Surviving 9/11 documentary

[He's here!]

Anyone watched this (available on BBCiplayer now)?

Twenty years on and the shock and disbelief when you see that second plane hitting the tower remains a raw as ever. This is a very moving documentary which doesn't attempt to explain or seek answers (Bin Laden is actually only mentioned once). It just presents the human horror of it all and the pain that will never leave those who have shared their stories.

[Pedantic_Hibee]

I watched the President’s War Room on iPlayer yesterday which was good. Wasn’t aware of this documentary but I’ll certainly watch it.

I have a somewhat morbid obsession with 9/11. Was unreal watching it unfold on the day.

[Willis1875]

I also watched the Presidents war room,was glued to it.
There’s a new Docuseries appeared on Netflix this week called Turning Point 9/11 the War on Terror which is also really good

[Pretty Boy]

We were talking in work the other day about how different 9/11 would be if it happened today. It's like another world. Obviously you could say that about any historical event but 9/11 still feels reecent enough for it to be relevant.

Firstly an attack on that scale wouldn't happen now. London, Madrid and countless acts of terrorism in the Middle East and North Africa have happened since but the sheer scale of 9/11 was immense. Secondly the first plane was barely caught on camera. I think there are a couple of bits of footage but it's minimal. Nowadays if a plane was streaking across the NY sky that low tens of thousands of phones would be tracking it. Also whilst are recordings of the phone calls from people on the planes saying their goodbyes, there isn't a lot more of the communications. Now there would be people tweeting from inside the buildings, images on Instagram etc etc.

I wonder if it's just an age thing or if people in 1989 felt the world had changed a huge amount since the moon landings?

[calumhibee1]

I watched the President’s War Room on iPlayer yesterday which was good. Wasn’t aware of this documentary but I’ll certainly watch it.

I have a somewhat morbid obsession with 9/11. Was unreal watching it unfold on the day.

I watched that as well. Bush actually comes across really well in it I thought. It’s a difficult watch at times though. The part where Bush talks about flight 93 and the courage of the passengers to make the ultimate sacrifice and bring their own plane down to save so many other lives is poignant.

I’m the same as you with regards to the obsession. I must have seen tens upon tens of 9/11 documentaries and know so much about it all. I was 10 at the time and it was the first real ‘event’ like that I remember. Even at the time I couldn’t stop watching the news.

[ronaldo7]

I watched that as well. Bush actually comes across really well in it I thought. It’s a difficult watch at times though. The part where Bush talks about flight 93 and the courage of the passengers to make the ultimate sacrifice and bring their own plane down to save so many other lives is poignant.

I’m the same as you with regards to the obsession. I must have seen tens upon tens of 9/11 documentaries and know so much about it all. I was 10 at the time and it was the first real ‘event’ like that I remember. Even at the time I couldn’t stop watching the news.

I've not watched it yet, but heard someone on radio Scotland today saying it was a president's perspective. I'll take a look later, the Netflix one on the go just now is decent.

[calumhibee1]

I've not watched it yet, but heard someone on radio Scotland today saying it was a president's perspective. I'll take a look later, the Netflix one on the go just now is decent.

Yeah it is.

Hearing GWB and his staffs version of events from that day is something I’ve not heard all that much about before.

[ronaldo7]

Yeah it is.

Hearing GWB and his staffs version of events from that day is something I’ve not heard all that much about before.

I was interested in the behind the scenes stuff, and all the photographic evidence of the day. Looking forward to it.

[Stairway 2 7]

It was interesting but it was a part political broadcast by the republicans, so one sided. Fahrenheit 9/11 was far superior.

[JimBHibees]

Saw the Surviving 9 /11 documentary and it was very good. Always sceptical about the 93 plane alleged to be brought down by the passengers. Always thought that would have been deliberately brought down by Air Force. I have an American relative who maintained the plane had been seen and was flanked by two jets at the time.

[Callum_62]

Saw the Surviving 9 /11 documentary and it was very good. Always sceptical about the 93 plane alleged to be brought down by the passengers. Always thought that would have been deliberately brought down by Air Force. I have an American relative who maintained the plane had been seen and was flanked by two jets at the time.That and the plane hitting the pentagon I've always been sceptical about

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[Santa Cruz]

Saw the Surviving 9 /11 documentary and it was very good. Always sceptical about the 93 plane alleged to be brought down by the passengers. Always thought that would have been deliberately brought down by Air Force. I have an American relative who maintained the plane had been seen and was flanked by two jets at the time.

I share your view. They maintain the fighter jets were sent up and the order was given to shoot it down but it crashed before they needed to take action. I do believe the passengers did try to overcome the terrorists, I'm just not convinced it crashed.

[He's here!]

Saw the Surviving 9 /11 documentary and it was very good. Always sceptical about the 93 plane alleged to be brought down by the passengers. Always thought that would have been deliberately brought down by Air Force. I have an American relative who maintained the plane had been seen and was flanked by two jets at the time.

One of the US Air Force pilots scrambled to bring down the plane is interviewed and she said the jets were not equipped with missiles to shoot down the plane, which meant she and one of her colleagues were primed to bring it down kamikaze-style (ie one would fly into the tail, the other into the front end). Before they could do so, however, the plane had crashed. Extraordinary to hear that that was the plan and reflective of how off guard the US armed forces were.

[He's here!]

I watched the President’s War Room on iPlayer yesterday which was good. Wasn’t aware of this documentary but I’ll certainly watch it.

I have a somewhat morbid obsession with 9/11. Was unreal watching it unfold on the day.

The Surviving 9/11 documentary is almost exclusively from the perspective of those who were actually in the towers/Pentagon or were related to people who died there. Especially moving are the reflections of an artist who had her studio on the 91st floor (and who now lives in Ayrshire) and of a fireman who was the only one of the 12 from his station who attended the scene to come back alive (though invalided out of the service). The bravery of the fire service and other emergency services personnel that day remains utterly humbling.

[Santa Cruz]

One of the US Air Force pilots scrambled to bring down the plane is interviewed and she said the jets were not equipped with missiles to shoot down the plane, which meant she and one of her colleagues were primed to bring it down kamikaze-style (ie one would fly into the tail, the other into the front end). Before they could do so, however, the plane had crashed. Extraordinary to hear that that was the plan and reflective of how off guard the US armed forces were.

Do you think that's conceivable, a US fighter jet not equipped with missiles? I don't. I remain sceptical.

[Ozyhibby]

I share your view. They maintain the fighter jets were sent up and the order was given to shoot it down but it crashed before they needed to take action. I do believe the passengers did try to overcome the terrorists, I'm just not convinced it crashed.

Why would they lie about that if they admit that they were going to shoot it down anyway?


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[Santa Cruz]

Why would they lie about that if they admit that they were going to shoot it down anyway?


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I don't think any Gov would want to be responsible for taking that action, it's a bit easier on their image if the public are told it crashed.

[He's here!]

Do you think that's conceivable, a US fighter jet not equipped with missiles? I don't. I remain sceptical.

I don't know any more than you do but she seemed credible enough in saying that the situation was so utterly unexpected and called for such immediate action that the jets simply could not be loaded with missiles in time.

I'm guessing you mean they didn't want to admit to shooting down a planeload of civilians, but given that they admitted they were going to have to bring it down anyway I don't see why they would make something like that up. What would be the point? As the pilot also says, those passengers were going to be massacred anyway, with the plane en route to plough into the Capitol.

I think if the plane had been shot down, in the context of an atrocity on that scale history would not have looked unkindly on the decision to do so.

Also, if the passengers did indeed help to bring the plane down before it caused untold additional slaughter (and personally I don't doubt that's what happened), then to cast doubt on what they achieved would be to belittle their extraordinary courage.

[JimBHibees]

I don't think any Gov would want to be responsible for taking that action, it's a bit easier on their image if the public are told it crashed.

That would be my view also. Imagine if they had admitted it the press would have been all over it trying to identify who made the call and who flew the jet. Also likely to have resulted in potential law suits from relatives of people on board. Just think it is the most likely outcome to be shot down over rural area than let it crash into populated location.

[Santa Cruz]

I don't know any more than you do but she seemed credible enough in saying that the situation was so utterly unexpected and called for such immediate action that the jets simply could not be loaded with missiles in time.

I'm guessing you mean they didn't want to admit to shooting down a planeload of civilians, but given that they admitted they were going to have to bring it down anyway I don't see why they would make something like that up. What would be the point? As the pilot also says, those passengers were going to be massacred anyway, with the plane en route to plough into the Capitol.

I think if the plane had been shot down, in the context of an atrocity on that scale history would not have looked unkindly on the decision to do so.

Also, if the passengers did indeed help to bring the plane down before it caused untold additional slaughter (and personally I don't doubt that's what happened), then to cast doubt on what they achieved would be to belittle their extraordinary courage.

I'm not belittling the passengers courage, I believe the did plan to overcome the terrorists. Maybe I'm wrong but I thought they planned to take control of the plane and with some sort of assistance attempt a landing?

I have no way of knowing if the pilot was credible or not, we have to take their word that the jets weren't armed, that's the bit that I found odd from her account in the programme.

I was sceptical before the programme as the other thing I found odd was where the plane landed, an empty field. Passengers with no aviation experience managing to down a flight in a spot where there will be no on the ground civilian loss of life is quite a feat, something I would have thought the military would be far more capable of doing.

[Callum_62]

One of the US Air Force pilots scrambled to bring down the plane is interviewed and she said the jets were not equipped with missiles to shoot down the plane, which meant she and one of her colleagues were primed to bring it down kamikaze-style (ie one would fly into the tail, the other into the front end). Before they could do so, however, the plane had crashed. Extraordinary to hear that that was the plan and reflective of how off guard the US armed forces were.No missiles but don't they all have internally mounted guns?

I can't believe any fighter jet would proceed with zero means of defending itself

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[hibsbollah]

The Surviving 9/11 documentary is almost exclusively from the perspective of those who were actually in the towers/Pentagon or were related to people who died there. Especially moving are the reflections of an artist who had her studio on the 91st floor (and who now lives in Ayrshire) and of a fireman who was the only one of the 12 from his station who attended the scene to come back alive (though invalided out of the service). The bravery of the fire service and other emergency services personnel that day remains utterly humbling.

The last fireman was fantastic, brought me to the verge of tears a few times. A really interesting and important watch. The second plane footage… unbelievable.

[He's here!]

No missiles but don't they all have internally mounted guns?

I can't believe any fighter jet would proceed with zero means of defending itself

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Even if they do, would that be enough to ensure bringing down a sizeable commercial airliner before it reached its impending target? The fact the fighter pilot said she realised they were going to have to crash into the plane to bring it down suggests not.

I can quite understand why air force jets wouldn't sit on the ground loaded with missiles 24/7 (and also why the location of the missile storage facility would be some distance away) but I've no more idea than most about US air force protocol in emergency situations, nor the extent to which fighter jets are otherwise armed - which is kind of why I took her word for what happened.

[Haymaker]

Do you think that's conceivable, a US fighter jet not equipped with missiles? I don't. I remain sceptical.

A fighter plane, based on US soil, during peace time?

Could see why it wouldn't be fully locked and loaded, no one was expecting a group of terrorists to hijack passenger planes and fly them into buildings at the time.

[Sylar]

I knew there'd be a lot more coverage of it this year, given it's been 20 years (still can't quite believe that).

Safe to say I'll be avoiding most documentaries about the day!

[Santa Cruz]

A fighter plane, based on US soil, during peace time?

Could see why it wouldn't be fully locked and loaded, no one was expecting a group of terrorists to hijack passenger planes and fly them into buildings at the time.

I just assumed a country like the US would always have their forces on alert regardless of not expecting a terrorist attack on that scale in preparedness for any kind of attack. So when Russian fighter jets come close to the North Sea and we scramble our jets, do those jets not have missiles?

[He's here!]

I knew there'd be a lot more coverage of it this year, given it's been 20 years (still can't quite believe that).

Safe to say I'll be avoiding most documentaries about the day!

Do you have a particular objection to such coverage?

After watching the documentary in question the difficulty I have with revisiting that day is that I still find it very emotional.

[Keith_M]

It was a horrendous day, for the roughly 3,000 people that died, their friends and relatives, plus all those watching on.

I fully get that and they really do have my sympathies... It's heartbreaking even thinking about it



The thing is, though, what about the hundreds of thousands that died as a result of that, when the US Government decided that revenge was the most important action and invaded Iraq?

What about those that have suffered and died in the twenty years since as a result of the actions of the western countries involved, including the UK, in destabilising the Middle East?

When is their international day of remembrance? When do we hear apologies from Bush, Blair, et al, for what they did?

:dunno:

[Just Alf]

I just assumed a country like the US would always have their forces on alert regardless of not expecting a terrorist attack on that scale in preparedness for any kind of attack. So when Russian fighter jets come close to the North Sea and we scramble our jets, do those jets not have missiles?The fast response aircraft at Lossiemouth certainly do... aircraft elsewhere in the country don't... there's been reports over the years where 'missiles' etc have been dropped during exercises and it turns out they're just dummies.

Wouldn't surprise me that since the terrible day there's now fully armed aircraft held in readiness close to London (rightly imho)

[Stairway 2 7]

The reason given for the jets was a multitude of unexpected events and also failings.

After the cold War jet numbers fell rapidly something like 23 in the US. There wasn't any based in the North East as no enemies were near there.

Two armed fighter jets raced out to the Atlantic when the emergency was called expecting it to come from off coast. The waited for instructions and then turned waisting a lot of time.

There had been almost 700 plane hijackings before 9/11 most had landed them asked for ransom. Some had crashed none had targeted buildings. The jets assisting usually went beside usually to show a presence to the hijackers, or locate crash site.

The two fighters that ended up being the ones going to the scene had just finished doing a training mission. The quickly got back in but it would take two long to load weapons.

[The Tubs]

The biggest "what if" of my lifetime is what if they hadn't had those shifty ballots in Jeb Bush's Florida in 2000? Would there have been 9/11? Where would we be with climate change today? Would organisations like the UN still have the respect they used to have before the US put them in their place?

The disillusionment felt like what it probably felt like to those who saw Kennedy being murdered.

[Haymaker]

I just assumed a country like the US would always have their forces on alert regardless of not expecting a terrorist attack on that scale in preparedness for any kind of attack. So when Russian fighter jets come close to the North Sea and we scramble our jets, do those jets not have missiles?

I would assume that fighter jets based where potential enemy attacks may come from (Lossiemouth here, Alaska in the US) would be ready to go straight away fully loaded.

I imagine some planes based in Virginia or somewhere similar probably wouldn't at the time. Probably would have a couple ready now though.

[He's here!]

It was a horrendous day, for the roughly 3,000 people that died, their friends and relatives, plus all those watching on.

I fully get that and they really do have my sympathies... It's heartbreaking even thinking about it



The thing is, though, what about the hundreds of thousands that died as a result of that, when the US Government decided that revenge was the most important action and invaded Iraq?

What about those that have suffered and died in the twenty years since as a result of the actions of the western countries involved, including the UK, in destabilising the Middle East?

When is their international day of remembrance? When do we hear apologies from Bush, Blair, et al, for what they did?

:dunno:

Personally I think those are probably wider questions for a different thread. I think it's possible to reflect on the the extraordinary horror of 9/11 as an event in itself, which is what the programme I watched does. There's nothing political about it, just a deeply moving collection of interviews from those who were involved and whose lives can never be properly put back together.

[He's here!]

The biggest "what if" of my lifetime is what if they hadn't had those shifty ballots in Jeb Bush's Florida in 2000? Would there have been 9/11? Where would we be with climate change today? Would organisations like the UN still have the respect they used to have before the US put them in their place?

The disillusionment felt like what it probably felt like to those who saw Kennedy being murdered.

The controversy around Bush's election had no bearing whatsoever on the 9/11 attacks. There had already been an attempt on the twin towers with the (often forgotten) World Trade Center bombing of 1993 which killed several people and injured hundreds but was actually intended to bring the towers down. It's also been well established that plans for the 9/11 attacks were set in motion in the late 90s.

[Sir David Gray]

I knew there'd be a lot more coverage of it this year, given it's been 20 years (still can't quite believe that).

Safe to say I'll be avoiding most documentaries about the day!

Me too, I have always struggled to watch anything related to what happened that day.

It's just all a bit too much for me. Watching it live as a 13 year old was enough.

[JimBHibees]

It was a horrendous day, for the roughly 3,000 people that died, their friends and relatives, plus all those watching on.

I fully get that and they really do have my sympathies... It's heartbreaking even thinking about it



The thing is, though, what about the hundreds of thousands that died as a result of that, when the US Government decided that revenge was the most important action and invaded Iraq?

What about those that have suffered and died in the twenty years since as a result of the actions of the western countries involved, including the UK, in destabilising the Middle East?

When is their international day of remembrance? When do we hear apologies from Bush, Blair, et al, for what they did?

:dunno:

Very good point.

[Sylar]

Do you have a particular objection to such coverage?

After watching the documentary in question the difficulty I have with revisiting that day is that I still find it very emotional.

I was in New York that day and I find the documentaries to be extremely triggering.

[JeMeSouviens]

The controversy around Bush's election had no bearing whatsoever on the 9/11 attacks. There had already been an attempt on the twin towers with the (often forgotten) World Trade Center bombing of 1993 which killed several people and injured hundreds but was actually intended to bring the towers down. It's also been well established that plans for the 9/11 attacks were set in motion in the late 90s.

:agree:

Plus Al-Qaeda had already been attacking US targets in the Clinton era. Suicide attacks on embassies in East Africa and the USS Cole off Yemen.

There might have been no 9/11 if the CIA had passed all the intelligence they had on the movements of the hijackers to the FBI.

[LeithMike]

:agree:

Plus Al-Qaeda had already been attacking US targets in the Clinton era. Suicide attacks on embassies in East Africa and the USS Cole off Yemen.

There might have been no 9/11 if the CIA had passed all the intelligence they had on the movements of the hijackers to the FBI.That's true but there was pretty clear evidence at the 9/11 Commission that the new US Gov wasnt interested in Al-Qaeda and had focussed back on their priorities from 8 years before - Iraq and Russia. The attack would probably still have happened but a continuation of the Democratic Gov might have given a better chance to stop it.

The failings of the CIA though are pretty horrific. Definitely seems that there was something going on with the Saudis, whatever that might have been. Yet again though no one held to account.

There's a really good documentary on Amazon Prime called the Terror Routes which documents the build up to 9/11 and all the missed chances to stop it. It looks like it is based on Lawrence Wight's book the Looming Tower on which the excellent Amazon Prime drama of the same name is based.

It's all very galling now to look at Afghanistan and all the ruined lives yet be back where we were 20 years ago before this all began.

One thing that seems to ring true is that humans don't learn from history. With all the survivors of WWII passing away one wonders whether we will truly have learnt the lessons from that time.

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[hibsbollah]

That's true but there was pretty clear evidence at the 9/11 Commission that the new US Gov wasnt interested in Al-Qaeda and had focussed back on their priorities from 8 years before - Iraq and Russia. The attack would probably still have happened but a continuation of the Democratic Gov might have given a better chance to stop it.

The failings of the CIA though are pretty horrific. Definitely seems that there was something going on with the Saudis, whatever that might have been. Yet again though no one held to account.

There's a really good documentary on Amazon Prime called the Terror Routes which documents the build up to 9/11 and all the missed chances to stop it. It looks like it is based on Lawrence Wight's book the Looming Tower on which the excellent Amazon Prime drama of the same name is based.

It's all very galling now to look at Afghanistan and all the ruined lives yet be back where we were 20 years ago before this all began.

One thing that seems to ring true is that humans don't learn from history. With all the survivors of WWII passing away one wonders whether we will truly have learnt the lessons from that time.

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They weren’t ‘failings’ by the CIA, it was deliberate policy to turn a blind eye to certain things that didn’t fit with US interests. I’d say it was a successful policy. They kept access to the regions oil reserves and won the Cold War. And the terror and paranoia that followed 9/11 allowed them to expand their work by big multiples. Just look at the number of Americans who now work in espionage/security/counter intelligence. Mind blowing.

[Frazerbob]

Another who is fascinated by the events of that day. The Bush documentary was excellent. Really showed the personal side of those in the inner sanctum that day, a side I never thought I’d appreciate.
9/11 will always be linked to Hibs for me (and many others) as we were in Greece at the time for the AEK game.

[overdrive]

I watched that as well. Bush actually comes across really well in it I thought. It’s a difficult watch at times though. The part where Bush talks about flight 93 and the courage of the passengers to make the ultimate sacrifice and bring their own plane down to save so many other lives is poignant.

I’m the same as you with regards to the obsession. I must have seen tens upon tens of 9/11 documentaries and know so much about it all. I was 10 at the time and it was the first real ‘event’ like that I remember. Even at the time I couldn’t stop watching the news.

For all Bush comes across well in it overall - and I think he generally does whenever I’ve heard him post Presidency - I actually think he comes across as openly blood-thirsty for revenge in parts of that documentary. I didn’t think he would be that openly like that.

[JimBHibees]

I thought that the Bush one made him look better than was probably the case imo.

[Keith_M]

I thought that the Bush one made him look better than was probably the case imo.


IIRC, he received a lot of criticism at the time for (allegedly) hiding away in his bunker, while the Mayor of New York was out and about consoling people and being interviewed on TV and radio.

I've no idea if he really was hiding away but nobody saw him, or even heard from him for quite a few days.

In his defence, he didn't hold back when it came to getting revenge, even if the targets he chose (e.g. Iraq) mostly played no part in it whatsoever.

[Fuzzywuzzy]

Was there not a military excercise run on the day and confusion when the reports came in whether it was 'real world'.

[Stairway 2 7]

Wendy Cope

Spared



That Love is all there is,
Is all we know of Love ....' - Emily Dickinson

It wasn't you, it wasn't me,
Up there, two thousand feet above
The New York street. We're safe, and free,
A little while, to live and love,

Imagining what might have been -
The phone-call from the blazing tower,
A last farewell on the machine,
While someone sleeps another hour,

Or worse, perhaps, to say goodbye
And listen to each other's pain,
Send helpless love across the sky,
Knowing we'll never meet again,

Or jump together, hand in hand,
To certain death. Spared all of this
For now, how well I understand
That love is all, is all there is.

[HH81]

20 years have flown by.

Still watch the videos and you just can't believe it happened.

[Sir David Gray]

I'll be avoiding most of the programmes and coverage today but R.I.P. to the 2,977.

[Stairway 2 7]

Was in the airport waiting to fly to Athens to see us play when the news was coming through. Greeks seemed to hate America shouting f America at is in the street seemed bizarre to us. One of them then burnt an American flag at the game, they were going mental every time we chanted u s a. I presume the hatred was for us support of turkey?

[Stairway 2 7]

https://time.com/6095709/steve-buscemi-9-11-firefighter/

Great article from Steve Buscemi about working clearing the ground zero site

[WhileTheChief..]

I would assume that fighter jets based where potential enemy attacks may come from (Lossiemouth here, Alaska in the US) would be ready to go straight away fully loaded.

I imagine some planes based in Virginia or somewhere similar probably wouldn't at the time. Probably would have a couple ready now though.

Cool vid here showing the UKs air responses, starts at 3 mins in.


https://youtu.be/Dr3BjynM1o8

[Bangkok Hibby]

I've been watching a lot of 9/11 anniversary stuff and cannot believe how many Americans continue to say things like "I survived thanks to the Lord" What about their friends and colleagues who died?
Not sure what I'm trying to say here but their belief that God chose to save them over others doesn't sit well with me.

[WhileTheChief..]

I've been watching a lot of 9/11 anniversary stuff and cannot believe how many Americans continue to say things like "I survived thanks to the Lord" What about their friends and colleagues who died?
Not sure what I'm trying to say here but their belief that God chose to save them over others doesn't sit well with me.

I’m like that when I hear Prime Ministers or Presidents talk about God.

I want to ask them, “like you really believe all that, despite your education and everything you learnt in science, and all the advisers around you, you still believe?”

They don’t of course, they just feel like they have to say it.

[Bangkok Hibby]

I’m like that when I hear Prime Ministers or Presidents talk about God.

I want to ask them, “like you really believe all that, despite your education and everything you learnt in science, and all the advisers around you, you still believe?”

They don’t of course, they just feel like they have to say it.

Totally agree when it comes to politicians. The American public seem to truly believe it though.

[Smartie]

I've been watching a lot of 9/11 anniversary stuff and cannot believe how many Americans continue to say things like "I survived thanks to the Lord" What about their friends and colleagues who died?
Not sure what I'm trying to say here but their belief that God chose to save them over others doesn't sit well with me.

Funnily enough, I thought exactly the same thing (I was watching the one on Netflix).

I realise this is a different debate for a different place - but why would God help you and those around you when he saw fit to drop this atrocity on you in the first place?

Faith can seem a very strange thing to those of us who do not have it.

[Keith_M]

...

I realise this is a different debate for a different place - but why would God help you and those around you when he saw fit to drop this atrocity on you in the first place?

Faith can seem a very strange thing to those of us who do not have it.


:agree:


I posted similar comments on another thread on here.

God thought they should survive bit the others weren't good enough?

God believes some people deserve to live but others aren't worth saving?



Just wow!!!

[Bristolhibby]

For all Bush comes across well in it overall - and I think he generally does whenever I’ve heard him post Presidency - I actually think he comes across as openly blood-thirsty for revenge in parts of that documentary. I didn’t think he would be that openly like that.

I was also shocked at how bad the communications was back in 2001.

He’s the most powerful man in the World and he was getting news from CNN when they had signal!

J

[ronaldo7]

Cool vid here showing the UKs air responses, starts at 3 mins in.


https://youtu.be/Dr3BjynM1o8

Bit in the video where the journo says they're not allowed to mention their surnames for fear of being identified, this shortly after the film shows the name of Squadron leader Robertson on the side of his plane. :greengrin

[Callum_62]

Was there not a military excercise run on the day and confusion when the reports came in whether it was 'real world'.I think they were running a military exercise about planes being hijacked weirdly enough

Even weirder was the same thing happened during the London bombings

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[JimBHibees]

I was also shocked at how bad the communications was back in 2001.

He’s the most powerful man in the World and he was getting news from CNN when they had signal!

J

Yep that was incredible how poor the communications were on Air Force one it would get better when they flew over population centres. Would have thought even in 2001 they would have been state of the art. The tv picture reminded me of the one I used to get in the 90s with a wee cheap portable tv. :greengrin