Edinburgh Inquirer Article

[BoomtownHibees]

Football is part and parcel of life in Scotland’s Capital. Professional sport as tribal rivalry with two big clubs sharing the city, it drives at least one (and occasionally two) weekly major events attracting 15,000-20,000 people, which in turn creates the footfall on which a multitude of local businesses depend.

And it’s more – both Hibs and Hearts are enormous city brands, but they are community assets with respected charitable foundations who work across a multitude of areas – including mental wellbeing, dementia, food poverty, and assisting refugees - to improve the lives of supporters and residents.

But… when all is said and done, for those who flock to matchdays it is still - and will always be - all about the beautiful game.

So, when Hibs shareholders meet this week to discuss and – almost certainly - agree the deal which will see the US-based billionaire Bill Foley’s Black Knights group take a 25% stake in the Club alongside majority shareholders the Gordon family, club chief executive Ben Kensell will feel contentment at a milestone reached.

Because while this deal will help the Club in all areas of its activity, the focus – without any doubt – is firmly on delivering football success. And to do that, the Club must compete with rivals Hearts reaping the benefit of £6m per year in donations – including more than £4m in each of the past three seasons from benefactor and investment fund wizard James Anderson, plus £1.5 million a season that continues to pour in from fans through the Foundation of Hearts.

That’s money over and above what the club can generate from its sporting and commercial efforts, and presents a financial and sporting challenge to both Hibs and Aberdeen.

Securing Foley’s investment is something of a coup for Hibs. The former US air force officer - who reportedly made $40,000 investing in the stock market in his spare time while training at West Point - is seen as one of the more astute sports investors in North America. And one of its more demanding. “I believe if you tolerate mediocrity, your business is going to be mediocre,” he once told the Las Vegas Review-Journal. “I don’t tolerate it.”

With a net worth estimated by Forbes at £1.6bn, the Texas-born owner of English Premier League Bournemouth and the successful Vegas Golden Knights ice hockey team is big league.

Hibs’ Chief Executive, who has been instrumental in sourcing and securing the deal, will look back on the process with both satisfaction and regret. Satisfaction at landing an agreement he believes will be transformational for the club. But more than a little regret that Ron Gordon, the charismatic Chairman of the club who passed away almost exactly a year ago, won’t be there to share the moment.

The man who persuaded Kensell to leave Norwich and head north to help him build commercial prosperity in order to deliver sporting success at Easter Road died after a battle with cancer on February 20th in the US last year. The timing is not lost on the Chief Executive.

“Ron often spoke about the importance of partnerships in building successful organisations. It was something he did in his own businesses, and it was something he was keen to do at Hibs. We spoke pretty much daily, and Ron spoke of it often, so I’m pretty sure he’ll be looking down with approval.”

[BoomtownHibees]

That is most certainly true. At the first annual shareholder meeting he addressed, Ron Gordon set out a vision that excited and encouraged supporters. Within that conversation, he stressed that the Club was looking at up to six partnerships with clubs from a variety of levels. At that same meeting, Gordon told shareholders he wanted to double the player budget within three years and invest £1m initially to carry out stadium improvements. The plan, he told them, was to improve the club commercially to generate the cash needed to bring sustainable success. In any league in the world, including Scotland he pointed out, success follows the clubs with money.

The final piece of the jigsaw was bringing in someone with the commercial experience and acumen to maximise the returns from that investment – to help grow the revenues needed. Enter Kensell.

The pandemic slowed things down, but only by a year. Kensell arrived in July 2021. Well into his third year at Hibs, the Chief Executive has seen the football budget grow year on year and it is indeed now around double what it was. And considerably more than £1 million has been spent on stadium improvements.

In addition, the new deal he appears to have secured after months of negotiation and wrangling will ensure that there is more investment to come – on and off the pitch. What the Club must now ensure, a point Kensell willingly concedes, is that it spends the money wisely. On and off the pitch.

Ben Kensell said: “I know the Club has been approached by quite a lot of suitors, when Ron was here and then inevitably after he passed. But the family has always taken the view that it wants to see Ron’s vision delivered, that it won’t simply fold tents and move on. Any partnership had to be good for the Club, and there was really nothing that we felt was serious enough to consider.

“All of that changed when a friend down south and I were chatting and he started to tell me about the multi-club model. Bill Foley’s group owns Bournemouth in the Premier League, but they also own a stake in Lorient in France and now Auckland, which will be a new franchise in the A-League in Australia next season.

[BoomtownHibees]

“I worked to learn more about the model as it operates across a number of European leagues, and I found it more and more interesting. Red Bull would be another example. I’d involved the Gordon family from early on, of course, and Ian Gordon was also interested in the possibilities and worked alongside me.

“Things developed, and we started talking more seriously directly to Bournemouth, where I know the Chief Executive, which obviously helped. They were interested from the start and took a really consistent and clear position which they’ve maintained all along. They’d be interested in investing and working alongside the Gordon family and were not pushing for a controlling interest. They saw the potential of Hibs and Scotland as a part of the multi-club model they are still building.”

Talks moved on, with the blessing of the Gordon family, and eventually an agreement was hammered out giving the Black Knights a 25% stake in Hibernian through a share deal which values the Club at around £20 million.

The next hurdle facing the Chief Executive was to gain the approval of the Scottish FA. While one previous dual investment had been agreed when Mike Ashley took 10% of Rangers, that was something born of the Glasgow giant’s financial distress and was limited by the SFA to 10% and significant conditions were imposed. A deal such as the one Hibs were seeking had never been done.

Kensell said: “It took a few conversations with the SFA, that’s for sure, but I have to be honest and say they were pretty constructive. Conditions were imposed, but as we negotiated these reduced in number and complexity and by the time the final deal was hammered out I have to say I was pretty happy with the outcome.”

As part of that agreement, a chunk of the fresh investment will be spent on infrastructure – completing the refurbishment of the Famous Five Stand to create a new Behind the Goals area, and improvements to the training centre which may include a covered, all-weather training pitch amongst other things.

“But there will also be significant funds available to football, have no doubt about that” Kensell added.

He believes the benefits will quickly become apparent to supporters, pointing to the arrival of the highly-rated Danish midfielder Emiliano Macrcondes on loan from Bournemouth.

“One quick example is Emiliano Marcondes. This is a talented player, on premier league wages which we could never afford, and we are getting him for a modest contribution that falls well within our wage structure. The multi-club model allows us access to talent we simply couldn’t bring here otherwise.

“Supporters need to rest assured that we don’t intend to build a team of loan players, and in any event the rules don’t allow it. But we will be collaborating with others to bring good players here, to look at best practice, at recruitment and talent development, at coach education, at a whole range of things designed to help our club get better and better.”

He believes the vast majority of individual shareholders will support the deal, but accepts some are concerned at the recently announced annual financial statement, which showed a pre-tax loss of £3.9 million despite gaining more than £3million in transfer fees. In other words, operating losses were well over £6 million. Debt stands at around £7 million, with around £5 million of that the funding of losses that is owed to the Gordon family. Wages to turnover – a benchmark figure in football clubs – was at a high 81%, at least 10% higher than would be considered acceptable. All of that on turnover which went up to a little more than £12 million.

While far from sanguine, Kensell is comfortable that supporters will understand the reasons behind the figures and that he sees the current outlook as considerably sunnier.

“The annual report is a snapshot in time. For the season in question, the Club had no European football and exited both Cup competitions early. That hit our income. Then we decided to invest in the playing squad, busting our budget in pursuit of increasing our chances of sporting success.

“This season we’ve hit our Cup budget, and we enjoyed a run of games in Europe early in the season. We’ve continued to improve all our commercial deals and to create new commercial opportunities. We’re on target to hit more than £15 million in turnover in the current season. Today we are in a much healthier financial position and the wages to turnover ration is back down in good territory.

“As supporters now know, the Gordon family is swapping its £5 million debt for shares, which is a really generous gesture, and the Club will be left with less than £2 million of Covid relief debt from the Government, which has zero interest and is repayable over 20 years. Financially we’re in a good place.”

[ancient hibee]

Sets out the position pretty well.

[worcesterhibby]

thanks for posting, very informative.

[greenlex]

Very positive. I have to ask why it was done through a media outlet (behind an paywall at that) instead of a more intimate platform. Either a simple post on the club website or better still a personal letter through the door. The folk running the club are being criticised left right and centre by its own fans (unfairly in my opinion) but they really don’t help them selves.

[Brightside]

Very positive. I have to ask why it was done through a media outlet instead of a more intimate platform. Either a simple post on the club website or better still a personal letter through the door. The folk running the club are being criticised left right and centre by its own fans (unfairly in my opinion) but they really don’t help them selves.

It’s an interview. Tbh there is nothing new in that article

[matty_f]

I don't think we learned anything new there, there's still questions about the future plans from Foley, to what extent these best practices around coaching and scouting will make a difference etc.

[greenlex]

It’s an interview. Tbh there is nothing new in that article

Yes but the interview was always gonna end up in “print”. They must know there is a fair bit of unrest within the fan base. What better time to reinforce in one place the vision and plan. If they don’t know there is unrest they need to get their act together. We are part of the club not customers. If they want to take us with them they need to improve communications or more to the point read the room and react,

[Torto7]

That was a great read and clearly set out what is going on. I can't wait for the next few years. Ben Kensell was big enough to appoint a DOF with Premier League experience to help him on the football side, there's no doubting his acumen on the commercial side. The clubs commercial activities under the previous regime was amateurish. Onwards and upwards. :flag:

[Alex Trager]

I don't think we learned anything new there, there's still questions about the future plans from Foley, to what extent these best practices around coaching and scouting will make a difference etc.

Agree. Nothing to get excited about in there.

We did learn that BK knows people I suppose.

[Viva_Palmeiras]

This is not a criticism just an observation in the name lf transparency.

I thought the article sounded like there was a pretty familiar /in depth access to the club.

The article was written by David Forsyth and another dude. Is this the same David Forsyth that does the clubs’ PR? If so I think it’s only fair the support understand that.

[Chipper1875]

This is not a criticism just an observation in the name lf transparency.

I thought the article sounded like there was a a pretty in depth access to the club.

The article was written by David Forsyth and another dude. Is this the same David Forsyth that does the clubs’ PR? If so I think it’s only fair the support understand that.
Yea he is one of the owners . This article should have been on the hibs website, not behind a paywall .

Also , don’t recall hibs every officially coming out to explain how the black knights investment would be used

[Viva_Palmeiras]

Yea he is one of the owners . This article should have been on the hibs website, not behind a paywall .

Also , don’t recall hibs every officially coming out to explain how the black knights investment would be used

it’s not behind a paywall tho. I was able to view although they are suggesting a 7-day trial.

https://www.edinburghinquirer.co.uk/p/the-us-billionaire-buying-into-hibs

[Chipper1875]

it’s not behind a paywall tho.

https://www.edinburghinquirer.co.uk/p/the-us-billionaire-buying-into-hibs

It is for me , asks me to subscribe, put in credit card details .

[Viva_Palmeiras]

It is for me , asks me to subscribe, put in credit card details .

Hmmm boo!

[Ringothedog]

it’s not behind a paywall tho. I was able to view although they are suggesting a 7-day trial.

https://www.edinburghinquirer.co.uk/p/the-us-billionaire-buying-into-hibs

No issues for me either, easy to read the article.

[DarlingtonHibee]

Excellent article, thought it was 15% not 25% ?

[Baldy Foghorn]

Last paragraph re debt for shares, quite how we have managed to rack up the debt is another question

[Since452]

£15 million turnover is impressive

[PHeffernan]

A very choreographed piece which I suspect was written to order and clearly aimed at getting the ducks in a row for the AGM Foley vote.
This weeks very public complaint to the SFA about Saturdays VAR decision is another obvious PR job to get all supporters onside including those attending the AGM.

[Lago]

Agree. Nothing to get excited about in there.

We did learn that BK knows people I suppose.
Maybe just as well he does

[Stairway 2 7]

£15 million turnover is impressive

Very. Caught up with hearts and Aberdeen (minus Europe group stages and donations) after being millions behind a few years ago. The business side is much improved shows how the maligned hospitality can help

[Brightside]

A very choreographed piece which I suspect was written to order and clearly aimed at getting the ducks in a row for the AGM Foley vote.
This weeks very public complaint to the SFA about Saturdays VAR decision is another obvious PR job to get supporters onside including those attending the AGM.
If there is people going to the AGM that don’t already know what’s in that article they probably shouldn’t be allowed to vote.

[Eyrie]

A very choreographed piece which I suspect was written to order and clearly aimed at getting the ducks in a row for the AGM Foley vote.
This weeks very public complaint to the SFA about Saturdays VAR decision is another obvious PR job to get supporters onside including those attending the AGM.

Too late for that as I've already voted (in favour).

[PHeffernan]

If there is people going to the AGM that don’t already know what’s in that article they probably shouldn’t be allowed to vote.

The article smells of PR rather than giving information.

[PHeffernan]

Too late for that as I've already voted (in favour).

When is the deadine for voting?

[Chipper1875]

If there is people going to the AGM that don’t already know what’s in that article they probably shouldn’t be allowed to vote.

Hibs haven’t released this information directly to shareholders. I may have missed it if they did.

You seem to continually tell hibs fans what they should or shouldn’t do .

[CropleyWasGod]

Hibs haven’t released this information directly to shareholders. I may have missed it if they did.

You seem to continually tell hibs fans what they should or shouldn’t do .

The financial information is all in the public domain.

Everything else can be gleaned from joining the dots from various sources.

[Chipper1875]

The financial information is all in the public domain.

Everything else can be gleaned from joining the dots from various sources.

Should not have to. And hibs haven’t officially told shareholders re the nature of BK investments .

[CropleyWasGod]

Should not have to. And hibs haven’t officially told shareholders re the nature of BK investments .

What is it you want to know that you won't be told at the AGM?

[Chipper1875]

What is it you want to know that you won't be told at the AGM?

You said financial info is in public domain. Until reading this article, to my knowledge, shareholders haven’t been told BK investment is going to FF corporate, FF rail seating and indoor pitch at East Mains .

We are already all ready said FF improvements are happening and selling season tickets for BTG .

But they haven’t had the AGM
And have the approval for BK investment .

They must think we are buttoned up
The back .

[Brightside]

Hibs haven’t released this information directly to shareholders. I may have missed it if they did.

You seem to continually tell hibs fans what they should or shouldn’t do .

Paying more attention would maybe help you.

[Chipper1875]

Paying more attention would maybe help you.

There you go again telling people what to do

[Brightside]

You said financial info is in public domain. Until reading this article, to my knowledge, shareholders haven’t been told BK investment is going to FF corporate, FF rail seating and indoor pitch at East Mains .

We are already all ready said FF improvements are happening and selling season tickets for BTG .

But they haven’t had the AGM
And have the approval for BK investment .

They must think we are buttoned up
The back .

All this information has been available for weeks. In about 10 different articles across lots of different media. So you are either making up the fact that you don’t know it already or you have just ignored it all. “They must think we are buttoned up the back”. Makes no sense at all. Nothing has been hidden.

[Brightside]

There you go again telling people what to do

Stop slagging the club then and claiming they are somehow hiding stuff. It’s embarrassing.

[Chipper1875]

Stop slagging the club then and claiming they are somehow hiding stuff. It’s embarrassing.

Stop telling me what to do . What have l said they are hiding ?

[Chipper1875]

All this information has been available for weeks. In about 10 different articles across lots of different media. So you are either making up the fact that you don’t know it already or you have just ignored it all. “They must think we are buttoned up the back”. Makes no sense at all. Nothing has been hidden.

Shareholders should have to read ten articles. Since you come over as Mr Hibs . Where have shareholders been given info about the proposed BK investment and where it will be spent ?

[CropleyWasGod]

Shareholders should have to read ten articles. Since you come over as Mr Hibs . Where have shareholders been given info about the proposed BK investment and where it will be spent ?

You'll get the broad strokes at the AGM. If you're looking for detailed breakdowns, I think you might be disappointed.

[Chipper1875]

You'll get the broad strokes at the AGM. If you're looking for detailed breakdowns, I think you might be disappointed.

That’s not the point lm making . I’ve been crystal
Clear . Ben has done interview with a paid hibs advisor. Information should have been provided to shareholders, to my knowledge l have not received it .

It’s a PR job and David Forsyth spin doctor, buttering shareholders up
Pre AGM . Which he’s done for decades when board under pressure.

Ben on a few occasions has played down financial performance in these accounts. Performance is terrible.

[Brightside]

Shareholders should have to read ten articles. Since you come over as Mr Hibs . Where have shareholders been given info about the proposed BK investment and where it will be spent ?

Loads of articles across the press. Around £3m on infra and a few million for players in the summer. Quotes came from Ben and Foley. Approx 6m in total invested. The share spread was also covered in recent articles. As minor shareholders we won’t get any more info than what’s available to the public.

[Eyrie]

When is the deadine for voting?

6pm on Sunday 25th if you want to vote by email.

6pm on Tuesday 27th if you want to vote in person.

[IberianHibernian]

6pm on Sunday 25th if you want to vote by email.

6pm on Tuesday 27th if you want to vote in person.Where is this information available ? I`ve got a few shares and used to get accounts sent to me every year. I haven`t changed address since the last time I received accounts . Important that as many people as possible know when they can vote .

[joe breezy]

Existing shareholders see the value of their shares decrease through dilution but not sure anyone buys shares in Hibs hoping to make a profit

Still I can understand why existing shareholders may be unhappy

I got a trial subscription to read that article then cancelled the subscription after reading

Hibs do have to get things right on the pitch for this to work
Not qualifying for Europe and exiting cups hits hard financially

[Ringothedog]

Existing shareholders see the value of their shares decrease through dilution but not sure anyone buys shares in Hibs hoping to make a profit

Still I can understand why existing shareholders may be unhappy

I got a trial subscription to read that article then cancelled the subscription after reading

Hibs do have to get things right on the pitch for this to work
Not qualifying for Europe and exiting cups hits hard financially
My share of the club will be diluted, that is a fact. The value of my shareholding will probably be the same.I will own a less percentage in a more valuable club.

[joe breezy]

Yeah dilution rather than value - thanks for the correction

[Ringothedog]

Where is this information available ? I`ve got a few shares and used to get accounts sent to me every year. I haven`t changed address since the last time I received accounts . Important that as many people as possible know when they can vote .

The accounts don’t get posted out anymore, they are available on the club website, the other information was posted to shareholders with a voting form and details of how to vote. If you as a shareholder have not received this information then contact the club urgently

[IberianHibernian]

The accounts don’t get posted out anymore, they are available on the club website, the other information was posted to shareholders with a voting form and details of how to vote. If you as a shareholder have not received this information then contact the club urgentlyOk. Thank you .

[PHeffernan]

The most interesting part of the article for me is the word "may" when considered along with the earlier 1st paragraph.

Kensell said: “It took a few conversations with the SFA, that’s for sure, but I have to be honest and say they were pretty constructive. Conditions were imposed, but as we negotiated these reduced in number and complexity and by the time the final deal was hammered out I have to say I was pretty happy with the outcome.

”As part of that agreement, a chunk of the fresh investment will be spent on infrastructure – completing the refurbishment of the Famous Five Stand to create a new Behind the Goals area, and improvements to the training centre which may include a covered, all-weather training pitch amongst other things.

“But there will also be significant funds available to football, have no doubt about that” Kensell added.


"May" is a very different word to "will".
Sounds like the SFA have allowed Hibs too much wiggle room and they will get out of building this covered pitch which would be sad as it's the only necessary infrastructure the club don't have and I fear there will never be another opportunity to build one i.e. we will never have the money in place again.

Fingers crossed my assessment of the semantics is wrong.

[Bakerman]

Yeah dilution rather than value - thanks for the correction

My RBS shares have been vastly diluted since Gordon Brown's financial meltdown. Once worth a small fortune, ouch.

[Bakerman]

The most interesting part of the article for me is the word "may" when considered along with the earlier 1st paragraph.

Kensell said: “It took a few conversations with the SFA, that’s for sure, but I have to be honest and say they were pretty constructive. Conditions were imposed, but as we negotiated these reduced in number and complexity and by the time the final deal was hammered out I have to say I was pretty happy with the outcome.

”As part of that agreement, a chunk of the fresh investment will be spent on infrastructure – completing the refurbishment of the Famous Five Stand to create a new Behind the Goals area, and improvements to the training centre which may include a covered, all-weather training pitch amongst other things.

“But there will also be significant funds available to football, have no doubt about that” Kensell added.


"May" is a very different word to "will".
Sounds like the SFA have allowed Hibs too much wiggle room and they will get out of building this covered pitch which would be sad as it's the only necessary infrastructure the club don't have and I fear there will never be another opportunity to build one i.e. we will never have the money in place again.

Fingers crossed my assessment of the semantics is wrong.

How do you know, that in the event, may build, isn't incorporated, that we'll never have the money in place again? The money you're talking about is nothing to the BK.

[Hibbyradge]

My RBS shares have been vastly diluted since Gordon Brown's financial meltdown. Once worth a small fortune, ouch.

It wasn't Gordon Brown's financial meltdown. It was a global recession and it's widely accepted, across the political spectrum, that Brown deserved huge credit for steering the country away from the worst of it.

:agree:

But yes, RBS were hit hard but that was because of the cavalier attitude it had to risk.

[Bakerman]

It wasn't Gordon Brown's financial meltdown. It was a global recession and it's widely accepted, across the political spectrum, that Brown deserved huge credit for steering the country away from the worst of it.

:agree:

But yes, RBS were hit hard but that was because of the cavalier attitude it had to risk.

It was a global recession indeed, i just blame everyone at that time for my small fortune disappearing into the abyss :greengrin

[Hibbyradge]

It was a global recession indeed, i just blame everyone at that time for my small fortune disappearing into the abyss :greengrin

Understandable. I know a few folk who had significant losses. The funny thing is that it didn't really affect their day to day lives at all, because the losses were investments not income or ready capital.

You seem about as stoic about it as they were. 👍

[Bakerman]

Understandable. I know a few folk who had significant losses. The funny thing is that it didn't really affect their day to day lives at all, because the losses were investments not income or ready capital.

You seem about as stoic about it as they were. 👍


i am, it was an inheritance, I'm very nonplussed really. Just annoyed at the dilution that we have no control over. :aok: I've since made another small fortune Mon the Hibs :greengrin

[El Gubbz]

Loads of articles across the press. Around £3m on infra and a few million for players in the summer. Quotes came from Ben and Foley. Approx 6m in total invested. The share spread was also covered in recent articles. As minor shareholders we won’t get any more info than what’s available to the public.

If fans are voting for the fan ownership % to drop way below the 25.1% safety net and potentially to 0% at the next takeover (as per changes to articles of association) I’d be wanting much more black and white assurances than a bit of gossip from a couple businessmen with no non-monetary skin in the game.

Don’t think you should be so dismissive of fans who want to do a bit of due diligence on the future of our club.

You’re allowed to support the club and be concerned about an irreversible change to ownership (for a potential one off windfall) such as the current proposal.

[El Gubbz]

My share of the club will be diluted, that is a fact. The value of my shareholding will probably be the same.I will own a less percentage in a more valuable club.

If you owned 10% of the club today, that would be worth 4.5% after the vote.

You’d need the value of the club to increase by more than double for your summation to be true - unfortunately it won’t.

[JohnM1875]

The most interesting part of the article for me is the word "may" when considered along with the earlier 1st paragraph.

Kensell said: “It took a few conversations with the SFA, that’s for sure, but I have to be honest and say they were pretty constructive. Conditions were imposed, but as we negotiated these reduced in number and complexity and by the time the final deal was hammered out I have to say I was pretty happy with the outcome.

”As part of that agreement, a chunk of the fresh investment will be spent on infrastructure – completing the refurbishment of the Famous Five Stand to create a new Behind the Goals area, and improvements to the training centre which may include a covered, all-weather training pitch amongst other things.

“But there will also be significant funds available to football, have no doubt about that” Kensell added.


"May" is a very different word to "will".
Sounds like the SFA have allowed Hibs too much wiggle room and they will get out of building this covered pitch which would be sad as it's the only necessary infrastructure the club don't have and I fear there will never be another opportunity to build one i.e. we will never have the money in place again.

Fingers crossed my assessment of the semantics is wrong.

If they think it'll add value and benefit the team then it'll happen. Owners have already shown they're willing to invest in such things. That's before the added Black Knight investment.

Personally rather see it spent on the playing squad.

[CapitalGreen]

The most interesting part of the article for me is the word "may" when considered along with the earlier 1st paragraph.

Kensell said: “It took a few conversations with the SFA, that’s for sure, but I have to be honest and say they were pretty constructive. Conditions were imposed, but as we negotiated these reduced in number and complexity and by the time the final deal was hammered out I have to say I was pretty happy with the outcome.

”As part of that agreement, a chunk of the fresh investment will be spent on infrastructure – completing the refurbishment of the Famous Five Stand to create a new Behind the Goals area, and improvements to the training centre which may include a covered, all-weather training pitch amongst other things.

“But there will also be significant funds available to football, have no doubt about that” Kensell added.


"May" is a very different word to "will".
Sounds like the SFA have allowed Hibs too much wiggle room and they will get out of building this covered pitch which would be sad as it's the only necessary infrastructure the club don't have and I fear there will never be another opportunity to build one i.e. we will never have the money in place again.

Fingers crossed my assessment of the semantics is wrong.

May because we need to seek and gain planning permission approval from East Lothian council before we can build such a facility.

[Chipper1875]

Loads of articles across the press. Around £3m on infra and a few million for players in the summer. Quotes came from Ben and Foley. Approx 6m in total invested. The share spread was also covered in recent articles. As minor shareholders we won’t get any more info than what’s available to the public.

So shareholders haven’t been told then. And you are using quotes from the press . Last thing ld be doing is trusting what the press say. I’d be suprised if there isn’t a presentation on the BK investment to woo shareholders and facilitate a positive vote and AGM

[Chipper1875]

If fans are voting for the fan ownership % to drop way below the 25.1% safety net and potentially to 0% at the next takeover (as per changes to articles of association) I’d be wanting much more black and white assurances than a bit of gossip from a couple businessmen with no non-monetary skin in the game.

Don’t think you should be so dismissive of fans who want to do a bit of due diligence on the future of our club.

You’re allowed to support the club and be concerned about an irreversible change to ownership (for a potential one off windfall) such as the current proposal.
Great post .

[Brightside]

It wasn't Gordon Brown's financial meltdown. It was a global recession and it's widely accepted, across the political spectrum, that Brown deserved huge credit for steering the country away from the worst of it.

:agree:

But yes, RBS were hit hard but that was because of the cavalier attitude it had to risk.

A little off track but Brown did encourage the ABN buy out. He loved the idea of RBS becoming a world powerhouse. He had many liquid lunches with Fred back then.

[Brightside]

So shareholders haven’t been told then. And you are using quotes from the press . Last thing ld be doing is trusting what the press say. I’d be suprised if there isn’t a presentation on the BK investment to woo shareholders and facilitate a positive vote and AGM

Minor shareholders like us will get told nothing tbh. As it always the case. Our shares are really just symbolism. I’ve got shares in other companies and I get even less information from them. My original point was there is nothing in that article that hasn’t already been announced.

[superfurryhibby]

A little off track but Brown did encourage the ABN buy out. He loved the idea of RBS becoming a world powerhouse. He had many liquid lunches with Fred back then.

Yes, well off track but nonsense. RBS were already a global powerhouse and the idea that Brown had influence on their reckless investments is ludicrous.

[Since90+2]

Yes, well off track but nonsense. RBS were already a global powerhouse and the idea that Brown had influence on their reckless investments is ludicrous.

Yup. RBS at one point were the largest company in the world by assets, close to 2 trillion. The idea that they needed the buy out to become a world powerhouse is simply not correct.

[Hibs4185]

It wasn't Gordon Brown's financial meltdown. It was a global recession and it's widely accepted, across the political spectrum, that Brown deserved huge credit for steering the country away from the worst of it.

:agree:

But yes, RBS were hit hard but that was because of the cavalier attitude it had to risk.

Global recession caused by RBS and Fred goodwin’s ego driven purchase of ABN Amro.

Off topic sorry

[Hibby Kay-Yay]

A very choreographed piece which I suspect was written to order and clearly aimed at getting the ducks in a row for the AGM Foley vote.
This weeks very public complaint to the SFA about Saturdays VAR decision is another obvious PR job to get all supporters onside including those attending the AGM.

Damned if they do, damned if they don’t.

[Brightside]

Yes, well off track but nonsense. RBS were already a global powerhouse and the idea that Brown had influence on their reckless investments is ludicrous.

The FSA report stated Gordon Brown encouraged "light touch" regulation in order to help the deal go through. That came after many meetings between the two. I saw GB with my own eyes at least 3 times over a 3 month period.

It was the ABN deal that killed RBS. Again as per the FSA report. and that deal was actively encouraged by the PM at the time. Fred Goodwin was a megalomaniac but was at no point put off by the UK government.

[CropleyWasGod]

When is the deadine for voting?


6pm on Sunday 25th if you want to vote by email.

6pm on Tuesday 27th if you want to vote in person.

I don't think that's correct.

That's the time of the meeting. The vote itself will be taken at the meeting; you don't need to vote in advance of it if you're going.

There is a stinger, though, which I don't think applied in the past. You need to tell them in advance if you are going. [email protected]

[RMQ1967]

I don't think that's correct.

That's the time of the meeting. The vote itself will be taken at the meeting; you don't need to vote in advance of it if you're going.

There is a stinger, though, which I don't think applied in the past. You need to tell them in advance if you are going. [email protected]

Where are you seeing that CWG? I got this yesterday but no mention of advance notification that you're attending:

"We would like to remind members that the Hibernian Supporters Annual General Meeting takes place at the Hibernian Supporters Association at Sunnyside at 7pm tomorrow.
The meeting will be held in the Pat Stanton Suite which is located upstairs within the club.

We want to take this opportunity to encourage as many of our members as possible to attend the meeting tomorrow evening, given it is one of the most important AGMs we’ve held to date with much to be discussed.
A strong attendance will ensure we are well placed ahead of the club’s AGM next week, which will also be an important event.

Please note only full members of Hibernian Supporters will be entitled to attend the AGM and to place a vote.

If you have any questions, or would like to discuss anything with us by email, please contact us on [email protected].

James Adie
Hibernian Supporters chairman"

[nonshinyfinish]

Where are you seeing that CWG? I got this yesterday but no mention of advance notification that you're attending:

"We would like to remind members that the Hibernian Supporters Annual General Meeting takes place at the Hibernian Supporters Association at Sunnyside at 7pm tomorrow.
The meeting will be held in the Pat Stanton Suite which is located upstairs within the club.

We want to take this opportunity to encourage as many of our members as possible to attend the meeting tomorrow evening, given it is one of the most important AGMs we’ve held to date with much to be discussed.
A strong attendance will ensure we are well placed ahead of the club’s AGM next week, which will also be an important event.

Please note only full members of Hibernian Supporters will be entitled to attend the AGM and to place a vote.

If you have any questions, or would like to discuss anything with us by email, please contact us on [email protected].

James Adie
Hibernian Supporters chairman"

That's the HSL AGM.

[RMQ1967]

That's the HSL AGM.

Ahhh thanks - :brickwall:brickwall

[GreenPJ]

A very choreographed piece which I suspect was written to order and clearly aimed at getting the ducks in a row for the AGM Foley vote.
This weeks very public complaint to the SFA about Saturdays VAR decision is another obvious PR job to get all supporters onside including those attending the AGM.

and..........?

[GreenPJ]

Understandable. I know a few folk who had significant losses. The funny thing is that it didn't really affect their day to day lives at all, because the losses were investments not income or ready capital.

You seem about as stoic about it as they were. 👍

There were a lot of staff members who had shares and were using that towards retirement planning - it might have not impacted the today but the tomorrow it certainly did.

[Eyrie]

I don't think that's correct.

That's the time of the meeting. The vote itself will be taken at the meeting; you don't need to vote in advance of it if you're going.

There is a stinger, though, which I don't think applied in the past. You need to tell them in advance if you are going. [email protected]

That's what I meant to say - you need to be there to vote on the 27th.

In my defence it was well past bed time when I posted.

[CropleyWasGod]

That's what I meant to say - you need to be there to vote on the 27th.

In my defence it was well past bed time when I posted.

Gotcha.:greengrin

I'm still waiting on clarification on whether it's BST or GMT :rolleyes:

[Bakerman]

There were a lot of staff members who had shares and were using that towards retirement planning - it might have not impacted the today but the tomorrow it certainly did.

Definitely. The high street local banks like RBS, and BOS, etc have never fully recovered from the global recession of 2007/08. It was a catastrophe not seen since the great depression of the thirties. Plus the fact, that most of it is online now, with local branches shutting down in droves. I feel very sorry for a lot of the staff, who not only watched their shares plummet, but also hundreds if not thousands of branches closed or closing. Apologies for taking the thread slightly off track last night.

[superfurryhibby]

The FSA report stated Gordon Brown encouraged "light touch" regulation in order to help the deal go through. That came after many meetings between the two. I saw GB with my own eyes at least 3 times over a 3 month period.

It was the ABN deal that killed RBS. Again as per the FSA report. and that deal was actively encouraged by the PM at the time. Fred Goodwin was a megalomaniac but was at no point put off by the UK government.

I think you need to read that article again.

The changes to banking regulation occurred long before the ANB deal was ever conceived.

Brown and Goodwin were friends, but Goodwin ran the bank and I doubt very much that he consulted the then Prime Minister on the fine detail of RBS’s recklessness. Some of his own board members admitted that they didn’t understand the risk or fine detail of that totally irresponsible venture.

[IberianHibernian]

If fans are voting for the fan ownership % to drop way below the 25.1% safety net and potentially to 0% at the next takeover (as per changes to articles of association) I’d be wanting much more black and white assurances than a bit of gossip from a couple businessmen with no non-monetary skin in the game.

Don’t think you should be so dismissive of fans who want to do a bit of due diligence on the future of our club.

You’re allowed to support the club and be concerned about an irreversible change to ownership (for a potential one off windfall) such as the current proposal.An excellent post and unfortunate that thread has been hijacked by Gordon Brown debate . Worrying word is " irreversible " . Hopefully that is not the case and we as supporters can get our act together and turn things round if coming changes are confirmed and don`t lead to results ( on and off field ) many are hoping for .

[greenlex]

An excellent post and unfortunate that thread has been hijacked by Gordon Brown debate . Worrying word is " irreversible " . Hopefully that is not the case and we as supporters can get our act together and turn things round if coming changes are confirmed and don`t lead to results ( on and off field ) many are hoping for .
What results on the field are many hoping for that you hope this doesn’t lead to? :confused:

[IberianHibernian]

What results on the field are many hoping for that you hope this doesn’t lead to? :confused:Not sure if I`ve expressed myself badly but I`ve read it several times and certainly understand what I meant to say . If proposed measures take place and club is in a bad way on and off field in next year or 5 or ten years` time then it`s important that we`re not starting from zero with saving our club . Many supporters seem to think that a few million pounds will see our club suddenly become more successful ( whatever that means ) and are prepared to get that " success " at the expense of how club is run and even worse endanger existence of club .

[tamig]

The FSA report stated Gordon Brown encouraged "light touch" regulation in order to help the deal go through. That came after many meetings between the two. I saw GB with my own eyes at least 3 times over a 3 month period.

It was the ABN deal that killed RBS. Again as per the FSA report. and that deal was actively encouraged by the PM at the time. Fred Goodwin was a megalomaniac but was at no point put off by the UK government.

Goodwin didn’t want to lose face by letting Barclays “win” ABN. Nothing to do with government backing or ambitions to become bigger. They were already a behemoth at that point. RBS had a reputation for carrying out forensic due diligence on their acquisitions as they grew. The ABN purchase was the only one where that approach wasn’t followed. Because the CEO was insistent it had to be bought.