Our next centre half pairing

[RIP]

With Paul Hanlon we 'grew our own' into a position he held since Rob Jones left. For a while he partnered another home-grown product in Ryan Porteous.

On the basis that we now only have one centre half in Rocky Bushiri, who are we going to sign to improve on Paul Hanlon?

[Unseen work]

Jason Kerr and Stuart Findlay

[JohnM1875]

Jason Kerr and Stuart Findlay

Get it done, Hibs

[easty]

Jason Kerr and Stuart Findlay

Would take that.

100% we need 2 starting centre halfs in for next season. I’d also rather resign Hanlon for another year and empty Rocky, as backup.

[The Spaceman]

Jason Kerr would be top of my list this summer in general. We desperately need a rock of a CB who is proven quality up here and he is that player. Get him, another good CB and a new GK and we’d already be a completely different side.

[04Sauzee]

Jason Kerr and Stuart Findlay

Stuart Findlay was always a shout. Bizarrely my memory of Jason Kerr isn't that great, obviously played in a decent St J team. Did he not mostly play in a 3 with Gordon in the middle and McCart LCB? Can he play in 4. Can't mind if he's pacy , a ball payer or what type of defender he is.

[B.H.F.C]

Whoever it is it should be completely new.

[bingo70]

Owen Bevan and Loris Mouyokolo

[Donegal Hibby]

Owen Bevan and Loris Mouyokolo

I think it wouldn't be a surprise if we did go for Owen Bevan again

[InvertedFullBak]

If Rocky starts our first game of next season then we all need to pack up and go home.

He isn’t the answer and will never be the answer.

[Libby Hibby]

Jason Kerr and make him skipper.

Study Findlay is a good shout and Rocky as back up is decent enough.

[MWHIBBIES]

If Rocky starts our first game of next season then we all need to pack up and go home.

He isn’t the answer and will never be the answer.

Our first game will be against some diddies like Spartans in the league cup. I'd imagine he will start and stroll it.

[InvertedFullBak]

Our first game will be against some diddies like Spartans in the league cup. I'd imagine he will start and stroll it.

If he does start and he has a shocker then the pressure is on from the get go.

[CapitalGreen]

Our first game will be against some diddies like Spartans in the league cup. I'd imagine he will start and stroll it.

Having watched him put in a horror show of a performance against Edinburgh City last summer I wouldn’t be putting any money on that.

[GreenCastle]

Findlay out of contract.

Someone mentioned Stephen Welsh from Celtic ?

Kerr - think he will definitely have a few options..and Maloney was saying he wants to keep him but would need a pay cut to stay at Wigan.

[MWHIBBIES]

If he does start and he has a shocker then the pressure is on from the get go.

If our new centre back starts and has a shocker, the pressure would also be on from the get go.

[InvertedFullBak]

If our new centre back starts and has a shocker, the pressure would also be on from the get go.

Yes but he will get time. Rocky having another Rocky moment won’t be anything new.

[.Sean.]

Owen Bevan and Loris Mouyokolo
Who’s he?

[chippy]

Would take that.

100% we need 2 starting centre halfs in for next season. I’d also rather resign Hanlon for another year and empty Rocky, as backup.

Agreed

[RIP]

Are the same people who would be happy to see the back of Bushiri, the same people who thought that Hanlon was past his sell by date?

This is Hibs.net. The Invisible Men that we are going to sign this summer are going to be a lot better than the players we have.

How often does that ever happen?

[Crab apple]

I've been really critical of our defence and our failure to strengthen in January. Seeing as David Gray managed to improve things and have us more organised in one game makes me think how significant Monty's role has been in our poor defensive form this year.

[PHeffernan]

Findlay out of contract.

Someone mentioned Stephen Welsh from Celtic ?

Kerr - think he will definitely have a few options..and Maloney was saying he wants to keep him but would need a pay cut to stay at Wigan.

Afraid not, Findlay is contracted for another 2 years but his club was promoted to the English Championship today so will probably be happy to move him on for circa £200k

[04Sauzee]

Owen Bevan and Loris Mouyokolo

Tell me more about Loris Mouyokolo 😁

[Paul1642]

Are the same people who would be happy to see the back of Bushiri, the same people who thought that Hanlon was past his sell by date?

This is Hibs.net. The Invisible Men that we are going to sign this summer are going to be a lot better than the players we have.

How often does that ever happen?

Love Hanlon but he IS past it in being good enough for a team targeting top 3 and silverware. I don’t dislike Rocky but the same applies in terms of ability rather than age.

Defence flipped from being our strongest area to our weakest pretty fast in recent years.

Depending on how many we score tomorrow our goals scored will be somewhere between 3rd and 5th most in the league.

Our goals conceded will be the 9th worst in the league.

Anyone who’s watched Hibs this season could quickly conclude that our defence is the main factor is costing us a good season, and for those who care more about stats, it’s backed up by them.

Coaching and tactics obviously take their share of the blame but individual errors and general poor defence have cost us.

Whist many of us still think that as individuals members of the defence could still do a job, it’s clear that as a collective the defence needs to change a lot.

Marshall, Hanlon and Stevenson are confirmed away so that’s a 50% change. I would also argue that if Rocky stays he should be 3rd choice at best, preferably 4th as injuries are inevitable, and whoever we sign to replace Stevenson should be competing with Obita for our best LB rather than a natural 2nd choice. I would be keen to sign Fish permanently but I wouldn’t break the bank and wouldn’t take him on just another loan. We’re suffering slightly due to him still developing and should only be doing that if we reap the benefits of the finished product.

With a pre season at the club Megwa could find himself a regular starter in the way that Doig did unexpectedly at a similar age. I’d imagine Cadden is a sure thing to stay but I actually prefer Miller.

We have the money to buy players who are bette than those being replaced and in all honesty it shouldn’t be hard because our defensive record really shouldn’t be hard to beat.

[stokesmessiah]

Would take that.

100% we need 2 starting centre halfs in for next season. I’d also rather resign Hanlon for another year and empty Rocky, as backup.

Honestly, would rather we signed 3 starting centre half’s…rocky is not good enough to fill in and for once we need some competition in there.

[RIP]

Love Hanlon but he IS past it in being good enough for a team targeting top 3 and silverware. I don’t dislike Rocky but the same applies in terms of ability rather than age.

Defence flipped from being our strongest area to our weakest pretty fast in recent years.

Depending on how many we score tomorrow our goals scored will be somewhere between 3rd and 5th most in the league.

Our goals conceded will be the 9th worst in the league.

Anyone who’s watched Hibs this season could quickly conclude that our defence is the main factor is costing us a good season, and for those who care more about stats, it’s backed up by them.

Coaching and tactics obviously take their share of the blame but individual errors and general poor defence have cost us.

Whist many of us still think that as individuals members of the defence could still do a job, it’s clear that as a collective the defence needs to change a lot.

Marshall, Hanlon and Stevenson are confirmed away so that’s a 50% change. I would also argue that if Rocky stays he should be 3rd choice at best, preferably 4th as injuries are inevitable, and whoever we sign to replace Stevenson should be competing with Obita for our best LB rather than a natural 2nd choice. I would be keen to sign Fish permanently but I wouldn’t break the bank and wouldn’t take him on just another loan. We’re suffering slightly due to him still developing and should only be doing that if we reap the benefits of the finished product.

With a pre season at the club Megwa could find himself a regular starter in the way that Doig did unexpectedly at a similar age. I’d imagine Cadden is a sure thing to stay but I actually prefer Miller.

We have the money to buy players who are bette than those being replaced and in all honesty it shouldn’t be hard because our defensive record really shouldn’t be hard to beat.

Having the money to buy players? Remember that we posted a big loss in the last financial year and the bulk of the BK funding will be invested in infrastructure.

The biggest challenge we face with signings is the same one we have had in the last five transfer windows. Players of quality are unwilling to sign for a managerless club with such a poor finishing position in an unpopular league and a disastrous record for managerial and player churn.

We supporters need to wake up and smell the coffee. We rarely sign players near the top of our shopping list.

[Paul1642]

Having the money to buy players? Remember that we posted a big loss in the last financial year and the bulk of the BK funding will be invested in infrastructure.

The biggest challenge we face with signings is the same one we have had in the last five transfer windows. Players of quality are unwilling to sign for a managerless club with such a poor finishing position in an unpopular league and a disastrous record for managerial and player churn.

We supporters need to wake up and smell the coffee. We rarely sign players near the top of our shopping list.

We are going to have whatever money would have had to spend prior to the BK deal, plus a couple of million extra IMO. The chat at the time was 6 million split 50/50 on infrastructure and playing squad. The BK are clearly a smart bunch who know that we need European Group stage football to make good money and they aren’t going to spend only on infrastructure to then not invest what’s needed on the park to give us a good shot at getting there. Why would they?

As for players, we will have a manger in when the window opens. Minus European football (hopefully for one season only) our pulling power is a big as ever, not to mention a good loan deal or two from Bournemouth freeing up even more money for other positions.

[Smartie]

Having the money to buy players? Remember that we posted a big loss in the last financial year and the bulk of the BK funding will be invested in infrastructure.

The biggest challenge we face with signings is the same one we have had in the last five transfer windows. Players of quality are unwilling to sign for a managerless club with such a poor finishing position in an unpopular league and a disastrous record for managerial and player churn.

We supporters need to wake up and smell the coffee. We rarely sign players near the top of our shopping list.

The fact that we’ve brought in so much dross in recent years (some of it reasonably costly and reasonably reputable) is partly why I’m a bit wary of seeing so many experienced and reliable players walk out the door.

Marshall, Hanlon, Stevenson, ALF - these are the guys in our squad that we know what to expect from.

We’re going to be left with the inconsistent lot and the shiny new objects. It’s got the potential to make a big improvement, for sure, but it’s also got the potential to go quite spectacularly wrong.

[Greensunshine]

Rocky cannot be part of a starting eleven. We need two new goalkeepers and two new CH’s along with a new midfield and a new forward line.

By my estimation that means we’re up **** creek without a paddle because there’s just no way all that will happen.

…..or could it? 😜

[bingo70]

Who’s he?

L’orient defender that appears to be in our price range.

Completely made up rumour by me.

[1875M]

Jason Kerr would be excellent business. Would also take Charles Dunne from St Mirren who’s out of contract. We need at least 2 new centre backs who will start for us. Get them and a decent keeper and our team already looks a lot better.

[fiolex1]

Findlay out of contract.

Someone mentioned Stephen Welsh from Celtic ?

Kerr - think he will definitely have a few options..and Maloney was saying he wants to keep him but would need a pay cut to stay at Wigan.

Jason not going to take Wigan offer, but is looking for £7k a week. Think he’ll be out of our price range

[easty]

Are the same people who would be happy to see the back of Bushiri, the same people who thought that Hanlon was past his sell by date?



Not me. I've been saying since forever that Hanlon is a far better player than Rocky. Rocky was ***** when he was here on loan. We should never have signed him on a permanent deal, and he's been ***** since we did.

[Donegal Hibby]

Not me. I've been saying since forever that Hanlon is a far better player than Rocky. Rocky was ***** when he was here on loan. We should never have signed him on a permanent deal, and he's been ***** since we did.

I'm sorry again I have to disagree with you in I don't think Rocky has been entirely bad . Thought he was improving before he got injured and had some good games when he came back from international duty . He does make mistakes and has been inconsistent this season though tell me one player apart from Maolida maybe who hasn't in our team this season?.

[Blaster]

I'm sorry again I have to disagree with you in I don't think Rocky has been entirely bad . Thought he was improving before he got injured and had some good games when he came back from international duty . He does make mistakes and has been inconsistent this season though tell me one player apart from Maolida maybe who hasn't in our team this season?.

He’s a centre half who can’t header a ball. The main requirement of a centre half. The only one I’ve seen nutmeg himself with his own header. Twice!
He’s simply not good enough and unfortunately never will be

[easty]

I'm sorry again I have to disagree with you in I don't think Rocky has been entirely bad . Thought he was improving before he got injured and had some good games when he came back from international duty . He does make mistakes and has been inconsistent this season though tell me one player apart from Maolida maybe who hasn't in our team this season?.

His defensive positioning is poor and he's terrible at judging a header. I don't think that his physicality and athleticism make up for that. You can rate him all you want, I dinnae.

I feel very similarly about Lewis Miller. Physically and athletically he's exactly what you'd want in defence. Doesn't have the football brain to be good enough though.

Just in my opinion, of course.

[JammyDoidger]

Not me. I've been saying since forever that Hanlon is a far better player than Rocky. Rocky was ***** when he was here on loan. We should never have signed him on a permanent deal, and he's been ***** since we did.

He wouldn't start for livi, he's nowhere near good enough to be a Hibs player.

[Greensunshine]

[QUOTE=RIP;7664610]Are the same people who would be happy to see the back of Bushiri, the same people who thought that Hanlon was past his sell by date?

Guilty as charged. No room for sentiment with Paul I’m afraid and Rocky is an absolute bomb scare!

Are you telling me you’d be happy to see Rocky at the heart of our defence next season ?

Not for me. We need better quality if we’re to get third spot or maybe your happy us scratching about bottom six.

[Donegal Hibby]

His defensive positioning is poor and he's terrible at judging a header. I don't think that his physicality and athleticism make up for that. You can rate him all you want, I dinnae.

I feel very similarly about Lewis Miller. Physically and athletically he's exactly what you'd want in defence. Doesn't have the football brain to be good enough though.

Just in my opinion, of course.

Your totally entitled to your opinion mate .

I do agree that his heading is poor which is something he will need to work on no doubt.

His physicality and athleticism is his strengths.

As to his defensive positioning he's being played at LCB which isn't his preferred position I'd say , he's also like our other CH in he's been getting dragged out wide regularly due to us having fullbacks that go rampaging forward and forgetting about their defensive duties.

I thought this was possibly down to our previous manager not having the right players though when you seen how organised we were against Motherwell at the back it was clearly night and day and the reason we kept a clean sheet in a game Rocky played well in too btw 👍

[MWHIBBIES]

Jason not going to take Wigan offer, but is looking for £7k a week. Think he’ll be out of our price range

That's not out of our price range if we want him.

[Smartie]

That's not out of our price range if we want him.

We could probably cover that amount by shipping out a dozen or so off the fringe of our squad who are unlikely to ever make a single positive contribution to our first team.

[MWHIBBIES]

We could probably cover that amount by shipping out a dozen or so off the fringe of our squad who are unlikely to ever make a single positive contribution to our first team.

We'll have covered that and then some by losing Lewis, Hanlon, ALF and hopefully, Marshall. Probably about 3x that on those guys.

[Col2]

Findlay out of contract.

Someone mentioned Stephen Welsh from Celtic ?

Kerr - think he will definitely have a few options..and Maloney was saying he wants to keep him but would need a pay cut to stay at Wigan.

Welsh is on a long term contract with Celtic but may struggle to start. A season long loan to us would be a good move.

[erin go bragh]

Jason not going to take Wigan offer, but is looking for £7k a week. Think he’ll be out of our price range

ALF was allegedly on more, so if true, Kerr will be no problem at that wage.

[JohnM1875]

ALF was allegedly on more, so if true, Kerr will be no problem at that wage.

Can I ask what that’s based on?

An EEN article came out not long after we signed ALF saying he was on £15k here. It was later explained, I think by Pat McPartlin, they’d ****ed up and took the fee from FM, where there’d been a glitch and it directly transferred over his 15k Australian dollars and he was on nowhere near that here.

I’d be surprised if he was on a high wage at Hibs.

[Paulie Walnuts]

That's not out of our price range if we want him.

Yup. We can comfortably pay that now. Whether we want to pay it for Jason Kerr is obviously up for debate, but if we want to pay someone £7k then we absolutely can/already do.

[fiolex1]

ALF was allegedly on more, so if true, Kerr will be no problem at that wage.

Really, we are paying a 37 yr old over £7k a week to sit on the bench. Wow!

[Gettin' Auld]

He’s a centre half who can’t header a ball. The main requirement of a centre half. The only one I’ve seen nutmeg himself with his own header. Twice!
He’s simply not good enough and unfortunately never will be

:faf: If we didn't laugh, we'd cry.

[blackpoolhibs]

I'd give Hanlon another year, but i'd hope we were in the process of bringing in 2 better central defenders than Hanlon and Rocky.

If Rocky wants to go then fine, if we get money for him even better, but he cant be a starter for us going forward.

Get the spine of the team right, stop conceding so many goals and watch our results improve.

[Coach Jon]

Not me. I've been saying since forever that Hanlon is a far better player than Rocky. Rocky was ***** when he was here on loan. We should never have signed him on a permanent deal, and he's been ***** since we did.

Your missing the point, its not a question of who is the better of the two, they are both sub standard and have weaknesses, the main one being ability to clear crosses, every coach in Scottish football can see this is a major weakness, has been for years with Hibs and we havent addressed the problem.

[easty]

Your missing the point, its not a question of who is the better of the two, they are both sub standard and have weaknesses, the main one being ability to clear crosses, every coach in Scottish football can see this is a major weakness, has been for years with Hibs and we havent addressed the problem.

Yeah, and I said already on this thread I want 2 new centre halfs, but I’d rather have Hanlon as back up than have Rocky.

[Unseen work]

Pretty sure the ALF rumours are nonsense based on Football Manager.

[InvertedFullBak]

Pretty sure the ALF rumours are nonsense based on Football Manager.

Aye there is a boy on twitter who has been given the “ job “ of doing all the stats for both Hibs and Hibs ladies first team and he whacked ALF on a whopping £15,000 a week.

Couldn’t make that up if you tried.

[BoomtownHibees]

Aye there is a boy on twitter who has been given the “ job “ of doing all the stats for both Hibs and Hibs ladies first team and he whacked ALF on a whopping £15,000 a week.

Couldn’t make that up if you tried.

It was translated from his wage in Australia I think. Or not in this case. Think the story was that he was on 15000 Aus Dollars

[Greenbeard]

Welsh is on a long term contract with Celtic but may struggle to start. A season long loan to us would be a good move.
They were talking about this on the radio yesterday - Welsh is apparently due to drop further down the pecking order at the Tic if they sign another CB to go with CCV and Scales so the suggestion was he needs a loan so he is starting each week in order to develop. Mikey Stewart said a loan to Hibs would be a good move for both parties.

[TrinityHibby]

If Rocky starts our first game of next season then we all need to pack up and go home.

He isn’t the answer and will never be the answer.

I completely agree with you 😔……I genuinely think Hibs are hoping he manages to string a few decent performances together and some cash rich English team will make an offer for him

[Scouse Hibee]

Loan and Loan

And then back to the drawing board again!

[Paul1642]

Fish seems to be completely forgotten about. It wouldn’t surprise me if we sign him permanently which I would be quite happy with.

[SeanWilson]

Our first game will be against some diddies like Spartans in the league cup. I'd imagine he will start and stroll it.

‘Diddies like Spartans’ would give us a game every week just now.

[Smartie]

Fish seems to be completely forgotten about. It wouldn’t surprise me if we sign him permanently which I would be quite happy with.

I'd have fully agreed not so long ago.

He's not had a great season, which I've struggled to get my head around as he was good for half a season the year before.

I still think he and we would have been better off if we'd accepted him and Hanlon as a first choice pairing and played them every week...

[MWHIBBIES]

‘Diddies like Spartans’ would give us a game every week just now.

They wouldnt, no. Wed win 4 or 5.

[JimBHibees]

Welsh is on a long term contract with Celtic but may struggle to start. A season long loan to us would be a good move.

Don’t think Welsh is that good personally quite injury prone too

[Brightside]

They wouldnt, no. Wed win 4 or 5.

eh? Did you watch them play against Hearts?

[MWHIBBIES]

eh? Did you watch them play against Hearts?

Why would I do that? I'm sure I'd have heard if they'd won.

They are a part time league 2 side. We'd win by 4 or 5.

[Brightside]

Why would I do that? I'm sure I'd have heard if they'd won.

They are a part time league 2 side. We'd win by 4 or 5.

Most Hibs fans at the Forfar game watched the game before our game kicked off. There is nothing to suggest we would beat them by 4 or 5 when we only beat Forfar 1-0 (who are below them in the league). I never know if you are actually just at it on here now.

[MWHIBBIES]

Most Hibs fans at the Forfar game watched the game before our game kicked off. There is nothing to suggest we would be them be 4 or 5 when we only beat Forfar 1-0 (who are below them in the league). I never know if you are actually just at it on here now.

I was also at Forfar, an awful day for us and we still won.

Not at it at all. Thinking we'd struggle vs league 2 opposition is trolling.

[Exuberance1875]

Fish and Kerr

[Tha Cabbage Kid]

Liam cooper and ben gibson :wink:

and or jason kerr

[Paul1642]

Fish and Kerr

Yes please

[04Sauzee]

Liam cooper and ben gibson :wink:

and or jason kerr
Ben Gibson would be more than decent but can't believe he wouldn't have good offers in the championship on wages we couldn't compete with.

[truehibernian]

Be good if we could move Rocky on, he’s not going to improve as a defender and we need much more accomplished central defenders next season - if he’s a starter next season then it’ll be much of the same I’m afraid.

[flash]

‘Diddies like Spartans’ would give us a game every week just now.

Well they gave Hertz a game so that's hardly surprising.

[sauzeelegod]

I’d like to see us line up in a back 3 next season.

[AllyT]

I’d like to see us line up in a back 3 next season.

Agreed, especially when playing 2 wing backs. 3 at the back will tighten up the goals against I think. Need 3 decent CBs with a couple back ups though.

[CapitalGreen]

It’ll be Rocky + another and we’ll still be absolutely s***e defensively.

[easty]

It’ll be Rocky + another and we’ll still be absolutely s***e defensively.

If Rockys playing we’ll leak goals. Simple as that.

[Brightside]

Hanlon and Knight.

[Bridge hibs]

Hanlon and Knight.

Josh Knight from Peterborough ?

[Unseen work]

I’d be stunned if Bevan isn’t back here next season

[theonlywayisup]

Defence flipped from being our strongest area to our weakest pretty fast in recent years.



Yes, but the midfield offer zero protection.

I recall a few seasons ago saying the same thing, but we resolved it by signing Gogic. We need something similar again. Obviously, we need to sign better defenders too, but it's wasted effort if we don't bolster the engine room.

[MWHIBBIES]

Yes, but the midfield offer zero protection.

I recall a few seasons ago saying the same thing, but we resolved it by signing Gogic. We need something similar again. Obviously, we need to sign better defenders too, but it's wasted effort if we don't bolster the engine room.

The forwards offer the midfield zero protection ever tbh. We're so easy to play through.

[truehibernian]

If Rockys playing we’ll leak goals. Simple as that.

Agreed, he should be moved on - he’s very much a weak link in there.

[Brightside]

Josh Knight from Peterborough ?

Yeh - like him a lot. Probably got offers down south tho.

[easty]

I’d be stunned if Bevan isn’t back here next season

Me too, but if he's brought in as anything other than a squad option then we're expecting too much from him.

The guys no kicked a ball in a first team game since the 9th December, spent the first half of last season on loan in League 1, played 14 and won 2.

Season before he spent the season at Yeovil in the National League. Played 31 times. They came 3rd bottom of the league.

He might turn out to be quality, but we better be looking to bring in AT LEAST one other first team SPL ready centre half.

[Bridge hibs]

Yeh - like him a lot. Probably got offers down south tho.Saw him a few times for Peterborough, was impressed with him, strong player and can play a bit too

[Smartie]

Any chance Harbottle gets an opportunity? Are his credentials much worse than Bevan’s?

One game at RB under Johnson then frozen out under Monty / Raimundo, who let’s face it - didn’t exactly cover themselves with glory when it came to the centre halves.

[cubehindthegoal]

Liam cooper and ben gibson :wink:

and or jason kerr

We are in a place now that the board need to make a bold move to back up the words around the fact the football on the pitch is what matters for the foreseeable.. the best statement they could make now is two big signing centre backs. They’d find we’d respond to that. Hope you’re reading those that matter.

[JimBHibees]

If Rocky starts our first game of next season then we all need to pack up and go home.

He isn’t the answer and will never be the answer.

Nice

[seanshow]

Nice

The good attributes Rocky has you cannot buy, Tall and strong.
he is 24 and still learning the rest.
A big honest committed guy, if he can improve his touch he deserves a chance at CB at the start anyway.

[CapitalGreen]

The good attributes Rocky has you cannot buy, Tall and strong.
he is 24 and still learning the rest.
A big honest committed guy, if he can improve his touch he deserves a chance at CB at the start anyway.

This isn’t true, there are countless players in Scottish football that are tall and strong, it’s players with ability we are sorely lacking.

[Donegal Hibby]

The good attributes Rocky has you cannot buy, Tall and strong.
he is 24 and still learning the rest.
A big honest committed guy, if he can improve his touch he deserves a chance at CB at the start anyway.

His weaknesses are heading and concentration . The good attributes are he's strong , agile , fairly good with the ball at his feet and goes forward with it the way Porto and Ambrose use too .

Considering he has played roughly only about 50 games when he came to us and has been put in at LCB ( not his proper position) even at 24 I think he's still learning . He's also been put in a position were him and the other CH we've played as been hung out to dry in many games this season imo because our fullbacks have left them utterly exposed.

Player I like because he's exactly what you said in a big honest committed guy who still learning . Seems to have a good character about him too .

Agree with you 👍

[easty]

His weaknesses are heading and concentration . The good attributes are he's strong , agile , fairly good with the ball at his feet and goes forward with it the way Porto and Ambrose use too .

Considering he has played roughly only about 50 games when he came to us and has been put in at LCB ( not his proper position) even at 24 I think he's still learning . He's also been put in a position were him and the other CH we've played as been hung out to dry in many games this season imo because our fullbacks have left them utterly exposed.

Player I like because he's exactly what you said in a big honest committed guy who still learning . Seems to have a good character about him too .

Agree with you 👍

He’s also positionally really poor. It doesn’t matter what your good attributes are if you have bad positioning, poor concentration, and struggle with headers. You cannae be a good centre half. I find it laughable that anyone can admit he’s weak in the air and with concentration, but still think he should play for Hibs?? That’s such a low bar for a central defender.

I do agree that our full backs don’t defend well enough, but that has no bearing on what Rocky struggles with.

[BILLYHIBS]

He’s also positionally really poor. It doesn’t matter what your good attributes are if you have bad positioning, poor concentration, and struggle with headers. You cannae be a good centre half. I find it laughable that anyone can admit he’s weak in the air and with concentration, but still think he should play for Hibs?? That’s such a low bar for a central defender.

I do agree that our full backs don’t defend well enough, but that has no bearing on what Rocky struggles with.

Will be interesting to see what a new Manager makes of Rocky and a few others

[Smartie]

I just don’t see Rocky ever stopping the big mistakes.

It’s a shame, because between the regular big mistakes he’s really quite good.

Defenders are always going to make mistakes and cost goals but with some it just happens a bit too often.

We’ve got a few imperfect players - some you could see being part of a top 4 team (Joe Newell, for example, already has been) whereas some you cannot.

Rocky I just cannot see being part of a miserly defence in a team that finishes top 4.

[BILLYHIBS]

I just don’t see Rocky ever stopping the big mistakes.

It’s a shame, because between the regular big mistakes he’s really quite good.

Defenders are always going to make mistakes and cost goals but with some it just happens a bit too often.

We’ve got a few imperfect players - some you could see being part of a top 4 team (Joe Newell, for example, already has been) whereas some you cannot.

Rocky I just cannot see being part of a miserly defence in a team that finishes top 4.

Only really big mistakes I can think of were Shankland and his assist for Simon Murray in Dingwall St Johnstone home misjudged a through ball ( wind assisted) when he looked to have it covered but stepped forward playing the guy off side only to find Triantis playing the guy on Does go long spells without errors has good mobility, passing average, left foot has improved but positioning concentration and heading need worked on

[JimBHibees]

He’s also positionally really poor. It doesn’t matter what your good attributes are if you have bad positioning, poor concentration, and struggle with headers. You cannae be a good centre half. I find it laughable that anyone can admit he’s weak in the air and with concentration, but still think he should play for Hibs?? That’s such a low bar for a central defender.

I do agree that our full backs don’t defend well enough, but that has no bearing on what Rocky struggles with.

Decent coaches should be able to coach positioning. His key issue as you have highlighted is heading sometimes he waits on the ball dropping to his head and doesn’t attack as he didn’t do in the derby goal. Really basic defensive skill. If he can’t improve that he needs to move on

[RIP]

Some real rubbish being stated about Rocky.

He had one miskick at the start against Livi. From then on when they were punting the ball to their basketball players Rocky didnt miss a single header. He also battered every player he came into contact with apart from a head clash with Nouble.

Shankland punched him in the throat to knock him off in that Derby loss. A foul he had carried out in a previous match. My group in the East spotted it but it was missed by the ref and VAR. One of many terrible refereeing decisions that season.

He's improving year on year and unless we can miraculously replace Hanlon and Fish and recruit two 'better' centre halves to a bottom six club with a horrendous track record of player churn, he will be an ever present next year.

As Lewis says, we need to put our money into sourcing a left centre half. Good ones are hard to find.

[Heisenberg]

Some real rubbish being stated about Rocky.

He had one miskick at the start against Livi. From then on when they were punting the ball to their basketball players Rocky didnt miss a single header. He also battered every player he came into contact with apart from a head clash with Nouble.

Shankland punched him in the throat to knock him off in that Derby loss. A foul he had carried out in a previous match. My group in the East spotted it but it was missed by the ref and VAR. One of many terrible refereeing decisions last season.

He's improving year on year and unless we can miraculously replace Hanlon and Fish and recruit two 'better' centre halves to a bottom six club with a horrendous track record of player churn, he will be an ever present next year.

As Lewis says, we need to put our money into sourcing a left centre half. Good ones are hard to find.

Our defensive record is absolutely howling when he plays, that’s not a coincidence. If he’s an ever present next season we will be in the bottom six again.

[BILLYHIBS]

Some real rubbish being stated about Rocky.

He had one miskick at the start against Livi. From then on when they were punting the ball to their basketball players Rocky didnt miss a single header. He also battered every player he came into contact with apart from a head clash with Nouble.

Shankland punched him in the throat to knock him off in that Derby loss. A foul he had carried out in a previous match. My group in the East spotted it but it was missed by the ref and VAR. One of many terrible refereeing decisions that season.

He's improving year on year and unless we can miraculously replace Hanlon and Fish and recruit two 'better' centre halves to a bottom six club with a horrendous track record of player churn, he will be an ever present next year.

As Lewis says, we need to put our money into sourcing a left centre half. Good ones are hard to find.

Agree with this saw the rabbit punch I wouldn’t be in a hurry to offload Rocky just yet not everyone’s cup of tea but with natural development we should be able to get a decent fee for Rocky and expect to see him still here in 2024/25

If we can sign better in the summer it’s all good

[B.H.F.C]

Our defensive record is absolutely howling when he plays, that’s not a coincidence. If he’s an ever present next season we will be in the bottom six again.

Exactly. I know players will always split opinion but he’s one where I just have no idea what anyone sees in him. He’s as poor a centre half as I’ve seen with a complete inability to do the basics. He’s no a young laddie now either, should be coming in to his best years soon.

[Tyler Durden]

Some real rubbish being stated about Rocky.

He had one miskick at the start against Livi. From then on when they were punting the ball to their basketball players Rocky didnt miss a single header. He also battered every player he came into contact with apart from a head clash with Nouble.

Shankland punched him in the throat to knock him off in that Derby loss. A foul he had carried out in a previous match. My group in the East spotted it but it was missed by the ref and VAR. One of many terrible refereeing decisions that season.

He's improving year on year and unless we can miraculously replace Hanlon and Fish and recruit two 'better' centre halves to a bottom six club with a horrendous track record of player churn, he will be an ever present next year.

As Lewis says, we need to put our money into sourcing a left centre half. Good ones are hard to find.

Get a grip man come on. It's a basic header to win and a decent CB doesn't let the likes of Shankland bully them. That was after he'd given away a penalty in the same game remember

He hasn't improved anywhere near enough. He continues to make basic errors.

[Gloucester Hibs]

Some real rubbish being stated about Rocky.

He had one miskick at the start against Livi. From then on when they were punting the ball to their basketball players Rocky didnt miss a single header. He also battered every player he came into contact with apart from a head clash with Nouble.

Shankland punched him in the throat to knock him off in that Derby loss. A foul he had carried out in a previous match. My group in the East spotted it but it was missed by the ref and VAR. One of many terrible refereeing decisions that season.

He's improving year on year and unless we can miraculously replace Hanlon and Fish and recruit two 'better' centre halves to a bottom six club with a horrendous track record of player churn, he will be an ever present next year.

As Lewis says, we need to put our money into sourcing a left centre half. Good ones are hard to find.

The guy can't judge the flight of a ball, there are many examples of this. The thought of him starting next season as one of our first choice centre halves isn't a pleasant one. His other attributes are pretty good though so wouldn't be against him sticking around as backup.

[AlbertK86]

The good attributes Rocky has you cannot buy, Tall and strong.
he is 24 and still learning the rest.
A big honest committed guy, if he can improve his touch he deserves a chance at CB at the start anyway.

He may be strong but still gets caught napping unawareand nudged off balance regularly as per Shankland in the last minute at ER


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Since452]

Rocky is only 24. Does he make any more mistakes and poor decisions than Porteous did when he was here?

[Tyler Durden]

Rocky is only 24. Does he make any more mistakes and poor decisions than Porteous did when he was here?

By a mile yes. He's also nowhere near the ability to pass the ball that Porteous has.

Porteous and Hanlon together where the best defence outside the OF for 2 years running (along with McGinn and Doig etc aswell of course).

Rocky just does not have the quality that the likes of Hanlon and Porto possess. He's miles off it in several key aspects.

[Bristolhibby]

Having watched him put in a horror show of a performance against Edinburgh City last summer I wouldn’t be putting any money on that.

Was he there vs the part timers in Andorra?

J

[Paul1642]

Rocky is only 24. Does he make any more mistakes and poor decisions than Porteous did when he was here?

The two aren’t comparable. Rocky does make more mistakes and whilst Porto was capable of the odd mad moment, he got the slack for that because he was pretty brilliant at times, hence why he will be a starting CB for Scotland at the euros and an English championship team again next seasons, whist Rocky will (fingers crossed) drop to 3rd or 4th choice for Hibs.

[Pytheas]

For me positioning is at least half the game for a centre half and Rocky's is really poor.

The mistakes are infrequent and not that important really. Ambrose, Porteous, Rob Jones all dropped the odd clanger.



Watch the recent Aberdeen highlights with his positioning in mind as the example.

1st goal - not his fault

2nd goal - he leaves his correct position marking Miovski to chase after the ball, not only did he not get it, he left their main striker unmarked in front of goal.

3rd goal - Ball watching, Hanlon has to come across to pick up his man, who dummys it, Hanlon's man scores.

4th Goal - The best example of this, hangs a boot at Duk, jogs back into his vague position and leaves his man free 3 yards out to tap in.


I Really like Rocky and his 1 on 1 defending is good but we need so much more at this level.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cb_v-7FrQk0

[AlbertK86]

For me positioning is at least half the game for a centre half and Rocky's is really poor.

The mistakes are infrequent and not that important really. Ambrose, Porteous, Rob Jones all dropped the odd clanger.



Watch the recent Aberdeen highlights with his positioning in mind as the example.

1st goal - not his fault

2nd goal - he leaves his correct position marking Miovski to chase after the ball, not only did he not get it, he left their main striker unmarked in front of goal.

3rd goal - Ball watching, Hanlon has to come across to pick up his man, who dummys it, Hanlon's man scores.

4th Goal - The best example of this, hangs a boot at Duk, jogs back into his vague position and leaves his man free 3 yards out to tap in.


I Really like Rocky and his 1 on 1 defending is good but we need so much more at this level.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cb_v-7FrQk0

Spot on


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[easty]

Rocky is only 24. Does he make any more mistakes and poor decisions than Porteous did when he was here?

Porteous definitely made bad decisions, but his overall game more than made up for it. I never doubted he’d move on to a higher level and play for Scotland.

I don’t see Rocky and see any chance of him playing in the English Championship at all.

[blackpoolhibs]

The good attributes Rocky has you cannot buy, Tall and strong.
he is 24 and still learning the rest.
A big honest committed guy, if he can improve his touch he deserves a chance at CB at the start anyway.

Is he that tall, he is strong?

We cant start next season with him, at this moment in time he just makes too many mistakes and is not good enough.

[BILLYHIBS]

For me positioning is at least half the game for a centre half and Rocky's is really poor.

The mistakes are infrequent and not that important really. Ambrose, Porteous, Rob Jones all dropped the odd clanger.



Watch the recent Aberdeen highlights with his positioning in mind as the example.

1st goal - not his fault

2nd goal - he leaves his correct position marking Miovski to chase after the ball, not only did he not get it, he left their main striker unmarked in front of goal.

3rd goal - Ball watching, Hanlon has to come across to pick up his man, who dummys it, Hanlon's man scores.

4th Goal - The best example of this, hangs a boot at Duk, jogs back into his vague position and leaves his man free 3 yards out to tap in.


I Really like Rocky and his 1 on 1 defending is good but we need so much more at this level.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cb_v-7FrQk0

Hmmmm!

I thought the much lauded ( on here ) Obita was more culpable in that game than Rocky seemed to be involved in every Sheep goal and not in a good way :greengrin

[The Modfather]

I quite like Rocky, but like Youan, has he developed much more than when he arrived and softened his rough edges. I don’t think he has, certainly not to the degree needed to be part of the solution at centreback. I’d be keeping him as backup though.

In defence of Rocky, he is the only centre back to have had to play on his wrong side. Despite that his spell after AFCON was probably the best and most consistent spell of any of our centre backs this season.

I don’t think he’s the answer, but would a left sided, vocal, aggressive ball winner who can talk him through games, a Darren McGregor type, be what he needs to kick on?

It was probably also a timely reminder at Livingston’s equaliser that, sentiment aside, Hanlon isn’t part of the solution and it’s a natural time to part ways.

[Hiber-nation]

Hmmmm!

I thought the much lauded ( on here ) Obita was more culpable in that game than Rocky seemed to be involved in every Sheep goal and not in a good way :greengrin

Obita has had some really poor games. But a lot of man of the match performances. The last derby at the piggery for example, he was a class apart. Can be infuriating at times with his inconsistency.

Rocky to me is English League 2 standard, maybe league 1 on a good day. Bit of pace and decent strength. But every team we play against lets him have the ball. And his positioning is so poor at times.

[H18 SFR]

For me Rocky’s best chance of shining would be playing in a 3 where both his CD partner’s are also strongest playing in a 3 - vibes of McCart-Kerr-Gordon type of trio.

[CapitalGreen]

For me Rocky’s best chance of shining would be playing in a 3 where both his CD partner’s are also strongest playing in a 3 - vibes of McCart-Kerr-Gordon type of trio.

He played in a back 3 last season and we were all over the shop defensively. Adding an extra central defender into the mix just causes more chaos.

[H18 SFR]

He played in a back 3 last season and we were all over the shop defensively. Adding an extra central defender into the mix just causes more chaos.

Whist this is correct do you feel the other two CD’s were suited to playing in a 3 or perhaps otherwise?

[BILLYHIBS]

Obita has had some really poor games. But a lot of man of the match performances. The last derby at the piggery for example, he was a class apart. Can be infuriating at times with his inconsistency.

Rocky to me is English League 2 standard, maybe league 1 on a good day. Bit of pace and decent strength. But every team we play against lets him have the ball. And his positioning is so poor at times.

Obita is a good player very good going forward sends over a mean cross but sometimes forgets to come back defending is not his strong point

Played very well at Centre Back showed a remarkable turn of pace

[H18 SFR]

Obita is a good player very good going forward sends over a mean cross but sometimes forgets to come back defending is not his strong point

Played very well at Centre Back showed a remarkable turn of pace

Obita is another one who I think would be suited to playing on the left of a 3. Very capable of being the spare stepping forward in an attacking sense - overlapping CD to create an overload down the left.

[truehibernian]

For me Rocky’s best chance of shining would be playing in a 3 where both his CD partner’s are also strongest playing in a 3 - vibes of McCart-Kerr-Gordon type of trio.

Really doesn’t matter whether it’s in a back 4 or a 3, he loses concentration far too frequently in games, is lackadaisical and languid, so will always be 1) the weak link in any defensive formation and 2) the defender opponents will target. He’s not a good technical player either so can never be trusted playing from the back. He has to go in afraid, and if not certainly shouldn’t start games next season.

[marinello59]

Really doesn’t matter whether it’s in a back 4 or a 3, he loses concentration far too frequently in games, is lackadaisical and languid, so will always be 1) the weak link in any defensive formation and 2) the defender opponents will target. He’s not a good technical player either so can never be trusted playing from the back. He has to go in afraid, and if not certainly shouldn’t start games next season.

I don't agree with the lackadaisical and languid comment but he does lack concentration at times. He does need to be moved on, we can do better.

[CapitalGreen]

Whist this is correct do you feel the other two CD’s were suited to playing in a 3 or perhaps otherwise?

Not sure on Porteous but Hanlon’s best period in a Hibs shirt was probably in a back 3 under Stubbs and Lennon.

[easty]

Not sure on Porteous but Hanlon’s best period in a Hibs shirt was probably in a back 3 under Stubbs and Lennon.

Under Lennon was Hanlons best spell for me.

[B.H.F.C]

Not sure on Porteous but Hanlon’s best period in a Hibs shirt was probably in a back 3 under Stubbs and Lennon.

Under Lennon was his best football by a mile IMO.

Back three of him, Ambrose and McGregor complimented each other perfectly and had a bit of everything.

[truehibernian]

I don't agree with the lackadaisical and languid comment but he does lack concentration at times. He does need to be moved on, we can do better.

I more mean due to his constant lack of concentration in games he drifts out of position and invariably passes his man onto others and then can’t make up the space due to lack of pace or awareness of what’s ahead of him or behind him. A simple ball over the top often catches him out because he’s not fully concentrating and/or completely drawn out of position because his mind wanders in games. There’s also been many occasions where even simple defending passes him by because he tries things that are simply not a the best option. I want him to do well but the lack of awareness and concentration levels are often innate traits and I’m not sure even the best coaching will change his style of play sadly.

[Aldo]

Maybe I’m old fashioned but can we not just get a CH pairing that can organise and defend. Pass a ball 5 yards to a midfielder who then takes it forward.

Keep it simple rather than trying to over complicate it and make continued mistakes putting us under more pressure.

Might not be modern day football but cmon we are Hibs not Man City

[Brightside]

Maybe I’m old fashioned but can we not just get a CH pairing that can organise and defend. Pass a ball 5 yards to a midfielder who then takes it forward.

Keep it simple rather than trying to over complicate it and make continued mistakes putting us under more pressure.

Might not be modern day football but cmon we are Hibs not Man City

If you watch that video from Sergio nothing we have been doing is that complicated. If a pro player can't do it we really shouldn't have them.

[Aldo]

If you watch that video from Sergio nothing we have been doing is that complicated. If a pro player can't do it we really shouldn't have them.

I get that but it was clear Brightside that they struggled but he still persisted with it. Just not good enough to implement it and not good enough for me.

Surely first and foremost we need CH’s tgat can defend?

[B.H.F.C]

Maybe I’m old fashioned but can we not just get a CH pairing that can organise and defend. Pass a ball 5 yards to a midfielder who then takes it forward.

Keep it simple rather than trying to over complicate it and make continued mistakes putting us under more pressure.

Might not be modern day football but cmon we are Hibs not Man City

You’re not being old fashioned IMO.

The way players are brought up these days, most of them are capable of passing the ball fairly competently. Less focus on the need for that and more focus on keeping the ball out of our net for me.

[Donegal Hibby]

He’s also positionally really poor. It doesn’t matter what your good attributes are if you have bad positioning, poor concentration, and struggle with headers. You cannae be a good centre half. I find it laughable that anyone can admit he’s weak in the air and with concentration, but still think he should play for Hibs?? That’s such a low bar for a central defender.

I do agree that our full backs don’t defend well enough, but that has no bearing on what Rocky struggles with.

Alot of his positioning is poor which is down to the fact both our CH's have regularly been dragged out wide because our fullbacks have been absolutely s**** when needed to do their defensive duties , fish has been in the same boat on the other side .

Your last line you agree with this though move the goalposts then , of course it has a bearing on it when your CH has been repeatedly getting dragged out of position due to a fullback not doing their job properly.

Its one of the reasons I think teams have found it so easy to put crosses into our box all season too .

What I find laughable is that the one player who has been major part of our problems this season due to being unable or unwilling to do his job defensively the fans voted PotY . Just shows how bad things were imo !.

Can be seen here on the first goal Killie got which Rocky got the blame for too though if you watch it again , where's the LB ? , when he does appear he's cantering back without a care in the world instead of busting a gut to get back and help his team out.

That's going back to Monty's first game and over the course of the season I think teams realised our fullbacks both were a liability.

Craig Levein certainly did not that long ago .

# 2:30 #

https://youtu.be/NkgmYL-iWGI?si=lHxnyuv3smGUMtT_


He's also one of our senior players who give away a penalty in the last minute to St Mirren for stupidly dragging a player down when he didn't need too .

As for Rocky playing for Hibs I always want better players if we can get them .

I think Rocky would be a decent player to have as backup as I think he can improve though I hope for his own sake he goes because from early on it was obvious folk had it in for him and yet others who have been just as at fault and maybe more so have pick up awards ! .

[Tyler Durden]

Alot of his positioning is poor which is down to the fact both our CH's have regularly been dragged out wide because our fullbacks have been absolutely s**** when needed to do their defensive duties , fish has been in the same boat on the other side .



No - that's nothing to do with it.

Weird that you think the full backs were constantly out of position... would that not ultimately be the coach's fault? And yet you continued to defend him to the last.

[Donegal Hibby]

No - that's nothing to do with it.

Weird that you think the full backs were constantly out of position... would that not ultimately be the coach's fault? And yet you continued to defend him to the last.

When your fullbacks are getting regularly caught out of position and your CH's are having to cover it has everything to do with it .

And yes I did defend him in the hope if he got better players of his own this might improve though from what I see since Gray came in we look better defensively .

As much as I like Obita and Cadden I still don't trust them defensively though . Always said I thought Cadden was more a RM than a RB and imo Obita has been even more suspect than Cadden this season .

Ultimately it is the coaches fault though I don't think we had any better options at the time either .

[CapitalGreen]

When your fullbacks are getting regularly caught out of position and your CH's are having to cover it has everything to do with it .

And yes I did defend him in the hope if he got better players of his own this might improve though from what I see since Gray came in we look better defensively .

As much as I like Obita and Cadden I still don't trust them defensively though . Always said I thought Cadden was more a RM than a RB and imo Obita has been even more suspect than Cadden this season .

Ultimately it is the coaches fault though I don't think we had any better options at the time either .

Our centre backs seemed to cope a lot better with our full backs when it was Porteous and Hanlon partnered together or Hanlon and Fish partnered together.

Hanlon and Porteous were part of the tighest defence outwith the old firm for 2 seasons in a row.
Hanlon and Fish were part of the 4th tighest defence behind the old Firm and Aberdeen when they were paired together for the 2nd half of last season.

[Aldo]

Alot of his positioning is poor which is down to the fact both our CH's have regularly been dragged out wide because our fullbacks have been absolutely s**** when needed to do their defensive duties , fish has been in the same boat on the other side .

Your last line you agree with this though move the goalposts then , of course it has a bearing on it when your CH has been repeatedly getting dragged out of position due to a fullback not doing their job properly.

Its one of the reasons I think teams have found it so easy to put crosses into our box all season too .

What I find laughable is that the one player who has been major part of our problems this season due to being unable or unwilling to do his job defensively the fans voted PotY . Just shows how bad things were imo !.

Can be seen here on the first goal Killie got which Rocky got the blame for too though if you watch it again , where's the LB ? , when he does appear he's cantering back without a care in the world instead of busting a gut to get back and help his team out.

That's going back to Monty's first game and over the course of the season I think teams realised our fullbacks both were a liability.

Craig Levein certainly did not that long ago .

# 2:30 #

https://youtu.be/NkgmYL-iWGI?si=lHxnyuv3smGUMtT_


He's also one of our senior players who give away a penalty in the last minute to St Mirren for stupidly dragging a player down when he didn't need too .

As for Rocky playing for Hibs I always want better players if we can get them .

I think Rocky would be a decent player to have as backup as I think he can improve though I hope for his own sake he goes because from early on it was obvious folk had it in for him and yet others who have been just as at fault and maybe more so have pick up awards ! .

I’m really struggling with this post and whilst as a team we have been poor for a large percentage of the season, to blame the fullbacks for our CH’s inability to do the basics is off the mark for me. Have you actually watched Rocky in a game.

An example being against Hearts when Shankland was allowed to control the ball. Rocky should have went right through him giving away a foul. Not strong enough and he scores.

Can you just not admit he’s poor and needs replaced? It’s like you are making excuse after excuse for someone who on the whole tries, cannot defend and is constantly caught out of position. So what you are really saying is if we had two better fullbacks he wouldn’t make the same mistakes as he’s made and continued to make throughout the season?

And you think Obita is a major part of our problems. Really. Whilst he’s had a few moments of madness etc he’s been the least of our problems.

[JimBHibees]

If you watch that video from Sergio nothing we have been doing is that complicated. If a pro player can't do it we really shouldn't have them.

Agree with that not rocket science but pretty basic ability

[Libby Hibby]

Under Lennon was Hanlons best spell for me.

The only real manager that we’ve had in the last 15 or so appointments.

[MWHIBBIES]

The only real manager that we’ve had in the last 15 or so appointments.

Behave.

[Donegal Hibby]

I’m really struggling with this post and whilst as a team we have been poor for a large percentage of the season, to blame the fullbacks for our CH’s inability to do the basics is off the mark for me. Have you actually watched Rocky in a game.

An example being against Hearts when Shankland was allowed to control the ball. Rocky should have went right through him giving away a foul. Not strong enough and he scores.

Can you just not admit his poor and needs replaced? It’s like you are making excuse after excuse for someone who on the whole tries, cannot defend and is constantly caught out of position. So what you are really saying is if we had two better fullbacks he wouldn’t make the same mistakes as he’s made and continued to make throughout the season?

And you think Obita is a major part of our problems. Really. Whilst he’s had a few moments of madness etc he’s been the least of our problems.

Your struggling with this post whilst admitting we has a team have been poor ? . Though lets single out individual players and blame them for everything, is that the way it works ? .

Yes there's absolutely no question that Rocky has made mistakes I'm not denying that though a big part of that has been down collectively to us has a team .

Midfield being weak unable to dominate games and fullbacks regularly missing hasn't helped.

On the footage of the Killie game I put up you can clearly see our LB is caught out , the most disappointing thing about it is he doesn't appear to be showing any urgency to get back .

In one of the Hertz games I had a debate with another poster at the time who blamed Rocky for a incident that happened , hertz played a long ball down the left side which Rocky had to go and cover.

He was left against two hertz players , one Shankland I think who he went too though the flight of the ball beat both Rocky and shankland and went to the other hertz player .

Rocky of course was blamed for not picking up the other player , I said at the time if he had and shankland had got the ball he would have been blamed for that too .

I asked the poster two questions then , why was rocky left against two hertz players ? , and were was the LB ? . I didn't get an answer though I knew were the LB was anyway .

I don't think Obita is a MAJOR part of the problem though this season he has been part of it due to probably the managers tactics and his inability to defend .

You say he's the least of our problems though I can show you many games were we have been exposed down our left flank or the other teams have had time and space to put crosses in our box . He's been part of the problem.

I actually like both Cadden and Obita , I think their main strengths are when both are attacking , both are defensively poor though which I think is a fair enough assessment .

That leaves me wondering for PotY how many assists and goals as he contributed this season? .

[Aldo]

Your struggling with this post whilst admitting we has a team have been poor ? . Though lets single out individual players and blame them for everything, is that the way it works ? .

Yes there's absolutely no question that Rocky has made mistakes I'm not denying that though a big part of that has been down collectively to us has a team .

Midfield being weak unable to dominate games and fullbacks regularly missing hasn't helped.

On the footage of the Killie game I put up you can clearly see our LB is caught out , the most disappointing thing about it is he doesn't appear to be showing any urgency to get back .

In one of the Hertz games I had a debate with another poster at the time who blamed Rocky for a incident that happened , hertz played a long ball down the left side which Rocky had to go and cover.

He was left against two hertz players , one Shankland I think who he went to though the flight of the ball beat both Rocky and shankland and went to the other hertz player .

Rocky of course was blamed for not picking up the other player , I said at the time if he had and shankland had got the ball he would have been blamed for that too .

I asked the poster two questions then , why was rocky left against two hertz players ? , and we're was the LB ? . I didn't get an answer though I knew were the LB was anyway .

I don't think Obita is a MAJOR part of the problem though this season he has been part of it due to probably the managers tactics and his inability to defend .

You say he's the least of our problems though I can show you many games were we have been exposed down our left flank or the other teams have had time and space to put crosses in our box . He's been part of the problem.

I actually like both Cadden and Obita , I think their main strengths are when both are attacking , both are defensively poor though which I think is a fair enough assessment .

That leaves me wondering for PotY how many assists and goals as he contributed this season? .


Now if I remember in the hearts game at ER the keeper punts it down the middle towards Shankland their CF. Rocky makes a complete and utter mess of what should really be easy header but no. Go watch the footage and you will see I’m correct. Nit two players not him having to cover his man and him making the mistake which lead to the goal. Why would a fullback come inside at that moment in time? He was Rocky’s man

You are the one that said the fullbacks were our problems and this caused issues for him. Caught out of position, ball watching and unable to win a header? Just to let you know I’m not saying he’s not the only one culpable.

Cadden has missed most of the season through injury so Miller, Whittaker and Megwa by your reckoning were part of the problem. Nothing to do with him. Look at the Aberdeen game when he ran out of position leaving Hanlon with 2 players to mark. Poor decision making. He’s no youngster so he should really know but makes similar mistakes and error of judgements every single game.

What’s goals and assists got to do with him getting PoTY. He’s obviously the best of a bad bunch this season.

As I said on another post I just want defenders who can organise and defend.

[Heisenberg]

A game that sticks in my mind was Aberdeen at home that we actually won. Rocky let Miovski wander away from him three or four times, god knows how he didn’t score.

[GreenNWhiteArmy]

Any manager that insists on playing with Cadden and Obita needs to go with a back 3 to protect the CBs. Neither are full backs. Wing backs MAYBE, bit I'd prefer to see them even further forward

That being said our CB pairings have been poor this season. We need a leader. We need a spine of leaders to be honest but incoming centre back should be someone that we realistically see as captain material

I'm not against keeping rocky but would prefer a fresh start with 2 (or 3) new starting CB'S

[NORTHERNHIBBY]

I would like to see us sign an old fashioned centre half in the mould of Bobo Balde. Tall and strong with a remit of winning the ball in the air and heading it back where it came from and defending as safety first even if that means row Z clearances.

[Donegal Hibby]

Now if I remember in the hearts game at ER the keeper punts it down the middle towards Shankland their CF. Rocky makes a complete and utter mess of what should really be easy header but no. Go watch the footage and you will see I’m correct. Nit two players not him having to cover his man and him making the mistake which lead to the goal. Why would a fullback come inside at that moment in time? He was Rocky’s man

You are the one that said the fullbacks were our problems and this caused issues for him. Caught out of position, ball watching and unable to win a header? Just to let you know I’m not saying he’s not the only one culpable.

Cadden has missed most of the season through injury so Miller, Whittaker and Megwa by your reckoning were part of the problem. Nothing to do with him. Look at the Aberdeen game when he ran out of position leaving Hanlon with 2 players to mark. Poor decision making. He’s no youngster so he should really know but makes similar mistakes and error of judgements every single game.

What’s goals and assists got to do with him getting PoTY. He’s obviously the best of a bad bunch this season.

As I said on another post I just want defenders who can organise and defend.

Sorry aldo but your not obviously on the same incident as I am as the ball comes down the left and what i remember is both Rocky and shankland get the flight of the ball wrong .

Our CH is not only exposed in the incident I'm talking about but he's left with two hertz players to deal with also .

Rocky's had to at times cover LB/RB in many , many games this season as Fish has had to as well .

Another example 1:30 in when we are exposed on the right side, later we lose a goal because we are exposed on the left . I do think teams copped onto the fact our fullbacks usually pushed forward too much .
https://youtu.be/cdSPSBfp2Eo?si=LLk1Rdg-CDHw194h

Youan has got alot of stick for switching off when it comes to defending and he's an attacker , why nobody can see that Obita has time and time again is beyond me .

You ask what goals and assists have to do with it ? , I'm wondering in an attacking sense what's he contributed that way to warrant his PotY . Its certainly not been his defending imo as he's regularly been caught out in a forward position leaving us exposed .

I'd have thought the way he plays ( outside the OF ) he'd be one of the top creative fullbacks in our league .

For what is worth Rocky has been guilty of mistakes no question , I've said that though there's been quite a few he's made when he's had to go covering a position I don't think he should have to as much as he's had too .

The defence in the Motherwell came looked more organised and they all done well imo which resulted in a clean
sheet . I honestly think now the way Monty had us we wouldn't have kept one tbh .

[marinello59]

I more mean due to his constant lack of concentration in games he drifts out of position and invariably passes his man onto others and then can’t make up the space due to lack of pace or awareness of what’s ahead of him or behind him. A simple ball over the top often catches him out because he’s not fully concentrating and/or completely drawn out of position because his mind wanders in games. There’s also been many occasions where even simple defending passes him by because he tries things that are simply not a the best option. I want him to do well but the lack of awareness and concentration levels are often innate traits and I’m not sure even the best coaching will change his style of play sadly.

Ah, get it.
Agreed.

[worcesterhibby]

The only real manager that we’ve had in the last 15 or so appointments.

So John Collins (League Cup win), Tony Mowbray (two consecutive top 4 finishes first time since Turnbull), Alan Stubbs (Scottish Cup Win) and Jack Ross (3rd place finish) weren't real managers.. but Neil Lennon was ?

[Since452]

Under Lennon was Hanlons best spell for me.

Think it was. Also don't think we'd have been relegated under Butcher if he was available more often.

[marinello59]

Think it was. Also don't think we'd have been relegated under Butcher if he was available more often.

:agree:

[Aldo]

Sorry aldo but your not obviously on the same incident as I am as the ball comes down the left and what i remember is both Rocky and shankland get the flight of the ball wrong .

Our CH is not only exposed in the incident I'm talking about but he's left with two hertz players to deal with also .

Rocky's had to at times cover LB/RB in many , many games this season as Fish has had to as well .


Youan has got alot of stick for switching off when it comes to defending and he's an attacker , why nobody can see that Obita has time and time again is beyond me .

You ask what goals and assists have to do with it ? , I'm wondering in an attacking sense what's he contributed that way to warrant his PotY . Its certainly not been his defending imo as he's regularly been caught out in a forward position leaving us exposed .

I'd have thought the way he plays ( outside the OF ) he'd be one of the top creative fullbacks in our league .

For what is worth Rocky has been guilty of mistakes no question , I've said that though there's been quite a few he's made when he's had to go covering a position I don't think he should have to as much as he's had too .

The defence in the Motherwell came looked more organised and they all done well imo which resulted in a clean
sheet . I honestly think now the way Monty had us we wouldn't have kept one tbh .

Clearly I’m not. The incident you’ve mentioned clearly came to nothing as I don’t remember it. Maybe someone else does. I also don’t get why he was exposed if both him and Shankland missed the ball completely.

So do you expect your FB’s to not cross the halfway line? Most CH’s in games will cover the fullback positions at some point. When a ball has been cleared etc. Tbh your DM if they are any good should watch things unfold and cover too.

As a CH you have an ideal view of how things unfold and can easily cut things out.you do realise that CH’s can cover?

Its clear you blame the FB and in particular Obita for others bad defending. Is it his or even the RB’s fault for their teammates mistakes and their inability at times to do the basics??

[Donegal Hibby]

Clearly I’m not. The incident you’ve mentioned clearly came to nothing as I don’t remember it. Maybe someone else does. I also don’t get why he was exposed if both him and Shankland missed the ball completely.

So do you expect your FB’s to not cross the halfway line? Most CH’s in games will cover the fullback positions at some point. When a ball has been cleared etc. Tbh your DM if they are any good should watch things unfold and cover too.

As a CH you have an ideal view of how things unfold and can easily cut things out.you do realise that CH’s can cover?

Its clear you blame the FB and in particular Obita for others bad defending. Is it his or even the RB’s fault for their teammates mistakes and their inability at times to do the basics??

Your right it didn't come to anything though it could have quite easily at the time. It was one of them situations like many we had this season were we've been caught being to gung-ho in attack . Much the same as we were when St Johnstone beat us at ER .

I don't expect the fullbacks not to cross the halfway line , no . But I do expect them not to forget about their defensive duties either and if they are caught out to try and get back rather than just cantering back at their leisure.

I don't mind the CH , DM having to cover attacking fullbacks though in truth it happened in too many games this season too many times imo .

I'm blaming the defence as a unit and also the midfield as well .

All season the wide areas of the team has been a weakness , there's been plenty of discussion on here why are so many crosses coming up into our box which I think tells a tale in its self. Teams I think sussed this out .

Don't mind playing with attacking fullbacks that leaves us exposed at the back if it's being productive which brings us back to the question how many assists , goals has the fullbacks contributed this season .

I don't know but have a feeling we might find alot of other SPL clubs fullbacks have contributed more ? .

[easty]

Your right it didn't come to anything though it could have quite easily at the time. It was one of them situations like many we had this season were we've been caught being to gung-ho in attack . Much the same as we were when St Johnstone beat us at ER .

I don't expect the fullbacks not to cross the halfway line , no . But I do expect them not to forget about their defensive duties either and if they are caught out to try and get back rather than just cantering back at their leisure.

I don't mind the CH , DM having to cover attacking fullbacks though in truth it happened in too many games this season too many times imo .

I'm blaming the defence as a unit and also the midfield as well .

All season the wide areas of the team has been a weakness , there's been plenty of discussion on here why are so many crosses coming up into our box which I think tells a tale in its self. Teams I think sussed this out .

Don't mind playing with attacking fullbacks that leaves us exposed at the back if it's being productive which brings us back to the question how many assists , goals has the fullbacks contributed this season .

I don't know but have a feeling we might find alot of other SPL clubs fullbacks have contributed more ? .

When St Johnstone beat us at home Rocky had a ‘mare, both him and Triantis. Shocking defending, and nothing to do with fullbacks being up the park.

[blackpoolhibs]

When St Johnstone beat us at home Rocky had a ‘mare, both him and Triantis. Shocking defending, and nothing to do with fullbacks being up the park.

If i remember rightly it was all Newells fault for losing the ball at the edge of the St Johnstone box.:faf:

[Aldo]

Your right it didn't come to anything though it could have quite easily at the time. It was one of them situations like many we had this season were we've been caught being to gung-ho in attack . Much the same as we were when St Johnstone beat us at ER .

I don't expect the fullbacks not to cross the halfway line , no . But I do expect them not to forget about their defensive duties either and if they are caught out to try and get back rather than just cantering back at their leisure.

I don't mind the CH , DM having to cover attacking fullbacks though in truth it happened in too many games this season too many times imo .

I'm blaming the defence as a unit and also the midfield as well .

All season the wide areas of the team has been a weakness , there's been plenty of discussion on here why are so many crosses coming up into our box which I think tells a tale in its self. Teams I think sussed this out .

Don't mind playing with attacking fullbacks that leaves us exposed at the back if it's being productive which brings us back to the question how many assists , goals has the fullbacks contributed this season .

I don't know but have a feeling we might find alot of other SPL clubs fullbacks have contributed more ? .

The manager/coach sets up the team and if he wants the fullbacks to push on it’s on him. We need a good DM who can read the game so it allows our FB to push on.
But you reckon our FB’s don’t bother and just jog back?


So what do you actually want? Full backs who defend or full backs who contribute going forward? Surely when you have the likes of Boyle and Youan on the flanks they are the creators??

I think if you watch back pretty much every team in the leagues full backs get caught out high up the park. Not just ours.

I think it is clear we think differently about players, their roles and how they should be played.

On a whole the only player with pass marks from January until the end of the season was Maolida.

[AlbertK86]

For me Rocky’s best chance of shining would be playing in a 3 where both his CD partner’s are also strongest playing in a 3 - vibes of McCart-Kerr-Gordon type of trio.

We could reunite that three … all out of contract I think


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk