Lee dixon

[vuefrom1875]

3rd goal goes in..."bring on the french"....just love it when they shoot themselves in the foot...add shearer and ferdinand to that posse.

[Pretty Boy]

I don't get ITVs commentary choice.

Champion and McCoist are brilliant together and Seb Huthcison and Andros Townsend had a really easy chemistry last night (and it was great to hear a current players view as well). Yet their number 1 duo is the insufferable Matterface and Dixon.

Moribund, monotone and completely lacking any insight beyond tired cliches.

[MWHIBBIES]

Pretty reasonable. Both them and the French have strolled through so far. Should be a good game. England have a chance.

[1875Sean]

I don't get ITVs commentary choice.

Champion and McCoist are brilliant together and Seb Huthcison and Andros Townsend had a really easy chemistry last night (and it was great to hear a current players view as well). Yet their number 1 duo is the insufferable Matterface and Dixon.

Moribund, monotone and completely lacking any insight beyond tired cliches.

Agree with Champion and McCoist but they are always going to stick with Dixon etc as they are English

[Broken Gnome]

I don't get ITVs commentary choice.

Champion and McCoist are brilliant together and Seb Huthcison and Andros Townsend had a really easy chemistry last night (and it was great to hear a current players view as well). Yet their number 1 duo is the insufferable Matterface and Dixon.

Moribund, monotone and completely lacking any insight beyond tired cliches.

Think I hate them for different reasons than you - Matterface's attempts to be wacky and fit in nonsense scene-setting anecdotes are insufferable. Dixon used to come across quite well in his MOTD2 days, but he's got a really off-putting smug air about him now.

Jenas and Keown can get stuffed as well mind you, so I'm fairly open to accusations of anti-English bias.

[JeMeSouviens]

I don't get ITVs commentary choice.

Champion and McCoist are brilliant together and Seb Huthcison and Andros Townsend had a really easy chemistry last night (and it was great to hear a current players view as well). Yet their number 1 duo is the insufferable Matterface and Dixon.

Moribund, monotone and completely lacking any insight beyond tired cliches.

Jermaine Jenas is even worse. He’s making me pine for greeting faced Lawro.

[Tyler Durden]

I would add Dion Dublin to the list. He has a habit of saying “as we call it in the game” after describing the most obvious well know cliches that every man and his dog would know.

“Done him with the eyes” being his latest example, as if he was letting us in on a massive secret

[loanheadhibby]

Pretty reasonable. Both them and the French have strolled through so far. Should be a good game. England have a chance.

I agree 50/50 against France.

[Stonewall]

I agree 50/50 against France.

They’ll need to start better than they did tonight though.

[hibsbollah]

Jermaine Jenas is even worse. He’s making me pine for greeting faced Lawro.

You’ve gone too far there

[JohnM1875]

I agree 50/50 against France.

France definite favourites but it should be a classic of a game.

[B.H.F.C]

I agree 50/50 against France.

England capable but I’d have France as favourites.

Mbappe will have the game done and dusted after 20 minutes if England start like they did tonight.

[Sir David Gray]

England capable but I’d have France as favourites.

Mbappe will have the game done and dusted after 20 minutes if England start like they did tonight.

:agree: Senegal started well tonight and if they had Mbappe and Giroud up front they would have gone ahead.

[Brooster]

I agree 50/50 against France.

There's not a bookie in Britain who will lay this this as 50/50, not one.

[Bobby's Cinema]

3rd goal goes in..."bring on the french"....just love it when they shoot themselves in the foot...add shearer and ferdinand to that posse.
he actually went even earlier than that at 2-0 54mins 'is it too early to talk about the french' :bitchy:

[Iain G]

Bet the voted for Brexit 😁

[Bostonhibby]

There's an awful lot of Lee Dixon's about down here, feels like they've been wanting to play France all along and it's just a formality, it's coming home etc......

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[Crunchie]

I agree 50/50 against France.
Bookies don't think so, you can get 21-10 England 11-8 France

[Gloucester Hibs]

Dixon seems to have channeled his inner Mark Lawrenson lately, and that’s not a good thing.

[Shrekko]

It's absolutely nuts that folk continue to get upset about English commentators being optimistic about their own team in a World Cup.

Whether we like it or not they have a good team and are excited... it's the World Cup after all. Have they really to say nothing because they might offend people from the other home nations? It's hardly fair to expect that.

There is an argument we should have our own commentators but really who cares? There will be this type of "bring it on" stuff from all the competing countries.

For those of us who don't want them to win it, it just make's it funnier when they don't. Unfortunately, they are good enough to win this one though.

[sleeping giant]

It's absolutely nuts that folk continue to get upset about English commentators being optimistic about their own team in a World Cup.

Whether we like it or not they have a good team and are excited... it's the World Cup after all. Have they really to say nothing because they might offend people from the other home nations? It's hardly fair to expect that.

There is an argument we should have our own commentators but really who cares? There will be this type of "bring it on" stuff from all the competing countries.

For those of us who don't want them to win it, it just make's it funnier when they don't. Unfortunately, they are good enough to win this one though.

Yip.
No issue with any excitement from any commentators.
It's what football is all about.

[norhfc]

I dont mind the English commentators getting over excited, its all part of the game. What I do mind is the first 8 minutes of the BBC breakfast news at 6 am this morning dedicated to the fantastic victory last night.

[worcesterhibby]

Of all the names mentioned above, the only one that gets on my nerves is Dion Dublin, nice guy I'm sure, but terrible pundit. I wish we had more ex-pros talking up ther Scottish game. Dixon called it right at 2-0, they cruised through.

[Pretty Boy]

Bookies don't think so, you can get 21-10 England 11-8 France

England at better than 2/1 is a cracking price. Might be tempted to have a bit of that.

[Since452]

Could you imagine we had our own WC coverage with Steven Thompson, Chris Iwelumo and Leanne Crichton out there in Qatar giving their words of wisdom? We should thank our lucky stars we have to listen to a bit of England bias.

[hibsbollah]

Could you imagine we had our own WC coverage with Steven Thompson, Chris Iwelumo and Leanne Crichton out there in Qatar giving their words of wisdom? We should thank our lucky stars we have to listen to a bit of England bias.

That is actually a fair point.
Although it would be nice to have higher aspirations than the lot of them :greengrin

[Winston Ingram]

I dont mind the English commentators getting over excited, its all part of the game. What I do mind is the first 8 minutes of the BBC breakfast news at 6 am this morning dedicated to the fantastic victory last night.

This. I remember back to the World Cups that Scotland qualified for when I was growing up and Jock Brown, Archie McPherson and their co-commentators were exactly the same.

Harrison when he was commentating on the Wales USA was obscenely biased and talking all sorts of nonsense.

[WestCoastHibby]

Could you imagine we had our own WC coverage with Steven Thompson, Chris Iwelumo and Leanne Crichton out there in Qatar giving their words of wisdom? We should thank our lucky stars we have to listen to a bit of England bias.
Absolutely spot on.

[darwenhibby]

Could you imagine we had our own WC coverage with Steven Thompson, Chris Iwelumo and Leanne Crichton out there in Qatar giving their words of wisdom? We should thank our lucky stars we have to listen to a bit of England bias.
Gladly listen to them if it meant Scotland were in the last 8 of the World Cup!

[Iain G]

Could you imagine we had our own WC coverage with Steven Thompson, Chris Iwelumo and Leanne Crichton out there in Qatar giving their words of wisdom? We should thank our lucky stars we have to listen to a bit of England bias.

Scottish football coverage from that lot are more likely to put ourselves down than any kind of positive coverage.

[Col2]

Could you imagine we had our own WC coverage with Steven Thompson, Chris Iwelumo and Leanne Crichton out there in Qatar giving their words of wisdom? We should thank our lucky stars we have to listen to a bit of England bias.

Leanne Crichton, Willie Miller and Craig Levein usually do the Scotland games and it’s brutal.

[JimBHibees]

Leanne Crichton, Willie Miller and Craig Levein usually do the Scotland games and it’s brutal.

Yep absolute torture

[blackpoolhibs]

Eni Aluko is brilliant too, she said about Richarlison, he's scored 19 goals in 40 games, do the maths, it's pretty much a goal a game. :greengrin

[bigwheel]

Leanne Crichton, Willie Miller and Craig Levein usually do the Scotland games and it’s brutal.

Funnily enough, I like Levein as a pundit …

[BILLYHIBS]

Best co-commentator Ally McCoist

Alan Shearer was as dull as dish water should stick to the studio

Super confident RF is starting to get on my thrupnies :greengrin

[Since452]

Best co-commentator Ally McCoist

Alan Shearer was as dull as dish water should stick to the studio

Super confident RF is starting to get on my thrupnies :greengrin

:agree: Must admit McCoist is a very good co-commentator. Agree with pretty much everything he says.

[hibsbollah]

Eni Aluko is brilliant too, she said about Richarlison, he's scored 19 goals in 40 games, do the maths, it's pretty much a goal a game. :greengrin

I think she's good. Fairly obvious that she knew the maths and meant 'Every other game', just stumbled her words. Of course she's always going to be a target for a certain type of twitter user, so shes being destroyed for it.

McCoist is so clearly the best co commentator out there.

[Gloucester Hibs]

I think she's good. Fairly obvious that she knew the maths and meant 'Every other game', just stumbled her words. Of course she's always going to be a target for a certain type of twitter user, so shes being destroyed for it.

McCoist is so clearly the best co commentator out there.

On TalkSPORT she also mentioned “Jimmy Greaves hat-trick in the 66 World Cup final” 😱

[JimBHibees]

Eni Aluko is brilliant too, she said about Richarlison, he's scored 19 goals in 40 games, do the maths, it's pretty much a goal a game. :greengrin

:faf::faf:

[Springbank]

Always a curiosity with our neighbours, and their small-island Nationalism (as I would see it - I'm a European Hibee, Scots Italian, never a butchers apron wearer)

I have always noticed the celtic nations tend to refer to their upcoming opponents by their country (not their nationality) ie Ireland would talk about "we're through and we'll face Germany next"

It's only England that reduces the conversation to "the French" or "the Germans"

A curiosity

[Mcbizz1998]

I think she's good. Fairly obvious that she knew the maths and meant 'Every other game', just stumbled her words. Of course she's always going to be a target for a certain type of twitter user, so shes being destroyed for it.

McCoist is so clearly the best co commentator out there.

Of course she just misspoke but let’s be honest, if any pundit said that they would be getting ripped.

It’s not always a race/sex thing.

[MWHIBBIES]

I think she's good. Fairly obvious that she knew the maths and meant 'Every other game', just stumbled her words. Of course she's always going to be a target for a certain type of twitter user, so shes being destroyed for it.

McCoist is so clearly the best co commentator out there.

Yeah. Absolute gammons out in force slaughtering her for a small mistake. Real shame. Twitter is a cesspit.

[007]

On TalkSPORT she also mentioned “Jimmy Greaves hat-trick in the 66 World Cup final” 😱

She obviously mis-spoke there too and meant Anthony Stokes' brace in the '16 Scottish Cup quarter-final replay. 😃

[Since452]

Of course she just misspoke but let’s be honest, if any pundit said that they would be getting ripped.

It’s not always a race/sex thing.

Yup. Michael Owen is a prime example. Had some howlers and was slaughtered for them.

[CL0762]

Dixon is the most boring pundit out there.

Don’t even care about the bias, he adds absolutely zero to the game in terms of insightful analysis or even any type of patter.

McCoist is so far ahead of clowns like him.

[HoboHarry]

Dixon is the most boring pundit out there.

Don’t even care about the bias, he adds absolutely zero to the game in terms of insightful analysis or even any type of patter.

McCoist is so far ahead of clowns like him.
Dixon is still light years ahead of dafties like Andy Walker, Boyd et al.

[Bostonhibby]

Dixon is still light years ahead of dafties like Andy Walker, Boyd et al.So was my (recently deceased) goldfish.

Sent from my SM-A750FN using Tapatalk

[Shrekko]

I think she's good. Fairly obvious that she knew the maths and meant 'Every other game', just stumbled her words. Of course she's always going to be a target for a certain type of twitter user, so shes being destroyed for it.

McCoist is so clearly the best co commentator out there.

I think it is so bad that people can’t point out how awful Aluko is without being accused of all kinds of terrible stuff and lumped into one basket.

The vast majority of people who are stating the obvious will also do the same with any other pundit … and let’s face it most of them get dogs abuse on social media.

She’s responded on Twitter by telling everyone how much more intelligent and tactically aware she is than them. That’s who she is.

[OstKurve Hibs]

Add john hartson the pish pundits list, he's brutal

[hibsbollah]

In my short list of pundits I like, Hal Robson Kanu has been good in the ITV booth with Joe Cole, who’s upped his game recently.

[hibsbollah]

I think it is so bad that people can’t point out how awful Aluko is without being accused of all kinds of terrible stuff and lumped into one basket.

The vast majority of people who are stating the obvious will also do the same with any other pundit … and let’s face it most of them get dogs abuse on social media.

She’s responded on Twitter by telling everyone how much more intelligent and tactically aware she is than them. That’s who she is.

Wrong. She has told SOME people she is more intelligent than them and knows her tactics. Not ‘everyone’. She probably is.
Black people and women are disproportionately subject to online abuse. That’s a demonstrable fact. So she will inevitably get it worse than a comparable mistake from McCoist or Souness.

And I said ‘a certain type’ of Twitter user will target her. So give it a rest with the suggestions that everyone’s been accused of anything. Unless you think misogynistic and racist behaviour doesn’t exist, your post isn’t really finding a target.

[MWHIBBIES]

Wrong. She has told SOME people she is more intelligent than them and knows her tactics. Not ‘everyone’. She probably is.
Black people and women are disproportionately subject to online abuse. That’s a demonstrable fact. So she will inevitably get it worse than a comparable mistake from McCoist or Souness.

And I said ‘a certain type’ of Twitter user will target her. So give it a rest with the suggestions that everyone’s been accused of anything. Unless you think misogynistic and racist behaviour doesn’t exist, your post isn’t really finding a target.

Spot on.

[Shrekko]

Wrong. She has told SOME people she is more intelligent than them and knows her tactics. Not ‘everyone’. She probably is.
Black people and women are disproportionately subject to online abuse. That’s a demonstrable fact. So she will inevitably get it worse than a comparable mistake from McCoist or Souness.

And I said ‘a certain type’ of Twitter user will target her. So give it a rest with the suggestions that everyone’s been accused of anything. Unless you think misogynistic and racist behaviour doesn’t exist, your post isn’t really finding a target.

No, I’m saying the vast majority of criticism she gets isn’t because of anything else but how awful she is.

So many defending her are using the blanket “misogyny” argument and it’s just not the case.

Her degree, caps, or Doctorate has nothing to do with her level of punditry. Yet she thinks that’s the way to answer.

Jermaine Jenas has been given pelters for one of his recent statements and rightly so - they all get it! For various reasons the quality of punditry has been utterly pathetic on all the major channels. Why can’t they just get people who are good at it?

[hibsbollah]

No, I’m saying the vast majority of criticism she gets isn’t because of anything else but how awful she is.

So many defending her are using the blanket “misogyny” argument and it’s just not the case.

Her degree, caps, or Doctorate has nothing to do with her level of punditry. Yet she thinks that’s the way to answer.

Jermaine Jenas has been given pelters for one of his recent statements and rightly so - they all get it! For various reasons the quality of punditry has been utterly pathetic on all the major channels. Why can’t they just get people who are good at it?

So she hasn’t told ‘everyone’ she’s more intelligent than them has she? Admit when you’re talking rubbish instead of just moving the goalposts. How good she is or isn’t isn’t a demonstrable fact, it’s a matter of opinion. I and others think she’s a good pundit regardless of race or gender, simply has nothing to do with it. And misogyny isn’t a ‘blanket argument’, it’s an actual demonstrable fact. If you don’t acknowledge that and still insist on arguing the toss you’re part of the problem.

[Pretty Boy]

I like that both the BBC and ITV have studio pundits from the countries involvedin the games being covered quite often. I'm sure other countries do it too but I don't watch a lot of football coverage from Spain or Germany for example.

Pablo Zabaleta was excellent during the Argentina game the other night. I know people will say 'then they always end up talking about England' but that's to be expected really. I'm sure coverage in other countries focuses on the nation of the host broadcaster more than other teams.

[TAHibby]

So she hasn’t told ‘everyone’ she’s more intelligent than them has she? Admit when you’re talking rubbish instead of just moving the goalposts. How good she is or isn’t isn’t a demonstrable fact, it’s a matter of opinion. I and others think she’s a good pundit regardless of race or gender, simply has nothing to do with it. And misogyny isn’t a ‘blanket argument’, it’s an actual demonstrable fact. If you don’t acknowledge that and still insist on arguing the toss you’re part of the problem.

She's a tory which unfortunately cancels out any accolades, qualifications or pundit capabilities

[green day]

I like that both the BBC and ITV have studio pundits from the countries involvedin the games being covered quite often. I'm sure other countries do it too but I don't watch a lot of football coverage from Spain or Germany for example.

Pablo Zabaleta was excellent during the Argentina game the other night. I know people will say 'then they always end up talking about England' but that's to be expected really. I'm sure coverage in other countries focuses on the nation of the host broadcaster more than other teams.

I thought Zabaleta spoke really well in the BBC Messi documentary on at the moment. Seems a pretty switched on but relaxed guy.

[bingo70]

I’d love there to be more goalkeepers as pundits so we can get some genuine insight into that position.

[BS44]

I think it is so bad that people can’t point out how awful Aluko is without being accused of all kinds of terrible stuff and lumped into one basket.

The vast majority of people who are stating the obvious will also do the same with any other pundit … and let’s face it most of them get dogs abuse on social media.

She’s responded on Twitter by telling everyone how much more intelligent and tactically aware she is than them. That’s who she is.

Why does that wind you up?

[green day]

In my short list of pundits I like, Hal Robson Kanu has been good in the ITV booth with Joe Cole, who’s upped his game recently.

I would add Pat Nevin, Matthew Upson, Pablo Zabaleta, and Alex Scott.

[WeeRussell]

Why does that wind you up?

He doesn’t seem wound up to me? Just making a point.

[hibsbollah]

I would add Pat Nevin, Matthew Upson, Pablo Zabaleta, and Alex Scott.

:agree: If there’s a five live game Nevin is doing I’ll always listen to it even if I’m not particularly interested in the result. He’s always interesting.

[Stairway 2 7]

She's a tory which unfortunately cancels out any accolades, qualifications or pundit capabilities

Yep. Said some crap about being angry the furlough was being
extended and people enjoying the benefits too much. Although Souness has been a tory too. Neville, Jenas, shearer, Nevin and Lineker I know of are openly Labour if we're separating them all ha. I'd doubt Hartson has a choice ha

[Bostonhibby]

Wrong. She has told SOME people she is more intelligent than them and knows her tactics. Not ‘everyone’. She probably is.
Black people and women are disproportionately subject to online abuse. That’s a demonstrable fact. So she will inevitably get it worse than a comparable mistake from McCoist or Souness.

And I said ‘a certain type’ of Twitter user will target her. So give it a rest with the suggestions that everyone’s been accused of anything. Unless you think misogynistic and racist behaviour doesn’t exist, your post isn’t really finding a target.[emoji106]

Sent from my SM-A750FN using Tapatalk

[matty_f]

I’d love there to be more goalkeepers as pundits so we can get some genuine insight into that position.

Just not Pat Bonner. Keepers who are relevant to the game today. :agree:

[bingo70]

Just not Pat Bonner. Keepers who are relevant to the game today. :agree:

Granted I don’t listen to the radio much but when I have I’ve never heard him give any technical insight into the position.

[green day]

Granted I don’t listen to the radio much but when I have I’ve never heard him give any technical insight into the position.

And, hilariously he has a UEFA technical delegate role..............

[Shrekko]

So she hasn’t told ‘everyone’ she’s more intelligent than them has she? Admit when you’re talking rubbish instead of just moving the goalposts. How good she is or isn’t isn’t a demonstrable fact, it’s a matter of opinion. I and others think she’s a good pundit regardless of race or gender, simply has nothing to do with it. And misogyny isn’t a ‘blanket argument’, it’s an actual demonstrable fact. If you don’t acknowledge that and still insist on arguing the toss you’re part of the problem.

Ah the old "you're part of the problem" to someone you don't even know nonsense. People defending her by saying its simply misogyny (and nothing else) are talking rubbish. Every pundit gets ripped when they come out with nonsense- and boy does she make some howlers. You know fine well what I mean by "blanket argument"- don't try to make out I'm trying to say misogyny doesn't exist or can't be a factor in some cases. I'd happily go after anyone making "back to the kitchen" type comments.

I've never once said that sexism, misogyny or even racism don't play a part in some of the vitriol - I'm saying people should be allowed to say she's awful without it automatically being assumed it's because they are prejudiced due to other factors. Most of it is because she's (in many people's opinions) a sub-standard pundit and that's it.

I think going on twitter and saying that's she's super clever and that people could learn about football if they just listen to her is telling 'everyone' regardless of whether she's aiming it mainly at her detractors- and it's also totally irrelevant. A bit like when some players use the "show me your medals" argument when trying to say their opinion carries more weight than others.

[Shrekko]

Why does that wind you up?

Not sure what you think I'm wound up about? Not any more wound up about this than any other thing i've posted an opinion on hibs.net about recently.

If you're trying to create a 'triggered gammon' narrative, then you've badly misjudged and should be a bit more careful with your presumptions.

[Since452]

I would add Pat Nevin, Matthew Upson, Pablo Zabaleta, and Alex Scott.

Can't stomach Alex Scott. Not because she's female before anyone says that. The whole "because i love my job" thing after a long pause when asked why she was going to Qatar after criticising the regime annoyed me.

[Pretty Boy]

I’d love there to be more goalkeepers as pundits so we can get some genuine insight into that position.

Definitely.

I always find outfield players either fall into cliches: 'keeper should never be beaten at his near post' or 'if it's in the 6 yard box it's the keepers' or focus on the mistakes of a striker rather than what the keeper has done well

I said it a few nights ago during the Japan v Spain game. Japan keeper made a very good stop and all the commentary (might have been McCoist) wanted to talk about was how bad the miss was. No awareness of how difficult the keeper had made it for the striker. If you watch the Swiss keeper last night for one of the goal from a similar position he comes out, sort of flops/slides over and makes it so easy for the striker just to lift it over him. Not a howler but something that a modern day keeper would pick up on and analyse properly.

[Broken Gnome]

Definitely.

I always find outfield players either fall into cliches: 'keeper should never be beaten at his near post' or 'if it's in the 6 yard box it's the keepers' or focus on the mistakes of a striker rather than what the keeper has done well

I said it a few nights ago during the Japan v Spain game. Japan keeper made a very good stop and all the commentary (might have been McCoist) wanted to talk about was how bad the miss was. No awareness of how difficult the keeper had made it for the striker. If you watch the Swiss keeper last night for one of the goal from a similar position he comes out, sort of flops/slides over and makes it so easy for the striker just to lift it over him. Not a howler but something that a modern day keeper would pick up on and analyse properly.

I'd be quite interested in that, as I always find it hugely subjective as to how good a supposed world class save actually is.

The potentially simple looking ones are often overlooked even though they're only possible by a keeper's decision making or positioning - you don't get a clear idea of how much various goalkeeper's reaction times might differ either, whereby one keeper can make a save look simple but that split second difference in movement means another keeper has no chance.

Portugal's first last night didn't give the keeper a hope in hell of reacting in time - I've no idea whether he was completely blameless, or if the old near post cliche applies there.

[bingo70]

Definitely.

I always find outfield players either fall into cliches: 'keeper should never be beaten at his near post' or 'if it's in the 6 yard box it's the keepers' or focus on the mistakes of a striker rather than what the keeper has done well

I said it a few nights ago during the Japan v Spain game. Japan keeper made a very good stop and all the commentary (might have been McCoist) wanted to talk about was how bad the miss was. No awareness of how difficult the keeper had made it for the striker. If you watch the Swiss keeper last night for one of the goal from a similar position he comes out, sort of flops/slides over and makes it so easy for the striker just to lift it over him. Not a howler but something that a modern day keeper would pick up on and analyse properly.

David Preece is quite good on Twitter for that kind of analysis. He’s spoken before about keeper being criticised for going with the wrong hand but I think he explained it was something to do with his footwork that meant his body shape meant he had to go that way.

My boy plays in goals and I think the whole footballing community needs educated on the position, especially coaches. Half the time when keepers do something well, it means they don’t have to make the big elaborate save but that’s completely taken for granted where as people gush over keepers making great saves after getting their positioning wrong in the first place.

It’s the most important position on the pitch yet it’s pretty much ignored by the media unless there’s a howler.

[SaulGoodman]

I don’t get it really, they’re English and supporting their nation in a World Cup, it would be hard not to be biased.

I remember Ally McCoist going mental at the Scotland Israel game and I thought it was brilliant.

[hibsbollah]

Ah the old "you're part of the problem" to someone you don't even know nonsense. People defending her by saying its simply misogyny (and nothing else) are talking rubbish. Every pundit gets ripped when they come out with nonsense- and boy does she make some howlers. You know fine well what I mean by "blanket argument"- don't try to make out I'm trying to say misogyny doesn't exist or can't be a factor in some cases. I'd happily go after anyone making "back to the kitchen" type comments.

I've never once said that sexism, misogyny or even racism don't play a part in some of the vitriol - I'm saying people should be allowed to say she's awful without it automatically being assumed it's because they are prejudiced due to other factors. Most of it is because she's (in many people's opinions) a sub-standard pundit and that's it.

I think going on twitter and saying that's she's super clever and that people could learn about football if they just listen to her is telling 'everyone' regardless of whether she's aiming it mainly at her detractors- and it's also totally irrelevant. A bit like when some players use the "show me your medals" argument when trying to say their opinion carries more weight than others.

It sounds like you’re arguing about something you’ve seen on Twitter which bears no relevance to what I actually said, because you don’t like Aluko as a pundit. I couldn’t really care either way if you like her or not. It’s a simple question really, does McCoist gets called a monkey or get rape threats when he’s getting a hard time on Twitter ? If he doesn’t and Aluko does, that’s what’s being called out here as being motivated by something else.

[hibsbollah]

David Preece is quite good on Twitter for that kind of analysis. He’s spoken before about keeper being criticised for going with the wrong hand but I think he explained it was something to do with his footwork that meant his body shape meant he had to go that way.

My boy plays in goals and I think the whole footballing community needs educated on the position, especially coaches. Half the time when keepers do something well, it means they don’t have to make the big elaborate save but that’s completely taken for granted where as people gush over keepers making great saves after getting their positioning wrong in the first place.

It’s the most important position on the pitch yet it’s pretty much ignored by the media unless there’s a howler.

I’ve been listening to Richard Lees podcast for a long time, I like his insight. Preece is definitely funnier, Lee is clearly an earnest obsessive with great attention to detail but not as personable as Preece.

Both passionate about what is being discussed; getting proper keeper analysis instead of the utter nonsense you get from the likes of Neville and Keane who may as well be talking about ice hockey for all they know about being a goalie.

[Is It On....]

David Preece is quite good on Twitter for that kind of analysis. He’s spoken before about keeper being criticised for going with the wrong hand but I think he explained it was something to do with his footwork that meant his body shape meant he had to go that way.

My boy plays in goals and I think the whole footballing community needs educated on the position, especially coaches. Half the time when keepers do something well, it means they don’t have to make the big elaborate save but that’s completely taken for granted where as people gush over keepers making great saves after getting their positioning wrong in the first place.

It’s the most important position on the pitch yet it’s pretty much ignored by the media unless there’s a howler.

Peter Schmeichel said something similar in that the better your positioning, the fewer spectacular saves a goalkeeper is required to make.

[Baader]

Peter Schmeichel said something similar in that the better your positioning, the fewer spectacular saves a goalkeeper is required to make.

Peter Shilton said similar before. He organised his defence and took up positions in his goal that he knew would prevent a striker from having a shot as the angle wouldn't be on. So he might not have many saves to make but it was due to good goalkeeping, which he wouldn't get any credit for.

[Pretty Boy]

David Preece is quite good on Twitter for that kind of analysis. He’s spoken before about keeper being criticised for going with the wrong hand but I think he explained it was something to do with his footwork that meant his body shape meant he had to go that way.

My boy plays in goals and I think the whole footballing community needs educated on the position, especially coaches. Half the time when keepers do something well, it means they don’t have to make the big elaborate save but that’s completely taken for granted where as people gush over keepers making great saves after getting their positioning wrong in the first place.

It’s the most important position on the pitch yet it’s pretty much ignored by the media unless there’s a howler.

A few years back when I was playing I had a goalkeeping coach who had been an absolute stalwart in the lower leagues and really knew his stuff. Myself and another keeper (who had spent time at Chelsea as a youth) played a half each and conceded 3 goals between us that were almost carbon copies of each other. Wide player got to the goal line, stood it up to the back post and striker had a header with the entirety of the goal to aim at. He went absolutely nuts at us after the game and asked why we hadn't sorted our positioning after the 1st time it happened. Our stock answer was 'we didn't want to get beaten at the near post'. His answer was 'but it's ok to concede 3 at the back post?'

Not one of the non goalkeeping specific coaches laid any blame on either of us but this guy had a real thing about what he saw as the nonsense of the 'keeper should never be beaten at his near post' mantra. His argument was twofold. Firstly there is no need to be standing right on the near post, a good keeper should be able to give himself a yard or 2 and still cover that near post space. A wonder strike like we saw the other night from Portugal or from Zitelli v Motherwell is a rarity, 90% of the time a striker won't get anything like that clean a connection on it and you should be able to cover the space and make a save. Secondly he argued you were probably losing multiple goals a season from totally taking yourself out the game at the near post and not being able to cover the space to get a dive away. His point was that goalkeepers were continuously doing the wrong thing through a fear of criticism from non goalkeepers, pundits and fans. He said if you got beat once at the near post through taking a step back there is every chance you would make up for it by saving 4, 5 or 6 efforts you might not otherwise have. This video below is a prime example (not that I was complaining at the time):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QLV-DCTD2OA

Waterreus completely takes himself out the game by standing half a yard in front of his near post. He takes 2 steps back and Sproule can't stand the ball up like he does and O'Connor doesn't have a nigh on unmissable header.

It's one of the things that worries me when I watch youth football. The lack of goalkeeping specific coaching means bad habits are ingrained from a young age. Young goalies standing leaning with one hand on the near post and CBs taking goal kicks are my 2 pet peeves. The former is because managers just won't tolerate a keeper not covering that near post area and the latter is just mental. Distribution is everything in the modern game and not having the keeper taking goal kicks and being involved in playing out from the back leaves them way behind in their development.

I think pundits have a responsibility too. Subconsciously or otherwise a lot of fans parrot what they hear ex pros and other pundits say; if they are talking utter bollocks about goalkeeping it becomes gospel and certain mantras get repeated over and over again and prevent any proper mainstream analysis of the position.

[bingo70]

A few years back when I was playing I had a goalkeeping coach who had been an absolute stalwart in the lower leagues and really knew his stuff. Myself and another keeper (who had spent time at Chelsea as a youth) played a half each and conceded 3 goals between us that were almost carbon copies of each other. Wide player got to the goal line, stood it up to the back post and striker had a header with the entirety of the goal to aim at. He went absolutely nuts at us after the game and asked why we hadn't sorted our positioning after the 1st time it happened. Our stock answer was 'we didn't want to get beaten at the near post'. His answer was 'but it's ok to concede 3 at the back post?'

Not one of the non goalkeeping specific coaches laid any blame on either of us but this guy had a real thing about what he saw as the nonsense of the 'keeper should never be beaten at his near post' mantra. His argument was twofold. Firstly there is no need to be standing right on the near post, a good keeper should be able to give himself a yard or 2 and still cover that near post space. A wonder strike like we saw the other night from Portugal or from Zitelli v Motherwell is a rarity, 90% of the time a striker won't get anything like that clean a connection on it and you should be able to cover the space and make a save. Secondly he argued you were probably losing multiple goals a season from totally taking yourself out the game at the near post and not being able to cover the space to get a dive away. His point was that goalkeepers were continuously doing the wrong thing through a fear of criticism from non goalkeepers, pundits and fans. He said if you got beat once at the near post through taking a step back there is every chance you would make up for it by saving 4, 5 or 6 efforts you might not otherwise have. This video below is a prime example (not that I was complaining at the time):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QLV-DCTD2OA

Waterreus completely takes himself out the game by standing half a yard in front of his near post. He takes 2 steps back and Sproule can't stand the ball up like he does and O'Connor doesn't have a nigh on unmissable header.

It's one of the things that worries me when I watch youth football. The lack of goalkeeping specific coaching means bad habits are ingrained from a young age. Young goalies standing leaning with one hand on the near post and CBs taking goal kicks are my 2 pet peeves. The former is because managers just won't tolerate a keeper not covering that near post area and the latter is just mental. Distribution is everything in the modern game and not having the keeper taking goal kicks and being involved in playing out from the back leaves them way behind in their development.

I think pundits have a responsibility too. Subconsciously or otherwise a lot of fans parrot what they hear ex pros and other pundits say; if they are talking utter bollocks about goalkeeping it becomes gospel and certain mantras get repeated over and over again and prevent any proper mainstream analysis of the position.

Brilliant, agree with everything, apologies for taking the thread off on a tangent but I could go on about this sort of thing all day. Especially the lack of knowledge from youth coaches and interest they pay in the position, until a mistake is made, then the keeper they’ve given absolutely no help to, gets chucked under the bus or they try to find another one.

As you say though, it does come back to the lack of technical insight on the tele from pundits and I wish someone would recognise this. You don’t need 3 bland outfielders all agreeing about the same thing at half time, in fact, there’s more likely to be a ref pundit giving analysis on the ref now than there is of the goalies.

[The Baldmans Comb]

I dont mind the English commentators getting over excited, its all part of the game. What I do mind is the first 8 minutes of the BBC breakfast news at 6 am this morning dedicated to the fantastic victory last night.

So English TV and English commentators get fully behind their team 100% and crank up the volume as their team go further and further in the competition.

This is all actually very normal and happens in every country of the world.

Its not English people or English TV that is out of step, its those who somehow think that English people should downplay their excitement for some obscure reasons of affecting others sensitivities.

England has a good football team and is a fine country populated by very very clever people who know exactly what buttons to press when dealing with the Scots.

[heretoday]

All the pundits are awful, sitting in the studio dressed younger than their years and all wearing horrible white-soled Matchday trainers. Absolute shower.

[blackpoolhibs]

I think if we had our own BBC or STV commentators and studio hosts, we wouldn't bother one jot what they were saying, but we have to endure English coverage and it does grate a bit.

[Callum_62]

So English TV and English commentators get fully behind their team 100% and crank up the volume as their team go further and further in the competition.

This is all actually very normal and happens in every country of the world.

Its not English people or English TV that is out of step, its those who somehow think that English people should downplay their excitement for some obscure reasons of affecting others sensitivities.

England has a good football team and is a fine country populated by very very clever people who know exactly what buttons to press when dealing with the Scots.I'd suggest whats obviously out of step is that it's broadcast into another countries viewing throughout every tournament

I'm sure Dutch, Argentinian and Brazilian pundits all get excited - it's just not broadcast into our livingrooms during the breakfast show or the Portugal vs Switzerland game

Sent from my VOG-L29 using Tapatalk

[tamig]

Folk bemoaning the lack of ex-keeper pundits should really tune into 5 Live. Rob Green is s mainstay now and I think he’s an excellent pundit. I

[hibby rae]

So English TV and English commentators get fully behind their team 100% and crank up the volume as their team go further and further in the competition.

This is all actually very normal and happens in every country of the world.

Its not English people or English TV that is out of step, its those who somehow think that English people should downplay their excitement for some obscure reasons of affecting others sensitivities.

England has a good football team and is a fine country populated by very very clever people who know exactly what buttons to press when dealing with the Scots.

But when Messi scores against the Dutch do they really need to mention England at that point?

[Irish_Steve]

Folk bemoaning the lack of ex-keeper pundits should really tune into 5 Live. Rob Green is s mainstay now and I think he’s an excellent pundit. I

Rob Green is excellent to listen too and he certainly doesn't mind making fun of himself. Mind you, he has had some high profile howlers!

And speaking of 5 Live, whenever a match is on the Beeb, i always log into the iPlayer so I can hear the Five Live commentary with the match instead of the TV commentators. The Five Live ones are superior in so many ways mainly because traditionally they were commentating on a game no one could see so had to describe the action clearly, painting the pictures as John Murray says.

[JimBHibees]

I think if we had our own BBC or STV commentators and studio hosts, we wouldn't bother one jot what they were saying, but we have to endure English coverage and it does grate a bit.

Exactly this

[hibsbollah]

Folk bemoaning the lack of ex-keeper pundits should really tune into 5 Live. Rob Green is s mainstay now and I think he’s an excellent pundit. I

Rob Green is an intelligent pundit, but to be honest he doesn’t get involved in much keeper analysis on five live, he’s called upon mostly to talk about what it’s like to be in the international tournament environment ( like getting mocked by the other English players for being the only one who read books travelling to games :greengrin). It’s left to shearer to tell us ‘for me, keepers should never get beat on their near post’