A Scottish Premiership grass pitch fund?

[Antifa Hibs]

Is it needed? Top professionals shouldn't be expected to play on these surfaces and fans at this level shouldn't be expected to pay good money to watch matches on these surfaces.

Something along the lines of 1st place giving 5% of league prize money pro-rata down to 12th place giving up 1% of prize money. Clubs competing in Europe can give up 2-3% of Champions League and Europa prize money. At the end of the season add everything up and split 12 ways ensuring that every single penny goes towards the maintenance of a grass pitch.

If diddy clubs want to keep plastic they can live in the Championship.

If Ayr Utd, Raith Rovers etc can maintain grass pitches Killie, Accies and Livi should be able to.

[percy veer]

I think the opposite you should be given more money if you have a grass pitch, or not compete at the top level of you dont have one

[Hibee Mac]

I'm onboard with this. Don't see why the SPFL couldn't make something like this work.

Splitting it 12 ways like that removes any potential for favouring certain clubs and then no excuses if they also implement a rule for no promotion to the premiership unless you have a grass pitch.

Maybe some issues around clubs needing to pay a lot to change from plastic to grass, rather than just upkeep a grass pitch, however, I don't have too much sympathy for that scenario as we have to eradicate these pitches from the top flight.

[tonyrougier123]

Is it needed? Top professionals shouldn't be expected to play on these surfaces and fans at this level shouldn't be expected to pay good money to watch matches on these surfaces.

Something along the lines of 1st place giving 5% of league prize money pro-rata down to 12th place giving up 1% of prize money. Clubs competing in Europe can give up 2-3% of Champions League and Europa prize money. At the end of the season add everything up and split 12 ways ensuring that every single penny goes towards the maintenance of a grass pitch.

If diddy clubs want to keep plastic they can live in the Championship.

If Ayr Utd, Raith Rovers etc can maintain grass pitches Killie, Accies and Livi should be able to.

These pitches have to go totally agree.there's no place for them in top level football.

I wonder how fans of these clubs feel about the artificial pitches?I would hate that at easter road.imo it stifles the flow of a game.

[Diclonius]

These pitches have to go totally agree.there's no place for them in top level football.

I wonder how fans of these clubs feel about the artificial pitches?I would hate that at easter road.imo it stifles the flow of a game.

Probably just fine seeing as it gives them a disproportionately huge advantage.

[steelendhibs]

Is it needed? Top professionals shouldn't be expected to play on these surfaces and fans at this level shouldn't be expected to pay good money to watch matches on these surfaces.

Something along the lines of 1st place giving 5% of league prize money pro-rata down to 12th place giving up 1% of prize money. Clubs competing in Europe can give up 2-3% of Champions League and Europa prize money. At the end of the season add everything up and split 12 ways ensuring that every single penny goes towards the maintenance of a grass pitch.

If diddy clubs want to keep plastic they can live in the Championship.

If Ayr Utd, Raith Rovers etc can maintain grass pitches Killie, Accies and Livi should be able to.

Raith Rovers have an artificial surface. As do, Cove Rangers, Montrose, Forfar, East Fife, Stenhousemuir, Edinburgh City, Clyde, Airdrie, Annan, Queen of the South, Alloa and Falkirk. There may be more on the way as well. Will become the norm in time

[AugustaHibs]

Spfl should ask them why they can’t have a grass pitch, if it’s financial reasons they should be forced to sell players. Livi have a ****ing cheek rejecting over £1m for dykes but play on a plastic pitch

[Partyraiser]

Raith Rovers have an artificial surface. As do, Cove Rangers, Montrose, Forfar, East Fife, Stenhousemuir, Edinburgh City, Clyde, Airdrie, Annan, Queen of the South, Alloa and Falkirk. There may be more on the way as well. Will become the norm in time

Even more reason to nip it in the bud now and implement a rule that they're not allowed in the top division

[Partyraiser]

Spfl should ask them why they can’t have a grass pitch, if it’s financial reasons they should be forced to sell players. Livi have a ****ing cheek rejecting over £1m for dykes but play on a plastic pitch

They had the money to maintain a grass pitch in the lower leagues, so I fail to see how they cant afford it now

[tonyrougier123]

Probably just fine seeing as it gives them a disproportionately huge advantage.

They seem to be able to curtail opposition teams right enough.but that bounce man it looks terrible,it certainly affected boyle on saturday,I felt his confidence to carry the ball was affected by the pitch at times.

[Vault Boy]

They really have to go. I can't quite believe that they're allowed at the top level of our game. The players don't like them as seen with the PFA petition last year, and clearly fans feel the same way.

If Ross County are able to maintain a playable grass surface up in the Highlands, I don't see a reasonable excuse for any other top flight team not to have one. If a club can't afford it, they need to budget more efficiently, it should definitely be a requirement of top flight membership.

Another point that one of the managers made about them is that they all seem to be different. It wouldn't be as bad if there was a consistent surface used by Livi, Killie etc, but they all react in different ways, meaning you can never really get used to an artificial surface as an away team.

In short: ban 'em.

[GreenCastle]

Spfl should ask them why they can’t have a grass pitch, if it’s financial reasons they should be forced to sell players. Livi have a ****ing cheek rejecting over £1m for dykes but play on a plastic pitch

Livi didn’t even pay for their pay pitch!

It’s through the community foundation which will have got a grant to install it.

Same I assume with Killie - well the previous pitch had lots of grassroots stuff done on pitch for the community.

[Gaz]

Get rid from the top flight these pitches are a big advantage to these teams and i think its the only reason Hamilton are still in the league

[matty_f]

You very rarely get a good game on a plastic pitch. We won comfortably on Saturday, but aesthetically the game wasn’t as good as it should have been. I’m certain the ball spends more time in the air and players take extra touches because the ball bounces unpredictably (or unnaturally high).

Boyle, if the game was on grass, would have run through on goal no bother imho for his second half chances to give an example. Livi’s first have chance when Hanlon was dispossessed by Dykes doesn’t happen on a grass pitch.

I accept the economic reasons for clubs having them but if that could be mitigated then grass pitches should be mandatory.

[Hibee Mac]

You very rarely get a good game on a plastic pitch. We won comfortably on Saturday, but aesthetically the game wasn’t as good as it should have been. I’m certain the ball spends more time in the air and players take extra touches because the ball bounces unpredictably (or unnaturally high).

Boyle, if the game was on grass, would have run through on goal no bother imho for his second half chances to give an example. Livi’s first have chance when Hanlon was dispossessed by Dykes doesn’t happen on a grass pitch.

I accept the economic reasons for clubs having them but if that could be mitigated then grass pitches should be mandatory.Bang on with your comments on those chances, prime examples of why these teams get massive advantages playing on these pitches week in week out.

I've yet to watch a "good" game of free flowing football on a plastic pitch.

[Bristolhibby]

FWIW I think the utility is revenue based. They can get 5s playing on the pitch every night and train on the pitches.

But I agree, this is top flight football. Teams should have access to quality synthetic training pitches, and grass and have a grass pitch to play on at the Weekend.

Our local rugby club got a grant from the RFU to go synthetic. They now rent out the pitches for kids footie and rugby training all through the week.

J

[jacomo]

They need to go. The constant claims about the ‘next gen’ pitches being just as good as the real thing have been proved to be rubbish. You wouldn’t let competitors have such a disproportionate advantage in other sports, surely?

[lucky]

I don’t think the league or other top flight clubs should pay anything towards grass pitches. It should mandatory in the Premiership. Harrogate won promotion to the EFL and will play their first few games away from their home ground as they have to install a grass pitch to play league football. How can it be mandatory to have grass pitches in the fourth tier of English football but we allow it in the top tier of Scottish football?

[Alan62]

The three plastic pitches in the Premiership are an absolute joke and they need to be removed for the good of the game. There should be no artificial surfaces in the top league. Grass only and that grass should be well maintained. Even in these challenging times, there's no justification for allowing sub-standard playing conditions that give the home team an advantage. The problem we have now, however, is that three out of 12 teams would have to replace their pitches at a cost they probably can't afford.

[Kaff]

Agree completely with the concensus, top flight football should be played on grass and the idea of a pitch fund is exactly right.
The big turnaround in English football as an entertainment spectacle at the start of Sky/Premiership was the quite rapid upgrade in the playing surfaces allowing ball players to be centre stage all season rather than the start and end when the pitches were in better order.
Rodgers always maintained that Celtic wouldnt manage to play to the intensity he wanted until they had a hybrid pitch and id love all the top league teams to have one.
Fair play to Hearts and Celtic for getting theirs and hopefully we can start to see more if them.
Huge amount of money to find but i think we'd earn it back into the game if there was a way to find the funds to getvit kick started.
On the astros, i believe they cost as much to maintain as a grass pitch but of course they do away with necessity for separate training facilities and allow income to be generated by rental as well, the ones i have experienced at amateur level are generally good for 1 or 2 season then they are back to 80s style astro as everything is so compacted, dont like them other than to provide a training surface when the weather is poorest

[Jones28]

It should be like the old stadium criteria rules. If it’s not grass, it’s not allowed in the top flight.

[givescotlandfreedom]

The league won't have any money left after paying out their £8m they owe hearts.

[Hibeesforever]

I agree these plastic pitches have to go but fear the voting structure makes it very difficult to put it through 9-3....

[Clarence]

Raith Rovers have an artificial surface. As do, Cove Rangers, Montrose, Forfar, East Fife, Stenhousemuir, Edinburgh City, Clyde, Airdrie, Annan, Queen of the South, Alloa and Falkirk. There may be more on the way as well. Will become the norm in time

It’s fine for the Shan teams but the Premier League needs 100% of teams to have the real McCoy.

[Antifa Hibs]

FWIW I think the utility is revenue based. They can get 5s playing on the pitch every night and train on the pitches.

But I agree, this is top flight football. Teams should have access to quality synthetic training pitches, and grass and have a grass pitch to play on at the Weekend.

Our local rugby club got a grant from the RFU to go synthetic. They now rent out the pitches for kids footie and rugby training all through the week.

J

That's what makes it worse IMO. If it was the best surface out there and was only being used every 2 weeks you MAY just get away with it. But it will be middle of the road surfaces that are being trained on everyday by their teams then rented out to complete hackers on a Tuesday night from the local amateurs and 7 aside leagues.

Think I read Kiddimister's new grass pitch will post £20k per season extra to maintain over plastic. Let's double that cos we may/may not have harsher winters plus other factors so say it costs £40k per season extra. Rent training pitches for £300 a day, five days a week over a year is £78,000. Say renting their pitches out brought in a grand a week profit after all costs/staff/maintenance etc brought in £52k a year. The difference going from these ****tey plastic efforts to grass is around £170k a season. If you can't afford that then slip down a league and let Caley/Hearts/Dundee etc up. I can see part-time clubs like Alloa's reason for it, reduces costs and brings in income. Top flight professional football clubs shouldn't be needing to rent out pitches to bring in additional income (the odd cup-tie or Scotland game excluded).

[CMurdoch]

I agree these plastic pitches have to go but fear the voting structure makes it very difficult to put it through 9-3....

Is it 9-3 or 11-1? Is it one 9-3 for certain matters and 11-1 for others?

I reckon this is the season Hamilton will be relegated which will leave us with only 2 teams voting to keep plastic pitches and 10 against.

I agree with everyone else who has posted that it has to be grass pitches in the top league.
Happy for clubs to keep their existing pitches until they are done but then they should have to replace with grass. People throw the phrase "makes our league a laughing stock" about far too liberally but I believe plastic pitches are a thing that really does make us look like amateurs. They need to go.

[1 8 7 5]

Ban them from top flight football.

Agree with the OP aswell. A fighting fund for pitches and other things which would benefit our football collectively.

[Kaff]

That's what makes it worse IMO. If it was the best surface out there and was only being used every 2 weeks you MAY just get away with it. But it will be middle of the road surfaces that are being trained on everyday by their teams then rented out to complete hackers on a Tuesday night from the local amateurs and 7 aside leagues.

Think I read Kiddimister's new grass pitch will post £20k per season extra to maintain over plastic. Let's double that cos we may/may not have harsher winters plus other factors so say it costs £40k per season extra. Rent training pitches for £300 a day, five days a week over a year is £78,000. Say renting their pitches out brought in a grand a week profit after all costs/staff/maintenance etc brought in £52k a year. The difference going from these ****tey plastic efforts to grass is around £170k a season. If you can't afford that then slip down a league and let Caley/Hearts/Dundee etc up. I can see part-time clubs like Alloa's reason for it, reduces costs and brings in income. Top flight professional football clubs shouldn't be needing to rent out pitches to bring in additional income (the odd cup-tie or Scotland game excluded).

Some good info there.
I think the OPs original idea of the fund should negate any perceived losses though?

[silverhibee]

They really have to go. I can't quite believe that they're allowed at the top level of our game. The players don't like them as seen with the PFA petition last year, and clearly fans feel the same way.

If Ross County are able to maintain a playable grass surface up in the Highlands, I don't see a reasonable excuse for any other top flight team not to have one. If a club can't afford it, they need to budget more efficiently, it should definitely be a requirement of top flight membership.

Another point that one of the managers made about them is that they all seem to be different. It wouldn't be as bad if there was a consistent surface used by Livi, Killie etc, but they all react in different ways, meaning you can never really get used to an artificial surface as an away team.

In short: ban 'em.

They should be banned in the top flight league here in Scotland, I get why the lower league teams use them but if a team has ambition to get in to the top league and they have been using a plastic pitch there must be a rule that you must lay a grass pitch to get in the top league, it was implemented when you couldn't get in to league if your stadium didn't hold a 10000 seater stadium, the same should be applied to grass pitches, Killie Livi & Hamilton should be told this so that they can have funds to put grass pitches down for the next season to start.

[Brightside]

The clubs should pay for it. Part of acceptance to top level football. I'm all for them at grass roots and lower levels - AND they should all be opened to the public.

[Hakim Sar]

I don’t think they’ll be disappearing anytime soon as the smaller clubs now rely on them as a private training ground during the week rather than using council parks 1980s style.

Otherwise, it’s back to playing on sand covered, threadbare tattie fields from January to May, which is arguably worse.

I think it’s a case of waiting it out for the technology to gradually improve rather than carpeting them (if you pardon the pun) at this stage.

[Billy Whizz]

I don’t think they’ll be disappearing anytime soon as the smaller clubs now rely on them as a private training ground during the week rather than using council parks 1980s style.

Otherwise, it’s back to playing on sand covered, threadbare tattie fields from January to May, which is arguably worse.

I think it’s a case of waiting it out for the technology to gradually improve rather than carpeting them (if you pardon the pun) at this stage.

League 1 and 2 I tend to agree, but Championship and Premiership should be grass
Read last week that Harrogate Town, who got promoted to English League 2, have had to rip up their Astro to play in the league
Going to ground share until it’s ready

[Carheenlea]

I don’t think they’ll be disappearing anytime soon as the smaller clubs now rely on them as a private training ground during the week rather than using council parks 1980s style.

Otherwise, it’s back to playing on sand covered, threadbare tattie fields from January to May, which is arguably worse.

I think it’s a case of waiting it out for the technology to gradually improve rather than carpeting them (if you pardon the pun) at this stage.

Plastic football pitches have been around for 50 years and nobody's been able to make a decent one yet, with the improvement in playing surface during that time being minimal at best.

[Jdawg]

No way should be contributing. We spent many years building our infrastructure. A pitch should be considered within that.

Plastic pitches make the league look even more amateur.