Mowbray and Stubbs

[He's here!]

Trying to put a positive slant on Maloney by recalling that Mowbray and Stubbs didn't get off to great starts as rookie managers but went on to be very successful at Hibs. However I would say that from a relatively early stage you could sense their teams coming together. Under Maloney I've so far seen little to give me confidence. We seem directionless and are mostly awful to watch. I'm glad we have as many points on the board as we do because I'm struggling to see who in this league we're capable of beating on current evidence.

[jacomo]

Trying to put a positive slant on Maloney by recalling that Mowbray and Stubbs didn't get off to great starts as rookie managers but went on to be very successful at Hibs. However I would say that from a relatively early stage you could sense the team coming together. Under Maloney I've so far seen little to give me confidence. We seem directionless and are mostly awful to watch. I'm glad we have as many points on the board as we do because I'm struggling to see who in this league we're capable of beating on current evidence.


Indeed. Stubbs’ team didn’t really get going until the end of September in his first season.

The problem is that at the moment I’m not really sure what we are trying to do.

[H18 SFR]

Trying to put a positive slant on Maloney by recalling that Mowbray and Stubbs didn't get off to great starts as rookie managers but went on to be very successful at Hibs. However I would say that from a relatively early stage you could sense the team coming together. Under Maloney I've so far seen little to give me confidence. We seem directionless and are mostly awful to watch. I'm glad we have as many points on the board as we do because I'm struggling to see who in this league we're capable of beating on current evidence.

You’ve made valid points.

I think the difference is that Mowbray and Stubbs were willing to be flexible and develop the preferred tactic in incremental steps.

Maloney just seems to stick rigidly to his vision without having the players across the team to implement it.

I fear he will stand his ground and the rest will take care of itself.

I know every managerial appointment is the most important, however, we need to make sure who ever replaces Maloney in the summer or October time if he gets the start of next season, is the right person.

Maloney isn’t the man, hopefully he doesn’t leave us in a **** storm when he eventually goes later this year.

[hibby rae]

Trying to put a positive slant on Maloney by recalling that Mowbray and Stubbs didn't get off to great starts as rookie managers but went on to be very successful at Hibs. However I would say that from a relatively early stage you could sense their teams coming together. Under Maloney I've so far seen little to give me confidence. We seem directionless and are mostly awful to watch. I'm glad we have as many points on the board as we do because I'm struggling to see who in this league we're capable of beating on current evidence.

Bear in mind they didn't come in mid-season.

[H18 SFR]

Bear in mind they didn't come in mid-season.

Another fair point so probably unfair to make a direct comparison.

I think Maloney probably deserves a summer then maybe make an informed judgement re progress after the 3 or 4 league cup ties and half a dozen league games next season.

[The 90+2]

Trying to put a positive slant on Maloney by recalling that Mowbray and Stubbs didn't get off to great starts as rookie managers but went on to be very successful at Hibs. However I would say that from a relatively early stage you could sense their teams coming together. Under Maloney I've so far seen little to give me confidence. We seem directionless and are mostly awful to watch. I'm glad we have as many points on the board as we do because I'm struggling to see who in this league we're capable of beating on current evidence.


You could see in the two friendlies before the start of the season (Whyte and McKay cup I think) how Mowbray was shaping a side to play and it was glaringly better than anything under Williamson and that was right away. I'm sure we lost to Killie (Boyd free kick) but played them off the park too.

Stubbs had a massive, massive rebuild. Maloney shouldn't need that, we finished 3rd last season. If he does need a massive rebuild it would nice to be told why and not just for the sake of it. For all this "he needs his own players" the two most dependable players so far under management and a bus full of new players have been Stevenson and Cadden.

[flash]

You’ve made valid points.

I think the difference is that Mowbray and Stubbs were willing to be flexible and develop the preferred tactic in incremental steps.

Maloney just seems to stick rigidly to his vision without having the players across the team to implement it.

I fear he will stand his ground and the rest will take care of itself.

I know every managerial appointment is the most important, however, we need to make sure who ever replaces Maloney in the summer or October time if he gets the start of next season, is the right person.

Maloney isn’t the man, hopefully he doesn’t leave us in a **** storm when he eventually goes later this year.

He has made tactical changes during games and played a more direct style in the Derby.

Why are people just making stuff up to beat him with?

[The 90+2]

Another fair point so probably unfair to make a direct comparison.

I think Maloney probably deserves a summer then maybe make an informed judgement re progress after the 3 or 4 league cup ties and half a dozen league games next season.


He probably should get the summer (if it doesn't turn into a complete shambles before then, that's 50/50 just now)

But it leads to questioning the judgement of sacking the manager that had us third and in another cup final a week before the final and not just stick with him until the summer? It's like the club wanted him gone and didn't want to risk us winning the final and having to back him further.

[H18 SFR]

He has made tactical changes during games and played a more direct style in the Derby.

Why are people just making stuff up to beat him with?

Hearts pressing us prompted that. Pure and simple.

[Alfred E Newman]

Trying to put a positive slant on Maloney by recalling that Mowbray and Stubbs didn't get off to great starts as rookie managers but went on to be very successful at Hibs. However I would say that from a relatively early stage you could sense their teams coming together. Under Maloney I've so far seen little to give me confidence. We seem directionless and are mostly awful to watch. I'm glad we have as many points on the board as we do because I'm struggling to see who in this league we're capable of beating on current evidence.

I certainly hope this 5 subs rule is only a temporary measure.
For all that the performance wasn’t great, the starting line up yesterday didn’t look too bad on paper and you could see some sort of shape to the side .
After the subs were used the team looked a total shambles and it was impossible to figure out who was playing where.
Both Stubbs and Mowbrays sides had a structure to them but it difficult to see what Maloneys preferred style is other than skittering about at the back and having the occasional flurry up the wings.

[Smartie]

Stubbs’ start was brutal.

The upturn in fortunes seemed to stem from him getting Scott Allan match fit and stumbling across the diamond formation (which was the formation that suited that group of players best).

A lot of the crap Hibs have played over the years seems to have come from playing one up front whilst having no strikers who could do the job justice. Only Griffiths and Killen for a spell have ever looked like being able to do it and we’ve had to watch some guff struggle with it over the years.

Maloney might only be a stroke of luck away from finding a blend that suits our players. We might look a different side when any one of 3 or 4 players gets fully match fit. Doesn’t really feel like it though.

[ScottB]

We weren’t exactly setting the heather alight before Maloney arrived, we’ve since lost our best player and only genuinely creative threat.

Added to that Doidge coming back from a bad injury and Nisbet going through ‘quite’ the dry spell and it’s a mess.

At this point, never know. Maybe Nisbet suddenly remembers how to score goals, maybe Melkerson comes in and is a revelation.

He has to be given time. Third is out of reach unless Hearts collapse big time, but we’re 2 points off 4th.

[Irish_Steve]

Hearts pressing us prompted that. Pure and simple.

So you moan when he rigidity sticks to his plan and moan when he changes it, he’s onto a winner with you

[Stairway 2 7]

John mcginn changes everything

[jacomo]

John mcginn changes everything


John McGinn didn’t sign until Stubbs’ second season so irrelevant to this discussion.

[jacomo]

He has made tactical changes during games and played a more direct style in the Derby.

Why are people just making stuff up to beat him with?


Well, it’s partly because this is an entirely self-inflicted situation.

Had Jack Ross been poached mid season by another club and we were forced to appoint a replacement, I believe Maloney would be given a lot more patience and goodwill.

But this is the guy we binned our incumbent for and our CEO promised us that he is the chosen one.

He’s being judged in that context.

[H18 SFR]

So you moan when he rigidity sticks to his plan and moan when he changes it, he’s onto a winner with you

You’re putting inaccurate words in my mouth.

I’m not aligned with what you have suggested.

[007]

Well, it’s partly because this is an entirely self-inflicted situation.

Had Jack Ross been poached mid season by another club and we were forced to appoint a replacement, I believe Maloney would be given a lot more patience and goodwill.

But this is the guy we binned our incumbent for and our CEO promised us that he is the chosen one.

He’s being judged in that context.

When did Kensall promise Maloney is "the chosen one"?

[The 90+2]

Well, it’s partly because this is an entirely self-inflicted situation.

Had Jack Ross been poached mid season by another club and we were forced to appoint a replacement, I believe Maloney would be given a lot more patience and goodwill.

But this is the guy we binned our incumbent for and our CEO promised us that he is the chosen one.

He’s being judged in that context.

I completely agree.

[The 90+2]

When did Kensall promise Maloney is "the chosen one"?


He did say we have a good group of players at the club Maloney is delighted to work with and improve.

[Since452]

Well, it’s partly because this is an entirely self-inflicted situation.

Had Jack Ross been poached mid season by another club and we were forced to appoint a replacement, I believe Maloney would be given a lot more patience and goodwill.

But this is the guy we binned our incumbent for and our CEO promised us that he is the chosen one.

He’s being judged in that context.

100% spot on. Maloney is the guy the club deemed to be better than Ross and take us to the next level. The CEO has heaped massive pressure on a rookie never mind a growing section of our fans. We've shot ourselves in the foot again. As we did in the summer transfer window. Wonder what the next mistake will be.

[CentreLine]

I am convinced that the difference with both Mowbray and Stubbs was their astute choice of assistant. In both cases of Mark Venus and in John Doolan, they were people who immediately got the club. Both were reputed to carry the lions share of coaching and both were great motivators. I am not convinced that Gary Caldwell has the same easy connection with the dressing room.

[jacomo]

When did Kensall promise Maloney is "the chosen one"?


I’m paraphrasing, but we were definitely told to be excited by his appointment.

Original quotes here about the ‘standout candidate’:

https://www.hibernianfc.co.uk/article/shaun-maloney-appointed-hibs-manager

That’s fine, of course. It’s the clubs job to talk up the new man and build excitement.

My point is, the circumstances around his appointment raise the stakes. You’ve got one group of supporters who, as they might see it, have pressured the club to bin a manager who wasn’t getting results, and another who will feel sore at Ross’ departure and waiting to be convinced it was the right call.

The ONLY thing Shaun can do is get wins, and swiftly. I hope he is pragmatic and focused enough to do that.

[LaMotta]

I am convinced that the difference with both Mowbray and Stubbs was their astute choice of assistant. In both cases of Mark Venus and in John Doolan, they were people who immediately got the club. Both were reputed to carry the lions share of coaching and both were great motivators. I am not convinced that Gary Caldwell has the same easy connection with the dressing room.


Mowbray and Stubbs were also convincing communicators. Generally wanted to listen to what they said. I find Maloney a hard listen, which isn't ideal for the manager of a football team.

[jacomo]

I am convinced that the difference with both Mowbray and Stubbs was their astute choice of assistant. In both cases of Mark Venus and in John Doolan, they were people who immediately got the club. Both were reputed to carry the lions share of coaching and both were great motivators. I am not convinced that Gary Caldwell has the same easy connection with the dressing room.


I try to forget Caldwell is back at our club. Stop reminding me!

[CentreLine]

I try to forget Caldwell is back at our club. Stop reminding me!

Yeh, I’m ashamed, sorry. I too try to compartmentalise that trauma. Can’t believe he’s around the club and I really don’t see his presence helping SM on any level. Just a personal prejudice I suppose😠

[WhileTheChief..]

I’m paraphrasing, but we were definitely told to be excited by his appointment.

Original quotes here about the ‘standout candidate’:

https://www.hibernianfc.co.uk/article/shaun-maloney-appointed-hibs-manager

That’s fine, of course. It’s the clubs job to talk up the new man and build excitement.

My point is, the circumstances around his appointment raise the stakes. You’ve got one group of supporters who, as they might see it, have pressured the club to bin a manager who wasn’t getting results, and another who will feel sore at Ross’ departure and waiting to be convinced it was the right call.

The ONLY thing Shaun can do is get wins, and swiftly. I hope he is pragmatic and focused enough to do that.

Were there other candidates?

Was it not jut that Kensall and Ross had fallen out so he went and got Maloney.

I don't think Maloney, (or anyone else?), applied for the job?

[tonyrougier123]

Guys on here a lot older than me seen a lot more managers come in and go.
But I’ve seen a few come in with an absolute shambles to work with,maloney is the first for me with a decent core of players and no real response to his methods.
I don’t at this point even know what he is trying to achieve.
We could’ve done so much better for a first team coach,and it feels already most feel this way.

Thing is we need a coach who can also manage a team.
Not sure the current and last in charge are capable of both.

[MrSmith]

Our transfer scattergun approach hasn’t helped but what is quite clear is, we don’t have the calibre of player to perform to SM’s vision. Much like JC 15 years ago. Sacking managers is not great and I so want SM to succeed but not recognising that we need two central mids is not a good start.

[Jones28]

So now Caldwell is the enemy because he signed a pre contract with Celtic 16 years ago 😂

[The 90+2]

I am convinced that the difference with both Mowbray and Stubbs was their astute choice of assistant. In both cases of Mark Venus and in John Doolan, they were people who immediately got the club. Both were reputed to carry the lions share of coaching and both were great motivators. I am not convinced that Gary Caldwell has the same easy connection with the dressing room.


Mark Proctor was a vital part of Mowbray's team - like Doolan.

Many at the club at the time where convinced he would replace TM. Sure we smashed Dunfermline away under him on a Monday, the football was sensational.

[jacomo]

So now Caldwell is the enemy because he signed a pre contract with Celtic 16 years ago 😂


What’s he bringing to the party? How does he complement the manager?

I’ll forgive him acting like a prick back then but I’d like to see some passion, some sense he’s really committed to this job.

Maybe he is but there’s no real sign of that from the outside.

[Jones28]

What’s he bringing to the party? How does he complement the manager?

I’ll forgive him acting like a prick back then but I’d like to see some passion, some sense he’s really committed to this job.

Maybe he is but there’s no real sign of that from the outside.

We don’t know, he’s been here for 8 games!

If the manager trusts him is that not enough?

If you had said to me Stubbs was bringing Doolan with him I wouldn’t have had a ****ing clue who he was. If you said to me a former club captain is coming in alongside the manager is that not the better option?

[The 90+2]

We don’t know, he’s been here for 8 games!

If the manager trusts him is that not enough?

If you had said to me Stubbs was bringing Doolan with him I wouldn’t have had a ****ing clue who he was. If you said to me a former club captain is coming in alongside the manager is that not the better option?

Souleymane Coulibaly has accused Gary Caldwell of ruining Partick Thistle (https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/all-about/partick-thistle-fc) and insists his old gaffer knows nothing about football.
The striker spent a season at Firhill but played just three games and scored no goals for the club.

And he was particularly frustrated at former Celtic defender Caldwell (https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/all-about/gary-caldwell) and insists he's fully to blame for them being relegated to League One.
The club were in the Premiership (https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/all-about/scottish-premiership) just a few years ago but have been on a downward spiral in recent seasons.
But Coulibaly insists Caldwell has no clue what he's doing when it comes to football.
He told thesetpieces.com: (https://thesetpieces.com/latest-posts/souleymane-coulibaly-i-could-be-playing-with-kane-at-spurs/) "He knew nothing about football. He didn’t play me, so I just played for the reserve team.

"Sometimes I would play in defence or midfield as well. When a manager doesn’t like you, you can’t do anything about it. I don’t know why he didn’t like me.
"Only he knows. But he doesn’t know anything about football because if he did Partick wouldn’t be in League One. He destroyed the club."

[Danderhall Hibs]

What’s he bringing to the party? How does he complement the manager?

I’ll forgive him acting like a prick back then but I’d like to see some passion, some sense he’s really committed to this job.

Maybe he is but there’s no real sign of that from the outside.

We’ve conceded less goals since he came in? Certainly less free headers.

[Jones28]

Souleymane Coulibaly has accused Gary Caldwell of ruining Partick Thistle (https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/all-about/partick-thistle-fc) and insists his old gaffer knows nothing about football.
The striker spent a season at Firhill but played just three games and scored no goals for the club.

And he was particularly frustrated at former Celtic defender Caldwell (https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/all-about/gary-caldwell) and insists he's fully to blame for them being relegated to League One.
The club were in the Premiership (https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/all-about/scottish-premiership) just a few years ago but have been on a downward spiral in recent seasons.
But Coulibaly insists Caldwell has no clue what he's doing when it comes to football.
He told thesetpieces.com: (https://thesetpieces.com/latest-posts/souleymane-coulibaly-i-could-be-playing-with-kane-at-spurs/) "He knew nothing about football. He didn’t play me, so I just played for the reserve team.

"Sometimes I would play in defence or midfield as well. When a manager doesn’t like you, you can’t do anything about it. I don’t know why he didn’t like me.
"Only he knows. But he doesn’t know anything about football because if he did Partick wouldn’t be in League One. He destroyed the club."

Ffs, scorned ex player releases interview slamming former gaffer😂

[007]

Souleymane Coulibaly has accused Gary Caldwell of ruining Partick Thistle (https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/all-about/partick-thistle-fc) and insists his old gaffer knows nothing about football.
The striker spent a season at Firhill but played just three games and scored no goals for the club.

And he was particularly frustrated at former Celtic defender Caldwell (https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/all-about/gary-caldwell) and insists he's fully to blame for them being relegated to League One.
The club were in the Premiership (https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/all-about/scottish-premiership) just a few years ago but have been on a downward spiral in recent seasons.
But Coulibaly insists Caldwell has no clue what he's doing when it comes to football.
He told thesetpieces.com: (https://thesetpieces.com/latest-posts/souleymane-coulibaly-i-could-be-playing-with-kane-at-spurs/) "He knew nothing about football. He didn’t play me, so I just played for the reserve team.

"Sometimes I would play in defence or midfield as well. When a manager doesn’t like you, you can’t do anything about it. I don’t know why he didn’t like me.
"Only he knows. But he doesn’t know anything about football because if he did Partick wouldn’t be in League One. He destroyed the club."

Player not being picked criticises manager shocker!

Souleymane Coulibaly who now plies his trade in the giddy heights of Tunisian football.

[Jones28]

Player not being picked criticises manager shocker!

Souleymane Coulibaly who now plies his trade in the giddy heights of Tunisian football.

Wow, really?

Well I had no idea he’d been so successful. I take it all back.

[007]

Wow, really?

Well I had no idea he’d been so successful. I take it all back.

😀

[The 90+2]

Ffs, scorned ex player releases interview slamming former gaffer😂


Player not being picked criticises manager shocker!

Souleymane Coulibaly who now plies his trade in the giddy heights of Tunisian football.


Some Partick fans say he was their worst ever manager and laughed at our appointment of him.

[JamesHFC]

Souleymane Coulibaly has accused Gary Caldwell of ruining Partick Thistle (https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/all-about/partick-thistle-fc) and insists his old gaffer knows nothing about football.
The striker spent a season at Firhill but played just three games and scored no goals for the club.

And he was particularly frustrated at former Celtic defender Caldwell (https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/all-about/gary-caldwell) and insists he's fully to blame for them being relegated to League One.
The club were in the Premiership (https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/all-about/scottish-premiership) just a few years ago but have been on a downward spiral in recent seasons.
But Coulibaly insists Caldwell has no clue what he's doing when it comes to football.
He told thesetpieces.com: (https://thesetpieces.com/latest-posts/souleymane-coulibaly-i-could-be-playing-with-kane-at-spurs/) "He knew nothing about football. He didn’t play me, so I just played for the reserve team.

"Sometimes I would play in defence or midfield as well. When a manager doesn’t like you, you can’t do anything about it. I don’t know why he didn’t like me.
"Only he knows. But he doesn’t know anything about football because if he did Partick wouldn’t be in League One. He destroyed the club."

Football coach who won the Scottish Premiership twice, FA Cup and Scottish League Cup as a player as well as winning a league title as manager apparently knows nothing about football. Dearie me 🤣

[007]

Some Partick fans say he was their worst ever manager and laughed at our appointment of him.

Some St Mirren fans think Stubbs was their worst ever manager.

Besides, Caldwell isn't our manager. Maybe he's suited to being a number 2.

[Allant1981]

Souleymane Coulibaly has accused Gary Caldwell of ruining Partick Thistle (https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/all-about/partick-thistle-fc) and insists his old gaffer knows nothing about football.
The striker spent a season at Firhill but played just three games and scored no goals for the club.

And he was particularly frustrated at former Celtic defender Caldwell (https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/all-about/gary-caldwell) and insists he's fully to blame for them being relegated to League One.
The club were in the Premiership (https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/all-about/scottish-premiership) just a few years ago but have been on a downward spiral in recent seasons.
But Coulibaly insists Caldwell has no clue what he's doing when it comes to football.
He told thesetpieces.com: (https://thesetpieces.com/latest-posts/souleymane-coulibaly-i-could-be-playing-with-kane-at-spurs/) "He knew nothing about football. He didn’t play me, so I just played for the reserve team.

"Sometimes I would play in defence or midfield as well. When a manager doesn’t like you, you can’t do anything about it. I don’t know why he didn’t like me.
"Only he knows. But he doesn’t know anything about football because if he did Partick wouldn’t be in League One. He destroyed the club."

Player who didnt get much game time isnt happy with previous manager - shocker!

[Jones28]

Some Partick fans say he was their worst ever manager and laughed at our appointment of him.

He’s not our manager. He’s the assistant.