Saw Enough…

[Dashing Bob S]

…against Norwich (both halves) to convince me that the League Cup was a combo of pre season rust and management and players seriously underestimating the opposition.

I hope they’ve learned from both.

But as a fan I am holding my hand up as a generator of the negativity/despondency and resolving to sack that bleating, and am getting behind the boys in this campaign- though reserving the right to criticize constructively when appropriate.

Any of you chaps with me?

[Keith_M]

:top marks

[Juice-Terry]

Hard to disagree with that. That Norwich performance was a much needed shot in the arm. Onward and upward! GGTTH!

[NAE NOOKIE]

#Me too :greengrin

We seem to have a raft of talented young players if yesterday was anything to go by, though how the hell LJ can ease some of them into the team while making us as competitive as we need to be is the trick. Will he be willing to bin a 'safe' option and take a chance on one or two of these guys?

[heidtheba]

Great post and great way forward.

We've got so many promising youngsters in this crop. There will be 'getting up to speed' moments and there will be the inconsistency that comes with youth. They'll need time to learn and mistakes will happen. I hope the experienced pros (or ones we bring in) can help carry them through this. If we get through this season, give them opportunities and let them learn and learn constructively, next season could be really special.

[Since452]

Don't disagree. Falkirk in particular got wired in about us from the first minute and and caught us cold in that opening 45 minutes to their credit. It was a lesson for us. Morton game we just didn't punish them when we should have. Yesterday was a welcome win. As crap as it was going out the cup i still have faith. There is a lot to be excited about.

[H18 SFR]

We are going to dismantle St Johnstone. Not sure what will happen there after but it’s clicking on Saturday at 3pm.

[Nevi_SOL]

I’m in the same boat, yesterday was needed and as others have said we have some great youngsters waiting to take anyones place who doesn’t fancy the challenge.

[ionahibby]

The way I see it, if we get top 6 that’s a success and we can work from there.

[Pagan Hibernia]

I think we’ll do fine this season. Genuinely think a lot of people will be pleasantly surprised

[JammyDoidger]

The way I see it, if we get top 6 that’s a success and we can work from there.

Are you joking? If we don't finish in the top 4 it's a failure. Simple as that. There's also a difference between a pre season kickabout and the real stuff, I'll be there Saturday and I'll get behind them, but that's when we will see what they are really made of. Hopefully hibs bring in a centre half by then too. If not it's incredibly naive.

[ionahibby]

Are you joking? If we don't finish in the top 4 it's a failure. Simple as that. There's also a difference between a pre season kickabout and the real stuff, I'll be there Saturday and I'll get behind them, but that's when we will see what they are really made of. Hopefully hibs bring in a centre half by then too. If not it's incredibly naive.

We need to accept that 5th or 6th is where we are at the moment in terms of quality this season. It’s a hard one to swallow but if manage that then we can use that to build for next few seasons.

[Stuart93]

The way I see it, if we get top 6 that’s a success and we can work from there.

Ah back to the good old top 6 is good enough for us days. Jesus wept.

4th or higher please.

Need to hit the ground running on Saturday. I don’t think yesterdays friendly is going to have any bearing on how the game will go.

[Allant1981]

Are you joking? If we don't finish in the top 4 it's a failure. Simple as that. There's also a difference between a pre season kickabout and the real stuff, I'll be there Saturday and I'll get behind them, but that's when we will see what they are really made of. Hopefully hibs bring in a centre half by then too. If not it's incredibly naive.

Hardly a failure considering where we finished last season and the amount of new players LJ has had to bring in, we need to build on last season but to suggest not finishing top 4 is failure is a joke

[JammyDoidger]

Hardly a failure considering where we finished last season and the amount of new players LJ has had to bring in, we need to build on last season but to suggest not finishing top 4 is failure is a joke

It is purely because the rest of the league is that bad it's not an achievement to finish 5th, look at the state of us last season and we were a Melkersen sitter away from the top 6. We need to finish above hearts or aberdeen and finish 4th minumum, that's an achievement. Aberdeen look to have their house in order and they were in worse Nick than us. With the squad we have got though, 5th or 6th would probably be about as high as we will get. That's the boards fault though.

[chookyembra]

Are you joking? If we don't finish in the top 4 it's a failure. Simple as that. There's also a difference between a pre season kickabout and the real stuff, I'll be there Saturday and I'll get behind them, but that's when we will see what they are really made of. Hopefully hibs bring in a centre half by then too. If not it's incredibly naive.
Couldn’t agree more with all of that

[loanheadhibby]

Ah back to the good old top 6 is good enough for us days. Jesus wept.

4th or higher please.

Need to hit the ground running on Saturday. I don’t think yesterdays friendly is going to have any bearing on how the game will go.
I agree, to strive for top 6 is embarrassing.
All I ask is that we give Hearts and Aberdeen a run for their money.
Third would be great, fourth good and depending on how close we run the above two fifth would be ok.
For any other teams to finish above us would be pretty poor.

[Pagan Hibernia]

Ah back to the good old top 6 is good enough for us days. Jesus wept.

4th or higher please.

Need to hit the ground running on Saturday. I don’t think yesterdays friendly is going to have any bearing on how the game will go.

6th absolute minimum, if still disappointing.
5th satisfactory.
4th good!
3rd excellent.

[Spike Mandela]

It's the hope that kills.

[Stuart93]

6th absolute minimum, if still disappointing.
5th satisfactory.
4th good!
3rd excellent.

Yep I’d agree

I suppose it depends how the season pans out. A lot of football to be played.

At this point I’d be disappointed aiming for top 6 alone, but thankfully the club/manager/players will be a lot more ambitious than that

[NAE NOOKIE]

We are going to dismantle St Johnstone. Not sure what will happen there after but it’s clicking on Saturday at 3pm.

If by 'dismantle' you mean 1 - 0 through a scaffed shot that rebounds off the post hits their keeper on the arse and trickles over the line .... I'll take it :greengrin

[Vini1875]

Sorry but given the result against a second string Norwich, tells me nothing. I fear for us given how poor our midfield is, but I am hoping to be pleasantly surprised. I would like to see another couple of signings before St. J. game, but I will be there praying for any sort of win.

[hibbyfraelibby]

If by 'dismantle' you mean 1 - 0 through a scaffed shot that rebounds off the post hits their keeper on the arse and trickles over the line .... I'll take it :greengrin

You just described a stunning if typical Doige goal...

[Torto7]

…against Norwich (both halves) to convince me that the League Cup was a combo of pre season rust and management and players seriously underestimating the opposition.

I hope they’ve learned from both.

But as a fan I am holding my hand up as a generator of the negativity/despondency and resolving to sack that bleating, and am getting behind the boys in this campaign- though reserving the right to criticize constructively when appropriate.

Any of you chaps with me?

We don't know how to break down uber defensive teams. Most teams in Scotland don't play out from the back they just wait for intercepts and try and play ping pong blooter through the middle. We're very generous at giving the ball away for quick counters and conceding avoidable goals. The key to this is improving the crossing into the box which has been humpty for too long and being more careful on the ball when playing it forward. It's up to LJ to solve that.

[ian cruise]

6th absolute minimum, if still disappointing.
5th satisfactory.
4th good!
3rd excellent.

That's pretty accurate I'd say. I'm of the opinion that 5th or 6th this season is acceptable. Doesn't mean that is the target, or that it's not disappointing, just an acceptance that as we bed in so many new players and a new style of play we're going to hit some road bumps on the way.

If this season is anything like last season and our competition falter as much as we do then 3rd or 4th is achievable, but if a couple of other teams put in a good run of form, 5th or 6th might be best we can hope for.

Club (management and players) will definitely be targeting top 4, difference for us as fans tempering our expectations is it softens our disappointment when a game doesn't go our way and takes the pressure off the team. Rightly or wrongly our last season when the pressure has been on the team from the stands the players have played within themselves, same seemed to happen at Morton.

[Bushwoof]

A lot of people were calling for a major rebuild after last season, and that's what we're getting. These things rarely result in immediate success though, so some patience will be required. I expect us to have a slow start, so anything better than 6th this year will be a bonus, but we should be aiming for 3rd next season.

[Itsnoteasy]

The way I see it, if we get top 6 that’s a success and we can work from there.

🤣

[PeeJay]

Seems to me, if 3rd place is not a realistic target at the start of a season then something is seriously wrong at ER ...

[Carheenlea]

The League Cup debacle had me thinking I’d settle for top flight survival.

I didn’t see the game yesterday but encouraged by the positivity that many have in an improved performance.
Yes, we have players still to come in and hopefully new signings in key positions as well and those league cup line ups will never see the light of day again.

It’s hard to predict how good we can be this season, but we have seen already how bad we can be, and it was not very pretty at all.

[TheSouthMoroccan]

I'm in, I like the cut of LJ's jib. Think we will struggle at the the start of the season as tactics and players will take time to settle in but by the end we'll be 4th behind "them". We'll have seen a lot more of what we like than what we don't. Hurrah for happy clapping. Unfortunately it will be bed wetting central on here on Sat at 5pm after we are beaten by St J but no need to panic, it will all come good in the end.:agree:

[Smartie]

We don't know how to break down uber defensive teams. Most teams in Scotland don't play out from the back they just wait for intercepts and try and play ping pong blooter through the middle. We're very generous at giving the ball away for quick counters and conceding avoidable goals. The key to this is improving the crossing into the box which has been humpty for too long and being more careful on the ball when playing it forward. It's up to LJ to solve that.

This is my biggest concern about LJ and “English League One” types (sorry for the hopeless generalisation*).

It’s all very well coming up with a tidy counter attacking unit and claiming that possession is overrated. The problem is, a great deal of the time (especially at home) we’ll be coming up against teams who will be happy to let us have the ball and attempt to hit US on the break. It’ll be even worse if we lose the first goal.

So I tend to switch off a bit when I hear nice talk about “the press”. That’s great, but what are you going to do when Joe Newell is on the ball, you’re 1-0 down and the opposition have every man behind the ball? Press them, or find a way to break them down? Because your time at Hibs is likely to be defined by your ability to figure this out.

* I’ve gone with league one types here but I might be referring to Hecky and Jack Ross, both good coaches who obviously knew their stuff but arguably fell short of achieving what they might at Hibs. Certainly neither were given time to ride out a bad spell but it was hard to argue that either should. Ross certainly could point to a decent away record during his “good season” for evidence that his team was maybe better on the break?

[patlowe]

6th absolute minimum, if still disappointing.
5th satisfactory.
4th good!
3rd excellent.

Think it depends on a how we go about our business also. If we were to finish 5th behind a strong Aberdeen and Hearts, but demonstrate a real sense of progress in our style and approach, this will be perceived very differently to say sneaking in there almost by default, a la Motherwell last season.

[IberianHibernian]

Think it depends on a how we go about our business also. If we were to finish 5th behind a strong Aberdeen and Hearts, but demonstrate a real sense of progress in our style and approach, this will be perceived very differently to say sneaking in there almost by default, a la Motherwell last season.Exactly . Last season , we were very close to finishing 4th ( Melkersen`s miss in last pre split home match ) but I doubt many of us would have been celebrating 4th even if t meant some ( and maybe a lot of ) European matches . In a supposedly bad season , we were very close to 4th in league , SC final and winning the LC . We might play better this season but lose in first round of SC and finish just as low in league . Or we might play worse but finish high enough to make Europe . Hopefully some of the new players will prove to be entertaining and effective and we can enjoy some good performances whatever our final position .

[whiskyhibby]

…against Norwich (both halves) to convince me that the League Cup was a combo of pre season rust and management and players seriously underestimating the opposition.

I hope they’ve learned from both.

But as a fan I am holding my hand up as a generator of the negativity/despondency and resolving to sack that bleating, and am getting behind the boys in this campaign- though reserving the right to criticize constructively when appropriate.

Any of you chaps with me?


Absolutely :flag:

[Green Badger]

I think top 6 would not be a disaster, if we got 3rd that’d be fantastic. We may well end up somewhere between the two.

[Scotty Leither]

I absolutely despair at this "Top 6 is acceptable/transition period" chat.

I judge Hibs (certainly at Easter Road) by: Derby wins, at least one win at home v both of the Ugly Sisters, and qualifying for Europe. We've not done any of them with any regularity in the last 3-4 seasons.

The management and Board need to be held to the same standard; anything less than that isn't good enough for Hibernian FC.

[Lago]

…against Norwich (both halves) to convince me that the League Cup was a combo of pre season rust and management and players seriously underestimating the opposition.

I hope they’ve learned from both.

But as a fan I am holding my hand up as a generator of the negativity/despondency and resolving to sack that bleating, and am getting behind the boys in this campaign- though reserving the right to criticize constructively when appropriate.

Any of you chaps with me?
As long as it's constructive criticism I'm with you 👍

[mcohibs]

I absolutely despair at this "Top 6 is acceptable/transition period" chat.

I judge Hibs (certainly at Easter Road) by: Derby wins, at least one win at home v both of the Ugly Sisters, and qualifying for Europe. We've not done any of them with any regularity in the last 3-4 seasons.

The management and Board need to be held to the same standard; anything less than that isn't good enough for Hibernian FC.

Totally agree. For Hibs, 5th place should be a disappointing season and anything below that unacceptable. We need to start holding ourselves to that standard.

Excited for the season to start and will be right behind the team every kick of the ball, bring it on.

[loanheadhibby]

I absolutely despair at this "Top 6 is acceptable/transition period" chat.

I judge Hibs (certainly at Easter Road) by: Derby wins, at least one win at home v both of the Ugly Sisters, and qualifying for Europe. We've not done any of them with any regularity in the last 3-4 seasons.

The management and Board need to be held to the same standard; anything less than that isn't good enough for Hibernian FC.
I totally agree.
Our performances against Hearts were absolutely pathetic last season and the positivity after the 0-0 draw at Easter Road was embarrassing.
In most cases a 0-0 draw in a Derby at Tynecastle does not go down well with the home support.
Let's hope for some stirring displays v Hearts this season but do we have the players to produce them?

[munchar]

Hard to disagree with that. That Norwich performance was a much needed shot in the arm. Onward and upward! GGTTH!

Really? Norwich played their 2nd string team. Wasn’t impressed with the senior players. Still no identity to our play, or cutting edge.
2nd half, the development boys were a breath of fresh air. Couple of them nervous to start, understandably, but settled down & were hungry & adventurous, while showing their inexperience also.
I don’t buy this “getting up to speed, rusty” etc nonsense. Probably our best chance of silverware is the league cup, we just weren’t good enough. Falkirk & Morton would’ve been less prepared than ourselves, but still found a way to win. Very concerning imo. Not seeing anything to get excited about so far. Hopefully the visa boys will improve us, time will tell. Imperative we get something from Saints next week & Hearts the week after. Got to be positive & get behind the boys though. Hopefully it clicks into place.

[IberianHibernian]

I totally agree.
Our performances against Hearts were absolutely pathetic last season and the positivity after the 0-0 draw at Easter Road was embarrassing.
In most cases a 0-0 draw in a Derby at Tynecastle does not go down well with the home support.
Let's hope for some stirring displays v Hearts this season but do we have the players to produce them?We`re going to play 38 league games , only 3 or 4 of them will be against Hearts so a lot of other important matches . Likewise against Celtic and Rangers . We played Hearts 4 times last season , a season in which we had more injuries than I can remember in any season I`ve watched Hibs ( I started in late 1960s so for first 15 years or so a draw in a Derby was considered terrible and Hearts fans celebrated a corner against us let alone a draw ) . " draws which could have gone either way , a disappointing 3 v 1 defeat after being the better team in the first half and an unlucky 2 v 1 cup defeat where our understrength team dominated the match despite playing with 10 for a long time . So disappointing but not embarrassing . Do we have players to beat Hearts and OF ? Far too soon to know but I doubt we have enough to beat Celtic or Rangers yet , in 2023 hopefully yes . Hearts ? What have they done against any team in the last 10 years that makes you think we should fear them this season ?

Out of interest , are you satisfied with anything done by Hibs in recent years ? On or off the field .

[GreenGray]

I absolutely despair at this "Top 6 is acceptable/transition period" chat.

I judge Hibs (certainly at Easter Road) by: Derby wins, at least one win at home v both of the Ugly Sisters, and qualifying for Europe. We've not done any of them with any regularity in the last 3-4 seasons.

The management and Board need to be held to the same standard; anything less than that isn't good enough for Hibernian FC.

So we could lose every game at home but as long as we beat hearts you’re happy?

We shouldn’t judge our success by how we play against them, should focus on ourselves.

You can’t have a major rebuild and expect to fly straight back up the table, these things take time. Of course we should be aiming for 3rd but I hope fans don’t lose the head if we don’t manage it.


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[B.H.F.C]

So we could lose every game at home but as long as we beat hearts you’re happy?

We shouldn’t judge our success by how we play against them, should focus on ourselves.

You can’t have a major rebuild and expect to fly straight back up the table, these things take time. Of course we should be aiming for 3rd but I hope fans don’t lose the head if we don’t manage it.


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Thing is, we’re not going to lose every game at home are we.

Generally, if we’re getting results against Hearts, we’ve got a decent team. It’s pretty rare, that when we’re crap, we manage to dig a result out against them like they do against us.

If we can get some results against them this year it’ll be a decent indication that we’re doing all right IMO.

[loanheadhibby]

We`re going to play 38 league games , only 3 or 4 of them will be against Hearts so a lot of other important matches . Likewise against Celtic and Rangers . We played Hearts 4 times last season , a season in which we had more injuries than I can remember in any season I`ve watched Hibs ( I started in late 1960s so for first 15 years or so a draw in a Derby was considered terrible and Hearts fans celebrated a corner against us let alone a draw ) . " draws which could have gone either way , a disappointing 3 v 1 defeat after being the better team in the first half and an unlucky 2 v 1 cup defeat where our understrength team dominated the match despite playing with 10 for a long time . So disappointing but not embarrassing . Do we have players to beat Hearts and OF ? Far too soon to know but I doubt we have enough to beat Celtic or Rangers yet , in 2023 hopefully yes . Hearts ? What have they done against any team in the last 10 years that makes you think we should fear them this season ?

Out of interest , are you satisfied with anything done by Hibs in recent years ? On or off the field .

It's hard to be satisfied by much in recent years other than the cup win and some good cup runs.
We're all Hibbies on this site desperate to see our team do well.
At the moment we seem pretty unprepared for the season ahead and our league cup exit was a huge disappointment.
I admit I can be critical but refuse to praise guys like Newell and Doidge who are barely fit to wear the jersey.

[Pagan Hibernia]

I absolutely despair at this "Top 6 is acceptable/transition period" chat.

I judge Hibs (certainly at Easter Road) by: Derby wins, at least one win at home v both of the Ugly Sisters, and qualifying for Europe. We've not done any of them with any regularity in the last 3-4 seasons.

The management and Board need to be held to the same standard; anything less than that isn't good enough for Hibernian FC.

last 3 or 4 seasons? Take away the period of 2014-2018 and have we done those things regularly in the last 30 or 40 seasons?

[stantonhibby]

It's hard to be satisfied by much in recent years other than the cup win and some good cup runs.
We're all Hibbies on this site desperate to see our team do well.
At the moment we seem pretty unprepared for the season ahead and our league cup exit was a huge disappointment.
I admit I can be critical but refuse to praise guys like Newell and Doidge who are barely fit to wear the jersey.

You seem to find it hard to praise any Hibs players. Happy to praise Craig Levein though.

[Big90inOz]

I'm expecting more away wins than home wins, we really struggle to breakdown teams who sit in and hit on the break. Going to be interesting on Sat as St J will attack, could be a cracking game.

[MWHIBBIES]

It's hard to be satisfied by much in recent years other than the cup win and some good cup runs.
We're all Hibbies on this site desperate to see our team do well.
At the moment we seem pretty unprepared for the season ahead and our league cup exit was a huge disappointment.
I admit I can be critical but refuse to praise guys like Newell and Doidge who are barely fit to wear the jersey.
So you literally refuse to praise certain players regardless of their performance?

And you don't think finishing 3rd and 4th were satisfying?

Genuinely, are you sure you support Hibs?

[JimBHibees]

So you literally refuse to praise certain players regardless of their performance?

And you don't think finishing 3rd and 4th were satisfying?

Genuinely, are you sure you support Hibs?

Not so sure he does.

[Libby Hibby]

So you literally refuse to praise certain players regardless of their performance?

And you don't think finishing 3rd and 4th were satisfying?

Genuinely, are you sure you support Hibs?

100% not a hibby.

[Scotty Leither]

So we could lose every game at home but as long as we beat hearts you’re happy?

We shouldn’t judge our success by how we play against them, should focus on ourselves.

You can’t have a major rebuild and expect to fly straight back up the table, these things take time. Of course we should be aiming for 3rd but I hope fans don’t lose the head if we don’t manage it.


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They were a Championship team season before last. Promoted and finished 3rd at a canter. Took them no time at all to “transition” then, eh?

And we absolutely should judge ourselves with results and performances against them.

[GreenGray]

They were a Championship team season before last. Promoted and finished 3rd at a canter. Took them no time at all to “transition” then, eh?

And we absolutely should judge ourselves with results and performances against them.

True but how poor was the rest of the league last season? Hearts didn’t do anything special they just stayed relatively consistent compared to everyone else.

Why? Because they’re hearts? We’re our own team they like to constantly compare themselves to us I like to think we’re above that.


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[BlackSheep]

I absolutely despair at this "Top 6 is acceptable/transition period" chat.

I judge Hibs (certainly at Easter Road) by: Derby wins, at least one win at home v both of the Ugly Sisters, and qualifying for Europe. We've not done any of them with any regularity in the last 3-4 seasons.

The management and Board need to be held to the same standard; anything less than that isn't good enough for Hibernian FC.

Wow! To be honest i dont know why im surprised at this viewpoint, it seems to be creeping in across our fan base....

We could lose every game to Hearts and finish 3rd but a lot fo fans would be unhappy, its crazy!

The only time i feel that beating them is more important than our general season performance is when we have a rubbish season and beating them just softens the blow.

Its this impatience that bothers a lot of fans these days... and then affects the whole club when the vocal minority hound out players and managers and we end up back at square one.

I, for one, will endure some mediocrity if it means we have a strong squad that challenges in the long run.

[H18 SFR]

Wow! To be honest i dont know why im surprised at this viewpoint, it seems to be creeping in across our fan base....

We could lose every game to Hearts and finish 3rd but a lot fo fans would be unhappy, its crazy!

The only time i feel that beating them is more important than our general season performance is when we have a rubbish season and beating them just softens the blow.

Its this impatience that bothers a lot of fans these days... and then affects the whole club when the vocal minority hound out players and managers and we end up back at square one.

I, for one, will endure some mediocrity if it means we have a strong squad that challenges in the long run.

I share your frustration with this, it’s hard to pinpoint a moment in time or event that has sparked this as a ‘thing’.

[Scotty Leither]

I share your frustration with this, it’s hard to pinpoint a moment in time or event that has sparked this as a ‘thing’.

Our continual crap record against them, and our indifference as a club to revering that trend?

[CapitalGreen]

Our continual crap record against them, and our indifference as a club to revering that trend?

Our previous manager was sacked immediately after back to back derby defeats, that doesn’t suggest indifference to me, it suggests the complete opposite.

[BlackSheep]

Our continual crap record against them, and our indifference as a club to revering that trend?

Dont get me wrong, I want to beat them every time we play, but if it doesn't affect the bigger picture then I won't lose sleep over it.

[munchar]

Dont get me wrong, I want to beat them every time we play, but if it doesn't affect the bigger picture then I won't lose sleep over it.

What is the bigger picture? As someone mentioned previously, if we have our “usual” disappointing season, Derby success does soften the blow a bit. It’s actually quite simple the solution to beating Hearts regularly & competing for 3rd place every season…..sign QUALITY PLAYERS. You don’t get time to build squads, as bigger teams come & take the better players. Imo, players at a good age, 26-28 who have tried the top level & maybe not good enough, would still be top SPL players.

[BlackSheep]

What is the bigger picture? As someone mentioned previously, if we have our “usual” disappointing season, Derby success does soften the blow a bit. It’s actually quite simple the solution to beating Hearts regularly & competing for 3rd place every season…..sign QUALITY PLAYERS. You don’t get time to build squads, as bigger teams come & take the better players. Imo, players at a good age, 26-28 who have tried the top level & maybe not good enough, would still be top SPL players.

If you read my previous post that the member was replying to, you will see that i agree that in a poor season beating Hearts softens the blow... but in the grand scheme of things we could be up challenging for 3rd or even 2nd and losing to hearts wouldn't matter, unless it affects our chances of finishing in one of those positions.

My point is that too many fans are focused solely on beating Hearts.... it shows in the attendances at derbies vs our other games, full houses attended by fans just looking for a day out on the bevvy with some fighting thrown in for 'fun'.

For what its worth i think we have built a very good squad so far this summer, but i dont see us being an overnight sensation, give us the few months that Johnson has said and i think once gelled the team will be one of the top teams in the league.... BUT if the vocal minority are listened to should we fail to beat Hearts on game day 2 then it'll be a slippery slope for Johnson and the squad this season.

Bigger picture is to build a squad that finishes top 3/4 and challenges for the cups every year, thus making the players less likely to move on unless the prospect is hard to ignore. Consistency is the way forward.

[munchar]

If you read my previous post that the member was replying to, you will see that i agree that in a poor season beating Hearts softens the blow... but in the grand scheme of things we could be up challenging for 3rd or even 2nd and losing to hearts wouldn't matter, unless it affects our chances of finishing in one of those positions.

My point is that too many fans are focused solely on beating Hearts.... it shows in the attendances at derbies vs our other games, full houses attended by fans just looking for a day out on the bevvy with some fighting thrown in for 'fun'.

For what its worth i think we have built a very good squad so far this summer, but i dont see us being an overnight sensation, give us the few months that Johnson has said and i think once gelled the team will be one of the top teams in the league.... BUT if the vocal minority are listened to should we fail to beat Hearts on game day 2 then it'll be a slippery slope for Johnson and the squad this season.

Bigger picture is to build a squad that finishes top 3/4 and challenges for the cups every year, thus making the players less likely to move on unless the prospect is hard to ignore. Consistency is the way forward.

I’ll support the manager & players whoever they may be. I’m “hoping” his signings are quality, but so far, I’ve seen nothing to get excited about. McGeady is a proven quality player if he’s still got the legs at 36, but every other signings a gamble.
What makes you think it’s a quality squad?

[BlackSheep]

I’ll support the manager & players whoever they may be. I’m “hoping” his signings are quality, but so far, I’ve seen nothing to get excited about. McGeady is a proven quality player if he’s still got the legs at 36, but every other signings a gamble.
What makes you think it’s a quality squad?

I see a lot of potential in our squad this season so far, what's missing in my eyes are the relationships players build by playing together week in and week out.

The new signings and the younger lads coming through have all shown periods of confident play and effectiveness in their roles, but in most games i have seen a lot of miscommunication and lack of experience playing together that comes with such a big overhaul to the team.

I think LJ knows who he wants as his first 11 and once we have everyone available i see our first team and bench being very strong.

As a lot of folk have said we are one or two signings away from a team that fits LJ's proposed way of playing.

For me I would love if we signed someone like Graeme Shinnie or his mould of player for the team, experience and drive in the middle of the park, i think he would complete the picture.

All of this harks back to my call to the fans for patience, once it clicks i think we will be a force again.

[munchar]

I see a lot of potential in our squad this season so far, what's missing in my eyes are the relationships players build by playing together week in and week out.

The new signings and the younger lads coming through have all shown periods of confident play and effectiveness in their roles, but in most games i have seen a lot of miscommunication and lack of experience playing together that comes with such a big overhaul to the team.

I think LJ knows who he wants as his first 11 and once we have everyone available i see our first team and bench being very strong.

As a lot of folk have said we are one or two signings away from a team that fits LJ's proposed way of playing.

For me I would love if we signed someone like Graeme Shinnie or his mould of player for the team, experience and drive in the middle of the park, i think he would complete the picture.

All of this harks back to my call to the fans for patience, once it clicks i think we will be a force again.

But who do you see making an improvement? Midfield is still poor, defence still shaky, & don’t look dangerous up front. The league cup campaign was a disaster. No momentum going into league opener.Is there a starting 11 you could name that you’d be confident of us winning?

[worcesterhibby]

I see a lot of potential in our squad this season so far, what's missing in my eyes are the relationships players build by playing together week in and week out.

The new signings and the younger lads coming through have all shown periods of confident play and effectiveness in their roles, but in most games i have seen a lot of miscommunication and lack of experience playing together that comes with such a big overhaul to the team.

I think LJ knows who he wants as his first 11 and once we have everyone available i see our first team and bench being very strong.

As a lot of folk have said we are one or two signings away from a team that fits LJ's proposed way of playing.

For me I would love if we signed someone like Graeme Shinnie or his mould of player for the team, experience and drive in the middle of the park, i think he would complete the picture.

All of this harks back to my call to the fans for patience, once it clicks i think we will be a force again.

I agree and someone like Shinnie would be a very good addition. I understand his family have moved back to Scotland, so he is living down their on his todd, I think. He has also only featured as a 2nd half sub in Wigan's pre-season friendlies..85th minute in the last one, so doesn't seem to be a first choice pick for their manager right now.

[worcesterhibby]

But who do you see making an improvement? Midfield is still poor, defence still shaky, & don’t look dangerous up front. The league cup campaign was a disaster. No momentum going into league opener.Is there a starting 11 you could name that you’d be confident of us winning?

Goalie - Improved

Defence - Rocky has looked much more assured this season, Poto can only get better after a shaky start as we know there is a great player in there, Hanlon will be back soon and we are obviously in the process of signining another Centre back. Abra Abra Cabraja has an excellent pedigree so should slot in at left back and Lewis Miller has all the attributes to succeed.

Midfield - Hendo much improved on last season, Mcgeady adds experience and assists, young Kenneh signing means we have a defensive mid who can not only win the ball back, but also distribute it effectively, I'm confident he will be an upgrade once he's had a few games under his belt to adjust to the pace of the game up here. Both JDH and Newell are decent if not spectacular players, they are just not a good pairing, hopefully the new additions and Demetri Mitchell returning from injury mrans they won't be asked to play together again. Tavares is going to exite us going forward too.

Forwards - The manager has now had a very good chance to see what Doidge is capable of (win everything in the air..king of the sclaff) and once Melkerson get's more early balls in to him, he will score plenty. Bojang adds a huge amount of pace and energy and I am hugely confident that Youan is going to make a missive impact on Scottish football.

Add to all that some very, very good young players coming through such as Delfierre, Dylan Tait and Hauge and there is every reason to be both positive and excited to see how the team progresses once all the work permits are through and the team has a few matches together to bed in.

[BlackSheep]

Goalie - Improved

Defence - Rocky has looked much more assured this season, Poto can only get better after a shaky start as we know there is a great player in there, Hanlon will be back soon and we are obviously in the process of signining another Centre back. Abra Abra Cabraja has an excellent pedigree so should slot in at left back and Lewis Miller has all the attributes to succeed.

Midfield - Hendo much improved on last season, Mcgeady adds experience and assists, young Kenneh signing means we have a defensive mid who can not only win the ball back, but also distribute it effectively, I'm confident he will be an upgrade once he's had a few games under his belt to adjust to the pace of the game up here. Both JDH and Newell are decent if not spectacular players, they are just not a good pairing, hopefully the new additions and Demetri Mitchell returning from injury mrans they won't be asked to play together again. Tavares is going to exite us going forward too.

Forwards - The manager has now had a very good chance to see what Doidge is capable of (win everything in the air..king of the sclaff) and once Melkerson get's more early balls in to him, he will score plenty. Bojang adds a huge amount of pace and energy and I am hugely confident that Youan is going to make a missive impact on Scottish football.

Add to all that some very, very good young players coming through such as Delfierre, Dylan Tait and Hauge and there is every reason to be both positive and excited to see how the team progresses once all the work permits are through and the team has a few matches together to bed in.

All these points are where I am with the squad.

Add to that the younger players, especially those who shone on Sunday... Blaney and McIntyre look very good players and Hamilton looked lively at times too.

Not forgetting Allan Delferrière and Dylan Tait... both showed they are more than capable of playing for the first team.

If we add that additional CM we are all crying out for and then try and get a settled team i think we will be flying!

[Cuikyhibs]

Goalie - Improved

Defence - Rocky has looked much more assured this season, Poto can only get better after a shaky start as we know there is a great player in there, Hanlon will be back soon and we are obviously in the process of signining another Centre back. Abra Abra Cabraja has an excellent pedigree so should slot in at left back and Lewis Miller has all the attributes to succeed.

Midfield - Hendo much improved on last season, Mcgeady adds experience and assists, young Kenneh signing means we have a defensive mid who can not only win the ball back, but also distribute it effectively, I'm confident he will be an upgrade once he's had a few games under his belt to adjust to the pace of the game up here. Both JDH and Newell are decent if not spectacular players, they are just not a good pairing, hopefully the new additions and Demetri Mitchell returning from injury mrans they won't be asked to play together again. Tavares is going to exite us going forward too.

Forwards - The manager has now had a very good chance to see what Doidge is capable of (win everything in the air..king of the sclaff) and once Melkerson get's more early balls in to him, he will score plenty. Bojang adds a huge amount of pace and energy and I am hugely confident that Youan is going to make a missive impact on Scottish football.



Add to all that some very, very good young players coming through such as Delfierre, Dylan Tait and Hauge and there is every reason to be both positive and excited to see how the team progresses once all the work permits are through and the team has a few matches together to bed in.

exactly where i am at, think we will surprise a few people this season:agree:

[munchar]

Goalie - Improved

Defence - Rocky has looked much more assured this season, Poto can only get better after a shaky start as we know there is a great player in there, Hanlon will be back soon and we are obviously in the process of signining another Centre back. Abra Abra Cabraja has an excellent pedigree so should slot in at left back and Lewis Miller has all the attributes to succeed.

Midfield - Hendo much improved on last season, Mcgeady adds experience and assists, young Kenneh signing means we have a defensive mid who can not only win the ball back, but also distribute it effectively, I'm confident he will be an upgrade once he's had a few games under his belt to adjust to the pace of the game up here. Both JDH and Newell are decent if not spectacular players, they are just not a good pairing, hopefully the new additions and Demetri Mitchell returning from injury mrans they won't be asked to play together again. Tavares is going to exite us going forward too.

Forwards - The manager has now had a very good chance to see what Doidge is capable of (win everything in the air..king of the sclaff) and once Melkerson get's more early balls in to him, he will score plenty. Bojang adds a huge amount of pace and energy and I am hugely confident that Youan is going to make a missive impact on Scottish football.

Add to all that some very, very good young players coming through such as Delfierre, Dylan Tait and Hauge and there is every reason to be both positive and excited to see how the team progresses once all the work permits are through and the team has a few matches together to bed in.

All very positive points, but none of they signings are proven bar McGeady, & your mentioning players improving & coming back who have been poor for us. Results don’t lie. League cup performances brutal. So hard to see the positives going into Saints game. What would your starting 11 be to win the game?

[Smartie]

Goalie - Improved

Defence - Rocky has looked much more assured this season, Poto can only get better after a shaky start as we know there is a great player in there, Hanlon will be back soon and we are obviously in the process of signining another Centre back. Abra Abra Cabraja has an excellent pedigree so should slot in at left back and Lewis Miller has all the attributes to succeed.

Midfield - Hendo much improved on last season, Mcgeady adds experience and assists, young Kenneh signing means we have a defensive mid who can not only win the ball back, but also distribute it effectively, I'm confident he will be an upgrade once he's had a few games under his belt to adjust to the pace of the game up here. Both JDH and Newell are decent if not spectacular players, they are just not a good pairing, hopefully the new additions and Demetri Mitchell returning from injury mrans they won't be asked to play together again. Tavares is going to exite us going forward too.

Forwards - The manager has now had a very good chance to see what Doidge is capable of (win everything in the air..king of the sclaff) and once Melkerson get's more early balls in to him, he will score plenty. Bojang adds a huge amount of pace and energy and I am hugely confident that Youan is going to make a missive impact on Scottish football.

Add to all that some very, very good young players coming through such as Delfierre, Dylan Tait and Hauge and there is every reason to be both positive and excited to see how the team progresses once all the work permits are through and the team has a few matches together to bed in.

I'm inclined to agree with this, on paper.

Can't pretend not to be a little bit underwhelmed by what I've seen so far on grass (and whatever that crap is that Falkirk play on) though.

Early days and there's certainly plenty of cause for optimism if you want to look for it.

[Since452]

Goalie - Improved

Defence - Rocky has looked much more assured this season, Poto can only get better after a shaky start as we know there is a great player in there, Hanlon will be back soon and we are obviously in the process of signining another Centre back. Abra Abra Cabraja has an excellent pedigree so should slot in at left back and Lewis Miller has all the attributes to succeed.

Midfield - Hendo much improved on last season, Mcgeady adds experience and assists, young Kenneh signing means we have a defensive mid who can not only win the ball back, but also distribute it effectively, I'm confident he will be an upgrade once he's had a few games under his belt to adjust to the pace of the game up here. Both JDH and Newell are decent if not spectacular players, they are just not a good pairing, hopefully the new additions and Demetri Mitchell returning from injury mrans they won't be asked to play together again. Tavares is going to exite us going forward too.

Forwards - The manager has now had a very good chance to see what Doidge is capable of (win everything in the air..king of the sclaff) and once Melkerson get's more early balls in to him, he will score plenty. Bojang adds a huge amount of pace and energy and I am hugely confident that Youan is going to make a missive impact on Scottish football.

Add to all that some very, very good young players coming through such as Delfierre, Dylan Tait and Hauge and there is every reason to be both positive and excited to see how the team progresses once all the work permits are through and the team has a few matches together to bed in.

Pretty much sums up my view. We also have the added bonus of Magennis and Nisbet to come back in. I'm quite excited about this season and really looking forwrd to Perth on Saturday.

[Dashing Bob S]

I’d feel okay about 4th unless we were miles behind the Jambos. 5th would only be acceptable if the performances were exciting. Anything lower would be disappointing.

We should be challenging strongly for 3rd.