Elephant in the room

[Johnny_Leith]

Something I've rarely seen mentioned is that now hearts will have European football until December guaranteed, possibly Europa League.

Saturday was such a pivotal moment in the Edinburgh rivalry. Unfortunately, not preventing them making the final has given them access to significant additional resources.

With a wealthy benefactor and the FOH regular income, and extra £3m across 2022 Q3/Q4 could see them really strengthen their position as third force in Scotland. Neilson was even talking about building a platform for continued growth for a title bid in X years. That's the level of ambition they're showing, a clear pathway to where they want to be.

Hearts, the Tory *******s, having more resources than us isn't a new scenario but with a growing gap in spending power it will be harder for us to compete in the player market. It'll be tougher for us to compete against them.

So what can we do about this? I'm not s fan of Maloney, I want him to succeed but in the cold light of day he's out his depth and shouldn't be learning the job at Hibs. Unless Gordon gets the cheque book out then I'm really skeptical that SM has the ability to improve the current squad or bring in enough quality to have us winning more games, and I'm not even going to touch on his style of play which has seen us be absolutely toothless up front.

I have decided I will renew despite my doubts, it's the best way to back the club and I want a successful Hibernian.

Maybe we'll get lucky and McGinn will go to utd/Liverpool/arsenal/Newcastle for upwards of £50m and we can invest our kickback.

So it's a pivotal moment for Hibs as well, very frustrating that we let hearts get a result again, we never seem to have that ability to put a spanner in their works when it really matters. Do we have a clear plan as to where we want to be? Is it solely reliant on Maloney being able to consistently get results, develop players and sell them and reinvest?

We feel a bit rudderless I guess and it's probably felt that way since JR was sacked in the run up to a cup final.

Massive changes and improvement required over the summer.

[Hermit Crab]

The only thing I think about with Hearts being in Europe is that the first two derbies and games v Rangers are going to be Sundays. :rolleyes:

[easty]

Hearts have had more money than us for years, and it's got them what? They're having a good season, but they've won nothing, and they'll win nothing. They're going to finish on slightly more points than we finished on last season. Likely less than Killie finished with in 3rd a few years ago.

I'm more concerned with the way we've not made use of the money we have, and have spent, than what they're doing though. Get the right manager in, get the right players in for the positions where we're weak. We have a budget that should be enough to compete for 3rd in the league. We're not even competing in the top 6. Ignore whats happening at the other side of the city and get it right for ourselves.

[ekhibee]

Despite their obvious financial problems and all the Romanov nonsense etc, they are now a well run club. I'm not party to their financial position, but at the moment they are, or seem to be, in a better position than us at the moment. I really hate Hearts, but it looks like they've learnt from their mistakes, and as long as they keep investing and relying on divers like Craig Gordon they'll be fine until VAR comes in.

[MWHIBBIES]

Was all there for us to take. We had the head start. Utterly blown it.

[loanheadhibby]

Absolutely the key thing unfortunately. Bad enough they got to final but the financial ramifications for us are horrific.

[Bostonhibby]

Hearts are finally lucking out on the management of resources front and who knows if it will continue.

But as they've shown all too well since their administration and how much they've blown in return for the megastand and very little else so far, it's not what you've got but what you do with it.

That said we've regressed since 2016 too and if Hearts throw what they raise at buying quality football players rather than van loads of randoms from one of their managers pals we will have a lot of catching up to do when the priority doesn't seem to be the team on the pitch.

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[H18 SFR]

Was all there for us to take. We had the head start. Utterly blown it.

We did blow it, big time.

However, the rebuild starts now, we can’t change the past so we need to get our squad rebuild and recruitment much better. Get the season tickets bought and get behind the team!

[Gmack7]

The only saving grace with all the additional finance heading their way is its neilson spending it, I still think he's a dud even though they have clearly out performed us this season

[OstKurve Hibs]

If we are constantly gonna be developing players we are gonna win nothin and more than likely achieve poor league positions.
Once players do get up to the level required, as soon as an acceptable bid comes in they're off so we arent gonna reap the benefits on the park from the work put into developing these youngsters.

Like another poster on here said, hearts are average, they have had a good season. But theyde be a far better side if they had a good manager. Robbie replay gets away with his faults as a manager because he has a decent squad to dig him out.

[Northernhibee]

Ron better have very deep pockets because those in charge are largely responsible.

Finished third last season. Just needed to strengthen in some key areas and failed at that. Needed to make a decision on Jack Ross 1 they did - and needed to appoint the right man - and failed. Could have recruited well in the winter - and failed. The manager had multiple opportunities to at least secure top six and give us a shout- and failed.

Pony up Ron, can’t expect the fans to pay for the failures of your team.

[He's here!]

I'd say it's a major blot on Ron Gordon's already quite heavily blotted copybook that we've allowed Hearts to trade places with us quite so quickly. When was the last time they finished above us in the top flight?

However, Hearts themselves have shown that no matter how many years of f***-ups they endure (two relegations, Cathro, the main stand fiasco, a conveyer belt of dud signings, cup exits to Brora and Alloa...to name but a few) things can be turned around quite quickly and I hope Ron learns the lessons of this deeply disappointing season and gets us back on the right track asap.

[Scottie]

We did blow it, big time.

However, the rebuild starts now, we can’t change the past so we need to get our squad rebuild and recruitment much better. Get the season tickets bought and get behind the team!
How many rebuilds do we have to go through though ? It’s every season. TBH getting sick of it all.

They we’re there for the taking on Saturday again and we blew it again like every other time against them.

[H18 SFR]

How many rebuilds do we have to go through though ? It’s every season. TBH getting sick of it all.

I know, sadly the answer is as many as it takes.

Let’s hope we have a solid summer transfer window backed up by a decent January tweak to ensure we have a successful season.

[MWHIBBIES]

We did blow it, big time.

However, the rebuild starts now, we can’t change the past so we need to get our squad rebuild and recruitment much better. Get the season tickets bought and get behind the team!

The problem is, the idiots in charge of rebuilding are the same ones who caused this mess. I have no confidence whatsoever

[jacomo]

Ron better have very deep pockets because those in charge are largely responsible.

Finished third last season. Just needed to strengthen in some key areas and failed at that. Needed to make a decision on Jack Ross 1 they did - and needed to appoint the right man - and failed. Could have recruited well in the winter - and failed. The manager had multiple opportunities to at least secure top six and give us a shout- and failed.

Pony up Ron, can’t expect the fans to pay for the failures of your team.


Or maybe sacking Jack Ross was a mistake?

[Northernhibee]

Or maybe sacking Jack Ross was a mistake?

Wouldn’t have been if they appointed the right person. In many ways that’s the far more important decision. But let’s not kid ourselves, we were in trouble under Jack too.

Still, the board made the decision to sack him and sometimes they have to make the unpopular decision if it’s the right one. There’s an argument to say that they failed at that too, if you think JR would have turned it around.

Either way, fans shouldn’t pay for it.

[Bostonhibby]

I'd say it's a major blot on Ron Gordon's already quite heavily blotted copybook that we've allowed Hearts to trade places with us quite so quickly. When was the last time they finished above us in the top flight?

However, Hearts themselves have shown that no matter how many years of f***-ups they endure (two relegations, Cathro, the main stand fiasco, a conveyer belt of dud signings, cup exits to Brora and Alloa...to name but a few) things can be turned around quite quickly and I hope Ron learns the lessons of this deeply disappointing season and gets us back on the right track asap.Good post, all perfectly feasible.

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[easty]

Or maybe sacking Jack Ross was a mistake?

It wasn't.

The football under Ross was poor. I was happy to overlook that when the results were good. At the end of his time we were getting ***** football and ***** results. That's not something you stick with.

[Scouse Hibee]

We did blow it, big time.

However, the rebuild starts now, we can’t change the past so we need to get our squad rebuild and recruitment much better. Get the season tickets bought and get behind the team!

Lost count the number of times I have heard a statement similar to this regarding Hibs in the last thirty years.

[JimBHibees]

I know, sadly the answer is as many as it takes.

Let’s hope we have a solid summer transfer window backed up by a decent January tweak to ensure we have a successful season.

Not sure we needed a rebuild this season however for one reason or another we have messed it up big time. Poor summer recruitment including the bizarre announcement of a deal for Doig without a bid being in. Clear to anyone watching Hibs how huge Boyle is to the team but allowed him to leave without any real replacement in. We needed targeted buys centre back midfielder striker ended up with two horrific panic loan signings. Ross should have imo been given more time but seems like there were behind the scenes fall outs though his credit from league position were imo diminished by some howling cup defeats and performance what is clear we are in an awful position. Really unsure what right approach however personally would support Maloney properly.

[H18 SFR]

Not sure we needed a rebuild this season however for one reason or another we have messed it up big time. Poor summer recruitment including the bizarre announcement of a deal for Doig without a bid being in. Clear to anyone watching Hibs how huge Boyle is to the team but allowed him to leave without any real replacement in. We needed targeted buys centre back midfielder striker ended up with two horrific panic loan signings. Ross should have imo been given more time but seems like there were behaved be the scenes fall outs though his credit from league position were imo diminished by some howling cup defeats and performance what is clear we are in an awful position. Really unsure what right approach however personally would support Maloney properly.

I was meaning we need a rebuild now. I wasn’t referencing 12 months ago.

[Pete]

There will be other pivotal moments and who knows, it could be ourselves in third again next year. Football fans are the most fickle sort, and it won't be long before people want Neilson and Budge out. Hearts will be the worst run club in the country blah blah. Not a dig at hearts, thats just the cyclical nature of teams below the old firm.
All we can do is believe in our vision and support the current regime and management while it's all given time to develop. It's early days.

[B.H.F.C]

One thing Hearts have shown is how quickly it can turn. It’s only a year or so since they were getting knocked out of the cup by Brora and they were all calling for Neilson to go.

What they did was sign a few decent players in the summer and had a bit of a plan for the here and now. The players they signed generally went right in to the team and improved them straight away. Forget all this stuff about the future, get players that are ready to play.

[loanheadhibby]

The only saving grace with all the additional finance heading their way is its neilson spending it, I still think he's a dud even though they have clearly out performed us this season

Takes them in to a different transfer market tho. They technically shouldbe able to attract a better player than we will be able to afford next season.

They can push boat out a bit further than Ron will be able to.

For Captain Caveman, brings a different pressure but a nice pressure.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Takes them in to a different transfer market tho. They technically shouldbe able to attract a better player than we will be able to afford next season.

They can push boat out a bit further than Ron will be able to.

For Captain Caveman, brings a different pressure but a nice pressure.

I’m not sure that’ll really be the case.

They still won’t be able to compete with the Old Firm or most Championship teams. So it’ll be squad players from the English Championship or League One/Two in England and the Scottish Premiership will be their market which is what they’re shopping in now anyway . They might be able to knock a few extra quid on should they need it to get the deal over the line though.

[Northernhibee]

There will be other pivotal moments and who knows, it could be ourselves in third again next year. Football fans are the most fickle sort, and it won't be long before people want Neilson and Budge out. Hearts will be the worst run club in the country blah blah. Not a dig at hearts, thats just the cyclical nature of teams below the old firm.
All we can do is believe in our vision and support the current regime and management while it's all given time to develop. It's early days.

I have to disagree. This season I’ve felt more like a target for revenue than ever. Price tiers for tickets depending where you are, screens trying to sell NFTs or whatever that Sportemon stuff is, pube control partners, half and half Charleston and Hibs scarves, every break in play a time to run another advert on the big screens. Klarna for those wanting to add to their debt levels.

I’m not sure if I believe in this vision. I’m not afraid of change by any means but it’s felt like we’re being bombarded at times. £30 on average for travel through and back, £28 tickets, £15-20 on scran and not even good football to justify that outlay.

Things like the football for a fiver scheme is good but when the crowds are served up what we seen against St Johnstone will the majority of them return?

I love Hibs and likely always will, but I’m certainly not in love with this version of Hibs.

[s.a.m]

Takes them in to a different transfer market tho. They technically shouldbe able to attract a better player than we will be able to afford next season.

They can push boat out a bit further than Ron will be able to.

For Captain Caveman, brings a different pressure but a nice pressure.

On the other hand... this time last year we were in third place, looking forward to European football and a cup final (having also made it to the other cup final). And look at us now. Every cloud has a silver lining :greengrin

[fiolex1]

Folks,
What is new here? Underperformed, not where we should be, selling best assets and not investing back in the team.
Has been happening for the last 40-50 years. Are we really still surprised by our strategy?
We have the odd successful season in the cup and league, but don’t do consistently enough for a club our size. We never seem to build on success from a previous season.
Listen we all know the script but it doesn’t deter our support of the club through thick and thin

[B.H.F.C]

On the other hand... this time last year we were in third place, looking forward to European football and a cup final (having also made it to the other cup final). And look at us now. Every cloud has a silver lining :greengrin

What we didn’t have was the guarantee of millions from Europe that they currently have though. Hopefully they revert to type and waste it all though.

[ThisIsTheYear]

Most seasons finishing 3rd for Scottish teams means hee haw in the grand scheme of things, defo has very little impact in the transfer market as it would equate to one or two rounds tops before getting pumped out. This season was always going to be different, the quality of the teams even in the conference groups is decent and a few players will be keen to get their name in the shop window with a move to England. Hearts can now spend knowing they have guaranteed European football to Xmas even if they get pumped every game. Only silver lining is next season will be tough playing mid week and weekends. We can’t afford to allow them to capitalise on this for say 3 seasons on the bounce.

[greenlex]

Hearts will ***** the dosh away in dross. The fact they have T this season is a one off. They’ll get even more ideas above their station than normal and blow it. It’s what they do.

[H18 SFR]

Hearts will ***** the dosh away in dross. The fact they have T this season is a one off. They’ll get even more ideas above their station than normal and blow it. It’s what they do.

I agree. They will end up overpaying two or three current players to keep them and if Craig Gordon has any sense he will negotiate a final bumper contract that will be aligned with his Celtic wage.

[ekhibee]

I have to disagree. This season I’ve felt more like a target for revenue than ever. Price tiers for tickets depending where you are, screens trying to sell NFTs or whatever that Sportemon stuff is, pube control partners, half and half Charleston and Hibs scarves, every break in play a time to run another advert on the big screens. Klarna for those wanting to add to their debt levels.

I’m not sure if I believe in this vision. I’m not afraid of change by any means but it’s felt like we’re being bombarded at times. £30 on average for travel through and back, £28 tickets, £15-20 on scran and not even good football to justify that outlay.

Things like the football for a fiver scheme is good but when the crowds are served up what we seen against St Johnstone will the majority of them return?

I love Hibs and likely always will, but I’m certainly not in love with this version of Hibs.

Well I totally agree with you on this. We do, at the moment, seem to be spending an awful lot on what? Like you I'm a Hibs fan, I always will be, but I'm really not buying in to what's being served right now.

[Northernhibee]

Well I totally agree with you on this. We do, at the moment, seem to be spending an awful lot on what? Like you I'm a Hibs fan, I always will be, but I'm really not buying in to what's being served right now.

The tail is wagging the dog just now. The vision should be provide good, successful entertaining football first to bring the fans in. Then get your advertising up once you’ve done that. Then reinvest it.

Short of two bigger boys holding us upside down and shaking the loose change out of our pockets once you head through the turnstile I’m not sure what else there is next. It does concern me where the priorities lie when it comes to the running of the club, hence why I’m adamant that the fans shouldn’t be paying to close the gap between us and Hearts/Dundee United.

Fans will pay the extra only if they can see the return.

[LithgaeHibby]

Let us never forget that they are only in this position because they shafted charities and Lithuanian tax payers whilst £30m of debt simply evaporated. BBC Scotland constantly helps them to skate over this with the narrative about how the "fans saved the club". Meanwhile we have continuously had to sell our key assets to pay our debts.

[Northernhibee]

Let us never forget that they are only in this position because they shafted charities and Lithuanian tax payers whilst £30m of debt simply evaporated. BBC Scotland constantly helps them to skate over this with the narrative about how the "fans saved the club". Meanwhile we have continuously had to sell our key assets to pay our debts.

I hate to say it because that shouldn’t be forgotten but it can’t be used as an excuse anymore. We finished third last season and they got pumped out of the cup by Brora. At the start of the season we were a country mile ahead of where they were.

There is absolutely no excuse to finish behind them in the league and to be knocked out of the cup by them. At all.

[Alfred E Newman]

We did blow it, big time.

However, the rebuild starts now, we can’t change the past so we need to get our squad rebuild and recruitment much better. Get the season tickets bought and get behind the team!

The time to rebuild was 2014 after our relegation and we did .
Much of that was down to the great work done by Leeane Dempster, backed by the much maligned Petrie. The fans bought into it with their support, buying shares, season tickets, etc.
Unfortunately all that hard work that brought us record gates the Scottish Cup and. 3rd place finish is being steadily dismantled by mismanagement.
The prospect of yet another rebuild after such a short time is ridiculous.

[superfurryhibby]

I hate to say it because that shouldn’t be forgotten but it can’t be used as an excuse anymore. We finished third last season and they got pumped out of the cup by Brora. At the start of the season we were a country mile ahead of where they were.

There is absolutely no excuse to finish behind them in the league and to be knocked out of the cup by them. At all.

Really?

They also reached a delayed Scottish Cup final, which they came close to winning and pumped us out of that into the bargain.

At the start of the season, they had a strong squad of players and anyone with a bit of insight knew they would be a challenge for us this season.

There is a significant disparity in budget between the two clubs, thanks to Hearts fans and benefactor. I would be very naive to imagine that doesn’t make a difference.

[Greenio]

Swings and roundabouts.

We're on a par with them plus 3 or 4 others

Like folk said, not that long ago they were utter dugs mess and we were outperforming them on all meaningful fronts.

Football isn't science.

They'll fall off

We'll come good

Swings and roundabouts

[A Hi-Bee]

Something I've rarely seen mentioned is that now hearts will have European football until December guaranteed, possibly Europa League.

Saturday was such a pivotal moment in the Edinburgh rivalry. Unfortunately, not preventing them making the final has given them access to significant additional resources.

With a wealthy benefactor and the FOH regular income, and extra £3m across 2022 Q3/Q4 could see them really strengthen their position as third force in Scotland. Neilson was even talking about building a platform for continued growth for a title bid in X years. That's the level of ambition they're showing, a clear pathway to where they want to be.

Hearts, the Tory *******s, having more resources than us isn't a new scenario but with a growing gap in spending power it will be harder for us to compete in the player market. It'll be tougher for us to compete against them.

So what can we do about this? I'm not s fan of Maloney, I want him to succeed but in the cold light of day he's out his depth and shouldn't be learning the job at Hibs. Unless Gordon gets the cheque book out then I'm really skeptical that SM has the ability to improve the current squad or bring in enough quality to have us winning more games, and I'm not even going to touch on his style of play which has seen us be absolutely toothless up front.

I have decided I will renew despite my doubts, it's the best way to back the club and I want a successful Hibernian.

Maybe we'll get lucky and McGinn will go to utd/Liverpool/arsenal/Newcastle for upwards of £50m and we can invest our kickback.

So it's a pivotal moment for Hibs as well, very frustrating that we let hearts get a result again, we never seem to have that ability to put a spanner in their works when it really matters. Do we have a clear plan as to where we want to be? Is it solely reliant on Maloney being able to consistently get results, develop players and sell them and reinvest?

We feel a bit rudderless I guess and it's probably felt that way since JR was sacked in the run up to a cup final.

Massive changes and improvement required over the summer.

Been saying the same for months now, we have really shot ourselves in the foot. It will be a long way back as well. We all have to keep investing, now even more if we can afford it, I will buy another season ticket and keep putting into HSL, its the only way, we dont have a rich backer or not as rich as the ggunts so we have to get smarter.
:top marks

[Greenio]

Bet hearts fans were saying the same thing 12 months ago

[A Hi-Bee]

Bet hearts fans were saying the same thing 12 months ago

Difference, being that they have the cash to invest, way more than we now have or had.

[B.H.F.C]

Bet hearts fans were saying the same thing 12 months ago

About us? No chance. Apart from anything else, the guaranteed money they have (that we didn’t) means it’s not entirely comparable.

[easty]

Difference, being that they have the cash to invest, way more than we now have or had.

They definitely bring in more money, have done for a while now. But on the pitch, other than Craig Gordon, do you think they have players we can't afford? They aren't shopping in a fancier market than us, they've just shopped better.

[Bostonhibby]

They definitely bring in more money, have done for a while now. But on the pitch, other than Craig Gordon, do you think they have players we can't afford? They aren't shopping in a fancier market than us, they've just shopped better.Indeed, and borrowed better

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[CallumHibs07]

If RG wants us to outperform them and Aberdeen, he needs to spend more than them. Until then, we’ll continue to be mid-table and achieve nothing bar the odd season. Simple reality tbh.

[easty]

If RG wants us to outperform them and Aberdeen, he needs to spend more than them. Until then, we’ll continue to be mid-table and achieve nothing bar the odd season. Simple reality tbh.

If it were that simple, Hibs and Aberdeen would be in the top 6. Having a bigger budget counts for nothing if you waste it.

[JohnM1875]

They definitely bring in more money, have done for a while now. But on the pitch, other than Craig Gordon, do you think they have players we can't afford? They aren't shopping in a fancier market than us, they've just shopped better.

Maybe for this season, sure. But guaranteed group stage football will undoubtedly be a big draw for some players. Meaning they will be able to attract a better player for the upcoming season. And if they somehow manage to make the Europa League group stages that standard will rise again with the money they'll have.

Unbelievable we didn't invest properly and kick on after finishing third last season. Shocking ownership.

[CallumHibs07]

If it were that simple, Hibs and Aberdeen would be in the top 6. Having a bigger budget counts for nothing if you waste it.

In the long run, it is that simple. It’s why they’re 3rd and 4th on the All Time SPL table and we’re languishing way behind. You get what you pay for.

[cabbageandribs1875]

I have to disagree. This season I’ve felt more like a target for revenue than ever. Price tiers for tickets depending where you are, screens trying to sell NFTs or whatever that Sportemon stuff is, pube control partners, half and half Charleston and Hibs scarves, every break in play a time to run another advert on the big screens. Klarna for those wanting to add to their debt levels.


my pet dislike at what the club has done :agree: when it's not broken DON'T F*****G FIX IT

[easty]

Maybe for this season, sure. But guaranteed group stage football will undoubtedly be a big draw for some players. Meaning they will be able to attract a better player for the upcoming season. And if they somehow manage to make the Europa League group stages that standard will rise again with the money they'll have.

Unbelievable we didn't invest properly and kick on after finishing third last season. Shocking ownership.

They won't make the Europa groups.

Your last point, I agree to an extent, we maybe should've invested further to try to kick on...but, it was on the back of a good third placed season, and a great start to the current one. So, when the transfer window closed at the end of August, we actually looked in pretty good shape. We'd played 9, won 6, drawn 2 and lost 1. If the collapse had come straight away, maybe we would've spent?

[Lago]

Was all there for us to take. We had the head start. Utterly blown it.
Believe it or not I totally agree with you 100%. Got shot down on another thread for saying same thing.

[JohnM1875]

They won't make the Europa groups.

Your last point, I agree to an extent, we maybe should've invested further to try to kick on...but, it was on the back of a good third placed season, and a great start to the current one. So, when the transfer window closed at the end of August, we actually looked in pretty good shape. We'd played 9, won 6, drawn 2 and lost 1. If the collapse had come straight away, maybe we would've spent?

I don't think they will either, but it's them we're talking about. One of the luckiest teams going. Probably end up drawing the lowest seeded team in the whole thing.

We knew at the end of last season that we needed to add to the squad, not just depth but players who could come in and make the first XI better. We came nowhere near that in the summer transfer window and it resulted in us needing to play McGregor in our most important European qualifier. It's piss poor. We should be trying to improve the starting XI every single window regardless of how well last season or the current season started.

Finished third and best we can do this season is seventh. It's the kind of crap we were promised wouldn't happen again.

[Baader]

Unfortunately they weren't going to keep getting it so badly wrong forever. A bit like a broken clock. This Joe Savage seems to know what he's doing and is making a difference. We need better recruitment on the park and off it.

[Tambo]

No doubt they have done better than much expected they would do and probably deverve 3rd place but definitely have been times when they have looked utter garbage aswell with Gordon saving them.

[NAE NOOKIE]

Despite their obvious financial problems and all the Romanov nonsense etc, they are now a well run club. I'm not party to their financial position, but at the moment they are, or seem to be, in a better position than us at the moment. I really hate Hearts, but it looks like they've learnt from their mistakes, and as long as they keep investing and relying on divers like Craig Gordon they'll be fine until VAR comes in.

I'm not sure the 'well run club' theory is entirely accurate to be honest. Is it not the case that without a cash injection from 'benefactors' running into millions of pounds their accounts would have shown a pretty sore deficit in the last 3 financial years.

If Hearts are the Elephant in our room then that is the Elephant in theirs. Yes they have had a good season and without a doubt their cut from the two semi finals and the final, not to mention a fair wedge from European football, will see them OK for the next financial year and possibly even the year after. But if we have learned anything watching Scottish football it's that nothing lasts forever unless you are the Ugly sisters, not getting to cup finals, not getting into Europe and not altruistic benefactors willing to just hand over millions of quid simply for love of the club. Just ask Aberdeen or Dundee United if you don't agree with me.

The big question facing Hearts is what happens when they inevitably do run into debt and there are no 'benefactors' willing to give away free millions, especially with no prospect of that giving them any sort of boardroom presence or say in the club whatsoever? What happens after a few seasons without making Europe or the final stages of the cups?

When that day comes, and it surely will, what happens then? The Foundation of Hearts has been running for a good few years now, it quickly hit a height of around 8,000 members, but in the years since it has barely moved from that. In order to raise the likes of three million quid from these 'owners' of the club they would all have to ante up an average of £375 each and that's on top of their normal FoH contributions and buying season tickets and we wouldn't even be talking about money to buy players or pay for infrastructure, it would simply be money to keep the club out of the red.

Look at their current squad, yes it may have bags of experience and be able to finish third and make the cup final, but where is the resale value of any of them, even the near 40 year old Craig Gordon? The guy Simms looks a handful, but he's on loan. The only guy worth anything like decent money is about to join Rangers for nothing. There isn't a club in the UK able to point to a conveyor belt of talent .... you might get lucky once or twice in a generation like we did with Mowbray's team, but it never lasts, not even at Man United.

What happens when the day arrives, as it surely will, that they have to cut their cloth and be realistic about what they can pay in transfer fees or wages with no rich owner or charitable benefactors to pump money in, or even to guarantee a bank loan on the back of their personal wealth as STF did with us, because banks don't lend to Scottish clubs any more and that's not going to change any time soon.

If I was a Hearts fan I would be asking these questions now while the club is on a high. Unfortunately for them they have a history of acting like the three monkeys and living in the moment. At Hampden on Saturday the 'wee team' trope was maxed out by practically every group of Jambos I passed, well we all know when that pish started and how it ended.

A combination of FoH and Ann Budge saved them from disaster the last time, but the next time who will save them? Will an Ann Budge get involved and pump millions into a club that is 'fan owned' and therefor by definition has no room to hand over control or ownership to some multi millionaire, Hearts fan or not. FoH already bankrolls the club so that well is practically dry, could they find another new 8,000 members or get the folk who already contribute to double their contributions?

So aye, at the moment things look great for them in the Edinburgh football balance, but I can see a day where once again their hubris will come back to bite them on the arse and when it does happen its far from certain that the outcome will be the same as it was the last time.

[Northernhibee]

Really?

They also reached a delayed Scottish Cup final, which they came close to winning and pumped us out of that into the bargain.

At the start of the season, they had a strong squad of players and anyone with a bit of insight knew they would be a challenge for us this season.

There is a significant disparity in budget between the two clubs, thanks to Hearts fans and benefactor. I would be very naive to imagine that doesn’t make a difference.

Yeah. If we make the most of things we can control - recruitment, the first team squad, clever investment there’s no reason why we shouldn’t be comfortably ahead of them this season.

However we’ve recruited terribly, planned terribly, invested terribly and gone for the wrong manager and we’re in an absolute mess and they’ve won the lottery.

[Since452]

This is a game changer for Hearts unfortunatley. We will be in their shadow for the forseeable and we only have ourselves to blame. We had a massive head start on them and have utterly self destructed this season. Lets just hope relegation isn't the cherry on top.

[Hermit Crab]

They won't make the Europa groups.

Your last point, I agree to an extent, we maybe should've invested further to try to kick on...but, it was on the back of a good third placed season, and a great start to the current one. So, when the transfer window closed at the end of August, we actually looked in pretty good shape. We'd played 9, won 6, drawn 2 and lost 1. If the collapse had come straight away, maybe we would've spent?


Maybe not but they're guaranteed to be in the group stage of the conference league are they not? The will play 1 qualifier to get into the europa league group stages first. That game is worth millions in prize money. Meanwhile we are at home watching tennis at Wimbledon.

[GreenCastle]

I would still be wary as things in Scottish Football with Rangers and Celtic dominance can change very quickly.

Success also brings own issues..

Teams may want Neilson
Teams look at Hearts better players
Players want more wages
Playing European football means larger squad and costs plus Thursday / Sundays and the challenges that brings.

Hearts still have an incomplete smaller stadium and pitch with limited options to expand.

They also don't have their own training Academy. All big clubs have OWN set up - not shared with various other sports and university clubs.

Now of course I would rather be in their position than ours on the footballing side but it's not just as simple as group stages and keep growing.

I've always said though Hibs and Hearts need each other to be strong - in Hibs case fans should be annoyed our standards have dropped. When Hearts were in the Championship and no league derbies last season (except the cup loss!) I feel the club and fans relaxed a bit - derbies add pressure and expectation to succeed.

It works both ways and you can see this with Celtic and Rangers right now also pushing each other.

The worst part for a Hearts fan or Hibs fan is knowing 3rd will always be the ceiling in Scotland - it shouldn't be that way but as long as Celtic and Rangers keep making Europe and having the fan base they have the rest are playing for 3rd. While Hearts may want to pull away next few years - Hibs and Aberdeen I am confident will be back challenging so won't be as easy as one may think.

[Key West]

This season has been a one off who would you buy from Hearts that would improve any of the title challengers, Celtic and The Rangers?
I've never knows us to lose so many key players for long periods of time through injuries
and suspensions.
Boyle took us to 3rd last season, a 40 year old keeper has taken them to that position this season.

[Hibernia&Alba]

I'm not sure the 'well run club' theory is entirely accurate to be honest. Is it not the case that without a cash injection from 'benefactors' running into millions of pounds their accounts would have shown a pretty sore deficit in the last 3 financial years.

If Hearts are the Elephant in our room then that is the Elephant in theirs. Yes they have had a good season and without a doubt their cut from the two semi finals and the final, not to mention a fair wedge from European football, will see them OK for the next financial year and possibly even the year after. But if we have learned anything watching Scottish football it's that nothing lasts forever unless you are the Ugly sisters, not getting to cup finals, not getting into Europe and not altruistic benefactors willing to just hand over millions of quid simply for love of the club. Just ask Aberdeen or Dundee United if you don't agree with me.

The big question facing Hearts is what happens when they inevitably do run into debt and there are no 'benefactors' willing to give away free millions, especially with no prospect of that giving them any sort of boardroom presence or say in the club whatsoever? What happens after a few seasons without making Europe or the final stages of the cups?

When that day comes, and it surely will, what happens then? The Foundation of Hearts has been running for a good few years now, it quickly hit a height of around 8,000 members, but in the years since it has barely moved from that. In order to raise the likes of three million quid from these 'owners' of the club they would all have to ante up an average of £375 each and that's on top of their normal FoH contributions and buying season tickets and we wouldn't even be talking about money to buy players or pay for infrastructure, it would simply be money to keep the club out of the red.

Look at their current squad, yes it may have bags of experience and be able to finish third and make the cup final, but where is the resale value of any of them, even the near 40 year old Craig Gordon? The guy Simms looks a handful, but he's on loan. The only guy worth anything like decent money is about to join Rangers for nothing. There isn't a club in the UK able to point to a conveyor belt of talent .... you might get lucky once or twice in a generation like we did with Mowbray's team, but it never lasts, not even at Man United.

What happens when the day arrives, as it surely will, that they have to cut their cloth and be realistic about what they can pay in transfer fees or wages with no rich owner or charitable benefactors to pump money in, or even to guarantee a bank loan on the back of their personal wealth as STF did with us, because banks don't lend to Scottish clubs any more and that's not going to change any time soon.

If I was a Hearts fan I would be asking these questions now while the club is on a high. Unfortunately for them they have a history of acting like the three monkeys and living in the moment. At Hampden on Saturday the 'wee team' trope was maxed out by practically every group of Jambos I passed, well we all know when that pish started and how it ended.

A combination of FoH and Ann Budge saved them from disaster the last time, but the next time who will save them? Will an Ann Budge get involved and pump millions into a club that is 'fan owned' and therefor by definition has no room to hand over control or ownership to some multi millionaire, Hearts fan or not. FoH already bankrolls the club so that well is practically dry, could they find another new 8,000 members or get the folk who already contribute to double their contributions?

So aye, at the moment things look great for them in the Edinburgh football balance, but I can see a day where once again their hubris will come back to bite them on the arse and when it does happen its far from certain that the outcome will be the same as it was the last time.


Very good post. Hearts are in a good position, but it's contingent upon continued benefactor financing to a large degree. Who are these sugar daddies anyway?

[ancient hibee]

Very good post. Hearts are in a good position, but it's contingent upon continued benefactor financing to a large degree. Who are these sugar daddies anyway?
James Anderson is in for £5million over 5 years. FOH for whatever their annual take is.

[Antonyopus]

Please get your spelling correct when posting and I am a Tory and Hibs supporter so please don’t use this as a derogatory term when describing football supporters. End of.

[easty]

Please get your spelling correct when posting and I am a Tory and Hibs supporter so please don’t use this as a derogatory term when describing football supporters. End of.

It's as derogatory a term as you can get :na na:

[Hibernia&Alba]

It's as derogatory a term as you can get :na na:

It was fighting talk when I was a kid. "Yer da's a Tory" meant a square go. You just didn't call someone that name :greengrin

[tamig]

The only saving grace with all the additional finance heading their way is its neilson spending it, I still think he's a dud even though they have clearly out performed us this season

The guy Savage seems to be the main man there now and has been behind the successful recruitment.

[MWHIBBIES]

The only saving grace with all the additional finance heading their way is its neilson spending it, I still think he's a dud even though they have clearly out performed us this season

Neilson has managed Hearts for 4 full season over 2 spells.

Hes won the championship by miles twice, finished 3rd by miles twice, and now reached 2 cup finals beating us in the semis twice.

He is not a dud.

[GreenCastle]

The guy Savage seems to be the main man there now and has been behind the successful recruitment.

Joe Savage is Sporting Director.

William Lancefield is head of recruitment.

Both have significantly improved Hearts but won’t be around forever as they take bigger jobs at some point.

[tamig]

This season has been a one off who would you buy from Hearts that would improve any of the title challengers, Celtic and The Rangers?
I've never knows us to lose so many key players for long periods of time through injuries
and suspensions.
Boyle took us to 3rd last season, a 40 year old keeper has taken them to that position this season.

I think you’re the first person to acknowledge the horrific injury problems we’ve had this season. A huge factor in how things have panned out. The summer recruitment is the other major failure that’s come back to haunt us.

[Viva_Palmeiras]

One thing Hearts have shown is how quickly it can turn. It’s only a year or so since they were getting knocked out of the cup by Brora and they were all calling for Neilson to go.

What they did was sign a few decent players in the summer and had a bit of a plan for the here and now. The players they signed generally went right in to the team and improved them straight away. Forget all this stuff about the future, get players that are ready to play.

Ok let’s look at that then - how many of the players that slotted in to Hearts came in a January transfer window?

could the more important question be :

which players that were available,’that could have improved us (presumable “in the forward areas”) were either not bought, could not get over the line (was McGrath one?) if the answer is none then surely we rightly opted to buy our time?

in these maddening times is it not time for cool heads?

For all the mimics of Mikey Stewart not seeing a plan / strategy, there will be one.

Questions on my mind:

Has Maloney tried to do too much too soon without the right players in place?

In his persistence has he demonstrated enough to show there’s light at the end of the tunnel and which players have the ability to fit into the system

If January was not the right time, can we expect to see a big influx of players of the required quality ? ( are the fees for developlement players an indicator of our willingness to loosen purse strings if the right deal can be struck?)

have we seen enough from e.g Jasper, Clarke to give us encouragement in the ability to pick the right players?


I think we needs to see how things pan out.

[tamig]

Ok let’s look at that then - how many of the players that slotted in to Hearts came in a January transfer window?

could the more important question be :

which players that were available,’that could have improved us (presumable “in the forward areas”) were either not bought, could not get over the line (was McGrath one?) if the answer is none then surely we rightly opted to buy our time?

in these maddening times is it not time for cool heads?

For all the mimics of Mikey Stewart not seeing a plan / strategy, there will be one.

Questions on my mind:

Has Maloney tried to do too much too soon without the right players in place?

In his persistence has he demonstrated enough to show there’s light at the end of the tunnel and which players have the ability to fit into the system

If January was not the right time, can we expect to see a big influx of players of the required quality ? ( are the fees for developlement players an indicator of our willingness to loosen purse strings if the right deal can be struck?)

have we seen enough from e.g Jasper, Clarke to give us encouragement in the ability to pick the right players?


I think we needs to see how things pan out.

Great post. But Maloney’s card is well and truly marked by a few on here and some of the wider support as they cannot see past poor derby results unfortunately.

[Mick O'Rourke]

The only thing I think about with Hearts being in Europe is that the first two derbies and games v Rangers are going to be Sundays. :rolleyes:

Some here can look forward to that after Mass

Nothing as good as beating the pagans and heretics on a Sunday. :greengrin

[easty]

Great post. But Maloney’s card is well and truly marked by a few on here and some of the wider support as they cannot see past poor derby results unfortunately.

As poor as the derby results have been, it's a stretch to say that it's just those games that have marked his card. He has 3 wins in his 15 league games in charge. Only 1 win in his last 13 league games. The footballs been crap. The results have been crap. It's not just the derby results that have his card well and truly marked.

[Heisenberg]

As poor as the derby results have been, it's a stretch to say that it's just those games that have marked his card. He has 3 wins in his 15 league games in charge. Only 1 win in his last 13 league games. The footballs been crap. The results have been crap. It's not just the derby results that have his card well and truly marked.


Was about to post similar. If he’d lost the last two hearts games and been much better in the league (I.e had us in 4th if not still challenging for 3rd) then I’d be absolutely fine with him. His overall record so far has been horrific and has marked his card for him.

[tamig]

As poor as the derby results have been, it's a stretch to say that it's just those games that have marked his card. He has 3 wins in his 15 league games in charge. Only 1 win in his last 13 league games. The footballs been crap. The results have been crap. It's not just the derby results that have his card well and truly marked.

He’s been severely hamstrung by the ongoing injuries as well. I think we’ve shown some promise in quite a few games but have been terribly inconsistent and patchy. He’s just not had the bodies to bring in to change things unfortunately. In my opinion. I want him to get the summer and see what we can bring in to change things. Appreciate that many will disagree with that though.

[Brizo]

I have to disagree. This season I’ve felt more like a target for revenue than ever. Price tiers for tickets depending where you are, screens trying to sell NFTs or whatever that Sportemon stuff is, pube control partners, half and half Charleston and Hibs scarves, every break in play a time to run another advert on the big screens. Klarna for those wanting to add to their debt levels.

I’m not sure if I believe in this vision. I’m not afraid of change by any means but it’s felt like we’re being bombarded at times. £30 on average for travel through and back, £28 tickets, £15-20 on scran and not even good football to justify that outlay.

Things like the football for a fiver scheme is good but when the crowds are served up what we seen against St Johnstone will the majority of them return?

I love Hibs and likely always will, but I’m certainly not in love with this version of Hibs.

:top marks

[BlackSheep]

We would have had to win the Scottish to take their guaranteed European place away this year…. They’ve got 3rd wrapped up and if any of the old firm win the Scottish then the guaranteed European place would go to third place…. So beating them at the weekend would not have stopped that. We would still have needed to beat Rangers…. So let not add that to the disappointment of the season, it was highly likely they had guaranteed Europe til December from their league form.

[Hibee Mac]

He’s been severely hamstrung by the ongoing injuries as well. I think we’ve shown some promise in quite a few games but have been terribly inconsistent and patchy. He’s just not had the bodies to bring in to change things unfortunately. In my opinion. I want him to get the summer and see what we can bring in to change things. Appreciate that many will disagree with that though.

The injuries are not a get out clause for me though. Despite injuries Maloney is still fully to blame for not achieving top 6 due to his stubbornness and inability to play to the strengths of the players at his disposal.

[Not So Young]

Ignore whats happening at the other side of the city and get it right for ourselves.

Been saying this for quite a few years

[chrisski33]

Can say Hearts have been lucky etc but look where they are now? We cane out with slogans like "this is our city" but dont follow it up on the park against them. Think one of the reasons they have done well is the appointment of the recruitment guy from Preston who seems to got recruitment right. Also they have had the drive feeling hard done by being relegated in the way they did (which was deserved based on results).

[SlickShoes]

The injuries are not a get out clause for me though. Despite injuries Maloney is still fully to blame for not achieving top 6 due to his stubbornness and inability to play to the strengths of the players at his disposal.

What are the strengths of Drey Wright and James Scott?

[B.H.F.C]

Ok let’s look at that then - how many of the players that slotted in to Hearts came in a January transfer window?

could the more important question be :

which players that were available,’that could have improved us (presumable “in the forward areas”) were either not bought, could not get over the line (was McGrath one?) if the answer is none then surely we rightly opted to buy our time?

in these maddening times is it not time for cool heads?

For all the mimics of Mikey Stewart not seeing a plan / strategy, there will be one.

Questions on my mind:

Has Maloney tried to do too much too soon without the right players in place?

In his persistence has he demonstrated enough to show there’s light at the end of the tunnel and which players have the ability to fit into the system

If January was not the right time, can we expect to see a big influx of players of the required quality ? ( are the fees for developlement players an indicator of our willingness to loosen purse strings if the right deal can be struck?)

have we seen enough from e.g Jasper, Clarke to give us encouragement in the ability to pick the right players?


I think we needs to see how things pan out.

They signed Simms in January, someone who was ready to go and was on the pitch for them the same day as he signed. Someone who has made a big difference in the two season defining games for us. They obviously didn’t need to try and rescue things in the same way we did in January because they’d done the good work in the previous window but they managed to add to what they already had. I’m still not convinced we did that in January.

My initial point wasn’t really intended to criticise us (although there is plenty to criticise). More just to say that, they’ve not done anything that is rocket science over the last year. They’ve just signed players that have improved them and the rest of it looks after itself thereafter IMO.

[Northernhibee]

What are the strengths of Drey Wright and James Scott?

Drey Wright can be used in several positions. Fairly neat and tidy and although lacking confidence a bit of good man management can get that out of him. Has scored in a couple of big games at his time here and is a hard worker. Mostly versatility in his instance if not bags of flair.

James Scott - you’d need to ask Maloney that as to what he seen in him and why he’s kept playing him. But he put in a good shift on Saturday.

[SlickShoes]

I don't buy that January was a disaster incoming signing-wise. Boyle is the huge loss and is not replaceable on our budget at short notice without developing someone into a player like we did with Boyle.

Henderson - Good
Clarke - Good
Mitchell - Good
Melkerson - could be good
Jasper - decent
Meuller - could be decent but has a lot of work to do
Bushiri - mediocre, but we desperately needed a body due to injuries and suspensions

The fact that two of the good ones were instantly injured has not been very good for us, Magennis was on his way back then got injured yet again and, we haven't had a settled defense since October or something.

The other signings we made were specifically at youth level, so should not be considered even though they have made the bench due to our injury crisis.

[SlickShoes]

Drey Wright can be used in several positions. Fairly neat and tidy and although lacking confidence a bit of good man management can get that out of him. Has scored in a couple of big games at his time here and is a hard worker. Mostly versatility in his instance if not bags of flair.

James Scott - you’d need to ask Maloney that as to what he seen in him and why he’s kept playing him. But he put in a good shift on Saturday.

James Scott is all we have senior striker wise, so that's why he's getting games, ask last summers recruitment team why that is.

None of the things you mention about Wright would make us a better team, in fact, Maloney has used him in this way and stuck by him to try and get that confidence going.

[leith lynx]

Let us never forget that they are only in this position because they shafted charities and Lithuanian tax payers whilst £30m of debt simply evaporated. BBC Scotland constantly helps them to skate over this with the narrative about how the "fans saved the club". Meanwhile we have continuously had to sell our key assets to pay our debts.
Great post👏

[Hibee Mac]

What are the strengths of Drey Wright and James Scott?Ask Maloney, he's the one frequently playing them ahead of Henderson, Allan, Jasper, Melkersson etc ...

In all seriousness though, you've pointed to the weak points of our squad, which are what they are. But my point is that he's not been utilising the strengths of the better parts of our squad to help balance out the deficiencies.

[Jones28]

Let us never forget that they are only in this position because they shafted charities and Lithuanian tax payers whilst £30m of debt simply evaporated. BBC Scotland constantly helps them to skate over this with the narrative about how the "fans saved the club". Meanwhile we have continuously had to sell our key assets to pay our debts.

This is comfort blanket pish.

[MWHIBBIES]

This is comfort blanket pish.

It's not comfort blanket stuff. They stole 30 million and employed 2 registered sex offenders. They are a disgusting club. I'd lose the next 1000 derbies before I was ever jealous of them.

[Jones28]

It's not comfort blanket stuff. They stole 30 million and employed 2 registered sex offenders. They are a disgusting club. I'd lose the next 1000 derbies before I was ever jealous of them.

I never said I was jealous of them, but using all that to mitigate the fact we lost to them at hampden again is a bit desperate imo

[where'stheslope]

Folks,
What is new here? Underperformed, not where we should be, selling best assets and not investing back in the team.
Has been happening for the last 40-50 years. Are we really still surprised by our strategy?
We have the odd successful season in the cup and league, but don’t do consistently enough for a club our size. We never seem to build on success from a previous season.
Listen we all know the script but it doesn’t deter our support of the club through thick and thin
This in spades!!
Just look at St Johnstone, last season taking on all comers and did quite well in Europe, now they are fighting to stay in the premiership???
Every team has spells when things just click, but in Scotland if its not the Old Firm the team usually gets broken up in transfers!!!

[Mrimbetween]

A big concern will be the fans that have had enough and wont renew

The financial implications alone and sadly i see it

Also bottom 6 games are hardly attractive, get the points required then apathy sets in

Though Ron maybe just maybe relalise a lift i s required and soon as as the summer awaits

If Ryan goes i fear the worst glad to be well wrong

[Viva_Palmeiras]

I don't buy that January was a disaster incoming signing-wise. Boyle is the huge loss and is not replaceable on our budget at short notice without developing someone into a player like we did with Boyle.

Henderson - Good
Clarke - Good
Mitchell - Good
Melkerson - could be good
Jasper - decent
Meuller - could be decent but has a lot of work to do
Bushiri - mediocre, but we desperately needed a body due to injuries and suspensions

The fact that two of the good ones were instantly injured has not been very good for us, Magennis was on his way back then got injured yet again and, we haven't had a settled defense since October or something.

The other signings we made were specifically at youth level, so should not be considered even though they have made the bench due to our injury crisis.


I think this is a more balanced view. I think I may well be we did the decent business that we could but there’s no guarantee.

To pick up on a separate point raised re Jambos Jan signings - Is Simms loan or permy for them regardless if it helps get you over the line…

For the Mikey Stewarts of the world - I think this is a longer term project - bold leaders take a different tack - The Bunnets for example was ridiculed for his biscuit tin mentality and look where he tools Celtic - arguably giving them the platform ok which todays successes have been built.

My thinking is that Sean needs time - he has seen what’s wrong and what’s needed to fix it. And that aligned more with Ronald(o) thinking.

To do that will not be like flipping a switch. He is talking about a cultural change - arguably you don’t get that by firing long balls up to a Lafferty type players. Yes in the meantime we need to be challenging in the top 6 but we’ve almost hit every single hurdle along the way - a leader would be foolish to ignore the context.

[The Spaceman]

They’ll have a war chest to spend this summer as well and being able to promote guaranteed European Group Stage football as a perk will certainly help them lure in their targets.

This season has been nothing short of a disaster for us in our growth and progress. We need a minimum 4th placed finish next season otherwise we will really fall behind. We have been really hamstrung by injuries this season, but that doesn’t excuse how we’ve managed it.

[givescotlandfreedom]

You'd think they were clear top of the league from some of these responses. They'll get (more) cocky, fall flat on their faces and we'll laugh at them.
It's what they do.

[LithgaeHibby]

I never said I was jealous of them, but using all that to mitigate the fact we lost to them at hampden again is a bit desperate imo

not desperate, just recognition that if they’d had to pay their dues, there’s no way that they’d have been able to afford the standard of player (Kingsley, Simms etc) they had on the pitch on Saturday

[givescotlandfreedom]

not desperate, just recognition that if they’d had to pay their dues, there’s no way that they’d have been able to afford the standard of player (Kingsley, Simms etc) they had on the pitch on Saturday

They wouldn't even have a club if they had to pay what they owed. They're a shameless club though so don't do self awareness.

[Mrimbetween]

not desperate, just recognition that if they’d had to pay their dues, there’s no way that they’d have been able to afford the standard of player (Kingsley, Simms etc) they had on the pitch on Saturday

Honest that cuts no ice, changes nothing at all

All clubs hace done ***** in the past bringing this up after a huge defeat is just silly

[Jones28]

not desperate, just recognition that if they’d had to pay their dues, there’s no way that they’d have been able to afford the standard of player (Kingsley, Simms etc) they had on the pitch on Saturday

If that makes you feel better about it then fair enough. It does nothing for me.

[Irish_Steve]

I thought I had read somewhere or heard it on the radio that Villarreal's unexpected progression to the CL semi may put the mockers on the big money for the Fartz

Would be funny as f if that pans out

[oneone73]

I thought I had read somewhere or heard it on the radio that Villarreal's unexpected progression to the CL semi may put the mockers on the big money for the Fartz

Would be funny as f if that pans out
Only if Russian clubs are reinstated. Not going to happen.

[tamig]

What are the strengths of Drey Wright and James Scott?

What happened when Drey Wright went of against them the other week?

[IberianHibernian]

Was about to post similar. If he’d lost the last two hearts games and been much better in the league (I.e had us in 4th if not still challenging for 3rd) then I’d be absolutely fine with him. His overall record so far has been horrific and has marked his card for him.We`d be 4th now if Melkerson had taken late chance v Arabs or we got late penalty ( and didn`t miss it ! ) in same game after tackle on Muller . So almost 4th and cup final despite horrendous injury problems .

[Hermit Crab]

We`d be 4th now if Melkerson had taken late chance v Arabs or we got late penalty ( and didn`t miss it ! ) in same game after tackle on Muller . So almost 4th and cup final despite horrendous injury problems .


Aye and if Paul Mcginn hadn't made a James Hunt of it on Saturday, and Clarke hadn't fouled on the edge of the box Hearts wouldn't have been 2-0 up in 20 minutes.

[LewysGot2]

not desperate, just recognition that if they’d had to pay their dues, there’s no way that they’d have been able to afford the standard of player (Kingsley, Simms etc) they had on the pitch on Saturday

Simms isn't theirs. Wonder how much they subsidise his Everton wages by? And how their recruitment team managed the likes of him and Ben Woodburn from Liverpool on loan? Is it all finances?

[Waxy]

Aye and if Paul Mcginn hadn't made a James Hunt of it on Saturday, and Clarke hadn't fouled on the edge of the box Hearts wouldn't have been 2-0 up in 20 minutes.

Simple as that plus the Gordon save.
Other than that we were the better team by quite a bit.
Our time will come.

[Steve20]

I don't buy that January was a disaster incoming signing-wise. Boyle is the huge loss and is not replaceable on our budget at short notice without developing someone into a player like we did with Boyle.

Henderson - Good
Clarke - Good
Mitchell - Good
Melkerson - could be good
Jasper - decent
Meuller - could be decent but has a lot of work to do
Bushiri - mediocre, but we desperately needed a body due to injuries and suspensions

The fact that two of the good ones were instantly injured has not been very good for us, Magennis was on his way back then got injured yet again and, we haven't had a settled defense since October or something.

The other signings we made were specifically at youth level, so should not be considered even though they have made the bench due to our injury crisis.

That's being very generous.

Henderson - meh so far
Clarke - has looked decent in the few games he's played
Mitchell - Ok, nothing more.
Melkerson - good at Motherwell, that's it. But he's one for the future so could be good
Jasper - meh
Mueller - done nothing so far. Poor
Bushri - awful