Tories are still lying *******s

[lapsedhibee]

Both the sovereign queen and the Maybot clearly follow the ‘five second rule’, just like my own household.

Slatterns all!

[Mick O'Rourke]

Mercer is the only tory I have time for.



Sent from my SM-G991B using Tapatalk

Wallace!!!?

[Mick O'Rourke]

:greengrin
Both the sovereign queen and the Maybot clearly follow the ‘five second rule’, just like my own household.

That’s class for you.

In oor hoose,when i was wee!
Pick it up say "God before the devil" and eat it !!






An auld Socialist and trade union organiser said to me many many moons ago and his wise words stand today.

"There are not enough lunatic asylums built for working class tories!":greengrin

[grunt]

“It is very hard to believe that the right to paid holiday is an absolute moral right” Jacob Rees-MoggThis is the new secretary of state for business, energy & industrial strategy.

https://twitter.com/PeterStefanovi2/status/1568544382311174146?s=20&t=5eQokfwoJQI1bOhE_twK9A

[Hibernia&Alba]

“It is very hard to believe that the right to paid holiday is an absolute moral right” Jacob Rees-MoggThis is the new secretary of state for business, energy & industrial strategy.

https://twitter.com/PeterStefanovi2/status/1568544382311174146?s=20&t=5eQokfwoJQI1bOhE_twK9A


A climate change denier now head of the energy department. This government is just trolling us.

[wookie70]

A climate change denier now head of the energy department. This government is just trolling us.

His first speech, after his 10 day break, will be to advocate using the unemployed and disabled to undertake in manual fracking of shale gas. I'm going to start brushing up on Victorian Employment Rights, done, there weren't any

[Hibernia&Alba]

His first speech, after his 10 day break, will be to advocate using the unemployed and disabled to undertake in manual fracking of shale gas. I'm going to start brushing up on Victorian Employment Rights, done, there weren't any

I remember as a kid, when Thatcher was PM, my gran used to say, "she wants to put us all in the workhouse." They never change.

[wookie70]

I remember as a kid, when Thatcher was PM, my gran used to say, "she wants to put us all in the workhouse." They never change.

Your Gran was a wise women and I suspect she would say the same about this shower. I genuinely think there is a toffs' Hunger Games going on. Each ruler seems more determined to kill or make life more miserable for workers. I suspect their will be some kind of bet probably for a small amount, a Guinea perhaps.

I also think they are looking ahead and making workers work longer and harder so life expectancy is reduced, combine that with the destruction of the Health service, reduction in numbers of workers with quality diets and the lack of heating in winter and they may just crack the pensions problem. I do sometimes think they aren't as thick as they make out use their overt stupidity to mask the real evil below. JRM can't help but let the mask slip though

[OldEast]

Your Gran was a wise women and I suspect she would say the same about this shower. I genuinely think there is a toffs' Hunger Games going on. Each ruler seems more determined to kill or make life more miserable for workers. I suspect their will be some kind of bet probably for a small amount, a Guinea perhaps.

I also think they are looking ahead and making workers work longer and harder so life expectancy is reduced, combine that with the destruction of the Health service, reduction in numbers of workers with quality diets and the lack of heating in winter and they may just crack the pensions problem. I do sometimes think they aren't as thick as they make out use their overt stupidity to mask the real evil below. JRM can't help but let the mask slip though

There's nothing thick about them. Everything in your last paragraph is true. They are tories, we know them, we know what to expect. What is staggering in it's absolute absurdity is the fact working class people vote for them. These idiots are the true enemy of the people.

[Hibernia&Alba]

There's nothing thick about them. Everything in your last paragraph is true. They are tories, we know them, we know what to expect. What is staggering in it's absolute absurdity is the fact working class people vote for them. These idiots are the true enemy of the people.

Who was it who said words to the effect "there aren't enough lunatic asylums built to house the working class men and women who vote Tory"?

[Just_Jimmy]

Your Gran was a wise women and I suspect she would say the same about this shower. I genuinely think there is a toffs' Hunger Games going on. Each ruler seems more determined to kill or make life more miserable for workers. I suspect their will be some kind of bet probably for a small amount, a Guinea perhaps.

I also think they are looking ahead and making workers work longer and harder so life expectancy is reduced, combine that with the destruction of the Health service, reduction in numbers of workers with quality diets and the lack of heating in winter and they may just crack the pensions problem. I do sometimes think they aren't as thick as they make out use their overt stupidity to mask the real evil below. JRM can't help but let the mask slip thoughI said so many times, covid was their wet dream. Pensioners killed off in the thousands.

They're vile.

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[cabbageandribs1875]

https://scontent.fman1-2.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/306000754_1375030846357638_2261821083637249227_n.j pg?_nc_cat=101&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=8bfeb9&_nc_ohc=AycNRbDJPOwAX-47Ocm&_nc_ht=scontent.fman1-2.fna&oh=00_AT8fM2UBncjl7fWN8F2XUD97NyNyfhZe3FcVWiHyAYmW _Q&oe=6322098E

[Hibernia&Alba]

https://scontent.fman1-2.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/306000754_1375030846357638_2261821083637249227_n.j pg?_nc_cat=101&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=8bfeb9&_nc_ohc=AycNRbDJPOwAX-47Ocm&_nc_ht=scontent.fman1-2.fna&oh=00_AT8fM2UBncjl7fWN8F2XUD97NyNyfhZe3FcVWiHyAYmW _Q&oe=6322098E

Meaning, if inflation hits 22% next spring as predicted, the very poorest in society - those on welfare - will be told to starve. No surprise.

[wookie70]

Meaning, if inflation hits 22% next spring as predicted, the very poorest in society - those on welfare - will be told to starve. No surprise.

The report basically says it is fine giving CPI rises when inflation is low but we can't do it when it gets high. In April they got 3.3% I think as that was what inflation was last September. At that time it was 9%. Only the lowest type of human makes these decisions and if you vote for them them shoulder the blame for enabling them

[Hibernia&Alba]

The report basically says it is fine giving CPI rises when inflation is low but we can't do it when it gets high. In April they got 3.3% I think as that was what inflation was last September. At that time it was 9%. Only the lowest type of human makes these decisions and if you vote for them them shoulder the blame for enabling them

I agree. It's utilitarianism - human beings are numbers on a balance sheet, and those numbers can be altered to fit a narrative. The lives of those affected are not a consideration.

[cabbageandribs1875]

not a very sweet reply from Lord Sugar....stay classy old boy

(1) Lord Sugar on Twitter: "Shut your bloody mouth you jealous ****" / Twitter (https://twitter.com/Lord_Sugar/status/1568305030066995200)

[cabbageandribs1875]

Meaning, if inflation hits 22% next spring as predicted, the very poorest in society - those on welfare - will be told to starve. No surprise.


i'm predicting riots ahead

[Kato]

not a very sweet reply from Lord Sugar....stay classy old boy

(1) Lord Sugar on Twitter: "Shut your bloody mouth you jealous ****" / Twitter (https://twitter.com/Lord_Sugar/status/1568305030066995200)Not very sweet.

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[grunt]

The tories have appointed Wol Kolade, managing partner of private equity firm Livingbridge which has multiple investments in private healthcare, to the post of deputy chair of NHS England. He has donated £730,000 to their party.

[wookie70]

The tories have appointed Wol Kolade, managing partner of private equity firm Livingbridge which has multiple investments in private healthcare, to the post of deputy chair of NHS England. He has donated £730,000 to their party.

Is conflict of interest a job requirement these days.

[JimBHibees]

Is conflict of interest a job requirement these days.

Seems to be. Corrupt as fek as per. Sure media will be all over it not

[Stairway 2 7]

This is dispite the tories really but no other thread for it. Decent wage data. Wage growth that would normally be good, dwarfed by massive inflation though

.https://www.ons.gov.uk/employmentandlabourmarket/peopleinwork/earningsandworkinghours/bulletins/earningsandemploymentfrompayasyouearnrealtimeinfor mationuk/september2022

Early estimates for August 2022 indicate that the number of payrolled employees rose by 2.8% compared with August 2021, a rise of 803,000 employees; the number of payrolled employees was up by 2.5% since February 2020, a rise of 718,000

Early estimates for August 2022 indicate that median monthly pay increased by 6.5% compared with August 2021, and increased by 13.7% when compared with February 2020.

[grunt]

In 2013 the tories sold 80% of the NHS blood plasma service to US firm Bain for £90m. 3 years later Bain sold it to the Chinese for a whopping £820m.
Health secretary Andrew Lansley subsequently worked for Bain as a paid adviser.

[Jones28]

In 2013 the tories sold 80% of the NHS blood plasma service to US firm Bain for £90m. 3 years later Bain sold it to the Chinese for a whopping £820m.
Health secretary Andrew Lansley subsequently worked for Bain as a paid adviser.

If this happened in a country in Sub-Saharan Africa we would call it corruption. As it happens it's just normal practice.

[hibsbollah]

If this happened in a country in Sub-Saharan Africa we would call it corruption. As it happens it's just normal practice.

The problem is it’s become so commonplace it could easily be mistaken for normal behaviour. And why not? There are no proper investigative journalists who expose any of this for the news networks, just bloggers and folk on Twitter. I am currently watching Rise of the Nazis and I estimate the UK is currently at about 1932 levels of pre fascism, just prior to the stormtroopers starting to run amok.

[grunt]

This is dispite the tories really but no other thread for it. Decent wage data. Wage growth that would normally be good, dwarfed by massive inflation though

.https://www.ons.gov.uk/employmentandlabourmarket/peopleinwork/earningsandworkinghours/bulletins/earningsandemploymentfrompayasyouearnrealtimeinfor mationuk/september2022

I guess it's ok if you just focus narrowly on the wage data.

This Director of Institute for Employment Studies thinks differently:


Oh dear. V poor jobs data again today - huge rise in 'economic inactivity' and employment falling, even as unemployment plumbs new depths; while real pay is down for 9th month in row as inflation spirals.
Need to do far more to help ppl into work and help firms fill jobs.

Half million more out of work, driven by 600k+ rise in econ inactivity, esp in last few mths. Employment also still down on pre-crisis, with unempl lower too. What's driving the rise in econ inactivity?

... since last summer it's been long-term ill health. And figs getting much worse in most recent data. Student numbers up too, making the overall rise even starker.

Long-term ill health now highest *on record*, with largest ever quarterly rise - up 130k in three months and 350k since pandemic, to 2.46m.
Waiting lists, lack of empl support, MH, covid all playing a part.

Also now seeing econ inactivity rise across all ages, but again rising most strongly for 50-64s

Taken together - high vacancies and very low unemployment means the labour market is as tight as a very tight drum. Now 0.96 unemployed per vacancy, comfortably the lowest rate on record. Firms just can't find the workers as labour force contracts.

[ronaldo7]

If this happened in a country in Sub-Saharan Africa we would call it corruption. As it happens it's just normal practice.

They'd need a king to be walking around in fancy dress, after pocketing millions in cash, delivered in bags from dubious friends.

[Stairway 2 7]

I guess it's ok if you just focus narrowly on the wage data.

This Director of Institute for Employment Studies thinks differently:

Pandemic has hammered us and will take a decade to recover. The rise in long term sick non working is crazy. I said in my post it would in a normal year be a good rise in wages but inflation is so crazy that its a drop.

If inflation drops to 3% and lower for a few years we should be able to claw that back. But inflation will have long term effects even after it drops. Pay growth good but public sector shafted

Tony Wilson
@tonywilsonIES
·
1h
However the main focus today will be on pay, understandably, as 'real' pay (after inflation) falls for ninth month in a row (yellow below).
But with inflation running near 10%, the reason this isn't far worse is cos 'nominal' pay is really very strong - at +5.7%.

And pay growth is even higher in private sector services: 7%+ across a range of industries, which just isn't sustainable without prices rising further (and even then, not enough to keep up with inflation).
Public sector pay growth tho is awful - 2.4% - no wonder vacancies rising.

[Hibrandenburg]

The problem is it’s become so commonplace it could easily be mistaken for normal behaviour. And why not? There are no proper investigative journalists who expose any of this for the news networks, just bloggers and folk on Twitter. I am currently watching Rise of the Nazis and I estimate the UK is currently at about 1932 levels of pre fascism, just prior to the stormtroopers starting to run amok.

:agree: Been saying similar for a while but I don't think we're that far down the line yet, but we're just a bawhair away from a major economical disaster that would bring us there. People are already polarising towards both ends of the political spectrum with pro and anti Brexit supporters completely unable to settle their differences and providing fertile ground for the seeds of hate that we saw represented by the far left and right in pre Nazi Germany.

[cabbageandribs1875]

i like this dude :agree: (1) ☀️�� on Twitter: "that time Piers Morgan had on someone he thought would be an easy target to berate live on air, but instead he got utterly destroyed and humiliated by him. "You look like honey-glazed gammon." lmao https://t.co/uJtBzTXacy" / Twitter (https://twitter.com/zei_squirrel/status/1569603076557774848?fbclid=IwAR3CwJ08Vv0CvZscaOikA k4QjheAoK7VTW6QNAanKDMwOVeXhh51CSsDEWs)


also further down the first time i've ever saw that video of Churchill getting booed

[hibsbollah]

When Fortune magazine is reporting concern about bankers bonus cap being lifted…you know we’ve gone through the looking glass completely.

https://fortune.com/2022/09/15/uk-plan-scrap-banker-bonus-cap-comes-under-spotlight-cost-of-living-crisis/amp/

Meanwhile, nurses are being offered a range of increases between 4-5%, way below inflation and are voting on strike action over the next few weeks.

[weecounty hibby]

Isn't it just vintage Tory to look about the country and see how many people need financial help and think, I know, the bankers are the neediest so let's help them out!!

[Stairway 2 7]

ElectionMapsUK
·
2h
Nowcast Model + Interactive Map (15/09):

LAB: 326 (+124) - 42.0%
CON: 225 (-140) - 31.8%
SNP: 49 (+1) - 3.9%
LDM: 24 (+13) - 10.4%
PLC: 5 (+1) - 0.8%
GRN: 1 (=) - 5.3%
RFM: 0 (=) - 2.8%
Others: 1 (+1) - 3.0%

[cabbageandribs1875]

(1) HappyToast ★ on Twitter: "Mourning protocol\enact bow(0-40 degrees), RUN https://t.co/zfwdiLC3H3" / Twitter (https://twitter.com/IamHappyToast/status/1570349694282342400)

[grunt]

Liz Truss's chief of staff has been interviewed by FBI agents about an alleged criminal plot to bribe a politician and influence a US electionMark Fullbrook quizzed this year after detectives made secret request via Metropolitan Police and NCA

https://t.co/o8aKIbIlvX

[cabbageandribs1875]

https://scontent.fman1-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/306845462_2969198823227011_6458491373453444041_n.j pg?_nc_cat=110&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=730e14&_nc_ohc=_dlUoRWx4K8AX-unf-z&_nc_ht=scontent.fman1-1.fna&oh=00_AT80W5TNMQuEp2voo8WzNRBEsZzb9QxU3h_K_ulgR7lg-w&oe=632B30D8

[CropleyWasGod]

https://scontent.fman1-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/306845462_2969198823227011_6458491373453444041_n.j pg?_nc_cat=110&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=730e14&_nc_ohc=_dlUoRWx4K8AX-unf-z&_nc_ht=scontent.fman1-1.fna&oh=00_AT80W5TNMQuEp2voo8WzNRBEsZzb9QxU3h_K_ulgR7lg-w&oe=632B30D8

😁

[grunt]

https://scontent.fman1-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/306845462_2969198823227011_6458491373453444041_n.j pg?_nc_cat=110&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=730e14&_nc_ohc=_dlUoRWx4K8AX-unf-z&_nc_ht=scontent.fman1-1.fna&oh=00_AT80W5TNMQuEp2voo8WzNRBEsZzb9QxU3h_K_ulgR7lg-w&oe=632B30D8

I think you'll find this is a fake. The Tories are doing enough evil things without the need for us to invent more.

https://fullfact.org/economy/cabinet-office-ban-trade-union-996-working-system/

[cabbageandribs1875]

I think you'll find this is a fake. The Tories are doing enough evil things without the need for us to invent more.

is it, oh well...., that's good then, for now

[GlesgaeHibby]

https://scontent.fman1-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/306845462_2969198823227011_6458491373453444041_n.j pg?_nc_cat=110&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=730e14&_nc_ohc=_dlUoRWx4K8AX-unf-z&_nc_ht=scontent.fman1-1.fna&oh=00_AT80W5TNMQuEp2voo8WzNRBEsZzb9QxU3h_K_ulgR7lg-w&oe=632B30D8

That's a fake - although it's a sad state of affairs that it is believable enough that I had to check.

[grunt]

This article was written before Truss became PM, and before Fullbrook became her Chief of Staff:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FbmYTFbWYAAoiij?format=png&name=medium

[Ozyhibby]

https://twitter.com/shahryar_sultan/status/1571811768946642946?s=46&t=F_TcI2KjlL-ACW6sOI8htQ


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Kato]

https://twitter.com/bigtoekne/status/1571810157033570307?t=6_Mt6bBDNeOOmlytKkpHMg&s=09

Sent from my SM-A528B using Tapatalk

[Glory Lurker]

https://twitter.com/bigtoekne/status/1571810157033570307?t=6_Mt6bBDNeOOmlytKkpHMg&s=09

Sent from my SM-A528B using Tapatalk

I'm genuinely not following you for a fight:-) , but who cares what some guy who's head of a club that believes in a magic sky man thinks?

[Kato]

I'm genuinely not following you for a fight:-) , but who cares what some guy who's head of a club that believes in a magic sky man thinks?What difference does it make? Someone is having a dig at the fat muppet who was our PM. That'll do for me and the fact it's coming from someone in their establishment makes it a wee bit sweeter.

If you don't care, don't reply.

Sent from my SM-A528B using Tapatalk

[Glory Lurker]

What difference does it make? Someone is having a dig at the fat muppet who was our PM. That'll do for me and the fact it's coming from someone in their establishment makes it a wee bit sweeter.

If you don't care, don't reply.

Sent from my SM-A528B using Tapatalk

I'm just scunnered with the weight of the state over the last week and a bit. I just wish that crown and church played no part in our society. I reject it all. I amn't having a go at you, just expressing my exasperation that in 2022 these guys are still relevant.

[Kato]

I'm just scunnered with the weight of the state over the last week and a bit. I just wish that crown and church played no part in our society. I reject it all. I amn't having a go at you, just expressing my exasperation that in 2022 these guys are still relevant.Don't get angry or even exasperated by it, mate. One, it's not worth the anguish and two, it ain't going to go away any time soon.

Sent from my SM-A528B using Tapatalk

[Glory Lurker]

Don't get angry or even exasperated by it, mate. One, it's not worth the anguish and two, it ain't going to go away any time soon.

Sent from my SM-A528B using Tapatalk

Aye, but that's what lights my fuse! :-)

[Kato]

Aye, but that's what lights my fuse! :-)[emoji1787]

Sent from my SM-A528B using Tapatalk

[Stairway 2 7]

I think boris will be remembered for a very long time, but not for the reasons he will have wanted. Clown of a man

[grunt]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-62970803


Treasury refuses to publish UK economic forecast


The Treasury is refusing to publish a forecast of the UK's economic outlook alongside this Friday's mini-Budget.

Independent forecaster the Office for the Budget Responsibility (OBR) has already provided a draft to Chancellor Kwasi Kwarteng, the BBC understands.

[Kato]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-62970803Oh, goody goody. That must be because it is very good news for us and our liquidity is assured for the rest of our lives.
Hopefully it's leaked and we can all go on the randan at the weekend.

Well done, Liz. (Not that one)

Sent from my SM-A528B using Tapatalk

[Moulin Yarns]

@trussliz I'm just wondering, what do you think is a "well paid job" salary wise? And what will you do about zero hours contracts?

Anybody think that I will get an answer?

[Bostonhibby]

https://twitter.com/shahryar_sultan/status/1571811768946642946?s=46&t=F_TcI2KjlL-ACW6sOI8htQ


Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkQuid pro quo as she hadn't a scooby where Australia was.....

Sent from my SM-A750FN using Tapatalk

[poolman]

Nope, they're not getting off that lightly.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/politics/2021/apr/03/boris-johnson-a-clown-with-no-diplomacy-skills-says-ex-deputy-in-diaries

Copy n paste:

Alan Duncan was a conservative MP until his resignation from the party in 2019.

In a new set of diaries he has released, he absolutely goes to town on his former colleagues.

For those of us who follow politics closely, none of what he says comes as a surprise. But it’s nice to see Tory commentators squirming and attacking him on twitter for what some might describe as quite a kind and generous description of some Tory MPs and Ministers.

Here’s a taste:

* Jacob Rees-Mogg: ‘He thinks he’s clever: he is not. He is a cheap nationalist with faux manners and an ego the size of a planet.’

* Nicky Morgan: ‘Not up to much, bitter, poor judgement, self indulgent.’

* Michael Gove: 'Gove is an unctuous freak who generates his own publicity, a wacky weirdo who is both unappealing and untrustworthy... There’s something so socially unaware about him: it lies somewhere between shameless and synthetic.'

* Philip Hammond: 'I have never so much as had a meeting with Philip Hammond about this poor dilapidated country [Yemen] because quite frankly he’s not bothered. As Foreign Secretary, he’s only interested in the rich ones… He has no idea how to extend elementary courtesies.'

* Mike Penning: ‘What a dumbo. He is one of the dimmest MPs on our side. He has been over-promoted at every stage… moronic, ungrateful, self-deluded, treacherous dunce.’

* Tom Tugendhat: ‘These types have little concept of what it takes to be a minister, let alone the Prime Minister... Cocky little tosser.

* Nadine Dorries: 'Nadine Dorries, aka Mad Nad, is promoting David Davis as an interim PM. No, no, please, please, NO!'

* Johnny Mercer: 'If he were still in a regiment, he'd be taken behind the officers' mess and roughed up.’

* Andrea Jenkyns: 'Ghastly... a brainless nothing'

* Boris Johnson: 'He is Harold Wilson's George Brown without the alcohol... thinks he is the next Churchill. He has a self-deluding mock-romantic passion which is not rooted in realism. He is disloyal. His comedy routine has gone stale; his lack of seriousness in a serious job rankles; and he has little following among MPs.'

* Steve Baker: 'Quite the most useless minister and is just so simplistic he might just as well not have a brain.'

* Gavin Williamson: 'A venomous, self-seeking little ****... an inexperienced schemer, only in it for himself.'

* Jesse Norman: 'Suspect he is one of those who is incapable of wiring a plug.'

* Andrea Leadsom: 'Despicable — Sarah Palin on crack'

* Priti Patel: 'A dolled up nothing person... a complete and utter nightmare... the Wicked Witch of Witham'

Duncan’s review of Boris Johnson explains why Johnson refuses to sack any one of his small band of loyalist Ministers - like Williamson or Patel - regardless of how incompetent, negligent or corrupt they are when it comes to looking after their portfolios.


Your deluded if you think it's just the Tory politicians that lie

[Hibrandenburg]

Your deluded if you think it's just the Tory politicians that lie

You didn't even read the post you're quoting. It doesn't mention lying once and I'm deluded :faf:

[Kato]

Your deluded if you think it's just the Tory politicians that lieYou're deluded if you think that is included in the post.

Sent from my SM-A528B using Tapatalk

[poolman]

You didn't even read the post you're quoting. It doesn't mention lying once and I'm deluded :faf:



Sorry, I was just presuming that you agreed totally with the Quoted text
I don't favour any political party, I just don't trust politicians

Having said that,I wish I went into politics when I was a lot younger

I could have had a lovely duck pond and two nice detached houses

[cabbageandribs1875]

i watched a small clip earlier of Bolsonaro pointing at a garage petrol price sign of £1.61 whilst proclaiming petrol prices in a lot of states in Brazil are half that


rip-off Britain

[Jack]

You'd have thought being found out to be a liar would have made him an ideal tory worker of high office!

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-62980787

[Moulin Yarns]

You'd have thought being found out to be a liar would have made him an ideal tory worker of high office!

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-62980787

Admitting to working for Jim Murphy would disqualify you from most jobs 😂

[grunt]

You'd have thought being found out to be a liar would have made him an ideal tory worker of high office!

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-62980787
I love that Scottish Tories trumpet their new hire by quoting from his CV that he used to work for Jim Murphy, which then gets reported in The Times, and Jim Murphy reads it in the paper and says, "Who"? :greengrin

[CyberSauzee]

https://twitter.com/DanNeidle/status/1572505120717537281?t=Pj0SgY588x47_qv_NQr9Mg&s=19

[Kato]

https://twitter.com/DanNeidle/status/1572505120717537281?t=Pj0SgY588x47_qv_NQr9Mg&s=19A High Ranking Member of His Majesties Government.

He swore an oath to King Charles the Third's recently deceased mother, Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth II.

Looks he has been making serendipitous use of the opaque, labyrinthine, loosely regulated Tax Laws invented by His Majesty's Government to avoid paying the money which he owes to His Majesty's Revenue and Customs.

This is all normal.

Sent from my SM-A528B using Tapatalk

[hibsbollah]

A High Ranking Member of His Majesties Government.

He swore an oath to King Charles the Third's recently deceased mother, Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth II.

Looks he has been making serendipitous use of the opaque, labyrinthine, loosely regulated Tax Laws invented by His Majesty's Government to avoid paying the money which he owes to His Majesty's Revenue and Customs.

This is all normal.

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The problem here isn’t that the mainstream media fails to cover this extensively (they won’t), or whether he’s guilty or not. The real problem is if he is widely assumed to be guilty by the public, but that this behaviour is now not really considered that remarkable or a criminal or resigning offence. Our collective expectations for our leaders are so low.

[degenerated]

You'd have thought being found out to be a liar would have made him an ideal tory worker of high office!

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-62980787Sacked from Tories for not having worked for Labour, is how I would spin it :hilarious

[Kato]

The problem here isn’t that the mainstream media fails to cover this extensively (they won’t), or whether he’s guilty or not. The real problem is if he is widely assumed to be guilty by the public, but that this behaviour is now not really considered that remarkable or a criminal or resigning offence. Our collective expectations for our leaders are so low.That's why I say its normal, because it's been normalised.

Sent from my SM-A528B using Tapatalk

[Stairway 2 7]

ashcowburn
·
4m
Kwarteng announces national insurance hike will be reversed from November 6 - health and social care levy bill will be repealled. Cost to Treasury: £13 billion a year

[overdrive]

Just received a weird poll from YouGov Chat asking my opinion on Theresa May running for PM again. Is there a suggestion that she might? It seemed a bit of an odd poll to have.

[Mon Dieu4]

Just received a weird poll from YouGov Chat asking my opinion on Theresa May running for PM again. Is there a suggestion that she might? It seemed a bit of an odd poll to have.

No chance, probably trying to gauge opinion on returning PMs but don't want to come right out and say it's Boris that will be attempting it

[overdrive]

No chance, probably trying to gauge opinion on returning PMs but don't want to come right out and say it's Boris that will be attempting it

Good shout, actually. Most of the questions involved Boris, e.g. who was the better PM: May, Cameron or Johnson? Would be in a better/worse position during covid if May hadn’t resigned.

[JimBHibees]

Admitting to working for Jim Murphy would disqualify you from most jobs 😂

Absolutely

[Smartie]

Just received a weird poll from YouGov Chat asking my opinion on Theresa May running for PM again. Is there a suggestion that she might? It seemed a bit of an odd poll to have.

There was fairly strong rumour (well, my mate who is a Tory told me) that she was lined up to return in a caretaker basis after Boris was emptied, whilst they were waiting to have the leadership election.

[Stairway 2 7]

Good thread on the interest rate rise, comparatively speaking it could get as bad for home owners as its ever been. Add in bellow inflation rises and gas prices it's going to be grim

https://mobile.twitter.com/EdConwaySky/status/1572975530722627584
@EdConwaySky
🧵RISING INTEREST RATES ARE A BIGGER DEAL THAN YOU MIGHT THINK🧵
This is important (hence the caps).
I’m a bit worried people are being WAY too complacent about rising interest rates.
They assume that because they’re so low now vs the 1990s, this’ll be a walk in the park.
NO.

[Jack]

Good thread on the interest rate rise, comparatively speaking it could get as bad for home owners as its ever been. Add in bellow inflation rises and gas prices it's going to be grim

https://mobile.twitter.com/EdConwaySky/status/1572975530722627584
@EdConwaySky
🧵RISING INTEREST RATES ARE A BIGGER DEAL THAN YOU MIGHT THINK🧵
This is important (hence the caps).
I’m a bit worried people are being WAY too complacent about rising interest rates.
They assume that because they’re so low now vs the 1990s, this’ll be a walk in the park.
NO.

Eh. No.

When they hit 15% that's as bad as it ever been as discussed previously.

[Ozyhibby]

Eh. No.

When they hit 15% that's as bad as it ever been as discussed previously.

Anyone who has got a new mortgage in last 14 years has had their affordability calculations based on low rates. If rates double then we are in big trouble.


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[Hibernia&Alba]

Anyone who has got a new mortgage in last 14 years has had their affordability calculations based on low rates. If rates double then we are in big trouble.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Interest rates have been historically low since the financial crash of 2008. The past fifteen years have bucked the trend. Like you say, if they return to previous norms, a lot of people will be in a mess. As I mentioned earlier in the thread, my dad's mortgage rate hit 17.5% in 1981 - imagine that!

[cabbageandribs1875]

oops, a little slip from Johnson

(1) Shaun Walker on Twitter: "Oops https://t.co/N6FykKGO8R" / Twitter (https://twitter.com/shaunwalker7/status/1572978707064623104?s=12&t=sIZCLt0hX2imyhUBHJffIQ&fbclid=IwAR0q97El1vr5ibsQPi_VdSml_X9153svpzk0heicZ 27kn2rdWJLc5ZSK4OY)

[Stairway 2 7]

Eh. No.

When they hit 15% that's as bad as it ever been as discussed previously.

You didn't read the thread or the article did you. Its adjusted for multiple factors like cost of a mortgage comparable to yearly wage. If inflation goes to 4.5 as expected, only a few years in the early 90s and before the 2000s crash will be comparable. Add in other factors and this could be the biggest drop in living standards that most of us has known. Fear for alot of home owners who are going to lose their homes. Baby boomers with cushty pensions who bought there houses for pennies won't relate. Glad I'm not starting out now. I pray for independence for them

[Stairway 2 7]

Interest rates have been historically low since the financial crash of 2008. The past fifteen years have bucked the trend. Like you say, if they return to previous norms, a lot of people will be in a mess. As I mentioned earlier in the thread, my dad's mortgage rate hit 17.5% in 1981 - imagine that!

From the article

Ed Conway
@EdConwaySky
·
4h
So for instance, take 1980. Back then, official BoE interest rates were on average 14.2%.
But because people were much less heavily indebted, because their incomes were much higher vs their repayments, that was, in affordability terms, EQUIVALENT to 3% in today’s interest rates

[Ozyhibby]

From the article

Ed Conway
@EdConwaySky
·
4h
So for instance, take 1980. Back then, official BoE interest rates were on average 14.2%.
But because people were much less heavily indebted, because their incomes were much higher vs their repayments, that was, in affordability terms, EQUIVALENT to 3% in today’s interest rates

There is a guy on Twitter who is a housing analyst and he has been warning of this for a few years now. We could be in for an almighty housing crash.

https://twitter.com/resi_analyst?s=21&t=yXRVOstHyS584w0yNW-z3A


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[Hibernia&Alba]

From the article

Ed Conway
@EdConwaySky
·
4h
So for instance, take 1980. Back then, official BoE interest rates were on average 14.2%.
But because people were much less heavily indebted, because their incomes were much higher vs their repayments, that was, in affordability terms, EQUIVALENT to 3% in today’s interest rates

Yes, house prices were much lower in comparison to incomes, true. My parents' mortgage was only ten thousand for a three bedroom semi-detached, but it was a massive struggle with a family etc. 17.5% was brutal for most folk. With house prices so much higher compared to incomes today, even small interest rate increases have a large effect.

[Moulin Yarns]

A wee insight into inflation, I'm reading a book called "Lifted Over the Turnstiles", a photo book of Scottish football grounds in the past. A photo of Firhill with the turnstiles showing prices of 4/- or 20p in 1970. ONS statistics show inflation average 5.8% per year from 1970 to 2018, that 20p is the equivalent of £3.

Think about it and the cost of football today!!!

[Stairway 2 7]

Yes, house prices were much lower in comparison to incomes, true. My parents' mortgage was only ten thousand for a three bedroom semi-detached, but it was a massive struggle with a family etc. 17.5% was brutal for most folk. With house prices so much higher compared to incomes today, even small interest rate increases have a large effect.

Thinks we're brutal in the 70s and 80s financially, our lives are comfortable for many now. It's just depressing in this day and age we will see so much suffering coming up. More so as alot is self inflicted ie voting the tories and brexit. Pass the bottle

[Ozyhibby]

The more tax cutting Truss does, the more the Bank of England will have to raise interest rates to try hold back inflation. She is going to run the country into the ground.


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[Stairway 2 7]

There is a guy on Twitter who is a housing analyst and he has been warning of this for a few years now. We could be in for an almighty housing crash.

https://twitter.com/resi_analyst?s=21&t=yXRVOstHyS584w0yNW-z3A


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Cheers looks a good follow

[Hibernia&Alba]

A wee insight into inflation, I'm reading a book called "Lifted Over the Turnstiles", a photo book of Scottish football grounds in the past. A photo of Firhill with the turnstiles showing prices of 4/- or 20p in 1970. ONS statistics show inflation average 5.8% per year from 1970 to 2018, that 20p is the equivalent of £3.

Think about it and the cost of football today!!!

Absolutely. So many things have risen in price beyond both inflation and wage growth.

[cabbageandribs1875]

early chrimbo present, or just use the paper to build a bonfire for heat

https://scontent.fman1-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/307648250_176870821580592_7983269178984223644_n.jp g?_nc_cat=110&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=5cd70e&_nc_ohc=IO0a-0gJbW0AX-esrZK&_nc_ht=scontent.fman1-1.fna&oh=00_AT9cXf_fPBzSTDJPHxeKmXUfrJ_dyQkBVyOEYrAVXad1 2w&oe=6331F71E

[Jack]

You didn't read the thread or the article did you. Its adjusted for multiple factors like cost of a mortgage comparable to yearly wage. If inflation goes to 4.5 as expected, only a few years in the early 90s and before the 2000s crash will be comparable. Add in other factors and this could be the biggest drop in living standards that most of us has known. Fear for alot of home owners who are going to lose their homes. Baby boomers with cushty pensions who bought there houses for pennies won't relate. Glad I'm not starting out now. I pray for independence for them

I don't care how many factors its assessed over. When you're in a good job and all of a sudden all you have from your salary, after you've paid your mortgage, is 3 quid (4 to 6 pints worth) then come back and tell me how well off I was as a baby boomer.

You post some stuff I totally agree with but you really have to think more before you hit submit reply.

[davy67 +]

early chrimbo present, or just use the paper to build a bonfire for heat

https://scontent.fman1-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/307648250_176870821580592_7983269178984223644_n.jp g?_nc_cat=110&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=5cd70e&_nc_ohc=IO0a-0gJbW0AX-esrZK&_nc_ht=scontent.fman1-1.fna&oh=00_AT9cXf_fPBzSTDJPHxeKmXUfrJ_dyQkBVyOEYrAVXad1 2w&oe=6331F71E
i thought s***e didn't burn ?

[Bostonhibby]

early chrimbo present, or just use the paper to build a bonfire for heat

https://scontent.fman1-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/307648250_176870821580592_7983269178984223644_n.jp g?_nc_cat=110&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=5cd70e&_nc_ohc=IO0a-0gJbW0AX-esrZK&_nc_ht=scontent.fman1-1.fna&oh=00_AT9cXf_fPBzSTDJPHxeKmXUfrJ_dyQkBVyOEYrAVXad1 2w&oe=6331F71EGoing to give it a couple of months for Truss and Kwarteng's mastery of the economy to kick in then pick up a container load for 25p.

Cheaper than firewood.

Sent from my SM-A750FN using Tapatalk

[Stairway 2 7]

I don't care how many factors its assessed over. When you're in a good job and all of a sudden all you have from your salary, after you've paid your mortgage, is 3 quid (4 to 6 pints worth) then come back and tell me how well off I was as a baby boomer.

You post some stuff I totally agree with but you really have to think more before you hit submit reply.

Your posting Your personal circumstances that's one person's situation and it sounds tough, but this is population wide data. I wasn't talking about you as the boomer that would be crass, I've no idea if you have a pension for when you retire although I hope you do. The point I was trying to make is boomers in general got there houses at a good rate comparing to wages.

As oz said alot of people got huge mortgages thinking inflation would stay low, they will in many cases lose their house. I don't think truss cares and its a ticking time bomb before the inevitable housing crash

[Jack]

Your posting Your personal circumstances that's one person's situation and it sounds tough, but this is population wide data. I wasn't talking about you as the boomer that would be crass, I've no idea if you have a pension for when you retire although I hope you do. The point I was trying to make is boomers in general got there houses at a good rate comparing to wages.

As oz said alot of people got huge mortgages thinking inflation would stay low, they will in many cases lose their house. I don't think truss cares and its a ticking time bomb before the inevitable housing crash

There were millions of me.

[Stairway 2 7]

There were millions of me.

I'm sure and I'm not diminishing how bad it was in the 80s, it was worse in many ways. Living standards are much better now. But you get used to what you know and the fall in living standards is going to be worst since the war, I think there could be the second biggest housing collapse post war. Youngsters have hardly any chance of getting a mortgage due to price, deposit and that idiot Thatcher selling millions of council homes for a pittance. At least scot gov has put an end to selling council homes but thousands need built also

[OldEast]

I'm sure and I'm not diminishing how bad it was in the 80s, it was worse in many ways. Living standards are much better now. But you get used to what you know and the fall in living standards is going to be worst since the war, I think there could be the second biggest housing collapse post war. Youngsters have hardly any chance of getting a mortgage due to price, deposit and that idiot Thatcher selling millions of council homes for a pittance. At least scot gov has put an end to selling council homes but thousands need built also

Amazing how many people still say Thatcher was good because "she let me become a home owner" conveniently forgetting their children and grandchildren are absolutely struggling to get on the ownership ladder because of that very policy.

[hibsbollah]

There is a guy on Twitter who is a housing analyst and he has been warning of this for a few years now.

I bought my first home in 2001, but at the time sector professionals were warning about an upcoming burst bubble in the housing market, because of the rapid (at that time, it seems positively slow compared to now) unsustainable rises in prices. In reality, it took around 7 years for crash to happen, by which point I’d built up some equity and reduced any exposure. And of course the bailouts simply allowed the banks to carry on as before. It’s easy enough to say something is going to happen with the housing market, but knowing When? Is the real trick, and these predictions are self fulfilling prophecies really, boom and bust is a necessary feature of consumer capitalism.

[hibsbollah]

Amazing how many people still say Thatcher was good because "she let me become a home owner" conveniently forgetting their children and grandchildren are absolutely struggling to get on the ownership ladder because of that very policy.

Almost all the moderately ‘wealthy’ people I know of my approximate age are working no more hard or smart than my daughters generation are, they are merely recipients of generous policies designed to help families that have already bought a house. We get to say we have £200k or whatever because that’s the value of the gain in property value, but it’s a meaningless number unless you get out of the market altogether, or become part of the problem yourself by becoming a landlord.

[Stairway 2 7]

Amazing how many people still say Thatcher was good because "she let me become a home owner" conveniently forgetting their children and grandchildren are absolutely struggling to get on the ownership ladder because of that very policy.

I read 32% of people lived in social housing when Thatcher took power, its now 14% and dropping. Many millions more paying massive private rents, who can't afford to save up for a mortgage.

Think the tories are starting to allow people to buy housing association homes now too

[Scorrie]

I read 32% of people lived in social housing when Thatcher took power, its now 14% and dropping. Many millions more paying massive private rents, who can't afford to save up for a mortgage.

Think the tories are starting to allow people to buy housing association homes now too

With regards to your last point, Johnson did say that but it is hugely problematic and I suspect that will be canned or at least seriously watered down

[GlesgaeHibby]

I don't care how many factors its assessed over. When you're in a good job and all of a sudden all you have from your salary, after you've paid your mortgage, is 3 quid (4 to 6 pints worth) then come back and tell me how well off I was as a baby boomer.

You post some stuff I totally agree with but you really have to think more before you hit submit reply.

I don't doubt the 80s / early 90s were tough - my folks told me how close they were to losing our home and how difficult it was. House prices are at much higher multiples of wages now though, so smaller rises in interest rates will be much more keenly felt.

We are quickly heading for a similar, potentially worse situation here. Markets are expecting rates to rise to 4.5% next year from the historic lows of 0.1%. If you factor that rise into a £200k, 25 year mortgage then that adds an extra £5,244 in annual payments. Throw in the fact that energy bills have been capped at double last October's energy price cap and the picture is truly frightening for many.

It's perhaps not so bad yet, because 75% of folk are on fixed rate mortgages. The real disaster will become evident over the next year - there are around 2m on fixes that are due to remortgage next year and will suffer a massive shock. For anybody in that position, you can typically secure a fixed rate remortgage deal up to 6 months in advance of your current deal expiring so it may be worth talking to brokers sooner rather than later.

[Mon Dieu4]

I work in savings/mortgages and ever since around July it's been pandemonium with people panicking big time, we have seen our daily contact from customers basically double and countless people saying they won't be able to afford their mortgage going forward, it's a real issue

[Paul1642]

I recently fixed my mortgage at 2.6% for 10 years. A gamble which didn’t pay off for my previous 5 year fix but on this occasion looks to have been. a pretty good move.

[GlesgaeHibby]

That mini budget has to guarantee the Tories lose big next election. Utterly disgusting giveaways to the wealthiest in society.

[GlesgaeHibby]

That mini budget has to guarantee the Tories lose big at the next election. Utterly disgusting giveaways to the wealthiest in society.

[Stairway 2 7]

@HugoGye
·
11m
First big surprise:

The 45% additional rate of income tax for highest earners is to be abolished, with the top rate now back to 40% as it was in Labour years.

Basic rate of income tax is cut to 19% from next April (year earlier than previously planned

[Paul1642]

Jesus Christ what a way to save the rich money!

I won’t turn my nose up at the 1.25% National Insurance decrease or the 1% income tax cut (will we even see this in Scotland?), however there is no mistaking that the entire budged is set up to benefit the rich. Great.

Trickle down economics is a load of crap and everyone knows it.

[Paul1642]

That mini budget has to guarantee the Tories lose big at the next election. Utterly disgusting giveaways to the wealthiest in society.

I bloody hope so however would not count on it for a minute. I have never been pro independence however started to sway a little towards it under Boris. I think today might be the tipping point for me. It feels like the the alternative is to spend another generation under the Tories keeping the rich in the money.

[JeMeSouviens]

Jesus Christ what a way to save the rich money!

I won’t turn my nose up at the 1.25% National Insurance decrease or the 1% income tax cut (will we even see this in Scotland?), however there is no mistaking that the entire budged is set up to benefit the rich. Great.

Trickle down economics is a load of crap and everyone knows it.

In Scotland it ony applies on non-earned income: savings and dividends essentially. The Tories made sure that devolution of tax couldn't hurt the people they care about most. :rolleyes:

Interesting headache for the SG about whether to match these changes or leave Scottish rates unchanged. Actually, I'm not sure if the SG is allowed to vary rates mid-year or not?

Personally, as a higher rate tax payer, I'm happy not to get the cut and continue to benefit from the best NHS in the UK.

https://i.ibb.co/ssMXgpH/Screenshot-2022-09-23-at-10-26-38.png

[Mon Dieu4]

The part about people on Universal Credit getting a "work coach" who will help them take steps to increase their earnings and facing benefit reductions if commitments aren't met sounds ominous as ****, Tories being Tories, it's all these workshy poor peoples fault

[JeMeSouviens]

Paul Johnson of the IFS:


Paul Johnson@PJTheEconomist

£45 billion of tax cuts. This is biggest tax cutting event since 1972. Barber's "dash for growth" then ended in disaster. That Budget is now known as the worst of modern times. Genuinely, I hope this one works very much better.

[nonshinyfinish]

@HugoGye
·
11m
First big surprise:

The 45% additional rate of income tax for highest earners is to be abolished, with the top rate now back to 40% as it was in Labour years.

Basic rate of income tax is cut to 19% from next April (year earlier than previously planned

Might just be the way it's worded ("now back to 40%"), but am I reading that right in that the cut that only affects high earners is immediate, while the one that affects most people comes in six months later?

[CropleyWasGod]

Might just be the way it's worded ("now back to 40%"), but am I reading that right in that the cut that only affects high earners is immediate, while the one that affects most people comes in six months later?

I've just seen a Treasury post which suggests it's April.

https://twitter.com/hmtreasury/status/1573235498134503425?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcam p%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Etweet

[Smartie]

Paul Johnson of the IFS:

What's the actual thinking behind the tax cuts?

Truss pandering to her support base?

Or is there a credible economic argument that can be made for them right now, given the poor economic situation we find ourselves in?

I take an interest in economics and own a business, but can't pretend to know all that much about it.

My work has brought me into contact with a lot of dentists and my WhatsApp is alive today with them both howling about the uplift on their NHS fees being cut (SNP Baaaaaaaaad) but delight at the tax cuts from the Tories. I've never understood how supposedly intelligent people can't see any sort of link between the 2.

But then again, I happily admit to knowing little about it.

(Maybe one for our Tory chums on this thread?)

[JeMeSouviens]

What's the actual thinking behind the tax cuts?

Truss pandering to her support base?

Or is there a credible economic argument that can be made for them right now, given the poor economic situation we find ourselves in?

I take an interest in economics and own a business, but can't pretend to know all that much about it.

My work has brought me into contact with a lot of dentists and my WhatsApp is alive today with them both howling about the uplift on their NHS fees being cut (SNP Baaaaaaaaad) but delight at the tax cuts from the Tories. I've never understood how supposedly intelligent people can't see any sort of link between the 2.

But then again, I happily admit to knowing little about it.

(Maybe one for our Tory chums on this thread?)



Yes, she is, but she is in tune with her base, so it's what she wants to do anyway. The gamble is that if you take less tax, people and/or businesses have more money to spend so you see a boost in economic activity and therefore growth.

I think the fact that they are refusing to let the OBR publish forecasts based on these actions tells you all you need to know about how mainstream economists view the chances of this paying off.

[Stairway 2 7]

Be interesting to see what scot gov do. Will we benefit from the extra borrowing through Barnett

[Stairway 2 7]

I recently fixed my mortgage at 2.6% for 10 years. A gamble which didn’t pay off for my previous 5 year fix but on this occasion looks to have been. a pretty good move.

I definitely think so.

Oh **** things are going to get bad

MehreenKhn
·
8m
Money markets are now pricing in at 50% possibility of 100 basis point rate rise (!) from the Bank of England next month and a peak rate of 5.4 per cent by the end of next year (it stood around 4.75% this morning

[JeMeSouviens]

Be interesting to see what scot gov do. Will we benefit from the extra borrowing through Barnett

No. Barnett is an entirely spending based formula. If UK gov borrows then gives away as tax cuts, there's no extra money from it.

[Ozyhibby]

No. Barnett is an entirely spending based formula. If UK gov borrows then gives away as tax cuts, there's no extra money from it.

The money they borrow to give away as income tax cuts will have to be passed onto the SG to do the same. Of course the SG may decide not to cut income tax and offer more targeted approach? Or have I got that totally wrong?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Col2]

IR35 changes in 2021 being reversed from April 2023

Will change the contract market significantly. A positive👍

[GlesgaeHibby]

The money they borrow to give away as income tax cuts will have to be passed onto the SG to do the same. Of course the SG may decide not to cut income tax and offer more targeted approach? Or have I got that totally wrong?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

https://twitter.com/conor_matchett/status/1573258700126851072?t=voDkFP_F5nXg-FSPKSY94w&s=19

Additional £600m expected from UK treasury estimates due to stamp duty and income tax changes.

[Ozyhibby]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220923/eac6b549b506f4cb8d075792b823c773.jpg


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[ronaldo7]

In Scotland it ony applies on non-earned income: savings and dividends essentially. The Tories made sure that devolution of tax couldn't hurt the people they care about most. :rolleyes:

Interesting headache for the SG about whether to match these changes or leave Scottish rates unchanged. Actually, I'm not sure if the SG is allowed to vary rates mid-year or not?

Personally, as a higher rate tax payer, I'm happy not to get the cut and continue to benefit from the best NHS in the UK.

https://i.ibb.co/ssMXgpH/Screenshot-2022-09-23-at-10-26-38.png

The Scotland act doesn't allow us to vary the tax rates mid year. Flexibility only for the ukgov. How very nice of them to have written this into the act.

[Ozyhibby]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220923/5cf5d25aca2c5dcdec73d55cad8c0df1.jpg


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Stairway 2 7]

https://twitter.com/conor_matchett/status/1573258700126851072?t=voDkFP_F5nXg-FSPKSY94w&s=19

Additional £600m expected from UK treasury estimates due to stamp duty and income tax changes.

Brilliant. Let them get on with it then good luck to them. A huge amount of money for Scottish Gov to do as they wish

[Scorrie]

Imagine if Corbyn (or even Labour) had given a budget with 150bn uncosted proposals in it. There would be murder in the right wing press. The rule book has been torn up today. Sadly if Starmer gets in in 2024, he will have one unholy mess to sort out and then the Tories will win the next election as the party of “fiscal competence” ! 1970s all over again

[Stairway 2 7]

PippaCrerar
·

Treasury says scrapping 45p tax rate will cost £2bn a year - and give those who had been paying it an average £10,000 cut - with the richest saving more

[Lee Marvin]

Brilliant. Let them get on with it then good luck to them. A huge amount of money for Scottish Gov to do as they wish

The SNP are in a real sticky situation now. The tax gap between Scotland and the UK was already quite big, however there is now a relative chasm between the nations.

What does she do? Does she mirror what the **** in Westminster have done today (highly unlikely) or use the money in a more targeted way? (likely).

However, if she does go down the latter route the 'average' Scot will get little benefit from this cluste***** of a budget but all the negative ramifications i.e even higher inflation, higher interest rates, ruined pound and a deep recession.

This is a dark day for the UK and there will be millions, me included, devastated that Boris (quite rightly I may add) was ousted. I fear Truss is going to go down in history - for all the wrong reasons.

[hibsbollah]

It’s class war, pure and simple.

[James310]

https://twitter.com/HTScotPol/status/1573243863937982464?t=Q6O2rgjsZdlAlj7dHqtZxw&s=19

At the moment those earning more than £28K pay more tax than their equivalents in England, if the SG don't make any changes to tax rates then it falls to anyone in Scotland earning over £15K paying more tax than their equivalents in England, so basically almost everyone will be paying higher taxes in Scotland.

(And way higher stamp duty if moving house as well)

I can see an issue with attracting inward investment as well, why would you set up shop in Scotland over England now if all your employees are going to be paying higher taxes.

Big decisions for the SG to make.

[Mon Dieu4]

https://twitter.com/HTScotPol/status/1573243863937982464?t=Q6O2rgjsZdlAlj7dHqtZxw&s=19

At the moment those earning more than £28K pay more tax than their equivalents in England, if the SG don't make any changes to tax rates then it falls to anyone in Scotland earning over £15K paying more tax than their equivalents in England, so basically almost everyone will be paying higher taxes in Scotland.

(And way higher stamp duty if moving house as well)

I'm quite happy to pay more tax than people down south if it goes towards helping those less fortunate and a more equal society

[Paul1642]

The SNP are in a real sticky situation now. The tax gap between Scotland and the UK was already quite big, however there is now a relative chasm between the nations.

What does she do? Does she mirror what the **** in Westminster have done today (highly unlikely) or use the money in a more targeted way? (likely).

However, if she does go down the latter route the 'average' Scot will get little benefit from this cluste***** of a budget but all the negative ramifications i.e even higher inflation, higher interest rates, ruined pound and a deep recession.

This is a dark day for the UK and there will be millions, me included, devastated that Boris (quite rightly I may add) was ousted. I fear Truss is going to go down in history - for all the wrong reasons.

In regards to your second paragraph I hope a mixture of things. I hope she partially mirrors it’s with tax cuts however aims them at lower earners rather than top earners. Maybe by bringing NI back to its previous level and bringing the 21% income tax down to 20%. The. Uses the rest of the new money on public services when they really need it.

[hibsbollah]

“for too long in this country we've indulged in a fight over redistribution" was a revealing comment from Kwarteng. Essentially, they’re not even paying lip service to helping the poor. It’s all over. A flat rate of tax is probably not far off. What a ****ing country this is. In 15 years it’s become absolutely unrecognisable.

[JeMeSouviens]

In regards to your second paragraph I hope a mixture of things. I hope she partially mirrors it’s with tax cuts however aims them at lower earners rather than top earners. Maybe by bringing NI back to its previous level and bringing the 21% income tax down to 20%. The. Uses the rest of the new money on public services when they really need it.

Not devolved.

Otherwise I agree.

[Ozyhibby]

SG should change very little. Help those at the very bottom and use the rest to make sure our public services remain operational.


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[James310]

I'm quite happy to pay more tax than people down south if it goes towards helping those less fortunate and a more equal society

Most people would agree, issue is how do you evidence this? And how much are you willing to pay, if you earn £50K that's a good wage but you are now paying nearly two thousand pounds more in tax than your colleague in England doing exactly the same job as you. Are the people you want to benefit from that seeing that in terms of services or help they are getting.

[Ozyhibby]

Most people would agree, issue is how do you evidence this? And how much are you willing to pay, if you earn £50K that's a good wage but you are now paying nearly two thousand pounds more in tax than your colleague in England doing exactly the same job as you. Are the people you want to benefit from that seeing that in terms of services or help they are getting.

Yes. Which services in England are performing better than in Scotland?


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[James310]

Yes. Which services in England are performing better than in Scotland?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Scotland already has by far the best funded services in the UK so I would kind of expect them to be the best performing.

Although many are still crap like A&E waiting times or cancer waiting times, I don't think it's much comfort to someone waiting on cancer treatment to.let them know it's worse over the border, that won't bring a smile to their face.

If the majority of people are happy paying £X extra for improved services then great, it's not something the SNP need to worry about is it. They keep rates as they are.

[Mon Dieu4]

Most people would agree, issue is how do you evidence this? And how much are you willing to pay, if you earn £50K that's a good wage but you are now paying nearly two thousand pounds more in tax than your colleague in England doing exactly the same job as you. Are the people you want to benefit from that seeing that in terms of services or help they are getting.

I don't earn anywhere near £50k but if my additional tax is going towards the bedroom tax, free prescriptions, free education, baby boxes etc then I'm fine with that

[James310]

I don't earn anywhere near £50k but if my additional tax is going towards the bedroom tax, free prescriptions, free education, baby boxes etc then I'm fine with that

So if you earn less than £27K you are not paying any "additional" tax, you are paying less tax than someone in England earning the same as you. That will change though as explained so you will probably soon be paying that additional tax compared to someone in England.

[Ozyhibby]

Scotland already has by far the best funded services in the UK so I would kind of expect them to be the best performing.

Although many are still crap like A&E waiting times or cancer waiting times, I don't think it's much comfort to someone waiting on cancer treatment to.let them know it's worse over the border, that won't bring a smile to their face.

If the majority of people are happy paying £X extra for improved services then great, it's not something the SNP need to worry about is it. They keep rates as they are.

At least you now accept that the SG are providing the best services in the UK now. A big step.


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[LeithMike]

What a mess!

1. In terms of simple economics on an individual scale, you never encourage anyone to spend more than they bring in which is exactly what UK Government are doing.

2. Have we really not learnt from the pandemic (and indeed war in Ukraine) that society is a whole and that we cannnot leave sections of it behind? The cut on high rate tax at this time is dreadful.

3. Have we not learned that you should really save for a rainy day? The government should be saving money up for future crisis. Certainly environmental crisis do not appear to be far away.

4. Hopefully this means Truss and the Conservative party will be quickly consigned to history. Does Labour have the gumption to reverse all the bad policy decisions?!

Sent from my SM-N960F using Tapatalk

[The_Exile]

So if I'm in England right now and my salary is the bang average 25k a year and my boss is 100k a year this is how it breaks down?:

25k employee - Extra £10 a month in pay due to the NI increase being scrapped and extra £10.50 with the tax rate being reduced 1%. Essentially an extra £20 a month

100K boss - Total monthly tax bill falls from £2285 to £1384 due to the abolition of the higher rate of tax and the NI savings, so essentially an extra £900ish quid a month

If that's right, and there's not rioting over this, then there will never be rioting over anything. The UK workers will be confirmed as the cap doffing subservant buffoons that we are. I feel like I've woken up and it's the early 80's again.

[ronaldo7]

The pound plummets to a 37 year low following the chancellor's plans to give more money to the richest in society.

Tories doing what they do whilst trying to paint devolved government's into a corner.

Nice to see them introduce a 19p rate for England following on from ours which they said was the wrong course of action.

[James310]

At least you now accept that the SG are providing the best services in the UK now. A big step.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

We get about 20% higher spending thanks to Barnett, seems crazy to want to give this all up when they are so important.

Buts that's for another thread.

[James310]

What a mess!

1. In terms of simple economics on an individual scale, you never encourage anyone to spend more than they bring in which is exactly what UK Government are doing.

2. Have we really not learnt from the pandemic (and indeed war in Ukraine) that society is a whole and that we cannnot leave sections of it behind? The cut on high rate tax at this time is dreadful.

3. Have we not learned that you should really save for a rainy day? The government should be saving money up for future crisis. Certainly environmental crisis do not appear to be far away.

4. Hopefully this means Truss and the Conservative party will be quickly consigned to history. Does Labour have the gumption to reverse all the bad policy decisions?!

Sent from my SM-N960F using Tapatalk

I think you are correct on point 4 - it was the last throw of the dice and a massive gamble. I think it will usher in a Labour government at the next GE. I can see them reversing a number of these changes.

[Hibby Bairn]

I am self employed and do quite well. I generally support paying more tax to help those in greater need.

However, my children (all now over 18) cannot access an NHS dentist. I pay a private dentist plan for the same reason. My eldest has been given an unknown wait time to see a specialist at a hospital. Our roads are a disgrace.

But we do benefit from free prescriptions, free tuiition fees, personal care etc which I think are very important.

BUT. The big BUT. I now aim to cap any profits I make to £43k per year (the SG threshold for higher tax rate coming into effect). Every £ I earn above this level I pay around 50p in additional income tax and NI.

I'm not sure that is conducive to economic growth. Nor investment in public services.

[He's here!]

Bold stuff from Kwarteng which will hopefully kick-start the economy. Hopefully the Scottish government will see sense and follow suit.

[Moulin Yarns]

Caps will be removed from bankers’ bonuses, while people on benefits face their money being slashed.


That's levelling up for you 🙄

[Ozyhibby]

Bold stuff from Kwarteng which will hopefully kick-start the economy. Hopefully the Scottish government will see sense and follow suit.

Anyone with a mortgage will be a lot worse off once the BofE raise interest rates massively to try prop up the plummeting pound. Any extra money put into the economy by these cuts will be taken out by higher interest rates. Still, you keep on cheering.[emoji106]


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[LeithMike]

Anyone with a mortgage will be a lot worse off once the BofE raise interest rates massively to try prop up the plummeting pound. Any extra money put into the economy by these cuts will be taken out by higher interest rates. Still, you keep on cheering.[emoji106]


Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkIts crazy. Bank of England trying to stop people having cash to slow inflation and now UK Government doing the exact opposite. Bonkers


Sent from my SM-N960F using Tapatalk

[grunt]

I am self employed and do quite well. I generally support paying more tax to help those in greater need.

However, my children (all now over 18) cannot access an NHS dentist. I pay a private dentist plan for the same reason. My eldest has been given an unknown wait time to see a specialist at a hospital. Our roads are a disgrace.

But we do benefit from free prescriptions, free tuiition fees, personal care etc which I think are very important.

BUT. The big BUT. I now aim to cap any profits I make to £43k per year (the SG threshold for higher tax rate coming into effect). Every £ I earn above this level I pay around 50p in additional income tax and NI.

I'm not sure that is conducive to economic growth. Nor investment in public services.:confused:

Man who does quite well but doesn't want to pay taxes complains about lack of NHS dentists?

[grunt]

Who benefits from Kwarteng's IEA tax cuts?

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FdVyAmzWQAEls6M?format=jpg&name=large

[GlesgaeHibby]

Bold stuff from Kwarteng which will hopefully kick-start the economy. Hopefully the Scottish government will see sense and follow suit.

How on earth will handing money to the richest in society kick start the economy? They'll squirel it away in offshore investments or by buying up property and exacerbating the housing crisis.

[Stairway 2 7]

Oh dear

@KateAndrs
·

This is significant. Truss-Kwarteng are betting the house on reaching 2.5% growth. The first forecasts are coming in and Capital Economics has revised its 2023 growth forecast from 0%...to 0.5%.

[Keith_M]

How on earth will handing money to the richest in society kick start the economy? They'll squirel it away in offshore investments or by buying up property and exacerbating the housing crisis.


Yeah, that's a weird take on what they've done and I have a strong feeling that somebody's just trolling.

[gbhibby]

Bold stuff from Kwarteng which will hopefully kick-start the economy. Hopefully the Scottish government will see sense and follow suit.I believe there will be a decision/discussion in the next 2 weeks by the SG. If stamp duty threshold is not increased to £250k in Scotland I will be paying double the amount in stamp duty compared to the same value purchase in England and NI. The SG have big decisions to make with regards to taxation as in reality how many people are willing to stomach paying more tax compared to people down south.

Sent from my SM-A127F using Tapatalk

[Hibby Bairn]

:confused:

Man who does quite well but doesn't want to pay taxes complains about lack of NHS dentists?

Who doesn't want to pay taxes?

Why shouldn't I complain about NHS dentists. Its what we pay taxes for.

Selective in your argument. The reason I shared my situation is that it can be an example of curtailing economic activity.

[Moulin Yarns]

I believe there will be a decision/discussion in the next 2 weeks by the SG. If stamp duty threshold is not increased to £250k in Scotland I will be paying double the amount in stamp duty compared to the same value purchase in England and NI. The SG have big decisions to make with regards to taxation as in reality how many people are willing to stomach paying more tax compared to people down south.

Sent from my SM-A127F using Tapatalk

We don't pay stamp duty in Scotland!

[Colr]

We don't pay stamp duty in Scotland!

Don’t pay it in England either it’s SDLT!

Great day for pedants, this!

[marinello59]

We don't pay stamp duty in Scotland!

OK LBTT but plenty of us still call it stamp duty.

[marinello59]

Don’t pay it in England either it’s SDLT!

Great day for pedants, this!


:greengrin

[grunt]

Who doesn't want to pay taxes?

Why shouldn't I complain about NHS dentists. Its what we pay taxes for.

I genuinely don't know how to respond to you. If you can't see the link between paying tax and funding the NHS then I don't think I can help you.

[Moulin Yarns]

Don’t pay it in England either it’s SDLT!

Great day for pedants, this!

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/the-growth-plan-2022-factsheet-on-stamp-duty-land-tax

[Ozyhibby]

I get the keys to my new house on Nov 1st and a stamp duty cut would be a big help for me but I don’t think it’s the right thing to do.


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[Colr]

I don’t think I’ve ever done so well from a budget.

I would be please if I didn’t think it was a short term gamble to try and nick the next election.

Barber tried this before. Even the enterprize zones are a rehash of an older failed policy.

Rule if thumb. If something is coming from the tories it’ll be a lie, a grift or both.

[CropleyWasGod]

I am self employed and do quite well. I generally support paying more tax to help those in greater need.

However, my children (all now over 18) cannot access an NHS dentist. I pay a private dentist plan for the same reason. My eldest has been given an unknown wait time to see a specialist at a hospital. Our roads are a disgrace.

But we do benefit from free prescriptions, free tuiition fees, personal care etc which I think are very important.

BUT. The big BUT. I now aim to cap any profits I make to £43k per year (the SG threshold for higher tax rate coming into effect). Every £ I earn above this level I pay around 50p in additional income tax and NI.

I'm not sure that is conducive to economic growth. Nor investment in public services.

I would have a word with your accountant. 2 things:-

1. If you are earning that much, you should be thinking about converting into a limited company. It will probably be cheaper for you.

2. If you are paying 50% tax and NI,you are keeping 50% of it. 50% of a quid is better than 0% of nothing.

[gbhibby]

I get the keys to my new house on Nov 1st and a stamp duty cut would be a big help for me but I don’t think it’s the right thing to do.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Why don't you think that. Would you use the savings to buy something extra for the house so you would be paying Vat. I personally think that stamp duty rates are too high and thresholds should change each year.

[Hibby Bairn]

I would have a word with your accountant. 2 things:-

1. If you are earning that much, you should be thinking about converting into a limited company. It will probably be cheaper for you.

2. If you are paying 50% tax and NI,you are keeping 50% of it. 50% of a quid is better than 0% of nothing.

Thanks CWG. Possibly re (1) but a bit more complicated and probably marginal gains, if any. Re (2) I agree. But I'm OK at that level.

The more general point was about the differences between Scotland and England. And the behaviours that taxation rates can influence in certain circumstances..

[gbhibby]

We don't pay stamp duty in Scotland!
Didn't want to use other terminologies as it might confuse some people😁

[weecounty hibby]

Bold stuff from Kwarteng which will hopefully kick-start the economy. Hopefully the Scottish government will see sense and follow suit.
That has to be a piss take surely.
Cards on the table here, I benefit from this big time. But it is a ****ing disgrace that i benefit from this big time while the poorest in society get nearly nothing. I have worked my arse off over the last 37 years to be in a very well paid role and I can and am willing to pay my fair share as a high earner!! Honestly sick to my stomach that these crooks keep doing this and even more sick that people keep voting for them.

[Hibby Bairn]

I get the keys to my new house on Nov 1st and a stamp duty cut would be a big help for me but I don’t think it’s the right thing to do.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yes. But if you then spent the money saved on other "stuff" then you'd help sustain other people's jobs (and knock on income tax), pay a bit more VAT and generally keep more money in the economy.

[weecounty hibby]

Yes. But if you then spent the money saved on other "stuff" then you'd help sustain other people's jobs (and knock on income tax), pay a bit more VAT and generally keep more money in the economy.

Yeah, that has been proven not to work over the last 12 years at least
Trickle down economy benefits the richest most and the poorest least.

[grunt]

I wonder which parts of the UK benefit from the SDLT cuts?
#LevellingUpTheSouthEast

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FdVgNm-X0AM-qmS?format=png&name=large

[gbhibby]

Yes. But if you then spent the money saved on other "stuff" then you'd help sustain other people's jobs (and knock on income tax), pay a bit more VAT and generally keep more money in the economy.
Exactly the point I made as well. People need to look at the bigger picture.

[grunt]

Yes. But if you then spent the money saved on other "stuff" then you'd help sustain other people's jobs (and knock on income tax), pay a bit more VAT and generally keep more money in the economy.

https://twitter.com/benphillips76/status/1572909416638459905?s=20&t=uhcAOdf2lgBuMYr3RM4KkA

[Ozyhibby]

Why don't you think that. Would you use the savings to buy something extra for the house so you would be paying Vat. I personally think that stamp duty rates are too high and thresholds should change each year.


Yes. But if you then spent the money saved on other "stuff" then you'd help sustain other people's jobs (and knock on income tax), pay a bit more VAT and generally keep more money in the economy.

If the SG use the money to help those most vulnerable just now, it will make its way back into the economy anyway?
In the meantime, I don’t think the the housing bubble needs any more air.


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[grunt]

Exactly the point I made as well. People need to look at the bigger picture.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FdHOignXkAAand_?format=jpg&name=900x900

[gbhibby]

I wonder which parts of the UK benefit from the SDLT cuts?
#LevellingUpTheSouthEast

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FdVgNm-X0AM-qmS?format=png&name=large
Have you got a table for non first time buyers. If the same policy applied in Scotland it would benefit people mainly in the central belt.

[grunt]

Have you got a table for non first time buyers. If the same policy applied in Scotland it would benefit people mainly in the central belt.
Sorry I don't.

What you save in stamp duty will be dwarfed by what you pay in increased interest rates - it only really helps cash buyers and foreign investors.

[Mon Dieu4]

Have you got a table for non first time buyers. If the same policy applied in Scotland it would benefit people mainly in the central belt.

70% of the Scottish population live in the central belt, 32% of the population of England live in London and the South East

[Moulin Yarns]

The Economist

Worth repeating. Take all the tax changes coming in over next few years and:

If your income is < £155k, you lose

If your income is > £155k you win

If your income > £1m you gain more than £40,000

[ronaldo7]

Imagine if Corbyn (or even Labour) had given a budget with 150bn uncosted proposals in it. There would be murder in the right wing press. The rule book has been torn up today. Sadly if Starmer gets in in 2024, he will have one unholy mess to sort out and then the Tories will win the next election as the party of “fiscal competence” ! 1970s all over again

This seems to have been body swerved from the hard right types. You're bang on btw. They'll be telling us next that the economy is safe in their hands.

No mention of the sanctions on the way for part time workers either.

Tax cuts for the rich, benefit cuts for the poor.

[Moulin Yarns]

IFS


Today’s measures mean that the richest tenth of households, who were set to lose around £3,500 a year (3%) on average by 2025-26 under Johnson and Sunak’s plans, will now gain around £700 a year (1%) on average

[Moulin Yarns]

The Economist


Despite today's tax cuts middle earners are still set to lose as a result of tax changes over next years. The freezing of allowances and thresholds is still a big tax increase.

Only those on over £155,000 will pay less tax overall. The very rich will pay tens of thousands less

[gbhibby]

70% of the Scottish population live in the central belt, 32% of the population of England live in London and the South East
Properties in the central belt are more expensive in general than other parts of Scotland so would any changes to stamp duty not benefit more people in Scotland per capita.
Also it would benefit areas where house prices are not as high as the central belt. The SG will get funds from Westminster for this.

[Moulin Yarns]

Doug Ross 80 hour A&E story blown out of the water


https://talkingupscotlandtwo.com/2022/09/23/the-80-hours-in-an-ayrshire-ae-story-by-douglas-ross-is-exposed-as-fake-news/

[Moulin Yarns]

Good news for the average Premier League footballer (salary £3.5m) who has just been given a £167,500 tax cut

[CropleyWasGod]

The Economist


Despite today's tax cuts middle earners are still set to lose as a result of tax changes over next years. The freezing of allowances and thresholds is still a big tax increase.

Only those on over £155,000 will pay less tax overall. The very rich will pay tens of thousands less

That bit isn't true, albeit that's not really the point.

[Paul1642]

The Economist


Despite today's tax cuts middle earners are still set to lose as a result of tax changes over next years. The freezing of allowances and thresholds is still a big tax increase.

Only those on over £155,000 will pay less tax overall. The very rich will pay tens of thousands less

Not sure that’s a true at all. From what I can tell everyone will pay less tax.

It’s more so that the rich will pay much less tax whilst the poor will save a much less noticeable amount.

I can’t get my head around this budget. Like most people I had a bad feeling about the new government but I didn’t event to be proven right so quickly and so severely. It’s an absolute car crash and I pray the Scottish government have enough devolved powers to turn it into a good thing for the Scottish people.

I’m really looking forward to hearing form Sturgeon (for the first time in my life).

[James310]

Doug Ross 80 hour A&E story blown out of the water


https://talkingupscotlandtwo.com/2022/09/23/the-80-hours-in-an-ayrshire-ae-story-by-douglas-ross-is-exposed-as-fake-news/

Lol, someone who 'has a feeling' the patient was their Mum but says they can't be sure posts it on Twitter under the name 'George the Ayrshire Geek' and then it appears on a website called 'Talking Up Scotland' and you believe it blows Douglas Ross's story out the water.

I got flak for posting story's from The Times.

You must read some really great stuff if that is your sources, you should share more often.

[hibsbollah]

Not sure that’s a true at all. From what I can tell everyone will pay less tax.

It’s more so that the rich will pay much less tax whilst the poor will save a much less noticeable amount.

I can’t get my head around this budget. Like most people I had a bad feeling about the new government but I didn’t event to be proven right so quickly and so severely. It’s an absolute car crash and I pray the Scottish government have enough devolved powers to turn it into a good thing for the Scottish people.

I’m really looking forward to hearing form Sturgeon (for the first time in my life).

From a tweet by Paul Johnson the Economist

Worth repeating. Take all the tax changes coming in over next few years and:If your income is < £155k, you loseIf your income is > £155k you winIf your income > £1m you gain more than £40,000


Quote Tweet








https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/575759935507660801/JTNY4s21_mini.jpeg











Paul Johnson





@PJTheEconomist








· 1h


Despite today's tax cuts middle earners are still set to lose as a result of tax changes over next years. The freezing of allowances and thresholds is still a big tax increase.Only those on over £155,000 will pay less tax overall. The very rich will pay tens of thousands less twitter.com/TheIFS/status/…

[patch1875]

I get the keys to my new house on Nov 1st and a stamp duty cut would be a big help for me but I don’t think it’s the right thing to do.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

We move in January new rate makes the Scottish system £4100 more expensive for us.

[Speedy]

So if I'm in England right now and my salary is the bang average 25k a year and my boss is 100k a year this is how it breaks down?:

25k employee - Extra £10 a month in pay due to the NI increase being scrapped and extra £10.50 with the tax rate being reduced 1%. Essentially an extra £20 a month

100K boss - Total monthly tax bill falls from £2285 to £1384 due to the abolition of the higher rate of tax and the NI savings, so essentially an extra £900ish quid a month

If that's right, and there's not rioting over this, then there will never be rioting over anything. The UK workers will be confirmed as the cap doffing subservant buffoons that we are. I feel like I've woken up and it's the early 80's again.

Those figures don't seem right. It's the 45% rate being scrapped, would only benefit people over £150k I believe?

[Speedy]

Sorry I don't.

What you save in stamp duty will be dwarfed by what you pay in increased interest rates - it only really helps cash buyers and foreign investors.

And people with existing property assets. Reducing stamp duty increases house prices - moving the cash from public funds (i.e. tax) to private asset owners.

Again, it is there to benefit the rich

[Keith_M]

I'm so grateful that Donald Trump has been involved in massive tax avoidance schemes over many years, as it means he has more money to spend, therefore keeps people in jobs and keeps the economy going.


Am I getting this right?


:dunno:

[gbhibby]

And people with existing property assets. Reducing stamp duty increases house prices - moving the cash from public funds (i.e. tax) to private asset owners.

Again, it is there to benefit the rich
Is it not all relative.

[gbhibby]

And people with existing property assets. Reducing stamp duty increases house prices - moving the cash from public funds (i.e. tax) to private asset owners.

Again, it is there to benefit the rich
Is it not all relative most people are private asset owners and not all rich. There are people who are asset rich but cash poor.

[Ozyhibby]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220923/1e664776e5cc5b33c00e3ef8bac0c3ca.jpg


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[neil7908]

Can't believe I'm saying this but they are actually worse than Boris aren't they?

This country is genuinely ****ed. Even a Labour Govt in 2 years time won't be able to sort all of this out and we are no nearer to tackling one of main reasons the economy is in such a mess - Brexit.

[neil7908]

We move in January new rate makes the Scottish system £4100 more expensive for us.

Any word if Scotland will follow suit?

[LewysGot2]

A lot of this is only affecting places outside Scotland?
Is there a go to resource available to compare our situation v elsewhere on this land mass?

[Bostonhibby]

Can't believe I'm saying this but they are actually worse than Boris aren't they?

This country is genuinely ****ed. Even a Labour Govt in 2 years time won't be able to sort all of this out and we are no nearer to tackling one of main reasons the economy is in such a mess - Brexit.They are, Kwartenklike, laughing at us all just because they know they can.

BBC News - Liz Truss's Foreign Office spend at Norwich City shop questioned
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-norfolk-63006755

Sent from my SM-A750FN using Tapatalk

[Stairway 2 7]

A lot of this is only affecting places outside Scotland?
Is there a go to resource available to compare our situation v elsewhere on this land mass?

Do you mean how much more tax? This from torygraph is a chart on how much you'll pay. Doesn't take in free education, childcare for 3yos, prescriptions ect ect

https://mobile.twitter.com/simon_telegraph/status/1573263052341919744

[Ozyhibby]

Do you mean how much more tax? This from torygraph is a chart on how much you'll pay. Doesn't take in free education, childcare for 3yos, prescriptions ect ect

https://mobile.twitter.com/simon_telegraph/status/1573263052341919744

About £500 a year cheaper council tax.


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[hibsbollah]

Marina cheering me up slightly.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/sep/23/poor-rich-kwasi-kwarteng-tax-mini-budget-liz-truss

[Stairway 2 7]

About £500 a year cheaper council tax.


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That needs to end pronto, thankfully I believe it will. Hopefully they don't bow to pressure (which will be huge) and don't lower tax. Tories will go full pelt asking for it. Labour will be in a funny position and will have to show their colours

[LewysGot2]

Do you mean how much more tax? This from torygraph is a chart on how much you'll pay. Doesn't take in free education, childcare for 3yos, prescriptions ect ect

https://mobile.twitter.com/simon_telegraph/status/1573263052341919744

Including all those would be tricky given only some of the population benefit from all of the different components.

A job for a computer literate financial analyst somewhere

[Ozyhibby]

That needs to end pronto, thankfully I believe it will. Hopefully they don't bow to pressure (which will be huge) and don't lower tax. Tories will go full pelt asking for it. Labour will be in a funny position and will have to show their colours

I thought getting rid of council tax and replacing with a local income tax was what people wanted? Isn’t that sort of what’s happening?


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[Hibrandenburg]

Marina cheering me up slightly.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/sep/23/poor-rich-kwasi-kwarteng-tax-mini-budget-liz-truss

She should do stand-up.

[Stairway 2 7]

I thought getting rid of council tax and replacing with a local income tax was what people wanted? Isn’t that sort of what’s happening?


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Yeah but it shouldn't have been frozen for over a decade causing austerity for councils

[Hiber-nation]

She should do stand-up.

Aye the Mogg comments are comedy gold!

[LunasBoots]

Torys are aware they are going to lose the next GE and are fleecing monies for there rich chums.

[Stairway 2 7]

Absolutely awful for mortgages on this track we'll have the biggest housing crash on record.

@EdConwaySky
·
Golly.
Markets are now pricing in 5.5% interest rates from the @bankofengland next year.
Up from 4.75% yesterday.
Deutsche Bank saying BoE may need to table an emergency rate hike as soon as next week.
Extraordinary.
And, as I said yday, higher rates are a big, big deal.
Ugh. twitter.com/edconwaysky/st…

[Speedy]

Is it not all relative most people are private asset owners and not all rich. There are people who are asset rich but cash poor.

Not really. I'm not saying everyone who owns their home is rich.

If you own one house and live in it, then the value going up means little to you personally unless you are going to downside, borrow against it or move somewhere cheaper. For most people they buy bigger places, so while it's great saying you made '£x' on the house you sold but it just means the bigger place you want is less affordable.

The rich, with multiple properties can sell them at a higher price or charge higher rents to generate more income. They're the big winners from these types of policies.

[Ozyhibby]

Absolutely awful for mortgages on this track we'll have the biggest housing crash on record.

@EdConwaySky
·
Golly.
Markets are now pricing in 5.5% interest rates from the @bankofengland next year.
Up from 4.75% yesterday.
Deutsche Bank saying BoE may need to table an emergency rate hike as soon as next week.
Extraordinary.
And, as I said yday, higher rates are a big, big deal.
Ugh. twitter.com/edconwaysky/st…

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220923/06fcf757b0fa0400c5c9c3190daa0b80.jpg


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[Ozyhibby]

To be fair to the other idiot, Sunak, he did warn that her plans would push interest rates sky high.


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[cabbageandribs1875]

https://scontent.fman1-2.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/307459352_457000589801935_3190799959699264770_n.jp g?stp=cp6_dst-jpg&_nc_cat=100&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=730e14&_nc_ohc=mkCahU4HWJsAX8w46gc&_nc_ht=scontent.fman1-2.fna&oh=00_AT-0k8YhhAWczhOhK7_oXTBQLC20V9K7iKZDodky2iA66Q&oe=6333A6AC

[Kato]

Bold stuff from Kwarteng which will hopefully kick-start the economy. Hopefully the Scottish government will see sense and follow suit.1980's wants its soft soap back, please.

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[Kato]

Shadow Chancellor calling the budget "reckless". Which could what they are trying to do. A smash and grab for two years then leave the next govt with the mess.

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[Speedy]

Shadow Chancellor calling the budget "reckless". Which could what they are trying to do. A smash and grab for two years then leave the next govt with the mess.

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Appeases donors and leaves Labour being the bad guys next time when they need to raise taxes

[Ozyhibby]

Appeases donors and leaves Labour being the bad guys next time when they need to raise taxes

Whenever that may be. If she crashes the economy bad enough, it should be growing again in about 2 years and then it will be ‘Don’t let Labour ruin the recovery’. Don’t rule out another Tory victory.


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[Paul1642]

Do you mean how much more tax? This from torygraph is a chart on how much you'll pay. Doesn't take in free education, childcare for 3yos, prescriptions ect ect

https://mobile.twitter.com/simon_telegraph/status/1573263052341919744

I’m very much okay with this.

[Stairway 2 7]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20220923/06fcf757b0fa0400c5c9c3190daa0b80.jpg


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Jeez seeing as that hasn't peaked and is going near vertical it is utterly frightening. I don't think people realise how bad this will be. Stomach actually drops looking at that. Add in brexit, fuel crisis, high inflation and a government that doesn't care and I'm very worried

[degenerated]

1980's wants its soft soap back, please.

Sent from my SM-A528B using TapatalkI have absolutely no idea how these tax cuts are expected to kick start the economy, I wish someone could explain it to me.

[Stairway 2 7]

I have absolutely no idea how these tax cuts are expected to kick start the economy, I wish someone could explain it to me.

Duncan Weldon economists and financial writer doesn't understand it so I doubt we can

https://mobile.twitter.com/DuncanWeldon/status/1573351616547282944

Duncan Weldon
@DuncanWeldon
I’ve been following U.K. budgets for 20 years or so.
I have often profoundly disagreed with the decisions made. But I’ve always at least - sort of - understood the logic behind them.
Today is a new for me. I genuinely don’t understand the decision making process

[Stairway 2 7]

Colour me surprised

SamCoatesSky
Sources in Labour's Treasury team say they want to look at the OBR forecasts before deciding whether to promise to reverse the additional 45p rate.

In other words, under current plans, this ain't happening any time soon

[Hibernia&Alba]

Trickledown economics turned up to eleven; Milton Friedman, Thatcher and Reagan will all be dancing a jig of joy in hell. Completely unjust, but what else do you expect. Those earning over £155,000 per year will be better off; the rest of us can get tae ****. Universal credit claimants to be further harassed and punished as bankers pay caps are removed; environmental protections trashed; supply side garbage which hasn't delivered on its promises this past forty years.

Honestly, I don't know much more I can take of this. It's slash and burn suicide economics.

[Paul1642]

I wish someone could explain to me why saving the rich money is expected to promote growth. They already have money and will likely invest the money saved or keep it in the bank.

Surely to promote growth you give that money to the lower and middle earners who will go out and spend it!

In my whole lifetime of following politics today is probably the most I have ever disagreed with a government decision. It’s a favour to those who don’t need it and slap in the face to those who do. I’m utterly baffled.

[Hibernia&Alba]

I have absolutely no idea how these tax cuts are expected to kick start the economy, I wish someone could explain it to me.

Milton Friedman 101: The rising tide lifts all boats. You see, if you give miles more to those who already have the most, they spend that money in economy, which means businesses benefit, will expand and then hire more low wage staff.

It's a bit like going to your doctor with an infected toe. The doctor says, "I'm not going to address the problem directly, I'm going to treat your head, then wait for the antibiotics to trickledown to your toe."

"But my toe is very painful now."
"Ah, but your toe doesn't know what's in its own best interests. In the long run it will be better off, and, if the worst happens, we can amputate, and you will have one less toe to worry about."

It doesn't work and is totally self-serving, giving an intellectual facade to avarice. A great example of verisimilitude.

[Speedy]

I have absolutely no idea how these tax cuts are expected to kick start the economy, I wish someone could explain it to me.

https://twitter.com/Exploding_Heads/status/1572887669319041030?s=20&t=Sr9uXVUYrQOjAUcxg6uvTw

[Paul1642]

https://twitter.com/Exploding_Heads/status/1572887669319041030?s=20&t=Sr9uXVUYrQOjAUcxg6uvTw

Brilliant but also very sadly true.

[Rumble de Thump]

It's exactly what anyone should expect from a Tory government. The wealthiest who don't need help get the most help, at the expense of the poorest. The people running this Tory government are clearly just trying to fleece the public for as much dosh as possible before they get voted out at the next election. Their greed and corruption will do a considerable amount of damage before then.

[Kato]

https://twitter.com/Exploding_Heads/status/1572887669319041030?s=20&t=Sr9uXVUYrQOjAUcxg6uvTwhttps://twitter.com/IsabelOakeshott/status/1573349307595751426?t=4KFAHemdG8-MxdwQLOozIA&s=19

Creating an "aspiration nation". That was one of Thatchers PR sayings, iirc.

Baloney.

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[wookie70]

Yeah but it shouldn't have been frozen for over a decade causing austerity for councils Depends what band you are in. Mine went up a few years back

[gbhibby]

Not really. I'm not saying everyone who owns their home is rich.

If you own one house and live in it, then the value going up means little to you personally unless you are going to downside, borrow against it or move somewhere cheaper. For most people they buy bigger places, so while it's great saying you made '£x' on the house you sold but it just means the bigger place you want is less affordable.

The rich, with multiple properties can sell them at a higher price or charge higher rents to generate more income. They're the big winners from these types of policies.
There are people who own multiple properties that are paying mortgages on these properties not all are cash buyers and rich in the big scheme of things.

[marinello59]

There are people who own multiple properties that are paying mortgages on these properties not all are cash buyers and rich in the big scheme of things.

If they were renting them out when times were good then they coined it in. I have no sympathy for capitalists when it goes wrong for them.

[Glory Lurker]

We move in January new rate makes the Scottish system £4100 more expensive for us.

No it doesn't. The Scottish rate is the same as it was yesterday.

[JeMeSouviens]

The £ absolutely tanked today. Fair to say markets not buying Trussonomics.

[Glory Lurker]

Appeases donors and leaves Labour being the bad guys next time when they need to raise taxes

Aye,like any Labour government in the last 43 years has ever done that.

[Hibrandenburg]

Trickle down financial politics, you could also call it "scraps from the table", problem is that us dogs only get scraps and the rest goes in the fridge.

[weecounty hibby]

The £ absolutely tanked today. Fair to say markets not buying Trussonomics.

Wonder how many Tories and Tory supporters and donors will make a killing due to this?

[Glory Lurker]

Wonder how many Tories and Tory supporters and donors will make a killing due to this?

Hunners.

[makaveli1875]

Liz Truss is on another planet , there are no words . She’s a **** , a stupid **** .

[stoneyburn hibs]

Lol, someone who 'has a feeling' the patient was their Mum but says they can't be sure posts it on Twitter under the name 'George the Ayrshire Geek' and then it appears on a website called 'Talking Up Scotland' and you believe it blows Douglas Ross's story out the water.

I got flak for posting story's from The Times.

You must read some really great stuff if that is your sources, you should share more often.

You must be delighted with the budget John BC
Toryboy.

[cabbageandribs1875]

https://scontent.fman1-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/308420124_382548717422529_6843688293766983582_n.jp g?_nc_cat=110&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=730e14&_nc_ohc=bFfRmamE2bEAX98bHwW&tn=vIvSFNl06GFFe0Qb&_nc_ht=scontent.fman1-1.fna&oh=00_AT-5LdudUHG5YfFB_mz4evhLBkhdjSexUyiJYk5N_1Vmow&oe=6332FAA2

[cabbageandribs1875]

Groper Pincher will not be investigated by parliamentary watchdog

[Moulin Yarns]

I can buy 1 kg of oatmeal from Tesco for 70 pence. It will make 20 meals. Why does the Left pretend people in Britain are starving?
effiedeans.com/2022/09/not-so…

Unionist blogger in Aberdeenshire!!

Obviously thinks eating gruell every meal is nutritional!

[Kato]

I can buy 1 kg of oatmeal from Tesco for 70 pence. It will make 20 meals. Why does the Left pretend people in Britain are starving?
effiedeans.com/2022/09/not-so…

Unionist blogger in Aberdeenshire!!

Obviously thinks eating gruell every meal is nutritional!This is literally Victorian Values.

Another one of Thatcher's hits.

20 JazzFunk Greats from Saatchi & Saatchi on K-Tel Tories.



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[Hibernia&Alba]

This is literally Victorian Values.

Another one of Thatcher's hits.

20 JazzFunk Greats from Saatchi & Saatchi on K-Tel Tories.



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At least in the Thatcher years the Tories would say things like, "if you own a colour TV, you can't really be in poverty." In 2022 it's regressed to, "if you can afford a 70p bag of oatmeal, you can't really be in poverty." In ten years, it will be, "if you're only going without food every other day, you can't really be in poverty."

[Jack]

I can buy 1 kg of oatmeal from Tesco for 70 pence. It will make 20 meals. Why does the Left pretend people in Britain are starving?
effiedeans.com/2022/09/not-so…

Unionist blogger in Aberdeenshire!!

Obviously thinks eating gruell every meal is nutritional!

When I was young 😆 one of my friends ended up at Dundee University. A friend of his spent all but a few pounds of his student grant, remember them, on a hifi system.

To feed himself he spent the rest on oats and ate porridge for what would have been 10 weeks but he contracted scurvy and was taken to hospital before then!