Too many out there don’t fancy it…

[Scotty Leither]

Team selection looked lightweight and it’s the same movie again through here.

Martin to the rescue again it looks like, but with the midfield anonymous and Tavares getting brushed aside too easy I’d take a point now.

****ty pitch isn’t helping, but it’s been a hard watch that first half.

[Since452]

Rocky missing is a huge miss. Especially with that giant playing. Massive improvement needed second half.

[Stubbsy90+2]

There’s a complete lack of quality and character. Same issues we have had for ages.

We’re just not very good, it’s that simple really. Martin Boyle may drag us to top 6 almost single handedly if he picks up where he left off. If not then this team is nailed on bottom 6.

[worcesterhibby]

Too many people make up their mind about a game before it's finished.

[Ryan91]

Too many people also don't seem to understand that it's a work in progress.

[SaulGoodman]

I’ve said it before, it seems like some people go from one extreme to the other. We’re either amazing (we’re not) or the worst team they’ve ever seen (we’re not)

[The Modfather]

Too many people also don't seem to understand that it's a work in progress.

We’re about 2 or 3 years into that work in progress with the same problems still remaining IMO. That’s the issue for me.

[Libby Hibby]

A draw is a good result on that ****ty pitch

[Libby Hibby]

Ffs

[Sammy7nil]

We’re about 2 or 3 years into that work in progress with the same problems still remaining IMO. That’s the issue for me.

For the last 50 years excluding maybe three or four years Hibs have constantly been a work in progress and always will be. As soon as players get near their potential they will be sold.

[One Day Soon]

Too many people also don't seem to understand that it's a work in progress.

It’s a work but it’s currently far from clear that it’s in progress I’m afraid.

[Jim44]

It’s a work but it’s currently far from clear that it’s in progress I’m afraid.

Too true …….. looking at our first three games, a win against a poor team, a draw against on of the top teams and a defeat against a mediocre team puts us in 6th place in the league. I think that this is how it will pan out over the season. I don’t see us improving on where we’re at.

[WestStandWillie]

Another season of just going through the motions. There’s easily 5 or 6 players who shouldn’t pull the jersey on again. Embarrassing doesn’t even cover it. School boy defending again and again.

The malaise is back with a vengeance

[Hibs90]

Newell is an absolute imposter. Get rid.

[Unseen work]

The first half was just bizarre.

Second half much much improved and what we expect, we shouldn’t have to get a rollicking at half time to get going.

Thought Cadden was really poor today, his use of the ball needs to be better.

Tavares just doesn’t look like a player, I know that sounds ridiculous as it’s very early days but sometimes there’s a flash or something where you think aye he’s got something. To me he looks uncomfortable, clumsy and so weak.

Youan showed his qualities and to me looked much better out on the left, if we signed a centre forward or tried Melkersen there with Boyle on the right we’d be stronger imo.

We really miss someone in midfield that can skin someone, drop a shoulder or play a real quality pass.

[Alfred E Newman]

We are poor in the same areas we've been poor over the past couple of seasons. I don't see the players that have been brought in changing that.

[Tambo]

Newell is an absolute imposter. Get rid.

Henderson was the one looking to make something happen in the center of midfield with Kenneh doing his usual role( yes could of done better for the first goal)

A very quiet game in the first half not involved with with his usual giving away silly fouls.

Second half again for me not really that much involved wanting to try and make something happen.

Not a scapegoat attack on Joe Newell after a defeat as a couple players underperformed today, I was just wondering what his role was today? Unless I watched a different game?

[BoyledEgg]

Too many people also don't seem to understand that it's a work in progress.

Hearts came up and finished 3rd in there first season. We should be ahead of them not miles behind.

[A Hi-Bee]

The first half was just bizarre.

Second half much much improved and what we expect, we shouldn’t have to get a rollicking at half time to get going.

Thought Cadden was really poor today, his use of the ball needs to be better.

Tavares just doesn’t look like a player, I know that sounds ridiculous as it’s very early days but sometimes there’s a flash or something where you think aye he’s got something. To me he looks uncomfortable, clumsy and so weak.

Youan showed his qualities and to me looked much better out on the left, if we signed a centre forward or tried Melkersen there with Boyle on the right we’d be stronger imo.

We really miss someone in midfield that can skin someone, drop a shoulder or play a real quality pass.

Aye someone like Scott Allan such a shame he could not stay and perform at the highest level, it will be a long time before we see his skill in a Hibs jersey again.
:thumbsup:

[Hibs90]

Henderson was the one looking to make something happen in the center of midfield with Kenneh doing his usual role( yes could of done better for the first goal)

A very quiet game in the first half not involved with with his usual giving away silly fouls.

Second half again for me not really that much involved wanting to try and make something happen.

Not a scapegoat attack on Joe Newell after a defeat as a couple players underperformed today, I was just wondering what his role was today? Unless I watched a different game?

Just doing his usual one decent game in five routine.

[H18S NX]

Newell is an absolute imposter. Get rid....Have to admit,my heart sinks when i see his name on the teamsheet every week.

[Hibiza]

Newell is an absolute imposter. Get rid.

:top marks

[JohnM1875]

Henderson was the one looking to make something happen in the center of midfield with Kenneh doing his usual role( yes could of done better for the first goal)

A very quiet game in the first half not involved with with his usual giving away silly fouls.

Second half again for me not really that much involved wanting to try and make something happen.

Not a scapegoat attack on Joe Newell after a defeat as a couple players underperformed today, I was just wondering what his role was today? Unless I watched a different game?

Thought Hendo was terrible again today. Blowing out his arse as well. Newell really poor as well and Kenneh was fine. Praying for a class central midfielder signing this week as we really really need it.

[hhibs]

...Have to admit,my heart sinks when i see his name on the teamsheet every week.

Yep,same old ,same old.yet still has many vocal supporters on here !

Until he is gone and/or we get a forward thinking ,strong willed midfielder we will not improve,maybe even get worse than last season.

[matty_f]

Shouldn’t take for it to reach half time before the team start to look like they give a ****. Pathetic lack of desire/fight/Will to win in that first half. Inexcusable, really.

[thebausburst]

We’re back to being soft as %£&* again, the likes of Hanlon, Jair, Bojang, Newell are horrific.

[The Tubs]

We’re back to being soft as %£&* again, the likes of Hanlon, Jair, Bojang, Newell are horrific.

I actually thought Hanlon and Newell had good games. Fair enough, Hanlon helped give away the first goal, but he's been chucked in due to Rocky's injury.

It's unfair to judge Tavares and Bojang based on their limited time on the pitch so far, Mr Burst.

[Alfred E Newman]

If we hadn’t brought any players in over the summer, Boyle excluded, would we be any worse off than we are now?
The recruitment leaves a lot be desired if you ask me.

[BoomtownHibees]

Can only play for half a game

[hhibs]

I actually thought Hanlon and Newell had good games. Fair enough, Hanlon helped give away the first goal, but he's been chucked in due to Rocky's injury.

It's unfair to judge Tavares and Bojang based on their limited time on the pitch so far, Mr Burst.



On Newell.....wow,just wow!!

[H18 SFR]

Tavares isn’t going to make it in Scotland. I actually don’t have an issue with signing him in some ways - we are trying something different for once rathe than going for Tom James’ etc.

We now know categorically that Henderson isn’t a wide player - the important thing is we 100% need to learn from today.

[A Hi-Bee]

I actually thought Hanlon and Newell had good games. Fair enough, Hanlon helped give away the first goal, but he's been chucked in due to Rocky's injury.

It's unfair to judge Tavares and Bojang based on their limited time on the pitch so far, Mr Burst.

I wonder what Neil Lennon would have to say about a first half display like that, prancing around pretending to be professional football players some of them.
Now, I have not heard what our Mr Lee Johnson has said about that insipid display yet.

[hhibs]

Tavares isn’t going to make it in Scotland. I actually don’t have an issue with signing him in some ways - we are trying something different for once rathe than going for Tom James’ etc.

We now know categorically that Henderson isn’t a wide player - the important thing is we 100% need to learn from today.




Not sure Hibs are capable of doing this "learning " thing,recent history suggest it's not our thing .

[Nicho87]

Tavares, newell, doidge, Hanlon

Simply not good enough

[The Tubs]

I wonder what Neil Lennon would have to say about a first half display like that, prancing around pretending to be professional football players some of them.
Now, I have not heard what our Mr Lee Johnson has said about that insipid display yet.

He might not have been complimentary but, going by his time at Hibs, I doubt he'd have bothered to find a long-term solution if he knew the celtc job was coming up.

[H18 SFR]

Not sure Hibs are capable of doing this "learning " thing,recent history suggest it's not our thing .

I agree but we’ve got to, this has to be a pivotal moment in our journey as it’s referred to.

[roc1]

Sorry too old to know how reply to a single message 🙄
It overall our defence has been crap for years.
Happy to be shot down in flames for that comment but apart from one season in last 10 it’s been awful defensively

[JohnM1875]

I wonder what Neil Lennon would have to say about a first half display like that, prancing around pretending to be professional football players some of them.
Now, I have not heard what our Mr Lee Johnson has said about that insipid display yet.

Think it's pretty clear the message that LJ gave at half time had an impact though. We were like a different team second half and should have scored a few.

[Scotty Leither]

Application was much better in 2nd half, and their left wing-back should have walked for a second foul, but we lack a focal point up top and I would seriously consider a bid for Noubile.

He's not the most mobile but the ball sticks to him and gets his team up the pitch, everything that Doidge doesn't do. And no Hibs team at any time whether or not we're a "work in progress" or "in transition" should lose so frequently to that sham of a football club and their carpet remnant pitch.

[SaulGoodman]

I wonder what Neil Lennon would have to say about a first half display like that, prancing around pretending to be professional football players some of them.
Now, I have not heard what our Mr Lee Johnson has said about that insipid display yet.

We got beat 2-1 at Livi whilst Lennon was in charge as well..

Although to answer your question I reckon Lennon would react by having a meltdown, chucking his players under the bus, refuse to do media interviews for the next 3 months, maybe try Chuck a few things at our strikers before ****ing off to his beloved Celtic.

[B.H.F.C]

Too many people also don't seem to understand that it's a work in progress.

I could deal with that if I thought we had addressed the really obvious fundamental problems. But we’re not and much of what we saw today was entirely predictable.

Being a work in progress is no excuse for many aspects of that performance today. Experienced players are letting us down. Hanlon at the first. Doidge at the second.

[LewysGot2]

Just back from Toy Town - false alarm evacuation of the stadium before kick off after the scanners weren't working before we finally got in set the tone for a hideous outing on a bone dry equally hideous pitch and an all too familiar outcome.

There were too many people unable or unwilling to adapt to a surface that is an embarrassment in our so-called top flight. We need to stop this nonsense if we ever want the game in this country to move on. It spoils any chance of free flowing football and it risks players wellbeing- which impacts on how players consciously or subconsciously perform. Today, there would have been more moisture in the Sahara. It's a joke. It's not exactly bringing in the punters either. 3000 odd folk at the game - the vast majority Hibs fans.

Lucky us, Killie are back, too. However, that's another thread altogether.

Rocky being out was a surprise. Assuming he has some injury or was ill. Their big forward whose hype will continue to grow if he keeps running through or over the top of midfielders and centre halves but, I'll be honest, I'd not be overly fussed at watching that every week. Maybe more the fool me for being the purist.

We lost because of individual errors not because Livingston are great. They were more aggressive, direct and hungry in the first half. Even Shinnie had been on the brave pills. By contrast, we looked our customary uncomfortable on the nylon carpet littered in reconstituted tyre pellets. And we looked too light weight. Kenneh was totally owned by Jason Holt - rightly MotM - and Melkerson, Jair and Henderson were three of a number of players who were just lost.

Henderson was to be far more effective in the 2nd half and we were far better for 35 mins of the 2nd half but players need to impact for 90mins not 35mins.

I'm going to be happy to be proven way wrong but Jair and Bojang are lost. One is physically struggling with the demands of our game, the other doesn't look like a football player of any technical ability. His miss in injury time was criminal.

Marshall was solid and had one particularly great save 2nd half. Boyle had them worried when he came on - they immediately doubled up on him - but he's not match fit yet and we need to be patient. Likewise Hanlon. Porto was a mixed bag and seemed to lose his man at the winner but I'll need to see that back. He apologised to the fans at the end. Melkerson was on crutches at the end - another one to add to our Emergency Ward 10 list already. He'd been anonymous prior to going off so injury may explain some of that.

The season is going to be a roller coaster, of that there is no doubt. Some of the really personal vile stuff about players from wee dafties in green Stone Island tee-shirts is uncalled for. But there's a lot of work needed done with this squad. Some are not going to cut the mustard, some will come back and improve things and some will be everything in between.

Buckle up, we're in for a long season...

[Tully]

Bojang got 8 minutes should have scored but done more than doidge,who cost us a point by not picking up the runner at the winner

[matty_f]

No idea how folk can have an opinion one way or another on Bojang or Tavares based on the very little we’ve seen of them both.

[BoomtownHibees]

No idea how folk can have an opinion one way or another on Bojang or Tavares based on the very little we’ve seen of them both.

Tavares was poor today. Very poor. Like someone who hadn’t ever played 1st team football.

Bojang I agree with, although he did miss a sitter today

[LunasBoots]

No idea how folk can have an opinion one way or another on Bojang or Tavares based on the very little we’ve seen of them both.

Tavares has come from a different style of football in Portugal, we've had these kind of players before and they just can't hack the style of play here.

[LunasBoots]

Too many people also don't seem to understand that it's a work in progress.

So when exactly are we going to address the glaring problem foe years, the spine of the team? There will be no progress if its not addressed

[Libby Hibby]

Drop Newell and play either Tait or JDH

[Not In The Know]

Newell is an absolute imposter. Get rid.

I’ve always given him the benefit of the doubt but today was the last straw. At times he was deeper than Kenneh when the centre half’s had the ball. Was blowing out his arse and hiding the whole game. man short. With him and the malnourished looking Henderson in midfield it’s no surprise we lost.

[Scorrie]

So when exactly are we going to address the glaring problem foe years, the spine of the team? There will be no progress if its not addressed

Exactly. This has been work in progress for a while now and nobody in charge of recruitment has been bothered / able to address it

[Dr_Regal]

He has played about 5 games for us, including preseason and I am yet to see Taveres win the ball once. Soft

[madsen5]

Can only play for half a game

Hibeys ????????

[BoomtownHibees]

Hibeys ????????

Madsen ??????????

[MWHIBBIES]

I wonder what Neil Lennon would have to say about a first half display like that, prancing around pretending to be professional football players some of them.
Now, I have not heard what our Mr Lee Johnson has said about that insipid display yet.

Neil was responsible was plenty of first and second halfs like that.

[thebausburst]

Tavares, newell, doidge, Hanlon

Simply not good enough

Tavares looks like he could be the worst singing since “The Tank”, embarrassing to think he’s our number 10.

[Joe6-2]

If we hadn’t brought any players in over the summer, Boyle excluded, would we be any worse off than we are now?
The recruitment leaves a lot be desired if you ask me.

It’s horrendous

[Leith Green]

Tavares was poor today. Very poor. Like someone who hadn’t ever played 1st team football.

Bojang I agree with, although he did miss a sitter today


I cant help but think that he looks like he won a raffle or something.. He looks miles away from playing at this level. And that is being kind to him

[Leith Green]

No idea how folk can have an opinion one way or another on Bojang or Tavares based on the very little we’ve seen of them both.

I disagree.. You can clearly see , in the few games he has played that tavares is nowhere near this level. Yet the likes of dan mackay are papped out on loan as they are not deemed ready. Our whole recruitment policy and strategy around developing our players is all wrong ..

[Nicho87]

LJ has referred a few times Tavares needs time - he hasn’t even played in front of crowds etc

Too many players in our squad I still think are just not good enough or under the category of let’s hope they really kick on a level and sell on for a few quid. Scatter-gun signings of under 23 players is quite scary

Bojang
Tavares
McClelland
Henderson
Miller
Rocky

All of the above for me requiring time ….

Ultimately we don’t have time, season started and we need results

[Scotty Leither]

LJ has referred a few times Tavares needs time - he hasn’t even played in front of crowds etc

Too many players in our squad I still think are just not good enough or under the category of let’s hope they really kick on a level and sell on for a few quid. Scatter-gun signings of under 23 players is quite scary

Bojang
Tavares
McClelland
Henderson
Miller
Rocky

All of the above for me requiring time ….

Ultimately we don’t have time, season started and we need results

So if any of the above make it, what's the plan after that? Sign another clutch of players with promise and hope one of them makes us a few quid?

This rinse and repeat scattergun approach to recruiment is simply not good enough for Hibs.

[Spike Mandela]

Tavares, newell, doidge, Hanlon

Simply not good enough

Hanlon?

First game back after a long lay off. Surely he's likely to be a bit rusty and off form at first.

The guy certainly doesn't owe us anything after all he's done for the club and should have enough 'credit in the bank' for us to give him a bit of time to get up to speed. Club captain and our best centre half when he's on top form.

[Nicho87]

So if any of the above make it, what's the plan after that? Sign another clutch of players with promise and hope one of them makes us a few quid?

This rinse and repeat scattergun approach to recruiment is simply not good enough for Hibs.

Yes that clearly is the strategic plan

And yes I am worried

Tin hat on, they have signed Shankland and Mackay, 2 players who would start most weeks in this current squad. Certainly Mackay would first name down on current form

Point is Scottish players who know what it takes

We are signing guys who haven’t played in their top leagues and now not even in front of crowds.

Bewildering

[Springbank]

So if any of the above make it, what's the plan after that? Sign another clutch of players with promise and hope one of them makes us a few quid?

This rinse and repeat scattergun approach to recruiment is simply not good enough for Hibs.

The great Alfredo di Stefano had a phrase to sum up his exasperation with football in Argentina

"I don't get why we sell all our good players, just to inflate the wages of the poor players we keep"

[MWHIBBIES]

Yes that clearly is the strategic plan

And yes I am worried

Tin hat on, they have signed Shankland and Mackay, 2 players who would start most weeks in this current squad. Certainly Mackay would first name down on current form

Point is Scottish players who know what it takes

We are signing guys who haven’t played in their top leagues and now not even in front of crowds.

Bewildering

We've got guys like that though.

Doidge and Nisbet are proven scorers in this league. We can't account for brutal injury. Allan on his day much better than McKay. Again, a heart problem you can't account for. Hanlon and Porteous a proven pairing, again bad injury. Even midfield, Newell played every week when we finished 3rd. Bad form and bad injury are killing the proven guys we have.

[Hibernian Verse]

So if any of the above make it, what's the plan after that? Sign another clutch of players with promise and hope one of them makes us a few quid?

This rinse and repeat scattergun approach to recruiment is simply not good enough for Hibs.

I can understand why the approach isn't for everyone, but it is in no way scattergun. We will have identified these players using data analysis not plucked them out of thin air. A scattergun approach is one like what Levein employed at Hearts.

[One Day Soon]

I can understand why the approach isn't for everyone, but it is in no way scattergun. We will have identified these players using data analysis not plucked them out of thin air. A scattergun approach is one like what Levein employed at Hearts.


If it wasn't scattergun we would have signed players for the positions we need to fill well before now. We haven't done that though, instead we have signed quite a few players on the basis of their potential (presumably that part IS based on data analysis).

The result is a hefty sized squad which somehow also manages to not have enough players of established first team calibre ready to play right now.

[superfurryhibby]

If it wasn't scattergun we would have signed players for the positions we need to fill well before now. We haven't done that though, instead we have signed quite a few players on the basis of their potential (presumably that part IS based on data analysis).

The result is a hefty sized squad which somehow also manages to not have enough players of established first team calibre ready to play right now.

This is our recruitment summary in a nutshell.

Injuries have been a factor, but we have weakness right down the spine of our team. It's good that we are looking at different approaches, but people need to stop kidding themselves. We are way short of where we want to be.

[One Day Soon]

This is our recruitment summary in a nutshell.

Injuries have been a factor, but we have weakness right down the spine of our team. It's good that we are looking at different approaches, but people need to stop kidding themselves. We are way short of where we want to be.


Maybe it is good we are trying lots of different approaches but that's far from proven and I'm certainly not yet convinced.

My two observations would be these: 1. If this is the way to go forward why is no other club in our league trying it? Do we somehow have insight that no-one else does through experience, contacts and data available exclusively to us? Seems unlikely. 2. If there were short cuts to success in football it is highly likely, given the number of leagues in the world, that these would be known about and exploited already by many, many other clubs.

The harsh truth tends to be that broadly you get what you pay for. The most likely path to sustained success is through a mixture of squad and first team stability with gradual evolution built upon judicious signing of the best players you can afford mixed with the careful development of your own youth talent. In among all that you try to unearth the occasional hidden jewels elsewhere that others have missed. We seem to be on a mission to bulk buy hidden jewels in a volume greater than others have managed with the rest as an afterthought.