[NHC] Neanderthal Football Journalists

[Colr]

Kind of demonstrating what we knew already.

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2022/may/09/scottish-football-writers-association-sorry-sexist-jokes-prompt-walk-out

Well done, those women that walked out. I hope a few men did in support!

[JimBHibees]

Kind of demonstrating what we knew already.

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2022/may/09/scottish-football-writers-association-sorry-sexist-jokes-prompt-walk-out

Well done, those women that walked out. I hope a few men did in support!

They should be saying who the speaker was cracking these supposed jokes and who was comparing the event. Absolutely Neanderthal behaviour reflecting pretty much how poor in general sports journalism is in this country with a few notable exceptions. Just smacks of a closed shop jobs for the boys culture. Nowhere near good enough. You would have thought after succulent lamb period that this should have been changed however normal service resumed no doubt.

[hibsbollah]

Quelle surprise. I wish women in Journalism Scotland would name names here. Who was the speaker and who were the hacks who were so amused to the point Barbour and colleagues walked out?

Whoever it was, they’ll just ‘learn from their mistakes’ like Malky Mackay Richard Keys Andy Gray and continue being absolute dicks in private and more careful what they say in public while their attitudes remain the same and folk that call it out get called snowflakes and do-Gooders on the internet. :aok:

[LaMotta]

Speaker was Bill Copeland, a former criminal defence lawyer turned "comedian".

http://speakersscotland.com/Bill_Copeland.html

[blackpoolhibs]

Quelle surprise. I wish women in Journalism Scotland would name names here. Who was the speaker and who were the hacks who were so amused to the point Barbour and colleagues walked out?

Whoever it was, they’ll just ‘learn from their mistakes’ like Malky Mackay Richard Keys Andy Gray and continue being absolute dicks in private and more careful what they say in public while their attitudes remain the same and folk that call it out get called snowflakes and do-Gooders on the internet. :aok:

Unless you know these people, how do you know this is the case? And as i suspect you dont know them, how can they ever repent, if your attitude and others wont change?

Guilty as charged, guilty forever.

[Radium]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220509/c7c387d4b32fd43e934ecccea2f680d0.png


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[Greenbeard]

Speaker was Bill Copeland, a former criminal defence lawyer turned "comedian".

http://speakersscotland.com/Bill_Copeland.html

“BILL COPELAND PUSHES BACK THE FRONTIERS OF COMEDY, REACHING INTO NEW AND HITHERTO UNDISCOVERED AREAS OF HUMOUR”.




This should maybe read "
“BILL COPELAND PUSHES BACK THE FRONTIERS OF COMEDY TO THE 60s AND 70s, REACHING BACK INTO LONG ABANDONED AREAS OF HUMOUR”.

[gbhibby]

“BILL COPELAND PUSHES BACK THE FRONTIERS OF COMEDY, REACHING INTO NEW AND HITHERTO UNDISCOVERED AREAS OF HUMOUR”.




This should maybe read "
“BILL COPELAND PUSHES BACK THE FRONTIERS OF COMEDY TO THE 60s AND 70s, REACHING BACK INTO LONG ABANDONED AREAS OF HUMOUR”.
He is a well known Bluenose. He would be with that name. Says it all doesn't it.

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[Brightside]

Kind of demonstrating what we knew already.

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2022/may/09/scottish-football-writers-association-sorry-sexist-jokes-prompt-walk-out

Well done, those women that walked out. I hope a few men did in support!

They just need to go on a course.

[Sioux]

Lowest of the low, most of them.

[hibsbollah]

Unless you know these people, how do you know this is the case? And as i suspect you dont know them, how can they ever repent, if your attitude and others wont change?

Guilty as charged, guilty forever.

I dont understand why being a Total Dick these days is somehow less bad than calling someone out for being a Total Dick. Sounds like an excuse to give folk a free pass to continue being a Total Dick to me.

[Yorkshire HFC]

This is why I haven't been to a sportsmans dinner for 20 years. Seems things in Scotland still haven't changed.

[blackpoolhibs]

I dont understand why being a Total Dick these days is somehow less bad than calling someone out for being a Total Dick. Sounds like an excuse to give folk a free pass to continue being a Total Dick to me.

He did act like a total dick, but surely everyone deserves a 2nd chance, especially if they seek help and change?

If he's never to be forgiven, what is the point in him even trying?

[Hibernia&Alba]

This is why I haven't been to a sportsmans dinner for 20 years. Seems things in Scotland still haven't changed.

It all sounds very 1970s. I can just picture obese middle aged men, bursting out of their tuxedos as they swig brandy and smoke huge cigars, guffawing over some Bernard Manning type speaker.

[LewysGot2]

Seems the sexist stuff was followed up by racist stuff and at that point a number of folk walked out. Now given Eilidh Barbour's partner is Marvin Bartley and he was there with her, it's not a surprise.

The usual dinosaurs are defending it but the 1970s are calling them. Scotland likes to present itself as progressive but the reality is that exceptionalism will be no more than a window dressing and a political soundbite as long as sectarianism remains unchallenged and other bigotry goes unchallenged. The Ugly Sisters, Malky McKaygate, Hugh Dallas emails about the Pope... all indicative of a culture that excuses hate as banter.

Eilidh is an excellent broadcaster with a solid knowledge of more than one sport, grew up playing/going to football and playing golf. She's got the potential to be up there with the excellent Hazel Irvine in due course, who is undoubtedly a national treasure. Its brave of her to put a target on her own back by speaking out but it needs done. Football isn't to blame for society's problems but it sure as hell reflects them. Sadly, the neanderthals are trolling and giving her grief today for daring to have the temerity to stand up to the ignorant old boys ludge...

[Hibernia&Alba]

Seems the sexist stuff was followed up by racist stuff and at that point a number of folk walked out. Now given Eilidh Barbour's partner is Marvin Bartley and he was there with her, it's not a surprise.

The usual dinosaurs are defending it but the 1970s are calling them. Scotland likes to present itself as progressive but the reality is that exceptionalism will be no more than a window dressing and a political soundbite as long as sectarianism remains unchallenged and other bigotry goes unchallenged. The Ugly Sisters, Malky McKaygate, Hugh Dallas emails about the Pope... all indicative of a culture that excuses hate as banter.

Eilidh is an excellent broadcaster with a solid knowledge of more than one sport, grew up playing/going to football and playing golf. She's got the potential to be up there with the excellent Hazel Irvine in due course, who is undoubtedly a national treasure. Its brave of her to put a target on her own back by speaking out but it needs done. Football isn't to blame for society's problems but it sure as hell reflects them. Sadly, the neanderthals are trolling and giving her grief today for daring to have the temerity to stand up to the ignorant old boys ludge...


True, and she's a stoater.*


*Hangs head in shame and leaves the thread, feeling like a sexist bassa :greengrin

[stuart-farquhar]

He did act like a total dick, but surely everyone deserves a 2nd chance, especially if they seek help and change?

If he's never to be forgiven, what is the point in him even trying?

How do you get the measure of these dicks? Is there a scale from "bit of a" to total? Who decides. And in inches or centimetres.

[gbhibby]

How do you get the measure of these dicks? Is there a scale from "bit of a" to total? Who decides. And in inches or centimetres.
Nah complete and utter is the only measurement.

[blackpoolhibs]

How do you get the measure of these dicks? Is there a scale from "bit of a" to total? Who decides. And in inches or centimetres.

Who knows?

[Since452]

Dinosaurs.

[ekhibee]

Seems the sexist stuff was followed up by racist stuff and at that point a number of folk walked out. Now given Eilidh Barbour's partner is Marvin Bartley and he was there with her, it's not a surprise.

The usual dinosaurs are defending it but the 1970s are calling them. Scotland likes to present itself as progressive but the reality is that exceptionalism will be no more than a window dressing and a political soundbite as long as sectarianism remains unchallenged and other bigotry goes unchallenged. The Ugly Sisters, Malky McKaygate, Hugh Dallas emails about the Pope... all indicative of a culture that excuses hate as banter.

Eilidh is an excellent broadcaster with a solid knowledge of more than one sport, grew up playing/going to football and playing golf. She's got the potential to be up there with the excellent Hazel Irvine in due course, who is undoubtedly a national treasure. Its brave of her to put a target on her own back by speaking out but it needs done. Football isn't to blame for society's problems but it sure as hell reflects them. Sadly, the neanderthals are trolling and giving her grief today for daring to have the temerity to stand up to the ignorant old boys ludge...

Eilidh Barbour is an excellent presenter, and IMO far better than Hazel Irvine. Everything else you said is very true indeed sadly.

[Radium]

Copeland, a former lawyer and professional after dinner speaker, is understood to have used sexist and homophobic language. He also used racially insensitive language when referring to Celtic’s Asian footballers.

https://www.teamtalk.com/news/scottish-football-writers-association-issue-apology-bill-copeland-ceremony-remarks

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220509/c361d049b0392c2b2dfb7172da5538d1.png


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[WeeRussell]

Has anyone heard any examples of what the ‘jokes’/remarks were that caused the walk-out?

*edit - just seen post immediately above

[Scotty Leither]

This is why I haven't been to a sportsmans dinner for 20 years. Seems things in Scotland still haven't changed.

Last one I was at was at a bowling club about 6/7 years ago where Chic "Hehehe" Young was the main speaker and he was crap, compounded by the fee the organiser told me he was getting which was eye-watering.

I've not been to one since and I've no desire to go to another one, either. Same lame patter and tired, cliched *****.

Suppose all of us thinking like this must be "woke" though, eh?

[LaMotta]

True, and she's a stoater.*


*Hangs head in shame and leaves the thread, feeling like a sexist bassa :greengrin

She is also dating Marvin Bartley so you don't stand a chance :greengrin

[Hibernia&Alba]

She is also dating Marvin Bartley so you don't stand a chance :greengrin

True :greengrin

[Lendo]

If anyone is looking for some real comedy go and check out the Kickback thread on this. Especially these two gems.

25840

Then a short 12 minutes later.

25841

[MGmick]

There's a dinner planned for two players from my local Highland League club. Guest speakers are Colin Hendrie and Donald Finlay. I'm giving it a miss.

[Alfred E Newman]

I suppose it’s inevitable that jokes will eventually be outlawed in this wonderful modern society where nobody is offended by anything.
I’m glad I’m on the way oot.

[heretoday]

The guy probably thought he was going to be addressing a roomful of drunken hacks like the old days.

[Coco Bryce]

I remember being at a Hibs fans smoker years ago. Some failed comedian from the West got up and starting with the sexist/racist jokes only to be informed by many in the venue that Farid El Alagui was also present at the top table just along from said racist. He shat himself and apologised profusely.

[Vault Boy]

I suppose it’s inevitable that jokes will eventually be outlawed in this wonderful modern society where nobody is offended by anything.
I’m glad I’m on the way oot.

That's right! I'm so sick of this snowflake generation, showing a little resistance to unfunny, discriminatory humour that punches down. Just force an uncomfortable fake laugh and sit there miserable, like the good old days.

[TAHibby]

I suppose it’s inevitable that jokes will eventually be outlawed in this wonderful modern society where nobody is offended by anything.
I’m glad I’m on the way oot.

I miss the good old days when you could call someone a p**f. Now that's been taken away, there's just nothing left apart from knock knock jokes. Wokeness gone mad I tells ya

[Coco Bryce]

P**f is making a comback in a different form now though thankfully.

My daughter and her pals call each other it for some strange reason? Seemingly it means if you don't want to do something or go somewhere you're one.

Just about choked when I first heard her say it 😂

[stuart-farquhar]

That's right! I'm so sick of this snowflake generation, showing a little resistance to unfunny, discriminatory humour that punches down. Just force an uncomfortable fake laugh and sit there miserable, like the good old days.

Is that what we did!?. Wow never noticed. Some folks just know all the ****!

[Paulie Walnuts]

If anyone is looking for some real comedy go and check out the Kickback thread on this. Especially these two gems.

25840

Then a short 12 minutes later.

25841

To be fair there’s a good few posts on here where folk have said similar, maybe just not so blatantly.

‘We’ve aw sent racist jokes and said racist things in private WhatsApp groups but I’m no racist’ or words to those effect have been posted on here god knows how many times since Malky Mackay has been linked to the Hibs job.

For the avoidance of doubt to anyone who thinks they’re not racist despite their love of delivering ‘hilarious’ racist jokes in private WhatsApp groups with their pals - that absolutely is racist and you are a racist.

[The dalmeny]

I suppose it’s inevitable that jokes will eventually be outlawed in this wonderful modern society where nobody is offended by anything.
I’m glad I’m on the way oot.

Plenty good humour out there that isn't at folks expense

[LaMotta]

P**f is making a comback in a different form now though thankfully.

My daughter and her pals call each other it for some strange reason? Seemingly it means if you don't want to do something or go somewhere you're one.

Just about choked when I first heard her say it 😂

Yeah but when used in that way it is still linked to the original meaning of the word.

[Coco Bryce]

Yeah but when used in that way it is still linked to the original meaning of the word.

Hmmm not really. It was originally a derogatory word for a homosexual. Pretty sure my daughter and her pals ain't one of them 😉

[LaMotta]

Hmmm not really. It was originally a derogatory word for a homosexual. Pretty sure my daughter and her parts ain't one of them ��

Yes it did - so when they are saying to someone if you don't want to do something or go somewhere and then calling them that name, its because they are linking it to all the derogatory negative ( and totally unfair) connotations that was associated with said people.

I'm sure they might not be aware of that, but that's what it means.

[stuart-farquhar]

Yeah but when used in that way it is still linked to the original meaning of the word.

Which was? Or shall I enlighten you having worked for years with men in theatre and film industry who were homosexual.

[Hibernia&Alba]

There's a dinner planned for two players from my local Highland League club. Guest speakers are Colin Hendrie and Donald Finlay. I'm giving it a miss.

A proper sash bash. Are tickets still available? :greengrin

[LaMotta]

Which was? Or shall I enlighten you having worked for years with men in theatre and film industry who were homosexual.

Well the most common use of it for decades was the abuse and disparagement of a gay man.

What enlightenment other than that do you have?

[Pretty Boy]

Humour is just so much better when it punches up the way. It generally requires a bit more nuance.

Banal observations about people who have different genitalia, skin tone or sexual preferences are just a bit 70s. I'm not particularly offended by them personally but it's hardly original. There's a reason increasing numbers of people don't want to hear it anymore.

[ancient hibee]

Well the most common use of it for decades was the abuse and disparagement of a gay man.

What enlightenment other than that do you have?

Well in those decades nobody had adopted “gay” to mean homosexual or lesbian for that matter.

[stuart-farquhar]

Well the most common use of it for decades was the abuse and disparagement of a gay man.

What enlightenment other than that do you have?

That you clearly have no idea. Have never had gay friends or lived as a gay man or understand the nuances of that community. Or the fact the the word poof is not derogatory in that community amongst particularly the older age group and etc etc etc. Just give it up. We don't need patronising ok!

[MGmick]

A proper sash bash. Are tickets still available? :greengrin

Loads I hope.

[LaMotta]

That you clearly have no idea. Have never had gay friends or lived as a gay man or understand the nuances of that community. Or the fact the the word poof is not derogatory in that community amongst particularly the older age group and etc etc etc. Just give it up. We don't need patronising ok!

No your right I have never lived as a gay man. So what :hilarious

The word may be a playful affectionate term used by gay people to describe other gay people. But its more common and everyday use over the years is as a derogatory homophobic slur by people who aren't gay. There is no doubt about that and the dictionary would agree - https://www.collinsdictionary.com/dictionary/english/poof

[LaMotta]

Well in those decades nobody had adopted “gay” to mean homosexual or lesbian for that matter.

Its been used for over 70 years as slang for homosexual.

[Jones28]

If anyone is looking for some real comedy go and check out the Kickback thread on this. Especially these two gems.

25840

Then a short 12 minutes later.

25841

The Mackay thread has seen similar comments.

[ancient hibee]

Its been used for over 70 years as slang for homosexual.

Really. Never heard it in my younger days.

[LaMotta]

Really. Never heard it in my younger days.

Was in the dictionary as early as 1951, but had been used in underground speak for up to 3 decades before that apparently.

[LewysGot2]

Its been used for over 70 years as slang for homosexual.

Yup. Can remember as a kid Larry Grayson’s catch phrase double entendre was “what a gay day!”

Another expression used by teens is “that’s soooo gay!” When they don’t approve of something.

[stuart-farquhar]

No your right I have never lived as a gay man. So what :hilarious

The word may be a playful affectionate term used by gay people to describe other gay people. But its more common and everyday use over the years is as a derogatory homophobic slur by people who aren't gay. There is no doubt about that and the dictionary would agree - https://www.collinsdictionary.com/dictionary/english/poof

I'm confused by why you want to make it an issue. It's really simple. Just don't care. We don't. Got it!

[LaMotta]

I'm confused by why you want to make it an issue. It's really simple. Just don't care. We don't. Got it!

What are you on about? The only one with an issue on this thread appears to be you.

[stuart-farquhar]

What are you on about? The only one with an issue on this thread appears to be you.

Are you trolling or just determined to try and have the last word. You're not looking good my non friend. Not looking good at all.

[LaMotta]

Are you trolling or just determined to try and have the last word. You're not looking good my non friend. Not looking good at all.

This thread was full of people generally having a fairly polite and interesting discussion until you turned up.

It's like you are spoiling for an argument for no particular reason other than you are either gay or have some friends that are gay. You are not making much sense.

[WestCoastHibby]

This is why I haven't been to a sportsmans dinner for 20 years. Seems things in Scotland still haven't changed.

I was just saying this today, I’ve competed in several team and individual sports but have I ever been to one of these functions?
No, I’d rather pour sand in my eyes. Jurassic period

[WestCoastHibby]

It all sounds very 1970s. I can just picture obese middle aged men, bursting out of their tuxedos as they swig brandy and smoke huge cigars, guffawing over some Bernard Manning type speaker.

Bernard Manning tbf was occasionally funny. The Copeland guy looks as funny as piles

[Hibernia&Alba]

Bernard Manning tbf was occasionally funny. The Copeland guy looks as funny as piles

I think it was Stephen Fry who once said Manning had the best comic timing he'd ever seen. Not someone you'd imagine as a fan of big Bernard. His material was often in very poor taste, but he was a master of telling a joke or story.

[sunshinejim]

This thread was full of people generally having a fairly polite and interesting discussion until you turned up.

It's like you are spoiling for an argument for no particular reason other than you are either gay or have some friends that are gay. You are not making much sense.

This thread is horrendous. Even the word 'gay' is appalling. Same sex people/folk are just that - people and folk, same as any other sexual orientation. About time we treated everyone with equal respect and understanding. Live and let live.

[LaMotta]

This thread is horrendous. Even the word 'gay' is appalling. Same sex people/folk are just that - people and folk, same as any other sexual orientation. About time we treated everyone with equal respect and understanding. Live and let live.

The word gay is not appalling and nobody on this thread had treated anyone without equal respect and understanding.

This place is mad at times.

[Paulie Walnuts]

They just need to go on a course.

:agree:

That should fix their deep rooted racial/sexist issues.

As long as they get 70% on the multiple choice quiz at the end they’ll be magically cured.

[Shrekko]

:agree:

That should fix their deep rooted racial/sexist issues.

As long as they get 70% on the multiple choice quiz at the end they’ll be magically cured.

Can I respectfully ask what the answer is?

When I see a rep from an anti-racism group on tv they’ll normally talk about education being the key … yet you and others are implying that won’t work. In fact you’re mocking the idea.

What will work?

[hibby rae]

Can I respectfully ask what the answer is?

When I see a rep from an anti-racism group on tv they’ll normally talk about education being the key … yet you and others are implying that won’t work. In fact you’re mocking the idea.

What will work?

Just a guess but I don't think they are mocking a genuine commitment from people to learn from mistakes, show genuine contrition etc.

But perhaps mocking someone like Malky Mackay who gave a non-apology after the event by saying 'I've been on a course now so probably know more about it than most, so people need to move on'

[Shrekko]

Just a guess but I don't think they are mocking a genuine commitment from people to learn from mistakes, show genuine contrition etc.

But perhaps mocking someone like Malky Mackay who gave a non-apology after the event by saying 'I've been on a course now so probably know more about it than most, so people need to move on'

So kind of a sanctimonious judgemental opinion on something you can’t really assess unless you know the person really well or have spoken to the people who did the training sort of thing?

[Scotty Leither]

Can I respectfully ask what the answer is?

When I see a rep from an anti-racism group on tv they’ll normally talk about education being the key … yet you and others are implying that won’t work. In fact you’re mocking the idea.

What will work?

I don't think there is any "answer", that's the sad thing.

Slightly off-topic, but I used to work for one of the banks, and as part of my job I had to go and work in the Glasgow office one week in four.

The staff were generally fine, and there was some harmless banter exchanged about the Edinburgh/Glasgow divide (even though I tried to explain that I wasn't actually "from" Edinburgh, and classed myself as a Leither, but that seemed a bit too nuanced for them).

The subject of football allegiance was a different matter though; as once on a night out, one of the female managers (who supported a team in blue and who was slightly worse for wear) asked me why I supported Hibs, as according to her, I had "a right Proddy name".

Amused and bemused in equal measure, I answered "wait until I tell you what school I went to", which she didn't seem able to compute why I had said that.

I pissed off to catch the train shortly afterwards, but it highlights just how deep-rooted this ***** is, along with the casual racism and sexism that's becoming too prevalent again; stoked by twats like Piers Morgan, Farage, and co.

If you call it out, you're part of "wokeism" or some such guff, and it's depressing.

[Pretty Boy]

Just a guess but I don't think they are mocking a genuine commitment from people to learn from mistakes, show genuine contrition etc.

But perhaps mocking someone like Malky Mackay who gave a non-apology after the event by saying 'I've been on a course now so probably know more about it than most, so people need to move on'

Surely if groups like Kick It Out and Show Racism the Red Card are satisfied with the efforts Mackay made then it suggests genuine contrition and a desire to change on his part?

I'm aware of the imperfect nature of both of those organisations but when Mackay was appointed to his role with the SFA both praised the efforts he had made and stated a belief he was fit for the role.

I have no idea if Mackay is a rabid racist, sexist, antisemitic homophobe who only underwent training to tick a box but nor does anyone else really. Taken at face value he has made an effort and sought to change. Whether that was only because he was caught is largely irrelevant if the outcome is positive. If anti racism organisations are satisfied with his efforts then I see no reason why I shouldn't be.

I'm not really sure why the fact he went on courses and underwent training is the source of such amusement either. I'm not entirely sure what the alternative is? I daresay it's a pretty effective way for someone to learn about the impact of their actions.

[AltheHibby]

P**f is making a comback in a different form now though thankfully.

My daughter and her pals call each other it for some strange reason? Seemingly it means if you don't want to do something or go somewhere you're one.

Just about choked when I first heard her say it 😂

I seem to recall that the word is also used in (American) cartoons when something disappears. Maybe that's where it comes from?

[Coco Bryce]

I seem to recall that the word is also used in (American) cartoons when something disappears. Maybe that's where it comes from?

Could be that. I blame the Disney Channel :greengrin

[Brightside]

I'm not aware of any of my kids or their friends calling people poofs. It just wouldnt happen. I'd massively question any kids saying its OK slang now.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Surely if groups like Kick It Out and Show Racism the Red Card are satisfied with the efforts Mackay made then it suggests genuine contrition and a desire to change on his part?

I'm aware of the imperfect nature of both of those organisations but when Mackay was appointed to his role with the SFA both praised the efforts he had made and stated a belief he was fit for the role.

I have no idea if Mackay is a rabid racist, sexist, antisemitic homophobe who only underwent training to tick a box but nor does anyone else really. Taken at face value he has made an effort and sought to change. Whether that was only because he was caught is largely irrelevant if the outcome is positive. If anti racism organisations are satisfied with his efforts then I see no reason why I shouldn't be.

I'm not really sure why the fact he went on courses and underwent training is the source of such amusement either. I'm not entirely sure what the alternative is? I daresay it's a pretty effective way for someone to learn about the impact of their actions.

It’s not the fact he went on the course is the source of amusement. It’s the idea that he done the course and now he simply must be a reformed man and we must all accept him as manager of our football club if he gets the job as people have suggested.

We’ve all done diversity courses at work and the like. You can click your way through to the quiz at the end and pass these sort of courses with nothing but a bit common sense.

Actions such as Mackays come with consequences and imo one of those consequences should be that you never become employed as manager of Hibernian Football Club even if you’ve said sorry and done a course much the same as I would never want a sex offender or the like to be employed by Hibernian, even if they apologised.

[oldbutdim]

I'm not aware of any of my kids or their friends calling people poofs. It just wouldnt happen. I'd massively question any kids saying its OK slang now.

What about "4Poofs and a Piano" who featured on Jonathan Ross for years?

Jonathan Woss seemed to get away with lots of homo type jokes, although maybe not homophobic.
Not sure how long ago that was - 10 years maybe?

Or whether they are still on the go.

[McHibby]

I suppose it’s inevitable that jokes will eventually be outlawed in this wonderful modern society where nobody is offended by anything.
I’m glad I’m on the way oot.

Aw c'mon. *Everyone* should be offended by racism. It's a criminal offence for a reason.

[Shrekko]

It’s not the fact he went on the course is the source of amusement. It’s the idea that he done the course and now he simply must be a reformed man and we must all accept him as manager of our football club if he gets the job as people have suggested.



Pretty Boy has already said that we have the assurance of the anti-racism groups that he has bought into their education, which is at least something of substance. Whereas all you have is your own judgement based on.... absolutely zero and your own intolerance.

[hibsbollah]

Pretty Boy has already said that we have the assurance of the anti-racism groups that he has bought into their education, which is at least something of substance. Whereas all you have is your own judgement based on.... absolutely zero and your own intolerance.

He doesn’t like Mackay because of the disgusting things he said, and those things make me 100% sure I also don’t him as ‘my’ manager either. Rehabilitation is a complex issue, good luck to him on becoming a better person, but yet again this thread is morphing into ‘you are more intolerant than the racist bully because you’re not willing to unconditionally believe he’s changed because he says he has’, which is of course a stupid argument to make.

[Shrekko]

He doesn’t like Mackay because of the disgusting things he said, and those things make me 100% sure I also don’t him as ‘my’ manager either. Rehabilitation is a complex issue, good luck to him on becoming a better person, but yet again this thread is morphing into ‘you are more intolerant than the racist bully because you’re not willing to unconditionally believe he’s changed because he says he has’, which is of course a stupid argument to make.

Absolutely not saying he's more intolerant than a racist bully.

Can there never EVER be any middle ground? You're either completely "woke" or a total "dinosaur". There is room for a bit of inbetween surely?

[hibee1875]

I don’t get the whole dinosaurs, or feels like the 60s/70s type of chatter.

These “jokes” and comments have never been acceptable. People just feel more empowered now to call them out than they would have in the past.

They’re not dinosaurs, they just are and always have been arse holes

[Paulie Walnuts]

Pretty Boy has already said that we have the assurance of the anti-racism groups that he has bought into their education, which is at least something of substance. Whereas all you have is your own judgement based on.... absolutely zero and your own intolerance.

What about the other groups? Have we had assurances from anti-sectarian, anti sexist and LGBTQ+ groups that he’s a reformed man?

I would also point out that my intolerance only extends to him being manager of Hibernian FC. If other clubs want to give him a chance then crack on, I’m not advocating for him to be banished from society but I certainly don’t want him being the figurehead of my club which is supposed to be open to anyone regardless of race, gender, religion or sexual orientation.

Also, on your last point, I’ll make no apology for being intolerant of racism, bigotry, sexism or homophobia and seeing people who are intolerant of such being held up as the ones who are the issue is a sad indictment of how far society still has to go to address these issues and how these issues aren’t treated nearly as seriously as they should be. People are even comparing his comments to jokes they’ve told ffs.

[hibsbollah]

Absolutely not saying he's more intolerant than a racist bully.

Can there never EVER be any middle ground? You're either completely "woke" or a total "dinosaur". There is room for a bit of inbetween surely?

That would be an ecumenical matter.

Best ask Gary Mackay. He managed to go from belting out monkey noises in Russell Latapys face to penning To Kill a Mockingbird Part Two or getting a Mandela tattoo or whatever it is he’s up to now. He’s managed a career out of his reformist zeal so good luck to him.

[JimBHibees]

That would be an ecumenical matter.

Best ask Gary Mackay. He managed to go from belting out monkey noises in Russell Latapys face to penning To Kill a Mockingbird Part Two or getting a Mandela tattoo or whatever it is he’s up to now. He’s managed a career out of his reformist zeal so good luck to him.

Kevin Harper not Russell

[hibby rae]

So kind of a sanctimonious judgemental opinion on something you can’t really assess unless you know the person really well or have spoken to the people who did the training sort of thing?

No, you misunderstand what I was saying.

My point was he finally comments on what he did, he responds in a very arrogant manner and doesn't show contrition for what he said repeatedly. He instead acts like he's suddenly the authority on it all.

[hibby rae]

It’s not the fact he went on the course is the source of amusement. It’s the idea that he done the course and now he simply must be a reformed man and we must all accept him as manager of our football club if he gets the job as people have suggested.

We’ve all done diversity courses at work and the like. You can click your way through to the quiz at the end and pass these sort of courses with nothing but a bit common sense.

Actions such as Mackays come with consequences and imo one of those consequences should be that you never become employed as manager of Hibernian Football Club even if you’ve said sorry and done a course much the same as I would never want a sex offender or the like to be employed by Hibernian, even if they apologised.

Yep, agree with that.

And beside anything else, he just strikes me as a massive bell end and I'd prefer our managers to not be.

[basehibby]

P**f is making a comback in a different form now though thankfully.

My daughter and her pals call each other it for some strange reason? Seemingly it means if you don't want to do something or go somewhere you're one.

Just about choked when I first heard her say it 😂

I think there's just some words that are a bit onomatopoeic (spelling?) - and "poof" is one of them. It just sounds a bit soft like a wet blanket and that's probably what your girls have picked up on, and are throwing it about in much the same way as we used to as kids without much thought to underlying meanings. It doesn't sound like your girls even know the word's origins right now but I'm willing to bet it's not actually changed at all.

There are quite a few words out there like that which just sound comical - some of which have fallen out of favour on account of hurting people's feelings. On the whole this is a good thing and we should not get too hung up about embracing these changes OR by crucifying people for isolated slip ups But there are certain people who really should know better - such as the "cream" of Scottish sporting journalistm for example :greengrin

[Coco Bryce]

I think there's just some words that are a bit onomatopoeic (spelling?) - and "poof" is one of them. It just sounds a bit soft like a wet blanket and that's probably what your girls have picked up on, and are throwing it about in much the same way as we used to as kids without much thought to underlying meanings. It doesn't sound like your girls even know the word's origins right now but I'm willing to bet it's not actually changed at all.

There are quite a few words out there like that which just sound comical - some of which have fallen out of favour on account of hurting people's feelings. On the whole this is a good thing and we should not get too hung up about embracing these changes OR by crucifying people for isolated slip ups But there are certain people who really should know better - such as the "cream" of Scottish sporting journalistm for example :greengrin

They are 12/13 years old.

I have no idea where they got it from. Also not even on their radar regarding the 'gay' thing.

My parents still call their footstool a pouffes (sp) which sounds weird :greengrin

[Torto7]

Barbour is dating a guy who has a history of threatening females. Copeland is a 70s fossil. Which ones worse?

[ancient hibee]

I don't think there is any "answer", that's the sad thing.

Slightly off-topic, but I used to work for one of the banks, and as part of my job I had to go and work in the Glasgow office one week in four.

The staff were generally fine, and there was some harmless banter exchanged about the Edinburgh/Glasgow divide (even though I tried to explain that I wasn't actually "from" Edinburgh, and classed myself as a Leither, but that seemed a bit too nuanced for them).

The subject of football allegiance was a different matter though; as once on a night out, one of the female managers (who supported a team in blue and who was slightly worse for wear) asked me why I supported Hibs, as according to her, I had "a right Proddy name".

Amused and bemused in equal measure, I answered "wait until I tell you what school I went to", which she didn't seem able to compute why I had said that.

I pissed off to catch the train shortly afterwards, but it highlights just how deep-rooted this ***** is, along with the casual racism and sexism that's becoming too prevalent again; stoked by twats like Piers Morgan, Farage, and co.




If you call it out, you're part of "wokeism" or some such guff, and it's depressing.


Of course the old joke was that in Glasgow they asked your school to find out your religion while in Edinburgh it was to check if you were a fee payer.

[basehibby]

They are 12/13 years old.

I have no idea where they got it from. Also not even on their radar regarding the 'gay' thing.

My parents still call their footstool a pouffes (sp) which sounds weird :greengrin

I reckon "pouffe" is probably where the term "poof" originated - popularised because of it's soft and faintly comical overtones. I also reckon I missed my calling and am now looking up post grad opportunities on the Etymology of Insults :greengrin

Joking aside though - that your girls are 12/13 years old puts the whole thing in context, exposing the Scottish Sports Journalism establishment for the pathetic joke they actually are. The level of "humour" they deem fit for their showcase occasion barely passes muster as pre-teen banter on the social barrometer of 21st Century Scotland - where Football has long since been a multi-racial sport and now routinely features the woman's game with female presenters and analysts as part of the mainstream.

That the organisers of this event thought this a good idea goes to show how a rump of out of touch dinosaurs still dominates the reporting of football in Scotland - something that will come as no surprise to those more familiar with their output.

[hibsbollah]

Kevin Harper not Russell

Apologies, that’s correct :aok:

[Sylar]

I was invited to a sportsman's dinner last month - one of the speaker's was notorious Sevco referee, Bobby Tait, loudly giving it the pro-Rangers, pro-Orange jokes for the duration of his talk - guy before him was another fossil who just made sexist jokes the whole night (no racist stuff thankfully). Was I offended enough to walk out, no - did I laugh at anything, definitely not. But I fully support folk like Eilidh Barbour etc walking out of this event after hearing similar material - as Pretty Boy said earlier, it's about the direction your comedy punches, and punching down just isn't funny or acceptable.

Incidentally, I didn't realise she was dating Marv - for some reason I thought she was married to the BBC Sport journalist, Chris McLaughlin - was sure I'd read that somewhere a few years ago.

[Smartie]

The Viz Profanisaurus definition of “poof” was “a man who doesn’t want another pint”.

I found this pretty amusing but only in the sense that it mocks the liberal and careless use of homophobic terms between certain groups of males, rather than it actually being anything remotely homophobic.

The use of that word is probably the thing I’d personally have reflected upon changing most of the past quarter of a century. I’d use it everywhere and unpleasantly as a very young adult, wouldn’t dream of it today.

I don’t like MacKay’s comments at all. Neither do I like the idea of restricting other people’s opportunity to learn and change though. Improving the world becomes much more difficult when you take that away.

[Keith_M]

Seeing as this thread has turned a bit weird, are we allowed to mention Mr Humphreys from Are You Being Served?

[Paulie Walnuts]

The Viz Profanisaurus definition of “poof” was “a man who doesn’t want another pint”.

I found this pretty amusing but only in the sense that it mocks the liberal and careless use of homophobic terms between certain groups of males, rather than it actually being anything remotely homophobic.

The use of that word is probably the thing I’d personally have reflected upon changing most of the past quarter of a century. I’d use it everywhere and unpleasantly as a very young adult, wouldn’t dream of it today.

I don’t like MacKay’s comments at all. Neither do I like the idea of restricting other people’s opportunity to learn and change though. Improving the world becomes much more difficult when you take that away.

Nobody is suggesting he doesn’t get the opportunity to learn and change, nobody is suggesting he gets banished from society.

He’s done his course and had a job at the SFA and Ross County since. He’s had/got his opportunity to learn, change and carry on with his life and career.

People just don’t want him to be the figurehead at our club.