Managed Alcohol Programmes

[Pretty Boy]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-64464406

What are people's thoughts on the above?

I remember reading about this model in Canada years ago. I'm sure in that model those on the programme made their own wine for consumption. I recall one of those promoting it had said that some of those involved had reached a point where they were entering hospitals and consuming alcohol hand gels from public areas! I'm surprised but not displeased to see it being piloted in Scotland.

I suppose opponents would argue that such an environment is still feeding an addiction. I would counter and say that the community support, supported accommodation and access to mental health support is invaluable. Immediate cessation of alcohol is dangerous to the point of being life threatening and a pretty horrific experience. A managed programme that sees people provided with a calculated level until they may be ready to undergo full detox seems sensible.

I'm broadly supportive of such a move. We have a real problem with alcohol in Scotland but a puritanical approach to tackling it isn't going to work, neither is window dressing. We need to tackle the underlying issues that have created our problematic relationship with alcohol and look at new ways of dealing with those suffering with a horrendous addiction. I'm intrigued to see how it plays out and hopeful it's successful.

[Stairway 2 7]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-64464406

What are people's thoughts on the above?

I remember reading about this model in Canada years ago. I'm sure in that model those on the programme made their own wine for consumption. I recall one of those promoting it had said that some of those involved had reached a point where they were entering hospitals and consuming alcohol hand gels from public areas! I'm surprised but not displeased to see it being piloted in Scotland.

I suppose opponents would argue that such an environment is still feeding an addiction. I would counter and say that the community support, supported accommodation and access to mental health support is invaluable. Immediate cessation of alcohol is dangerous to the point of being life threatening and a pretty horrific experience. A managed programme that sees people provided with a calculated level until they may be ready to undergo full detox seems sensible.

I'm broadly supportive of such a move. We have a real problem with alcohol in Scotland but a puritanical approach to tackling it isn't going to work, neither is window dressing. We need to tackle the underlying issues that have created our problematic relationship with alcohol and look at new ways of dealing with those suffering with a horrendous addiction. I'm intrigued to see how it plays out and hopeful it's successful.

Haven't some alcoholics been prescribed alcohol for a while. Think it's sensible it's a medical problem and needs treated as such.

It's probably why minimum pricing has poor results dropping problem drinking. Alcoholics won't stop drinking because of pricing, support is what's needed as you say.

Counseling and support must be our priority in Scotland, particularly for our unbelievable drug deaths.

[Pretty Boy]

Haven't some alcoholics been prescribed alcohol for a while. Think it's sensible it's a medical problem and needs treated as such.

It's probably why minimum pricing has poor results dropping problem drinking. Alcoholics won't stop drinking because of pricing, support is what's needed as you say.

Counseling and support must be our priority in Scotland, particularly for our unbelievable drug deaths.

I think providing alcoholics with alcohol is pretty common and something of an essential.

The community setting, the way the alcohol is funded and the whole environment around this is interesting though and does seem quite different.

[Stairway 2 7]

I think providing alcoholics with alcohol is pretty common and something of an essential.

The community setting, the way the alcohol is funded and the whole environment around this is interesting though and does seem quite different.

Definitely. The shame needs removed from the disease or we will get nowhere. I bet for many this will be the first time they have felt part of a community. Hopefully it's successful and I'm glad the government are trying something different

[Edina Street]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-64464406

What are people's thoughts on the above?

I remember reading about this model in Canada years ago. I'm sure in that model those on the programme made their own wine for consumption. I recall one of those promoting it had said that some of those involved had reached a point where they were entering hospitals and consuming alcohol hand gels from public areas! I'm surprised but not displeased to see it being piloted in Scotland.

I suppose opponents would argue that such an environment is still feeding an addiction. I would counter and say that the community support, supported accommodation and access to mental health support is invaluable. Immediate cessation of alcohol is dangerous to the point of being life threatening and a pretty horrific experience. A managed programme that sees people provided with a calculated level until they may be ready to undergo full detox seems sensible.

I'm broadly supportive of such a move. We have a real problem with alcohol in Scotland but a puritanical approach to tackling it isn't going to work, neither is window dressing. We need to tackle the underlying issues that have created our problematic relationship with alcohol and look at new ways of dealing with those suffering with a horrendous addiction. I'm intrigued to see how it plays out and hopeful it's successful.

Having had experience of living with someone that was suffering a temporary psychosis and choosing alcohol poisoning as a means of ending it I know just how hellish alcoholism can be. The person became so bad that a doctor came round to the flat and announced that the person had one month to live unless they were sectioned. He gave me a note to take to the Royal Edinburgh so I took the person up there with the note. However the laws are different in Scotland than England and back in 2006 in Scotland a person could not be sectioned against their will, even if they only have one month to live, and when asked if they wanted help, they replied, "I just want to die" and the staff looked at me and said "see, they don't want help, so we cannot section the person". I had to be dragged out by security unfortunately. I made an effort to take the person to England where the person had previously been sectioned before I had made the error of getting the person released, however en route my car engine blew up on the A7 and I ended up being towed back to Edinburgh. Having been told that the person had one month to live, I considered spending £2500 of the persons money to put them in the priory for two weeks, however I was convinced that the person would just walk out and discharge themself. I then tried to lock the person inside our flat to prevent the person going out to buy or steal booze. However the person simply phoned the police and the police came round and questioned me about holding someone unlawfully against their will. They didn't charge me however, I just got a warning, but they did release the person, and the first thing the person done was go and get booze and continue with their bid to kill themself. The outcome was that the person ended up spending nearly one month in a coma in Royal infirmaries ward 118 and came out of it with cirrhosis of the liver. The person has not touched a drop of drink since their remarkable recovery, and no longer suffers from depression.

I did later take a lawsuit out on the Royal Edinburgh, and I had the support of our doctor whom said "if I did not think the person required sectioning, then I would not have gave you a note to take to the Royal Edinburgh advising them that this person required sectioning". I asked him if he would testify to this in court, and he said "yes". However after a discussion with the person, we decided to drop the lawsuit based upon how good the staff of ward 118 in the Royal Infirmary had been. They were "absolutely amazing" and did everything in their power to not only keep the person alive, but even helped in their rehabilitation. Amazing. Big thank you.

But, I am heavily invested in this subject, and understand how much of a nightmare alcoholism can become, not only for the alcoholic, but also for loved ones, whom might even find themselves being questioned about serious crimes such as unlawfully holding someone prisoner.

I personally find giving alcohol to alcoholics a bit bizarre, and is not one of the methods I would have chosen. However if professors think this works then I guess it is worth a trial. However there are definitely changes that need to be made when it comes to dealing with alcoholics, I agree.

I remember another occasion when I took the person to the Royal Edinburgh for some detox. They took the person in, but the first thing the person done was go to the Merlin and have a few drinks, before smuggling a bottle back in to the Royal Edinburgh. The Royal Edinburgh then discharged the person and sent them home. I went racing to the Royal Edinburgh to ask for an explanation, and they said "it is against the rules for a person to be under the influence of alcohol in here, so we had to send the person home". I responded by saying "but that is what alcoholics do".

For me, it was simply criminal to kick an alcoholic that wants to kill themself out of the hospital.

The whole thing was just total hell.

[PHeffernan]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-64464406

What are people's thoughts on the above?

I remember reading about this model in Canada years ago. I'm sure in that model those on the programme made their own wine for consumption. I recall one of those promoting it had said that some of those involved had reached a point where they were entering hospitals and consuming alcohol hand gels from public areas! I'm surprised but not displeased to see it being piloted in Scotland.

I suppose opponents would argue that such an environment is still feeding an addiction. I would counter and say that the community support, supported accommodation and access to mental health support is invaluable. Immediate cessation of alcohol is dangerous to the point of being life threatening and a pretty horrific experience. A managed programme that sees people provided with a calculated level until they may be ready to undergo full detox seems sensible.

I'm broadly supportive of such a move. We have a real problem with alcohol in Scotland but a puritanical approach to tackling it isn't going to work, neither is window dressing. We need to tackle the underlying issues that have created our problematic relationship with alcohol and look at new ways of dealing with those suffering with a horrendous addiction. I'm intrigued to see how it plays out and hopeful it's successful.

I read that yesterday.
Makes total sense to me and it is more progressive and holistic than previous approaches.
It will be interesting to see if the scheme is extended given it is the only unit in Scotland and they are looking after 10 men.
It will be expensive but folk with destructive chaotic lifestyles cost the state a fortune if left to their addiction so it will be cost effective and you would like to think it will be extended to other Scottish cities if they can prove a degree of success with their clients.