Newell

[Greenio]

Does he get back into this squad as a starter?

Kwon n Triantis are both solid and i feel need to stay... Can Joe play with them?

[MWHIBBIES]

He did at Kilmarnock and we played well.

Joe gets back in imo. He's a better option than Campbell, Levitt etc.

And Kwon and Triantis won't play every single match.

[McGruber]

Gets back in for me as Campbell whilst good v Rangers didn't quite do enough to make himself undroppable. He did play well though which comes on the back of a good showing from him off the bench v St Johnstone. Just needs to keep those performances up to get regular starts.

Levitt also not done enough - though still want to see him in an advanced position with Triantis and Kwon behind, think we'd see the best of him. He still played deeper coming on at Ibrox though at that point Kwon was off and Triantis labouring so not seen that combo yet

[hibsbollah]

Does he get back into this squad as a starter?

Kwon n Triantis are both solid and i feel need to stay... Can Joe play with them?

Yes. In for Campbell. In scenarios when we want to be more attacking, bring in Rudi instead, either instead of Newell or to give Kwon a rest, Moriah Welsh to provide cover for Kwon and Triantis. When we want someone who can run around a lot in advanced positions, bring back Campbell but he’s someone who isnt really contributing at the moment.

[sauzeelegod]

I like Joe but I don’t see how he gets back in if we’re keeping a 4231 shape. Triantis and Kwon can’t be dropped and none of them are really suited to playing as a 10.
Would have to switch to a 433 to get him back in.

[TrinityHFC]

I like Joe but I don’t see how he gets back in if we’re keeping a 4231 shape. Triantis and Kwon can’t be dropped and none of them are really suited to playing as a 10.
Would have to switch to a 433 to get him back in.

It isn't a huge change though. Triantis just sits a bit deeper than the other two. Worked well enough v Killie.

He will play when he's available.

[snedzuk]

He did at Kilmarnock and we played well.

Joe gets back in imo. He's a better option than Campbell, Levitt etc.

And Kwon and Triantis won't play every single match.

He scored at Killie during possibly the worst half of football I've ever witnessed. It was dire from both sides.

[Unseen work]

He scored at Killie during possibly the worst half of football I've ever witnessed. It was dire from both sides.

I honestly felt sorry for the ball in the first half

Was constantly getting hit as hard as it could

There was a huge amount of composure lacking for big spells of the first half

[Hibernian Verse]

Can Kwon play 10? Looks to me to have the attributes

[B.H.F.C]

Can Kwon play 10? Looks to me to have the attributes

He’s made a big difference playing where he has been. Best leaving him there.

[JohnM1875]

Newell will come back in. Captain as well.

Newell and Triantis will play deeper and Kwon will be more box-to-box. Hope we continue to get plenty minutes into Rudi though!

[CapitalGreen]

Newell will come back in. Captain as well.

Newell and Triantis will play deeper and Kwon will be more box-to-box. Hope we continue to get plenty minutes into Rudi though!

It looks like we’ve finally sorted the base of our midfield after it being an issue for years, why would we go back to what we had last season just to accommodate Newell?

[hibsbollah]

Newell will come back in. Captain as well.

Newell and Triantis will play deeper and Kwon will be more box-to-box. Hope we continue to get plenty minutes into Rudi though!

I think Newells best performances have been when he’s been more advanced. He’s not an archetypal #10 but id rather have him up there where he can retain possession and link up with strikers than shielding the defence, which even his staunchest defenders would admit isnt his game.

[Lago]

Does he get back into this squad as a starter?

Kwon n Triantis are both solid and i feel need to stay... Can Joe play with them?
Why not, good player.

[CapitalGreen]

Why not, good player.

Because his position is currently occupied by someone else.

[wookie70]

If we play 433 do we actually need a 10. Triantis, Kwon and Newell can all pass a ball from midfield and we have two wide men who can come in and help Myko or provide crosses from wide with the midfielders trying to get in the box. I think Newell, Triantis and Kwon would be a very solid 3 and also offer lots going forward too. Junior actually defends pretty well and Boyle definitely can but hasn't shown as much off the ball as he did previously. For me Joe looks better nearer the opposition's goal so we may see the best of him with the security of two other mobile midfielders and we could have a team with square pegs in square holes all knowing and being capable in their role.

[Shrekko]

Because his position is currently occupied by someone else.

We all know that some fans have this agenda against Newell but to suggest he can't be accommodated next to Kwon and Triantis is nonsense - the 3 of them will rightfully all play when fit. One of them will play in a more advanced role - which all are capable of... unless someone wants to say that role is 'currently occupied' by Campbell?

[Hibs4185]

We’ve had the best two performances from the midfield in the last couple of games, it’s no coincidence.

Sunday was the first time in years I’ve watched us play and felt we played some nice football.

We’ve been missing a midfield for years and Sunday was the first positive signs of a solid midfield forming.

[andrew70]

We all know that some fans have this agenda against Newell but to suggest he can't be accommodated next to Kwon and Triantis is nonsense - the 3 of them will rightfully all play when fit. One of them will play in a more advanced role - which all are capable of... unless someone wants to say that role is 'currently occupied' by Campbell?

“All are capable of” Triantis and Kwon aren’t and Newell doesn’t have the creative output to play that position. So that’s a false statement. The “10” position should be Rudi’s or Junior’s. Rudi a more all round midfielder than Hoilett.

Newell is a sub at best.

We’ve finally found the solution, let’s not bring back a problem. Also if he’s as good as people make out then he’ll win his way back in via the bench but I highly doubt it.

[MWHIBBIES]

“All are capable of” Triantis and Kwon aren’t and Newell doesn’t have the creative output to play that position. So that’s a false statement. The “10” position should be Rudi’s or Junior’s. Rudi a more all round midfielder than Hoilett.

Newell is a sub at best.

We’ve finally found the solution, let’s not bring back a problem. Also if he’s as good as people make out then he’ll win his way back in via the bench but I highly doubt it.

Have a look, a real look, at Newells creative stats for last season. He is well above average in this league.

Newell wasn't the problem, and Gray knows that.

[andrew70]

Have a look, a real look, at Newells creative stats for last season. He is well above average in this league.

Newell wasn't the problem, and Gray knows that.

I can see what he offers at every game. Very little.

This league is poor so that doesn’t say much. We need better, much better and we have found it. No surprise we play our best football in the games he’s been missing.

Let’s not go backwards.

[Shrekko]

So that’s a false statement

Apologies - and thanks to the fact checker for pointing it out...

[andrew70]

Apologies - and thanks to the fact checker for pointing it out...

Newell scores once every 1594 minutes
Newell assists once every 638 minutes.

Not exactly great numbers for someone in the 10 position.

[MWHIBBIES]

I can see what he offers at every game. Very little.

This league is poor so that doesn’t say much. We need better, much better and we have found it. No surprise we play our best football in the games he’s been missing.

Let’s not go backwards.

It's a lot more than very little. Go look. I dare you.

The massive sample size of 2 matches. The first 45 Vs st Johnstone was absolutely dreadful as well.

Still has a big part to play. You think Gray renewed his contract for a laugh? Starts alongside Kwon and Triantis.

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

Sunday was the first time in years I’ve watched us play and felt we played some nice football.

We’ve been missing a midfield for years and Sunday was the first positive signs of a solid midfield forming.

I got that impression on Sunday too, it's been a while since we showed that level of control of midfield away to an OF team.

[andrew70]

It's a lot more than very little. Go look. I dare you.

The massive sample size of 2 matches. The first 45 Vs st Johnstone was absolutely dreadful as well.

Still has a big part to play. You think Gray renewed his contract for a laugh? Starts alongside Kwon and Triantis.

As above, very little. We need to move on.

[andrew70]

I got that impression on Sunday too, it's been a while since we showed that level of control of midfield away to an OF team.

This, we now have a midfield who are not scared to fight tooth and nail for our club. Need a creative influence but Rudi will nail that position in time.

[Shrekko]

Newell scores once every 1594 minutes
Newell assists once every 638 minutes.

Not exactly great numbers for someone in the 10 position.

So, his stats while not being played as a 10 (assuming they are right), prove he couldn't do it? Ok then.

You've been told already that his creative stats are well above average, but you say that's irrelevant and it's all about what YOU see.... now you're throwing stats around to back yourself up? Make up your mind- you're all over the shop.

You don't like him - we get it. If you and others think our midfield is now resolved after 45 good mins v St Johnstone and a solid but not spectacular show at Ibrox because Joe's not there then that's fine.

[andrew70]

So, his stats while not being played as a 10 (assuming they are right), prove he couldn't do it? Ok then.

You've been told already that his creative stats are well above average, but you say that's irrelevant and it's all about what YOU see.... now you're throwing stats around to back yourself up? Make up your mind- you're all over the shop.

You don't like him - we get it. If you and others think our midfield is now resolved after 45 good mins v St Johnstone and a solid but not spectacular show at Ibrox because Joe's not there then that's fine.

The point around him not being played as a ‘10’ is fair but his general stats don’t back up that he can play there.

It’s a strange one but it’s not to do with not liking him.

I think we are a more balanced team without him and that is shown in the stats. We haven’t missed him the way we may have done previously.

[blackpoolhibs]

Why change something we look to have improved on to accomodate Newell? The only change i'd make is Rudi for Campbell, he's more of a footballer and creative too.

The balance is better without Newell, we've been looking for a better balance, lets work on it now instead of going backwards.

[Greenio]

Have a look, a real look, at Newells creative stats for last season. He is well above average in this league.

Newell wasn't the problem, and Gray knows that.

Sometimes you dont have to be the problem to not be the solution

I like him, just cant see how he slots back in atm, not saying he never will

[Shrekko]

The point around him not being played as a ‘10’ is fair but his general stats don’t back up that he can play there.

It’s a strange one but it’s not to do with not liking him.

I think we are a more balanced team without him and that is shown in the stats. We haven’t missed him the way we may have done previously.

He's generally played as a deep lying midfielder - very difficult to have mind blowing productivity from there. I think he could be a number 10 or play further forward and be effective but I may be wrong. We had Campbell up supporting the forwards on Sunday and he hardly touched the ball.

I do think the narrative some are spinning about us being better simply because he's not there is agenda driven. I don't think he's beyond criticism either and can see merit in some of it- I just think he can be part of our first 11 and will be surprised if he's not when fit. I also know that the first poor game we play when he's in the team will be blamed on him regardless of how he plays.

[Tyler Durden]

Sometimes you dont have to be the problem to not be the solution

I like him, just cant see how he slots back in atm, not saying he never will

Don't really get the can't see how....... It was only 2 games ago that we started with Kwon, Triantis and Newell together. For me that is preferable to playing Campbell, who again did very little with the ball on Sunday.

Plenty of teams play with a flatter 3 in the middle. I think we'll rotate between that approach and playing Rudi or Campbell as a 10.

[CapitalGreen]

So, his stats while not being played as a 10 (assuming they are right), prove he couldn't do it? Ok then.

You've been told already that his creative stats are well above average, but you say that's irrelevant and it's all about what YOU see.... now you're throwing stats around to back yourself up? Make up your mind- you're all over the shop.

You don't like him - we get it. If you and others think our midfield is now resolved after 45 good mins v St Johnstone and a solid but not spectacular show at Ibrox because Joe's not there then that's fine.

His chance creation stats are inflated due to having a near monopoly over set pieces, his open play chance creation is nothing special. With Hoilett now in the team, it’s unlikely Newell will be taking as many set pieces.

Maybe MWHIBBIES could provide his chance creation numbers from open play?

[CapitalGreen]

Don't really get the can't see how....... It was only 2 games ago that we started with Kwon, Triantis and Newell together. For me that is preferable to playing Campbell, who again did very little with the ball on Sunday.

Plenty of teams play with a flatter 3 in the middle. I think we'll rotate between that approach and playing Rudi or Campbell as a 10.

I’m far from Campbell’s biggest fan but I think that’s harsh regarding Sunday. He played his part in probably the best Hibs midfield performance at Ibrox since 2018 and could have walked off with an assist had the ref not blown for the Traintis non-foul.

[MWHIBBIES]

As above, very little. We need to move on.

You think those are stats that show his ability to play 8 or 10? Yikes

[MWHIBBIES]

Honestly if we hang on against Dundee and Kilmarnock (late goals not of Joe's doing) we wouldn't be talking about being better without him.

Rudi will get minutes, but Newell is a far better option than Campbell, Levitt and NMW, so will play plenty.

[Shrekko]

His chance creation stats are inflated due to having a near monopoly over set pieces, his open play chance creation is nothing special. With Hoilett now in the team, it’s unlikely Newell will be taking as many set pieces.

Maybe MWHIBBIES could provide his chance creation numbers from open play?

To prove I'm objective - having seen Hoilet's crosses on Sunday I doubt Joe will be anywhere near set pieces when he's in the team.

But, as I've said already- why would you judge Newell in his current role on chance creation? He sits just on front of the back 4.

[MWHIBBIES]

His chance creation stats are inflated due to having a near monopoly over set pieces, his open play chance creation is nothing special. With Hoilett now in the team, it’s unlikely Newell will be taking as many set pieces.

Maybe MWHIBBIES could provide his chance creation numbers from open play?

Done that multiple times before. Takes minutes to look up.

Passing and creative stats here

https://footystats.org/players/england/joe-newell

They are very good, especially from a deep position.

[CapitalGreen]

Done that multiple times before. Takes minutes to look up.

Passing and creative stats here

https://footystats.org/players/england/joe-newell

They are very good, especially from a deep position.

That doesn’t distinguish between set pieces and open play like I requested, they are all bundled into the same stats. Whether he is playing deep or advanced is irrelevant if most of those chances are created from set piece situations. Do you have the numbers split out?

[The Tubs]

Honestly if we hang on against Dundee and Kilmarnock (late goals not of Joe's doing) we wouldn't be talking about being better without him.

Rudi will get minutes, but Newell is a far better option than Campbell, Levitt and NMW, so will play plenty.

I really don't want to get into a discussion about Joe Newell, but, to tell you the truth, he always looks shattered by the end of games and I've been starting to think that either his lack of stamina or not managing his energy well enough contributes to us losing goals at the end. Especially as he's the captain now. i don't have any stats, but it seems to me that folk start to get past more easily in the last 15-20 minutes of games.

[CapitalGreen]

That doesn’t distinguish between set pieces and open play like I requested, they are all bundled into the same stats. Whether he is playing deep or advanced is irrelevant if most of those chances are created from set piece situations. Do you have the numbers split out?

Whoscored.com suggests that at least 0.7 of his key passes per 90 were from free kicks (0.3) and corners (0.4), meaning at most his open play chance creation is 0.72 per 90. This puts him on par with the likes of Cammy Devlin (0.73) for open play chance creation.

[MWHIBBIES]

That doesn’t distinguish between set pieces and open play like I requested, they are all bundled into the same stats. Whether he is playing deep or advanced is irrelevant if most of those chances are created from set piece situations. Do you have the numbers split out?

You think most of his chances are created from set pieces? I really don't think that's the case.

If they are, he'll continue to take them as that would be exceptional.

[Tyler Durden]

I’m far from Campbell’s biggest fan but I think that’s harsh regarding Sunday. He played his part in probably the best Hibs midfield performance at Ibrox since 2018 and could have walked off with an assist had the ref not blown for the Traintis non-foul.

Possibly a little harsh. My view on Campbell is that he'll look ok in these games where his main role is to press and harry. When we have more possession in games against the teams around us, his lack of quality on the ball will be telling. I'd rather change the shape a little and have Newell if it was a straight forward choice.

My preference overall would be Rudi taking Campbell's place and Newell on the bench. But I think SDG is right to hold Rudi back at times and he was due a rest.

[CapitalGreen]

You think most of his chances are created from set pieces? I really don't think that's the case.

If they are, he'll continue to take them as that would be exceptional.

I doubt it.

2023/24
Hoilett 1.4 chances created p90 from corners & FKs
Newell 0.7 chances created p90 from corners & FKs

[JohnM1875]

It looks like we’ve finally sorted the base of our midfield after it being an issue for years, why would we go back to what we had last season just to accommodate Newell?

Looked more like that (Triantis and Newell deeper) against Killie to me, so just guessing that's what it'll be

[RIP]

Before we signed Triantis, Joe had been playing 6. It's not his best position but Monty and Gray lacked a better option.

I see Joe as an excellent fit as an 8. Can tackle, pass and shoot. Some teams like St Mirren, Dundee and Motherwell try to play through the centre of the pitch. Thats when we need a hard-tackling midfield three.

Joe goes back into the 8 role IMO.

[JohnM1875]

Before we signed Triantis, Joe had been playing 6. It's not his best position but Monty and Gray lacked a better option.

I see Joe as an excellent fit as an 8. Can tackle, pass and shoot. Some teams like St Mirren, Dundee and Motherwell try to play through the centre of the pitch. Thats when we need a hard-tackling midfield three.

Joe goes back into the 8 role IMO.

Not got the engine to be an 8 for me

[Donegal Hibby]

Possibly a little harsh. My view on Campbell is that he'll look ok in these games where his main role is to press and harry. When we have more possession in games against the teams around us, his lack of quality on the ball will be telling. I'd rather change the shape a little and have Newell if it was a straight forward choice.

My preference overall would be Rudi taking Campbell's place and Newell on the bench. But I think SDG is right to hold Rudi back at times and he was due a rest.

Thing about it is I don’t think we will be more possession based under Gray as we were under our previous managers.. Dundee at home we had 50% , St Johnstone at home we had 52% .

[J-C]

What I did notice on Sunday was Kwong and Triantis willingness to push forward where possible and many passes moving in a forward direction, Newell's problem is he has a tendency to dawdle on the ball and look backwards/sideways too often. I liked our positivity against Rangers, I fear when Newell comes back in that disappears.

[MWHIBBIES]

I doubt it.

2023/24
Hoilett 1.4 chances created p90 from corners & FKs
Newell 0.7 chances created p90 from corners & FKs

Impressive.

I guess we'll wait and see. Newell still has a big part to play. Hence the new deal.

[Tyler Durden]

Thing about it is I don’t think we will be more possession based under Gray as we were under our previous managers.. Dundee at home we had 50% , St Johnstone at home we had 52% .

And 50% is more possession than the 33% we had on Sunday. Per the point I made.

[InvertedFullBak]

Does he get back into this squad as a starter?

Kwon n Triantis are both solid and i feel need to stay... Can Joe play with them?

I’d like to think he’d have to earn his way back in but I fear he’ll walk straight back in. For me , the position of number 10 should be for Dwight gayle. More than capable of playing there.

Newell has had his day now I’m afraid. Time to move him and a few others on.

[TrinityHFC]

I’d like to think he’d have to earn his way back in but I fear he’ll walk straight back in. For me , the position of number 10 should be for Dwight gayle. More than capable of playing there.

Newell has had his day now I’m afraid. Time to move him and a few others on.

Why do we need to play with a 10?

Anyway, he will back playing with Triantis and Kwon when he’s fit.

[007]

Newell scores once every 1594 minutes
Newell assists once every 638 minutes.

Not exactly great numbers for someone in the 10 position.

Are those stats from him playing in the 10 position?

[CapitalGreen]

Why do we need to play with a 10?

Anyway, he will back playing with Triantis and Kwon when he’s fit.

We don’t need to but the managers preferred formation includes a number 10. From his use of Campbell and willingness to spend £1m on McCowan it’s clear he wants someone in there who is willing/able to get forward and beyond our centre forward and provide a goal scoring threat.

[MWHIBBIES]

We don’t need to but the managers preferred formation includes a number 10. From his use of Campbell and willingness to spend £1m on McCowan it’s clear he wants someone in there who is willing/able to get forward and beyond our centre forward and provide a goal scoring threat.
Was Campbell starting when Newell, Kwon and Triantis were all fit?

[CapitalGreen]

Was Campbell starting when Newell, Kwon and Triantis were all fit?

No, because he’s shown he’s not good enough. Do you think I’m advocating for Campbell to start as a 10? My point is It was clear in preseason Gray hoped we could use him in that role however he wasn’t good enough once we started playing decent opposition and we stepped up our pursuit of McCowan - McCowan would have been starting in that role had we been able to get the deal done.

[MWHIBBIES]

No, because he’s shown he’s not good enough. Do you think I’m advocating for Campbell to start as a 10? My point is It was clear in preseason Gray hoped we could use him in that role however he wasn’t good enough once we started playing decent opposition and we stepped up our pursuit of McCowan - McCowan would have been starting in that role had we been able to get the deal done.

Did we even play with a 10 when Newell, Kwon and Triantis were all fit?

Is McCowan at 10? Certainly didn't play there at Easter Road.

[InvertedFullBak]

Why do we need to play with a 10?

Anyway, he will back playing with Triantis and Kwon when he’s fit.

If we don’t then we’ll have a 3 man midfield and a centre forward isolated with no help for 20/30 yards.

[Donegal Hibby]

And 50% is more possession than the 33% we had on Sunday. Per the point I made.

You said more possession though mate , 50 % of it is exactly the same as the other teams got .. and we don’t get a lot of possession against the OF normally , at home to Celtic we only had 25% so it’s hard to judge us in them games . At Killie we had 47% which is why I said we weren’t as focused on possession under Gray .

[Tyler Durden]

You said more possession though mate , 50 % of it is exactly the same as the other teams got .. and we don’t get a lot of possession against the OF normally , at home to Celtic we only had 25% so it’s hard to judge us in them games . At Killie we had 47% which is why I said we weren’t as focused on possession under Gray .

“My view on Campbell is that he'll look ok in these games where his main role is to press and harry. When we have more possession in games against the teams around us, his lack of quality on the ball will be telling.”

Didn’t think this was too tough to follow. Against the OF we don’t have much possession. Campbell does ok as he’s better out of possession.

When we play other teams we have a greater share of the ball than we do against the OF. Campbell not so effective as he’s asked to do more on the ball.

👍🏻

[hibee-boys]

“My view on Campbell is that he'll look ok in these games where his main role is to press and harry. When we have more possession in games against the teams around us, his lack of quality on the ball will be telling.”

Didn’t think this was too tough to follow. Against the OF we don’t have much possession. Campbell does ok as he’s better out of possession.

When we play other teams we have a greater share of the ball than we do against the OF. Campbell not so effective as he’s asked to do more on the ball.

👍🏻

Agree with all that but pretty telling when a footballers best qualities, in particular a supposed offensive midfielder, are when he’s NOT on the ball🙈

[Donegal Hibby]

“My view on Campbell is that he'll look ok in these games where his main role is to press and harry. When we have more possession in games against the teams around us, his lack of quality on the ball will be telling.”

Didn’t think this was too tough to follow. Against the OF we don’t have much possession. Campbell does ok as he’s better out of possession.

When we play other teams we have a greater share of the ball than we do against the OF. Campbell not so effective as he’s asked to do more on the ball.

👍🏻

Forget about the OF games … since the St mirren game where we had 58% possession in we have played Killie 47% , Dundee 50% and St Johnstone 52 % .

Three of these games we haven’t exactly got a greater share of the ball unless you think against one of the poorer teams in the league at home 52% is a significant amount.

We aren’t with Gray as manager going to be a possession based team .

[Tyler Durden]

Forget about the OF games … since the St mirren game where we had 58% possession in we have played Killie 47% , Dundee 50% and St Johnstone 52 % .

Three of these games we haven’t exactly got a greater share of the ball unless you think against one of the poorer teams in the league at home 52% is a significant amount.

We aren’t with Gray as manager going to be a possession based team .

I cannot spend any more energy explaining a very simple point. Maybe have another read

[TrinityHFC]

If we don’t then we’ll have a 3 man midfield and a centre forward isolated with no help for 20/30 yards.

Rubbish. The midfield and the two wide players can all move forward.

[Donegal Hibby]

I cannot spend any more energy explaining a very simple point. Maybe have another read

Your simple point is Campbell is less effective when we are having more possession though against Killie one of the bottom teams we don’t have more possession .. against one of the worst teams in the league St Johnstone at home our possession is only marginally better … against Dundee who finished 6th last year at home we had exactly the same possession as them.

I think no disrespect it’s you that fails to understand that we aren’t as interested in possession as we were under Monty and that Gray wants to play more direct .. who you think we are going to dominate in possession when we haven’t done it against teams down the bottom of the league is interesting .

[Heisenberg]

Your simple point is Campbell is less effective when we are having more possession though against Killie one of the bottom teams we don’t have more possession .. against one of the worst teams in the league St Johnstone at home our possession is only marginally better … against Dundee who finished 6th last year at home we had exactly the same possession as them.

I think no disrespect it’s you that fails to understand that we aren’t as interested in possession as we were under Monty and that Gray wants to play more direct .. who you think we are going to dominate in possession when we haven’t done it against teams down the bottom of the league is interesting .

But we have more possession against these teams than we usually do against the Glasgow two, think that’s the point being made.

[Shrekko]

Agree with all that but pretty telling when a footballers best qualities, in particular a supposed offensive midfielder, are when he’s NOT on the ball🙈
Aye if somebody’s most effective games involve mainly shuttling in between opposition players and not getting near the ball for 90 minutes then it’s not a ringing endorsement .

[Donegal Hibby]

But we have more possession against these teams than we usually do against the Glasgow two, think that’s the point being made.

Not the way I read it from his post in he said …..when we have more possession in games against teams around us .. which we haven’t done significantly apart from our first game .

Campbell not so long ago was 2nd for recovering the ball in the opposition’s half which could be said increases our possession and when we have lots of possession ( 65% ) like in this game he’s still very useful IMO ….

https://youtu.be/QNK92LNnaEM?si=8e85YjnS8WBd1tWV

[BoomtownHibees]

Impressive.

I guess we'll wait and see. Newell still has a big part to play. Hence the new deal.

Yeah since we’ve been so great over the last few years at making sure only those who deserve it have been given new deals

[K-Zazu]

Not the way I read it from his post in he said …..when we have more possession in games against teams around us .. which we haven’t done significantly apart from our first game .

Campbell not so long ago was 2nd for recovering the ball in the opposition’s half which could be said increases our possession and when we have lots of possession ( 65% ) like in this game he’s still very useful IMO ….

https://youtu.be/QNK92LNnaEM?si=8e85YjnS8WBd1tWV

That game was over 2 years ago I think 🤔?

[Tyler Durden]

Your simple point is Campbell is less effective when we are having more possession though against Killie one of the bottom teams we don’t have more possession .. against one of the worst teams in the league St Johnstone at home our possession is only marginally better … against Dundee who finished 6th last year at home we had exactly the same possession as them.

I think no disrespect it’s you that fails to understand that we aren’t as interested in possession as we were under Monty and that Gray wants to play more direct .. who you think we are going to dominate in possession when we haven’t done it against teams down the bottom of the league is interesting .

This is your point - I was not referring to this. You are the only person who misreads it and then labours your same argument multiple times. One might think you're trolling but I think you're just not the brightest. You crack on.

[Libby Hibby]

I don’t mind Newell playing but would prefer if O’Hora remained captain.

[easty]

I don’t mind Newell playing but would prefer if O’Hora remained captain.

If Newell and O'Hora are playing, and Newell is wearing the armband, do you think O'Hora acts differently?

[Hibs4185]

Newell has a good stats because he is a safe player. Takes the ball, looks busy but passes sideways or backwards.

He takes the safe option on the majority of occasions.

For me, he is a decent option from the bench.

[The Modfather]

I’d have Newell competing with Triantis & Kwon for those 2 midfield positions. Play all 3 when we want to be solid and playing the Old Firm or at Tynecastle or Pittodrie. Outside of those kind of games it would probably be fairly successful, but depressing if the extent of a David Gray team is to be solid, functional etc against most of the league.

3 players for those two deeper positions, and someone more forward thinking for that 3rd midfielder from Rudi, Hoillet & maybe Gayle.

[Donegal Hibby]

This is your point - I was not referring to this. You are the only person who misreads it and then labours your same argument multiple times. One might think you're trolling but I think you're just not the brightest. You crack on.

Trolling by defending a player that always gives 100% and chips in with goals ? Josh Campbell is a fine player to have and his criticism is regularly OTT on here …

Don’t know who’s not the brightest here as the thread titles is about newell .

anyhow I will let you carry on as your now acting like a petulant child with your latest remark 👍

[supermcginn]

Trolling by defending a player that always gives 100% and chips in with goals ? Josh Campbell is a fine player to have and his criticism is regularly OTT on here …

Don’t know who’s not the brightest here as the thread titles is about newell .

anyhow I will let you carry on as your now acting like a petulant child with your latest remark 👍

Campbell has scored 12 goals in 86 league games he's hardly prolific. Even Newell has more league goals this season.

[K-Zazu]

Trolling by defending a player that always gives 100% and chips in with goals ? Josh Campbell is a fine player to have and his criticism is regularly OTT on here …

Don’t know who’s not the brightest here as the thread titles is about newell .

anyhow I will let you carry on as your now acting like a petulant child with your latest remark 👍

I thought this thread was about Newell?

[Wilson]

I thought this thread was about Newell?

Does he get back in the team?

He can't even get into his own thread!

[Donegal Hibby]

Campbell has scored 12 goals in 86 league games he's hardly prolific. Even Newell has more league goals this season.

12 in 86 .. what midfielder do we have that’s got a better ratio ?

[MWHIBBIES]

Yeah since we’ve been so great over the last few years at making sure only those who deserve it have been given new deals

At the time they were given, who didn't deserve the new deal?

Maybe Doyle Hayes?

[Libby Hibby]

If Newell and O'Hora are playing, and Newell is wearing the armband, do you think O'Hora acts differently?

Yes, he might but I think the team is playing better with O’Hora as captain.

[easty]

Campbell has scored 12 goals in 86 league games he's hardly prolific. Even Newell has more league goals this season.


12 in 86 .. what midfielder do we have that’s got a better ratio ?

He's got 15 in 113 games total. None in his last 22 appearances.

[Tambo]

With Newell missing the last two games then I don't think starting should be a problem if available, SDG will maybe have him on the bench.

[Donegal Hibby]

With Newell missing the last two games then I don't think starting should be a problem if available, SDG will maybe have him on the bench.

Depending on how he is , I don’t think that’s a bad shout in Gray might start him on the bench and ease him into the team again . I think Gray said he had been playing with the injury for a while so hopefully we see Newell back to his best soon .

[blackpoolhibs]

Does he get back in the team?

He can't even get into his own thread!
:faf:

[BoomtownHibees]

At the time they were given, who didn't deserve the new deal?

Maybe Doyle Hayes?

JDH
Delfierre
Doidge

[MWHIBBIES]

JDH
Delfierre
Doidge

Delfierre yeah.

When was Doidge renewal? He was a key player before injury, so no brainer if it was then.

[KWJ]

Campbell has scored 12 goals in 86 league games he's hardly prolific. Even Newell has more league goals this season.

It's a lot better when you say he's had 11 goals in his last 36 starts.

I'm not a big Josh Campbell fan but there was a big improvement in his attacking play over the past 2-3 years.

[Hibiza]

Joe : all the best but you won't be missed.

[MWHIBBIES]

Joe : all the best but you won't be missed.

He had years on his deal bud, you'll be seeing him plenty more :faf:

[BoomtownHibees]

Delfierre yeah.

When was Doidge renewal? He was a key player before injury, so no brainer if it was then.

He had scored 7 league goals from 36 appearances in 20/21, not sure I would class that as a “key player”.

He got injured at the start of the following season and got his new deal in November 2021 whilst still out injured and was then loaned out 9 months later

[Donegal Hibby]

Newell ,Boyle could be back .

https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/sport/football/hibs/hibs-gaffer-on-loan-celtic-star-world-cup-call-up-crocked-stars-training-4807507

[BILLYHIBS]

Joe : all the best but you won't be missed.

Thought I was the only one that was missing something he hasn’t turned up for months apart from his cross/cum shot at Killie 😀

[Fergus52]

Newell has a good stats because he is a safe player. Takes the ball, looks busy but passes sideways or backwards.

He takes the safe option on the majority of occasions.

For me, he is a decent option from the bench.

This is a massive myth, 5th most progressive passes per 90 of CMs in the league last season. More than O'Riley, Clarkson, Lennon miller, Connor Barron, Callum McGregor, baningame, O'Hara.

[MWHIBBIES]

He had scored 7 league goals from 36 appearances in 20/21, not sure I would class that as a “key player”.

He got injured at the start of the following season and got his new deal in November 2021 whilst still out injured and was then loaned out 9 months later

Doidge absolutely was a key player in our season in 3rd. Great foil for Nisbet and Boyle. Great in the cups too.

[hibsbollah]

Doidge absolutely was a key player in our season in 3rd. Great foil for Nisbet and Boyle. Great in the cups too.

If hibs were the french national team Doidge= Giroud. Never really rated but popped up with vital goals.

[Big_Franck]

Newell should be a sub on Saturday. We've looked better without him.

[easty]

Newell should be a sub on Saturday. We've looked better without him.

I think the improvement is overstated. We’ve beat St Johnstone at home. The worst team in the league, where I don’t think we were great at all. Then lost against a piss poor Rangers side.

I don’t think Rudi or Campbell played well against St Johnstone, and I thought Campbell was poor v Rangers.

[Since452]

I think the improvement is overstated. We’ve beat St Johnstone at home. The worst team in the league, where I don’t think we were great at all. Then lost against a piss poor Rangers side.

I don’t think Rudi or Campbell played well against St Johnstone, and I thought Campbell was poor v Rangers.

Hearts?

[BILLYHIBS]

This is a massive myth, 5th most progressive passes per 90 of CMs in the league last season. More than O'Riley, Clarkson, Lennon miller, Connor Barron, Callum McGregor, baningame, O'Hara.

Yet would probably take all of the above before Newell not sure about Baningame not seen enough of him but looks to have a decent pedigree

[Fergus52]

Yet would probably take all of the above before Newell not sure about Baningame not seen enough of him but looks to have a decent pedigree

As would I (barring maybe Baningame or O'Hara) - just using the metric as an example to show that Newell's passing is generally far less negative than he gets credit for on here.

It definitely was at times under Ross and Maloney but that was more down to those managers safety first in possession tactics than him individually imo.

For the last couple of seasons he's been statistically one of the best centre mids in the league at progressing the ball vertically up the pitch.

[BILLYHIBS]

As would I (barring maybe Baningame or O'Hara) - just using the metric as an example to show that Newell's passing is generally far less negative than he gets credit for on here.

It definitely was at times under Ross and Maloney but that was more down to those managers safety first in possession tactics than him individually imo.

For the last couple of seasons he's been statistically one of the best centre mids in the league at progressing the ball vertically up the pitch.

Looking at last season’s stats re success rate accuracy of passing in the opposition half SPFL Baningame 87% McGregor 85% O’Riley 72% O’Hara 67% and Newell 66%

Source : Sofascore

[theonlywayisup]

As would I (barring maybe Baningame or O'Hara) - just using the metric as an example to show that Newell's passing is generally far less negative than he gets credit for on here.

It definitely was at times under Ross and Maloney but that was more down to those managers safety first in possession tactics than him individually imo.

For the last couple of seasons he's been statistically one of the best centre mids in the league at progressing the ball vertically up the pitch.

Stats are great at times, but I also trust my eyes.

With Super Joe Newell, at times, I see a player who receives the ball in midfield and almost instinctively passes the ball back to the defender rather than lift his head, look forward and either play the ball forward quickly or burst forward into space.

Obviously, he doesn't do what I describe all the time. He is a very good player, as the stats clearly show. He will rightly get back into the team, when fit. But, I'd rather he gave us more great performances, rather that what feels the safety first performances.

[Paulie Walnuts]

I think the improvement is overstated. We’ve beat St Johnstone at home. The worst team in the league, where I don’t think we were great at all. Then lost against a piss poor Rangers side.

I don’t think Rudi or Campbell played well against St Johnstone, and I thought Campbell was poor v Rangers.

I’ve thought the same to an extent, especially when the ‘rate the summer transfer window’ type thread was ongoing a couple of days ago.

A rotten first half and good second half against St J and a good performance but ultimately ending in defeat against a poor Rangers side seems to have had people over egging the pudding a bit.

The next few weeks will tell us where we are imo and we’re nowhere near the point of saying we look a decent side with excellent/good signings etc yet.

[tamig]

I’ve thought the same to an extent, especially when the ‘rate the summer transfer window’ type thread was ongoing a couple of days ago.

A rotten first half and good second half against St J and a good performance but ultimately ending in defeat against a poor Rangers side seems to have had people over egging the pudding a bit.

The next few weeks will tell us where we are imo and we’re nowhere near the point of saying we look a decent side with excellent/good signings etc yet.
I’d say we are an improving side who are starting to look much stronger through the core of the team. Long way to go yet but a good base developing.

[Donegal Hibby]

I think the improvement is overstated. We’ve beat St Johnstone at home. The worst team in the league, where I don’t think we were great at all. Then lost against a piss poor Rangers side.

I don’t think Rudi or Campbell played well against St Johnstone, and I thought Campbell was poor v Rangers.

I think St Johnstones plan under Levein was to try and disrupt us and defend hoping to get a 0-0 or even pinch a win .. that went out the window when we got the first goal and they didn’t have any answers to falling behind…

Thought the 2nd half was enjoyable and we played some good stuff at times , Campbell came on the same time as Boyle about 62 minutes and 10 minutes later we got our 2nd .

The rangers side you refer to as being piss poor is still sadly another level above us and I thought it was as good as a performance as I’ve seen from a Hibs team there … I thought Campbell put in a great shift like Myko , Hoilett etc and where probably knackered when Gray started to make changes around the 68 minute mark .

I don’t think any of the substitutes actually made us better or made any impact on the game though.

[CapitalGreen]

I’d say we are an improving side who are starting to look much stronger through the core of the team. Long way to go yet but a good base developing.

:agree: I think anyone watching the last few games would agree we look much stronger defensively, particularly centrally, compared to where we were in the first few games of the season. One goal conceded from open play in 3 matches and that was a worldie. It’s no coincidence Bursik, O’Hora and Ekitpitea are looking more competent with better protection in front of them. Any defensive issues in recent games have been at full back where we haven’t strengthened.

[Fergus52]

Looking at last season’s stats re success rate accuracy of passing in the opposition half SPFL Baningame 87% McGregor 85% O’Riley 72% O’Hara 67% and Newell 66%

Source : Sofascore

If these players are all playing less forward passes per 90 than Newell then it makes sense they have a higher success rate as a higher proportion will be backwards or sideways.

[supermcginn]

I think St Johnstones plan under Levein was to try and disrupt us and defend hoping to get a 0-0 or even pinch a win .. that went out the window when we got the first goal and they didn’t have any answers to falling behind…

Thought the 2nd half was enjoyable and we played some good stuff at times , Campbell came on the same time as Boyle about 62 minutes and 10 minutes later we got our 2nd .

The rangers side you refer to as being piss poor is still sadly another level above us and I thought it was as good as a performance as I’ve seen from a Hibs team there … I thought Campbell put in a great shift like Myko , Hoilett etc and where probably knackered when Gray started to make changes around the 68 minute mark .

I don’t think any of the substitutes actually made us better or made any impact on the game though.

You thought that was the best Hibs performance at Ibrox you've ever seen? What? You can't be serious?

[Donegal Hibby]

You thought that was the best Hibs performance at Ibrox you've ever seen? What? You can't be serious?

Didn’t say the best , said it was as good as a performance as I seen there ( should have added in recent times) , yes . They were always going to have more possession which they did though matched them on the shots and really unfortunate not to get at least a point with a missed penalty , finger tip save from Butland .

[CapitalGreen]

If these players are all playing less forward passes per 90 than Newell then it makes sense they have a higher success rate as a higher proportion will be backwards or sideways.

This isn’t correct as it is based on an assumption that all players attempt the same number of passes.

Player A attempts 20 passes, 10 forward. 50% are forward, 50% are backwards/sideways.
Player B attempts 15 passes, 9 forward. 60% are forward, 40% are backwards/sideways.

Just because player A attempts more forward passes than player B it doesn’t mean player B has a higher proportion of backwards or sideways passes.

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

I’d say we are an improving side who are starting to look much stronger through the core of the team. Long way to go yet but a good base developing.

I would agree with that, the penalty miss apart, I was quite encouraged by Sunday's performance, you can see a team materialising in front of your eyes, fingers crossed. 😊

[SickBoy32]

This is a massive myth, 5th most progressive passes per 90 of CMs in the league last season. More than O'Riley, Clarkson, Lennon miller, Connor Barron, Callum McGregor, baningame, O'Hara.

The only defence Newell ever has is these obscure, ultra niche stats 😂

Most of us can see with our eyes his many limitations.

Roll on the end of the Newell era - canny come quick enough!

[BILLYHIBS]

If these players are all playing less forward passes per 90 than Newell then it makes sense they have a higher success rate as a higher proportion will be backwards or sideways.

I would imagine both the Celtic guys would be on the front foot and a higher proportion would be forward passes and more passes as well (IIRC) than Newell and a higher success rate than Newell do not have the actual number of passes to hand as out and about but both were more than Joe as you would expect playing with the Champions

The Hearts boy was a higher percentile success rate but defo fewer passes

Face facts Joe is not that good too many games pass him by

[Fergus52]

The only defence Newell ever has is these obscure, ultra niche stats 😂

Most of us can see with our eyes his many limitations.

Roll on the end of the Newell era - canny come quick enough!

I didn't post that metric to claim he's a brilliant player,

It was in response to a post saying he only passes backwards and sideways which is objectively untrue, especially when comparing him to many of the highly rated centre mids in our league

[SHODAN]

I would play Newell over Campbell but Molotnikov over Newell.

Captain or not, he shouldn't be an automatic first pick.

[Fergus52]

I would imagine both the Celtic guys would be on the front foot and a higher proportion would be forward passes and more passes as well (IIRC) than Newell and a higher success rate than Newell do not have the actual number of passes to hand as out and about but both were more than Joe as you would expect playing with the Champions

The Hearts boy was a higher percentile success rate but defo fewer passes

Face facts Joe is not that good too many games pass him by

As I said earlier, Newell has more progressive (i.e. forward) passes per 90 than either of them


28193

[BILLYHIBS]

As I said earlier, Newell has more progressive (i.e. forward) passes per 90 than either of them


28193

Could you provide a link to your matrice to support this

[MWHIBBIES]

The only defence Newell ever has is these obscure, ultra niche stats 😂

Most of us can see with our eyes his many limitations.

Roll on the end of the Newell era - canny come quick enough!

Forward passes is not a niche stat. It's in response to the nonsense claim he doesn't pass forward, which no one with eyes would possibly claim imo.

Go on, list his many limitations.

[Since90+2]

As I said earlier, Newell has more progressive (i.e. forward) passes per 90 than either of them


28193

I'm not sure how relevant they actually is though. Newell is miles ahead of Matt O'Riley who is a far better and more creative forward thinking midfielder.

Dylan Levit is the 3rd highest in the league and he's been pretty poor.

[Fergus52]

Could you provide a link to your matrice to support this

That graph came from one of the Scottish football analytics guys on twitter, I think "Irving analysis" but I saved it a while ago.


I'm not sure how relevant they actually is though. Newell is miles ahead of Matt O'Riley who is a far better and more creative forward thinking midfielder.

Dylan Levit is the 3rd highest in the league and he's been pretty poor.

Again, I'm not posting this to claim he's some amazing player, or any better overall as a midfielder than some of the players he's ahead of in that metric - I'm posting it to try and refute the myth he only ever passes backwards and sideways.

If someone says he never passes forward, the fact plays more forward passes than the vast majority of starting midfielders in the league is extremely relevant to that discussion.

[Since90+2]

That graph came from one of the Scottish football analytics guys on twitter, I think "Irving analysis" but I saved it a while ago.



Again, I'm not posting this to claim he's some amazing player, or any better overall as a midfielder than some of the players he's ahead of in that metric - I'm posting it to try and refute the myth he only ever passes backwards and sideways.

If someone says he never passes forward, the fact plays more forward passes than the vast majority of starting midfielders in the league is extremely relevant to that discussion.

It only actually matters if the forward passes are making us more creative though. A forward pass can be a simple 2 yard pass that is sometimes easier to play than a sideways ball into space.

When you look at the players at the top, Llundstrom is the highest rated player on the whole thing, miles ahead of Matt O'Riley, but nobody is going to claim he's doing more for the team.

[basehibby]

Newell is recovering from a hernia which, even if minor, is still abdominal surgery.
I therefore don't think Gray will start Newell this weekend unless he absolutely HAS to. The midfield performed well enough at Ibrox and we have options- so Newell will be on the bench vs Motherwell with the intention to give him 20 mins or so to ease him back in.
There is a long season ahead and Newell will absolutely be needed in good condition - as will all the midfield incumbents from Ibrox.

[MWHIBBIES]

Extreme mental gymnastics will be done to discredit Newell sadly.

"Doesn't pass forward enough"
Proof is shown he passes forward a lot
"They're only 2 yard passes, though"

"Not enough assists"
Gets a good amount of assists last season
"Aye, but they're from corners"

"Doesn't show up in big games"
Excellent for us in our European games, and gets many key assists and a few goals in those big games
"Aye, but apart from those ones"


It's a shame. All his biggest fans on here, me especially, admit he has weaknesses, but the amount of crap made up about him is just ridiculous. Never seen anything like it. He's genuinely just never recovered him his bad start here 5 years ago.

[Donegal Hibby]

Newell is recovering from a hernia which, even if minor, is still abdominal surgery.
I therefore don't think Gray will start Newell this weekend unless he absolutely HAS to. The midfield performed well enough at Ibrox and we have options- so Newell will be on the bench vs Motherwell with the intention to give him 20 mins or so to ease him back in.
There is a long season ahead and Newell will absolutely be needed in good condition - as will all the midfield incumbents from Ibrox.

I don’t think Gray will take a chance on him either if he isn’t 100% and will probably be on the bench. The more players we have fit the better, makes us stronger and gives Gray more options.

[Since90+2]

Extreme mental gymnastics will be done to discredit Newell sadly.

"Doesn't pass forward enough"
Proof is shown he passes forward a lot
"They're only 2 yard passes, though"

"Not enough assists"
Gets a good amount of assists last season
"Aye, but they're from corners"

"Doesn't show up in big games"
Excellent for us in our European games, and gets many key assists and a few goals in those big games
"Aye, but apart from those ones"


It's a shame. All his biggest fans on here, me especially, admit he has weaknesses, but the amount of crap made up about him is just ridiculous. Never seen anything like it. He's genuinely just never recovered him his bad start here 5 years ago.

I think it's completely reasonable to question how relevant a stat is in relation to it's impact on the team.

I can't see any correlation between the stat provided and how much a player positively impacts a team.

Dylan Levit is the 3rd highest player in the league in that regard, yet I'd be surprised if anyone actually thought it made any material difference to his performance when you evaluate his impact.

[Fergus52]

It only actually matters if the forward passes are making us more creative though. A forward pass can be a simple 2 yard pass that is sometimes easier to play than a sideways ball into space.

When you look at the players at the top, Llundstrom is the highest rated player on the whole thing, miles ahead of Matt O'Riley, but nobody is going to claim he's doing more for the team.

The progressive pass metric used in that chart has a minimum amount of distance it needs to progress the ball (20 or 30 yards IIRC), to distinguish it from a more simple or safe basic forward pass as you describe.

The players towards the top right of that graph, including Newell, are the best in the league at vertical ball progression.

Matt O'Riley is obviously a much better player than Lundstram, but his role was very different - O'Riley was much more attacking, scoring goals, getting assists and generally playing in the final 3rd, whereas Lundstram played deeper and consistently played more line breaking passes to the forwards.

The point of the metric isn't about who's "doing more for the team" it's about who's the best at progressing the ball through defensive lines - which I posted in response to posters claiming Newell only ever plays it sideways or backwards.

[MWHIBBIES]

I think it's completely reasonable to question how relevant a stat is in relation to it's impact on the team.

I can't see any correlation between the stat provided and how much a player positively impacts a team.

Dylan Levit is the 3rd highest player in the league in that regard, yet I'd be surprised if anyone actually thought it made any material difference to his performance when you evaluate his impact.

No, but no one ever says Levitt doesn't pass forward. It wouldn't be true. So why is it made up about Newell, when it's equally untrue?

[Fergus52]

I think it's completely reasonable to question how relevant a stat is in relation to it's impact on the team.

I can't see any correlation between the stat provided and how much a player positively impacts a team.

Dylan Levit is the 3rd highest player in the league in that regard, yet I'd be surprised if anyone actually thought it made any material difference to his performance when you evaluate his impact.

He was third highest on the x axis but his success rate is way below most other midfielders in the league, so while he's attempting a lot of difficult vertical passes a large number of them aren't coming off.

Levitt's passing has always been pretty good though (which the the graph shows), its other parts of his game which massively let him down.

[Since90+2]

No, but no one ever says Levitt doesn't pass forward. It wouldn't be true. So why is it made up about Newell, when it's equally untrue?

All players get criticised. You don't need to take it personally when Newell does.

It's happened since football began and it will continue to happen. As long as it doesn't stray into real personal abuse and more a critique of a player's ability, I don't see the massive problem with it.

[MWHIBBIES]

All players get criticised. You don't need to take it personally when Newell does.

It's happened since football began and it will continue to happen. As long as it doesn't stray into real personal abuse and more a critique of a player's ability, I don't see the massive problem with it.

I don't take it personally, but thanks.

I'm asking why Newell specifically gets various lies told about him, that's all.

[Pedantic_Hibee]

I don't take it personally, but thanks.

I'm asking why Newell specifically gets various lies told about him, that's all.

Calm down, Joe.

[MWHIBBIES]

Calm down, Joe.

Damn, you really done me with that one.

[Donegal Hibby]

Watched the highlights of their last game and whoever’s playing in midfield somebody’s got to do a good job on Miller ,seems to make them tick .

I see Kettlewell making comparisons to our penalty and the one they give away and asking the question .. why was his player sent off ? . Millers goal shouldn’t have stood either IMO….

https://youtu.be/3OVjgoilj1g?si=_h5lZ6AiHqaqQbLe

[ancient hibee]

The
Newell is recovering from a hernia which, even if minor, is still abdominal surgery.
I therefore don't think Gray will start Newell this weekend unless he absolutely HAS to. The midfield performed well enough at Ibrox and we have options- so Newell will be on the bench vs Motherwell with the intention to give him 20 mins or so to ease him back in.
There is a long season ahead and Newell will absolutely be needed in good condition - as will all the midfield incumbents from Ibrox.
And as he tries to get his fitness back everyone can post that he is disinterested and doesn’t try.:greengrin

[easty]

The only defence Newell ever has is these obscure, ultra niche stats 😂

Most of us can see with our eyes his many limitations.

Roll on the end of the Newell era - canny come quick enough!

Ultra niche stats?

The season before last he was our player of the year, but some posters talk about him like he cannae even play football.

Anyone hoping for an end to the “Newell era” will be disappointed this season when he’ll be playing almost always.

[CapitalGreen]

Ultra niche stats?

The season before last he was our player of the year, but some posters talk about him like he cannae even play football.

Anyone hoping for an end to the “Newell era” will be disappointed this season when he’ll be playing almost always.

I think a lot of people are already pretty disappointed this season given our performances and pitiful points tally. Early indications have been that this season will be much like the last few however there have been some positive signs in the last couple of games.

[J-C]

The Newell debate, we go round and round in circles and this must be the umpteenth thread about him. He's at Hibs for a reason, he's bang average just like 3/4 of the squad, if they he or they were that good he'd be off somewhere else for more dosh. Thing is Newell is OK and nothing more, does the basics alright but doesn't stamp himself on a game, you never walk away from a game and say, wow! Newell was unplayable tonight, you get the odd game when you say that about Boyle, Youan etc, but never Newell and that's where he is, Mr OK with the very odd pretty decent game in him but always just lacks something.

[MWHIBBIES]

The Newell debate, we go round and round in circles and this must be the umpteenth thread about him. He's at Hibs for a reason, he's bang average just like 3/4 of the squad, if they he or they were that good he'd be off somewhere else for more dosh. Thing is Newell is OK and nothing more, does the basics alright but doesn't stamp himself on a game, you never walk away from a game and say, wow! Newell was unplayable tonight, you get the odd game when you say that about Boyle, Youan etc, but never Newell and that's where he is, Mr OK with the very odd pretty decent game in him but always just lacks something.

Don't think I've ever seen so many cliches in one post.

[wookie70]

Newell is recovering from a hernia which, even if minor, is still abdominal surgery.
I therefore don't think Gray will start Newell this weekend unless he absolutely HAS to. The midfield performed well enough at Ibrox and we have options- so Newell will be on the bench vs Motherwell with the intention to give him 20 mins or so to ease him back in.
There is a long season ahead and Newell will absolutely be needed in good condition - as will all the midfield incumbents from Ibrox.


Spoke to Joe tonight and he is back training.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Don't think I've ever seen so many cliches in one post.

:greengrin:

[blackpoolhibs]

The Newell debate, we go round and round in circles and this must be the umpteenth thread about him. He's at Hibs for a reason, he's bang average just like 3/4 of the squad, if they he or they were that good he'd be off somewhere else for more dosh. Thing is Newell is OK and nothing more, does the basics alright but doesn't stamp himself on a game, you never walk away from a game and say, wow! Newell was unplayable tonight, you get the odd game when you say that about Boyle, Youan etc, but never Newell and that's where he is, Mr OK with the very odd pretty decent game in him but always just lacks something.
:top marks

[Libby Hibby]

Like I said previously, I don’t mind him in the team but I’d have O’Hora as captain.

[MWHIBBIES]

Hope he's back soon.

[lugz]

Just a quick reminder that he played the first 4 games of the season, how many did we win? Oh that's right none!! Unbelievable that after this long people still think he would improve us. Him along with many others aren't good enough.

[blackpoolhibs]

:faf:

[Cabbage-Patch]

Hope he's back soon.

Here we go, I knew someone would say it. Joe Newell whilst admittedly a better option than Campbell (not hard) makes no difference to that result today. How many wins did we get when he was in the team this season? None.

[MWHIBBIES]

Here we go, I knew someone would say it. Joe Newell whilst admittedly a better option than Campbell (not hard) makes no difference to that result today. How many wins did we get when he was in the team this season? None.

He's better than Campbell, and Triantis is suspended, so I hope Newell is back soon. Why has that upset people?

[Heisenberg]

He’s a much better option than Campbell in that midfield and there shouldn’t even be a debate about that. Campbell is so far away from being good enough

[supermcginn]

Newell is absolutely miles ahead of Campbell, as are most of the squad.

[LaMotta]

If Campbell starts the next game for us, then I will have lost all faith in David Gray.

An absolutely atrocious performance today including one the worst five minute spells I've seen from a Hibs player. Cost us one goal and nearly cost us a second. Can't pass, cant control the ball, can't track his man, shooting from ridiculous positions.

[NC1875]

Newell is absolutely miles ahead of Campbell, as are most of the squad.

Let me train with the squad for a month and I’d be miles ahead of Campbell. Absolutely terrible footballer and should be nowhere near our squad, never mind starting 11.

And if Gray thinks different, he should be gone asap.

[JohnM1875]

Let me train with the squad for a month and I’d be miles ahead of Campbell. Absolutely terrible footballer and should be nowhere near our squad, never mind starting 11.

And if Gray thinks different, he should be gone asap.

You must be awful, I think I'm better technically than him now and I haven't played fives in about six years.

[NC1875]

You must be awful, I think I'm better technically than him now and I haven't played fives in about six years.

😂 I’m better than him technically, that’s not difficult. The training part was just so I could run!

Unbelievable he starts games for Hibs.

[Nicho87]

Watched Campbell really closely today, he was awful, from running offside, not moving after passing, not to mention the needless foul for their goal

I don’t think he’d get in many teams in the league, to me if that’s the case that’s a concern, if he’s not good enough for the rest he shouldn’t be anywhere near our first eleven.

[JohnM1875]

😂 I’m better than him technically, that’s not difficult. The training part was just so I could run!

Unbelievable he starts games for Hibs.

Actually, you're spot on. I’d absolutely need that month as well!

It's just so glaring obviously he shouldn't be starting. Was shocked he made the starting XI today.

[JohnM1875]

Watched Campbell really closely today, he was awful, from running offside, not moving after passing, not to mention the needless foul for their goal

I don’t think he’d get in many teams in the league, to me if that’s the case that’s a concern, if he’s not good enough for the rest he shouldn’t be anywhere near our first eleven.

Then not properly tracking the player that scored. Awful.

[random sub]

Watched Campbell really closely today, he was awful, from running offside, not moving after passing, not to mention the needless foul for their goal

I don’t think he’d get in many teams in the league, to me if that’s the case that’s a concern, if he’s not good enough for the rest he shouldn’t be anywhere near our first eleven.
What’s the script with Newell’s injury- when is he due back? Thanks for reply

[Nicho87]

Then not properly tracking the player that scored. Awful.

Haha was it actually his man. I must have been crying into my cardboard chips at the goal and here’s me saying I watched him closely.

Says a lot if I never realised it was his man.

[JohnM1875]

Haha was it actually his man. I must have been crying into my cardboard chips at the goal and here’s me saying I watched him closely.

Says a lot if I never realised it was his man.

Oh, it was Campells man alright. So poor

[InvertedFullBak]

Josh Campbell aside from his season where he scored a decent amount of goals has been totally ineffective playing for Hibs. He offers nothing and we could be here all day discussing what his best position actually is.

he along with Cadden , miller , Newell , Boyle and a good few others have been tried , tested and failed playing for Hibs.

[MWHIBBIES]

Josh Campbell aside from his season where he scored a decent amount of goals has been totally ineffective playing for Hibs. He offers nothing and we could be here all day discussing what his best position actually is.

he along with Cadden , miller , Newell , Boyle and a good few others have been tried , tested and failed playing for Hibs.

Boyle a failure? Are you okay?

[supermcginn]

Let me train with the squad for a month and I’d be miles ahead of Campbell. Absolutely terrible footballer and should be nowhere near our squad, never mind starting 11.

And if Gray thinks different, he should be gone asap.

I've said for the last 3 seasons he's the worst player in the squad ability wise, it's infuriating watching him and even more annoying Gray seems to rate him.

[InvertedFullBak]

Boyle a failure? Are you okay?

Perfectly ok thank you very much.

[MWHIBBIES]

Perfectly ok thank you very much.

How on earth has Martin Boyle been a failure at Hibs? Some poor trolling that.

[InvertedFullBak]

How on earth has Martin Boyle been a failure at Hibs? Some poor trolling that.


:troll:

[BoomtownHibees]

:troll:

I reckon it’s you being the troll if you reckon Boyle has been a failure at Hibs

[InvertedFullBak]

I reckon it’s you being the troll if you reckon Boyle has been a failure at Hibs

Not trolling in the slightest. Just must my opinion.

[BoomtownHibees]

Not trolling in the slightest. Just must my opinion.

Having an opinion is fine but that one is bollocks

[InvertedFullBak]

Having an opinion is fine but that one is bollocks

That’s your opinion and that’s fine.

[blackpoolhibs]

Even i'd prefer Newell over Campbell.

[MikeyS]

Watched Campbell really closely today, he was awful, from running offside, not moving after passing, not to mention the needless foul for their goal

I don’t think he’d get in many teams in the league, to me if that’s the case that’s a concern, if he’s not good enough for the rest he shouldn’t be anywhere near our first eleven.

He really does leave you yearning for a Brian Hamilton, a Billy Findlay, a Brian Grant, a Jarko Wiss or even a Brian Kerr! If he hadn't have got that contract extension he'd be a PT at a gym playing part time in league 2 right now

[MWHIBBIES]

Not trolling in the slightest. Just must my opinion.

Good player and Scottish cup winner at Hibs. It's just incorrect to say he's a failure. No hiding behind the opinion card.

[cameronw-hfc]

Perfectly ok thank you very much.


If you think he's been a failure then I'd hate to see what your criteria is. Won a trophy, a promotion, sealed a big money move and lots of international caps whilst at hibs, I'm pretty sure this is pushing the factually wrong category as he's just not been a failure, no matter how you look at it really.

[InvertedFullBak]

Good player and Scottish cup winner at Hibs. It's just incorrect to say he's a failure. No hiding behind the opinion card.


We all use the opinion card. You use it when you go on about Joe newell.

[MWHIBBIES]

We all use the opinion card. You use it when you go on about Joe newell.

At least my opinions are somewhat based in reality.

If Boyles a failure, I assume you think Lewis is the only successful Hibs player since the 50s? More than one trophy must be required.

[Hiber-nation]

Not trolling in the slightest. Just must my opinion.

You might want to check his stats and retract your ridiculous opinion.

[Donegal Hibby]

Oh, it was Campells man alright. So poor

Thought he done alright in the first half and didn’t mind the foul he done for the booking though did switch off at the goal which Kwon did too for the other one I think …

Sensibly taking Campbell off when on a yellow though didn’t think Rudi made much of an impact for the few that wanted him on TBH .

[Tyler Durden]

Thought he done alright in the first half and didn’t mind the foul he done for the booking though did switch off at the goal which Kwon did too for the other one I think …

Sensibly taking Campbell off when on a yellow though didn’t think Rudi made much of an impact for the few that wanted him on TBH .

Didn’t mind the foul? It stemmed from Campbell not being able to protect the ball for starters. The Well player is then moving towards Triantis and Kwon and our entire back 4. So it was not a particularly threatening position and no need for Campbell to make the foul.

His yellow card wouldn’t have had anything to do with his subbing. He was removed because he was awful. Lost his man a second time at a later free kick also and could have conceded a pen.

Horror show

[LaMotta]

Not trolling in the slightest. Just must my opinion.

That's like that you claiming the sky is bright green, and saying that's your opinion so its ok, even though it's blatantly wrong.

[LaMotta]

Didn’t mind the foul? It stemmed from Campbell not being able to protect the ball for starters. The Well player is then moving towards Triantis and Kwon and our entire back 4. So it was not a particularly threatening position and no need for Campbell to make the foul.

His yellow card wouldn’t have had anything to do with his subbing. He was removed because he was awful. Lost his man a second time at a later free kick also and could have conceded a pen.

Horror show

Spot on.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Didn’t mind the foul? It stemmed from Campbell not being able to protect the ball for starters. The Well player is then moving towards Triantis and Kwon and our entire back 4. So it was not a particularly threatening position and no need for Campbell to make the foul.

His yellow card wouldn’t have had anything to do with his subbing. He was removed because he was awful. Lost his man a second time at a later free kick also and could have conceded a pen.

Horror show

:agree:

[JohnM1875]

Didn’t mind the foul? It stemmed from Campbell not being able to protect the ball for starters. The Well player is then moving towards Triantis and Kwon and our entire back 4. So it was not a particularly threatening position and no need for Campbell to make the foul.

His yellow card wouldn’t have had anything to do with his subbing. He was removed because he was awful. Lost his man a second time at a later free kick also and could have conceded a pen.

Horror show

Correct

[GreenCastle]

Just saw he highlights and Campbell lucky not to give away a pen from a free kick with a shirt pull - was pretty obvious - Well played missed the chance but could have easily have been brought back.

[Shrekko]

Thought he done alright in the first half and didn’t mind the foul he done for the booking though did switch off at the goal which Kwon did too for the other one I think …

Sensibly taking Campbell off when on a yellow though didn’t think Rudi made much of an impact for the few that wanted him on TBH .

Your consistent glass half full comments on Campbell are admirable but I think it’s dawned on most people that he is nowhere near what’s required.

The fact Gray rates him so highly is quite frankly terrifying.

[Murphys Touch]

Your consistent glass half full comments on Campbell are admirable but I think it’s dawned on most people that he is nowhere near what’s required.

The fact Gray rates him so highly is quite frankly terrifying.

He’s no where near back up…never mind required. A coward of a footballer. Can’t pass, tackle and hides.

You are right about Gray. One of the “positive” spins for him getting the job is that he will have “seen the mistakes others made”. Well he’s making the same ones

[NC1875]

Thought he done alright in the first half and didn’t mind the foul he done for the booking though did switch off at the goal which Kwon did too for the other one I think …

Sensibly taking Campbell off when on a yellow though didn’t think Rudi made much of an impact for the few that wanted him on TBH .

Your eyes must be painted on!

I don’t know what games you watch honestly. Josh Campbell wouldn’t get a game for Dunfermline. And if Gray persists with him he’ll be gone before Xmas.

[Donegal Hibby]

He’s no where near back up…never mind required. A coward of a footballer. Can’t pass, tackle and hides.

You are right about Gray. One of the “positive” spins for him getting the job is that he will have “seen the mistakes others made”. Well he’s making the same ones

Coward of a footballer? :faf:

[lyonhibs]

Your consistent glass half full comments on Campbell are admirable but I think it’s dawned on most people that he is nowhere near what’s required.

The fact Gray rates him so highly is quite frankly terrifying.

That Josh Campbell does not have what it takes to be a starter in a team with any aspirations for top 4 has been blatantly obvious from day 1.

[BILLYHIBS]

He’s no where near back up…never mind required. A coward of a footballer. Can’t pass, tackle and hides.

You are right about Gray. One of the “positive” spins for him getting the job is that he will have “seen the mistakes others made”. Well he’s making the same ones

Don’t think he is a ‘ coward ‘ per se

Always gives 100% have never seen him shirk a tackle I just think he is not very good and nowhere near what we need

As you say cannae pass or tackle cannot control a ball cannot do the basics a miracle he even became a professional footballer imo and a major worry SDG rates him so highly

‘Hides’ I think he runs about chasing shadows and has no concept or awareness of what is happening around about him you can tell by the amount of daft counter productive and unnecessary things he does ( giving the ball away cardinal sin crashing into tackles ) He is not effective and would struggle to get into any other team in our league in fact he is regressing

He hides no more than others I can think of

Has a good engine can get up and down the pitch his knack of scoring important goals has deserted him one attempt yesterday from outside the box first half was pathetic but he was not alone

Was surprised he appeared for the second half yesterday he was that bad

[blackpoolhibs]

It's getting to the stage I'm thinking JDH might be the answer.

[J-C]

It's getting to the stage I'm thinking JDH might be the answer.

Hush your mouth.

[hibee-boys]

It's getting to the stage I'm thinking JDH might be the answer.

I’d have MVG in before Campbell.

[Murphys Touch]

Coward of a footballer? :faf:

Yes coward - if he thinks being fit to run about is what it takes and clattering into people at the wrong time is what make him get over his faults then it’s the cowards option. Mistake happen - but he is dire more than the majority of the time on the very basics of football

Being brave is about battling through, doing the right thing, working on your faults and getting the basics right 99% regardless of what others think/want you to be. And certainly not hiding. Can accept bad games but be better tactically and help your team. A Stuart Lovell if you like

I see the complete opposite and body language of someone that is way ahead of his station.

Said for years - we are where we are because Josh Campbell is the standard which is deemed acceptable both on the pitch and by some in the stands.

Harsh but true

[Unseen work]

I just can’t believe we’ve not signed a ‘number 10’ type of player.

We really miss the quality of an attacking player who can receive it on the half turn, beat a man or thread a pass. Someone that finds pockets of space or everything goes through.

Not had one in years and I think it makes it very easy for the opposition.

What I’d do for a prime Scott Allan, Zemmama etc back

[Heisenberg]

Thought he done alright in the first half and didn’t mind the foul he done for the booking though did switch off at the goal which Kwon did too for the other one I think …

Sensibly taking Campbell off when on a yellow though didn’t think Rudi made much of an impact for the few that wanted him on TBH .

Yesterday we saw exactly what people were telling you we’d see of Campbell. He was fine at Ibrox because all he had to do was run about a lot. Yesterday when we saw more of the ball he was absolutely hopeless and was the sole reason we went a goal down. Gray continuing to pick him is baffling.

[JimBHibees]

Yes coward - if he thinks being fit to run about is what it takes and clattering into people at the wrong time is what make him get over his faults then it’s the cowards option. Mistake happen - but he is dire more than the majority of the time on the very basics of football

Being brave is about battling through, doing the right thing, working on your faults and getting the basics right 99% regardless of what others think/want you to be. And certainly not hiding. Can accept bad games but be better tactically and help your team. A Stuart Lovell if you like

I see the complete opposite and body language of someone that is way ahead of his station.

Said for years - we are where we are because Josh Campbell is the standard which is deemed acceptable both on the pitch and by some in the stands.

Harsh but true

Wow. That’s a shocker

[Coco Bryce]

Yes coward - if he thinks being fit to run about is what it takes and clattering into people at the wrong time is what make him get over his faults then it’s the cowards option. Mistake happen - but he is dire more than the majority of the time on the very basics of football

Being brave is about battling through, doing the right thing, working on your faults and getting the basics right 99% regardless of what others think/want you to be. And certainly not hiding. Can accept bad games but be better tactically and help your team. A Stuart Lovell if you like

I see the complete opposite and body language of someone that is way ahead of his station.

Said for years - we are where we are because Josh Campbell is the standard which is deemed acceptable both on the pitch and by some in the stands.

Harsh but true

Don't think he's a coward but he is an extremely awful footballer.

Wouldn't get a game for any other team in our league.

[Bostonhibby]

It's getting to the stage I'm thinking JDH might be the answer.What was the question though?[emoji6]

Sent from my SM-A750FN using Tapatalk

[hibsbollah]

Don’t think he is a ‘ coward ‘ per se

Always gives 100% have never seen him shirk a tackle I just think he is not very good and nowhere near what we need

As you say cannae pass or tackle cannot control a ball cannot do the basics a miracle he even became a professional footballer imo and a major worry SDG rates him so highly

‘Hides’ I think he runs about chasing shadows and has no concept or awareness of what is happening around about him you can tell by the amount of daft counter productive and unnecessary things he does ( giving the ball away cardinal sin crashing into tackles ) He is not effective and would struggle to get into any other team in our league in fact he is regressing

He hides no more than others I can think of

Has a good engine can get up and down the pitch his knack of scoring important goals has deserted him one attempt yesterday from outside the box first half was pathetic but he was not alone

Was surprised he appeared for the second half yesterday he was that bad

The most accurate and balanced contribution ive read on Campbell so far. Yet snother ‘squad player who can contribute occasionally off the bench’, not really what we need.

[Exuberance1875]

Hope he's back soon.

Aye worked out well tbh

[The Tubs]

Although I disagreed with the booking, Newell got sent off as a result of trying to take too many touches.

[Jones28]

If he doesn’t take that rotten touch he doesn’t get sent off and we win that game. Just humpty.

[NC1875]

If he doesn’t take that rotten touch he doesn’t get sent off and we win that game. Justl.

He takes as many touches as needed until he sees that easy backwards/sideways pass.

Loser who’s been made captain for some mental reason.

One of many mistakes by Gray.

[Willis1875]

He doesn’t have to look too far to seek advice from the last guy to captain us to relegation

[MWHIBBIES]

Aye worked out well tbh

Daft 2nd booking.

We were quite comfortable until then.

[Alfred E Newman]

Newell is supposedly our best player.
I rest my case m’lud.