Ceasefire Protest in London on November 11

[wookie70]

There was a really good debate on Nicky Campbell's radio 5 show today. It was about the Ceasefire protests that are arranged on 11 November in London. Among lots of good points there were a few that really stuck out. The 11th November marked a very historic ceasefire and the original poppy message was Never Again so that date is actually the perfect date for this protest and it is happening the day before the ceremony so there is no disrespect here especially as the organisers have said they are aware of the sensitivity of that area and day and will not go to the Cenotaph.

Those against the protest did however demonstrate how important the day was to them albeit they extrapolated that to everyone and that certainly is not the case.

One thing they all agreed on was that Muslims were a big a part of many conflicts that were being remembered. The debate was as it should be with both sides passionate and making their points responsibly and respectfully. Contrast that with our Leaders who are doing everything they can to whip up fear of the protest and make sure there were be plenty British Bulldog nutters there almost guaranteeing trouble. Describing the protest as " provocative and disrespectful," words I would use for a Government ignoring the public yet again on a matter of War. The papers going two footed for Starmer not wearing a Poppy and trying to link it with fear of Muslims makes it another fantastic few days for those that trot out fear and those that despite all we have heard at the Covid Enquiry continue to believe those who lead us.

[Bostonhibby]

There was a really good debate on Nicky Campbell's radio 5 show today. It was about the Ceasefire protests that are arranged on 11 November in London. Among lots of good points there were a few that really stuck out. The 11th November marked a very historic ceasefire and the original poppy message was Never Again so that date is actually the perfect date for this protest and it is happening the day before the ceremony so there is no disrespect here especially as the organisers have said they are aware of the sensitivity of that area and day and will not go to the Cenotaph.

Those against the protest did however demonstrate how important the day was to them albeit they extrapolated that to everyone and that certainly is not the case.

One thing they all agreed on was that Muslims were a big a part of many conflicts that were being remembered. The debate was as it should be with both sides passionate and making their points responsibly and respectfully. Contrast that with our Leaders who are doing everything they can to whip up fear of the protest and make sure there were be plenty British Bulldog nutters there almost guaranteeing trouble. Describing the protest as " provocative and disrespectful," words I would use for a Government ignoring the public yet again on a matter of War. The papers going two footed for Starmer not wearing a Poppy and trying to link it with fear of Muslims makes it another fantastic few days for those that trot out fear and those that despite all we have heard at the Covid Enquiry continue to believe those who lead us.

Very good points well made, there's definitely a deflect and distract agenda around the whole protest and Starmer thing for sure.

I wonder if the media or the Nasty party propagandists picked up on Charlie and "queen" Camilla's lack of the all important poppy when Charlie was delivering Sunak's latest list of promises?

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[grunt]

https://youtu.be/i-fPN16MOw8?si=JMF6QZAq9gUZW8c5

[wookie70]

Very good points well made, there's definitely a deflect and distract agenda around the whole protest and Starmer thing for sure.

I wonder if the media or the Nasty party propagandists picked up on Charlie and "queen" Camilla's lack of the all important poppy when Charlie was delivering Sunak's latest list of promises?

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The PM never had one on when interviewing Musk. The vast majority of teh population don't wear one either. I would never dream of wearing one and I would never be challenged particularly in Scotland where they seem to be few and far between

[wookie70]

https://youtu.be/i-fPN16MOw8?si=JMF6QZAq9gUZW8c5 The vast majority on that march will have similar motivations. Very moving piece and when you hear the tone and restraint from him compared to a woman that is meant to be representing all UK communities through her oversight of policing it is scary how far to the right this county is.

[Bostonhibby]

The PM never had one on when interviewing Musk. The vast majority of teh population don't wear one either. I would never dream of wearing one and I would never be challenged particularly in Scotland where they seem to be few and far betweenI'm surrounded by it, and respect people's right to wear them, it's just a pity many don't respect people's right not to, and their reasons for it.

I always did for historical family reasons but the last couple of years I've kept the donation up as our veterans shouldn't have to rely on charity but they do, I don't wear the badge as the symbolism has become too mixed up with nationalism for me.

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[wookie70]

I'm surrounded by it, and respect people's right to wear them, it's just a pity many don't respect people's right not to, and their reasons for it.

I always did for historical family reasons but the last couple of years I've kept the donation up as our veterans shouldn't have to rely on charity but they do, I don't wear the badge as the symbolism has become too mixed up with nationalism for me.

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If the message had remained Never Again my views may have been different. Even then we are very nearly at the point where every service person who was conscripted has passed. I view them very differently to career service people. The later are doing a job and in general one that is far safer than farming and construction and certainly nowhere near as valuable. I'd be quite happy if there was a remembrance day for workers who had lost their life while doing their jobs but not one that recognises one job above another. Poppies, whether deliberate or not, are political and now it seems so is the whole idea of remembrance day, weekend, week or month whatever it has become. If you didn't think so previously the current Home Secretary has made sure there is no doubt any longer.

I would argue that by keeping up donations you are making it easier for government to rely on you to provide that service. My views are similar in terms of foodbanks but my principles have been overcame by the practicalities of a government that would see, and perhaps enjoy, standing by and watching citizens starve so I have folded and contributed and helped out. I do so so acknowledging I am empowering the government to continue with not meeting their obligations in feeding its citizens.

[Bostonhibby]

If the message had remained Never Again my views may have been different. Even then we are very nearly at the point where every service person who was conscripted has passed. I view them very differently to career service people. The later are doing a job and in general one that is far safer than farming and construction and certainly nowhere near as valuable. I'd be quite happy if there was a remembrance day for workers who had lost their life while doing their jobs but not one that recognises one job above another. Poppies, whether deliberate or not, are political and now it seems so is the whole idea of remembrance day, weekend, week or month whatever it has become. If you didn't think so previously the current Home Secretary has made sure there is no doubt any longer.

I would argue that by keeping up donations you are making it easier for government to rely on you to provide that service. My views are similar in terms of foodbanks but my principles have been overcame by the practicalities of a government that would see, and perhaps enjoy, standing by and watching citizens starve so I have folded and contributed and helped out. I do so so acknowledging I am empowering the government to continue with not meeting their obligations in feeding its citizens.

No problem agreeing with all you say, an awful lot of this is what we have been dragged down to in the last decade or so. The current home secretary is one of the nastiest in a nasty party. Pretty transparent about it too.

I suspect she thinks she has read the mood of the country when I hope she's actually continued her general incompetence and actually just read the mood of the right wing nutters in her own party and beyond that she probably already had on board anyway.

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[Mibbes Aye]

I'd be quite happy if there was a remembrance day for workers who had lost their life while doing their jobs but not one that recognises one job above another.


There is.

International Workers’ Memorial Day falls on April 28, every year.

Remember the dead, fight for the living.......

[Aldo]

I will not deny when I initially heard about the protest being on the same day as Armistice Day event I was outraged/disgusted. I’m ex military, lost a friend during the First Gulf war however fast forward 12 hours and the details of timings route etc were provided and I see no reason why this protest cannot take place. Nowhere near Cenopath and taking place well after the earlier proceedings.

Step Up Braverman who has stirred up racial hatred towards those taking part by her comments. The former met Police Chief Superintendent Sal Babu called it yesterday if the comments were made by a male of female who were white then there would be a witch hunt against them. Regardless of race, colour, gender or ethnicity Braverman should be reported for a hate crime

CPS definition of Hate crime

The law recognises five types of hate crime on the basis of:

Race
Religion
Disability
Sexual orientation
Transgender identity
Any crime can be prosecuted as a hate crime if the offender has either:

demonstrated hostility based on race, religion, disability, sexual orientation or transgender identity
Or

been motivated by hostility based on race, religion, disability, sexual orientation or transgender identity
Someone can be a victim of more than one type of hate crime.

These crimes are covered by legislation (Crime and Disorder Act 1998 and section 66 of the Sentencing Act 2020) which allows prosecutors to apply for an uplift in sentence for those convicted of a hate crime.

The police and the CPS have agreed the following definition for identifying and flagging hate crimes:

"Any criminal offence which is perceived by the victim or any other person, to be motivated by hostility or prejudice, based on a person's disability or perceived disability; race or perceived race; or religion or perceived religion; or sexual orientation or perceived sexual orientation or transgender identity or perceived transgender identity."

There is no legal definition of hostility so we use the everyday understanding of the word which includes ill-will, spite, contempt, prejudice, unfriendliness, antagonism, resentment and dislike.

What she has done is drip fed and planted the seeds into the minds of those with Neanderthal mindset and increased the tensions, putting everyone taking part (including passers-by and police) at more risk.

As I mentioned I was outraged initially however the death of children, elderly and the vulnerable no the innocent should be stopped and I see no reason why both these events cannot take place on the same day.

You can almost write the headlines for Sunday morning media but ultimately I hope everyone can behave and the day passes without serious incidents.

Sorry for the long post!

[Pretty Boy]

I'm sure those poor boys sent to the slaughter in 1914 would have been proud of the respectful scenes at the Cenotaph today.........

The politicisation of the poppy in recent years by those driving a very dangerous agenda is a shameful episode. I've said before that the as the number of people who actually remember the 2 world wars becomes fewer so to does the remeberance element of this weekend. For too many now it's a display in jingoism, patriotism and the glorification of war.

[Bostonhibby]

I'm sure those poor boys sent to the slaughter in 1914 would have been proud of the respectful scenes at the Cenotaph today.........

The politicisation of the poppy in recent years by those driving a very dangerous agenda is a shameful episode. I've said before thatas the number of people who actually remember the 2 world wars becomes fewer so to does the remeberance element of this weekend. For too many now it's a display in jingoism, patriotism and the glorification of war.Ironic, fighting so right wing, dare I say fascist nutters can behave like this on remembrance day?

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[silverhibee]

Ironic, fighting so right wing, dare I say fascist nutters can behave like this on remembrance day?

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Tommy Robinson being chased in Chinatown by police, reports from his buddies is he jumped in a taxi and bolted from the scene, so Patriotic of him.

[stokesmessiah]

Stella Braverman has to be held to account for today. She has whipped this up into a frenzy..

[Bostonhibby]

Tommy Robinson being chased in Chinatown by police, reports from his buddies is he jumped in a taxi and bolted from the scene, so Patriotic of him.It's what pwopa heroes do.

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[Jones28]

Tommy Robinson being chased in Chinatown by police, reports from his buddies is he jumped in a taxi and bolted from the scene, so Patriotic of him.

I’d love to see him get a paggering, him and his pal Farage.

I’ll volunteer actually.

[Hibrandenburg]

I’d love to see him get a paggering, him and his pal Farage.

I’ll volunteer actually.

Join the queue.

[Ozyhibby]

I’d love to see him get a paggering, him and his pal Farage.

I’ll volunteer actually.

The midget has about ten wall punchers beside him at all times.


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[stokesmessiah]

I’d love to see him get a paggering, him and his pal Farage.

I’ll volunteer actually.

Anyone seen the videos he posted today in London…him walking along with a few hundred extras from green street and in his goggle jacket ha ha

[Pretty Boy]

The way that guys like Robinson, Grimes, Fox etc are trying to make remeberance all about them and painting themselves as being soldiers in a war is laughable.

Some might even say direspectful. A bunch of utter fuds.

[Hibrandenburg]

The way that guys like Robinson, Grimes, Fox etc are trying to make remeberance all about them and painting themselves as being soldiers in a war is laughable.

Some might even say direspectful. A bunch of utter fuds.

:agree: Both extremes of the political spectrum have hijacked remembrance in a repulsive manner. The right have turned it into a nationalist hate fest and the left twisting and belittling it's significance at every opportunity.

[DaveF]

:agree: Both extremes of the political spectrum have hijacked remembrance in a repulsive manner. The right have turned it into a nationalist hate fest and the left twisting and belittling it's significance at every opportunity.

It should be dropped from the football too. I can't remember when it all started to take centre stage in football but it has no place there.

[wookie70]

It should be dropped from the football too. I can't remember when it all started to take centre stage in football but it has no place there. Totally agree. It was very well observed today but I don't think I saw a single poppy of a supporter today. I'm sure there were a good few but I never spotted one.

The Government and particularly Braverman got exactly what they wanted today. British bulldogs emboldened and a bit of a scrap to sew some more fear into citizens. Looking at the footage the far right listened to the call from the Tory front benchers but thankfully they are massively outnumbered by decent people. Looking at the gene pool of those draped in Union and England flags they could do with a bit of immigration entering their gene pool. Saying all that there were some other groups on the pro Palestine side that are not helping either.

[Kato]

I resent those twats being associated with football. "Football lads" gives the impression all football fans are like these inadeqates. I bet there were many times the amount of football fans in the peace march and or quietly honouring the dead from the wars.

The other thing I noticed on twitter is that they are dubbed "the" far right. They are part of it but I never saw any psycho-billionaire political donors, or weirdo think tank reps, or Tory MPs in their ranks, which would have made that crowd more representative.

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[Stairway 2 7]

Everyone on the outside especially the politicians and media got what they wanted. The far right showed themselves to be the **** they are. There are tons of videos of antisemitism and pro Hamas ********s. Spoils two separate peaceful events and the 1% get the headlines

[Moulin Yarns]

Anyone seen the videos he posted today in London…him walking along with a few hundred extras from green street and in his goggle jacket ha ha

Please enlighten me, what is green street? I saw it mentioned on the bird platform.

[Stairway 2 7]

Please enlighten me, what is green street? I saw it mentioned on the bird platform.

Awful football violence movie staring one of the hobbits.

[Pretty Boy]

Anyone seen the videos he posted today in London…him walking along with a few hundred extras from green street and in his goggle jacket ha ha

He's getting a fair bit of stick on Twitter from his own side.

After leading the march into Chinatown, jumping in a cab and being rushed away a few minutes before the riot police arrived and got stuck in. Few comments about him being a mole, grass, traitor etc etc.

[Bostonhibby]

I resent those twats being associated with football. "Football lads" gives the impression all football fans are like these inadeqates. I bet there were many times the amount of football fans in the peace march and or quietly honouring the dead from the wars.

The other thing I noticed on twitter is that they are dubbed "the" far right. They are part of it but I never saw any psycho-billionaire political donors, or weirdo think tank reps, or Tory MPs in their ranks, which would have made that crowd more representative.

Sent from my SM-A528B using TapatalkThey'll never be there though, they are miles from the front line, hoping they have inspired enough of their modern day equivalent of the brown shirts to do their dirty work. On todays showing they failed miserably

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[tamig]

He's getting a fair bit of stick on Twitter from his own side.

After leading the march into Chinatown, jumping in a cab and being rushed away a few minutes before the riot police arrived and got stuck in. Few comments about him being a mole, grass, traitor etc etc.

Does the clown not live in Spain nowadays? Not sure how that stacks up with his Rule Britannia ideals.

[silverhibee]

The way that guys like Robinson, Grimes, Fox etc are trying to make remeberance all about them and painting themselves as being soldiers in a war is laughable.

Some might even say direspectful. A bunch of utter fuds.

And an added bonus was Charlie Veitch getting a kicking through the week. :thumbsup:

[stokesmessiah]

And an added bonus was Charlie Veitch getting a kicking through the week. :thumbsup:

Missed that, couldn’t happen to a nicer chap!

[silverhibee]

He's getting a fair bit of stick on Twitter from his own side.

After leading the march into Chinatown, jumping in a cab and being rushed away a few minutes before the riot police arrived and got stuck in. Few comments about him being a mole, grass, traitor etc etc.

Made his escape in a pride taxi, his hanger ons not happy with him.

[Pretty Boy]

And an added bonus was Charlie Veitch getting a kicking through the week. :thumbsup:

Oh that's a shame. Still he'll get about 50 hours of content from it.

[Aldo]

Absolute waffle and deflection from Schapps this morning.

[stokesmessiah]

Absolute waffle and deflection from Schapps this morning.

Just watching it now….chundering absolute garbage

[Aldo]

Just watching it now….chundering absolute garbage

I like Trevor Phillips and never shy’s away from asking what needs asked. I wish he had asked Schapp’s if he though Braverman should be reported for a hate crime given her comments in the week!

[JimBHibees]

I resent those twats being associated with football. "Football lads" gives the impression all football fans are like these inadeqates. I bet there were many times the amount of football fans in the peace march and or quietly honouring the dead from the wars.

The other thing I noticed on twitter is that they are dubbed "the" far right. They are part of it but I never saw any psycho-billionaire political donors, or weirdo think tank reps, or Tory MPs in their ranks, which would have made that crowd more representative.

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Your last sentence sums it up the actual people emboldening the dangerous freaks would never be seen dead with them and hideaway funding them and pulling their strings.

[Keith_M]

The way that guys like Robinson, Grimes, Fox etc are trying to make remeberance all about them and painting themselves as being soldiers in a war is laughable.

Some might even say direspectful. A bunch of utter fuds.


Didn't he play a major role in WWI?

27399

[Hibrandenburg]

Didn't he play a major role in WWI?

27399

I think he was a member of these special forces.