Have Hearts broke lockdown restrictions?

[Ozyhibby]

Just read that Souter picked up an injury and that other players and club officials were present? How can this be?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[matty_f]

Just read that Souter picked up an injury and that other players and club officials were present? How can this be?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I asked Joel Sked this and his reply was that he’d heard Souter was running alone.

Interesting that before the story broke there was an asking that referenced other players and a physio being present for running exercises, in which case it can’t be anything other than a breach.

Edit: just read a post from MacGruber saying it was rehab work, in which case no rules have been broken.

[PatHead]

I asked Joel Sked this and his reply was that he’d heard Souter was running alone.

Interesting that before the story broke there was an asking that referenced other players and a physio being present for running exercises, in which case it can’t be anything other than a breach.

Edit: just read a post from MacGruber saying it was rehab work, in which case no rules have been broken.

But someone else said players were running along and they heard a scream behind them. Turning round they saw Souttar in agony. Which was it?

[Since452]

But someone else said players were running along and they heard a scream behind them. Turning round they saw Souttar in agony. Which was it?

Good point

[matty_f]

But someone else said players were running along and they heard a scream behind them. Turning round they saw Souttar in agony. Which was it?

My guess is that more than one person was doing rehab work.

[Scouse Hibee]

Guy suffers potentially career ending injury during some form of training rehab or otherwise, feel sorry for the guy and really don’t care if they were flouting some rule that was thrust upon them following the poor behaviour of Celtic and Aberdeen players.

[PatHead]

My guess is that more than one person was doing rehab work.

When it comes to Hearts I wouldn't believe an official word they said.

[hibbysam]

My guess is that more than one person was doing rehab work.

Rehab work would still be organised training. However, as Scouse says it was an absolute nonsense decision to stop them and it’s an injury that could have happened at any time. Doesn’t affect us so it’s neither here nor there.

[matty_f]

Rehab work would still be organised training. However, as Scouse says it was an absolute nonsense decision to stop them and it’s an injury that could have happened at any time. Doesn’t affect us so it’s neither here nor there.

It wasn’t a nonsense decision, imho. It wouldn’t have been fair to allow them to continue training when other clubs couldn’t if they wanted to.

If Hearts ignored that, they should be punished.

Fwiw, i think if it’s rehab then that’s different, though i am not sure what the stance on that would be.

[hibbysam]

It wasn’t a nonsense decision, imho. It wouldn’t have been fair to allow them to continue training when other clubs couldn’t if they wanted to.

If Hearts ignored that, they should be punished.

Fwiw, i think if it’s rehab then that’s different, though i am not sure what the stance on that would be.

Other clubs shouldn’t have been stopped, is why it was nonsense. I was training for weeks then had to take a week off for absolutely no reason. I’ve learnt nothing new in that timeframe than I knew before. Your going down the road of it being about Hearts when it wasn’t, it was about every club up and down the country from championship to Sunday amateur, and everything in between.

[Danderhall Hibs]

Other clubs shouldn’t have been stopped, is why it was nonsense. I was training for weeks then had to take a week off for absolutely no reason. I’ve learnt nothing new in that timeframe than I knew before. Your going down the road of it being about Hearts when it wasn’t, it was about every club up and down the country from championship to Sunday amateur, and everything in between.

I don’t think it was about education- it was about minimising the risk.

[The 90+2]

Other clubs shouldn’t have been stopped, is why it was nonsense. I was training for weeks then had to take a week off for absolutely no reason. I’ve learnt nothing new in that timeframe than I knew before. Your going down the road of it being about Hearts when it wasn’t, it was about every club up and down the country from championship to Sunday amateur, and everything in between.

It was only 5 days ffs people are acting like it was months and the biggest miscarriage of justice ever because they had to stop for a few days. It comes with the perks of being lower league *****. They shouldn’t have been ***** enough to go down at there would be no issue, Tom English wouldn’t give a single **** if Hamilton had to cancel training for a few days. It’s bonkers and faux rage because they didn’t stay up because they are the big team and budge is a successful businesswoman.

[Tynie01011973]

The SFA&SPFL should be asking the question at least IMO

[hibbysam]

It was only 5 days ffs people are acting like it was months and the biggest miscarriage of justice ever because they had to stop for a few days. It comes with the perks of being lower league *****. They shouldn’t have been ***** enough to go down at there would be no issue, Tom English wouldn’t give a single **** if Hamilton had to cancel training for a few days. It’s bonkers and faux rage because they didn’t stay up because they are the big team and budge is a successful businesswoman.

It was 11 days, but that’s not the point. Calling LL, EOS, Amateur boys that just want to play football ‘lower league *****’ is horrendous patter. Our game at the top wouldn’t survive without the game at the bottom, grassroots is far more important to the country as a whole than the premiership is.

[hibbysam]

I don’t think it was about education- it was about minimising the risk.

Unless the SFA are lying about it then it was 100% about education, ensuring that people knew the government guidelines. If it was about risk then the government would’ve stopped it. The fact we’ve come straight back and now allowed full contact to me shows how ridiculous a decision it was. Totally pointless exercise to prove a point.

[Danderhall Hibs]

Unless the SFA are lying about it then it was 100% about education, ensuring that people knew the government guidelines. If it was about risk then the government would’ve stopped it. The fact we’ve come straight back and now allowed full contact to me shows how ridiculous a decision it was. Totally pointless exercise to prove a point.

I didn’t see them say anything about education. It was implied that it was a thing done to minimise the risk while the government were on the rampage looking for the 2nd yellow card. The government didn’t ask for it directly but they must’ve been clear to the SFA that it was expecting measures in place.

A week off training (or a delay by a week) seems to have allowed things to die down.

[Danderhall Hibs]

It was 11 days, but that’s not the point. Calling LL, EOS, Amateur boys that just want to play football ‘lower league *****’ is horrendous patter. Our game at the top wouldn’t survive without the game at the bottom, grassroots is far more important to the country as a whole than the premiership is.

So were non league teams back training? I thought it was all off unless kids teams?

[hibbysam]

I didn’t see them say anything about education. It was implied that it was a thing done to minimise the risk while the government were on the rampage looking for the 2nd yellow card. The government didn’t ask for it directly but they must’ve been clear to the SFA that it was expecting measures in place.

A week off training (or a delay by a week) seems to have allowed things to die down.

All club facilities comply with the current JRG Protocols, social distancing and hygiene measures.

“• All club policies and procedures comply with the current protocols and government guidance.

“• Club testing regimes in the professional game comply with the protocols.

“• Players and staff at all levels of the game have been reminded of the latest government guidance.”

Pause the lower leagues to ensure professional teams (those outwith the top league who now dont need to test) are complying with testing protocols 😂

The last point states it was all about education. Even though nobody was educated any more than they already were.

[hibbysam]

So were non league teams back training? I thought it was all off unless kids teams?

They were back training prior to the ‘pause’, and are now back training from Monday coming. All adult training was paused for 11 days.

[Danderhall Hibs]

They were back training prior to the ‘pause’, and are now back training from Monday coming. All adult training was paused for 11 days.

Genuinely thought all teams apart from the premiership and youth teams were not training. What testing were you guys doing?

[hibbysam]

Genuinely thought all teams apart from the premiership and youth teams were not training. What testing were you guys doing?

None, it was all non contact, small groups etc. No need for testing etc. For us, the training wouldn’t make a difference, but when the amateur game is dying on its knees, it sounds daft but telling folk to take 2 weeks out (we missed two Thursday sessions) then you get half them going out on the bevy and not bothering to come back when it resumes. Just a pain in the arse, the higher up the tree you go, the more effect losing 2 weeks of training has, just found it pointless myself.

[Andy74]

None, it was all non contact, small groups etc. No need for testing etc. For us, the training wouldn’t make a difference, but when the amateur game is dying on its knees, it sounds daft but telling folk to take 2 weeks out (we missed two Thursday sessions) then you get half them going out on the bevy and not bothering to come back when it resumes. Just a pain in the arse, the higher up the tree you go, the more effect losing 2 weeks of training has, just found it pointless myself.

It was a public health issue and so a few days impact on football which wasn’t at the elite level with full testing isn’t really a hardship.

[Bostonhibby]

I'm waiting until Tom English speaks out on this one before jumping to any conclusions on this one, for the sake of Scottish football.

Sent from my SM-A750FN using Tapatalk

[Keith_M]

Jeez, some people seem desperate to go running to tell the teacher.

[hibbysam]

It was a public health issue and so a few days impact on football which wasn’t at the elite level with full testing isn’t really a hardship.

What was a public health issue? There was no issue, half a dozen boys training/kicking a ball about without contact, when I could do the exact same but in a non organised way. It’s not a hardship if it doesn’t affect you. A lot of boys rely on football to get out the house, to get away from the **** in their lives, to help their mental health, as well as their physical fitness and wellbeing. It’s already been 5 months, to then be allowed back and then told for no reason to take 11 days out was wrong.

[bingo70]

Jeez, some people seem desperate to go running to tell the teacher.

Exactly......

If hearts have broken any roles let’s just all be quiet about it and hope nobody notices!

[The 90+2]

What was a public health issue? There was no issue, half a dozen boys training/kicking a ball about without contact, when I could do the exact same but in a non organised way. It’s not a hardship if it doesn’t affect you. A lot of boys rely on football to get out the house, to get away from the **** in their lives, to help their mental health, as well as their physical fitness and wellbeing. It’s already been 5 months, to then be allowed back and then told for no reason to take 11 days out was wrong.

The only alternative was going to be a two week blanket ban on all of football which almost happened, then you guys and hearts would still have not been allowed to go to training for the 2 times you missed and 6 days hearts missed. It’s only blown out of proportion because of one football club. Everyone has to make sacrifices, the same day football was banned below the Prem there was Hibs players instructed not to take their kids to school regardless of it being the first day. How does that impact someone’s mental health?

[The 90+2]

Exactly......

If hearts have broken any roles let’s just all be quiet about it and hope nobody notices!

It worked from about 2005 to 2013 tbh.

[hibbysam]

The only alternative was going to be a two week blanket ban on all of football which almost happened, then you guys and hearts would still have not been allowed to go to training for the 2 times you missed and 6 days hearts missed. It’s only blown out of proportion because of one football club. Everyone has to make sacrifices, the same day football was banned below the Prem there was Hibs players instructed not to take their kids to school regardless of it being the first day. How does that impact someone’s mental health?

That’s nonsense, there was no prospect of a two week blanket ban. The government couldn’t have been clearer that this had nothing to do with them. Are you seriously telling me people are now more aware of the government guidelines because of that break, than they were before? Answer is no. The game was stopped to ensure testing protocols are met, when testing isn’t necessary anymore 😂 amateur hour.

[Springbank]

It worked from about 2005 to 2013 tbh.

Correct.

If they have been breaking rules like the Aberdeen 8 then they as a club will expect to face the SFA disciplinary process - same as Aberdeen

[Danderhall Hibs]

That’s nonsense, there was no prospect of a two week blanket ban. The government couldn’t have been clearer that this had nothing to do with them. Are you seriously telling me people are now more aware of the government guidelines because of that break, than they were before? Answer is no. The game was stopped to ensure testing protocols are met, when testing isn’t necessary anymore 😂 amateur hour.

The government didn’t make the SFA stop training but they made it clear they expected something to happen.

[The 90+2]

That’s nonsense, there was no prospect of a two week blanket ban. The government couldn’t have been clearer that this had nothing to do with them. Are you seriously telling me people are now more aware of the government guidelines because of that break, than they were before? Answer is no. The game was stopped to ensure testing protocols are met, when testing isn’t necessary anymore 😂 amateur hour.

The government highly recommended a two week ban. The same as they recommended Celtic and the sheep not to play games, they can’t enforce but can recommend. The alternative was under the Prem apart from Glasgow city.

[The 90+2]

Correct.

If they have been breaking rules like the Aberdeen 8 then they as a club will expect to face the SFA disciplinary process - same as Aberdeen

More tears and snorters and it’s no fair etc on the way it is then 😁

[hibbysam]

The government highly recommended a two week ban. The same as they recommended Celtic and the sheep not to play games, they can’t enforce but can recommend. The alternative was under the Prem apart from Glasgow city.

Did they? If that was the case then the SFA would have been all over releasing that info to stop the backlash that they got. The government slapped it down and said all they asked for was actions to be put in place around punishments for clubs and players breaking rules.

[Andy74]

What was a public health issue? There was no issue, half a dozen boys training/kicking a ball about without contact, when I could do the exact same but in a non organised way. It’s not a hardship if it doesn’t affect you. A lot of boys rely on football to get out the house, to get away from the **** in their lives, to help their mental health, as well as their physical fitness and wellbeing. It’s already been 5 months, to then be allowed back and then told for no reason to take 11 days out was wrong.

Everyone has been affected by this. It is a global pandemic and if you could do the same thing anyway then there really isn’t a big issue for you.

Decisions had to be made if the exceptions for organised sports could be allowed to continue. There are much bigger issues here all round than a few days of sport.

[The 90+2]

Did they? If that was the case then the SFA would have been all over releasing that info to stop the backlash that they got. The government slapped it down and said all they asked for was actions to be put in place around punishments for clubs and players breaking rules.

It was in the media the day after, Jason Leitch needed persuaded you convince Sturgeon a blanket ban wasn’t needed including the Prem games. Sturgeon recommended Celtic and Sheep games got called off and the compromise was football stopped under the Prem.

The government never slapped it down, they said they didn’t shut the lower leagues down, they can’t after all, but they compromised that solution for the SFA.

[hibbysam]

Everyone has been affected by this. It is a global pandemic and if you could do the same thing anyway then there really isn’t a big issue for you.

Decisions had to be made if the exceptions for organised sports could be allowed to continue. There are much bigger issues here all round than a few days of sport.

I could, however removing clubs’ organised non contact training and effectively saying to people if they want a game of football to go down the pArk with their mates, is far more likely to get them to disobey the rules and go straight to a full contact game. It achieved absolutely nothing, and you’ll not convince me otherwise. Your delighted it affected hearts and not hibs, fair enough. I’ve seen absolutely nothing in the media about Sturgeons two week blanket ban on football, and the fact the SFA made zero mention of it when taking plenty of flak gives me my doubts.

[Kaff]

I could, however removing clubs’ organised non contact training and effectively saying to people if they want a game of football to go down the pArk with their mates, is far more likely to get them to disobey the rules and go straight to a full contact game. It achieved absolutely nothing, and you’ll not convince me otherwise. Your delighted it affected hearts and not hibs, fair enough. I’ve seen absolutely nothing in the media about Sturgeons two week blanket ban on football, and the fact the SFA made zero mention of it when taking plenty of flak gives me my doubts.

I'm with you on this.
To suspend all adult football below Prem level for the reasons given and then to announce the resumption with far less controls than were in place before the suspension shows how stupid it was.
We trained for weeks with restricted numbers, distancing etc gradually working towards the expectation of contact training and then get shut down!
All it did for me was make young people wonder about the sense of any decisions made till then, a dangerous situation to have where there is no logic to bans/restrictions as they'll be more inclined to ignore official advice in future.
Stupid decision made to deal with stupid elite players at clubs who won't accept that they didn't educate their staff correctly. No other companies can get away with their staff being unaware of regulations pertaining to their business causing a health risk and claiming ignorance as a defence and then restricting lesser entitled people as the punishment!
Comical

[hibbysam]

I'm with you on this.
To suspend all adult football below Prem level for the reasons given and then to announce the resumption with far less controls than were in place before the suspension shows how stupid it was.
We trained for weeks with restricted numbers, distancing etc gradually working towards the expectation of contact training and then get shut down!
All it did for me was make young people wonder about the sense of any decisions made till then, a dangerous situation to gave where there is no logic to bans/restrictions as they'll be more inclined to ignore official advice in future.
Stupid decision made to deal with stupid elite players at clubs who won't accept that they didn't educate their staff correctly. No other companies can get away with their staff being unaware of regulations pertaining to their business causing a health risk and claiming ignorance as a defence and then restricting lesser entitled people as the punishment!
Comical

Agreed. It’s easy to sit back and say ‘it’s doesn’t affect us, it doesn’t affect me, let’s all laugh at hearts’ and ‘it was only a couple of sessions or a week or whatever’, but the reality is totally different when your in the middle of it. Boys were happily following the rules looking forward to next week, then because they wanted their football fix they went out this week and played down the park in bigger numbers and in full contact. It’s mental, and not one person I know have been any more educated than they were previously.

[Andy74]

I could, however removing clubs’ organised non contact training and effectively saying to people if they want a game of football to go down the pArk with their mates, is far more likely to get them to disobey the rules and go straight to a full contact game. It achieved absolutely nothing, and you’ll not convince me otherwise. Your delighted it affected hearts and not hibs, fair enough. I’ve seen absolutely nothing in the media about Sturgeons two week blanket ban on football, and the fact the SFA made zero mention of it when taking plenty of flak gives me my doubts.

I’m not delighted about anything. It is pandemic. Lots more of these decisions will be made in the coming weeks, months and maybe years. You are worrying about how put out you’ve been for a few days rather than the overall public health.

We won’t agree with every decision made. Some will be wrong but in the scheme of things some short term restrictions on sport are not a hardship.

[Andy74]

Agreed. It’s easy to sit back and say ‘it’s doesn’t affect us, it doesn’t affect me, let’s all laugh at hearts’ and ‘it was only a couple of sessions or a week or whatever’, but the reality is totally different when your in the middle of it. Boys were happily following the rules looking forward to next week, then because they wanted their football fix they went out this week and played down the park in bigger numbers and in full contact. It’s mental, and not one person I know have been any more educated than they were previously.

Jeez. You talk about it as if you’ve been through an ordeal. Whilst there’s still a chance of people dying. Think you might have lost your perspective on this one.

[hibbysam]

Jeez. You talk about it as if you’ve been through an ordeal. Whilst there’s still a chance of people dying. Think you might have lost your perspective on this one.

Putting your two points into one, The decision done absolutely nothing for public health though. If anything it was worse for public health, like I said, more people playing contact games on their own rather than attending organised sessions. The SFA never stopped football below the elite level because of public health reasons, they done it to prove a nothing point to the government. The experts allowed football weeks ago, non contact, agreeing that it was safe to do so. The only ones proven to have broken the rules were the elite, not the minions at the bottom.

We’re now going back on Monday with even less restrictions, the break has done absolutely nothing unless your saying the pandemic is over so grassroots football is safe again when it wasn’t last week.

[The 90+2]

Putting your two points into one, The decision done absolutely nothing for public health though. If anything it was worse for public health, like I said, more people playing contact games on their own rather than attending organised sessions. The SFA never stopped football below the elite level because of public health reasons, they done it to prove a nothing point to the government. The experts allowed football weeks ago, non contact, agreeing that it was safe to do so. The only ones proven to have broken the rules were the elite, not the minions at the bottom.

We’re now going back on Monday with even less restrictions, the break has done absolutely nothing unless your saying the pandemic is over so grassroots football is safe again when it wasn’t last week.

Can I ask you one thing? Would you give up football training on two nights to see your child at their first day of school?

That’s what Premiership footballers sacrificed last week. Strict instructions by the JRG.

[hibbysam]

Can I ask you one thing? Would you give up football training on two nights to see your child at their first day of school?

That’s what Premiership footballers sacrificed last week. Strict instructions by the JRG.

Many parents and grandparents around the country had to miss their child’s first day, as majority of schools were one parent only and dropping kids off at the gate. Luckily enough I got to see mine go in regardless. Not overly sure what point your trying to make in that regard. My wider point is the government we’re clearly fine with football continuing, so couldn’t have been down to a public health issue, unless we are saying the SFA have a better handle on public health than the SG. The pause on football done nothing and was an ego trip from the Scottish FA. You can have your opinion on that, and had it been on instruction from the government I’d have agreed, bare facts are that it wasn’t.

[The 90+2]

Many parents and grandparents around the country had to miss their child’s first day, as majority of schools were one parent only and dropping kids off at the gate. Luckily enough I got to see mine go in regardless. Not overly sure what point your trying to make in that regard. My wider point is the government we’re clearly fine with football continuing, so couldn’t have been down to a public health issue, unless we are saying the SFA have a better handle on public health than the SG.

Footballers from the Premier League got told under no circumstances to go near schools. We all have to make sacrifices, my point is the Prem players are being vilified as being treated differently - that’s true as my example outlines above. The Hibs players had no choice, I’m glad like you I got to see mines go into school. Different sacrifices for different levels.

[Kaff]

Can I ask you one thing? Would you give up football training on two nights to see your child at their first day of school?

That’s what Premiership footballers sacrificed last week. Strict instructions by the JRG.

If it meant I kept my well paid career in a job I loved, yes I would miss my kids first day at school.
I would justify it by reconciling my home/work balance and the other rewards it brings, for instance in normal times I'm sure a pro footballer gets to spend a large amount of time with his family whereas many working people will see their kids for a short time before they go to bed.
They can choose 'normal' jobs if they want and join us in the park playing football!

[hibbysam]

Footballers from the Premier League got told under no circumstances to go near schools. We all have to make sacrifices, my point is the Prem players are being vilified as being treated differently - that’s true as my example outlines above. The Hibs players had no choice, I’m glad like you I got to see mines go into school. Different sacrifices for different levels.

And rightly so, they were/still are being treated differently and getting the perks of keeping their jobs going. It’s also the professionals that have broken protocol and guidelines.

[The 90+2]

Yes they are still being treated differently and had to make sacrifices.

As do we all.

[hibbysam]

Yes they are still being treated differently and had to make sacrifices.

As do we all.

Also, if they were told not to attend a school, I would also say that is completely over the top and absolutely no need for it, just for balance.

[tamig]

Guy suffers potentially career ending injury during some form of training rehab or otherwise, feel sorry for the guy and really don’t care if they were flouting some rule that was thrust upon them following the poor behaviour of Celtic and Aberdeen players.

Steady. You’re sounding like them with that lingo - “some rule that was thrust upon them”. Straight from statement bingo that one.

[MacGruber]

But someone else said players were running along and they heard a scream behind them. Turning round they saw Souttar in agony. Which was it?

It was both. A few players doing rehab work with physio. It is allowed. No football training, no rule breach.

Arguments as to.whether or not the decision to stop their training was merited is a separate issue.

Could potentially be the boys career so hope he fully recovers and gets back to playing

[The 90+2]

Also, if they were told not to attend a school, I would also say that is completely over the top and absolutely no need for it, just for balance.

Well it’s 100% and that’s what the top teams in the country had to sacrifice.

[JimBHibees]

Craig Levein seemed be be suggesting Souttar should be in Scotland squad which seems odd if he wasn't training with squad and was fully fit.

[JimBHibees]

Also, if they were told not to attend a school, I would also say that is completely over the top and absolutely no need for it, just for balance.

Maybe so but given the previous breaches football had to be seen as getting its house in order.

[Since452]

Everything Hearts do is skeekit so it's no wonder people raise eyebrows at things even if they're innocent. They have previous.

[NC1875]

I see Jamie Walker heading onto the a1 before 8.00am some mornings. He must be going somewhere

[matty_f]

I see Jamie Walker heading onto the a1 before 8.00am some mornings. He must be going somewhere

Diving lessons :agree:

[Eyrie]

Diving lessons :agree:

Didn't know he'd moved into coaching.

[Dashing Bob S]

Terrible for Soutar as this is a potentially career ending injury, especially recurring and at such a young age. Let's just agree with that and feel for him as a gifted young pro starting out.


As for Hearts, the astonishing calamity of errors under the Budge regime continues. I wouldn't disbelieve the contention that they broke the regulations and did it in such a crap way that their rehab program cost them one of their only assets. What a mess of a club they are.

[007]

I see Jamie Walker heading onto the a1 before 8.00am some mornings. He must be going somewhere

I can think of one way to find out.

[KDY Hibs]

Breaking the rules, throw the book at them! Always cheating.....