Soft as *****

[AugustaHibs]

Not the result that bothers me but for **** sake. Didn’t try a leg

[The Harp Awakes]

Not the result that bothers me but for **** sake. Didn’t try a leg

Embarrassing. What's the point in playing 2 wingers most of the game when you stand off them and never have the ball? Like playing with 9 men against mega million £ team. A predictable scoreline but not because they were brilliant. Hibs set up wrong and tactically naive. Taxi for Johnson.

[Vault Boy]

We tried. It’s quality, tactical acumen, and physicality we lacked.

[Chorley Hibee]

Not the result that bothers me but for **** sake. Didn’t try a leg

Meek acceptance yet again, not even a shuddering tackle or **** all.

The club is riddled with it, and it's why we still have that abysmal defence playing too.

[AugustaHibs]

We tried. It’s quality, tactical acumen, and physicality we lacked.

Did we try though?

I didn’t see it. Pathetic.

[Callum_62]

Did we try though?

I didn’t see it. Pathetic.Ofcourse we tried

They were just far too good for us

Sent from my Pixel 7 Pro using Tapatalk

[coldingham hibs]

I’m sure everyone gave 100%. The problem is a serious lack of quality and very poor tactics. We made it very easy for Villa to get balls into the box, this appears to be a real problem for us.

[SaulGoodman]

Maybe we did try. Maybe the fact we were playing a top 10 EPL side made it look like we didn’t?

I doubt the players went out there with the mentality of “**** it I can’t be arsed”

[JammyDoidger]

The fact we took till the 90th minute to get a booking says it all, never put a foot in, stood and watched them most of the game, Youan was an embarrassment, lazy, greedy. So bad.

[lyonhibs]

We tried. It’s quality, tactical acumen, and physicality we lacked.

Physicality, touch, a vague hint of game intelligence etc etc.

The result was immaterial but the performance lacked much that we should have reasonably expected

[MKHIBEE]

Ofcourse we tried

They were just far too good for us

Sent from my Pixel 7 Pro using Tapatalk
I tried to return to my seat for the 2nd half but couldn’t stomach it. Thankfully Villa stayed in first gear. I cannot get away from the fact that a different manager would be getting a lot more out of our players. Time for a change I feel

[Unseen work]

Not the result that bothers me but for **** sake. Didn’t try a leg

Honestly such a lazy assessment of what happened.

The players tried their best which was always going to fall short.

Embarrassing labelling that criticism against the players.

[BoomtownHibees]

The fact we took till the 90th minute to get a booking says it all, never put a foot in, stood and watched them most of the game, Youan was an embarrassment, lazy, greedy. So bad.

Couldn’t get close enough to them to put a foot in

[Tyler Durden]

Fouls and the “dark arts” are obviously not something Lee Johnson favours. It’s been the same in several games against the OF, we have a chance to foul the opposition in a good area but we won’t take it.

There is never a thought to leave the boot in to maybe unsettle a better team. Take a card and move on. We just stand off and let the opposition play.

Pathetic and it comes from the coaching clearly. That’s before we even talk about tactics

[Brightside]

Fans ****ing off at 80. Look forward to 7000 on Saturday.

[Bobo]

Meek acceptance yet again, not even a shuddering tackle or **** all.

The club is riddled with it, and it's why we still have that abysmal defence playing too.

The players perform in the managers image, weak ineffective waste of space, no desire, grit or tempo to our play, submissive at best, Johnson has nowhere to hide and needs emptied ASAP.

[Irish_Steve]

Honestly such a lazy assessment of what happened.

The players tried their best which was always going to fall short.

Embarrassing labelling that criticism against the players.

I agree with you, saying we didn’t try a leg shows his much footballing knowledge the OP has.

Villa are light years ahead of us, you could see it in every department and remember, this was a team that spanked Everton at the weekend.

It’s not a gulf in class, it’s a chasm

[Pretty Boy]

I thought we put in plenty effort. Quality was lacking, was always going to be v Villa but it's also been lacking against far weaker opposition. Work to be done.

[degenerated]

We tried. It’s quality, tactical acumen, and physicality we lacked.And about 175 million a year in turnover

[WhileTheChief..]

The players maybe put in the effort , but they looked like they didn’t have a clue what to do.

We never held possession of the ball for more than 10 seconds.

Marshall’s punts up the park to the Villa defence was simply letting them launch another attack. It was liek basketball but with us just giving the ball back instead of trying to do something.

Midfield was non existent and I’ve no idea if Vente even got a touch of the ball at all.

My expectations were low going into the game, but man, I don’t think I’ve felt as pissed off at a result and performance as I am tonight.

Bet we get nowt against Livvi at the weekend, cause the players will be tired or some other BS.

[Musselbound]

Stevenson made a number of late tackles and fouls. Not through lack of effort. Would it have made it a better performance if he had been booked or even sent off for persistent fouling?

[weecounty hibby]

Probably the best side I've ever seen at ER. To say we didn't try is rubbish. They are so dark ahead of us in every department. Skill, physicality, intelligence, everything. I'll not be judging Hibs on that game

[The Harp Awakes]

Ofcourse we tried

They were just far too good for us

Sent from my Pixel 7 Pro using Tapatalk

Yes they were too good for us granted. The thing is we could have lost those first 3 goals to a pub team. 3 crosses into the box and defending non existent. Never gave ourselves a chance.

[BoomtownHibees]

Stevenson made a number of late tackles and fouls. Not through lack of effort. Would it have made it a better performance if he had been booked or even sent off for persistent fouling?

Those come from him being so far off his man or not getting to balls quick enough, nothing to do with leaving something on a player or doing something to get the crowd going

[Unseen work]

Stevenson made a number of late tackles and fouls. Not through lack of effort. Would it have made it a better performance if he had been booked or even sent off for persistent fouling?

Supposedly it would have showed he cared 🤣

[MacBean]

Tactics were *****, especially defending wide areas. Same last week just this time we were against a quality opposition who could punish it. Narrow defending in final third is unforgivable

[lyonhibs]

The players perform in the managers image, weak ineffective waste of space, no desire, grit or tempo to our play, submissive at best, Johnson has nowhere to hide and needs emptied ASAP.

The players should perform with a bit of professionalism and determination regardless of whatever wet bit of paper is in charge.

I agree that LJ needs gone ASAP though.

[lyonhibs]

Tactics were *****, especially defending wide areas. Same last week just this time we were against a quality opposition who could punish it. Narrow defending in final third is unforgivable

Yup. Texted my Hibs WhatsApp group here saying that we let about a million crosses fly in last week and learnt **** all from it.

[tamig]

I agree with you, saying we didn’t try a leg shows his much footballing knowledge the OP has.

Villa are light years ahead of us, you could see it in every department and remember, this was a team that spanked Everton at the weekend.

It’s not a gulf in class, it’s a chasm

Agreed Steve. I was fed up listening to some tactical geniuses behind me screaming at us to press them every 30 seconds or so. We’d have been torn to shreds if we’d tried that against a team of that quality. Folk need to get a wee bit of reality.

[Potty78]

Full backs who don't stop crosses and central defenders who can't win headers. Lewis Miller cost us 3 of the 5 goals. Villa just too quick and better on the ball all over the park.

[Bobo]

The players should perform with a bit of professionalism and determination regardless of whatever wet bit of paper is in charge.

I agree that LJ needs gone ASAP though.

I agree but unfortunately we have very few players who show any guts or desire, far too soft, slow and apologetic game after game after game.

[Tyler Durden]

Stevenson made a number of late tackles and fouls. Not through lack of effort. Would it have made it a better performance if he had been booked or even sent off for persistent fouling?

It would be better if he wasn’t playing. But he’s a good example - there were times he should have fouled his man 40 yards out. He backs off and lets them run into the box instead. In all honesty and respect to Lewis, he should not be put in this position to be playing so often this season

Hanlon in the first half. Watkins gets the ball back to goal 45 yards out. Hanlon should foul him but he lets him lay it off and turn. Watkins is through on goal.

Of course we were going to be outclassed and outpaced etc. But there are basic things that we don’t do when defending that would help massively with some proper organisation and the right attitude

[WhileTheChief..]

Right from kick off they had more of the ball.

How is that even possible? Literally from thre first kick, they controlled everything.

Playing out from the back, picking their passes and runs.

We stood back and watched.

When the ball inevitably ended up with Marshall he punted up the park so Villa could have another go.

Not once did we pass it about a bit and then make a pass for a player to run on to. Ok, maybe once or twice in 90mins, but that was it.

There was nothing positive to be seen from us at all.

[Pedantic_Hibee]

Right from kick off they had more of the ball.

How is that even possible? Literally from thre first kick, they controlled everything.

Playing out from the back, picking their passes and runs.

We stood back and watched.

When the ball inevitably ended up with Marshall he punted up the park so Villa could have another go.

Not once did we pass it about a bit and then make a pass for a player to run on to. Ok, maybe once or twice in 90mins, but that was it.

There was nothing positive to be seen from us at all.

There’s about 200 million reasons why that was so.

[Colr]

We tried. It’s quality, tactical acumen, and physicality we lacked.

The way you talk you’d thing they had a budget for than 15 times the one we have!!!

[Since90+2]

How much longer do we persist with Hanlon and Stevenson as first team picks. It's getting ridiculously silly now.

Both are legends, but it's time they were moved on and that's been the case for literally years now.

[Irish_Steve]

Agreed Steve. I was fed up listening to some tactical geniuses behind me screaming at us to press them every 30 seconds or so. We’d have been torn to shreds if we’d tried that against a team of that quality. Folk need to get a wee bit of reality.

I sit in the FFU right in line with the penalty box so can see straight up the pitch.

If it wasn't for the fact that we were getting humped, it was a joy to see the way the Villa players moved off the ball and the way they could move Hibs players out of position and get around them

They are miles better, it's not even close. They brought on international calibre players and we brought on a bloke who was playing for Edinburgh City.

But hey ho, LJ out, isn't that what we are supposed to say

Some folk wouldn't know good opposition if it smacked them in the face

[Corstorphine Hibby]

Yup. Texted my Hibs WhatsApp group here saying that we let about a million crosses fly in last week and learnt **** all from it.

About a million or exactly a million?

[lyonhibs]

Agreed Steve. I was fed up listening to some tactical geniuses behind me screaming at us to press them every 30 seconds or so. We’d have been torn to shreds if we’d tried that against a team of that quality. Folk need to get a wee bit of reality.

You think after about the 3rd goal it was a bit much to expect the team to focus on blocking the odd cross or 2?

Yes, they were in a different league but they also never broke sweat pretty much.

[GreenCastle]

This Hibs team just simply isn’t very good.

The poor defending of crosses continues.

Leaks goals and awful midfield.

We were never going to win tonight but even most folk surely can see that Raith and St Mirren etc have shown have average we are.

[lyonhibs]

About a million or exactly a million?

1,247,389 to be precise

[Dazzjw1875]

OK they are miles ahead financially,but I'm sure most could see the space Digne had from the 2nd min and LJ done nowt. RB and LB were so narrow and midfield overrun again and again but nothing. the biggest gap for me, tactical awareness of the manager to change/fix the formation when required. Why play 3 up top?? To use the speed oh aye great when we never played the ball to feet. This hoofball is also very frustrating...

[Tyler Durden]

I sit in the FFU right in line with the penalty box so can see straight up the pitch.

If it wasn't for the fact that we were getting humped, it was a joy to see the way the Villa players moved off the ball and the way they could move Hibs players out of position and get around them

They are miles better, it's not even close. They brought on international calibre players and we brought on a bloke who was playing for Edinburgh City.

But hey ho, LJ out, isn't that what we are supposed to say

Some folk wouldn't know good opposition if it smacked them in the face

Of course they are brilliant. The point is that HIbs are not playing to our own potential. We are less than the sum of the parts.

We lose goals from corners almost every game this season!

[Springbank]

Full backs who don't stop crosses and central defenders who can't win headers. Lewis Miller cost us 3 of the 5 goals. Villa just too quick and better on the ball all over the park.

Miller didn't Boyle did.

Posted missing leaving digne in all the space.
He's not miller's man

[Jim44]

I didn’t find the result embarrassing at all. The performance was disappointing but not unexpected, given the chasm of difference in quality and stature of the two teams. The only time I felt embarrassed was watching our diminutive manager bleating like a wee schoolboy, complaining at the behaviour of the Villa manager in the technical area. A very poor night, but, again, not unexpected, at the office. Now that we’re out of Europe, we can focus on domestic games and objectively look at where we are going with LJ.

[Since452]

Really not embarrassed about the result. It was expected. ***** defending though.

[Hibby Bairn]

Right from kick off they had more of the ball.

How is that even possible? Literally from thre first kick, they controlled everything.

Playing out from the back, picking their passes and runs.

We stood back and watched.

When the ball inevitably ended up with Marshall he punted up the park so Villa could have another go.

Not once did we pass it about a bit and then make a pass for a player to run on to. Ok, maybe once or twice in 90mins, but that was it.

There was nothing positive to be seen from us at all.

Stick the kettle on mate and calm down.

[Donegal Hibby]

Ofcourse we tried

They were just far too good for us

Sent from my Pixel 7 Pro using Tapatalk

In a nutshell unfortunately :agree:

[WhileTheChief..]

There’s about 200 million reasons why that was so.

Maybe as the game went on you’d have a point.

But from kick off?

Even after each goal, we had 5 chances to do something different, but Villa still had the ball within 10 seconds!!

[heretoday]

Hibs did well to keep it to five.

Aston Villa are one of the coming teams now under Unai Emery and I wouldn't be surprised to see them qualify for the CL this and every season for the next few years.

[GreenCastle]

Maybe as the game went on you’d have a point.

But from kick off?

Even after each goal, we had 5 chances to do something different, but Villa still had the ball within 10 seconds!!

To be fair our kick offs were awful too.

It was a training match for Villa and they would have tougher games against their own squad in training.

Could easily be another 5 goals plus next week if they want.

[Pedantic_Hibee]

Maybe as the game went on you’d have a point.

But from kick off?

Even after each goal, we had 5 chances to do something different, but Villa still had the ball within 10 seconds!!

Yes, from kick-off. That’s the chasm between us.

I know fine well how bad we can be, I also share the pessimism regarding Johnson as well. But criticism of tonight? Nope, we were ****ed before we even kicked a ball, that’s the gulf in class between both teams. Pep Guardiola in the Hibs dugout wouldn’t have made a difference tonight.

[SeanWilson]

Fouls and the “dark arts” are obviously not something Lee Johnson favours. It’s been the same in several games against the OF, we have a chance to foul the opposition in a good area but we won’t take it.

There is never a thought to leave the boot in to maybe unsettle a better team. Take a card and move on. We just stand off and let the opposition play.

Pathetic and it comes from the coaching clearly. That’s before we even talk about tactics

Jeggo, our 'hard man' was the epitome of this... just stood off and let them waltz past him.

[WhileTheChief..]

Stick the kettle on mate and calm down.

Something stronger required once I get home.

Unlike some on here (not directed at you) I was at the game, I’ve now had a few drinks, and am utterly gutted about how things went tonight.

I feel like I’m allowed to rant a little in these circumstances.l

[Onion]

Nothing to do with Hibs. We needed AV to not give a toss about the Conf League (as most EPL teams do with the FA Cup), but they put out a strong team that was light-years ahead of every single Hibs player. I would sooner it was a top 4 club like Man C or Arsenal, but hey - the gulf between the EPL and SPL is vast. No shame on Hibs.

[O'Rourke3]

My view. Our players worked hard. No one had a particularly bad game, the chasm between skill, physicality, speed, size and ability was the issue. We were playing a team several levels better than we are and big step up from either of the two cheeks. Villa are the clear favourites to win this cup. We could be considered lucky to be in this round. Welcome to the world of Financial gulf..

Sent from my SM-G990B using Tapatalk

[SaulGoodman]

Something stronger required once I get home.

Unlike some on here (not directed at you) I was at the game, I’ve now had a few drinks, and am utterly gutted about how things went tonight.

I feel like I’m allowed to rant a little in these circumstances.l

You can’t pull out the Uber fan card for attending a home match. That’s not in the rules.

[weecounty hibby]

They may very well go on and win the competition and their first team squad is rated at approx 400m but aye we should have tried harder and taken some bodies. FFS as one other poster has said they were a joy to watch. Pity it was against us but they will do that to other clubs this year.

[Swedish hibee]

They were quicker, fitter and stronger. Their awareness of the ball & where they wanted it to be was outstanding tonight. We did well to keep it at five.
In saying all that, the freedom for the headers made me rage.

[Onion]

Something stronger required once I get home.

Unlike some on here (not directed at you) I was at the game, I’ve now had a few drinks, and am utterly gutted about how things went tonight.

I feel like I’m allowed to rant a little in these circumstances.l

Can understand that. But if we're all honest we've been done by average SPL teams St Mirren and Motherwell this season, so how surprising is it that a top top team like Aston Villa destroys us ? Not in the least.

The real shock would have been if Hibs had kept the score down and tie alive after tonight.

[Greenwich_Hibby]

We are a poorly coached, mediorce team capable of the odd good result. I've not seen anything under the current coaching team which will change this. Gulf in class to EPL is however huge, but my view is based not just on tonight, but the last year. Question is, are the club happy with that, and achieving top 6 with the odd foray into Europe.

[tamig]

You think after about the 3rd goal it was a bit much to expect the team to focus on blocking the odd cross or 2?

Yes, they were in a different league but they also never broke sweat pretty much.

The first three goals were avoidable. Not blocking the cross, poor defending in the box, poor keeper positioning. This was about pressing during open play. Our defending today was poor though.

[Irish_Steve]

Something stronger required once I get home.

Unlike some on here (not directed at you) I was at the game, I’ve now had a few drinks, and am utterly gutted about how things went tonight.

I feel like I’m allowed to rant a little in these circumstances.l

I was at the game too and it panned out exactly as I thought it would - anyone who thought we could beat Villa after seeing the team they put out needs their head felt.

The sad thing is Villa will probably put out a second string team next week and will still be too good for us

[WhileTheChief..]

You can’t pull out the Uber fan card for attending a home match. That’s not in the rules.

I can when there’s folk sitting watching on the telly saying we’re talking crap!

[WhileTheChief..]

I was at the game too and it panned out exactly as I thought it would - anyone who thought we could beat Villa after seeing the team they put out needs their head felt.

The sad thing is Villa will probably put out a second string team next week and will still be too good for us

There were very few posters, if any, who thought we’d get a result tonight.

Most of us expected a performance though.

[SaulGoodman]

I can when there’s folk sitting watching on the telly saying we’re talking crap!

Did they watch a different game in the tele?

[Shanksaidno]

I was at the game too and it panned out exactly as I thought it would - anyone who thought we could beat Villa after seeing the team they put out needs their head felt.

The sad thing is Villa will probably put out a second string team next week and will still be too good for us


WTF was Campbell doing at the second goal ... got bossed as if he was a kid

[WhileTheChief..]

Must have done!

[Keith_M]

While I always knew we were going to lose, I'm convinced that a manager with even a bit of tactical nous would have set us up to be a lot less of a walkover.

As others have said, the weaknesses in the team that were so brutally taken advantage of tonight we're already evident in both our league games, and multiple times last season, but have still not been addressed

[Davy Mac]

While I always knew we were going to lose, I'm convinced that a manager with even a bit of tactical nous would have set us up to be a lot less of a walkover.

As others have said, the weaknesses in the team that were so brutally taken advantage of tonight we're already evident in both our league games, and multiple times last season, but have still not been addressed

Hence the reason why the manager needs replacing.

[Iain G]

Did they watch a different game in the tele?

Were BBC Scotland not showing the right game? Did we actually win tonight 😁

[hibsitis]

Stick the kettle on mate and calm down.
😀👍

[WeAreHibs]

The way you talk you’d thing they had a budget for than 15 times the one we have!!!

Try 150x

[Iain G]

I can when there’s folk sitting watching on the telly saying we’re talking crap!

The benefit of watching on the telly is that we can drink during the game and not have to wait til after. 😁

[Callum_62]

Yes they were too good for us granted. The thing is we could have lost those first 3 goals to a pub team. 3 crosses into the box and defending non existent. Never gave ourselves a chance.

you don't think movement, quality and physicality comes into any of the goals from crosses?

[Kentao1985]

We can't be too upset about tonight, villa are a good few levels above us in footballing ability. I watched Spurs do the exact same at Ibrox. The Rangers players were chasing shadows and couldn't get close to them and it looked like Spurs could go up a couple of gears if required. Not too dissimilar in our game.

The players need to dust themselves down and get ready for the next league game.

Sent from my moto g22 using Tapatalk

[HITSB6]

As a Villa I thought it would be a close game maybe 2 1 to Villa. I thought Hibs were very poor especially the defence was like watching several trialist playing or a testimonial game. Villa were sloppy in parts and should of been more clinical and not so arrogant in parts of their game I'd give Villa 6/10.

[wookie70]

I think we played to our weaknesses.

We sat in a 442 that was nearer a 46 in the first 10-15 minutes. There was absolutely no pressure on the ball until it got in our half and Villa looked genuinely confused in the first 10 minutes as we simply let them do what they wanted at least until they got well in hour half centrally. However it never took them long to realise our full backs were tucked in and they could get their up the park, no pressure on the pass to them or any pressure for the cross in. We should have got a tanking with some ambition and grit shown that had the crowd onside from teh first whistle. As Marshall said the team never gave the crowd anything to get behind. There may be a gulf in class but I would argue there is between Spain and Scotland. If Clarke allowed Spain to literally walk the ball to our full back positions and then get unchallenged crosses in he would deserve everything he got as we did tonight. There is only one way to play to bridge a gulf of class and that is contact, aggression, some foul play and work rate. I never saw any of that tonight and it looked by design. Very close to leaving before the final whistle and contemplated it at half time. It has been a long time since I have been so disappointed with the way we approached a game.

[Nutmegged]

Just nowhere remotely near enough to even believe we could get a performance let alone a result against a team like Villa, I'm always critical of Johnson, I just don't rate him in the slightest but I suppose he was damned if he does and damned if he didn't tonight.

For the life of me I don't know why we set up so open, we basically asked to get pumped but I also know if we parked the bus and also got well beaten I'd probably be pondering what if we tried to have a go, our big tie was against Luzern, they're a club we're on a somewhat level playing field with.

The luck of the draw wasn't kind at all and it's just one of those things, I'm not so much gutted we got gubbed, that was to be expected, I suppose the real gutter is seeing how vast the quality is, we all knew it before hand but seeing it in person makes you realise that we don't even play the same sport as teams like this anymore.

[B.H.F.C]

I didn’t think we gave all we had. The number of offsides just highlighted the lack of concentration and laziness.

Our approach right from the first whistle was crap and the place was dead after about 5 minutes as a result.

[ionahibby]

Opposition aside there were glaring mistakes that we see week in week out in the league. That’s what worries me. I don’t hold much hope we will get a result at the weekend.

[Hibernia&Alba]

Ofcourse we tried

They were just far too good for us

Sent from my Pixel 7 Pro using Tapatalk
Yes. A different approach wouldn’t have changed a thing. It isn’t the 1980s; putting in some aggressive tackles would have risked red cards in today’s game. We were outclassed by far better players in a good EPL team. A skelping was always on the cards. The gulf is huge.

[truehibernian]

As a Villa I thought it would be a close game maybe 2 1 to Villa. I thought Hibs were very poor especially the defence was like watching several trialist playing or a testimonial game. Villa were sloppy in parts and should of been more clinical and not so arrogant in parts of their game I'd give Villa 6/10.

Villa are an excellent side mate, deserved win and could have been more. Very athletic and skilful side. Hibs were star struck and overawed throughout. A dominant performance 👍 as good as you were, Hibs were and are abject and that comes from having a very very poor manager and coaching staff I’m afraid.

[wookie70]

As a Villa I thought it would be a close game maybe 2 1 to Villa. I thought Hibs were very poor especially the defence was like watching several trialist playing or a testimonial game. Villa were sloppy in parts and should of been more clinical and not so arrogant in parts of their game I'd give Villa 6/10. I think that is generous. I didn't think they were that great and agree with your comments. Very easy to play passes and find space when no-one is looking to get close. You much have tripped over the ball 5 times tonight and still had time to stand up and get your next touch without a Hibs player getting in your face. If you draw a non league team in the FA cup you will have a harder game than we gave you.

[Hibernia&Alba]

As a Villa I thought it would be a close game maybe 2 1 to Villa. I thought Hibs were very poor especially the defence was like watching several trialist playing or a testimonial game. Villa were sloppy in parts and should of been more clinical and not so arrogant in parts of their game I'd give Villa 6/10.

I think you overestimated us, mate. I think 5-0 was always more likely than 2-1, sadly.

[erin go bragh]

Not the result that bothers me but for **** sake. Didn’t try a leg
Definitely tried but basic errors are punished by a far superior team
Maybe worth remembering that Villa team just took four of Everton.
Thought we started well but the first goal stopped us in our tracks and we never really recovered

[Iain G]

Just nowhere remotely near enough to even believe we could get a performance let alone a result against a team like Villa, I'm always critical of Johnson, I just don't rate him in the slightest but I suppose he was damned if he does and damned if he didn't tonight.

For the life of me I don't know why we set up so open, we basically asked to get pumped but I also know if we parked the bus and also got well beaten I'd probably be pondering what if we tried to have a go, our big tie was against Luzern, they're a club we're on a somewhat level playing field with.

The luck of the draw wasn't kind at all and it's just one of those things, I'm not so much gutted we got gubbed, that was to be expected, I suppose the real gutter is seeing how vast the quality is, we all knew it before hand but seeing it in person makes you realise that we don't even play the same sport as teams like this anymore.

We have the ability to hit well and effectively on the break so why not set us up to do so, make it compact and hard to break down, pounce when we have the chance and get the ball forward quickly and accurately to our quick and skillful forwards. But no we kinda pressed a bit but without the required urgency or energy to make that work which exposed our own defence to their quick break.

And our narrow defence gave them lots of unchallenged time and space in the wide areas to get food crosses in.

We didn't set it up right from the start and they exploited the space so effectively.

[S4uzee]

We are a poorly coached, mediorce team capable of the odd good result. I've not seen anything under the current coaching team which will change this. Gulf in class to EPL is however huge, but my view is based not just on tonight, but the last year. Question is, are the club happy with that, and achieving top 6 with the odd foray into Europe.

That’s it for me - poorly coached, 100% agree.

Look at Luzern, you could see they had a style of play. With us, what are we doing? I’ve no idea and he’s been here over a year now and 3 transfer windows

[Callum_62]

That’s it for me - poorly coached, 100% agree.

Look at Luzern, you could see they had a style of play. With us, what are we doing? I’ve no idea and he’s been here over a year now and 3 transfer windowsWe pumped Luzern

You'd argue we used our style of play far more effectively than they did - especially away from home

Sent from my Pixel 7 Pro using Tapatalk

[The_Exile]

That Villa team are the real deal. Coached by one of the worlds best. They were fitter, stronger, quicker, they always found space because of the movement of smaller double and triple teams of rotation in the midfield and out wide, this comes with the very best coaching in the world and players that are highly motivated with a lot of self belief. We did not have a chance and they were an absolute joy to watch in full flow. Yes, helped by our almost comical defending at times but still, they will easily be top 8 this season and probably even top 6. I would be quite surprised if they didn't win the Europa Conference League, barring a load of injuries and suspensions etc.

I find it really difficult to get upset about getting bent over by a team like this as the chasm is so vast. We could've set up perfetly tonight and every player could've put in the shift of their lives and we still would've got done over. This is the difference between the best and the rest, I'm still more upset at losing against Motherwell and St Mirren than what I witnessed tonight. Still think it's time for Johnson to go though, everything feels stale and in need of a fresh approach.

[7Hero]

So far ahead of yes, so much more money yes, but they did not get out of first gear,

was like a game of walking football for them, did they even break sweat ?

In a game where had to make every pass count, every tackle count and minimise any gaps, errors , mistakes etc. we simply failed.

Hibs had to be the best version that we could possibly be, we were not even close to that, we were miles short.

We were so naive for the first 3 goals, all headers and the 4th from the same Left side.

Clearly emrie has seen our defending and said just stick it in the box and we will score.

Anyone that thinks this is just a case of them being bigger and richer should ask themselves why did we not even turn up ? If we had they might have had to move out of first gear.

It was embarrassing tonight and a sad indictment of where the management of the club has left us with a truly awful manager who was out the front in his well assembled outfit and manicured hair but once the third went in he dissapeared into the dugout, as he did at full time up the tunnel.

You can argue with the OP about us not trying tonight but if you are happy with what has been happening in the club regards management of our playing department then i really am stumped, how anyone can see that we are going forward under lee johnson is beyond me.

[Allant1981]

I can when there’s folk sitting watching on the telly saying we’re talking crap!

I hope this is tongue in cheek after your post saying a poster was getting grief after giving an opinion despite not being at the game at the weekend

[Pagan Hibernia]

I can when there’s folk sitting watching on the telly saying we’re talking crap!

people watching on the tele watched the exact same match that you watched.

[SickBoy32]

BK last week in Switzerland after the match: ‘We’ll be lucky if it’s not 10 next week’

Tone at the top reeks

Simply not good enough that tonight imo, should’ve made that a tougher workout for Villa than what we did.

I’ve seen other posters describe us as starstruck and that is bang on, stood off them throughout

[S4uzee]

BK last week in Switzerland after the match: ‘We’ll be lucky if it’s not 10 next week’

Tone at the top reeks

Simply not good enough that tonight imo, should’ve made that a tougher workout for Villa than what we did.

I’ve seen other posters describe us as starstruck and that is bang on, stood off them throughout

Is that what he said?

[He's here!]

Ofcourse we tried

They were just far too good for us

Sent from my Pixel 7 Pro using Tapatalk

It's that simple. We got taken apart by a team on a level way above ours. It was always on the cards.

What does 'trying' look like to those who claim we didn't? No amount of perspiration will overcome a chasm in class.

[SaulGoodman]

BK last week in Switzerland after the match: ‘We’ll be lucky if it’s not 10 next week’

Tone at the top reeks

Simply not good enough that tonight imo, should’ve made that a tougher workout for Villa than what we did.

I’ve seen other posters describe us as starstruck and that is bang on, stood off them throughout

Why’s that only coming out now and not last week when he apparently said it?

[SickBoy32]

Why’s that only coming out now and not last week when he apparently said it?

Take it or leave it mate - that’s 100percent what was said

[thebakerboy]

Right foks I have to say that tonight went much as I expected although slightly annoyed at 5 but remember their squad is valued at £500 mill and ours about £11. I was more angry about Sunday where although we won by basically having better players Raith looked more like an organised team who knew what they were trying to do but our quality won it for us . Problem I see is our players dont seem to know what the plan , if there is one ,is. Now beginning to think we need a knew coaching team in place.

[Iain G]

BK last week in Switzerland after the match: ‘We’ll be lucky if it’s not 10 next week’

Tone at the top reeks

Simply not good enough that tonight imo, should’ve made that a tougher workout for Villa than what we did.

I’ve seen other posters describe us as starstruck and that is bang on, stood off them throughout

Maybe he was talking about the options for kick off time? Or how many injuries we may have? Or how long it would take to get a pie at half time in the west upper? 😁

[jacomo]

Embarrassing. What's the point in playing 2 wingers most of the game when you stand off them and never have the ball? Like playing with 9 men against mega million £ team. A predictable scoreline but not because they were brilliant. Hibs set up wrong and tactically naive. Taxi for Johnson.

This is true.

The notion that our players didn’t try is bs.

[Chorley Hibee]

BK last week in Switzerland after the match: ‘We’ll be lucky if it’s not 10 next week’

Tone at the top reeks

Simply not good enough that tonight imo, should’ve made that a tougher workout for Villa than what we did.

I’ve seen other posters describe us as starstruck and that is bang on, stood off them throughout

Was probably in hospitality telling everyone the team again too.

He's as big a fraud as his pal Johnson.

[allezsauzee]

I would say the result was no worse than I expected. I was bracing myself for worse to be honest. Villa will be challenging for top 6 in the strongest league in the world by a distance. I don't think it was the case of Hibs players not trying hard enough, they just couldn't get close. If i was critical of Hibs at all , maybe we showed a lack of composure when we did get the ball but probably understandable given that they were probably subconsciously already thinking about getting back behind the ball .

[He's here!]

you don't think movement, quality and physicality comes into any of the goals from crosses?

Again, spot on. Said it on another thread but it's not just our defenders who would have toiled to cut out deliveries of that standard.

Folk are just upset we got a doing, which when all's said and done was what we all knew deep down was going to happen. The reason Villa didn't get out of second gear is not because we didn't make life hard enough for them. We tried our best for the first 20 minutes but nothing we had to offer was going to force them to step things up. The steady procession of goals was really just a matter of time.

As older fans have mentioned, there was a time when we'd have fancied our chances against some of the top teams in England but the glaring imbalance between England and Scotland's top flight since those days means there's no point in trying to make out we could have run Villa close. The only Scottish team who wouldn't have lost comfortably at home to them tonight is probably Celtic.

Had we had, say, our 2016/17 team playing tonight I imagine it would have been less of a stroll, but this Hibs side is barely a shadow of that one so it's hard to know why anyone felt there were reasons for optimism.

[Nicho87]

Tonight showed money talks

But we don’t have any horrible *******s in the team

We need a nasty horrible player in midfield, Campbell goes through the motions on too many games.

[He's here!]

BK last week in Switzerland after the match: ‘We’ll be lucky if it’s not 10 next week’

Tone at the top reeks

Simply not good enough that tonight imo, should’ve made that a tougher workout for Villa than what we did.

I’ve seen other posters describe us as starstruck and that is bang on, stood off them throughout

Maybe just being realistic, if that is indeed what he said. He knows he's got a lot work to do and is probably savvy enough to know that he'd end up looking daft if he'd said we had a right good chance of going through.

They could have scored 10 tonight had they really wanted to.

[Iain G]

BK last week in Switzerland after the match: ‘We’ll be lucky if it’s not 10 next week’

Tone at the top reeks

Simply not good enough that tonight imo, should’ve made that a tougher workout for Villa than what we did.

I’ve seen other posters describe us as starstruck and that is bang on, stood off them throughout

So we can call him "Ten-nil Kensall" now then.

[eastterrace]

Fans ****ing off at 80. Look forward to 7000 on Saturday.
Well I ****ed off at 85 minutes and I will be there Saturday is that okay.

[1875M]

Think some of us need a reality check. We played Aston Villa who will probably finish in the Top 7/8 of the Premier League and have beat Chelsea, Spurs and Newcastle under Emery. They aren’t even 1 or 2 levels above us, they are about 5. I honestly think the players gave their best for the most part. They just played against players who were stronger, faster, fitter and just overall much, much better footballers. They had a boy they just signed for £50m ffs. This is coming from someone who doesn’t really rate Lee Johnson and would gladly see the back of him.

[Iain G]

Think some of us need a reality check. We played Aston Villa who will probably finish in the Top 7/8 of the Premier League and have beat Chelsea, Spurs and Newcastle under Emery. They aren’t even 1 or 2 levels above us, they are about 5. I honestly think the players gave their best for the most part. They just played against players who were stronger, faster, fitter and just overall much, much better footballers. They had a boy they just signed for £50m ffs. This is coming from someone who doesn’t really rate Lee Johnson and would gladly see the back of him.

Yes and no, I think the point people are generally making is that we made it pretty easy for them tonight. It's not a reality check, we know where Villa are at but we could have made a better fist if it, altered the tactics and done the basics better.

It's a frustration at not being more effective or putting on a better showing, more than any expectations of getting a result I think.

[1875M]

Yes and no, I think the point people are generally making is that we made it pretty easy for them tonight. It's not a reality check, we know where Villa are at but we could have made a better fist if it, altered the tactics and done the basics better.

It's a frustration at not being more effective or putting on a better showing, more than any expectations of getting a result I think.

Did we make it easy for them? Or was it actually just easy for them because they’re a much better side? I get your point though. I think the best version of Hibs could’ve played tonight, done the basics right and we still lose 3-0 comfortably.

[007]

I think we played to our weaknesses.

We sat in a 442 that was nearer a 46 in the first 10-15 minutes. There was absolutely no pressure on the ball until it got in our half and Villa looked genuinely confused in the first 10 minutes as we simply let them do what they wanted at least until they got well in hour half centrally. However it never took them long to realise our full backs were tucked in and they could get their up the park, no pressure on the pass to them or any pressure for the cross in. We should have got a tanking with some ambition and grit shown that had the crowd onside from teh first whistle. As Marshall said the team never gave the crowd anything to get behind. There may be a gulf in class but I would argue there is between Spain and Scotland. If Clarke allowed Spain to literally walk the ball to our full back positions and then get unchallenged crosses in he would deserve everything he got as we did tonight. There is only one way to play to bridge a gulf of class and that is contact, aggression, some foul play and work rate. I never saw any of that tonight and it looked by design. Very close to leaving before the final whistle and contemplated it at half time. It has been a long time since I have been so disappointed with the way we approached a game.

The difference between Spain and Scotland is not even remotely comparable to the difference between Aston Villa and Hibs.

[stoneyburn hibs]

Although I have wanted Johnson gone for a while, I won't criticise him or the players for that performance.

The gulf in class was evident,they would have skelped any Scottish team tonight.

[Stanton Spence]

As a Villa I thought it would be a close game maybe 2 1 to Villa. I thought Hibs were very poor especially the defence was like watching several trialist playing or a testimonial game. Villa were sloppy in parts and should of been more clinical and not so arrogant in parts of their game I'd give Villa 6/10.

I think your over estimating Scottish football mate and apart from the arse cheeks who you would beat there’s no other side in Scotland would give you a close game which I sadly say imo

[007]

Is that what he said?

Probably not or probably a joke or agreeing with whoever he was speaking to.

[wookie70]

The difference between Spain and Scotland is not even remotely comparable to the difference between Aston Villa and Hibs. There are many examples of big teams getting beaten by far smaller teams. It doesn't happen very often though. There are far, far more examples of small teams giving far far bigger teams a fright and making them work way harder than they ever thought they would. We were an example of a smaller team being completely in awe of a bigger team and not coming close to showing any bottle or will to win and Villa were a bigger team that couldn't believe their luck in how little effort they needed to use to win very comfortably.

I recall watching Cummings playing for League One Shrewsbury(much smaller turnover than us) against Liverpool in the FA Cup. Liverpool hardly got beat in the League that year and were a far better side than Villa and a good deal richer too. Shrewsbury realised that they had nothing to lose, threw everything at it and could easily have won the tie. They ended up drawing but the biggest difference between their approach and ours tonight was they went out thinking it was 11 v 11 and we went out thinking it was EPL v SPFL and x turnover again y turnover. We went out thinking if not knowing we couldn't win imo and the tactics suited that mentality.

[I'm_cabbaged]

Forget the gulf in class, everyone knew it before the game. What I can’t accept is that the team accepted that and just stood off them. Ffs just make a foul and stop them in their half instead of taking the piss and let them know they’re in for game. I blame the manager for that. Would NL’s play like that?

[Since452]

Rangers 1 Liverpool 7. It is what it is.

[SlickShoes]

It feels like some people can’t comprehend that other teams have much better players than us and the only reason we ever lose any game is because we don’t try hard enough.

Anyone in that hibs team is levels below what villa have alongside one of the best managers in the world and billions financially backing them.

I used to play a Monday night game with a boy who played for PSG, some German teams and the Algeria national team, I could try as hard as I wanted but if he put in the same effort level as me it was never a competition. Sometimes you have to accept that someone else is better than you and that’s fine, it happens.

[Springbank]

There are many examples of big teams getting beaten by far smaller teams. It doesn't happen very often though. There are far, far more examples of small teams giving far far bigger teams a fright and making them work way harder than they ever thought they would. We were an example of a smaller team being completely in awe of a bigger team and not coming close to showing any bottle or will to win and Villa were a bigger team that couldn't believe their luck in how little effort they needed to use to win very comfortably.

I recall watching Cummings playing for League One Shrewsbury(much smaller turnover than us) against Liverpool in the FA Cup. Liverpool hardly got beat in the League that year and were a far better side than Villa and a good deal richer too. Shrewsbury realised that they had nothing to lose, threw everything at it and could easily have won the tie. They ended up drawing but the biggest difference between their approach and ours tonight was they went out thinking it was 11 v 11 and we went out thinking it was EPL v SPFL and x turnover again y turnover. We went out thinking if not knowing we couldn't win imo and the tactics suited that mentality.

Agree with this

The difference in that Shrewsbury game was down to 1 man, with a gallus streak that went on the pitch saying (to hinself) I'll show thae bxxtards who I am

Jason Cummings

A bit of swag

We need more of that & less off the permanently (lazily) offside forward line we saw tonight

[WhileTheChief..]

Fans ****ing off at 80. Look forward to 7000 on Saturday.

If that's what it takes for the board to take notice then so be it.

[tamig]

Probably not or probably a joke or agreeing with whoever he was speaking to.

I don’t know if he said it or not. If he did though, you’re spot on. No context or anything. Could have been a jokey response. But some will take it out of context, post the words and the guy is the devil in disguise.

[Stanton Spence]

Let’s be honest we’re not even a good Scottish premier league club never mind a really good English premier league club
I don’t know what folk where expecting but a backs to the wall and get right aboot them style just doesn’t work or happen in modern football these villa players are playing at the level they are for a reason and our are where we are for a reason
What gets me is why teams like villa are actually playing in the same round as us when they are one of the favourites to win the trophy? Are these rounds not all about letting the teams around our level to progress to the group stages ? What’s the point in even thinking about group stages when you have to play teams at that level

[007]

There are many examples of big teams getting beaten by far smaller teams. It doesn't happen very often though. There are far, far more examples of small teams giving far far bigger teams a fright and making them work way harder than they ever thought they would. We were an example of a smaller team being completely in awe of a bigger team and not coming close to showing any bottle or will to win and Villa were a bigger team that couldn't believe their luck in how little effort they needed to use to win very comfortably.

I recall watching Cummings playing for League One Shrewsbury(much smaller turnover than us) against Liverpool in the FA Cup. Liverpool hardly got beat in the League that year and were a far better side than Villa and a good deal richer too. Shrewsbury realised that they had nothing to lose, threw everything at it and could easily have won the tie. They ended up drawing but the biggest difference between their approach and ours tonight was they went out thinking it was 11 v 11 and we went out thinking it was EPL v SPFL and x turnover again y turnover. We went out thinking if not knowing we couldn't win imo and the tactics suited that mentality.

Not comparable. Liverpool put out their B team that night so it wasn't the team that had barely lost in the league.

[wookie70]

Not comparable. Liverpool put out their B team that night so it wasn't the team that had barely lost in the league.

A B-team worth a huge amount more than Shrewsbury and with players coming off the bench who cost approximately 100 million in transfers. The comparison is that money isn't always the deciding factor in one off football matches. Sometimes it is grit and belief and making your own luck. Morton turned up against Rangers and Stirling Albion against Aberdeen, Darvel easily beat Aberdeen in the cup. It can be done but it needs you to enter the field of play thinking you have a chance. There was absolutely no evidence of that tonight as we shuffled back into static, narrow banks of four straight from KO and waited for Villa to create chances which inevitably would lead to a pretty heavy defeat.

[NAE NOOKIE]

Like another poster I was in the FF upper near enough behind the goals. Like him I had a perfect view up the pitch, it's one of the reasons I like to sit behind the goals, you can see the play building up from that vantage point and the movement of the players much better.

What I saw was a team who could move and retain the ball without allowing a Hibs player to get close enough to affect their play, no matter how hard they tried, and they did try. Folk saying they didn't are talking absolute rubbish.
Almost without exception the Villa player on the ball had an out ball, the result of intelligent movement by their team mates. They didn't think twice about playing the ball to a team mate who was covered because they know they would hold it, control it, pass it and almost without exception they all could very comfortably, even under pressure.

This is the quality multiple millions gets you ... it's why clubs with the financial power of Aston Villa are willing to pay that sort of money for talented, athletic and intelligent players. it's why the can compete well enough in a league containing about 18 clubs who would absolutely walk two thirds of the leagues in Europe, including the Scottish premier league, with their current squads to finish 7th in it last season.

I saw plenty of Hibs players trying to put in tackles, trying to be physical ... the trouble was by the time they got there the ball had been played to another talented player who was just as quick, just as fit, just as athletic and physical as the guy who had given him it. This had absolutely sod all to do with the Hibs players being 'soft as ****' ... we were just simply outplayed by a far far more talented, intelligent, athletic and physical team.

[Callum_62]

Like another poster I was in the FF upper near enough behind the goals. Like him I had a perfect view up the pitch, it's one of the reasons I like to sit behind the goals, you can see the play building up from that vantage point and the movement of the players much better.

What I saw was a team who could move and retain the ball without allowing a Hibs player to get close enough to affect their play, no matter how hard they tried, and they did try. Folk saying they didn't are talking absolute rubbish.
Almost without exception the Villa player on the ball had an out ball, the result of intelligent movement by their team mates. They didn't think twice about playing the ball to a team mate who was covered because they know they would hold it, control it, pass it and almost without exception they all could very comfortably, even under pressure.

This is the quality multiple millions gets you ... it's why clubs with the financial power of Aston Villa are willing to pay that sort of money for talented, athletic and intelligent players. it's why the can compete well enough in a league containing about 18 clubs who would absolutely walk two thirds of the leagues in Europe, including the Scottish premier league, with their current squads to finish 7th in it last season.

I saw plenty of Hibs players trying to put in tackles, trying to be physical ... the trouble was by the time they got there the ball had been played to another talented player who was just as quick, just as fit, just as athletic and physical as the guy who had given him it. This had absolutely sod all to do with the Hibs players being 'soft as ****' ... we were just simply outplayed by a far far more talented, intelligent, athletic and physical team.Aye but RUN!!

Your post is spot on, villa were just far too good

There was always a good change that would be how it played out

If villa in anyway turned up we were in bother - as soon as they announced their team and it was at full strength I didn't give us a hope in hell

I think some folk are vastly under rating the EPL and how big the disparity now is

Villa of course were one of the form teams in that league since Emery came in and they've just splashed about another 100 million

Sent from my Pixel 7 Pro using Tapatalk

[Hibs1969]

The fact we took till the 90th minute to get a booking says it all, never put a foot in, stood and watched them most of the game, Youan was an embarrassment, lazy, greedy. So bad.
So the fact the we didn’t resort to fouling means we didn’t try a leg? Nonsense. Villa were a couple of classes above us, they moved the ball quickly, concisely and accurately in a way way couldn’t match. Just look at the pace of their defenders whenever Youan tried to go past them, they were every bit as quick as he was, and a lot more physical too. That’s what a Sky financed multi million ££ budget buys you, something all the blood and thunder get intae them tactics will never overcome.

[007]

A B-team worth a huge amount more than Shrewsbury and with players coming off the bench who cost approximately 100 million in transfers. The comparison is that money isn't always the deciding factor in one off football matches. Sometimes it is grit and belief and making your own luck. Morton turned up against Rangers and Stirling Albion against Aberdeen, Darvel easily beat Aberdeen in the cup. It can be done but it needs you to enter the field of play thinking you have a chance. There was absolutely no evidence of that tonight as we shuffled back into static, narrow banks of four straight from KO and waited for Villa to create chances which inevitably would lead to a pretty heavy defeat.

Only facing the B team, no matter their value, makes a massive difference.

Instead of facing the Liverpool team that played Wolves a few days earlier:
Alisson
Alexander-Arnold
Gomez
van Dijk
Robertson
Oxlade-Chamberlain
Henderson
Wijnaldum
Salah
Firmino
Mané

They faced:
Adrián
N Williams
Matip
Lovren
Larouci
Chirivella
Fabinho
Jones
Elliot
Minamino
Origi

Villa played pretty much their strongest team available (it was only one changed from their starting line up that beat Everton 4-0).

For every shock result like Darvel v Aberdeen there are about 50 occasions where the much bigger/better resourced team won. Which is what happened in the other 2 examples you gave, albeit they weren't comfortable wins but then the gulf isn't comparable in those 2. And Shrewsbury only drew with Liverpool then lost the replay.

[Iain G]

Like another poster I was in the FF upper near enough behind the goals. Like him I had a perfect view up the pitch, it's one of the reasons I like to sit behind the goals, you can see the play building up from that vantage point and the movement of the players much better.

What I saw was a team who could move and retain the ball without allowing a Hibs player to get close enough to affect their play, no matter how hard they tried, and they did try. Folk saying they didn't are talking absolute rubbish.
Almost without exception the Villa player on the ball had an out ball, the result of intelligent movement by their team mates. They didn't think twice about playing the ball to a team mate who was covered because they know they would hold it, control it, pass it and almost without exception they all could very comfortably, even under pressure.

This is the quality multiple millions gets you ... it's why clubs with the financial power of Aston Villa are willing to pay that sort of money for talented, athletic and intelligent players. it's why the can compete well enough in a league containing about 18 clubs who would absolutely walk two thirds of the leagues in Europe, including the Scottish premier league, with their current squads to finish 7th in it last season.

I saw plenty of Hibs players trying to put in tackles, trying to be physical ... the trouble was by the time they got there the ball had been played to another talented player who was just as quick, just as fit, just as athletic and physical as the guy who had given him it. This had absolutely sod all to do with the Hibs players being 'soft as ****' ... we were just simply outplayed by a far far more talented, intelligent, athletic and physical team.

All fair points, but we didn't change our shape or learn or react to reduce the crosses coming in from their left back. Whether that's the intelligence of the management and/or players but we should have changed our set up at least to try to stop the flow. We kept the narrow back 4 all the way through the game.

[lyonhibs]

I can when there’s folk sitting watching on the telly saying we’re talking crap!

What about people that live thousands of miles away watching on the telly that agree with you? 🤔😅

[ErinGoBraghHFC]

I can when there’s folk sitting watching on the telly saying we’re talking crap!

Some of those folks travel to a home game is further than yours to most away games, mind.

Not me, but some.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[matty_f]

It honestly blows my mind how unwilling some folk are to give our own team a bit of slack here.

Folk are annoyed that we scraped past Raith on Saturday, the assumption being we should have beaten them easily.

Raith’s squad value is about £7m less than us. That doesn’t buy you the right leg of any of Villa’s first team. But the expectation is that gulf means we should have tucked them away without any hassle.

Inter Club d’Escalades’ squad is valued at about £8m less than ours. There was ****ing uproar - demands for sacking etc - when we lost the first leg to them, and everyone expected/demanded we pump them at Easter Road.

We did pump them and because the expectations were so high (and rightly so) folk were talking about it being a sackable offence if we didn’t get through.

Our expectations were that we were so much better that anything other than a pumping would have been reason to sack the manager against both/either of Raith and Inter.

£7m and £8m (approx) difference in squad value between us and them, respectively.


The difference between us and Villa in squad value is around £540m. Over half a billion quid.

Their manager is one of the best in the world, their goalkeeper is the best in the world. They are littered with internationalists from top footballing countries.

Not one of our players gets into Villa’s team, not one. Our manager is never getting quoted for the Villa job. In every single way, they are better than us. There is no advantage we have that Villa don’t trump.

Of course if looked easy for them. Of course it looked like we didn’t get near them and of course they dominated the ball from first whistle to last.

In the same way that we were better than Raith and found it easier against Inter, Villa found it easy against us.

I was as frustrated as anyone at the game yesterday but ffs, we have to have some degree of realism and perspective as to what’s happened on the night.

Villa are amongst the top 20 richest clubs in the world. For context, Celtic - who regularly pump us - just make the top 70.

[He's here!]

A B-team worth a huge amount more than Shrewsbury and with players coming off the bench who cost approximately 100 million in transfers. The comparison is that money isn't always the deciding factor in one off football matches. Sometimes it is grit and belief and making your own luck. Morton turned up against Rangers and Stirling Albion against Aberdeen, Darvel easily beat Aberdeen in the cup. It can be done but it needs you to enter the field of play thinking you have a chance. There was absolutely no evidence of that tonight as we shuffled back into static, narrow banks of four straight from KO and waited for Villa to create chances which inevitably would lead to a pretty heavy defeat.

Funny as they were there was a bit of an unspoken 'there but for...' about that Darvel result and Hearts losing to Brora ie I suspect Hibs could also have lost those ties. There would certainly have been more chance of that than this Hibs side laying a glove on Villa.

[lyonhibs]

It honestly blows my mind how unwilling some folk are to give our own team a bit of slack here.

Folk are annoyed that we scraped past Raith on Saturday, the assumption being we should have beaten them easily.

Raith’s squad value is about £7m less than us. That doesn’t buy you the right leg of any of Villa’s first team. But the expectation is that gulf means we should have tucked them away without any hassle.

Inter Club d’Escalades’ squad is valued at about £8m less than ours. There was ****ing uproar - demands for sacking etc - when we lost the first leg to them, and everyone expected/demanded we pump them at Easter Road.

We did pump them and because the expectations were so high (and rightly so) folk were talking about it being a sackable offence if we didn’t get through.

Our expectations were that we were so much better that anything other than a pumping would have been reason to sack the manager against both/either of Raith and Inter.

£7m and £8m (approx) difference in squad value between us and them, respectively.


The difference between us and Villa in squad value is around £540m. Over half a billion quid.

Their manager is one of the best in the world, their goalkeeper is the best in the world. They are littered with internationalists from top footballing countries.

Not one of our players gets into Villa’s team, not one. Our manager is never getting quoted for the Villa job. In every single way, they are better than us. There is no advantage we have that Villa don’t trump.

Of course if looked ready for them. Of course it looked like we didn’t get near them and of course they dominated the ball from first whistle to last.

In the same way that we were better than Ray and found it easier against Inter, Villa found it easy against us.

I was as frustrated as anyone at the game yesterday but ffs, we have to have some degree of realism and perspective as to what’s happened on the night.

Villa are amongst the top 20 richest clubs in the world. For context, Celtic - who regularly pump us - just make the top 70.

Many good points well made, but just wait until the Livingston game. If they shell our box with crosses from wingers under next to no pressure then we can be sure that LJ's seat in the dugout doesn't face the pitch.

The fundamental failings of this team have been consistently on show this season, they just get punished to varying degrees dependent on the opposition.

[matty_f]

Only facing the B team, no matter their value, makes a massive difference.

Instead of facing the Liverpool team that played Wolves a few days earlier:
Alisson
Alexander-Arnold
Gomez
van Dijk
Robertson
Oxlade-Chamberlain
Henderson
Wijnaldum
Salah
Firmino
Mané

They faced:
Adrián
N Williams
Matip
Lovren
Larouci
Chirivella
Fabinho
Jones
Elliot
Minamino
Origi

Villa played pretty much their strongest team available (it was only one changed from their starting line up that beat Everton 4-0).

For every shock result like Darvel v Aberdeen there are about 50 occasions where the much bigger/better resourced team won. Which is what happened in the other 2 examples you gave, albeit they weren't comfortable wins but then the gulf isn't comparable in those 2. And Shrewsbury only drew with Liverpool then lost the replay.

I would bet the difference between Darvel and Aberdeen, one of the biggest shocks ever in Scottish football would be at the absolute maximum around £15m.

It’s over half a billion pounds been Hibs and Villa.

Yes, shocks can happen but on that scale - it’s very, very rare.

[matty_f]

Many good points well made, but just wait until Livingston shell our box with crosses from wingers under next to no pressure.

The fundamental failings of this team have been consistently on show, they just get punished to varying degrees dependent on the opposition.

They might well do that but it’ll be a different game against Livingston than it was last night and everyone will be expecting us to beat Livi because we’re the bigger team so if Livi don’t defend our crosses out however else we score, we’re not going to be heaping praise on the manager or players for being so brilliant that we found a way through and we won’t be slaughtering Livi’s defence for conceding because it’s expected that they’ll lose to the bigger team.

[flash]

Hearts 0 Spurs 5.
Rangers 1 Liverpool 7.
Hibs 0 Villa 5.
It's nothing out of the ordinary sadly.
There is a very coherent argument for thinking a change of manager would be beneficial but none of it comes from last night.
They just did to us what they did to a multi million pound Everton a few days previously.

[Gatecrasher]

Was anyone really expecting a shock last night? I certainly didn't but I expected much more from hibs last night, there was a severe lack of fight and resilience. We didn't even try to make things difficult for villa, it was all just to easy for them.

[green day]

Hearts 0 Spurs 5.
Rangers 1 Liverpool 7.
Hibs 0 Villa 5.
It's nothing out of the ordinary sadly.
There is a very coherent argument for thinking a change of manager would be beneficial but none of it comes from last night.
They just did to us what they did to a multi million pound Everton a few days previously.

Yep, your post and Matty's ones above are bang on the money.

People seem to think "trying harder" would have helped.

It wouldn't.

[flash]

Yep, your post and Matty's ones above are bang on the money.

People seem to think "trying harder" would have helped.

It wouldn't.

I would have picked a different team and packed the midfield but I certainly don't think the boys who were selected "didn't try a leg" as some joker put it.

[green day]

I would have picked a different team and packed the midfield but I certainly don't think the boys who were selected "didn't try a leg" as some joker put it.

Aye, I get that on formation.....but you can guarantee if we did and lost some would be straight on here saying that we were scared.

We were never winning this tie, full stop.

However, we need to address the defending for the league and cup games now.

[lyonhibs]

Aye, I get that on formation.....but you can guarantee if we did and lost some would be straight on here saying that we were scared.

We were never winning this tie, full stop.

However, we need to address the defending for the league and cup games now.

Your last line is the key. It's fine and correct to say we won't face players of the calibre of Digne or Watkins week on week, but if we press (or rather don't press) in our bread and butter games then LJ won't be in a job much longer

[WestStandWillie]

Not the result that bothers me but for **** sake. Didn’t try a leg


Villa were very good but we gifted them the first 3 goals. In an ideal world you strip out the entire back line and replace but there's a week left of the transfer window so not gonnae happen. I'm getting sick to the back teeth of watching those keystone cops masquerading as footballers.

[WestStandWillie]

It honestly blows my mind how unwilling some folk are to give our own team a bit of slack here.

Folk are annoyed that we scraped past Raith on Saturday, the assumption being we should have beaten them easily.

Raith’s squad value is about £7m less than us. That doesn’t buy you the right leg of any of Villa’s first team. But the expectation is that gulf means we should have tucked them away without any hassle.

Inter Club d’Escalades’ squad is valued at about £8m less than ours. There was ****ing uproar - demands for sacking etc - when we lost the first leg to them, and everyone expected/demanded we pump them at Easter Road.

We did pump them and because the expectations were so high (and rightly so) folk were talking about it being a sackable offence if we didn’t get through.

Our expectations were that we were so much better that anything other than a pumping would have been reason to sack the manager against both/either of Raith and Inter.

£7m and £8m (approx) difference in squad value between us and them, respectively.


The difference between us and Villa in squad value is around £540m. Over half a billion quid.

Their manager is one of the best in the world, their goalkeeper is the best in the world. They are littered with internationalists from top footballing countries.

Not one of our players gets into Villa’s team, not one. Our manager is never getting quoted for the Villa job. In every single way, they are better than us. There is no advantage we have that Villa don’t trump.

Of course if looked easy for them. Of course it looked like we didn’t get near them and of course they dominated the ball from first whistle to last.

In the same way that we were better than Raith and found it easier against Inter, Villa found it easy against us.

I was as frustrated as anyone at the game yesterday but ffs, we have to have some degree of realism and perspective as to what’s happened on the night.

Villa are amongst the top 20 richest clubs in the world. For context, Celtic - who regularly pump us - just make the top 70.

Doesn't excuse the primary school defending, nae matter how ye dress it up.

[matty_f]

Doesn't excuse the primary school defending, nae matter how ye dress it up.

It really does.

Villa made it look easy and that says far not about their players than it does ours.

Go back and watch the goals, first one they worth space on our right very well., and the cross in is absolutely perfect. Neither Fish or Hanlon are badly positioned but the cross is just high enough to beat Fish and is right on the striker’s head and it’s a great finish.

The second is from a set piece, Campbell should do better against Watkins but we should also allow for the fact that Villa can afford to pay a set piece coach, someone whose sole job is to focus on goes to score and defend see pieces. Their financial advantage absolutely played a part there.

The third is a mistake from Hanlon that loses possession and we should have defended better after that but again, Villa’s pace and accuracy on the ball - inch perfect cross and a striker being faster to it than our defenders, comes from ing better players making better decisions.

Their fourth goal is a counter attack and again is the pace of their players and the accuracy of their execution that makes the difference.

And the fifth is a penalty after a great bit of play forced the error from Stevenson, again a total mis-match in quality.

The difference in class absolutely dictates how those goals are conceded.

[flash]

I wonder if people go home thinking Scottish lower league teams haven't tried a leg if they are well beaten by top division teams in the Cups.

[WestStandWillie]

It really does.

Villa made it look easy and that says far not about their players than it does ours.

Go back and watch the goals, first one they worth space on our right very well., and the cross in is absolutely perfect. Neither Fish or Hanlon are badly positioned but the cross is just high enough to beat Fish and is right on the striker’s head and it’s a great finish.

The second is from a set piece, Campbell should do better against Watkins but we should also allow for the fact that Villa can afford to pay a set piece coach, someone whose sole job is to focus on goes to score and defend see pieces. Their financial advantage absolutely played a part there.

The third is a mistake from Hanlon that loses possession and we should have defended better after that but again, Villa’s pace and accuracy on the ball - inch perfect cross and a striker being faster to it than our defenders, comes from ing better players making better decisions.

Their fourth goal is a counter attack and again is the pace of their players and the accuracy of their execution that makes the difference.

And the fifth is a penalty after a great bit of play forced the error from Stevenson, again a total mis-match in quality.

The difference in class absolutely dictates how those goals are conceded.

I admire the positivity but we're losing those first 3 goals every week. It's almost a collective sigh around me when we concede rather than anger these days. Thanks for the memories Lewis and Paul but we need better. Hanlon is not captain material, he's no vocal enough.

[Heisenberg]

I admire the positivity but we're losing those first 3 goals every week. It's almost a collective sigh around me when we concede rather than anger these days. Thanks for the memories Lewis and Paul but we need better. Hanlon is not captain material, he's no vocal enough.

Exactly. If we had one poor night defensively against a really good Villa team then it’s understandable but this has been a problem in every one of our games so far. The manager cannot set us up to keep a clean sheet by the looks of it.

Hanlon and Stevenson eventually need replaced by better but we don’t seem interested in doing so. Hanlon especially is still of a good standard for our level, the defence is being badly exposed every game due to the manager imo.

[Brightside]

I admire the positivity but we're losing those first 3 goals every week. It's almost a collective sigh around me when we concede rather than anger these days. Thanks for the memories Lewis and Paul but we need better. Hanlon is not captain material, he's no vocal enough.

That’s just pish tbh.

[WestStandWillie]

That’s just pish tbh.

It really isn't so suck it up buttercup.

[matty_f]

I admire the positivity but we're losing those first 3 goals every week. It's almost a collective sigh around me when we concede rather than anger these days. Thanks for the memories Lewis and Paul but we need better. Hanlon is not captain material, he's no vocal enough.

It’s not positivity, it’s realism. Villa took 4 off Everton at the weekend, Everton who are managed by a guy with a great reputation for making his teams hard to beat.

Good players make average players look awful.

World class players like Villa’s do what they did last night to average players.

[WestStandWillie]

It’s not positivity, it’s realism. Villa took 4 off Everton at the weekend, Everton who are managed by a guy with a great reputation for making his teams hard to beat.

Good players make average players look awful.

World class players like Villa’s do what they did last night to average players.


Still doesn't excuse pish defending. Did we encounter world class players against St Mirren and Motherwell?

[matty_f]

Still doesn't excuse pish defending. Did we encounter world class players against St Mirren and Motherwell?

No we didn’t, we lost cheap goals to them.

Maybe need to realise that our players are not levels and levels above their players though.

We’re not likely to sign players who don’t make any mistakes.

[One Day Soon]

I see the debate - borrowing from other debates in the world in general - has now reached the binary point or at least it is being characterised as such. Either Villa have billions more than us so nothing could be done or our players didn’t even bother trying hard enough.

Actually though many of us who were sickened by last nights performance are not refusing to acknowledge the massive financial gulf - and all the advantages that brings - in every conceivable respect. I thought we would lose by 5 to 7 goals, but I thought we would make them earn it. We didn’t. They didn’t kill the atmosphere and with it any chance of making it harder for them last night, we did with our set up and play. Marshall admitted that in his interview.

Last night was simply an extreme demonstration of the weaknesses we have been carrying for months if not years, exposed by a team well equipped to do so.

Our midfield is at best average, has no depth and is full of lightweights. Our defence is terrible and I don’t blame the players for that. They are not signing themselves. They are not choosing themselves for selection. Lewis Stephenson loves Hibernian. He has been one of its greatest servants. He is in all fairness, these days a really great cover option in that position. He is also a good distance past his best. So is Paul Hanlon. Fish is not currently the same player he was last season. That defence was given next to no protection out wide last night. All this BTW after signing, what, 20 or so players under Johnson? Most of those signings cannot get anywhere near the first team.

We didn’t get to this overnight. Someone is responsible for who we sign, who gets picked, what formation we play, what tactics we adopt, how we train, how fit we are, how individual players are motivated, how individual players are coached and developed and how the team and the club are led. We are a mess and have been for a long time.

Villa were just the x-ray machine that exposed the mess but plenty of other much, much weaker sides have exposed the same and other vulnerabilities.

So yes, Villa should expect to beat us very, very comfortably. That doesn’t excuse our own underperformance though. After the game Johnson described it. When though, if ever, is his management going to do something about it rather than just narrating it back at us?

[ErinGoBraghHFC]

It’s not positivity, it’s realism. Villa took 4 off Everton at the weekend, Everton who are managed by a guy with a great reputation for making his teams hard to beat.

Good players make average players look awful.

World class players like Villa’s do what they did last night to average players.

I totally agree with everything that you’re saying, but why the **** were they set up to absorb pressure in our own box and inviting crosses? We can’t defend them, we conceded two soft goals from corners in the Luzern games, free headers. What made the manager think the story would be any different against a far better team in Villa? Bizarre.


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[Svengali]

Games like last night bring out the worst in our support. Guys who haven’t been to games in years shouting absolute sh*te and abuse at our own players, whilst we play against a team who’d pump the bigots from the west.

There were 3 muppets behind us in the east last night, every Hibs player was p*sh, but why are we booing John McGinn??

I genuinely wonder what folk were expecting last night.

We were facing a team looking to win it, we’re merely taking part in the competition

[Brightside]

It really isn't so suck it up buttercup.

I sit in the west stand also Willie. Come sit next to me at the Livi game and I’ll talk you through it. Sweet cheeks.

[WhileTheChief..]

What about people that live thousands of miles away watching on the telly that agree with you? ����

Just to be clear on this, I’m not having a go at anyone that wasn’t at the game last night.

Your, or their view, on the game is just as valid as anyone inside ER.

What I take issue with is if you start saying that those of us in the ground didn’t support the team well enough or complain about anything we did or didn’t do at the game.

There were folk travelled thousands of miles to be there last night. They made the effort to support the team, which in my book gives them the right to complain about the performance or result.

To then be told they’re talking crap by someone who only had to flick channels?? That’s BS.

[WestStandWillie]

I sit in the west stand also Willie. Come sit next to me at the Livi game and I’ll talk you through it. Sweet cheeks.

Would be my pleasure!

When Nouble bullies our soft centered defenders you can buy me a pie instead of watching my "told you so" dance. :na na:

[lyonhibs]

They might well do that but it’ll be a different game against Livingston than it was last night and everyone will be expecting us to beat Livi because we’re the bigger team so if Livi don’t defend our crosses out however else we score, we’re not going to be heaping praise on the manager or players for being so brilliant that we found a way through and we won’t be slaughtering Livi’s defence for conceding because it’s expected that they’ll lose to the bigger team.

I was talking about Livi peppering our box with crosses, not the reverse.

There won't be the "chasm in quality/finance" explanation then was my point, it would just be pish tactics/management acumen

[matty_f]

I was talking about Livi peppering our box with crosses, not the reverse.

There won't be the "chasm in quality/finance" explanation then was my point, it would just be pish tactics/management acumen

It would be, let’s see what happens though eh?

It’s worth remembering that we can’t buy players who don’t make mistakes. We can definitely do better than we’re doing but anyone going to Easter Road and expecting a perfect performance or for us not to concede goals is going to be sorely disappointed.

[WhileTheChief..]

We managed to sign John McGinn.

The world hasn’t changed so much that we can’t sign quality players again.

[GreenCastle]

I see the debate - borrowing from other debates in the world in general - has now reached the binary point or at least it is being characterised as such. Either Villa have billions more than us so nothing could be done or our players didn’t even bother trying hard enough.

Actually though many of us who were sickened by last nights performance are not refusing to acknowledge the massive financial gulf - and all the advantages that brings - in every conceivable respect. I thought we would lose by 5 to 7 goals, but I thought we would make them earn it. We didn’t. They didn’t kill the atmosphere and with it any chance of making it harder for them last night, we did with our set up and play. Marshall admitted that in his interview.

Last night was simply an extreme demonstration of the weaknesses we have been carrying for months if not years, exposed by a team well equipped to do so.

Our midfield is at best average, has no depth and is full of lightweights. Our defence is terrible and I don’t blame the players for that. They are not signing themselves. They are not choosing themselves for selection. Lewis Stephenson loves Hibernian. He has been one of its greatest servants. He is in all fairness, these days a really great cover option in that position. He is also a good distance past his best. So is Paul Hanlon. Fish is not currently the same player he was last season. That defence was given next to no protection out wide last night. All this BTW after signing, what, 20 or so players under Johnson? Most of those signings cannot get anywhere near the first team.

We didn’t get to this overnight. Someone is responsible for who we sign, who gets picked, what formation we play, what tactics we adopt, how we train, how fit we are, how individual players are motivated, how individual players are coached and developed and how the team and the club are led. We are a mess and have been for a long time.

Villa were just the x-ray machine that exposed the mess but plenty of other much, much weaker sides have exposed the same and other vulnerabilities.

So yes, Villa should expect to beat us very, very comfortably. That doesn’t excuse our own underperformance though. After the game Johnson described it. When though, if ever, is his management going to do something about it rather than just narrating it back at us?

Good post.

Everyone with a brain cell realised Villa would win last night but the way we set up and players we played was a concern.

He talked about matching them physically - surely Rocky is one of our best athletes and should have been starting ?

You could even argue Doidge to hold the ball up and speed out wide.

It was 5-0 going on 10 for Villa which was a glorified training game for them.

We just aren’t very good - I just looked at the Jack Ross team that played Rijeka away and it’s very similar to the level we had last night.

I think if we started the league better I would be less concerned but there are many warning signs out there that our squad is still average in areas.

[lucky]

I sometimes wonder if people on here actually watch football! Aston Villa are a top side. Costa and McGinn will give most midfielders a game in any league. The movement of Villa off the ball was fantastic. Yes Hibs were limited in an attacking sense but that was not to effort. Villa were bigger, stronger, faster, mentally tougher, fitter and more skilful than us. That's the reason we got well beaten.

What's not acceptable is the way we lost 4 goals down the right-hand side. Boyle failed to track back leaving Miller exposed as he picked up McGinn, which left Digne the freedom of Leith. It was either a stupid tactic from Johnson, which he failed to address or a very poor performance from Boyle which again Johnson failed to address. Can someone explain why he took off Obita when it was our right-hand side that had lost 3 goals in the first half?

I really want LJ and his management team to succeed but if we lose at home on Saturday the demand will be massive for him to go. But next Thursday could be the biggest hammering in our history and our support will go into meltdown.

[WestStandWillie]

It would be, let’s see what happens though eh?

It’s worth remembering that we can’t buy players who don’t make mistakes. We can definitely do better than we’re doing but anyone going to Easter Road and expecting a perfect performance or for us not to concede goals is going to be sorely disappointed.

It's the same mistakes by the same players though. Other sides drop individuals, we seem to stick with them and it becomes a rinse and repeat job. It's actually got to the point where teams purposely target these areas because we have no plan b.

Martindale will be sitting salivating at the prospect of Nouble up against Hanlon and Stevenson. LJ needs to mix it up and keep them guessing. Can't see it sadly.

[matty_f]

We managed to sign John McGinn.

The world hasn’t changed so much that we can’t sign quality players again.

We did, it is potentially a once in a generation signing though and the McGinn we signed needed a lot of development to get to the McGinn that left, and he got a season in the Championship with us to develop.

You have to bear in mind that the football world has changed since then - the big English clubs scoop up the very best Scottish youth talent early doors because they can afford to.

The players who aren’t quite at that level get scooped up by Rangers and Celtic, and the rest of the clubs fight for what is left.

It’s much harder for a club like us to find a John McGinn now than it was even a few years ago. Not impossible, but much harder.

[lyonhibs]

It would be, let’s see what happens though eh?

It’s worth remembering that we can’t buy players who don’t make mistakes. We can definitely do better than we’re doing but anyone going to Easter Road and expecting a perfect performance or for us not to concede goals is going to be sorely disappointed.

It goes without saying I hope we hump Livingston with a coruscating attacking display and that LJ and team lead us to a cup double etc.

Agreed with your 2nd paragraph as well. As a French bloke once said "l'imperfection c'est la cime" 😅

[Tyler Durden]

Hibs could have played out of our skins last night, 8 or 9 player raising their game and still have lost 0-5 or worse. I don't think anyone is disputing that.

However that's not what happened. We barely had a player who acquitted themselves well and they were set up to fail by an increasingly incompetent manager. Who basically seemed to play the same tactics he'd adopt to play Motherwell or St Mirren. That's the problem.

Barring 20 minutes against St Mirren and spells at home to Luzern, we've been rubbish all season IMO.

A shame that a glamour tie like this has come up when we've just not got a good team.

[supermcginn]

I admire the positivity but we're losing those first 3 goals every week. It's almost a collective sigh around me when we concede rather than anger these days. Thanks for the memories Lewis and Paul but we need better. Hanlon is not captain material, he's no vocal enough.

You are absolutely spot on, some fans on here genuinely seem to care more about those two players than the actual club. Hanlon is one of the least inspiring captains I've ever seen.

[Callum_62]

There were folk travelled thousands of miles to be there last night. They made the effort to support the team, which in my book gives them the right to complain about the performance or result.

To then be told they’re talking crap by someone who only had to flick channels?? That’s BS.

I don't see the correlation between distance travelled and sense talked tbh



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[Just_Jimmy]

I sometimes wonder if people on here actually watch football! Aston Villa are a top side. Costa and McGinn will give most midfielders a game in any league. The movement of Villa off the ball was fantastic. Yes Hibs were limited in an attacking sense but that was not to effort. Villa were bigger, stronger, faster, mentally tougher, fitter and more skilful than us. That's the reason we got well beaten.

What's not acceptable is the way we lost 4 goals down the right-hand side. Boyle failed to track back leaving Miller exposed as he picked up McGinn, which left Digne the freedom of Leith. It was either a stupid tactic from Johnson, which he failed to address or a very poor performance from Boyle which again Johnson failed to address. Can someone explain why he took off Obita when it was our right-hand side that had lost 3 goals in the first half?

I really want LJ and his management team to succeed but if we lose at home on Saturday the demand will be massive for him to go. But next Thursday could be the biggest hammering in our history and our support will go into meltdown.And then elle didn't help Lewis at all in the second half meaning he got roasted and gave away the penalty in the end.

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[Brightside]

You are absolutely spot on, some fans on here genuinely seem to care more about those two players than the actual club. Hanlon is one of the least inspiring captains I've ever seen.

What is that actually based on? Ask the players if he is an inspiring captain or if Lewis is inspiring. Fans in the stand have no idea.

[Crunchie]

You are absolutely spot on, some fans on here genuinely seem to care more about those two players than the actual club. Hanlon is one of the least inspiring captains I've ever seen.
Look at his body language after the goals we conceded last night, it tells you all you need to know about his attitude. He's the softest captain I've ever seen at ER in all my years going and the softest CH.

[Crunchie]

What is that actually based on? Ask the players if he is an inspiring captain or if Lewis is inspiring. Fans in the stand have no idea.
He flaps his arms about a lot and never opens his mouth, his body language at all the goals tells you all you need to know about him.

[Clarence Beeks]

Yes, there's a gulf in class between the players and income of the two clubs and it showed last night.

But the real difference is the manager. If there are any weaknesses in your setup, he will find them and exploit them. If the game had taken place this time last year you'd have been in it, that useless carpethead we had in charge previously hadn't got a clue how to set a team up.

[WeeRussell]

Yes, there's a gulf in class between the players and income of the two clubs and it showed last night.

But the real difference is the manager. If there are any weaknesses in your setup, he will find them and exploit them. If the game had taken place this time last year you'd have been in it, that useless carpethead we had in charge previously hadn't got a clue how to set a team up.

I disagree somewhat . I could have managed Villa to a comfortable win last night.

However I do think Emery is a quality manager and will be good for Villa going forward.

[WeeRussell]

I hope this is tongue in cheek after your post saying a poster was getting grief after giving an opinion despite not being at the game at the weekend

Was also well-known the struggle for some posters to get tickets/make the game.

I’d also suggest the OP can’t be a regular attendee if that was the most pissed off at a Hibs result and performance they’ve ever been 😂

I don’t get the “right from kick off thing” either. I actually really enjoyed the first 10 mins or so. Unfortunately a quick couple of goals knocked the stuffing out us off and on the park. Ultimately the game turned out how we expected and the hope of being in the tie faded before half time.

I do like the south upper the rare times we’re in it. Decent view above the goals.

[Lago]

Was anyone really expecting a shock last night? I certainly didn't but I expected much more from hibs last night, there was a severe lack of fight and resilience. We didn't even try to make things difficult for villa, it was all just to easy for them.
It turned into no more than a training match for Villa, it does make you wonder if there is any point in Scottish teams, other than, Celtic and Rangers, playing in Europe now, perhaps the added European mspaces available are not worth the agro.

[green day]

It turned into no more than a training match for Villa, it does make you wonder if there is any point in Scottish teams, other than, Celtic and Rangers, playing in Europe now, perhaps the added European mspaces available are not worth the agro.

Someone elsewhere mentioned that the 3rd competition should perhaps not be open to clubs from the largest leagues.

It's certainly odds on that a club from England, Spain, Germany, Italy will win the conf league, enriching clubs in what are already the richest leagues.

As always, we are being taken for a ride by UEFA, and while the group stage money is good for a small number of clubs in smaller leagues, it won't help them be "competitive" in games like last night.

[lyonhibs]

It turned into no more than a training match for Villa, it does make you wonder if there is any point in Scottish teams, other than, Celtic and Rangers, playing in Europe now, perhaps the added European mspaces available are not worth the agro.

What "Aggro" is that? Lucerne away was one of the best nights of my Hibs supporting life.

[He's here!]

What is that actually based on? Ask the players if he is an inspiring captain or if Lewis is inspiring. Fans in the stand have no idea.

That's a fair point. I don't think there's any question both players have always given their absolute all to Hibs over many years and in some cases the criticism of them seems to be based on little more than the fact they've been with us their whole career (as though that automatically makes them poor players). As you say, you'd probably find little but praise for them both among those they've played alongside over the years. They are both thoroughly professional, great ambassadors for the club and better players than many give them credit for.

Pat Stanton's team-mates have referred to him as a quiet captain but he was also one of our greatest ever players so was able to lead by example. Crucially, though, he was regularly surrounded by really top players who carried plenty of clout on the park, which must have made his job easier. I also remember Sauzee lauding Yogi's motivational abilities as captain, particularly before derbies, but here again when you have players of Sauzee and Latapy's quality around you it's not so hard to conjure up a strong performance. Both Hanlon and Stevenson have played well in good Hibs teams but their limitations are laid bare when the quality of the team around them declines.

[Edinburgh Green]

Full backs who don't stop crosses and central defenders who can't win headers. Lewis Miller cost us 3 of the 5 goals. Villa just too quick and better on the ball all over the park.

Millers job wasn't to mark Digne, that was Boyle's job. Poor from Boyle but worse was Johnson not changing it to try and stop it happening over and over again

[He's here!]

What "Aggro" is that? Lucerne away was one of the best nights of my Hibs supporting life.

I'm assuming he means that if you're looking to make serious progress in a European tournament then we're miles off it and mis-matches like last night just lay that bare in rather embarrassing fashion. As you say, though, simply by qualifying you get the chance as a fan to escape from the domestic grind and enjoy a couple of away trips. If serious progress was all that mattered why are any fans bothering to travel to Birmingham next week?

Is Europe an occasionally pleasant diversion or should we aspire to be better at that level? The fact that the last 20-30 years are littered with truly humiliating results for non-Old Firm Scottish clubs in Europe suggests the former is pretty much the norm.

[lyonhibs]

I'm assuming he means that if you're looking to make serious progress in a European tournament then we're miles off it and mis-matches like last night just lay that bare in rather embarrassing fashion. As you say, though, simply by qualifying you get the chance as a fan to escape from the domestic grind and enjoy a couple of away trips. If serious progress was all that mattered why are any fans bothering to travel to Birmingham next week?

Is Europe an occasionally pleasant diversion or should we aspire to be better at that level? The fact that the last 20-30 years are littered with truly humiliating results for non-Old Firm Scottish clubs in Europe suggests the former is pretty much the norm.

As long as it's pleasant and you don't get turfed out by some Latvian coal miners in late June then that'll do me, although of course we would all want it to be more.

Of course, the best way to make progress full stop short of a rich Arab being entranced by Sunshine on Leith would be to finish 3rd more than once every bloody 15 years or so but that's for another thread.

[Hibernian Verse]

I'm assuming he means that if you're looking to make serious progress in a European tournament then we're miles off it and mis-matches like last night just lay that bare in rather embarrassing fashion. As you say, though, simply by qualifying you get the chance as a fan to escape from the domestic grind and enjoy a couple of away trips. If serious progress was all that mattered why are any fans bothering to travel to Birmingham next week?

Is Europe an occasionally pleasant diversion or should we aspire to be better at that level? The fact that the last 20-30 years are littered with truly humiliating results for non-Old Firm Scottish clubs in Europe suggests the former is pretty much the norm.

Don't exclude the Old Firm. 7-1 hammering at Ibrox last year.

[Iain G]

It really does.

Villa made it look easy and that says far not about their players than it does ours.

Go back and watch the goals, first one they worth space on our right very well., and the cross in is absolutely perfect. Neither Fish or Hanlon are badly positioned but the cross is just high enough to beat Fish and is right on the striker’s head and it’s a great finish.

The second is from a set piece, Campbell should do better against Watkins but we should also allow for the fact that Villa can afford to pay a set piece coach, someone whose sole job is to focus on goes to score and defend see pieces. Their financial advantage absolutely played a part there.

The third is a mistake from Hanlon that loses possession and we should have defended better after that but again, Villa’s pace and accuracy on the ball - inch perfect cross and a striker being faster to it than our defenders, comes from ing better players making better decisions.

Their fourth goal is a counter attack and again is the pace of their players and the accuracy of their execution that makes the difference.

And the fifth is a penalty after a great bit of play forced the error from Stevenson, again a total mis-match in quality.

The difference in class absolutely dictates how those goals are conceded.

Of course this and your post above are correct a d we never had a realistic chance of winning the game.

But there is a frustrating element to what we didnt do and that was to try adjust the setup and formation to try and make it less easy for them. A change of shape could have made us more solid, but we didn't seem to react to even try to counter them until Jeggo came on at halftime, and by then it was too late.

Could easily have tucked Miller into a back 3 and had Campbell drop to right wing back to help out against Digne and McGinn perhaps? We will never know as we never tried anything different, which is where some of the frustration comes from.

[GRA]

Don't exclude the Old Firm. 7-1 hammering at Ibrox last year.

Celtic have had a few hammerings from Barcelona (6-1, 7-0) & PSG (5-0, 7-1) in recent years as well.

[Hibs1969]

It honestly blows my mind how unwilling some folk are to give our own team a bit of slack here.

Folk are annoyed that we scraped past Raith on Saturday, the assumption being we should have beaten them easily.

Raith’s squad value is about £7m less than us. That doesn’t buy you the right leg of any of Villa’s first team. But the expectation is that gulf means we should have tucked them away without any hassle.

Inter Club d’Escalades’ squad is valued at about £8m less than ours. There was ****ing uproar - demands for sacking etc - when we lost the first leg to them, and everyone expected/demanded we pump them at Easter Road.

We did pump them and because the expectations were so high (and rightly so) folk were talking about it being a sackable offence if we didn’t get through.

Our expectations were that we were so much better that anything other than a pumping would have been reason to sack the manager against both/either of Raith and Inter.

£7m and £8m (approx) difference in squad value between us and them, respectively.


The difference between us and Villa in squad value is around £540m. Over half a billion quid.

Their manager is one of the best in the world, their goalkeeper is the best in the world. They are littered with internationalists from top footballing countries.

Not one of our players gets into Villa’s team, not one. Our manager is never getting quoted for the Villa job. In every single way, they are better than us. There is no advantage we have that Villa don’t trump.

Of course if looked easy for them. Of course it looked like we didn’t get near them and of course they dominated the ball from first whistle to last.

In the same way that we were better than Raith and found it easier against Inter, Villa found it easy against us.

I was as frustrated as anyone at the game yesterday but ffs, we have to have some degree of realism and perspective as to what’s happened on the night.

Villa are amongst the top 20 richest clubs in the world. For context, Celtic - who regularly pump us - just make the top 70.

Spot on. Some of our fans need a huge reality check, last night showed perfectly the financial gulf between Scottish football and the EPL. Some of the defending was poor admittedly but the constant pressure Hibs were under from a talented, highly professional outfit meant that cracks were bound to show. That was near enough the strongest side Hibs could put out last night and we never got a sniff, not due to lack of effort or passion but simply down to the massive financial gap between the 2 leagues. Money talks I’m afraid.

[Lago]

What "Aggro" is that? Lucerne away was one of the best nights of my Hibs supporting life.
Thankfully being that bit older than you I can say I've seen Hibs teams competing with the best in Europe, and winning, Lucerne believe me are not in that league.

[He's here!]

Don't exclude the Old Firm. 7-1 hammering at Ibrox last year.

Yes, that's true and Celtic have also taken a good few pastings at Champions League level. However, at the tier below Rangers have very recently reached their second European final in the last 15 to 20 years. All I mean is that thanks the financial clout they have relative to the rest of Scottish football they are at least competitive at that level. I reckon both would have lost fairly comfortably to Villa over two legs mind you.

[matty_f]

Yes, that's true and Celtic have also taken a good few pastings at Champions League level. However, at the tier below Rangers have very recently reached their second European final in the last 15 to 20 years. All I mean is that thanks the financial clout they have relative to the rest of Scottish football they are at least competitive at that level. I reckon both would have lost fairly comfortably to Villa over two legs mind you.

That Villa side would win the league here no bother.

[weecounty hibby]

Thankfully being that bit older than you I can say I've seen Hibs teams competing with the best in Europe, and winning, Lucerne believe me are not in that league.

Sadly for us football has moved on hugely and is unrecognisable to what it was in the 60s and 70s. We were probably not paying players not too much less than opposition. Now we are paying 5k max where Villa are probably paying a minimum of 10x that. Forget the history of the two clubs and just look financially etc at the Lucerne game and we actually had a great result to go through that tie

[lyonhibs]

Thankfully being that bit older than you I can say I've seen Hibs teams competing with the best in Europe, and winning, Lucerne believe me are not in that league.

I believe you, but those days are long gone and aren't coming back. For those of us under about 40, the Lucerne away game was one of our best European results of our lives :flag:

[Lago]

Sadly for us football has moved on hugely and is unrecognisable to what it was in the 60s and 70s. We were probably not paying players not too much less than opposition. Now we are paying 5k max where Villa are probably paying a minimum of 10x that. Forget the history of the two clubs and just look financially etc at the Lucerne game and we actually had a great result to go through that tie
I understand that, but is it really worth it to then become nothing more than cannon fodder for some big hitter from one of Europe's top league, especially when you see the disharmony the Villa result has caused within the Hibs support. I know Hibs will never achieve the levels of past years I just think some supporters are blind to that and consequently find it hard to accept the inevitable.

[SlickShoes]

I understand that, but is it really worth it to then become nothing more than cannon fodder for some big hitter from one of Europe's top league, especially when you see the disharmony the Villa result has caused within the Hibs support. I know Hibs will never achieve the levels of past years I just think some supporters are blind to that and consequently find it hard to accept the inevitable.

So should we just not bother?

Football is broken at this point but all we can do is continue to try to qualify and try to get better. I’m sure other Scottish teams would much rather have had our European run this season than playing in the league cup group stages.

[NAE NOOKIE]

Thankfully being that bit older than you I can say I've seen Hibs teams competing with the best in Europe, and winning, Lucerne believe me are not in that league.

My mate's dad who was at all the great European nights back in the 60s and 70s made the same point after the game last night. It's not his fault, but it's a singular failure to recognise or acknowledge how football has changed over the decades and the point it has now reached.

I remember Lawrie Reilly criticising Hibs a few years before he died bemoaning the fact that Hibs couldn't achieve the consistency required to mount a challenge to the Uglies. Legend or not he absolutely failed to understand the realities of modern day football in that comment. If you had taken the team he played in and transported it to any point past 1990 the chances of it staying together for more than a season would have been absolutely zero and you can say exactly the same for Turnbull's team a few decades later or even Ferguson's Aberdeen team.

In the modern era Hibs beating the likes of Luzern 3 - 1 at home and getting a 2 - 2 away IS a bloody good performance and if our players and manager are worthy of criticism for a heavy home defeat to a club who are so far ahead of us in every measurable department you could name that they might as well be from a different universe, then they deserve the credit they are due for defeating a club who probably rate somewhere below Celtic and Rangers, but are at least on a level with Aberdeen and Hearts.

The only criticism you can really level at LJ and it's a deserved one, is that against Luzern away he gave up the wings to them and apart from losing a poor goal from a cross it worked to an extent. To play the same tactic against a team of Villa's quality was at best naive.

[NAE NOOKIE]

Celtic have had a few hammerings from Barcelona (6-1, 7-0) & PSG (5-0, 7-1) in recent years as well.

Yeh, I saw those games, their players didn't try a leg. That must be it right?

[HarpOnHibee]

We were up against top class players, but there was nothing top class about the goals we conceded. Some league 2 outfit could have scored those just as easily against that defence. It was an utterly pathetic showing and i'm not optimistic for the season ahead.

[matty_f]

Simon Jordan made the point on the radio that Villa earn what we earn annually every three weeks.

[flash]

We were up against top class players, but there was nothing top class about the goals we conceded. Some league 2 outfit could have scored those just as easily against that defence. It was an utterly pathetic showing and i'm not optimistic for the season ahead.

They really couldn't. Not even close.

[Tyler Durden]

I think it's only one poster who suggested the team weren't trying a leg.

Others are just pointing out our obvious failings. The manager himself has said that he's disappointed with how we handled situations which should have been within our control. David Marshall has said that the players are disappointed that they didn't give a good account of themselves.

So I don't think we need the points about Villa's budget. We know they're exceptional. The point is that Hibs were rubbish and massively naive and didn't do the basics as players or a coaching staff.

[HarpOnHibee]

They really couldn't. Not even close.

Their first 3 goals were the same thing and there was nothing spectacular about them. I wasn't realistically expecting a result against Villa, but I thought if we were going to concede goals to them, they'd at least be unavoidable. There was nothing unavoidable about those goals and were probably the easiest Villa will score in the competition.

[NAE NOOKIE]

It turned into no more than a training match for Villa, it does make you wonder if there is any point in Scottish teams, other than, Celtic and Rangers, playing in Europe now, perhaps the added European mspaces available are not worth the agro.

Look at the clubs winning all 3 European competitions, money talks ... EG it's 13 years since a club outside of Europe's big 5 leagues has won the UEFA cup / Europa League. It's 20 years since a club from outside the big 5 leagues has won the Champions league. Who won the very first conference league? .. oh what a surprise, West Ham from the EPL.

When you look at the teams left in this round of the Conference league Aston Villa are simply the worst draw any club could have had, there isn't a team left they wouldn't have been favourites to beat, many of them far bigger and richer than us. Folk need to get some perspective.

There is a case for a European competition that is restricted to clubs from countries with populations of 10,000,000 or less. The trouble with that is clubs who dominate these countries like the Uglies here and Benfica, Porto and Sporting in Portugal would never stand for being excluded from the Chamion's league gravy train which enables their continued domination of their domestic leagues.

[NAE NOOKIE]

Their first 3 goals were the same thing and there was nothing spectacular about them. I wasn't realistically expecting a result against Villa, but I thought if we were going to concede goals to them, they'd at least be unavoidable. There was nothing unavoidable about those goals and were probably the easiest Villa will score in the competition.

That is a fact, based on the poor goals we have lost in games against far lesser opposition than Aston Villa, it's undoubtedly something we need to sort out and it was before last night.

But that for me is where using the Villa game as a stick to beat the team with begins and ends. So far as I'm concerned that game is done .. finished and done .. all that's left is to try and get through the away leg with a modicum of our dignity left intact. After that if I never hear the name Aston sodding Villa again it will be too bloody soon. Not because I have anything against them, I would love to see SJM pick up another winners medal.

I much prefer to conserve my anger and annoyance for poor performances and heavy defeats against our peers ... not clubs like Aston Villa.

[HarpOnHibee]

That is a fact, based on the poor goals we have lost in games against far lesser opposition than Aston Villa, it's undoubtedly something we need to sort out and it was before last night.

But that for me is where using the Villa game as a stick to beat the team with begins and ends. So far as I'm concerned that game is done .. finished and done .. all that's left is to try and get through the away leg with a modicum of our dignity left intact. After that if I never hear the name Aston sodding Villa again it will be too bloody soon. Not because I have anything against them, I would love to see SJM pick up another winners medal.

I much prefer to conserve my anger and annoyance for poor performances and heavy defeats against our peers ... not clubs like Aston Villa.

That's a fair response. I'm just frustrated that we didn't make them work harder for that result last night considering the priority of the fixture. If we can't raise the bar under those circumstances, I struggle to see how we're going to raise it against any of the clubs in the league this season whenever we find ourselves on the back foot.

[Smartie]

I'm assuming he means that if you're looking to make serious progress in a European tournament then we're miles off it and mis-matches like last night just lay that bare in rather embarrassing fashion. As you say, though, simply by qualifying you get the chance as a fan to escape from the domestic grind and enjoy a couple of away trips. If serious progress was all that mattered why are any fans bothering to travel to Birmingham next week?

Is Europe an occasionally pleasant diversion or should we aspire to be better at that level? The fact that the last 20-30 years are littered with truly humiliating results for non-Old Firm Scottish clubs in Europe suggests the former is pretty much the norm.

If we're talking about learning to crawl before we walk then run and fly, getting past Inter and then beating Luzern is progress whichever way you want to look at it.

We now need to get back in, maintain those good results and with a better bit of luck in the draw try to squeeze past the next team.

Or finish third and get straight into the group stages, picking off the opportunity to play more teams.

Last night was pish and I expect next week at Villa Park to be more of the same or worse but I honestly don't know what more we can expect from Hibs in these games.

We now need to focus fully on improving our domestic results.

This season's European adventure is a success (albeit a relative one) and a tick in a box of the season's expectations. Depressing and bleak that may be, but it's where we are and acknowledging relative accomplishments is a way to keep improving, even if we're not yet the best team in the world.

[Lago]

My mate's dad who was at all the great European nights back in the 60s and 70s made the same point after the game last night. It's not his fault, but it's a singular failure to recognise or acknowledge how football has changed over the decades and the point it has now reached.

I remember Lawrie Reilly criticising Hibs a few years before he died bemoaning the fact that Hibs couldn't achieve the consistency required to mount a challenge to the Uglies. Legend or not he absolutely failed to understand the realities of modern day football in that comment. If you had taken the team he played in and transported it to any point past 1990 the chances of it staying together for more than a season would have been absolutely zero and you can say exactly the same for Turnbull's team a few decades later or even Ferguson's Aberdeen team.

In the modern era Hibs beating the likes of Luzern 3 - 1 at home and getting a 2 - 2 away IS a bloody good performance and if our players and manager are worthy of criticism for a heavy home defeat to a club who are so far ahead of us in every measurable department you could name that they might as well be from a different universe, then they deserve the credit they are due for defeating a club who probably rate somewhere below Celtic and Rangers, but are at least on a level with Aberdeen and Hearts.

The only criticism you can really level at LJ and it's a deserved one, is that against Luzern away he gave up the wings to them and apart from losing a poor goal from a cross it worked to an extent. To play the same tactic against a team of Villa's quality was at best naive.
Look I know exactly how your mate's dad feels and it's not nice, but the point I was trying to make, perhaps badly, is if Hibs get into Europe is it worth what we now see on this forum, disgruntled and disappointed fans, embarrassed players, calls to sack managers, coaches, players etc. For me when the final whistle went against Lucerne our European adventure was over and we had 2 games left, which were effectively glamour friendlies but some folk seemed to think Hibs should have showed more against Villa, that was fantasy land so let's accept the outcome gracefully and aim to improve.

[NAE NOOKIE]

Look I know exactly how your mate's dad feels and it's not nice, but the point I was trying to make, perhaps badly, is if Hibs get into Europe is it worth what we now see on this forum, disgruntled and disappointed fans, embarrassed players, calls to sack managers, coaches, players etc. For me when the final whistle went against Lucerne our European adventure was over and we had 2 games left, which were effectively glamour friendlies but some folk seemed to think Hibs should have showed more against Villa, that was fantasy land so let's accept the outcome gracefully and aim to improve.

In principle don't disagree with a word of that mate.

Personally though I don't think Europe is a bust just yet. If we could put out Luzern there are teams still in that had we drawn them we could have had a reasonable chance to make the group stages, where no doubt we would have found it an extremely hard shift, as Hearts found out last season. Unfortunately for us we ended up with the club who are most likely going to win this competition, not a gimmie, but every chance of doing so. Anybody judging where we are as a club using this tie and this opposition as a barometer is just being ridiculously unfair.

[Lago]

In principle don't disagree with a word of that mate.

Personally though I don't think Europe is a bust just yet. If we could put out Luzern there are teams still in that had we drawn them we could have had a reasonable chance to make the group stages, where no doubt we would have found it an extremely hard shift, as Hearts found out last season. Unfortunately for us we ended up with the club who are most likely going to win this competition, not a gimmie, but every chance of doing so. Anybody judging where we are as a club using this tie and this opposition as a barometer is just being ridiculously unfair.
Agree re the luck of the draw, which brings me to another point, this competition was introduced to allow clubs from smaller leagues/countries the opportunity to participate in European football, but of course clubs from the top leagues have found their way into it consequently West Ham win it last year and I'm sure Villa will be in the mix this year, fair, I don't think so.