Rory Whittaker

[andrew_dundee]

He's a decent player with a good potential, but I don't think he's really ready for first team football yet (too many mistakes etc).

I don't mean that as a criticism as he's obviously young and puts in a shift and him having been playing so much is in part because of a lack of options.

I'm also a bit wary of the demoralising impact on him of playing in drubbing after drubbing.

Now that we have more defenders, would it be worth loaning him out for experience or do you think we should keep him in and around the first team?

[DIXIHIBS]

He's a decent player with a good potential, but I don't think he's really ready for first time football yet (too many mistakes etc).

I don't mean that as a criticism as he's obviously young and puts in a shift and him having been playing so much is in part because of a lack of options.

I'm also a bit wary of the demoralising impact on him of playing in drubbing after drubbing.

Now that we have more defenders, would it be worth loaning him out for experience or do you think we should keep him in and around the first team?

Some protection from players in front of him might help the laddie. Not ready yet though.

[hfc-1875]

Let’s be serious, he’s not a decent player(yet) is he? Not knocking him he’s a young boy who could go on to have a good career but he should be nowhere near hibs starting 11 if we want to be where we should be.

[JohnM1875]

Let’s be serious, he’s not a decent player(yet) is he? Not knocking him he’s a young boy who could go on to have a good career but he should be nowhere near hibs starting 11 if we want to be where we should be.

Totally. He's a 16 year old boy so he's never going to be a decent player for this level. Was honestly shocked when I seen him starting today.

Still clapped the laddie when he was subbed off. Won't blame him at all for that today

[VoltaireHibs]

He's a decent player with a good potential, but I don't think he's really ready for first time football yet (too many mistakes etc).

I don't mean that as a criticism as he's obviously young and puts in a shift and him having been playing so much is in part because of a lack of options.

I'm also a bit wary of the demoralising impact on him of playing in drubbing after drubbing.

Now that we have more defenders, would it be worth loaning him out for experience or do you think we should keep him in and around the first team?


Good young player. The fact he's not disgracing himself out there at his age is testament to that. However, for his own sake he should be away on loan. Tricky going back to youth level after playing first team football. He's also being targeted by opposing teams, naturally enough, and that's doing him no favours. A talented boy being asked to do a mans job.

[hfc-1875]

Totally. He's a 16 year old boy so he's never going to be a decent player for this level. Was honestly shocked when I seen him starting today.

Still clapped the laddie when he was subbed off. Won't blame him at all for that today

Absolutely, as I say not knocking the boy always gives his all. But to be relying on a 16 year old at right back is madness

[GreenNWhiteArmy]

He might be a decent player. He's a boy not ready to play at this level yet though. Which isn't his fault

I'm disappointed in how monty treated Megwa tbh. Brought back, started then punted back to bench.

Get Rory back to development and megwa back to airdrie

[ScottB]

Asking him to perform in a struggling team that can barely buy a win isn’t fair, or probably of much benefit to him.

[Willis1875]

Not a slight on the lad at all but can anybody that watched or even semi regularly watched the development/youths shed some light on him at that level?
He wasn’t a name I had heard of too often in comparison to Megwa,Aiken,O’Connor,Laidlaw etc so kind of concluded that he wasn’t really too much of a stand out at that level.
Montgomery seems to have taken a shine to him from the off to the point that one of his first acts as manager was to offload Megwa and promote Whittaker into the first team picture.
It could very well be that he showed up well in training early into the managers tenure so was given an opportunity but it also feels a bit forced like he’s trying to live up to having a reputation of moulding young footballers

[HibeeMackenzie]

Montgomery is going to absolutely ruin the laddie playing him when he’s clearly not anywhere near the level, especially keeping him on as long as he did in such a toxic atmosphere today

[VoltaireHibs]

He might be a decent player. He's a boy not ready to play at this level yet though. Which isn't his fault

I'm disappointed in how monty treated Megwa tbh. Brought back, started then punted back to bench.

Get Rory back to development and megwa back to airdrie


I agree re Whittaker, but not sure about Megwa. We need to make sure Cadden doesn't break down again and that Miller is back to decent form. I feel for the lad, the situation isn't ideal and Airdrie is probably what's best for him now, but the team needs that cover for the moment.

[Bobby's Cinema]

Asking him to perform in a struggling team that can barely buy a win isn’t fair, or probably of much benefit to him.
Exactly. He had a good cameo coming off the bench for debut when we were 3-0 up stroking the ball about and almost got in with a goal. No doubt he is a promising young player and he has shown he is capable of slotting in when required since then. But it's not going to work in this sort of environment.

We don't give young guys a chance at all and then we bring one in and ask him to do all too much. Can we not get the balance right.

[Smartie]

I feel heart sorry for him.

This can be doing him no good at all.

He needs to disappear for a year or two, develop a bit physically, get experience at a level appropriate for his age and physical development and come back when he’s ready - hopefully at a time when our first team setting is a good bit less toxic.

[davym7062]

Some protection from players in front of him might help the laddie. Not ready yet though.

yep... another young boy hibs are gonna ruin

[B.H.F.C]

Him playing is absolutely ridiculous. He’s so far off being ready and able. That’s absolutely no criticism of Whittaker but teams just so obviously target him. Not even by doing anything particularly good, just clipping the ball in behind him etc.

We’re not benefiting from playing him and he’s not going to benefit from it either. It’ll crush him. Get him back playing with the 18s and development team where he should be at 16.

[Musselbound]

He might be a decent player. He's a boy not ready to play at this level yet though. Which isn't his fault

I'm disappointed in how monty treated Megwa tbh. Brought back, started then punted back to bench.

Get Rory back to development and megwa back to airdrie

The most baffling selection for me today was dropping Megwa for Whittaker. Fine to bring back Megwa if he is going to play him or even have him as the main backup but I don't know what message this sends out.

[jeffers]

The most baffling selection for me today was dropping Megwa for Whittaker. Fine to bring back Megwa if he is going to play him or even have him as the main backup but I don't know what message this sends out.

And then bringing Megwa on for Whittaker. Another strange decision like Paul Hanlon coming on for Rocky or vice versa.

[David90+2]

What a lot of rubbish!!

Rory was excellent today, he was woefully exposed by Taveres, then later Yoan in front of him.

Anyone criticising Rory Whittaker, needs to give themselves a serious shake!!!

[JohnM1875]

And then bringing Megwa on for Whittaker. Another strange decision like Paul Hanlon coming on for Rocky or vice versa.

Guessing your point is Rocky shouldn't start over Hanlon? Cause subbing Whittaker for Megwa was about the only right call of today, the laddie was spent.

[BILLYHIBS]

And then bringing Megwa on for Whittaker. Another strange decision like Paul Hanlon coming on for Rocky or vice versa.

The Hanlon Rocky thing or viz a viz was usually with 20 minutes to go and always started with the loss of a goal

Never mess with your defence

I like Rocky but also happy with Hanlon

[B.H.F.C]

What a lot of rubbish!!

Rory was excellent today, he was woefully exposed by Taveres, then later Yoan in front of him.

Anyone criticising Rory Whittaker, needs to give themselves a serious shake!!!

He wasn’t excellent, you can’t really think that surely. But nobody is criticising him for it really. He’s been put out in to mens football at 16 when he’s not ready for it. Any criticism isn’t being aimed at him.

[neil7908]

He's not ready to be playing week in, week out at our level and I'd suggest playing in this current Hibs team is more likely to hinder his development.

That's absolutely no criticism of him - what was Messi doing at 16 after all. It's almost unheard of for 16 year olds to be getting a game at a half decent level.

[AL-Qaholik]

His development is being absolutely torpedoed by being thrust into a truly awful football team bereft of confidence and basic footballing competence.

[easty]

Being flung under a bus in the current set up

Must be an absolute dream to be part of the first team squad, but now he’s starting in a defence that’s absolutely bereft of any consistency, organisation or leadership.

Today is a shambles. Expecting a boy to be able to play at right back at the top level in Scotland with 2 other inexperienced guys inside him.

Give the laddie a fighting chance for ****s sake. He’s not learning a thing being a part of this back 4.

[CB Hibs 68]

What a lot of rubbish!!

Rory was excellent today, he was woefully exposed by Taveres, then later Yoan in front of him.

Anyone criticising Rory Whittaker, needs to give themselves a serious shake!!!No sorry but the majority of posts are correct.Not one of them are criticising Rory.We all recognise he is a lad with potential but that is what he is .This is all down to Montgomery and you are right that having Jair on the same wing left him exposed .He needs time out of the first team to develop .

[David90+2]

He wasn’t excellent, you can’t really think that surely. But nobody is criticising him for it really. He’s been put out in to mens football at 16 when he’s not ready for it. Any criticism isn’t being aimed at him.

I do think he was excellent.

Why can’t I think that???? Of the 16 Hibs players today, Whittaker would be in my top 3. I appreciate that the bar is not particularly high…….but he is as good today.

Tell me your qualifications to disagree….

[andrew70]

He’s being hung out to dry unfortunately. He’s an honest lad and will know. For that reason I am glad he got a decent reaction when he went off because sometimes we are too quick to get on our own backs.

[JohnM1875]

I do think he was excellent.

Why can’t I think that???? Of the 16 Hibs players today, Whittaker would be in my top 3. I appreciate that the bar is not particularly high…….but he is as good today.

Tell me your qualifications to disagree….

Excellent? We got beat by three goals at home and they targeted him the whole time he was on the pitch. Its admirable backing a homegrown player, but not a single player was remotely close to excellent today.

[B.H.F.C]

I do think he was excellent.

Why can’t I think that???? Of the 16 Hibs players today, Whittaker would be in my top 3. I appreciate that the bar is not particularly high…….but he is as good today.

Tell me your qualifications to disagree….

There isn’t a single Hibs player on that park who can be described as excellent.

You’re entitled to think whatever you want. They targeted him from the off and he didn’t cope (which is hardly surprising). I think you’ll be the only person who left the stadium today thinking he was excellent.

[Simkin911]

There wasn’t an excellent player wearing a Hibs shirt on show today,
One of the worst first half performances I’ve watched at ER in many years and no player managed to rise above it.

[jeffers]

Guessing your point is Rocky shouldn't start over Hanlon? Cause subbing Whittaker for Megwa was about the only right call of today, the laddie was spent.

No though I’d never start Rocky over Hanlon, but having started him I never saw the point in then taking him off when he wasn’t injured. I thought it was poor management dropping Megwa in the first place and starting Whittaker.

[Onceinawhile]

Airdrie obviously need a right back, can we maybe send him out there?

He's obviously got something, but at this moment he isn't good enough and Montgomery is absolutely not helping by putting players who won't track back in front of him.

[JohnM1875]

No though I’d never start Rocky over Hanlon, but having started him I never saw the point in then taking him off when he wasn’t injured. I thought it was poor management dropping Megwa in the first place and starting Whittaker.

Agree about dropping Megwa, but to my eye Whittaker was absolutely spent by the time he was subbed off so the sub made sense.

[SaulGoodman]

Development is being ruined due to being the current incumbents vanity project.

[SON OF PADDY]

Montgomery is going to absolutely ruin the laddie playing him when he’s clearly not anywhere near the level, especially keeping him on as long as he did in such a toxic atmosphere today

I concur, we need to protect these young laddies.

[BoyledEgg]

What a lot of rubbish!!

Rory was excellent today, he was woefully exposed by Taveres, then later Yoan in front of him.

Anyone criticising Rory Whittaker, needs to give themselves a serious shake!!!

Can’t pass, can’t tackle, not got much pace. Play him where he should be playing for the next 2/3 years, and get him away from the first team. No where near ready.

[LeithMike]

When he first played, he played in midfield. I don’t know why he then went to right back. He has ability but it doesn’t look to me that he knows the position he is being asked to play. Full back is a very specialist position and not an easy position to play as Delferriere shows.

Stand to be corrected but I’d be hugely surprised if he’s played as a defender in the youth team.

That’s not on him, that’s on the manager.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[andrew70]

When he first played, he played in midfield. I don’t know why he then went to right back. He has ability but it doesn’t look to me that he knows the position he is being asked to play. Full back is a very specialist position and not an easy position to play as Delferriere shows.

Stand to be corrected but I’d be hugely surprised if he’s played as a defender in the youth team.

That’s not on him, that’s on the manager.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

He played right back for the 18s in the games I’ve seen.

[Vault Boy]

Completely agree with the OP. Absolutely no slight on our youngest ever player, he’s been given a mammoth task and it’s simply before he’s ready for it. There’s nothing wrong with that, he’s got years to develop. But it’s on the football department to recognise that, protect him, and plug the gap that he’s filling.

Clearly that hasn’t happened yet.

[Since452]

Being hung out to dry by Montgomery. Said it when he was appointed that I was worried about how much he was taking about playing youngsters and got the feeling he was going to shoehorn them in. That's fine if they're good enough and ready. Rory isn't either.

[LaMotta]

Spoke to a boy recently who played with Hibs youth team last season - now released an doing well at another team. He said the boys he knows at Hibs all cant believe that Whittaker and Landers have been given a chance in the first team.

Worrying take.

[Gettin' Auld]

Promising 16 year olds should get the occasional run out when the team is doing well, like his first appearance from the bench. Unless he's strong mentally, his confidence must be shot to bits and that's down to the manager. It doesn't help that he gets little protection from the wide players in front of him either.

[Fuzzywuzzy]

Did the same not happen with Cochrane at hearts? Career took him down the leagues

[hibee-boys]

I’ve seen nothing from this lad that has led me to believe he was ready for first team football, irrespective of his age. Introducing him so early seemed more like a desperate act to try and endear himself to supporters. Fine, stick him on right midfield with a few minutes to go when we’ve got a game sewn up but to have put him in the spotlight has had the opposite effect. The fact he’s compounded the problem by playing Jair in front of him is even worse. Get him back in the under 18s or this could have a serious impact on his future chances.

[LewysGot2]

A couple of things about this.

Who let this situation transpire? That's the actual question we need an answer to.

We knew at the start of the season Cadds was out. At that time Miller wasn't an international so maybe wouldn't have been seen as likely to be away for these unfortunately timed Asian international things but as soon as he started getting selected for Australia someone should have been all over the strategy for getting through the Christmas period and January/early Feb.

What we ended up with was 2 kids, one only 16 and the other only 19 to somehow shore up a defence that leaked goals from crossed balls for fun. On top of that we had the prospect of one CB being away to sit on a bench for 6 weeks in Cote d'Ivoire. Another CB who is only 20 himself...its a dereliction of squad succession planning and continuity planning.


Whoever thought relying on an outfield defence of average age of just over 21 years
would work in a Scottish league rammed full of players like Gogic doesn't understand Scottish football.

St Mirren are succeeding points wise because they all know their jobs, they have a simple football philosophy, they all work hard, can be aggressive and streetwise when need be, understand the manager's plan and just get on with it.

What they don't live with is the pressure of expectation.
What they also don't live with is a plan that can't adapt.

I thought this morning I'd feel better but I don't.

[Forza Fred]

Those that shout "play the youngsters, they can't be any worse"hopefully now realise they can be.

Not Rory's fault...he's being left hanging out to dry.

The youngsters need to be blooded...not slaughtered.

Think it best for Rory's development if he has a loan spell at a club who are not fighting for survival...like we are at the moment.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Let’s be serious, he’s not a decent player(yet) is he? Not knocking him he’s a young boy who could go on to have a good career but he should be nowhere near hibs starting 11 if we want to be where we should be.

This.

He’s probably a League Two player at this point in time. That’s not to be sniffed at, that’s a high level for a 16 year old. He shouldn’t be anywhere near our team at this point though and the fact people have held it up as a positive about Montgomery is incredible. He’s going to ruin the young lad whilst also ruining our team.

[J-C]

Young lad who should be nowhere near our 1st team yet, promising youngster but we need to be careful not to ruin him and his confidence.

[erin go bragh]

His lack of pace is shocking and playing him at right back is crazy.

[EVENTUALLY]

Young lad who should be nowhere near our 1st team yet, promising youngster but we need to be careful not to ruin him and his confidence.


His lack of pace is shocking and playing him at right back is crazy.

Rory will be a very good player in time, but not as a full back. I don't think I've seen him win a race with an opponent yet. He has composure and decent passing ability with lots of energy however he is simply not ready yet to be an effective 1st team player. The manager has exposed him and drawn criticism his way.

[The Modfather]

Being hung out to dry by Montgomery. Said it when he was appointed that I was worried about how much he was taking about playing youngsters and got the feeling he was going to shoehorn them in. That's fine if they're good enough and ready. Rory isn't either.

To be fair I think there’s A LOT that can be labelled at Montgommery but shoehorning youngsters isn’t one. His options the last few games have been either Megwa or Whittaker at RB. It was a mistake not to play Megwa yesterday. However we’ve seen the likes of Landers and Rudi drop out of the squad once players have been returning. I expect the same of Whittaker, and possibly Megwa, once Miller returns and Cadden is fit enough to play.

[LunasBoots]

Was hung out to dry by the management team and Jair yesterday, hes got a lot of potential to be a good player for us but is still at development stage, if hes part of the team fair enough keep him in amongst the first team so he can grow into a better player but i dont think hes at all ready to be starting games.

[MKHIBEE]

I felt sorry for him yesterday. Playing in a crap team at such young age doesn’t help him or us. Nobody giving him protection and nobody showing for a ball in front of him, it was a ball backwards or hoof forward for the most part. Not his fault, he is not ready for the first team, especially one as bad as this

[MKHIBEE]

Did the same not happen with Cochrane at hearts? Career took him down the leagues
That is my worry about Rory, he needs nurturing and developing, not hung out to dry

[hibsbollah]

Totally. He's a 16 year old boy so he's never going to be a decent player for this level. Was honestly shocked when I seen him starting today.

Still clapped the laddie when he was subbed off. Won't blame him at all for that today

I was dreading him coming over to the East for a throw in because the atmosphere had got pretty toxic. To be fair he got a decent reception because most fans aren’t stupid and know he’s still young (6 months younger than my boy in fact, crazy).

[The Modfather]

I was dreading him coming over to the East for a throw in because the atmosphere had got pretty toxic. To be fair he got a decent reception because most fans aren’t stupid and know he’s still young (6 months younger than my boy in fact, crazy).

Can your boy play central midfield? Or defend crosses?

[NC1875]

To be fair I think there’s A LOT that can be labelled at Montgommery but shoehorning youngsters isn’t one. His options the last few games have been either Megwa or Whittaker at RB. It was a mistake not to play Megwa yesterday. However we’ve seen the likes of Landers and Rudi drop out of the squad once players have been returning. I expect the same of Whittaker, and possibly Megwa, once Miller returns and Cadden is fit enough to play.


That’s where his insistence on 4 at the back lets Nm down though. We only have 2 young boys at right back, none of them are ready for the first team.

He could have went to 3 at the back, put an extra man in midfield and I actually think we’d have been a better team for it.

But we know he’s not going to change it. And it will, eventually see him emptied.

He sees giving Whittaker his debut and continual playing time as some achievement when it’s clear to everyone the boys not ready for first team football.

[Smartie]

That’s where his insistence on 4 at the back lets Nm down though. We only have 2 young boys at right back, none of them are ready for the first team.

He could have went to 3 at the back, put an extra man in midfield and I actually think we’d have been a better team for it.

But we know he’s not going to change it. And it will, eventually see him emptied.

He sees giving Whittaker his debut and continual playing time as some achievement when it’s clear to everyone the boys not ready for first team football.

I passionately disagreed with and criticised the decision to play Whittaker yesterday... but in Monty's defence, we're not yet ready to start Cadden and Miller is away on International duty. With another game on Wednesday I'm assuming he didn't want to play Megwa too much therefore rotated his squad a bit.

As I say - not a decision I agreed with, but arguably had a bit of logic behind it, same if none of our new CMs are actually fit to be starting games (although given our desperate need for points right now, questions maybe need to be asked as to why we're signing anyone that isn't going to be able to make an immediate positive impact from the start of games).

Re 3 at the back - how does he do that with only really 2 fit CBs, unless he plays either Obita or Stevenson in the back 3? And does that give you any more in midfield than Newell / Levitt deep and Marcondes ahead of them, which is what we had anyway and didn't work?

[hibee1875]

Spoke to a boy recently who played with Hibs youth team last season - now released an doing well at another team. He said the boys he knows at Hibs all cant believe that Whittaker and Landers have been given a chance in the first team.

Worrying take.

Reeks of bitterness tbh

[The Modfather]

That’s where his insistence on 4 at the back lets Nm down though. We only have 2 young boys at right back, none of them are ready for the first team.

He could have went to 3 at the back, put an extra man in midfield and I actually think we’d have been a better team for it.

But we know he’s not going to change it. And it will, eventually see him emptied.

He sees giving Whittaker his debut and continual playing time as some achievement when it’s clear to everyone the boys not ready for first team football.

Going 3 at the back isn’t without issue though. Who would we have played at right wingback yesterday? Also given our weakness for defending basic crosses I’m not sure leaving space behind wingbacks would serve us well. Did we even have 3 centre backs available yesterday? Whatever way you cut it, short of throwing in the unfit new signings, it’s a grim set of options whatever you do.

[The Spaceman]

Looks so far off it it’s not even funny. Would loan him out for a couple of seasons to develop. No way should he be anywhere near our starting 11 just now.

[NC1875]

Going 3 at the back isn’t without issue though. Who would we have played at right wingback yesterday? Also given our weakness for defending basic crosses I’m not sure leaving space behind wingbacks would serve us well. Did we even have 3 centre backs available yesterday? Whatever way you cut it, short of throwing in the unfit new signings, it’s a grim set of options whatever you do.

Yeah it wouldn’t have been ideal either but he surely has to mix it up a bit to try and get a reaction.

Megwa and Stevenson as wing backs, Obita at LcH. Would have given us 3 in the middle of the park and able to play 2 strikers rather than 1.

Easy to say in hindsight, and he probably would’ve been slated if we’d been beaten for changing it up anyway.

He also stated he wanted January signings ready to hit the ground running yet we’ve barely any options because they’re clearly not fit.

I’m just pissed off with this team right now.

[LewysGot2]

Depressing thread I hope the kid doesn't read. Can't get my head round a 16 year old getting blasted by what we must assume grown adults for doing the best he can without shirking and with confidence that is a credit to his character. He's a child. It's not his fault he's here - blame everyone who thought that, in a season we were losing players to AfCon and Asian tournaments for best part of 7 weeks and Chris Cadden long term injured that we were somehow OK for this period. Blame the manager, recruitment or any other player who was playing yesterday for not protecting him in any way.

Grown men shouting abuse at him at Forfar and yesterday was simply embarrassing.

He's not (currently) a solution to our problems but he is not the reason for them.

There's a queue of highly paid, older bodies in front of him.

[California-Hibs]

The decision to play him right back is insane. Severe lack of pace and just not ready yet.

[Billy Whizz]

Looks so far off it it’s not even funny. Would loan him out for a couple of seasons to develop. No way should he be anywhere near our starting 11 just now.

You can’t loan out a 16 year old, how does he get to training etc

[LewysGot2]

You can’t loan out a 16 year old, how does he get to training etc

He can't even legally work beyond a certain time at night.

[matty_f]

It’s a difficult conversation to have because I'm sure nobody wants to criticise a 16 year old boy who is being asked to play way above his level but at the same time, he's a first team player so needs to be viewed as such.

He's going to take a lot from the experience but he shouldn't be in the first team at 16, imho. Properly exceptional 16 year olds make it into the first team at this level, generally, and don't think he's at that level.

No question about his effort and he's got years still to develop, but it's incredibly poor from Montgomery to continue to play him when week after week teams are targeting that side.

[B.H.F.C]

It’s a difficult conversation to have because I'm sure nobody wants to criticise a 16 year old boy who is being asked to play way above his level but at the same time, he's a first team player so needs to be viewed as such.

He's going to take a lot from the experience but he shouldn't be in the first team at 16, imho. Properly exceptional 16 year olds make it into the first team at this level, generally, and don't think he's at that level.

No question about his effort and he's got years still to develop, but it's incredibly poor from Montgomery to continue to play him when week after week teams are targeting that side.

They went for him right from kick off yesterday, it was so obvious. Nothing complicated, just put the ball on top of him and behind him.

It was fine when he had to play out of necessity. It’s just stupidity playing him now. I don’t know if Montgomery is just doing it to try and prove a point or whatever but, whatever the reason, he shouldn’t be.

I don’t even think he needs to be loaned out. He’s way ahead of where he should be. Get him back in to the youth and development team where he should be.

[LaMotta]

Reeks of bitterness tbh

Understand you saying that but its not my take from the conversation. Genuine surprise rather than bitterness.

[hibsbollah]

Can your boy play central midfield? Or defend crosses?

:greengrin Keeper. He’s actually played against him. And no, he’s definitely not ready to play in front of more than about 60 people, far less 15,000. Im impressed at Rorys composure in that environment to be honest, it cant be easy. Thats the nature of the job hes chosen of course, but the pressure must be enormous.

[andrew_dundee]

It’s a difficult conversation to have because I'm sure nobody wants to criticise a 16 year old boy who is being asked to play way above his level but at the same time, he's a first team player so needs to be viewed as such.

He's going to take a lot from the experience but he shouldn't be in the first team at 16, imho. Properly exceptional 16 year olds make it into the first team at this level, generally, and don't think he's at that level.

No question about his effort and he's got years still to develop, but it's incredibly poor from Montgomery to continue to play him when week after week teams are targeting that side.

To be fair, I don't think this thread has been critical of him. I thought about it before starting it, but I think almost all of us would agree he's not at fault. He's a young player who is improving and will continue to. My concern is that Monty is playing him before he's ready, and that doesn't often end well.

[Pretty Boy]

Young lad who has been thrown in at the deep end.

I think there is now a fine line between first team experience being invaluable and hammering the lads confidence and setting him back a wee bit. With Miller, Cadden and Megwa all now available or close to being available hopefully we can take him out the firing line for a bit.

I think a decent loan next season will be good for him, gear him up to come back at 18 with 30+ games under his belt and really push on.

He needs well managed from this point and hopefully there is scope now to do so. He's done ok for us but is a wee bit short of being ready imo.

[leftpeg]

Reeks of bitterness tbhCorrect,my son was in the 2007 squad for three years and Rory and Josh were two of the standouts along with a couple of others who have all been given pro contracts

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[Percy Vere]

Depressing thread I hope the kid doesn't read. Can't get my head round a 16 year old getting blasted by what we must assume grown adults for doing the best he can without shirking and with confidence that is a credit to his character. He's a child. It's not his fault he's here - blame everyone who thought that, in a season we were losing players to AfCon and Asian tournaments for best part of 7 weeks and Chris Cadden long term injured that we were somehow OK for this period. Blame the manager, recruitment or any other player who was playing yesterday for not protecting him in any way.

Grown men shouting abuse at him at Forfar and yesterday was simply embarrassing.

He's not (currently) a solution to our problems but he is not the reason for them.

There's a queue of highly paid, older bodies in front of him.

Well said.
He's got great potential and a lot of maturity for such a young player.
I was sat in that corner in the first half and it was obvious after 5 mins he was being targeted by St Mirren. And so it continued but nothing changed, no change of shape or midfield support. Lack of effort from all of the players. I think the worst half of football this season from Hibs. But let's not kid ourselves on this is down to any one player. I don't believe in booing my team or any player (I'll admit I came close), but let's hope for better, can't be hard!

[Hiber-nation]

If you play him or Megwa they need help in front of them. They had Youan and Tavares. Says it all.

[Crab apple]

The decision to play him right back is insane. Severe lack of pace and just not ready yet.

It's the continual selection of Rory and the central midfield pairing that convinces me Monty must go. He's either incredibly stubborn or incredibly stupid.

[Heisenberg]

It's the continual selection of Rory and the central midfield pairing that convinces me Monty must go. He's either incredibly stubborn or incredibly stupid.

The right back situation has been a bit of a mess. Expected Megwa to come back and perform but he cost two goals in his two starts and didn’t look ready either. Miller isn’t brilliant but he’s the best we’ve got till Cadden returns. Hopefully he’s back for Wednesday.

Monty clearly sees the midfield is an issue with the signings he’s made but still started the same pair, it’s baffling.

[B.H.F.C]

The right back situation has been a bit of a mess. Expected Megwa to come back and perform but he cost two goals in his two starts and didn’t look ready either. Miller isn’t brilliant but he’s the best we’ve got till Cadden returns. Hopefully he’s back for Wednesday.

Monty clearly sees the midfield is an issue with the signings he’s made but still started the same pair, it’s baffling.

After all the talk of needing players who could come in and make an impact, to then sign two midfielders and continue with the same ineffective pairing was just stupidity.

[LaMotta]

Correct,my son was in the 2007 squad for three years and Rory and Josh were two of the standouts along with a couple of others who have all been given pro contracts

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The obvious point was they are nowhere near first team ready - which has been categorically proven in recent weeks.

[Paul1642]

Depressing thread I hope the kid doesn't read. Can't get my head round a 16 year old getting blasted by what we must assume grown adults for doing the best he can without shirking and with confidence that is a credit to his character. He's a child. It's not his fault he's here - blame everyone who thought that, in a season we were losing players to AfCon and Asian tournaments for best part of 7 weeks and Chris Cadden long term injured that we were somehow OK for this period. Blame the manager, recruitment or any other player who was playing yesterday for not protecting him in any way.

Grown men shouting abuse at him at Forfar and yesterday was simply embarrassing.

He's not (currently) a solution to our problems but he is not the reason for them.

There's a queue of highly paid, older bodies in front of him.

Missing the point if you think it’s a depressing thread. Rory’s current ability is simply not what we need for a starting right back. If we had an older player performing to his level we would be crucifying him.

He’s not getting blasted and almost every poster on this thread has recognised that Rory is 16 years old and should not be expected to be good enough right now. He needs some time out of the squad and a loan move and I hold high hopes that he will be good enough to re emerge as a first team player aged 19/20

[leftpeg]

The obvious point was they are nowhere near first team ready - which has been categorically proven in recent weeks.I'm not arguing either way as I regard both lads families as friends,just that it was wrong to say they weren't highly rated in the age group,both lads been in the academy since they were ten years old.

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[B.H.F.C]

Missing the point if you think it’s a depressing thread. Rory’s current ability is simply not what we need for a starting right back. If we had an older player performing to his level we would be crucifying him.

He’s not getting blasted and almost every poster on this thread has recognised that Rory is 16 years old and should not be expected to be good enough right now. He needs some time out of the squad and a loan move and I hold high hopes that he will be good enough to re emerge as a first team player aged 19/20

Correct. If anything, I think everyone feels a bit of sympathy for him. He’s not performing well but nobody is blaming him for that, we all realise what stage he’s at and it’s not his fault he’s being put out there.

[LaMotta]

I'm not arguing either way as I regard both lads families as friends,just that it was wrong to say they weren't highly rated in the age group,both lads been in the academy since they were ten years old.

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The comment was that they were amazed they were at the level of playing for the first team, not about being highly rated at that age level.

[Percy Vere]

The right back situation has been a bit of a mess. Expected Megwa to come back and perform but he cost two goals in his two starts and didn’t look ready either. Miller isn’t brilliant but he’s the best we’ve got till Cadden returns. Hopefully he’s back for Wednesday.

Monty clearly sees the midfield is an issue with the signings he’s made but still started the same pair, it’s baffling.

Levitt Jair and Whittaker were mystery selections yesterday.
Guess we aren't privy to fitness issues, niggles and knocks.
Very disappointing but Rory not to blame. He can look at all ten of his team mates (and his manager) in that first half and ask them what the ... 's going on.

[Baader]

It's bad management and no reflection on Rory who is trying his best and is a prospect. Kids that age should be introduced very sparingly to a winning team to build their confidence, not thrown into a side that is on a downward spiral, lacking confidence and leaking goals.

I worry he's now a vanity project for Montgomery to try and prove he will use kids regardless of what they are up against. If that's the case it's all wrong. The manager is not doing him any favours and it's just not fair on the lad. Another black mark I'm afraid and an increasingly cynical looking one given age, fragility and the potential repercussions to young players like Rory having to deal with situations like this so early in their careers. Don't like it one bit.

[jakeshibs]

He's a decent player with a good potential, but I don't think he's really ready for first team football yet (too many mistakes etc).

I don't mean that as a criticism as he's obviously young and puts in a shift and him having been playing so much is in part because of a lack of options.

I'm also a bit wary of the demoralising impact on him of playing in drubbing after drubbing.

Now that we have more defenders, would it be worth loaning him out for experience or do you think we should keep him in and around the first team?


Totally agree with this post and this was evident against St Mirren, just not quite good enough

[Since452]

Depressing thread I hope the kid doesn't read. Can't get my head round a 16 year old getting blasted by what we must assume grown adults for doing the best he can without shirking and with confidence that is a credit to his character. He's a child. It's not his fault he's here - blame everyone who thought that, in a season we were losing players to AfCon and Asian tournaments for best part of 7 weeks and Chris Cadden long term injured that we were somehow OK for this period. Blame the manager, recruitment or any other player who was playing yesterday for not protecting him in any way.

Grown men shouting abuse at him at Forfar and yesterday was simply embarrassing.

He's not (currently) a solution to our problems but he is not the reason for them.

There's a queue of highly paid, older bodies in front of him.

He should be being protected by the management team. If you pull a Hibs shirt on you're always going to be vulnerable to criticism if you or the team are playing poorly. This is where he needs to be taken out of the firing line, or not put in it in the first place.

[Since452]

A couple of things about this.

Who let this situation transpire? That's the actual question we need an answer to.

We knew at the start of the season Cadds was out. At that time Miller wasn't an international so maybe wouldn't have been seen as likely to be away for these unfortunately timed Asian international things but as soon as he started getting selected for Australia someone should have been all over the strategy for getting through the Christmas period and January/early Feb.

What we ended up with was 2 kids, one only 16 and the other only 19 to somehow shore up a defence that leaked goals from crossed balls for fun. On top of that we had the prospect of one CB being away to sit on a bench for 6 weeks in Cote d'Ivoire. Another CB who is only 20 himself...its a dereliction of squad succession planning and continuity planning.


Whoever thought relying on an outfield defence of average age of just over 21 years
would work in a Scottish league rammed full of players like Gogic doesn't understand Scottish football.

St Mirren are succeeding points wise because they all know their jobs, they have a simple football philosophy, they all work hard, can be aggressive and streetwise when need be, understand the manager's plan and just get on with it.

What they don't live with is the pressure of expectation.
What they also don't live with is a plan that can't adapt.

I thought this morning I'd feel better but I don't.

Absolutely crazy eh. Whittaker, Fish and Nectar in the same team. Nuts, and unsurprisingly pumped. Like you say, how on earth did we get to this situation? It's three days after the game and i'm still angry about it. In a way i'm still thankful i care enough to be angry. Apathy is what i'm really worried about.

[Hibee Daft]

Him and Megwa are both great prospects and have alot of potential, maybe im finally going crazy but what about Megwa right back and whittaker right mid so they can track back for each other (our other wingers dont track back)

[neil7908]

Him and Megwa are both great prospects and have alot of potential, maybe im finally going crazy but what about Megwa right back and whittaker right mid so they can track back for each other (our other wingers dont track back)

Trying not to make this a pile on as he's a 16 year old lad but he's looked lost in attacking positions. He just needs a spell out of the first team to grow and progress, same as 99.9% of his peers.

There are almost no footballers that are ready to play week in, week out at 16. It's practically unheard of, and for good reason.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Trying not to make this a pile on as he's a 16 year old lad but he's looked lost in attacking positions. He just needs a spell out of the first team to grow and progress, same as 99.9% of his peers.

There are almost no footballers that are ready to play week in, week out at 16. It's practically unheard of, and for good reason.

This.

The fact our manager has openly come out and bigged himself up for ‘giving the young lad a chance’ is staggering. Whittaker is nowhere near ready, understandably. I’d argue what we’re doing is the opposite of giving him a chance long term, we’ve more chance of ruining him at this rate.

[WestStandWillie]

Whittaker has no protection in front of him. Throwing him to the sharks in that aspect.

He'll rightly go back to the dev squad once Miller and Cadden are back and fit. One of the future definitely. We should also see if it's possible to loan Megwa back to Airdrie as it's a waste of his development sitting on the bench/in the stand here.

[Smartie]

Whittaker has no protection in front of him. Throwing him to the sharks in that aspect.

He'll rightly go back to the dev squad once Miller and Cadden are back and fit. One of the future definitely. We should also see if it's possible to loan Megwa back to Airdrie as it's a waste of his development sitting on the bench/in the stand here.

I'd stick Megwa in the team, tell him he's my first choice to the end of the season and that the jersey is his to lose, whilst being prepared to back him through a few mistakes (like at Killie).

His credentials from his spell at Airdrie are good, he just needs to raise it a little now.

We need stability at the back.

Miller is a known quantity in that he's hopelessly inconsistent. He plays second fiddle this season and can battle it out with Megwa (and possibly a new RB depending on how Megwa does this season) next year.

More importantly - Cadden comes into the team at RM as soon as he is fit to do so - he'll help out at both ends of the pitch no end. I totally agree with your point about Whittaker having no protection.

[Unseen work]

I rate him highly, I really do. His attitude is fantastic, I don’t just mean he works hard I mean when he’s playing he gets right up against the opposition and for me has an arrogance about him for his age which I really like.

He's really composed on the ball and at times attempts the riskier option, it doesn’t always come off as he’s still adapting to the pace and how people at this level read those passes quicker. I also think he’s affected by the crowd at times which maybe forces him to try something given he’s a fan himself.

Those saying the know people at that age group that were stunned he and landers are in the first team just stinks of jealousy imo. Landers seems to score every week for the 18s/development squad and Whittaker has done well for his age. They’re also in due to limited options in the first team.

The only thing I’ll say is I do think Montgomery saw Whittikar and thought here’s a chance for me to get the support on board by giving a debut to a young boy and creating a new record - just something I picked up on in his interviews which I never liked.

But Rory is a good player, he may not be ready yet for week in week out at this level, but what 16/17 year old is? He’ll learn, hopefully go out on loan and improve. I actually think some of his best games for us has been when he came on in midfield

[Since452]

I rate him highly, I really do. His attitude is fantastic, I don’t just mean he works hard I mean when he’s playing he gets right up against the opposition and for me has an arrogance about him for his age which I really like.

He's really composed on the ball and at times attempts the riskier option, it doesn’t always come off as he’s still adapting to the pace and how people at this level read those passes quicker. I also think he’s affected by the crowd at times which maybe forces him to try something given he’s a fan himself.

Those saying the know people at that age group that were stunned he and landers are in the first team just stinks of jealousy imo. Landers seems to score every week for the 18s/development squad and Whittaker has done well for his age. They’re also in due to limited options in the first team.

The only thing I’ll say is I do think Montgomery saw Whittikar and thought here’s a chance for me to get the support on board by giving a debut to a young boy and creating a new record - just something I picked up on in his interviews which I never liked.

But Rory is a good player, he may not be ready yet for week in week out at this level, but what 16/17 year old is? He’ll learn, hopefully go out on loan and improve. I actually think some of his best games for us has been when he came on in midfield

If i'm being honest I'd never heard of Whittaker before he was put in the team by Montgomery. Seemed to come from nowhere. I'm sure he would have played but I didn't notice him in the UEFA youth league games we played last season. Probably says more about me than him to be fair!

[Nicho87]

Once cadden is back up to speed I’d be sending Whittaker out on loan, I believe lower league clubs can still loan from top tier?

If yes, a stint at a league one for 4 months could do him great.