour after my session as I go straight to work. Im usually about an hour, I usually get a 5 min warm up then about 45 mins of a workout, I'm lucky that I go really early so gym is quiet, it's then a 5 min cool down, any more for me and I'm not as productive but I see folk there much longer than that, just not for me

[HarpOnHibee]

Came a cropper tonight in our weight lifting challenge until Christmas, tonight was a leg night but we are both still crippled from Tuesday! Weighted split squats are brutal.

They certainly are. Squats are one of those exercises where form is absolutely crucial. I had a few dodgy moments when I first started doing squats and wasn't entirely sure how to coordinate my body movements correctly. Thankfully nothing serious and my form is starting to improve (although could still be better for sure).

How is your recovery coming along?

[Onceinawhile]

They certainly are. Squats are one of those exercises where form is absolutely crucial. I had a few dodgy moments when I first started doing squats and wasn't entirely sure how to coordinate my body movements correctly. Thankfully nothing serious and my form is starting to improve (although could still be better for sure).

How is your recovery coming along?

I've found it can't get deep enough with a barbell Squat, but if I use a smith machine I can get deep enough. Really need to add some flexibility so I can get deeper.

[HarpOnHibee]

I've found it can't get deep enough with a barbell Squat, but if I use a smith machine I can get deep enough. Really need to add some flexibility so I can get deeper.

I have no experience with the smith machine myself. I know it has it's uses, but the biggest criticism I hear about it is the lack of flexibility it allows. Honestly, I would go free form and just reduce the weight for a while. See how deep you can go with a lighter load, then gradually work your way back up.

[Hibs4185]

I've found it can't get deep enough with a barbell Squat, but if I use a smith machine I can get deep enough. Really need to add some flexibility so I can get deeper.

Never actually came across this thread before and as a regular gym goer I have no idea why!

I can squat a fair weight. In the last two years I’ve stayed away from barbells.

If you go on insta, look for the hyper trophy coach. Squatting is all about the depth and the weight and it’s doesn’t matter whether it’s a barbell, smith machine or any other machine.

Barbell squat has so many downsides that any other way to get the weight and depth is preferential.

For example you’ll ever see any big bodybuilders doing flat bench because you get past 100kg, 90% of chest injuries come from flat barbell bench.

[Jones28]

I've found it can't get deep enough with a barbell Squat, but if I use a smith machine I can get deep enough. Really need to add some flexibility so I can get deeper.

My ankle mobility is terrible so I elevate my ankles - only by 1.5-2 cm or so, but it makes a massive difference for me.

[Jones28]

They certainly are. Squats are one of those exercises where form is absolutely crucial. I had a few dodgy moments when I first started doing squats and wasn't entirely sure how to coordinate my body movements correctly. Thankfully nothing serious and my form is starting to improve (although could still be better for sure).

How is your recovery coming along?

We got there eventually, decided to cut the volume back slightly next time around. Got the last leg session of our pre Christmas block tonight.

Out of 14 nights planned we will have managed to do 12 which was not bad.

[HarpOnHibee]

Never actually came across this thread before and as a regular gym goer I have no idea why!

I can squat a fair weight. In the last two years I’ve stayed away from barbells.

If you go on insta, look for the hyper trophy coach. Squatting is all about the depth and the weight and it’s doesn’t matter whether it’s a barbell, smith machine or any other machine.

Barbell squat has so many downsides that any other way to get the weight and depth is preferential.

For example you’ll ever see any big bodybuilders doing flat bench because you get past 100kg, 90% of chest injuries come from flat barbell bench.

I think you make a good point regarding squats being about depth and weight (for the most part). The issue I have with the Smith Machine is that it takes away the aspect of balance. Because the bar is fixed to a vertical axis, the muscles that would be utilized to support your balance are not being properly utilized. This is why a person can generally squat more weight on a Smith Machine as opposed to free form, not as many muscles are being activated. It's the same with the bench press. To maximize hypertrophy the barbell should be arched, but the Smith Machine doesn't allow the bar to be arched, which isn't ideal.

[Onceinawhile]

I have no experience with the smith machine myself. I know it has it's uses, but the biggest criticism I hear about it is the lack of flexibility it allows. Honestly, I would go free form and just reduce the weight for a while. See how deep you can go with a lighter load, then gradually work your way back up.

I've tried that, even with just the barbell I can't get as deep as I can on the smith machine. It's bizarre.

It's been suggested below that I elevate my heels, think I'll try that next leg day.

Did legs on Saturday morning there. I currently have the worst DOMS of my life in my calves. It's a nightmare. Every step is sore!

[HarpOnHibee]

I've tried that, even with just the barbell I can't get as deep as I can on the smith machine. It's bizarre.

It's been suggested below that I elevate my heels, think I'll try that next leg day.

Did legs on Saturday morning there. I currently have the worst DOMS of my life in my calves. It's a nightmare. Every step is sore!

Heel elevation can help, particularly if you have tight hamstrings and struggle to keep your heels flat on the ground when squatting deeper. I see some squatters put a couple of weights under their heels to help with this, then they gradually reduce the thickness of the weights over time, bringing their heels closer to the ground until they are able to squat deep with flat heels. You'll get there. :aok:

[Jones28]

We started a strength focused training plan last night with lower reps for much higher weights.

Planning on doing this for a few months with regular strength testing to see how we have improved.

Anyone got any tips for concentrating on strength? Haven't really planned out training to this extent before.

[FifeHibs]

We started a strength focused training plan last night with lower reps for much higher weights.

Planning on doing this for a few months with regular strength testing to see how we have improved.

Anyone got any tips for concentrating on strength? Haven't really planned out training to this extent before.

the Wendler log is very good for strength training… simple and effective

[Jones28]

the Wendler log is very good for strength training… simple and effective

I had a good look at it, thanks for the rec.

Is progress quite slow? Just from looking at the numbers and the progression it looks like it will take an age to get anywhere with it? Maybe I'm too impatient for this sport:rolleyes:

[FifeHibs]

I had a good look at it, thanks for the rec.

Is progress quite slow? Just from looking at the numbers and the progression it looks like it will take an age to get anywhere with it? Maybe I'm too impatient for this sport:rolleyes:

for strength you will see a good increase over the programme.

[Onceinawhile]

How does everyone cope with recovery? I did a legs session on Friday night and I'm still sore.

Had planned to go and do legs again this morning, but feels like it wouldn't be worth it as I wouldn't be able to do much.

[FifeHibs]

How does everyone cope with recovery? I did a legs session on Friday night and I'm still sore.

Had planned to go and do legs again this morning, but feels like it wouldn't be worth it as I wouldn't be able to do much.

Lots and lots of stretching protein and water…

[MagicSwirlingShip]

How does everyone cope with recovery? I did a legs session on Friday night and I'm still sore.

Had planned to go and do legs again this morning, but feels like it wouldn't be worth it as I wouldn't be able to do much.

I split my leg-work across two days, Quads biased one day and Hams biased the other. Has helped me with recovery.

Ive found a gentle swim helps, along with a Sauna. However the best thing really is dialling in your sleep and making sure you a hitting your protein and carb macros.

[Onceinawhile]

I split my leg-work across two days, Quads biased one day and Hams biased the other. Has helped me with recovery.

Ive found a gentle swim helps, along with a Sauna. However the best thing really is dialling in your sleep and making sure you a hitting your protein and carb macros.

I'm getting there with my sleep - managing about 8 hours a night, though not sure how much of it is "deep".

Definitely hitting my protein - managing 170-200g per day. Will need to look at my carbs though, for all the protein advice there is on g/km or g/lbs, there's not really the same for carbs!

[ian cruise]

How does everyone cope with recovery? I did a legs session on Friday night and I'm still sore.

Had planned to go and do legs again this morning, but feels like it wouldn't be worth it as I wouldn't be able to do much.

Creatine powder every day, it's one of the most researched performance supplements and it's proven to work - https://www.instagram.com/p/DCPIXXisSS6/?igsh=MWJhM3hnZ2JkdmI1Yg==

High Protein diet to aid muscle recovery.

Active Recovery (walking, easy cycling, etc) on rest days.

Sorry adding to this. If you did heavy leg session the previous day, don't do legs the next day. It's the rest in between where you get the muscle growth. You don't want to over train as it will be detrimental

[MagicSwirlingShip]

I'm getting there with my sleep - managing about 8 hours a night, though not sure how much of it is "deep".

Definitely hitting my protein - managing 170-200g per day. Will need to look at my carbs though, for all the protein advice there is on g/km or g/lbs, there's not really the same for carbs!

Look into Magnesium supplementation for deep sleep. I don’t think I was sleeping well for at least a decade before using it.

[Dmas]

Look into Magnesium supplementation for deep sleep. I don’t think I was sleeping well for at least a decade before using it.

I’ve been using a 3 in 1 magnesium supplement, what point in the day do you take this at? I was having it after my first meal along with vit d and a multi vit but I’ve seen a lot of people use it not long before bed

[MagicSwirlingShip]

I’ve been using a 3 in 1 magnesium supplement, what point in the day do you take this at? I was having it after my first meal along with vit d and a multi vit but I’ve seen a lot of people use it not long before bed

I take mine 1hr before bed. Has really improved my sleep.

https://amzn.eu/d/fpPm1ZR

[Onceinawhile]

currently doing 2 x leg sessions per week, what do people think of the below - anything missing, or anything being over done (not necessarily in these orders):

Day 1:
Squats
Seated Calf Raises
Standing Calf Raises
Lying Hamstring Curl
Leg extension machine
Deadlifts

Day 2:
Leg Press
Seated Calf Raises
Standing Calf Raises
Lying Hamstring Curl
Leg extension machine

[Hibs4185]

currently doing 2 x leg sessions per week, what do people think of the below - anything missing, or anything being over done (not necessarily in these orders):

Day 1:
Squats
Seated Calf Raises
Standing Calf Raises
Lying Hamstring Curl
Leg extension machine
Deadlifts

Day 2:
Leg Press
Seated Calf Raises
Standing Calf Raises
Lying Hamstring Curl
Leg extension machine

Doing upper as well?

Depends on the overall goal I would say!

[Onceinawhile]

Doing upper as well?

Depends on the overall goal I would say!

Yes, I do 2 x upper as well.

Monday - Lower
Tuesday - Football
Wednesday - Uper
Thursday - Rest
Friday - Lower
Saturday - Upper
Sunday - Football

Tbh the goal is probably aesthetic. The machine in the gym has me at 21-23% body fat and I'm trying to lose that slowly, whilst retaining as much muscle as possible and hopefully getting the BF down to 14-16%

[Hibs4185]

Yes, I do 2 x upper as well.

Monday - Lower
Tuesday - Football
Wednesday - Uper
Thursday - Rest
Friday - Lower
Saturday - Upper
Sunday - Football

Tbh the goal is probably aesthetic. The machine in the gym has me at 21-23% body fat and I'm trying to lose that slowly, whilst retaining as much muscle as possible and hopefully getting the BF down to 14-16%


With playing football twice a week, I’d possibly do more upper and only one lower session a week, especially if the goal is aesthetic reasons.

If I’m training 4 times a week I’ll do Push (chest dominant), Pull, Legs and then an upper 2 session (shoulder dominant).

That could work well and hits your more aesthetically pleasing muscles a bit more? If you’re doing a lot of cardio that should get the body fat down?

[MagicSwirlingShip]

currently doing 2 x leg sessions per week, what do people think of the below - anything missing, or anything being over done (not necessarily in these orders):

Day 1:
Squats
Seated Calf Raises
Standing Calf Raises
Lying Hamstring Curl
Leg extension machine
Deadlifts

Day 2:
Leg Press
Seated Calf Raises
Standing Calf Raises
Lying Hamstring Curl
Leg extension machine

Personal opinion, I’d take out the deadlift altogether. Especially at the end of a hard leg session, the stimulus you’ll be getting from a deadlift will be minimal and it’ll be more risk to injury than anything.

You’re missing an RDL / SLDL which are much better exercises IMO. Maybe consider subbing out the Leg Press on day two as you’re already covering a squat pattern on day one, and sub in the RDL / SLDL for your Hinge movement.

Experiment with a set or two of high rep hamstring curls (I prefer seated leaning forward rather than lying) before your squats. I don’t try and progress these but after watching a few videos online and trying it out myself it’s helped up my squat by having some blood flowing through the legs beforehand.

I’d look into weighted lunges as a closer for both days if you’re feeling sadistic.i prefer reverse lunges in a Smith Machine with the standing foot elevated on a plate.

You must be done in after the above 😆😆

[Onceinawhile]

With playing football twice a week, I’d possibly do more upper and only one lower session a week, especially if the goal is aesthetic reasons.

If I’m training 4 times a week I’ll do Push (chest dominant), Pull, Legs and then an upper 2 session (shoulder dominant).

That could work well and hits your more aesthetically pleasing muscles a bit more? If you’re doing a lot of cardio that should get the body fat down?

So I'm doing 2 x legs because, from what I understand, building muscle is one of the best ways to reduce fat long term, and given that the leg muscles tend to be bigger, I'm trying to work them out in the hope that it helps with that. On my Monday Leg sessions, I thrown in one working set of Back, Chest, Bicep, Tricep and Shoulders in the hope that that'll be enough.

From what I've read between 12-20 working sets per muscle is the aim per week? For my upper body, I'm managing about 13 working sets (and a few warm up ones too)

The fat % does seem to be coming down (my cal deficit is about 500 a day)

[Onceinawhile]

Personal opinion, I’d take out the deadlift altogether. Especially at the end of a hard leg session, the stimulus you’ll be getting from a deadlift will be minimal and it’ll be more risk to injury than anything.

You’re missing an RDL / SLDL which are much better exercises IMO. Maybe consider subbing out the Leg Press on day two as you’re already covering a squat pattern on day one, and sub in the RDL / SLDL for your Hinge movement.

Experiment with a set or two of high rep hamstring curls (I prefer seated leaning forward rather than lying) before your squats. I don’t try and progress these but after watching a few videos online and trying it out myself it’s helped up my squat by having some blood flowing through the legs beforehand.

I’d look into weighted lunges as a closer for both days if you’re feeling sadistic.i prefer reverse lunges in a Smith Machine with the standing foot elevated on a plate.

You must be done in after the above 😆😆

I'll try adding in an RDL instead of the standard deadlift. I always feel a bit daft doing them however so I've not really kept them as part of my routine.

Weighted lunges I did for a bit, but I just couldn't recover from them in time, my legs found them absolutely murderous!

[Jones28]

currently doing 2 x leg sessions per week, what do people think of the below - anything missing, or anything being over done (not necessarily in these orders):

Day 1:
Squats
Seated Calf Raises
Standing Calf Raises
Lying Hamstring Curl
Leg extension machine
Deadlifts

Day 2:
Leg Press
Seated Calf Raises
Standing Calf Raises
Lying Hamstring Curl
Leg extension machine

A day of squatting and finishing with deadlifts gives me the fear. You’d be far better doing deadlifts at the start of your day 2 plan.

Based on what you’re doing in the gym and your football, that’s a lot of work.

How are you feeling generally? I’m a seasoned lifter and do 3-4 hours of zone cardio a week - usually spread over 3 or 4 runs - and the idea of 2 lots of football and 2 leg sessions a week gives me the fear.

I don’t mean to pry too much but if you’re pushing in the gym to the point of being close to failure in these sessions then at least one of the football sessions should be absolutely torture.

[Hibs90]

Never seen this thread before so may as well join in. Hadn't really stepped foot in a gym before but eventually got into it post COVID. Got a PT, taught me all the proper form etc - was great. Spent a couple years doing that and learned so much through them. Did 3 day full body sessions, 4 day upper/lower splits, different programs on rotation etc and was in the best shape I'd ever been in. I felt pretty good. And I wasn't exactly super strict from a nutrition standpoint, still allowed myself treats but I generally stuck to my calorie deficit and healthy eating whilst getting adequate protein in. Creatine was great for recovery.

Circumstances changed including a couple of injuries and whilst I kept the gym up for a a good while after that it's been absolutely shocking since. Switched to an office job, got lazy and the gym vanished from my habits. I was also getting fed up of gyms themselves as I was either having to go stupidly early in the morning at like 4/5am or post work in peak hours and what should have taken me 45-60 mins ended up taking me two hours at times. Unfortunately slim pickings for gyms round here so I have to venture to the Fort and it's just ridiculous how busy Pure Gym is. Other options are too expensive or aren't open in the hours I'd go. Yes that's an excuse I'm well aware :greengrin

I am trying to get back into it this year but it has been a bit stop-start and I'm finding it difficult to create the habits again. I've signed up for the EMF 10km in May so trying to train for that but my endurance is horrendous. I'm doing some golf swing speed training which is basically swing a club of different weights around for 30 mins 3 times a week and also trying to fit in 3 full body sessions a week, all whilst trying to maintain a calorie deficit to lose weight. I don't think I've managed to string together a solid week of everything yet. Something always ends up fading out or I end up having to take 2/3 days to recover from something so I miss the odd thing or I end up eating too much cos I'm knackered.

I am possibly trying to do too much - so may cut back on the 3 gym sessions and just go ad hoc (as in I've done the 10km/golf stuff and I feel up to it physically). Once the golf season begins to kick in I will be dropping that training and can focus more on gym work and running.

[Jones28]

Never seen this thread before so may as well join in. Hadn't really stepped foot in a gym before but eventually got into it post COVID. Got a PT, taught me all the proper form etc - was great. Spent a couple years doing that and learned so much through them. Did 3 day full body sessions, 4 day upper/lower splits, different programs on rotation etc and was in the best shape I'd ever been in. I felt pretty good. And I wasn't exactly super strict from a nutrition standpoint, still allowed myself treats but I generally stuck to my calorie deficit and healthy eating whilst getting adequate protein in. Creatine was great for recovery.

Circumstances changed including a couple of injuries and whilst I kept the gym up for a a good while after that it's been absolutely shocking since. Switched to an office job, got lazy and the gym vanished from my habits. I was also getting fed up of gyms themselves as I was either having to go stupidly early in the morning at like 4/5am or post work in peak hours and what should have taken me 45-60 mins ended up taking me two hours at times. Unfortunately slim pickings for gyms round here so I have to venture to the Fort and it's just ridiculous how busy Pure Gym is. Other options are too expensive or aren't open in the hours I'd go. Yes that's an excuse I'm well aware :greengrin

I am trying to get back into it this year but it has been a bit stop-start and I'm finding it difficult to create the habits again. I've signed up for the EMF 10km in May so trying to train for that but my endurance is horrendous. I'm doing some golf swing speed training which is basically swing a club of different weights around for 30 mins 3 times a week and also trying to fit in 3 full body sessions a week, all whilst trying to maintain a calorie deficit to lose weight. I don't think I've managed to string together a solid week of everything yet. Something always ends up fading out or I end up having to take 2/3 days to recover from something so I miss the odd thing or I end up eating too much cos I'm knackered.

I am possibly trying to do too much - so may cut back on the 3 gym sessions and just go ad hoc (as in I've done the 10km/golf stuff and I feel up to it physically). Once the golf season begins to kick in I will be dropping that training and can focus more on gym work and running.


Going ad hoc will stall any progress. Maybe try going twice a week early in the morning or late at night, it's a small change but if you can go at 9pm and spend an hour in the gym twice a week instead of 6 hours at peak times over 3 sessions its a better use of your time. Then when your time allows and your focus changes you will have a good base to build on.

I used to go early when the gym was empty - I used to use a Pure Gym when I lived in England and would go before 6am starts, I'd be in the gym for 4.30 when it was dead quiet. It was a good way to start the day. Extreme, perhaps, but it was much more productive than going at 5 pm.

[Onceinawhile]

A day of squatting and finishing with deadlifts gives me the fear. You’d be far better doing deadlifts at the start of your day 2 plan.

Based on what you’re doing in the gym and your football, that’s a lot of work.

How are you feeling generally? I’m a seasoned lifter and do 3-4 hours of zone cardio a week - usually spread over 3 or 4 runs - and the idea of 2 lots of football and 2 leg sessions a week gives me the fear.

I don’t mean to pry too much but if you’re pushing in the gym to the point of being close to failure in these sessions then at least one of the football sessions should be absolutely torture.

I maybe didn't make it clear, but that's not the exact order I do things in - I try and get the big compound exercises in pretty early.

How am I feeling generally? I wake up sore and tired every single morning. The 7s on a Tuesday is a real grind, but I don't like most other forms of cardio and that's when the football is available, so I don't have much choice!

From this thread, it certainly seems I'm doing a wee bit too much, so I'll maybe change the second leg session into a more mixed session when I get back from my holidays in the middle of March.

[Jones28]

I maybe didn't make it clear, but that's not the exact order I do things in - I try and get the big compound exercises in pretty early.

How am I feeling generally? I wake up sore and tired every single morning. The 7s on a Tuesday is a real grind, but I don't like most other forms of cardio and that's when the football is available, so I don't have much choice!

From this thread, it certainly seems I'm doing a wee bit too much, so I'll maybe change the second leg session into a more mixed session when I get back from my holidays in the middle of March.

Fair do's on the football, if you enjoy it there's no reason to stop.

What I would say is you're pushing really hard and barely giving yourself any recovery time. 6 days of training a week is very intense and I'd suggest dropping a day of activity down to a long walk to get your step count up.

Keep the football sessions as you enjoy them, drop down a gym day and maybe try spreading a bit of the load over the other sessions - especially the more aesthetic exercises you're doing.

[Jones28]

How are folks getting on?

Been a productive couple of weeks in the gym for me, we've started doing the 5x5 Stronglifts programme for our compound movements and seen a decent amount of progress.

Haven't tested anything yet but I'm bench pressing more weight for higher reps than I ever have before. My 1 rep max this time a year ago was around 100-110kg, now benching 95kg for sets of 5, some are struggle to get all the sets completed but usually managing to complete at least 4 of the 5 at 5 reps.

For reference I weigh about 91-93 kg's so happy to be at that stage after just a couple of weeks of the block.

Incline bench has jumped as well, I do this for lighter weights but higher reps, usually on an alternate day to flat bench.

We bought a tricep dip bar a few weeks ago and it's been an excellent addition to the home gym. Also got a weight belt so can add weight.

We are finding that it takes longer, usually we spend 50 or so minutes in the gym but get the 5x5 done, usually with a superset unless it's deadlift which I just do on its own. So 5x5 with or without a superset, plus maybe 2 further accessory movements usually does it for us.

[Onceinawhile]

How are folks getting on?

Been a productive couple of weeks in the gym for me, we've started doing the 5x5 Stronglifts programme for our compound movements and seen a decent amount of progress.

Haven't tested anything yet but I'm bench pressing more weight for higher reps than I ever have before. My 1 rep max this time a year ago was around 100-110kg, now benching 95kg for sets of 5, some are struggle to get all the sets completed but usually managing to complete at least 4 of the 5 at 5 reps.

For reference I weigh about 91-93 kg's so happy to be at that stage after just a couple of weeks of the block.

Incline bench has jumped as well, I do this for lighter weights but higher reps, usually on an alternate day to flat bench.

We bought a tricep dip bar a few weeks ago and it's been an excellent addition to the home gym. Also got a weight belt so can add weight.

We are finding that it takes longer, usually we spend 50 or so minutes in the gym but get the 5x5 done, usually with a superset unless it's deadlift which I just do on its own. So 5x5 with or without a superset, plus maybe 2 further accessory movements usually does it for us.

95kg bench is impressive, especially given it's above body weight.

I've been on my upper / lower and 2 x football routine for 7 weeks now and I'm having to take a rest / deload week this week as I am absolutely shot. I'm then on holiday next week, so that should be a nice recovery time.

I probably won't be able to keep it up once I get back, so I need to have a think and see what I want to do moving forward. Probably 3x a week, but the easiest time for me to go is a Monday night, Friday night and Saturday morning, which isn't really ideal.

Going to drop the barbell squats and try and just do them on either smith or hack machine, I can get much deeper that way.

Will probably try and focus a bit more on the upper as even though I'm squatting 120 and leg pressing 240, my bench is only around 45-50kg! Would like to try and really move that up.

[Hibs4185]

Stay away from 1 rep max unless you’re going for power lifting stuff.

1 rep max is for ego otherwise. Better 3 sets for 10-12 reps at 80-90kg

[Jones28]

Stay away from 1 rep max unless you’re going for power lifting stuff.

1 rep max is for ego otherwise. Better 3 sets for 10-12 reps at 80-90kg

Not done a test for a while - do you never do testing sessions so you can see where you are?

I find it useful - especially as lots of programmes I’ve come across use % of 1RM as their weights instead of specific weights.

[Jones28]

95kg bench is impressive, especially given it's above body weight.

I've been on my upper / lower and 2 x football routine for 7 weeks now and I'm having to take a rest / deload week this week as I am absolutely shot. I'm then on holiday next week, so that should be a nice recovery time.

I probably won't be able to keep it up once I get back, so I need to have a think and see what I want to do moving forward. Probably 3x a week, but the easiest time for me to go is a Monday night, Friday night and Saturday morning, which isn't really ideal.

Going to drop the barbell squats and try and just do them on either smith or hack machine, I can get much deeper that way.

Will probably try and focus a bit more on the upper as even though I'm squatting 120 and leg pressing 240, my bench is only around 45-50kg! Would like to try and really move that up.

Cheers, its my favourite exercise in the gym, always feel good after a bench session and rarely feel as good after squatting or deadlifts.

TBH if I could get away with it I wouldn't do either but with limited kit for legs and back work they're unavoidable.

You've done really well to stick with what you were doing for so long. It sounds very tough.

Re your bench, what reps and sets are you doing for that weight? If you're going for 10 reps at 3 or 4 sets then you could try upping the weight incrementally for fewer reps but maybe trying 6-8 reps for 4 or 5 sets? It's a good middle ground of keeping the volume up but spreading it over a couple more sets.

Don't be afraid to use the small plates - 1.25/1/.5 kg plates are there for a reason, an incremental increase of a single kg is still an increase.

[Onceinawhile]

Cheers, its my favourite exercise in the gym, always feel good after a bench session and rarely feel as good after squatting or deadlifts.

TBH if I could get away with it I wouldn't do either but with limited kit for legs and back work they're unavoidable.

You've done really well to stick with what you were doing for so long. It sounds very tough.

Re your bench, what reps and sets are you doing for that weight? If you're going for 10 reps at 3 or 4 sets then you could try upping the weight incrementally for fewer reps but maybe trying 6-8 reps for 4 or 5 sets? It's a good middle ground of keeping the volume up but spreading it over a couple more sets.

Don't be afraid to use the small plates - 1.25/1/.5 kg plates are there for a reason, an incremental increase of a single kg is still an increase.

I've mostly been doing 3 sets of 8. Although, I don't really enjoy it too much as an exercise so that probably helps explain it.

Going to move onto doing 5x5x5 up until the end of June doing weights every second day and cardio twice a week.

Not quite going for a recomp, but hoping to lose some fat and gain some muscle and get in a good shape for the summer holidays.

[Jones28]

Does anyone follow Dorian Yates on Youtube? He's got some brilliant tips, keeping things short and intense, training 3-4 times a week for 30-40 minutes.

Real Mike Mentzer style stuff. Some of his stuff on Youtube is well worth watching too.

[HarpOnHibee]

Does anyone follow Dorian Yates on Youtube? He's got some brilliant tips, keeping things short and intense, training 3-4 times a week for 30-40 minutes.

Real Mike Mentzer style stuff. Some of his stuff on Youtube is well worth watching too.

I don't follow him. But sounds like he's recommending super sets? They can be a great time saver, but are usually more suited for advanced lifters. My workouts generally take 60-80 minutes on average, but I require a decent amount of recovery time between sets or I end up with strains that can keep me out for weeks.

[MagicSwirlingShip]

Dorian Yates and Mike Mentzer are all about super low volume. Makes sense for them seeing as they are lifting rediculously heavy weights, often beyond failure with intensity techniques. Might work for competing bodybuilders but that’s not really what I’m after

[HarpOnHibee]

Dorian Yates and Mike Mentzer are all about super low volume. Makes sense for them seeing as they are lifting rediculously heavy weights, often beyond failure with intensity techniques. Might work for competing bodybuilders but that’s not really what I’m after

It certainly works well for "enhanced" lifters who can recover at unnatural speeds. For the more natural lifters among us it's generally better to go at a slower pace, focusing on great form and prioritizing adequate recovery time between work outs. That's not to say that you should be spending hours on end at the gym. But sticking to moderately heavy weights that are challenging, but allow you to perform 5-12 reps with proper form per set and giving yourself a good 2-3 minutes between sets is generally a good idea. Good nutritional and sleep habits during recovery are pivotal also.

[Jones28]

I don't follow him. But sounds like he's recommending super sets? They can be a great time saver, but are usually more suited for advanced lifters. My workouts generally take 60-80 minutes on average, but I require a decent amount of recovery time between sets or I end up with strains that can keep me out for weeks.

I don't think supersets are what either are advocating, they both argue, in slightly different ways, that over training is what leads to slower recovery and injury.

Mentzer would train, say, chest on a Monday. He would do a single set to muscular failure, then do partials or myo-reps to failure. He wouldn't go back to chest again until the following Monday.

Yates does similar, with more in the way of warm up sets, but then its a single, all out working set to failure then to partials, then failure again.

I suppose a summary would be their efficiency of work out. Now, they're body builders, I most definitely am not, but I'm not training for athletic performance. So I want to take my muscles to failure in the quickest way. Muscular failure + optimum recovery = growth.

For someone like yourself who is spending an hour plus in the gym it could be ideal to cut that time down.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Just started going to the gym again for the first time in about a decade.

I’ve always been lucky that I’m naturally fit, I run, play football etc, but it’s been a real eye opener how much strength I’ve lost when it comes to lifting in the decade I’ve not been. Have went from dumbbell chest press of about 26kg to 16kg and curls with 12kg dumbbells rather than 16kg. Massive drops :greengrin

[Hibs4185]

Does anyone follow Dorian Yates on Youtube? He's got some brilliant tips, keeping things short and intense, training 3-4 times a week for 30-40 minutes.

Real Mike Mentzer style stuff. Some of his stuff on Youtube is well worth watching too.

I watch some of his stuff. It’s a principle he’s sworn by for years. All blood and thunder type training. 45 mins in and out, no messing around.

Essentially rest and recovery is really important.

Not for everyone because it’s fairly brutal but it works for him.

If your smashing as much gear as these guys then you can pretty do what toi want and still grow .

[Hibs4185]

Just started going to the gym again for the first time in about a decade.

I’ve always been lucky that I’m naturally fit, I run, play football etc, but it’s been a real eye opener how much strength I’ve lost when it comes to lifting in the decade I’ve not been. Have went from dumbbell chest press of about 26kg to 16kg and curls with 12kg dumbbells rather than 16kg. Massive drops :greengrin

I don’t take it but TRT can be a game changer for some guys! Follow dr max draper on instagram, he’s a TRT specialist

[HarpOnHibee]

I don’t take it but TRT can be a game changer for some guys! Follow dr max draper on instagram, he’s a TRT specialist

Certainly if needed due to naturally low t levels. But it's perfectly reasonable to lose weight lifting strength when it hasn't been done in a good while, even if keeping physically active in other ways. Sometimes it can simply be down to a loss of overall body mass from more cardio orientated exercises and they may just need to consume more calories to put on a bit more body weight in order to get back to lifting those heavier weights.

[Jones28]

I watch some of his stuff. It’s a principle he’s sworn by for years. All blood and thunder type training. 45 mins in and out, no messing around.

Essentially rest and recovery is really important.

Not for everyone because it’s fairly brutal but it works for him.

If your smashing as much gear as these guys then you can pretty do what toi want and still grow .

That’s a fair point on the steroid use tbf.

I did deadlifts last night and feel mining already this morning. Usually takes a couple of days to hit but not today.

[Onceinawhile]

I don’t take it but TRT can be a game changer for some guys! Follow dr max draper on instagram, he’s a TRT specialist

You can essentially get TRT gels from online pharmacists with very little effort these days. I've no idea if gels actually help though - tbh, I've always thought that steroids needed injecting!

[Hibs4185]

You can essentially get TRT gels from online pharmacists with very little effort these days. I've no idea if gels actually help though - tbh, I've always thought that steroids needed injecting!

I’m a natural lifter so never taken anything but been around gyms and bodybuilders for years so I know bits and pieces!

You can get oral steroids but some can be toxic on your kidneys etc. Can’t remember why, something to do with having to be digested twice whereas injections go straight into your blood.

TRT is called TEST E I think and is predominantly injectable. You might get orals not 100% sure. Not sure about the gels.

In a couple of years, I’d be tempted to try TRT to be honest. Seems to lots of positive benefits for over 40’s

[HarpOnHibee]

The fundamental problem with anabolic steroids is that they cause enlargement of all muscles, including the heart. You hear of teenagers and 20 somethings hopping on the gear early and dying of heart failure by their early 30s.

Social media has played a major role in this problem in more recent years with body builders on social media getting sponsorship deals to sell snake oil products while being under pressure to achieve and maintain gains that would be unrealistically obtainable naturally. All to give the misleading impression that it's the product that they're selling that is responsible for those gains and not the unconscionable amount of steroids that they're taking instead.

[Hibs4185]

The fundamental problem with anabolic steroids is that they cause enlargement of all muscles, including the heart. You hear of teenagers and 20 somethings hopping on the gear early and dying of heart failure by their early 30s.

Social media has played a major role in this problem in more recent years with body builders on social media getting sponsorship deals to sell snake oil products while being under pressure to achieve and maintain gains that would be unrealistically obtainable naturally. All to give the misleading impression that it's the product that they're selling that is responsible for those gains and not the unconscionable amount of steroids that they're taking instead.

I agree to a certain extent but bodybuilders are far more educated nowadays with blood work and a better understanding of their bodies and steroids.

If you look at guys like vigorous Steve and Dean St Martin on instagram they are pretty healthy without the side effects.

Back in the day it was just listening to ‘Big Dave down the gym’, however there is a lot of info out there and the steroids are better understood now. They are more or less the same for the last 20-30 years.

Steroids can be done relatively safely if you have the right guidance and do enough research.

Still wouldn’t do it myself but I will do TRT if I feel I need it but through a well respected clinic and clinician.

All the famous ‘educators’ say you should max out your natural abilities for 5-6 years in the gym before making any decision. They if you do decide to jump on then you have a solid foundation and can add minimal amounts for maximum effect.

The guys who train for a month or two then jump on with little experience and no guidance are crazy

[HarpOnHibee]

I agree to a certain extent but bodybuilders are far more educated nowadays with blood work and a better understanding of their bodies and steroids.

If you look at guys like vigorous Steve and Dean St Martin on instagram they are pretty healthy without the side effects.

Back in the day it was just listening to ‘Big Dave down the gym’, however there is a lot of info out there and the steroids are better understood now. They are more or less the same for the last 20-30 years.

Steroids can be done relatively safely if you have the right guidance and do enough research.

Still wouldn’t do it myself but I will do TRT if I feel I need it but through a well respected clinic and clinician.

All the famous ‘educators’ say you should max out your natural abilities for 5-6 years in the gym before making any decision. They if you do decide to jump on then you have a solid foundation and can add minimal amounts for maximum effect.

The guys who train for a month or two then jump on with little experience and no guidance are crazy

The problem is where to draw the line. People who resort to steroids regardless of their level of experience are generally unsatisfied with their natural physique. They take a little gear to get bigger, until they feel unsatisfied again, then they take more gear to get even bigger and the cycle continues until it spirals out of control.

People who can't be satisfied with their natural physiques are never going to feel permanently satisfied, because they're forever chasing something "better" than where they currently are. So even if they take steroids to get bigger, they'll eventually feel unsatisfied again, leading to higher levels of steroid use.

[Hibs4185]

The problem is where to draw the line. People who resort to steroids regardless of their level of experience are generally unsatisfied with their natural physique. They take a little gear to get bigger, until they feel unsatisfied again, then they take more gear to get even bigger and the cycle continues until it spirals out of control.

People who can't be satisfied with their natural physiques are never going to feel permanently satisfied, because they're forever chasing something "better" than where they currently are. So even if they take steroids to get bigger, they'll eventually feel unsatisfied again, leading to higher levels of steroid use.

Unfortunately most people see IFBB pro’s, Mr Olympia etc and think that they are natural.

Even my wife didn’t know the difference. The fact that most pro’s don’t take about their steroid cycles, means a lot of people chase an unachievable goal.

If you google natural bodybuilding champions and Mr Olmpia the difference is extreme.

I just find the idea of injecting myself too much, I just couldn’t do it.

[HarpOnHibee]

Unfortunately most people see IFBB pro’s, Mr Olympia etc and think that they are natural.

Even my wife didn’t know the difference. The fact that most pro’s don’t take about their steroid cycles, means a lot of people chase an unachievable goal.

If you google natural bodybuilding champions and Mr Olmpia the difference is extreme.

I just find the idea of injecting myself too much, I just couldn’t do it.

You can identify who is taking steroids as they'll be a combination of big and shredded simultaneously. Which most men simply can't achieve naturally and have to contend with either being big (large muscles but with a higher body fat percentage) or being skinny shredded (low body fat but with sacrifices to muscle size). Those who have been taking high doses of steroids for an extended period of time will usually be left with bloated abdomens due to elevated HGH levels. As you say though, the average person who isn't into muscle fitness wouldn't know if a person is on steroids or not just by looking at them.