Yorkshire cricket club.

[mjhibby]

The chairman has resigned as have many non executive board members. Absolutely appalling its taken the loss of test match status and major sponsors for them to go. Can't see this happening with the bigoted clubs in Scotland. The so called accidental playing of the Billy's boys song at the pbs shows what we already knew regards some boots there. Of course the biggest by far are at castle greyskull and its to Scotland shame that nothing is done regards the sectarian singing. All the outrage at racism to their players looks hollow when they ignore the abhorrent goings on at their club. That nobody expects it to change is utterly damming on Scottish society.

[Tobias Funke]

The chairman has resigned as have many non executive board members. Absolutely appalling its taken the loss of test match status and major sponsors for them to go.

Reminds me of when Muirfield GC backed down on barring female members when their course was removed from the Open rota. :rolleyes:

I see Michael Vaughan has been implicated and his alleged comments have been corroborated by ex Yorkshire seamer Naved-Ul-Hasan.

[stu in nottingham]

Apparently, Yorkshire CCC have lost around eight sponsors since this story was reported, including the major one of Nike. Imagining that they could brush this under the carpet after the investigation has been an expensive mistake for them. Unless you're the Prime Minister, you just can't get away with this stuff nowadays and I'm surprised how naive they've been in thinking they could.

[brianmc]

The chairman has resigned as have many non executive board members. Absolutely appalling its taken the loss of test match status and major sponsors for them to go. Can't see this happening with the bigoted clubs in Scotland. The so called accidental playing of the Billy's boys song at the pbs shows what we already knew regards some boots there. Of course the biggest by far are at castle greyskull and its to Scotland shame that nothing is done regards the sectarian singing. All the outrage at racism to their players looks hollow when they ignore the abhorrent goings on at their club. That nobody expects it to change is utterly damming on Scottish society.

Billy boy's song?
I hate racism and sectarianism - but I hate people making up 'facts' to suit their own agenda more.

It just cheapens the whole debate.

[LancashireHibby]

Should ban them from all cricket forever as far as I’m concerned. The whole county. Everybody.

[lapsedhibee]

Should ban them from all cricket forever as far as I’m concerned. The whole county. Everybody.

:greengrin

[Bostonhibby]

Should ban them from all cricket forever as far as I’m concerned. The whole county. Everybody.Used to work on sites in Yakshire and with quite a few natives, they swept up all sorts of horrible stuff like this under the banner of banter.

Many will struggle to see that there's anything wrong with this episode.

Sent from my SM-A750FN using Tapatalk

[heretoday]

Should ban them from all cricket forever as far as I’m concerned. The whole county. Everybody.

Ban cricket altogether. It's not cricket anymore.

[Bostonhibby]

Ban cricket altogether. It's not cricket anymore.Rounders for folk that weren't any good at rounders but like tea and cake.

Sent from my SM-A750FN using Tapatalk

[LancashireHibby]

Ban cricket altogether. It's not cricket anymore.
How’s that?

[FromLeithtoNZ]

Before condemning everyone at Yorkshire CCC, lets wait for the facts, all the facts. In these ultra sensitive times, we are very quick to assume guilt based on nothing more than an accusation. If there are genuine issues, they need to be addressed, no question. I am concerned however at the current trend of 'cancelling' and publicly shaming people based on something they may or may not have said. This is especially concerning when alleged comments were made many years in the past. We are heading down a dangerous path, where anyone who has been deemed a witch, is a witch. If you defend them, you're a witch too. This mass hysteria which is drummed up by the church of woke has become a serious problem. That said, if people at the cricket claim routinely racially abused players and/or staff, they need to stand up and admit it. Have the courage to admit you were wrong and sincerely apologise. If that happens, we need to allow people to move on. In this cut throat woke world, there is no room for forgiveness. Surely we've all said things in the past we now regret. I remember what we all called the corner shop. How many of you bought a meal from the Chinese takeaway. Remember what we called that? Do I still use those terms now? No, of course not. I've grown up, matured and realise it's not fair or right to use the terms I used to use as a teenager. I'd like to think we all live and learn and we can all be better people. This absolute frenzy however, of removing everyone and everything which does not fit with woke orthodoxy has become become a purge. Two regimes arose in the 20th century with monstrous results. They purged everyone who wouldn't agree with their rules. We need to be very careful not to condemn those who genuinely have changed. Please understand, that I am not condoning racism. It should called out when we come across it. I do strongly believe that people can and do change however. If any of you want to throw the first stone, go ahead. Unfortunately, I can't do that, because I'm not perfect and I am choosing to be better, not because the mob tell me to, but because I believe that being racist is wrong. Ultimately, most people today agree I think. If you want to sleep at night and think of yourself as a decent person, you can't be racist. Sorry lads, long post.

[FromLeithtoNZ]

The chairman has resigned as have many non executive board members. Absolutely appalling its taken the loss of test match status and major sponsors for them to go. Can't see this happening with the bigoted clubs in Scotland. The so called accidental playing of the Billy's boys song at the pbs shows what we already knew regards some boots there. Of course the biggest by far are at castle greyskull and its to Scotland shame that nothing is done regards the sectarian singing. All the outrage at racism to their players looks hollow when they ignore the abhorrent goings on at their club. That nobody expects it to change is utterly damming on Scottish society.

You make a good point. Whilst I think some rangers fans have moved on, many haven't. To those who have put sectarianism behind them, fair play, we salute you and are pleased you've grown up. The problem is, a vast number of them still continue to hold the view they've always held. Whilst most Hearts fans are angered by the playing of the sash, rangers fans seem to be applauding it. I don't buy the argument that it's a minority. For me, they are just a bit quieter about it these days. Behind closed doors, the same songs are sung. As I've said in another post, we've all said and done things as younger men we're not proud of. There are decent rangers fans who aren't bigots. It's not fair to tar them all with the same brush. The truth is though so many of them are unrepentant. That is the issue. You can shake a mans hand if he says, I was wrong and I've changed. If he doesn't do things he used to do, you can respect that. I just don't see that enough is done at rangers to combat the vile sectarian thread that permeates the club. The fans themselves need to change it. The club can officially say what it likes. It makes little difference. The fans of that club need to ask themselves what they stand for. This to me is very different from the Yorkshire CCC situation. In that case, a few individuals might have said questionable things and now need to front up. Glasgow rangers however, is a club built on hate and sustained by hate for 150 years. So, the message to those decent rangers fans is, speak up and call it out. Do the right thing and be better men.

[lapsedhibee]

Before condemning everyone at Yorkshire CCC, lets wait for the facts, all the facts. In these ultra sensitive times, we are very quick to assume guilt based on nothing more than an accusation. If there are genuine issues, they need to be addressed, no question. I am concerned however at the current trend of 'cancelling' and publicly shaming people based on something they may or may not have said. This is especially concerning when alleged comments were made many years in the past. We are heading down a dangerous path, where anyone who has been deemed a witch, is a witch. If you defend them, you're a witch too. This mass hysteria which is drummed up by the church of woke has become a serious problem. That said, if people at the cricket claim routinely racially abused players and/or staff, they need to stand up and admit it. Have the courage to admit you were wrong and sincerely apologise. If that happens, we need to allow people to move on. In this cut throat woke world, there is no room for forgiveness. Surely we've all said things in the past we now regret. I remember what we all called the corner shop. How many of you bought a meal from the Chinese takeaway. Remember what we called that? Do I still use those terms now? No, of course not. I've grown up, matured and realise it's not fair or right to use the terms I used to use as a teenager. I'd like to think we all live and learn and we can all be better people. This absolute frenzy however, of removing everyone and everything which does not fit with woke orthodoxy has become become a purge. Two regimes arose in the 20th century with monstrous results. They purged everyone who wouldn't agree with their rules. We need to be very careful not to condemn those who genuinely have changed. Please understand, that I am not condoning racism. It should called out when we come across it. I do strongly believe that people can and do change however. If any of you want to throw the first stone, go ahead. Unfortunately, I can't do that, because I'm not perfect and I am choosing to be better, not because the mob tell me to, but because I believe that being racist is wrong. Ultimately, most people today agree I think. If you want to sleep at night and think of yourself as a decent person, you can't be racist. Sorry lads, long post.

Woke people are a bit like Nazis? :confused:

[FromLeithtoNZ]

Reminds me of when Muirfield GC backed down on barring female members when their course was removed from the Open rota. :rolleyes:

I see Michael Vaughan has been implicated and his alleged comments have been corroborated by ex Yorkshire seamer Naved-Ul-Hasan.

Muirfield Golf Club made changes, but I'm still waiting for application to join the Women's Institute to be approved. Oh wait, that's a one-way street isn't it. What's hers is hers and what's your is hers. All for equality when it really is equality, but what we have today is quite the opposite. Two wrongs have never made a right yet.

[CropleyWasGod]

Muirfield Golf Club made changes, but I'm still waiting for application to join the Women's Institute to be approved. Oh wait, that's a one-way street isn't it. What's hers is hers and what's your is hers. All for equality when it really is equality, but what we have today is quite the opposite. Two wrongs have never made a right yet.

You can set up your own single-gender charity if you want. That would be protected by law.

And there are many men's support groups throughout the country, both formal and informal.

[HH81]

Having watched a fair few games at Headingley over the years this is pretty poor.

Do I attend any next summer? I shall see but this is very poor and needs sorting so it never happens again.

Ps Matt, banning all cricket in Yorkshire is the only way you will ever finish above them 😁.

[neil7908]

Muirfield Golf Club made changes, but I'm still waiting for application to join the Women's Institute to be approved. Oh wait, that's a one-way street isn't it. What's hers is hers and what's your is hers. All for equality when it really is equality, but what we have today is quite the opposite. Two wrongs have never made a right yet.

You can't see the difference between the Women's Institute and a golf club that hosts major international tournaments but doesn't fancy letting half of the world's population use their course?

[He's here!]

Before condemning everyone at Yorkshire CCC, lets wait for the facts, all the facts. In these ultra sensitive times, we are very quick to assume guilt based on nothing more than an accusation. If there are genuine issues, they need to be addressed, no question. I am concerned however at the current trend of 'cancelling' and publicly shaming people based on something they may or may not have said. This is especially concerning when alleged comments were made many years in the past. We are heading down a dangerous path, where anyone who has been deemed a witch, is a witch. If you defend them, you're a witch too. This mass hysteria which is drummed up by the church of woke has become a serious problem. That said, if people at the cricket claim routinely racially abused players and/or staff, they need to stand up and admit it. Have the courage to admit you were wrong and sincerely apologise. If that happens, we need to allow people to move on. In this cut throat woke world, there is no room for forgiveness. Surely we've all said things in the past we now regret. I remember what we all called the corner shop. How many of you bought a meal from the Chinese takeaway. Remember what we called that? Do I still use those terms now? No, of course not. I've grown up, matured and realise it's not fair or right to use the terms I used to use as a teenager. I'd like to think we all live and learn and we can all be better people. This absolute frenzy however, of removing everyone and everything which does not fit with woke orthodoxy has become become a purge. Two regimes arose in the 20th century with monstrous results. They purged everyone who wouldn't agree with their rules. We need to be very careful not to condemn those who genuinely have changed. Please understand, that I am not condoning racism. It should called out when we come across it. I do strongly believe that people can and do change however. If any of you want to throw the first stone, go ahead. Unfortunately, I can't do that, because I'm not perfect and I am choosing to be better, not because the mob tell me to, but because I believe that being racist is wrong. Ultimately, most people today agree I think. If you want to sleep at night and think of yourself as a decent person, you can't be racist. Sorry lads, long post.

You make some good points there.

[stuart-farquhar]

I booked test tickets for next year and arranged a holiday around it. Stupid xxxxxxx xxxxx xxxxx.
Is it ok to still drink Landlord!?

[LancashireHibby]

Having watched a fair few games at Headingley over the years this is pretty poor.

Do I attend any next summer? I shall see but this is very poor and needs sorting so it never happens again.

Ps Matt, banning all cricket in Yorkshire is the only way you will ever finish above them 😁.

Apart from this year's County Championship, obviously :cb

[CMurdoch]

You can't see the difference between the Women's Institute and a golf club that hosts major international tournaments but doesn't fancy letting half of the world's population use their course?

I don't think Muirfield are keen on poor people or small dead comedians either

[Chorley Hibee]

Should ban them from all cricket forever as far as I’m concerned. The whole county. Everybody.

I echo this rational statement.

[Pedantic_Hibee]

Fat men’s baseball.

[Hibbyradge]

Lovely bloke.

https://news.sky.com/video/tpos-4-patel-12462761

[EI255]

Ban cricket altogether. It's not cricket anymore.Just ban it. Its p15h!

Sent from my LG-H870 using Tapatalk

[Northernhibee]

Some of Azeem Rafiq's evidence given to a committee today is absolutely horrific.

[ronaldo7]

Some of Azeem Rafiq's evidence given to a committee today is absolutely horrific.

He's been very forthright in his condemnation of "his club", and further afield. Some of the evidence is excruciating to listen to, but hopefully will lift the veil on the racists running the game.

The players union also let him down badly, and need to be held to account.

[Hibbyradge]

Some of Azeem Rafiq's evidence given to a committee today is absolutely horrific.

Where can I read this?

[heretoday]

I see cuddly Bumble Lloyd's name mentioned in this nasty business.
Him and Vaughan both Lancastrians ironically.

[Hibbyradge]

Just ban it. Its p15h!

Sent from my LG-H870 using Tapatalk

I'll translate..."I don't understand cricket, I am unaware of the athletic abilities, and speed of thought and reactions required to play the sport at elite level, and cricket's tactics are quite complicated, therefore I don't like it". :wink:

[DaveF]

I see cuddly Bumble Lloyd's name mentioned in this nasty business.
Him and Vaughan both Lancastrians ironically.

Lloyd, Hoggard, Vaughn, Ballance and Hales all get a mention. Those just the ex England players though.

I'm surprised some of the black players from years gone by have not stepped forward. Seems difficult to believe that people like Malcolm, Lewis, Lawrence etc didn't suffer as much if not worse.

[heretoday]

Lloyd, Hoggard, Vaughn, Ballance and Hales all get a mention. Those just the ex England players though.

I'm surprised some of the black players from years gone by have not stepped forward. Seems difficult to believe that people like Malcolm, Lewis, Lawrence etc didn't suffer as much if not worse.

Michael Holding has been talking lately but I notice he doesn't mention names.

[IWasThere2016]

If we are - rightly - going to call this out and ban/sack individuals etc can someone please do so for the PM?

Should be not be sacked after all his previous???

[gbhibby]

Unfortunately there is still a culture of Racism in our society, We have a PM who has made racist comments in the past. Yorkshire cricket clubs situation will be mirrored in many work places throughout the country, in Scotland it will also include Sectarian issues.

[heretoday]

Mark Ramprakash on five live trying not to comment on his own experience as a county player. He sounds like a Tory MP avoiding the main question!

The thing is that guys like Nasser Hussein and Ramprakash were of mixed race.

They didn't come in for harsh treatment like Rafiq and others.

[Radium]

https://youtu.be/HZ-pUulZZyo

Politics Joe coverage of Azeem Rafiq’s testimony.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[mjhibby]

Absolutely appealing what he's been through. Guys are scared to speak out in case it finishes their careers. They thought he wouldn't follow through on his numerous com plaints but he showed tremendous courage. The behaviour of the Yorkshire board beggars belief. Of course the tories set up a committee to decide there was no institutional racism in this country totally flying in the face of thousands of folks experience in sport especially.
The brex**** nonsense made things infinitely worse and it will take at least a generation before this dissipates. Loads of folk in Yorkshire need to take a look in the mirror and sort themselves out. Feel so sorry what he and many others have been through. Only matthew haggard phoned him to unreservedly apologise for any harm he caused. Shows how much compassion the club had. Makes my blood boil.

[JimBHibees]

Absolutely appealing what he's been through. Guys are scared to speak out in case it finishes their careers. They thought he wouldn't follow through on his numerous com plaints but he showed tremendous courage. The behaviour of the Yorkshire board beggars belief. Of course the tories set up a committee to decide there was no institutional racism in this country totally flying in the face of thousands of folks experience in sport especially.
The brex**** nonsense made things infinitely worse and it will take at least a generation before this dissipates. Loads of folk in Yorkshire need to take a look in the mirror and sort themselves out. Feel so sorry what he and many others have been through. Only matthew haggard phoned him to unreservedly apologise for any harm he caused. Shows how much compassion the club had. Makes my blood boil.

Yep absolutely disgusting to be honest. Very brave to do what he has done. The leadership at that club obviously rotten to the core

[Hibrandenburg]

YCC are only a mirror image of our society. What these Asian cricketers have experienced is happening every day in the workplace, clubs and schools throughout the country. Hopefully the bravery of these guys using their high profile status will have a trickle down effect on racism in the wider society.

[DaveF]

Absolutely appealing what he's been through. Guys are scared to speak out in case it finishes their careers. They thought he wouldn't follow through on his numerous com plaints but he showed tremendous courage. The behaviour of the Yorkshire board beggars belief. Of course the tories set up a committee to decide there was no institutional racism in this country totally flying in the face of thousands of folks experience in sport especially.
The brex**** nonsense made things infinitely worse and it will take at least a generation before this dissipates. Loads of folk in Yorkshire need to take a look in the mirror and sort themselves out. Feel so sorry what he and many others have been through. Only matthew haggard phoned him to unreservedly apologise for any harm he caused. Shows how much compassion the club had. Makes my blood boil.

I know you meant appalling but it's quite apt in a cricketing context 🙂

[Stairway 2 7]

YCC are only a mirror image of our society. What these Asian cricketers have experienced is happening every day in the workplace, clubs and schools throughout the country. Hopefully the bravery of these guys using their high profile status will have a trickle down effect on racism in the wider society.

I don't think so. While there are racist pricks in every job they're is no way it would be so open. I'd think almost every hr department would treat it more seriously.

As for schools outside Edinburgh might be different but my daughters school is unbelievably multi cultural, certainly a different world from when I went. My daughters big group of pals are from all over, I think racism seems a sad old thing from the past to them. I think things are changing for the better albeit slowly and from a crap start, just not in the upper echelons of tory racists ****

[He's here!]

I note that the issue is now coming under scrutiny in Scottish cricket:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/59309658

I'm no cricket expert (though I have enjoyed sitting with a beer at a sunny Grange in Edinburgh watching a few Scotland games down the years) but I'm a bit surprised that racism is so allegedly widespread in the game when you bear in mind its popularity among Asians/ethnic minorities in the UK. However, as Majid Haq points out in that article perhaps they're under-represented at higher levels of the game and there are issues at play which are responsible for that.

[gbhibby]

I don't think so. While there are racist pricks in every job they're is no way it would be so open. I'd think almost every hr department would treat it more seriously.

As for schools outside Edinburgh might be different but my daughters school is unbelievably multi cultural, certainly a different world from when I went. My daughters big group of pals are from all over, I think racism seems a sad old thing from the past to them. I think things are changing for the better albeit slowly and from a crap start, just not in the upper echelons of tory racists ****
Ask any Asian/black taxi phc drivers in Edinburgh the racist abuse they suffer comes from youngsters and through the age spectrum to the oldest in society.

[Stairway 2 7]

Ask any Asian/black taxi phc drivers in Edinburgh the racist abuse they suffer comes from youngsters and through the age spectrum to the oldest in society.

I'm still certain whilst will be a decent percentage in every age it will be much more heavily skewed to the older generation. Most under 18 that go to a state school will have bame friends, which helps change things for the better. My point wasn't there isn't racists just in almost every workplace it would be treated better by her departments

[Sergio sledge]

I note that the issue is now coming under scrutiny in Scottish cricket:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/59309658

I'm no cricket expert (though I have enjoyed sitting with a beer at a sunny Grange in Edinburgh watching a few Scotland games down the years) but I'm a bit surprised that racism is so allegedly widespread in the game when you bear in mind its popularity among Asians/ethnic minorities in the UK. However, as Majid Haq points out in that article perhaps they're under-represented at higher levels of the game and there are issues at play which are responsible for that.The under-representation at the top level is an indicator of the bigger underlying problem. I heard a crazy stat that if you go into Bradford, 85% of youth cricketers are of Asian descent and yet Yorkshire have only had 4 British born Asian players at county level in their history. I don't know if that's right or not, but it is unbelievable if true.

These kids are being forced out of the game because of the culture in cricket clubs where racism and abuse is passed off as "banter" as the Yorkshire CCC reaction to the report tried to do.

[gbhibby]

I'm still certain whilst will be a decent percentage in every age it will be much more heavily skewed to the older generation. Most under 18 that go to a state school will have bame friends, which helps change things for the better. My point wasn't there isn't racists just in almost every workplace it would be treated better by her departments
The schools are multi cultural and do teach equality but most racism/bigotry is taught at home.

[Radium]

https://twitter.com/ejrainfordbrent/status/1461058046650691584?s=21


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[hibsbollah]

Ask any Asian/black taxi phc drivers in Edinburgh the racist abuse they suffer comes from youngsters and through the age spectrum to the oldest in society.

:agree: My son has a number of openly racist classmates, both in the language they use and the ideas they spout. He’s 14. It’s not just a previous generations problem.

[Stairway 2 7]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.com/sport/cricket/59338118.amp

Azeem Rafiq apologises for historical anti-Semitic messages.

Doesn't make Yorkshires behaviour less abhorrent though

[He's here!]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.com/sport/cricket/59338118.amp

Azeem Rafiq apologises for historical anti-Semitic messages.

Doesn't make Yorkshires behaviour less abhorrent though

True, though it's not a great look for him to be admitting to sending racist messages himself.

[heretoday]

:agree: My son has a number of openly racist classmates, both in the language they use and the ideas they spout. He’s 14. It’s not just a previous generations problem.
Sit on a bus at school's out time and you’ll hear unbelievable anti gay stuff coming from the kids. They have to get that at home.

[Renfrew_Hibby]

Looks like cricket's going to need an army or pr consultants and a few years of rebrands and the like to overcome this. Seems to be endemic throughout the professional county game.

[Hibrandenburg]

:agree: My son has a number of openly racist classmates, both in the language they use and the ideas they spout. He’s 14. It’s not just a previous generations problem.

:agree: Anyone who thinks otherwise are kidding themselves.

[gbhibby]

:agree: My son has a number of openly racist classmates, both in the language they use and the ideas they spout. He’s 14. It’s not just a previous generations problem.
The private schools are probably the worst breeding grounds especially South of the border.

[hibsbollah]

The private schools are probably the worst breeding grounds especially South of the border.

I’m not sure I agree with that. I think it goes across all social classes and it’s a problem up here too. Schools are generally a good thing in this regard, whether state or private, education is always the enemy of ignorance.

[Paul1642]

:agree: My son has a number of openly racist classmates, both in the language they use and the ideas they spout. He’s 14. It’s not just a previous generations problem.

It was the same when I was at School 15 years ago (I feel old writing that). Now out of the ones I still keep in touch with none of the lads who were giving it racist crap are remotely racist and some have partners of varying ethnicity. They weren’t learning that behaviour at home either and generally had good parents who didn’t have a clue what they were up to when out with friends. Teenage boys are just a thick bunch and most grow out of it. Doesn’t make it right but society would be screwed if teenagers were a true indication of the future generation.

[gbhibby]

It was the same when I was at School 15 years ago (I feel old writing that). Now out of the ones I still keep in touch with none of the lads who were giving it racist crap are remotely racist and some have partners of varying ethnicity. They weren’t learning that behaviour at home either and generally had good parents who didn’t have a clue what they were up to when out with friends. Teenage boys are just a thick bunch and most grow out of it. Doesn’t make it right but society would be screwed if teenagers were a true indication of the future generation.
The problem is the people that don't move on and mirror their parents behaviours. Glad to hear your friends have grown out of it. Peer group pressure plays its part. Brexit was so divisive as in areas of England as it brought out the worst in people and became an immigration/race issue. The UK has now become a much worse place because of it.

[Smartie]

True, though it's not a great look for him to be admitting to sending racist messages himself.

It's interesting the scrutiny you come under if you speak out against bigotry involving traditional white, British institutions like Rangers and Yorkshire.

Personally, I think it's disgusting, and it's a counter attack used by hateful bigots who have no intention of changing their ways, moving with the times or being decent human beings.

[CropleyWasGod]

It's interesting the scrutiny you come under if you speak out against bigotry involving traditional white, British institutions like Rangers and Yorkshire.

Personally, I think it's disgusting, and it's a counter attack used by hateful bigots who have no intention of changing their ways, moving with the times or being decent human beings.

Yeah, I did wonder who had been tasked with finding some dirt on him.

[Danderhall Hibs]

It's interesting the scrutiny you come under if you speak out against bigotry involving traditional white, British institutions like Rangers and Yorkshire.

Personally, I think it's disgusting, and it's a counter attack used by hateful bigots who have no intention of changing their ways, moving with the times or being decent human beings.

He was right to apologise - he should’ve come out up front with it.

Clearly done to discredit him though.

[WhileTheChief..]

Rugby will be next.

How many clubs have board members that aren't white? I doubt there's any in Scotland.

[He's here!]

He was right to apologise - he should’ve come out up front with it.

Clearly done to discredit him though.

Suspect the expansive nature of his apology (ie alluding to unspecified 'other mistakes') was an attempt to pre-empt further damaging revelations about him which are set to come out.

As others have said the fact he's been revealed to have made such discriminatory comments himself while accusing others of racism doesn't necessarily diminish his claims the game is racist. It does, however, make him look more like part of the problem.

[He's here!]

Rugby will be next.

How many clubs have board members that aren't white? I doubt there's any in Scotland.

Does not having non-white board members necessarily constitute racism? How many Scottish football boards would fall foul of that? Or indeed club boards across the whole Scottish sporting spectrum.

[WhileTheChief..]

Does not having non-white board members necessarily constitute racism? How many Scottish football boards would fall foul of that? Or indeed club boards across the whole Scottish sporting spectrum.

I wouldn't say so, but plenty would.

[Keith_M]

I see Azeem Rafiq is one of the many that are really sorry... that they themselves have been caught being racist.

It's funny how the apologies only ever start flowing when the accused is caught red-handed.

[He's here!]

I see Azeem Rafiq is one of the many that are really sorry... that they themselves have been caught being racist.

It's funny how the apologies only ever start flowing when the accused is caught red-handed.

There does appear to be some hypocrisy here, particularly among those for whom these developments don't fit the narrative. More is being made by some of the fact Rafiq's tweets were 'historic' than the fact he's had to apologise for making racist comments himself. That doesn't seem to be a 'get out' for others who've had their social media feeds scrutinised for offensive comments they can then be hung out to dry for.

[Keith_M]

There does appear to be some hypocrisy here, particularly among those for whom these developments don't fit the narrative. More is being made by some of the fact Rafiq's tweets were 'historic' than the fact he's had to apologise for making racist comments himself. That doesn't seem to be a 'get out' for others who've had their social media feeds scrutinised for offensive comments they can then be hung out to dry for.


Marina Hyde has described it as a 'heartfelt apology'. There's a strong whiff of double standards here.


BTW, I totally agree with the point raised by a few people that this shouldn't in any way distract from the racism investigation into YCC.... I just can't stand the hypocrisy from some people.

[Hibrandenburg]

Marina Hyde has described it as a 'heartfelt apology'. There's a strong whiff of double standards here.


BTW, I totally agree with the point raised by a few people that this shouldn't in any way distract from the racism investigation into YCC.... I just can't stand the hypocrisy from some people.

There's a definite stink of hypocrisy here.........HOWEVER, I think we need to distinguish between racist language and racist behaviour. Whilst both are abhorrent the latter is definitely worse.

[Hibbyradge]

Marina Hyde has described it as a 'heartfelt apology'. There's a strong whiff of double standards here.


BTW, I totally agree with the point raised by a few people that this shouldn't in any way distract from the racism investigation into YCC.... I just can't stand the hypocrisy from some people.

I can honestly say that when I was 19 like him, I never said anything stupid or racist or sexist.

Frankly, I have no idea what I said in the year after I left school, but I can honestly say that I was squeaky clean because Twitter didn't exist and there is no proof to the contrary.

The Yorkshire players and officials firstly defended the racism and secondly, were a lot older than 19.

[mjhibby]

I think a few are losing sight of the realities of this situation. Yorkshire and most northern areas of England have massive amount of Asian youngsters playing cricket but very few go beyond their teens. There must be loads of potential first class players not coming through the system. Nothing to do with meaningless quotas. What this week has shown is those involved in cricket have known for years but didn't want to leave themselves open to a huge backlash by putting their heads above the parapet. I have met so many Asian cricket players and fans and they love their game. Its ridiculous that society can't see how much in the dark ages huge swathes of folk in England are. Utterly shameful that it has taken so long for this horrendous situation to be fully exposed.

[Lancs Harp]

As a proud Lancastrian I think Yorkshire CCC should do the honourable thing and fold. :wink:

[He's here!]

I think a few are losing sight of the realities of this situation. Yorkshire and most northern areas of England have massive amount of Asian youngsters playing cricket but very few go beyond their teens. There must be loads of potential first class players not coming through the system. Nothing to do with meaningless quotas. What this week has shown is those involved in cricket have known for years but didn't want to leave themselves open to a huge backlash by putting their heads above the parapet. I have met so many Asian cricket players and fans and they love their game. Its ridiculous that society can't see how much in the dark ages huge swathes of folk in England are. Utterly shameful that it has taken so long for this horrendous situation to be fully exposed.

How about other sports like football? Why are there so few Asian players in the UK despite as you say our large Asian population, many of whom I imagine love the game as much as cricket.

I'd suggest it's a generalisation to say it's only 'people in England' who are in the dark ages when you consider the scarcely believable, almost medieval guff that still hangs heavy over the Old Firm (to use the most obvious example in Scotland). Perhaps no coincidence that by far Scotland's largest Asian community is in the south side of Glasgow yet doesn't seem to provide many, if any, players to such huge football clubs.

[He's here!]

I can honestly say that when I was 19 like him, I never said anything stupid or racist or sexist.

Frankly, I have no idea what I said in the year after I left school, but I can honestly say that I was squeaky clean because Twitter didn't exist and there is no proof to the contrary.

The Yorkshire players and officials firstly defended the racism and secondly, were a lot older than 19.

What surprised me is that somebody who has made so much of being subjected to racism all his life would not know better by 19 than to post discriminatory stuff like that.

I like to think I never exhibited any racist behaviour when I was that age but then if I stop to think about it when I was at uni many years ago there was a corner shop in Glasgow which was routinely referred to by students as the 'white p*k* shop' due to the fact it seemed like an Asian shop but was run by a white guy. It was only when an Asian student asked asked why it was known as that that I stopped to think how offensive it sounded. Different times for sure.

[Smartie]

What surprised me is that somebody who has made so much of being subjected to racism all his life would not know better by 19 than to post discriminatory stuff like that.

I like to think I never exhibited any racist behaviour when I was that age but then if I stop to think about it when I was at uni many years ago there was a corner shop in Glasgow which was routinely referred to by students as the 'white p*k* shop' due to the fact it seemed like an Asian shop but was run by a white guy. It was only when an Asian student asked student asked why it was known as that that I stopped to think how offensive it sounded. Different times for sure.

Your example sort of proves the danger in only accepting claims of racism from people whose behaviour has been impossibly impeccable all their days. I guess everyone will have an example of a time they were wrong, had to learn they wrong, move on and not repeat it.

Yes, his historical comments don't sound great and the people highlighting the hypocrisy do have a point to an extent, but it's a crap argument in my opinion that the best certain institutions can do is to launch counter attacks to damage the credibility of the complainant. It pretty much backs up why the complaint was needed in the first place and like with our bluenosed and orange shirted friends in the West, is a tool used by people who are utterly in denial that the world has moved on and left them behind and that they need to change.

[Hibbyradge]

Your example sort of proves the danger in only accepting claims of racism from people whose behaviour has been impossibly impeccable all their days. I guess everyone will have an example of a time they were wrong, had to learn they wrong, move on and not repeat it.

Yes, his historical comments don't sound great and the people highlighting the hypocrisy do have a point to an extent, but it's a crap argument in my opinion that the best certain institutions can do is to launch counter attacks to damage the credibility of the complainant. It pretty much backs up why the complaint was needed in the first place and like with our bluenosed and orange shirted friends in the West, is a tool used by people who are utterly in denial that the world has moved on and left them behind and that they need to change.

Exactly. He's accepted that his behaviour and actions were poor, he has apologised and made no attempt to justify it. There is zero chance that he will repeat that behaviour.

YCC have defended their behaviour, blamed the victim and almost promised that they won't change.

[Keith_M]

Exactly. He's accepted that his behaviour and actions were poor, he has apologised and made no attempt to justify it. There is zero chance that he will repeat that behaviour.

YCC have defended their behaviour, blamed the victim and almost promised that they won't change.


I was the one that mentioned his apology, as it just seemed like yet another in a long line of people that only ever apologise when they've been caught red-handed.

[Smartie]

I was the one that mentioned his apology, as it just seemed like yet another in a long line of people that only ever apologise when they've been caught red-handed.

Is now the time for me to apologise publicly for everything I've done wrong earlier in my life?

Or would that apology only really be necessary with some sort of context and if the previous issue(s) meant that new people had been hurt or offended by what I'd done or said?

[Keith_M]

Is now the time for me to apologise publicly for everything I've done wrong earlier in my life?

Or would that apology only really be necessary with some sort of context and if the previous issue(s) meant that new people had been hurt or offended by what I'd done or said?


OK, let's go with that thought and start applying it to absolutely everybody:... friend or foe... SNP, Labour, Tory... Mother Theresa or Donald Trump.

[gbhibby]

As a proud Lancastrian I think Yorkshire CCC should do the honourable thing and fold. :wink:
But they will return as The Yorkshire CCC.

[Hibbyradge]

I was the one that mentioned his apology, as it just seemed like yet another in a long line of people that only ever apologise when they've been caught red-handed.

If YCC had apologised when they were "caught red handed" like he did, we wouldn't be having this conversation.

[DaveF]

Nothing to do with Yorkshire but does Radio Scotland need pulled up for giving 'Packie' Bonner airtime or should he just be called Pat?

It's ludicrous typing that but I would assume them saying that on air (regardless of the context where it's his nickname) would be offensive to certain listeners.

[Stairway 2 7]

Nothing to do with Yorkshire but does Radio Scotland need pulled up for giving 'Packie' Bonner airtime or should he just be called Pat?

It's ludicrous typing that but I would assume them saying that on air (regardless of the context where it's his nickname) would be offensive to certain listeners.

Packie is a different spelling and has been an Irish name since before the racist word became common

[Keith_M]

If YCC had apologised when they were "caught red handed" like he did, we wouldn't be having this conversation.


Have I even once defended YCC?

For avoidance of doubt...

I'm delighted that things like this are being investigated and they're being publicly called out. It's nearly as bad as a certain Scottish football club going 80 years or so without (knowingly) signing one single Catholic player.

[DaveF]

Packie is a different spelling and has been an Irish name since before the racist word became common

Maybe so, but I wouldn't have thought airing the word on the BBC would be what they do. Regardless of the context.

It just caught my attention when I was changing radio channels earlier and heard the commentator ask 'packie' for his thoughts, that's all

[Keith_M]

Nothing to do with Yorkshire but does Radio Scotland need pulled up for giving 'Packie' Bonner airtime or should he just be called Pat?

It's ludicrous typing that but I would assume them saying that on air (regardless of the context where it's his nickname) would be offensive to certain listeners.


Should we change all historic references to Attila the Hun in case it offends certain groups in the West of Scotland?

:hmmm:

[DaveF]

Should we change all historic references to Attila the Hun in case it offends certain groups in the West of Scotland?

:hmmm:

Nah, let those Huns stew 😃

[Stairway 2 7]

Maybe so, but I wouldn't have thought airing the word on the BBC would be what they do. Regardless of the context.

It just caught my attention when I was changing radio channels earlier and heard the commentator ask 'packie' for his thoughts, that's all

They call people f@nny or dick when it's their name on TV because people know the difference

[DaveF]

They call people f@nny or dick when it's their name on TV because people know the difference

I wasn't aware those were racist terms?

Fwiw, I'm not fussed about it. They could solve the issue by booting the boring git Bonner off the radio. Sorted.

[Stairway 2 7]

I wasn't aware those were racist terms?

Fwiw, I'm not fussed about it. They could solve the issue by booting the boring git Bonner off the radio. Sorted.

But the point is people know the difference between words being used for different things. You can call cigarettes a fag but not call someone one without offence. Its a name as is Jeff koons or Blackie Lawless.

But I'm also happy if he is banned from the Airways

[lapsedhibee]

But the point is people know the difference between words being used for different things. You can call cigarettes a fag but not call someone one without offence. Its a name as is Jeff koons or Blackie Lawless.


RAF would put a stop to it, at least if Bonner was a dug.

In July 2020 the headstone was replaced, with his name removed. The RAF said it "did not want to give prominence to an offensive term that went against its ethos".

[Stairway 2 7]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.opindia.com/2021/11/cricketer-azeem-rafiq-accused-of-sending-lewd-texts-to-minor-girl-gayathri-ajith-yorkshire-cricket-club-racism/amp/

Wud u hav let me kiss you?’: Yorkshire resident Gayathri reveals cricketer Azeem Rafiq sent her lewd texts when she was a minor

Problem with this is people will be reluctant to come forward if there life will get scrutinised. It doesn't make what happened to him less real or wrong. It's like talking up George Floyd's convictions or that one of the men rittenhouse killed was a pedophile

[Hibbyradge]

Have I even once defended YCC?

For avoidance of doubt...

I'm delighted that things like this are being investigated and they're being publicly called out. It's nearly as bad as a certain Scottish football club going 80 years or so without (knowingly) signing one single Catholic player.

I didn't suggest that you did defend YCC.

[He's here!]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.opindia.com/2021/11/cricketer-azeem-rafiq-accused-of-sending-lewd-texts-to-minor-girl-gayathri-ajith-yorkshire-cricket-club-racism/amp/

Wud u hav let me kiss you?’: Yorkshire resident Gayathri reveals cricketer Azeem Rafiq sent her lewd texts when she was a minor

Problem with this is people will be reluctant to come forward if there life will get scrutinised. It doesn't make what happened to him less real or wrong. It's like talking up George Floyd's convictions or that one of the men rittenhouse killed was a pedophile

He alluded to 'other mistakes' he's made when apologising for his racist tweets (and I'm guessing this is one of them) so I guess he's well aware that these days (particularly if you use social media) your life is laid bare to be picked apart.

One aspect of this situation (not being a cricket aficionado) is how racism in the game has in some respects been hidden in plain sight. On the surface when you read that Rafiq was not only captain of Yorkshire but skippered England under-17s and under-19s you'd likely get the impression that the game in this country was one where race was no barrier. Pretty sure former England captain Nasser Hussain is a practising muslim. However, I guess it's the number of players from different ethnic backgrounds who DON'T come through (despite the immense popularity of the game in those communities) which reveals a deeper story.