New shares

[Gerard]

The club will need the support of all its fans to get us through the turbulent financial times that we are going through. There are many fans who will not be able to buy season tickets for a variety of reasons. There will be fans who due to work will not be able to attend on a regular basis or perhaps be able to afford the ST. If the club want to raise money then consider having a share issue of new shares that all the fans would be able to buy. You could have a limit on the amount fo shares that any fan can puchase. There was a limit on the previous issue of shares. The issue of new shares is not to go down the road that the Hearts fans have done concerning fan ownership. If Hibs wanted to raise a million pounds in new shares it would not result in fans ownership as the PSH would be able to buy 67% of this issue. The financial situation is looking very uncertain and will continue to look uncertain for some time to come. It would make financial sense for many people to to be able to help our club with money that perhaps would not be available.

[Andy74]

The club will need the support of all its fans to get us through the turbulent financial times that we are going through. There are many fans who will not be able to buy season tickets for a variety of reasons. There will be fans who due to work will not be able to attend on a regular basis or perhaps be able to afford the ST. If the club want to raise money then consider having a share issue of new shares that all the fans would be able to buy. You could have a limit on the amount fo shares that any fan can puchase. There was a limit on the previous issue of shares. The issue of new shares is not to go down the road that the Hearts fans have done concerning fan ownership. If Hibs wanted to raise a million pounds in new shares it would not result in fans ownership as the PSH would be able to buy 67% of this issue. The financial situation is looking very uncertain and will continue to look uncertain for some time to come. It would make financial sense for many people to to be able to help our club with money that perhaps would not be available.

Ron has been pretty clear that after using his cash to buy the club and clear the debt he isn't going to entertain diluting his ownership by selling shares.

HSL was around for a long time and got very little interest.

[The Count]

Lets see how the Hearts get on with fan ownership with folk who could not run a bath trying to run a business.Personally i agree with full fan input and engagement to a club but i am not convinced fan ownership works.To be convinced.

[Gerard]

Ron has been pretty clear that after using his cash to buy the club and clear the debt he isn't going to entertain diluting his ownership by selling shares.

HSL was around for a long time and got very little interest.

I was at the last AGM and accept at that time he did not want to allow more shares to be sold. In the time that has elapsed since the AGM circumstances are greatly different.
The club announced great plans for the future that will enahance the football experience for all fans. I am not proposing fan ownership. HSL purchased £770,000 worth of shares and was thanked for their assistance to the club before Ronald Gordon puchased it. RG announced exciting plans for the club. I hope that these plans will still happen.
Hibs fans can help RG on this journey. If he wants to travel the journey alone it can be a very lonely one.
I think we are at our best when we work together.

[Keith_M]

Lets see how the Hearts get on with fan ownership with folk who could not run a bath trying to run a business.Personally i agree with full fan input and engagement to a club but i am not convinced fan ownership works.To be convinced.


The OP specifically stated that wasn't the aim.

[Gerard]

Lets see how the Hearts get on with fan ownership with folk who could not run a bath trying to run a business.Personally i agree with full fan input and engagement to a club but i am not convinced fan ownership works.To be convinced.
I also am sceptical about fan ownership. I am not suggesting that. I am suggesting that HS could be allowed to purchase some extra shares to increase shareholding to 25.1%
This would make possible for HS to have a director on the Hibs board. Ron Gordon would still have a majority share holding in the club.
I would also suggest that the fasn who have shares and wanted to give HS their small share holding be permitted to do so as again it will not create fan ownership of the club.
Lets work together and take the journey together.

[green day]

Are there still some "unsold" shares floating about that were intended for HSL to pick up - before RG took over?

Although I guess if they were bought it would dilute RG holding which he isnt keen on.

[Gerard]

Are there still some "unsold" shares floating about that were intended for HSL to pick up - before RG took over?

Although I guess if they were bought it would dilute RG holding which he isnt keen on.




All the shares that HS intended to buy are owned by RG. There are share holders who would like to give or sell their very small amount of shares to HS. This requires Hibs FC to agree to their transfers. At this time Hibs FC are not permitting this.

[CockneyRebel]

All the shares that HS intended to buy are owned by RG. There are share holders who would like to give or sell their very small amount of shares to HS. This requires Hibs FC to agree to their transfers. At this time Hibs FC are not permitting this.

Surely I can sell my shares to whoever I wish?

[Gerard]

Surely I can sell my shares to whoever I wish?

you can sell or give your shares to anybody when you have the clubs permission to authorise the transfer.
There are a number of shareholders who want to give their shares to HS and require the clubs consent to authorise that transfer.
At this time that permission has not been granted

[CockneyRebel]

you can sell or give your shares to anybody when you have the clubs permission to authorise the transfer.
There are a number of shareholders who want to give their shares to HS and require the clubs consent to authorise that transfer.
At this time that permission has not been granted

Is this usual or just a condition of sale for this particular share issue? This is the first time I have heard of this

[Gerard]

Is this usual or just a condition of sale for this particular share issue? This is the first time I have heard of this
This is a condition that I think has existed since STF ownership of Hibs
It may predate it.

[Pagan Hibernia]

I don't think this will happen but i'd be absolutely delighted if it did.

First we found out there were going be no more shares to buy. That was just about ok. Then the club blocked HSL from trading with existing shareholders. And that's when I cancelled my direct debit. I'd be more than happy to restart it if the share offer was revisited

We only need to look back 30 years to see that few people can be trusted in football

Sure Ron Gordon might be fine, I have no reason to believe otherwise. But what about in a generation or two? Who will he or his family sell it to? And who will they sell to? Clubs can easily fall into the wrong hands.

We need that 25.1%

[Andy74]

Is this usual or just a condition of sale for this particular share issue? This is the first time I have heard of this

It’s a private company. The Directors have the right to not accept transfers on the share register.

[Gerard]

It’s a private company. The Directors have the right to not accept transfers on the share register.

Fair point
I hope the directors will revisit their decision

[Argylehibby]

I also am sceptical about fan ownership. I am not suggesting that. I am suggesting that HS could be allowed to purchase some extra shares to increase shareholding to 25.1%
This would make possible for HS to have a director on the Hibs board. Ron Gordon would still have a majority share holding in the club.
I would also suggest that the fasn who have shares and wanted to give HS their small share holding be permitted to do so as again it will not create fan ownership of the club.
Lets work together and take the journey together.

That's not going to happen. Special resolutions at a GM need a 75% of shares voted in favour to pass. RG is not going to hold less than that as it's like buying a telly and giving the wife the remote. You might not get what you want to see happen.

If the club offer shares to existing shareholders then RG would be entitled to buy extra shares in proportion to those held so would be a sizeable investment on top of what he's provided already. If he decides to offer shares to all existing shareholders there are costs involved and they can be pretty high diluting the available funds.

If he's willing to put more cash into the club then he could simply increase his stake and the percentage he holds by creating and buying those extra shares (albeit after getting any necessary approval from existing shareholders but with over 75% of the shares nobody can stop him).

[Pagan Hibernia]

That's not going to happen. Special resolutions at a GM need a 75% of shares voted in favour to pass. RG is not going to hold less than that as it's like buying a telly and giving the wife the remote. You might not get what you want to see happen.

If the club offer shares to existing shareholders then RG would be entitled to buy extra shares in proportion to those held so would be a sizeable investment on top of what he's provided already. If he decides to offer shares to all existing shareholders there are costs involved and they can be pretty high diluting the available funds.

If he's willing to put more cash into the club then he could simply increase his stake and the percentage he holds by creating and buying those extra shares (albeit after getting any necessary approval from existing shareholders but with over 75% of the shares nobody can stop him).

He doesn't currently have 75% of the shares. Its more like two thirds.

[Argylehibby]

He doesn't currently have 75% of the shares. Its more like two thirds.

even more reason he wont want to dilute any further.

[Gerard]

That's not going to happen. Special resolutions at a GM need a 75% of shares voted in favour to pass. RG is not going to hold less than that as it's like buying a telly and giving the wife the remote. You might not get what you want to see happen.

If the club offer shares to existing shareholders then RG would be entitled to buy extra shares in proportion to those held so would be a sizeable investment on top of what he's provided already. If he decides to offer shares to all existing shareholders there are costs involved and they can be pretty high diluting the available funds.

If he's willing to put more cash into the club then he could simply increase his stake and the percentage he holds by creating and buying those extra shares (albeit after getting any necessary approval from existing shareholders but with over 75% of the shares nobody can stop him).

RG owns apprx 67 %
HS 15.4%
One nominee 10 percent
And remainder all small share holdings

One interesting issue who owns the 10 percent

[hibbydad]

RG owns apprx 67 %
HS 15.4%
One nominee 10 percent
And remainder all small share holdings

One interesting issue who owns the 10 percent
I know Ron said no to a rights issue at the agm but circumstances have changed and a successful rights issue would provide much needed working capital. It has been on my mind to write to Leanne about it

[Gerard]

I know Ron said no to a rights issue at the agm but circumstances have changed and a successful rights issue would provide much needed working capital. It has been on my mind to write to Leanne about it

I agree.
Good luck when you write to Leann.

[Andy74]

I know Ron said no to a rights issue at the agm but circumstances have changed and a successful rights issue would provide much needed working capital. It has been on my mind to write to Leanne about it

Donate to HSL. Provide money without impacting the owner’s shareholding.

Talking about share issues is a waste of everyone’s time. Not going to happen.

[Keith_M]

That's not going to happen. Special resolutions at a GM need a 75% of shares voted in favour to pass. RG is not going to hold less than that as it's like buying a telly and giving the wife the remote. You might not get what you want to see happen.
....


What a horrible thought!

:paranoid:

[tamig]

I was at the last AGM and accept at that time he did not want to allow more shares to be sold. In the time that has elapsed since the AGM circumstances are greatly different.
The club announced great plans for the future that will enahance the football experience for all fans. I am not proposing fan ownership. HSL purchased £770,000 worth of shares and was thanked for their assistance to the club before Ronald Gordon puchased it. RG announced exciting plans for the club. I hope that these plans will still happen.
Hibs fans can help RG on this journey. If he wants to travel the journey alone it can be a very lonely one.
I think we are at our best when we work together.
HSL hasn’t gone away. That vehicle is still there to pay money into the club. Many of us still pay into it. I think it does need a major reboot though and now would be an ideal time to do so.

[tamig]

I agree.
Good luck when you write to Leann.

And make sure her name is spelt right 😀

[Gerard]

And make sure her name is spelt right 😀

Yes

[Gerard]

HSL hasn’t gone away. That vehicle is still there to pay money into the club. Many of us still pay into it. I think it does need a major reboot though and now would be an ideal time to do so.

I think you make good and valid points. I look forward to HS making comment about its future development.

[04Sauzee]

HSL hasn’t gone away. That vehicle is still there to pay money into the club. Many of us still pay into it. I think it does need a major reboot though and now would be an ideal time to do so.

Thanks for this update,is the money paid to Hibs immediately or say on a qtly basis? Is it up to the club how the money is spent? I think you are absolutely correct now would be a good time for a reboot.

[tamig]

Thanks for this update,is the money paid to Hibs immediately or say on a qtly basis? Is it up to the club how the money is spent? I think you are absolutely correct now would be a good time for a reboot.

I’m not sure what arrangements are for payment of HSL funds over to the club. Jim would be able to confirm. Now that shares are off the agenda all money goes specifically towards the football budget. For player wages, transfers etc.

[lucky]

RG is not going to sell shares, he’s made that clear but what about Hibs fans buying the pitch. Chelsea fans own their pitch, its actually the freehold over the stadium but It’s stops club owners trying to cash in on the value of land and moving clubs out of town.

https://www.chelseafc.com/en/cpo

[Gerard]

RG is not going to sell shares, he’s made that clear but what about Hibs fans buying the pitch. Chelsea fans own their pitch, its actually the freehold over the stadium but It’s stops club owners trying to cash in on the value of land and moving clubs out of town.

https://www.chelseafc.com/en/cpo

I was at the AGM and fully aware that at that time Ron Gordon did not want to permit HS to increase its share holding. The Covid 19 Virus has changed the society in which we live in. There is a opportunity for the 'Hibs Family' to play a part in the continuing development of our club. I fully support the idea that fans can own a part of the club. I am not suggesting that the club be majority fan owned. That issue has been debated extensively. HS is the second biggest share holder in the club. There is a nominee that owns 10 percent of the club and the remainder of share holders have various levels of small numbers of shares. I have 500 shares.

HS will not get any more money from me until the membership decide what its purpose is now. If the purpose is to raise money and give it to Hibs then this is not for me. The reason I gave money to Hibs was to permit HS to buy shares in Hibs. I like the idea that all HS share structure is democratic all share holders own one share regardless of how much money they have given to Hibs. All members can stand for election to be a director in this company.

There are many ways to help Hibs and like many people I have purchased my season ticket. I also have a Hibs TV subscription and will buy HH tickets on line and at games when the games resume. I know that we can not have meetings at the moment. We can use video confrencing. I use Zoom but there are other platforms that can be used. HS please communicate with the members and let us know what your future plans are.

[Pagan Hibernia]

I was at the AGM and fully aware that at that time Ron Gordon did not want to permit HS to increase its share holding. The Covid 19 Virus has changed the society in which we live in. There is a opportunity for the 'Hibs Family' to play a part in the continuing development of our club. I fully support the idea that fans can own a part of the club. I am not suggesting that the club be majority fan owned. That issue has been debated extensively. HS is the second biggest share holder in the club. There is a nominee that owns 10 percent of the club and the remainder of share holders have various levels of small numbers of shares. I have 500 shares.

HS will not get any more money from me until the membership decide what its purpose is now. If the purpose is to raise money and give it to Hibs then this is not for me. The reason I gave money to Hibs was to permit HS to buy shares in Hibs. I like the idea that all HS share structure is democratic all share holders own one share regardless of how much money they have given to Hibs. All members can stand for election to be a director in this company.

There are many ways to help Hibs and like many people I have purchased my season ticket. I also have a Hibs TV subscription and will buy HH tickets on line and at games when the games resume. I know that we can not have meetings at the moment. We can use video confrencing. I use Zoom but there are other platforms that can be used. HS please communicate with the members and let us know what your future plans are.

pretty much how I feel

[Leithenhibby]

I don't think this will happen but i'd be absolutely delighted if it did.

First we found out there were going be no more shares to buy. That was just about ok. Then the club blocked HSL from trading with existing shareholders. And that's when I cancelled my direct debit. I'd be more than happy to restart it if the share offer was revisited

We only need to look back 30 years to see that few people can be trusted in football

Sure Ron Gordon might be fine, I have no reason to believe otherwise. But what about in a generation or two? Who will he or his family sell it to? And who will they sell to? Clubs can easily fall into the wrong hands.

We need that 25.1%


It's all I've ever wanted for our club. Having gone through the Mercer debacle it was always going to be a nervous time when the club was sold on. I can genuinely say that I wouldn't wish that time (Mercer) on our younger and future generations.

Glory Glory

[Andy74]

I was at the AGM and fully aware that at that time Ron Gordon did not want to permit HS to increase its share holding. The Covid 19 Virus has changed the society in which we live in. There is a opportunity for the 'Hibs Family' to play a part in the continuing development of our club. I fully support the idea that fans can own a part of the club. I am not suggesting that the club be majority fan owned. That issue has been debated extensively. HS is the second biggest share holder in the club. There is a nominee that owns 10 percent of the club and the remainder of share holders have various levels of small numbers of shares. I have 500 shares.

HS will not get any more money from me until the membership decide what its purpose is now. If the purpose is to raise money and give it to Hibs then this is not for me. The reason I gave money to Hibs was to permit HS to buy shares in Hibs. I like the idea that all HS share structure is democratic all share holders own one share regardless of how much money they have given to Hibs. All members can stand for election to be a director in this company.

There are many ways to help Hibs and like many people I have purchased my season ticket. I also have a Hibs TV subscription and will buy HH tickets on line and at games when the games resume. I know that we can not have meetings at the moment. We can use video confrencing. I use Zoom but there are other platforms that can be used. HS please communicate with the members and let us know what your future plans are.

You’ve never had a direct vote in Hibs though. The one vote is fine if you agree with the majority.

I think Hibs getting the donations is a much more important and beneficial thing than fans building up a single shareholding in the club. We have a healthy number of shares owned by fans. I don’t see it as a big issue.

[Gerard]

You’ve never had a direct vote in Hibs though. The one vote is fine if you agree with the majority.

I think Hibs getting the donations is a much more important and beneficial thing than fans building up a single shareholding in the club. We have a healthy number of shares owned by fans. I don’t see it as a big issue.

HS was setup to make possible the purchase of shares in Hibs. The HS members should be asked if they are content for HS to contribute money to the club as a donation and receive no shares. If that is the majority will of HS,then so be it.
I will contribute to Hibs in other ways,such as season ticket,Hibs TV etc
G

[Viva_Palmeiras]

HS was setup to make possible the purchase of shares in Hibs. The HS members should be asked if they are content for HS to contribute money to the club as a donation and receive no shares. If that is the majority will of HS,then so be it.
I will contribute to Hibs in other ways,such as season ticket,Hibs TV etc
G

If we take anything from Benny Factor coming forward it’s this (and the spokeswoman on Sportsound Podcast took pains to underline the point of it being “a charitable donation”)

- charitable donations are effectively a tax efficient way of injecting cash into the club
- income not subject to VAT
- Eligible for gift aid from the government.

Quite simply it’s an (the most?) efficient cash generator for clubs.

So the greatest and most abhorrent irony of all - the club that infamously stiffed charities is using a charitable status as a vehicle for taking money that during their Vlad induced crisis could have paid off their debts / saved the club, held back to pump money into the club after it came out of admin.

[CropleyWasGod]

If we take anything from Benny Factor coming forward it’s this (and the spokeswoman on Sportsound Podcast took pains to underline the point of it being “a charitable donation”)

- charitable donations are effectively a tax efficient way of injecting cash into the club
- income not subject to VAT
- Eligible for gift aid from the government.

Quite simply it’s an (the most?) efficient cash generator for clubs.

So the greatest and most abhorrent irony of all - the club that infamously stiffed charities is using a charitable status as a vehicle for taking money that during their Vlad induced crisis could have paid off their debts / saved the club, held back to pump money into the club after it came out of admin.

If you're meaning the money that Anderson has put into Hearts, that's not charitable donations. It's not eligible for Gift Aid. Hearts aren't a charity.

[southern hibby]

What a horrible thought!

:paranoid:



I know, who’d want a wife?

GGTTH