The Wee Hibees. Too Wee or Not Too Wee, that is the question.

[Greenbeard]

Just reflecting on last night's tremendous effort by the Wee team. The gap in strength and athleticism between the two teams was glaring and I lost count of the number of times Hibs players were easily brushed off in 50/50 situations. The same physical difference vs Nantes and to a lesser extent Molde. Much has been said about some of our players deserving their chance with the senior team but maybe not being quite ready yet. So it begs the question, are we doing enough strength work with our academy players to get them ready to step up? I know it takes a couple of years to start to see the real benefits (assuming you do it naturally of course) so maybe we are not starting them on a strength programme early enough?

[hibsforeurope]

It's a tough call, do you want them to learn the technical aspects of the game at a young age or become physically strong but with less technical ability. There's only a certain amount of time these youngsters can be worked before they burn out at that age.

Some will be ready quicker then others, and others will develop physically as their careers progress, lewy is a prime example of this.

[The Modfather]

Others will be better placed to comment on the strength and condition of our academy. However the U19s aren’t any less physically developed than Euan Henderson who has had a good amount of minutes and started a semi final against Hearts.

For me Hibs have got it wrong and badly managed the current crop, but with the clear out in January & O’Connor, Laidlaw and Johnson starting to make the beach regularly hopefully there’s a shift happening and we will proactively try to bring this group through moving forward. I’ve moaned about the U19s and their pathway a lot, so won’t labour my point anymore.

[Brightside]

Just reflecting on last night's tremendous effort by the Wee team. The gap in strength and athleticism between the two teams was glaring and I lost count of the number of times Hibs players were easily brushed off in 50/50 situations. The same physical difference vs Nantes and to a lesser extent Molde. Much has been said about some of our players deserving their chance with the senior team but maybe not being quite ready yet. So it begs the question, are we doing enough strength work with our academy players to get them ready to step up? I know it takes a couple of years to start to see the real benefits (assuming you do it naturally of course) so maybe we are not starting them on a strength programme early enough?

Overall they were younger than the Dortmund squad. Also as mentioned on another thread the Dortmond squad had a lot of players from other continents who were clearly of bigger physiques than our home grown. We should only be measuring our kids against kids of the same background.

[superfurryhibby]

Others will be better placed to comment on the strength and condition of our academy. However the U19s aren’t any less physically developed than Euan Henderson who has had a good amount of minutes and started a semi final against Hearts.

For me Hibs have got it wrong and badly managed the current crop, but with the clear out in January & O’Connor, Laidlaw and Johnson starting to make the beach regularly hopefully there’s a shift happening and we will proactively try to bring this group through moving forward. I’ve moaned about the U19s and their pathway a lot, so won’t labour my point anymore.

I think you might be surprised at how much Henderson would be able to use experience and technique in those contact situations, if he was playing last night There is no way any first team player would be eased off the ball as readily as the likes of young Zaid. There's also a fair bit of technique that comes into that side of the game, it's not all about power.

[BILLYHIBS]

Reminded me of the Under 16 World Cup Final Scotland v Saudi Arabia at Tiny in 1989

Men against boys some of whom looked about 25 with thighs like tree trunks and beards even

Said that to my mate just after kick off last night

What chance have you got ?

They were the better team last night no doubt but our boys can feel proud of their efforts

[lyonhibs]

Guinness and chicken diet the minute they turn 16, like the good old days

[King conrad]

They were technically better and made Hibs chase the ball all game.
Hibs players legs were gone after 75 minutes. I still think Dortmund could have stepped up another couple of gears.

Yes they were bigger but you need to keep the ball better, only so much running they could have done.

[Carheenlea]

They were technically better and made Hibs chase the ball all game.
Hibs players legs were gone after 75 minutes. I still think Dortmund could have stepped up another couple of gears.

Yes they were bigger but you need to keep the ball better, only so much running they could have done.

The "legs gone" could probably be put down more to a shortage of games rather than physique. Not sure how many games the 19`s have played this year, but can't be many?

[Greenbeard]

It's a tough call, do you want them to learn the technical aspects of the game at a young age or become physically strong but with less technical ability. There's only a certain amount of time these youngsters can be worked before they burn out at that age.

Some will be ready quicker then others, and others will develop physically as their careers progress, lewy is a prime example of this.
I agree it's a balance and for some, subject to their contact time with Hibs. I am ignorant of how many of that squad last night are full time, or what sort of contact time the U18 squad have directly with Hibs. But I'd expect any aspiring non-FT U18 player to be working hard at home or locally on an agreed programme on things like strength and running fitness so that the effectiveness of their contact time at Hibs is maximised by focusing on the technical side (including good technique for weights).

[Irish_Steve]

When both teams were standing in the tunnel, I just thought how much bigger and stronger the Dortmund players looked.

Overall, the U19's did fantastic and there were an quite a number of plus points to take from the game

[NAE NOOKIE]

They were technically better and made Hibs chase the ball all game.
Hibs players legs were gone after 75 minutes. I still think Dortmund could have stepped up another couple of gears.

Yes they were bigger but you need to keep the ball better, only so much running they could have done.

I cant say I got the impression Dortmund had a couple more gears, they improved after half time and that I think was using all their gears. The big question in games that go like that is did they simply impose themselves or did the tactics we employed allow them to do it?

It's hard to say, but certainly if Hibs had pushed up the park 20 yards or so we might have been able to pressure their back 4 a lot more, rather than allowing them unfettered possession up to the half way line. Yes that might have left space behind, but I didn't get the impression their forwards were all that quick.

[Edina Street]

Just reflecting on last night's tremendous effort by the Wee team. The gap in strength and athleticism between the two teams was glaring and I lost count of the number of times Hibs players were easily brushed off in 50/50 situations. The same physical difference vs Nantes and to a lesser extent Molde. Much has been said about some of our players deserving their chance with the senior team but maybe not being quite ready yet. So it begs the question, are we doing enough strength work with our academy players to get them ready to step up? I know it takes a couple of years to start to see the real benefits (assuming you do it naturally of course) so maybe we are not starting them on a strength programme early enough?

I took my pal Tony to a few Hibs games. He is a Londoner and Arsenal supporter. I took him to the Hibernian v Rangers (League Cup Final, 1993). He was of the opinion that Hibernian played some good football but their problem was that they were too lightweight in physical terms. He was still of this opinion when I took him to the Hibs 1-1 Hearts game on 02/01/2005. So according to him this problem goes way back.

However being wee never hindered Diego Maradona, Gordon Strachan, Mickey Weir, nor dare I say, that wee guy that became known as the "Hammer of the Hibs". In fact, Andy Goram was exceptionally wee for a goalkeeper.

[TheSouthMoroccan]

Their guy that came on and scored the winner, looked about 30...reminded me of Reggie coming to the door in Bad Boys :greengrin

[JimBHibees]

Reminded me of the Under 16 World Cup Final Scotland v Saudi Arabia at Tiny in 1989

Men against boys some of whom looked about 25 with thighs like tree trunks and beards even

Said that to my mate just after kick off last night

What chance have you got ?

They were the better team last night no doubt but our boys can feel proud of their efforts

That game was at Hampden

[superfurryhibby]

Shielding the ball and anticipating contact after you take a touch is something that is coachable and it definitely isn't all down to size. My own experience as a robust, but limited centre half at a good amateur level and playing against some well known former pro's tells me that.

[Hibbyradge]

That game was at Hampden

:agree:

[Edina Street]

Reminded me of the Under 16 World Cup Final Scotland v Saudi Arabia at Tiny in 1989

Men against boys some of whom looked about 25 with thighs like tree trunks and beards even

Said that to my mate just after kick off last night

What chance have you got ?

They were the better team last night no doubt but our boys can feel proud of their efforts

If I remember right, it was the Semi-Final against Argentina that was at Tynecastle. And if I remember just as right, we won 1-0.

I agree about the Scots looking like kids compared to the Saudis that all had beards. (Or was it bumfluff?). And if I remember right it was Scott Booth and Paul Dickov that scored Scotland's two goals that day. I could be wrong about that, but both wee guys that went on to have great careers.

[BoomtownHibees]

If I remember right, it was the Semi-Final against Argentina that was at Tynecastle. And if I remember just as right, we won 1-0.

I agree about the Scot's looking like kids compared to the Saudi's that all had beards. (Or was it bumfluff?). And if I remember right it was Scott Booth and Paul Dickov that scored Scotland's two goals that day. I could be wrong about that, both wee guys that went on to have great careers.

Portugal I think

[BILLYHIBS]

If I remember right, it was the Semi-Final against Argentina that was at Tynecastle. And if I remember just as right, we won 1-0.

I agree about the Scots looking like kids compared to the Saudis that all had beards. (Or was it bumfluff?). And if I remember right it was Scott Booth and Paul Dickov that scored Scotland's two goals that day. I could be wrong about that, but both wee guys that went on to have great careers.
My bad it was Hampden

Downie and Dickov I think

Portugal in the semi at Tiny

[Stonewall]

The Average height of a Scottish male is 171 cm. (About the same as Dutch females)
The average height of a German male is 178 cm.

Hard to see what we can do about that unless there is some sort of breeding and nutrition programme.

[Stairway 2 7]

Dortmund are one of the better youth teams in a nation of 80 million. They pull players from all over Germany and indeed the world. Half of their players started at other German clubs others in the squad last night were signed from ajax, AIK in Sweeden, Shaktar Donetsk, Lyngby in Denmark and FH in Iceland

They were big strong and with a wonderful touch because they are the best young players from a dozen youth teams. It's the way football is and no amount of coaching will get hibs up to that. Because if a bright star comes through at hibs he'll be away to a bigger club in Europe or England

[King conrad]

The "legs gone" could probably be put down more to a shortage of games rather than physique. Not sure how many games the 19`s have played this year, but can't be many?

Having so few games certainly doesn't help

[Hibees1973]

The German side on the whole were physically stronger than Hibs.

The standouts for me in the Hibs team were Blaney & Laidlaw. No coincidence that these are two of our more physically developed players. Strength and pace are not always the defining factor in the game such as last night, but around 4 or 5 of our players were not technically good enough to compensate for the overall physical deficiency.

We really need to get Blaney & Laidlaw in the first team squad now and allow them to develop further in the 1st team. There are others such as Johnson and Aiken and the McIntyre's who we have to keep. Would be really disappointing if we lose any of these guys.

Pressure is on the recruitment team to get the best ones on longer contracts.

[KWJ]

The "legs gone" could probably be put down more to a shortage of games rather than physique. Not sure how many games the 19`s have played this year, but can't be many?

I think it's probably more down to having to do more chasing than they would domestically.

[superfurryhibby]

I think it's probably more down to having to do more chasing than they would domestically.

Agreed. I think that was surely obvious to anyone at last night's game. We ran out of steam, chasing shadows for much of the second half isn't easy on the legs.

[green day]

The Average height of a Scottish male is 171 cm. (About the same as Dutch females)
The average height of a German male is 178 cm.

Hard to see what we can do about that unless there is some sort of breeding and nutrition programme.

According to the data in the Scottish Health survey (I looked at 2009), both the mean and median heights of Scottish Males are much taller than that.

16-24 year olds report around 176 (probably because some have growing to do) and the 25-34 is ~ 178cm

Yes, the overall average is slightly shorter, but better nutrition over the decades mean our youngsters are midgets no more.

I wouldnt compare anyone with the Dutch though they are the tallest nation in the world, iirc.

[The dalmeny]

The Average height of a Scottish male is 171 cm. (About the same as Dutch females)
The average height of a German male is 178 cm.

Hard to see what we can do about that unless there is some sort of breeding and nutrition programme.

5ft 7. Smells like ####.

Although if it all males you’ll be including those born in the 30s - 50s, so not representative of those born mid 90s onwards

[ErinGoBraghHFC]

5ft 7. Smells like ####.

Although if it all males you’ll be including those born in the 30s - 50s, so not representative of those born mid 90s onwards

Just buzzin that I’m average height if that’s true tbh


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[hibbydog]

Interesting thread.

It’s not as simple as sending a kid into the gym over the summer. Neil Lennon bulked up a lot when he was that age and regretted it so I believe. Turned him into a solid physical shape but lost what little pace he had in the first place.

I guess Hibs will take an ‘Easy does it’ approach to bulking up for that reason

[chippy]

It's a tough call, do you want them to learn the technical aspects of the game at a young age or become physically strong but with less technical ability. There's only a certain amount of time these youngsters can be worked before they burn out at that age.

Some will be ready quicker than others, and others will develop physically as their careers progress, lewy is a prime example of this.

Let’s face it Scots are a smaller in height on average than others in the UK and even more so compared to other European nations. Add in that Dortmund are a massively rich club and tap in to all markets and probably get their pick of players. A good big yin vs a good wee yin and all that

[ACLeith]

Everyone of our players was a credit to the club. They gave everything they had and some were running on empty in the last 15-20 minutes.

Murray Johnston was distraught at the end knowing that he had made his first mistake that led to the penalty. He'll put that behind him as he is a fine prospect.

Inter, Juve and Eintracht all got put out tonight

[RIP]

Let’s face it Scots are a smaller in height on average than others in the UK

Take the wee Weegies out the statistics and Boom!!

https://www.edinburghlive.co.uk/news/edinburgh-news/edinburgh-men-are-tallest-slimmest-15757277

[Phil MaGlass]

Dortmund are one of the better youth teams in a nation of 80 million. They pull players from all over Germany and indeed the world. Half of their players started at other German clubs others in the squad last night were signed from ajax, AIK in Sweeden, Shaktar Donetsk, Lyngby in Denmark and FH in Iceland

They were big strong and with a wonderful touch because they are the best young players from a dozen youth teams. It's the way football is and no amount of coaching will get hibs up to that. Because if a bright star comes through at hibs he'll be away to a bigger club in Europe or England

All of this, our players are mostly home grown. Big clubs can haul them in by the bus load.

[BILLYHIBS]

I remember former Scotland Manager Gordon Strachan once giving this as an excuse after yet another failure to qualify for the final stages of an international competition