Scotland's census

[He's here!]

I see that one in four households have yet to complete this despite the census being due to close on 1st May. Why such a low take-up rate compared to last time round when I note the response rate was 94%?

As far as I'm aware the census acts as the basis for a wide range of national stats that guide government policy so I'd have assumed there would be a bit more urgency about picking up the pace.

I also note that you can be fined £1000 for not completing it, though it's hard to imagine the SG prosecuting more than 700,000 people.

[CropleyWasGod]

I see that one in four households have yet to complete this despite the census being due to close on 1st May. Why such a low take-up rate compared to last time round when I note the response rate was 94%?

As far as I'm aware the census acts as the basis for a wide range of national stats that guide government policy so I'd have assumed there would be a bit more urgency about picking up the pace.

I also note that you can be fined £1000 for not completing it, though it's hard to imagine the SG prosecuting more than 700,000 people.

Could replace the entire MacBrayne fleet with that money 😀

[Stairway 2 7]

Yeah it's a disaster. Going to be massively down from last time

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-61184663.amp

[Ryan91]

I see that one in four households have yet to complete this despite the census being due to close on 1st May. Why such a low take-up rate compared to last time round when I note the response rate was 94%?

As far as I'm aware the census acts as the basis for a wide range of national stats that guide government policy so I'd have assumed there would be a bit more urgency about picking up the pace.

I also note that you can be fined £1000 for not completing it, though it's hard to imagine the SG prosecuting more than 700,000 people.

AFAIK the Census is almost entirely digital - a sensible choice given the modern world in which we live IMO, but there will be some that don't have internet access or even a computer and be unable to complete it, I'd have to assume that Paper copies of the census can be provided to those who have no PC/Internet, but was it made clear to people that the option was available, I don't recall seeing anything like that in the letter that was received regarding accessing the census online.

I haven't seen it heavily publicised either, a letter through the door that most people might not even have noticed or paid much attention to seems to be all that was received, given the importance of the census for the provisioning of services, there should have been greater promotion.

I don't watch much TV, but would have though surely there should have been at least one TV ad put out there to encourage census completion. Haven't heard anything on the radio either or seen any advertising billboards reminding folks about the importance of the census.

[He's here!]

Wondering also if people are more wary of sharing data these days ie is there a 'snooper's charter' feel about it for some? Also recall there being friction among some women's groups re the ability to self identify re gender.

[Stairway 2 7]

https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/why-the-scottish-census-mistakes-matter

Spectator goes in as per.

I think it's been as advertised as it usually is. I've completed it but have had a couple of letters about it. The fine is probably to high, as no one obviously believes it. The Spectator says only 1 person prosecuted last time, so rightly don't believe it.

[Pretty Boy]

I just completed it right away. Took about 10 minutes for a 4 person household.

I get that some people will have reasons for not being able to do it but 25% of households seems really high. As far as I can see it has been well advertised and if people aren't aware it is happening then I'd be surprised.

[Moulin Yarns]

I don't know if the number of households not filled it in includes second homes. I have a neighbour who lives in Kinghorn but will be moving here permanently in July. They will have got 2 letters, one to each house but will they have to fill it in for both addresses?

[Stairway 2 7]

I don't know if the number of households not filled it in includes second homes. I have a neighbour who lives in Kinghorn but will be moving here permanently in July. They will have got 2 letters, one to each house but will they have to fill it in for both addresses?
It's the same metrics as last time so wont effect numbers much, there is definitely hundreds of thousands more that haven't filled it. I think the reasons in the spectator article will only count for a minimal number, that's people unhappy with self identification and snp mistrust. Surely being online only will affect quite few though

[McD]

I thought it was supposed to have been completed weeks ago :dunno:

[Stairway 2 7]

I thought it was supposed to have been completed weeks ago :dunno:

Finishes on Saturday I think but will be a huge number not done

[Jack]

I worked on previous census in Scotland.

This is the first time they've gone digital.

Previously they employed 1,000s to go round the doors, delivering the form and able to talk face to face with householders explaining the importance of completing it. These guys would keep on knocking at doors, persuading folk, until they got the completed form.

[Moulin Yarns]

I thought it was supposed to have been completed weeks ago :dunno:

75% of households have submitted their census forms, either online or in paper form. The 25% who haven't yet been submitted may not tell the full story, the census is sent out to all households, even empty ones. That might include the ever increasing Airbnb or people who may have died during the pandemic.

[Jack]

I don't know if the number of households not filled it in includes second homes. I have a neighbour who lives in Kinghorn but will be moving here permanently in July. They will have got 2 letters, one to each house but will they have to fill it in for both addresses?

My wife did ours this time round but I'll assume it's a similar format; information about the people resident there on the night and the other about the house.

Your neighbour would basically fill in the people and house bit for where they were on the night but only the house bit at his other address.

[Moulin Yarns]

Glasgow City and West Dumbarton have the lowest return rate.

[Stairway 2 7]

75% of households have submitted their census forms, either online or in paper form. The 25% who haven't yet been submitted may not tell the full story, the census is sent out to all households, even empty ones. That might include the ever increasing Airbnb or people who may have died during the pandemic.

It just hasn't went from 97% of houses being physically occupied to 75%. Population is over 200,000 bigger than last census. Unfortunately not that many homes have been built in that time, so should be a higher percentage

[Jack]

75% of households have submitted their census forms, either online or in paper form. The 25% who haven't yet been submitted may not tell the full story, the census is sent out to all households, even empty ones. That might include the ever increasing Airbnb or people who may have died during the pandemic.

If there were people staying in the Airbnb (or similar) even if they were not normally resident in Scotland they would need to complete the form. The owner would be responsible for the housey questions.

Likewise there would be someone responsible for those houses where the occupiers have passed away, even if its the lawyer dealing with the estate. That's where the folk going door to door was handy. They'd be able to ask neighbours and in certain circumstances complete the form for empty houses.

[Stairway 2 7]

My wife did ours this time round but I'll assume it's a similar format; information about the people resident there on the night and the other about the house.

Your neighbour would basically fill in the people and house bit for where they were on the night but only the house bit at his other address.

I had a boy at my door with an ipad last week saying I hadn't filled it in, although I assured him I had for my whole family

[Moulin Yarns]

It just hasn't went from 97% of houses being physically occupied to 75%. Population is over 200,000 bigger than last census. Unfortunately not that many homes have been built in that time, so should be a higher percentage

City of Edinburgh is over 76% Glasgow is 65.5% looks like the higher returns are all rural areas and the lowest are the large urban areas.

There are suggestions that the reticence is political, anti snp or anti snooping.

[Just Alf]

Pal who works for a rental agency says they've had loads of cases where the tenants have dropped off the census letters thinking they were for the Landlords.

[Stairway 2 7]

City of Edinburgh is over 76% Glasgow is 65.5% looks like the higher returns are all rural areas and the lowest are the large urban areas.

There are suggestions that the reticence is political, anti snp or anti snooping.

Last time Edinburgh was 91% Glasgow 89%. I think there is more anti snooping, control nonsense online nowadays. Facebook has a lot to answer for

[Moulin Yarns]

Making it easier to submit online also makes it easier to ignore or forget.

[greenlex]

75% of households have submitted their census forms, either online or in paper form. The 25% who haven't yet been submitted may not tell the full story, the census is sent out to all households, even empty ones. That might include the ever increasing Airbnb or people who may have died during the pandemic.

I was working last week on the post office returns of the letters. They come back with a sticker on it with the reason for non delivery. It ranges from address being non existent to addressee gone away and lots of other nonsense excuse in between.
The latter baffles me as they are addressed as “the householder”!!! I get the impression that there are some rockets employed by the post office. There were tens of thousands of them returned.

[He's here!]

The deadline in Scotland is to be extended by another month.

According to the report on the BBC the take-up rate in the rest of the UK was 97%.

[Stairway 2 7]

The deadline in Scotland is to be extended by another month.

According to the report on the BBC the take-up rate in the rest of the UK was 97%.

Must be outside reasons if the rest of the uk was that, as they have the same Airbnb problems ect.

[He's here!]

Must be outside reasons if the rest of the uk was that, as they have the same Airbnb problems ect.

Scotland apparently delayed its census by a year for reasons I'm unclear about. Covid-related issues maybe? Tho not sure how that would impact on an online form. Not sur if thstvhas had some impact on the differing uptake rates.

[Sir David Gray]

Scotland apparently delayed its census by a year for reasons I'm unclear about. Covid-related issues maybe? Tho not sure how that would impact on an online form. Not sur if thstvhas had some impact on the differing uptake rates.

It was moved due to Covid-19.

https://www.scotlandscensus.gov.uk/news-and-events/news-release-scotland-s-census-to-be-moved-to-march-2022/

[Glory Lurker]

The deadline in Scotland is to be extended by another month.

According to the report on the BBC the take-up rate in the rest of the UK was 97%.

God, we're useless at everything!

[ballengeich]

If you don't want to or can't complete the form on-line you have to write away for a paper document. I wonder how many would be completed if all those who haven't done a return were sent the document to complete plus a pre-paid envelope.

[Glory Lurker]

If you don't want to or can't complete the form on-line you have to write away for a paper document. I wonder how many would be completed if all those who haven't done a return were sent the document to complete plus a pre-paid envelope.

That’s a good idea. Looks like the jails are going to be bursting over the summer though :greengrin

[danhibees1875]

Scotland apparently delayed its census by a year for reasons I'm unclear about. Covid-related issues maybe? Tho not sure how that would impact on an online form. Not sur if thstvhas had some impact on the differing uptake rates.

Covid related reasons (not sure what exactly? Maybe "focus")

Maybe lost out on synergy of having a UK wide campaign about filling the census in. :dunno:

[Stairway 2 7]

Was the rest of the uk online only

[Sir David Gray]

Was the rest of the uk online only

The one in England and Wales wasn't online only but in most areas you had to request a paper copy if you wanted one.

However in some areas of England and Wales, where the take-up of the online option was expected to be low the initial contact was a paper questionnaire, delivered by post. These questionnaires also included a code to allow those who preferred to complete the census online to do so.

Nearly 89% responded online.

[Stairway 2 7]

The one in England and Wales wasn't online only but in most areas you had to request a paper copy if you wanted one.

However in some areas of England and Wales, where the take-up of the online option was expected to be low the initial contact was a paper questionnaire, delivered by post. These questionnaires also included a code to allow those who preferred to complete the census online to do so.

Nearly 89% responded online.

Thanks. So a much higher % responded online than have responded here.

[s.a.m]

I was working last week on the post office returns of the letters. They come back with a sticker on it with the reason for non delivery. It ranges from address being non existent to addressee gone away and lots of other nonsense excuse in between.
The latter baffles me as they are addressed as “the householder”!!! I get the impression that there are some rockets employed by the post office. There were tens of thousands of them returned.


Pal who works for a rental agency says they've had loads of cases where the tenants have dropped off the census letters thinking they were for the Landlords.



Maybe 'Householder' is a bit ambiguous? There's probably tenants who - either innocently or just can't be ****ed checking - assume that this has nothing to do with them. Something more imperative and specific might be better. Like, Persons Resident in this Property on night of ../../.... . And much more visible and worrying looking! :greengrin Luminescent yellow... skull and crossbones... picture of a tear-stained toddler behind bars, bedraggled teddy dangling from its fist.


I did see an advert at the cinema - assume it also played on TV - which is what reminded me to do it, but the whole campaign has felt quite low-key to me this time. In the past, there seemed to be weeks of warnings that somebody was going to knock your door with it, and you were legally obliged to comply.



Making it easier to submit online also makes it easier to ignore or forget.

My daughters' school moved most of their communication online, and a few months later the headteacher sent an email to say that, while they hoped this would make communication easier, replies to forms had plummeted and staff were now having to waste time pursuing parents to remind them. Despite being someone who's generally keen to cooperate and make life easier for people, I'd become one of them. If I couldn't see it lying on the kitchen work-top, I either forgot about or mentally filed it away for later, and forgot about it.

Does anyone know if 'households' which haven't answered are being targeted with paper copies now?

[Moulin Yarns]

Maybe 'Householder' is a bit ambiguous? There's probably tenants who - either innocently or just can't be ****ed checking - assume that this has nothing to do with them. Something more imperative and specific might be better. Like, Persons Resident in this Property on night of ../../.... . And much more visible and worrying looking! :greengrin Luminescent yellow... skull and crossbones... picture of a tear-stained toddler behind bars, bedraggled teddy dangling from its fist.


I did see an advert at the cinema - assume it also played on TV - which is what reminded me to do it, but the whole campaign has felt quite low-key to me this time. In the past, there seemed to be weeks of warnings that somebody was going to knock your door with it, and you were legally obliged to comply.




My daughters' school moved most of their communication online, and a few months later the headteacher sent an email to say that, while they hoped this would make communication easier, replies to forms had plummeted and staff were now having to waste time pursuing parents to remind them. Despite being someone who's generally keen to cooperate and make life easier for people, I'd become one of them. If I couldn't see it lying on the kitchen work-top, I either forgot about or mentally filed it away for later, and forgot about it.

Does anyone know if 'households' which haven't answered are being targeted with paper copies now?

Imagine what would have happened if king herod hadn't had a census where everyone had to return to their town of birth, Mary and Joseph wouldn't have met the wee Donkey and Jesus might not have been the messiah.

[Santa Cruz]

I watched a debate in Holyrood about the Census yesterday. The Minister (can't mind his name) said numerous adverts prior to the Census happened and listed the sources. Went on to provide a list of reminder type letters that have been issued. Someone raised it was a bit of a hindrance if someone wanted a paper copy they had to write to request it, maybe a telephone line to request one would have helped.

I've been an Enumerator in the past and out of about 400 houses I visited only 2 refused to return. Some people are a little para and view you as a DWP type Gov Official even when you explain you're not. If they happened to know me and were suspect about giving me their info I explained I could arrange for someone else to collect it. It was made really easy in the past giving people options they were comfortable with. Disability, older people who may get confused with form filling and people who English is not their first language found the process a bit more challenging. They were always going to have problems transitioning to digital (which I preferred), I would think the next one will make other options and assistance easier to access.

[weecounty hibby]

It seems to have been turned into a political issue. The majority of those I see on Twitter(I know!) saying they're not doing it are claiming it is SNP and not Scottish government. Talking about sending a message to the SNP by not filling it in.

[grunt]

It seems to have been turned into a political issue. The majority of those I see on Twitter(I know!) saying they're not doing it are claiming it is SNP and not Scottish government. Talking about sending a message to the SNP by not filling it in.
People can be so stupid sometimes.

[Glory Lurker]

It seems to have been turned into a political issue. The majority of those I see on Twitter(I know!) saying they're not doing it are claiming it is SNP and not Scottish government. Talking about sending a message to the SNP by not filling it in.

Would be lovely if they were each made to pay a grand for standing by their, er, convictions.

[Jack]

Would be lovely if they were each made to pay a grand for standing by their, er, convictions.
I'm pretty certain even if they do pay their fine they still have to fill out the form.

[Stairway 2 7]

I'd doubt 700,000 will get get a fine, seeing as last time tens of thousands never filled and 1 person got a fine

[heretoday]

I worked on previous census in Scotland.

This is the first time they've gone digital.

Previously they employed 1,000s to go round the doors, delivering the form and able to talk face to face with householders explaining the importance of completing it. These guys would keep on knocking at doors, persuading folk, until they got the completed form.

I was a "census enumerator" in 1981 around the Albert St/Leith Walk area. It was quite an eye-opener. I must have been in several folks' flats persuading them they had to fill in the forms. I had to go back and collect the completed forms and check them on the doorstep. I became quite a kenspeckle figure in the neighbourhood and even got a free ice cream at Politi's Ices which was in the street at that time. Happy days!

[lapsedhibee]

I became quite a kenspeckle figure in the neighbourhood and even got a free ice cream at Politi's

Never heard that. What a brilliant word! :thumbsup:

[Glory Lurker]

I'm pretty certain even if they do pay their fine they still have to fill out the form.

Even better!

[Glory Lurker]

I'd doubt 700,000 will get get a fine, seeing as last time tens of thousands never filled and 1 person got a fine

Aye, but this time we could rake in a £700 million war chest for indyref 2. Worth the effort, I'd say!

[LewysGot2]

The number of documents gone missing at Holyrood of late this is possibly just more of the same, no? 😂👀😉

[Jack]

I was a "census enumerator" in 1981 around the Albert St/Leith Walk area. It was quite an eye-opener. I must have been in several folks' flats persuading them they had to fill in the forms. I had to go back and collect the completed forms and check them on the doorstep. I became quite a kenspeckle figure in the neighbourhood and even got a free ice cream at Politi's Ices which was in the street at that time. Happy days!

Same year I was an enumerator in deepest darkest Gorgie! I swore for the money I was paid I'd get my own back. 10 years later I lead a team doing the processing through in Hillington by Glasgow Airport where all the Scottish and English forms were being processed. I made a small fortune on expenses and made lots of good friends, some I'm still in contact with now.

[He's here!]

Anxiety over the war in Ukraine is seemingly slowing up responses in Scotland according to Angus Robertson...curious rationale.

[Stairway 2 7]

Presiding officer not happy the 4 week delay was leaked to the press before the house

https://www.heraldscotland.com/politics/20101261.snp-minister-angus-robertson-issues-fulsome-apology-msps-census-delays-leaks/

[Stairway 2 7]

Anxiety over the war in Ukraine is seemingly slowing up responses in Scotland according to Angus Robertson...curious rationale.

Also the cost of living crisis 🙃 😆

[LewysGot2]

Anxiety over the war in Ukraine is seemingly slowing up responses in Scotland according to Angus Robertson...curious rationale.

What? 🤪

Wow...