Hearts players pay suspended

[Ardenttwo]

Just on Sky Sports. Queen Ann threatens the players of having their salaries suspended on 31st March if they do not accept the 50% pay cut. Could be trouble ahead

[Pretty Boy]

It's a tough time for all clubs but she has handled this appalingly.

Contrast that with Hibs who have made fans aware of the difficulty of the situation whilst maintaining an air of calm and dignity.

[McD]

This could cause real splits in the fans and amongst the players, not to mention the players association might have a lot to say as well

[Sir David Gray]

To suspend the wages would she need to call in the administrators or how would that all work in practice?

[jgl07]

Hearts financial problems are nothing that a few cake bakes could not solve..,,,,

Except that...

[Pretty Boy]

Hearts financial problems are nothing that a few cake bakes could not solve..,,,,

Except that...

The big cow must be full by now........

[Cool_Hand_Luke]

From the sun:

ANN BUDGE has warned Hearts players to take 50 per cent wage cuts by next week or she will SUSPEND their salaries.
The Tynecastle chairman sent an email to first-team stars telling them of her plan to invoke controversial clause 12 - just hours after SPFL lawyer Rod McKenzie told all clubs his judgement was they CAN use it if players refuse to drop their wages.
And now stars at other clubs are terrified their bosses will follow suit.
SunSport revealed last week how a little-known section of a standard, off-the-shelf SPFL deal makes provision for chairmen to halt agreements if the SFA suspend football.
McKenzie is clear that now that has happened, clubs have the contracts weighted in their favour and can suspend them if they need to.
And Hearts immediately jumped on his advice in a bid to force wavering players into accepting cuts.
In an email sent today, Budge said: “This suspension by the SFA automatically suspends the agreement between you and the club governing your employment as a player.
“The precise effects of the suspension of the agreement are an extremely complex matter which the club is considering carefully.
“In the meantime, the club has decided that up until 31 March 2020 it will continue to pay your remuneration under the agreement.
"However, any continued payments of remuneration will be paid under the express condition that this is without prejudice to the question of whether you are entitled to receive them under the agreement following its suspension.
“It may be that, as we have discussed previously, the continued payments mentioned above will need to be adjusted.
“We reserve the right to make those adjustments if and when it becomes clear that this is necessary for the future sustainability of the club.
“If you do not agree with the express condition mentioned above, then by Wednesday 1 April 2020 at the latest you should (1) inform the club in writing that you do not agree and (2) instruct your bank to return any payments received after 1 April 2020 from or on behalf of the club.
“If we do not hear from you by 5pm on April 1 2020, we will take it that you do agree with our express condition.”
PFA Scotland were contacted by concerned players when Hearts first asked players to take cuts and they looked at their own contracts.
They have a QC looking at clause 12 and have vowed to fight it in the courts.
And in a statement they urged clubs to avoid slashing wages before holding proper negotiation.
They said: "The union is firm in its position that clubs and players can more effectively face the challenges ahead by working together and ensuring that decisions are reached by agreement only.
"The union will assist in negotiating agreements between clubs and players.
"Clubs must not and should not be unilaterally imposing contractual changes such as wage cuts.
"Further, the pandemic cannot and should not be used as a reason for terminating contracts - time consuming and costly litigation in the civil courts and disputes before the League will not be in anyone’s interests at this difficult time.
"The union believes that the welfare of clubs, players and Scottish football is best served by all interested stakeholders coming together now to work through the formidable challenges presented by these extraordinary testing times."

[ehf]

The big cow must be full by now........

And social distancing rules out the face-painting.

[ehf]

From the sun:

ANN BUDGE has warned Hearts players to take 50 per cent wage cuts by next week or she will SUSPEND their salaries.
The Tynecastle chairman sent an email to first-team stars telling them of her plan to invoke controversial clause 12 - just hours after SPFL lawyer Rod McKenzie told all clubs his judgement was they CAN use it if players refuse to drop their wages.
And now stars at other clubs are terrified their bosses will follow suit.
SunSport revealed last week how a little-known section of a standard, off-the-shelf SPFL deal makes provision for chairmen to halt agreements if the SFA suspend football.
McKenzie is clear that now that has happened, clubs have the contracts weighted in their favour and can suspend them if they need to.
And Hearts immediately jumped on his advice in a bid to force wavering players into accepting cuts.
In an email sent today, Budge said: “This suspension by the SFA automatically suspends the agreement between you and the club governing your employment as a player.
“The precise effects of the suspension of the agreement are an extremely complex matter which the club is considering carefully.
“In the meantime, the club has decided that up until 31 March 2020 it will continue to pay your remuneration under the agreement.
"However, any continued payments of remuneration will be paid under the express condition that this is without prejudice to the question of whether you are entitled to receive them under the agreement following its suspension.
“It may be that, as we have discussed previously, the continued payments mentioned above will need to be adjusted.
“We reserve the right to make those adjustments if and when it becomes clear that this is necessary for the future sustainability of the club.
“If you do not agree with the express condition mentioned above, then by Wednesday 1 April 2020 at the latest you should (1) inform the club in writing that you do not agree and (2) instruct your bank to return any payments received after 1 April 2020 from or on behalf of the club.
“If we do not hear from you by 5pm on April 1 2020, we will take it that you do agree with our express condition.”
PFA Scotland were contacted by concerned players when Hearts first asked players to take cuts and they looked at their own contracts.
They have a QC looking at clause 12 and have vowed to fight it in the courts.
And in a statement they urged clubs to avoid slashing wages before holding proper negotiation.
They said: "The union is firm in its position that clubs and players can more effectively face the challenges ahead by working together and ensuring that decisions are reached by agreement only.
"The union will assist in negotiating agreements between clubs and players.
"Clubs must not and should not be unilaterally imposing contractual changes such as wage cuts.
"Further, the pandemic cannot and should not be used as a reason for terminating contracts - time consuming and costly litigation in the civil courts and disputes before the League will not be in anyone’s interests at this difficult time.
"The union believes that the welfare of clubs, players and Scottish football is best served by all interested stakeholders coming together now to work through the formidable challenges presented by these extraordinary testing times."

Image dullards like Jamie Walker trying to understand that.

[Skol]

So basically they paid wages on I presume 1st March in full. Its now to late to change the payroll for 1st April (handy date) but they cant afford to pay the full wage bill. For those that agreed quickly, they will have sorted payroll. Some will have agreed too late to change payroll and will need to return 50% (presume Hearts do the tax and Ni calcs for them) and thos ethat have not agreed are asked to pay 100% back and contract terminated - or 50% and accept terms


I am glad my salary was paid today as planned by my employer

[Mibbes Aye]

Can they not just borrow the money to pay full wages and then owe it to themselves?

That will cover them until the run-up to Remembrance Sunday when their cash flow picks up again.

[SquashedFrogg]

That'll be why all the flour has been bought?

Mass cake sale imminent.

[hibsfan]

It is a tough time for all clubs and our approach to season tickets this year highlights that every team is going to take a hit. Thankfully, this has come at a time when Hearts were starting to fall anyway. You could see that their plan was not sustainable and throwing money at their new main stand was always going to be the death of them.

Having spoken to a work colleague this evening over FaceTime, whose husband is a bit of a Hearts legend, they are in real trouble and he doesn’t see them coming out of it. He genuinely thinks Hearts have just won the last ever derby.

My response didn’t go down well... silver linings and all that!

Really hope (and expect) that we are in a significantly better position and that we are able to get through this. As we have proclaimed this evening. This IS our city! 🇳🇬

[SquashedFrogg]

I for one don't take satisfaction in any small business struggling right now.

[The 90+2]

I for one don't take satisfaction in any small business struggling right now.

😁

[AltheHibby]

Just when I needed cheering up you come out with this:

"He genuinely thinks Hearts have just won the last ever derby."

:not worth

[Sir David Gray]

Just when I needed cheering up you come out with this:

"He genuinely thinks Hearts have just won the last ever derby."

:not worth

Even when they're ****** they're comparing themselves to us. :faf:

[Pretty Boy]

Where's the mystery benefactors when you need them?

I feel sorry for staff who are going to have to take pay cuts but as a club they never learn. Hearts in financial turmoil is like clockwork.

[murray26]

I honestly hope they go bust.. despicable club who know no morals or values.. football/ society would be better off without them unfortunately we all know the a going to wriggle out of this like the snakes that they are.. ridiculous

[Frankhfc]

I hope the players unhappy at this do go on to challenge it. Based on the clause itself its both vague and without context. As far as I'm aware the SFA is the regulatory body and the contract terms and conditions is between the club and player. Being vague it could read simply that while Scottish Football is suspended players contracts are suspended as in the event of plying their trade elsewhere. It fails to spell out that the clause allows clubs to suspend the terms and conditions of the contract signed between club and player.

It may well be that the clause is clarified in context elsewhere within SFA rules and regulations and that players were made aware of it. If not the players should take it further.

Shabby and underhand from Hearts treating their employees in such a manner.

[Danderhall Hibs]

Where's the mystery benefactors when you need them?

I feel sorry for staff who are going to have to take pay cuts but as a club they never learn. Hearts in financial turmoil is like clockwork.

Surely the non playing staff could be furloughed?

[murray26]

It shouldn’t be allowed plain and simple.. if there isn’t a points deduction then it’s penalising all the other clubs desperately trying to do the right thing by there players and other staff.. they can’t be allowed to get away with this again..

[Onion]

As said, she has Handled this like amateur. Panicking and flapping her way from one mess to another. Yes, Hearts have problems but you need a cool, experienced head in charge. Turning a drama into a crisis.

[Danderhall Hibs]

It shouldn’t be allowed plain and simple.. if there isn’t a points deduction then it’s penalising all the other clubs desperately trying to do the right thing by there players and other staff.. they can’t be allowed to get away with this again..

Sounds like it’s in the rules - all clubs can do it.

It’s just they’re the skintest so are going first. Their communication methods could be improved mind you.

[murray26]

Sounds like it’s in the rules - all clubs can do it.

It’s just they’re the skintest so are going first. Their communication methods could be improved mind you.

It should be compulsory across the board or not at all..

[Hibs4185]

I’ve always maintained that the season should just end and Celtic declares champions and hearts relegated but it cleans up the mess and leaves to start afresh when the situation becomes clearer.

However I think it might be hilarious the season finishing and budge relying on the players she has treated like ***** having to bail them out.

Relegated either way I think

[RoYO!]

And yet they want to complete the season?!

Can you imagine how up for it the players will be after this?!

[Dr Jimmy]

I know absolutely nothing about how admin or how business finance works, but if they went into Admin would she stand to lose her loans?

[Vault Boy]

I'd be really angry to receive an email of that sort, so curt and uncompromising. Clinging on to a weird technicality to punish players with just because she's mismanaged their finances so badly that they can't deal with even just the couple of missed home games. Would genuinely embarrass me to support a club like that.

[Green Blood]

I know absolutely nothing about how admin or how business finance works, but if they went into Admin would she stand to lose her loans?

She would probably be okay, its the FOH subscribers that would lose out! So a win win!

[Danderhall Hibs]

It should be compulsory across the board or not at all..

Why?

[Ozyhibby]

I know absolutely nothing about how admin or how business finance works, but if they went into Admin would she stand to lose her loans?

Pretty much. They don’t have that much external credit so it’s only cash flow that could force admin and by the desperation they are showing, cash flow appears to be the issue.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[mjhibby]

I’ve always maintained that the season should just end and Celtic declares champions and hearts relegated but it cleans up the mess and leaves to start afresh when the situation becomes clearer.

However I think it might be hilarious the season finishing and budge relying on the players she has treated like ***** having to bail them out.

Relegated either way I think

Exactly. It's telling that only Naismith agreed to the pay cut and that is because he has earned millions at the rangers,Everton and Norwich. They must have one totally split dressing room and should the PFA take them to court I think they would win due to them not being offered wage deferrals. At least they can claim to be first at something. Sevco and Hertz hitting the buffers at the same time. Hopefully the shops have some popcorn left. Shocking behaviour whichever way you look at it.

[we are hibs]

Absolutely embarrassing how often Hearts and Budge want to play the victim when they are clearly in the wrong/made an arse of it. Get these clowns out the top divison and in with the rest of the diddies, where they belong.

[chrisski33]

Sadly i see Hearts getting some mysterious benefactor at last minute. They are jammy fkers and will get out of this mess again.

[The 90+2]

Just when I needed cheering up you come out with this:

"He genuinely thinks Hearts have just won the last ever derby."

:not worth

Who quoted that?

[Sir David Gray]

Who quoted that?

The poster 3 posts before the one you quoted said that's what a Hearts fan had said.

[PatHead]

Absolutely embarrassing how often Hearts and Budge want to play the victim when they are clearly in the wrong/made an arse of it. Get these clowns out the top divison and in with the rest of the diddies, where they belong.

Stop being unfair on smaller clubs by comparing them to Hearts.

[PatHead]

I wonder if players will sue agents for not advising them of the clause? If so biscuits might get what he deserves.

[Waxy]

Its a tough time but its not THAT tough surely? The games will get played. Maybe its because they were in admin a few year ago.

[greenlex]

Players will be lining up to sign for them next season for sure.

[Real Emerald]

Its a tough time but its not THAT tough surely? The games will get played. Maybe its because they were in admin a few year ago.

They’re only missing around 5 home games that are mostly attended by season ticket holders and then there’s a natural summer break. I can see a problem if they get no more ST money in and next season doesn’t start but they surely should be able to weather the remaining missing 8 games. They must be in real smelly brown stuff.

[The 90+2]

The poster 3 posts before the one you quoted said that's what a Hearts fan had said.

Thanks mate, get it now. 👍

[whiskyhibby]

Budge now saying they won’t last 6 months without this pay suspension, sounds like they are deep in financial ****......but at least they have a £22M main stand......���������� which in itself is probably double the value for the whole Tynecastle site to erect flats on ��

[Since452]

One thing in certain. It'll only be a few years before their next financial meltdown

[Hibs4185]

Budge now saying they won’t last 6 months without this pay suspension, sounds like they are deep in financial ****......but at least they have a £22M main stand......😂😂🤣🤣🤣

I’d happily go 6 months without football just to see hearts disappear.

Hearts monthly outgoings £1.4 million x 6 - £8.4 million. No danger budge is pumping that into them to survive. Already fleeced fans.

Hibs monthly outgoings 700k x 6 - £4.2 million. Cash in the bank and various initiatives to survive.

[CloudSquall]

Sadly i see Hearts getting some mysterious benefactor at last minute. They are jammy fkers and will get out of this mess again.

Depends how much of the mysterious benefactors funds are tied to the stock market and/or how much they are currently financially bleeding given the effective shutdown of parts of the economy, given the 30% losses in the stock market they might think 3 or 4 times before throwing it down the drain at Tynecastle.

[jacomo]

As said, she has Handled this like amateur. Panicking and flapping her way from one mess to another. Yes, Hearts have problems but you need a cool, experienced head in charge. Turning a drama into a crisis.


The awful thing is that she seems to genuinely think she is some kind of sage, leading where others fear to go.

Lots of business leaders are facing tough decisions right now. Few have made as many mistakes as Budge though.

What a piece of work.

[JimBHibees]

Just on Sky Sports. Queen Ann threatens the players of having their salaries suspended on 31st March if they do not accept the 50% pay cut. Could be trouble ahead

Is that legal?

[Bostonhibby]

Budge now saying they won’t last 6 months without this pay suspension, sounds like they are deep in financial ****......but at least they have a £22M main stand......���������� which in itself is probably double the value for the whole Tynecastle site to erect flats on ��See when that stands finished, it'll be worth the original £9m. No other club owner could do what Mrs doctor Budge did here.

Sent from my SM-A750FN using Tapatalk

[AltheHibby]

Who quoted that?

Sorry, I should have said it was hibsfan I was quoting.

[murray26]

Why?

Because they are gaining an unfair advantage on clubs trying to do the right thing by there employees..

[Waxy]

Budge now saying they won’t last 6 months without this pay suspension, sounds like they are deep in financial ****......but at least they have a £22M main stand......���������� which in itself is probably double the value for the whole Tynecastle site to erect flats on ��

Cant build houses on tynecastle. Thats why Budge got them so cheap from admin.The land is worthless.

[Danderhall Hibs]

Because they are gaining an unfair advantage on clubs trying to do the right thing by there employees..

Every club is allowed to do it if they need to. You can’t make it compulsory - some clubs will want to look after their staff - I’d imagine clubs that don’t will get more loyalty post-corona.

[BoomtownHibees]

Another statement from them tonight saying they haven’t told the players this

[murray26]

Every club is allowed to do it if they need to. You can’t make it compulsory - some clubs will want to look after their staff - I’d imagine clubs that don’t will get more loyalty post-corona.

It doesn’t work like that I don’t believe.. footballers will give there all once they cross that line.. really frustrating how they keep getting away with blatant cheating.

[Col2]

PFA have made statement and warned clubs (indirectly Hearts) about making wage cuts and threatening the cancellation of contracts. This is going to get very messy. Hearts are now MIFI managing the cash flow given the points made around 1st April payroll and need for players to pay back immediately if they haven’t agreed cut in advance.

This is Ann Budge who said yesterday who said clubs always have 3 months cash flow contingency for outgoing - so that would be c£4m for Hearts. Yet they appear to be up the creek right now.

[Sir David Gray]

Hearts release another statement denying the media reports.

Where are they now in the statement league?

[Hibs4185]

Cant build houses on tynecastle. Thats why Budge got them so cheap from admin.The land is worthless.

Cala were willing to pay £21 million a few years ago when the pieman was in charge. They maybe told the Lithuanian administrators that it was worthless but that’s not the case.

[Frankhfc]

PFA have made statement and warned clubs (indirectly Hearts) about making wage cuts and threatening the cancellation of contracts. This is going to get very messy. Hearts are now MIFI managing the cash flow given the points made around 1st April payroll and need for players to pay back immediately if they haven’t agreed cut in advance.

This is Ann Budge who said yesterday who said clubs always have 3 months cash flow contingency for outgoing - so that would be c£4m for Hearts. Yet they appear to be up the creek right now.

Glad to hear it.

:aok:

[O'Rourke3]

Hearts release another statement denying the media reports.

Where are they now in the statement league?

Betweem them and the RAngers for the title. The Rangers are appealling to keep the season going as losing two at the same go is simply embarrassing.

[Hibs4185]

Hearts release another statement to clarify their position. Basically saying the news is fake news but their statement confirms they are paying staff in full for March but they reserve the right to invoke article 12 to safeguard the club.

A statement to clarify the situation but basically confirms the situation.

Budge has completely lost the plot. I think she knows she’s at the helm of a sinking ship

[Centre Hawf]

"We haven't made any threats to suspend peoples wages. But we do reserve the right to suspend peoples wages."


Yup. Very good PR work that.

[Bishop Hibee]

Hearts release another statement to clarify their position. Basically saying the news is fake news but their statement confirms they are paying staff in full for March but they reserve the right to invoke article 12 to safeguard the club.

A statement to clarify the situation but basically confirms the situation.

Budge has completely lost the plot. I think she knows she’s at the helm of a sinking ship

The fake news that isn’t fake news at all then. They really are despicable. History tells us they’ll try to beg, steal and cheat their way out of this. Let’s hope it doesn’t work this time.

[FilipinoHibs]

She would probably be okay, its the FOH subscribers that would lose out! So a win win!

Voluntary admin would protect her. Watch this space...

[BILLYHIBS]

I keep thinking about 1990 and Wallet Mercenary

I hope the good ship Budgie goes down with all hands

He who laughs last laughs laughs laughs :greengrin

[FilipinoHibs]

Depends how much of the mysterious benefactors funds are tied to the stock market and/or how much they are currently financially bleeding given the effective shutdown of parts of the economy, given the 30% losses in the stock market they might think 3 or 4 times before throwing it down the drain at Tynecastle.

And who that mysterious person is!

[FilipinoHibs]

Cala were willing to pay £21 million a few years ago when the pieman was in charge. They maybe told the Lithuanian administrators that it was worthless but that’s not the case.

Yes think the Lithuanians were told it would be very difficult to get planning permission. The Edinburgh establishment would close ranks

[Eyrie]

"We haven't made any threats to suspend peoples wages. But we do reserve the right to suspend peoples wages."


Yup. Very good PR work that.

That reads like a threat in itself.

[Frankhfc]

"We haven't made any threats to suspend peoples wages. But we do reserve the right to suspend peoples wages."


Yup. Very good PR work that.

The PFA response - ''We haven't called for players to boycott Hearts yet or that we'll be taking legal action, however, we do reserve the right to do so''.

Appears as if Hearts had to backtrack after the PFA intervened.

Good on the PFA. They can't allow the players to be forced into draconian pay cuts or terminated contracts.

Despicable from Hearts. Very shabby and underhand.

[SON OF PADDY]

The big cow must be full by now........


That's obviously why Levein was made to stay?

[JohnM1875]

She really is a horrible horrible person.

[The 90+2]

Sorry, I should have said it was hibsfan I was quoting.

Nae bother mate 💚

[The 90+2]

She really is a horrible horrible person.

She’s just let hearts get into her core. The same thing Mercer Robinson Levein Locke Foulkes Colquhoun would all do come the crunch. Robbo is the exception he would probably eventually be the same but you could at least tell he would be guilty as fk. The rest are shameless ****ers. Thank **** I don’t twirl that pink scarf.

[Haymaker]

The PFA response - ''We haven't called for players to boycott Hearts yet or that we'll be taking legal action, however, we do reserve the right to do so''.

Appears as if Hearts had to backtrack after the PFA intervened.

Good on the PFA. They can't allow the players to be forced into draconian pay cuts or terminated contracts.

Despicable from Hearts. Very shabby and underhand.

The thing is, if they had just gone to the players quietly and openly they might have gotten results. Now they're ****ed.

[jacomo]

They’re only missing around 5 home games that are mostly attended by season ticket holders and then there’s a natural summer break. I can see a problem if they get no more ST money in and next season doesn’t start but they surely should be able to weather the remaining missing 8 games. They must be in real smelly brown stuff.


Budge admitted they needed the income from the semi final to see them through. Hence the totally warranted criticism - they are in deep poo.

[Not In The Know]

I for one don't take satisfaction in any small business struggling right now.
😂😂😂😂

[Kato]

Where's the mystery benefactors when you need them?.

Staying mysterious so far.

Sent from my SM-A405FN using Tapatalk

[FilipinoHibs]

Staying mysterious so far.

Sent from my SM-A405FN using Tapatalk

They were not there when Hearts went into admin. They are not there when they are about to go into admin again. Budge was there both times. Throwing this over to inspector Cluedo to solve.

[Real Emerald]

She really is a horrible horrible person.

To be honest I don’t think she is a horrible person but I think the poo is hitting the fan and she’s in full panic mode. I think she’s probably weighing up pissing off 40+ employees or being hung drawn and quartered by their 500,000 😂 fans when Hearts go bust on her watch. She’s bricking it! I feel sorry for the families caught up in loosing their income at the club but not on the plight of their over indulgence yet again.

[JOD]

Where's the pieman when they need him?

Is he still aboot BTW?

[cocteautwin]

They were not there when Hearts went into admin. They are not there when they are about to go into admin again. Budge was there both times. Throwing this over to inspector Cluedo to solve.

I wonder if the Scottish Forbes rich list are showing her fortune to be £15m less than when she took over this sh ! t show? Her Brother is probably wealthier than her now.

Wouldn’t it be funny if it was JB Contracts that forced HMFC in to Admin for non payment of debts!

[jax67]

From the sun:

ANN BUDGE has warned Hearts players to take 50 per cent wage cuts by next week or she will SUSPEND their salaries.
The Tynecastle chairman sent an email to first-team stars telling them of her plan to invoke controversial clause 12 - just hours after SPFL lawyer Rod McKenzie told all clubs his judgement was they CAN use it if players refuse to drop their wages.
And now stars at other clubs are terrified their bosses will follow suit.
SunSport revealed last week how a little-known section of a standard, off-the-shelf SPFL deal makes provision for chairmen to halt agreements if the SFA suspend football.
McKenzie is clear that now that has happened, clubs have the contracts weighted in their favour and can suspend them if they need to.
And Hearts immediately jumped on his advice in a bid to force wavering players into accepting cuts.
In an email sent today, Budge said: “This suspension by the SFA automatically suspends the agreement between you and the club governing your employment as a player.
“The precise effects of the suspension of the agreement are an extremely complex matter which the club is considering carefully.
“In the meantime, the club has decided that up until 31 March 2020 it will continue to pay your remuneration under the agreement.
"However, any continued payments of remuneration will be paid under the express condition that this is without prejudice to the question of whether you are entitled to receive them under the agreement following its suspension.
“It may be that, as we have discussed previously, the continued payments mentioned above will need to be adjusted.
“We reserve the right to make those adjustments if and when it becomes clear that this is necessary for the future sustainability of the club.
“If you do not agree with the express condition mentioned above, then by Wednesday 1 April 2020 at the latest you should (1) inform the club in writing that you do not agree and (2) instruct your bank to return any payments received after 1 April 2020 from or on behalf of the club.
“If we do not hear from you by 5pm on April 1 2020, we will take it that you do agree with our express condition.”
PFA Scotland were contacted by concerned players when Hearts first asked players to take cuts and they looked at their own contracts.
They have a QC looking at clause 12 and have vowed to fight it in the courts.
And in a statement they urged clubs to avoid slashing wages before holding proper negotiation.
They said: "The union is firm in its position that clubs and players can more effectively face the challenges ahead by working together and ensuring that decisions are reached by agreement only.
"The union will assist in negotiating agreements between clubs and players.
"Clubs must not and should not be unilaterally imposing contractual changes such as wage cuts.
"Further, the pandemic cannot and should not be used as a reason for terminating contracts - time consuming and costly litigation in the civil courts and disputes before the League will not be in anyone’s interests at this difficult time.
"The union believes that the welfare of clubs, players and Scottish football is best served by all interested stakeholders coming together now to work through the formidable challenges presented by these extraordinary testing times."

All this and they're still letting
agents know they have money available
to buy players for next seasons campaign.
Not right!

[CA Hibby]

Budge might deny, but somebody leaked this, shows the players are right behind the club

[FilipinoHibs]

I wonder if the Scottish Forbes rich list are showing her fortune to be £15m less than when she took over this sh ! t show? Her Brother is probably wealthier than her now. Wouldn’t it be funny if it was JB Contracts that forced HMFC in to Admin for non payment of debts!Last time I looked it was approximately what she got for the IT company minus the mysterious donations.

She sold the company for £70 million having previously bought her partner, Ms Newell, out, in 2001. She owned 60% of tge share capital so she received £40 million. She has spenr £2.4 million on the initial take over, given a further £1.9 million loan and there are £ 11 million in mysterious donations. This leaves her with approximately £24.7 million. Forbes has her net wealth as £16 million in 2019. She could quite easily have spent £8 million on houses, yachts, gifts to family.

What I thinks is suspicious is that Hearts go into admin and there are no mysterious donations. Hearts are in trouble again and there are no mysterious donations. But Budge is there. They need money for a Budge vanity project and players to keep the club an attractive project and the mysterious donations appear.
Could be wrong and happy to proved so with some evidence and a logical argument.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/it-founder-ann-budge-nets-pound40m-after-sale-of-company-494197.html

[Waxy]

Cala were willing to pay £21 million a few years ago when the pieman was in charge. They maybe told the Lithuanian administrators that it was worthless but that’s not the case.
The liquidators wanted to sell tynecastle to claw back alot of their cash.
Hearts and the establishment did everything they could to devalue the land to basically worthless.

[JimBHibees]

"We haven't made any threats to suspend peoples wages. But we do reserve the right to suspend peoples wages."


Yup. Very good PR work that.

Looks like comical Ali is back, what a laughable statement.

Basically we haven't threatenened to do it but just have done now.

[lucky]

It amazes me she was ever successful in business. Her man management skills appear to be zero and the way she handles contract negotiations are startling. Under her leadership the club have wasted millions including £10m from fans. If and when they go down Hearts fans should run her out of the city. On the other hand maybe she’s so clever that she runs them into administration again, buys the club herself for a pound, pays 1p in the pound to the debtors and remains Queen Ann.

[Ozyhibby]

It amazes me she was ever successful in business. Her man management skills appear to be zero and the way she handles contract negotiations are startling. Under her leadership the club have wasted millions including £10m from fans. If and when they go down Hearts fans should run her out of the city. On the other hand maybe she’s so clever that she runs them into administration again, buys the club herself for a pound, pays 1p in the pound to the debtors and remains Queen Ann.

Was she amazing at business though at just got into IT at a time when it exploded? A rising tide lifts all boats.


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[lucky]

Was she amazing at business though at just got into IT at a time when it exploded? A rising tide lifts all boats.


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I think it’s reasonable to say she was successful as the business was sold for £70m.

[Onion]

Budge admitted they needed the income from the semi final to see them through. Hence the totally warranted criticism - they are in deep poo.

Bottom line is Hearts DEPEND on Hibs for their existence. Always have, always will.

They're a shamble of a club. You'd think what they went through just a few years ago would have taught them some important lessons and that the extra money they've pulled in through secret lovers and FOH would have been wisely invested / retained. But nope, they've pissed it all down a wall like a drunk.

[Green Badger]

I think it’s reasonable to say she was successful as the business was sold for £70m.

I think one of the main factors would have been the corporate management skills of 3i private equity (held 28%) that led to a significant increase in value of that company. They will typically restructure management teams and place key individuals to ensure they get maximum return on investment.

if Budge had been left to her own devices, as she is at hearts, who knows where it would all have ended...

[BoltonHibee]

Why don’t they furlough the players? ( or any other team for that matter)


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[bigwheel]

Why don’t they furlough the players? ( or any other team for that matter)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

They may well do. But will only give them up to 2500 per staff member per month ..won’t solve their first team wages cashflow issue

[mjhibby]

Medals McKay wrote a tremendous piece in the evening news where he slams the lack of professionalism at the club and how ridiculous they are back to where they were before administration. Good on him for having the bottle to tell the truth. As I said there are many decent Hertz fans who are disgusted at what's happening. They don't deserve this. It's the moronic element of their support who shout loudest and are seen to represent the club. Budge is just an embodiment of all that's wrong at that club.

[mjhibby]

The one thing the Hertz situation has shown is how lucky we are in having had stf at the helm. Yes the club has made mistakes in appointing managers but we will likely not face horrendous times again and have a secure club. Rather that than sevco and Hertz sailing close to the wind every season. Just a thought.

[Pretty Boy]

I see JKB have gone into full blown 'we owe it to ourselves' mode.

'Feels to me that Hearts are 'planning' and most others are 'hoping.'

'The rest of Scottish football are at the wash your hands for twenty minutes and you will be fine stage of acceptance., Hearts are at the stay the **** at home stage because they can see what's coming.'

'Just glad we still have Ann Budge at the helm during these times. Can only imagine the mess we’d be in right now and the actions (lack of?) we’d be taking'

'Its felt like we are a very easy target at the moment, pundits who want to make out that they are high and mighty'

It's scary to think that when we were allowed out these types walked among us. They are the people mythical Nigerian Princes and accident compensation scams dream of.

[Diclonius]

I'm sick of Hearts treating living within your means as optional and getting away with it.

[KingPat4]

Have Budge and Trump ever been seen in the same room?

[Sir David Gray]

Why don’t they furlough the players? ( or any other team for that matter)


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They could do but if you believe the figures then Liam Boyce for one is on around £6000 a week, that's £24000 a month.

The furlough scheme only provides for up to £2500 per month. Hearts would still need to pay the other £21500 per month and that's just for one player.

[Green Badger]

I see JKB have gone into full blown 'we owe it to ourselves' mode.

'Feels to me that Hearts are 'planning' and most others are 'hoping.'

'The rest of Scottish football are at the wash your hands for twenty minutes and you will be fine stage of acceptance., Hearts are at the stay the **** at home stage because they can see what's coming.'

'Just glad we still have Ann Budge at the helm during these times. Can only imagine the mess we’d be in right now and the actions (lack of?) we’d be taking'

'Its felt like we are a very easy target at the moment, pundits who want to make out that they are high and mighty'

It's scary to think that when we were allowed out these types walked among us. They are the people mythical Nigerian Princes and accident compensation scams dream of.

Classic Stockholm Syndrome behaviour from the jambo hordes.

[Largshibby]

Im sick of Hearts treating living within your means as optuonal and getting away with it.

I suspect they will get away with it again. The football authorities will rip up the rule book to prevent punishments such as points deductions and automatic relegation from depriving our top league of the biggest teams. They will use exceptional circumstances as justification for doing it and claim that it would be impossible to sell the scottish game to tv, sponsors etc (if any still exists once the crisis ends) without Edinburgh and Glasgow derbies.

[hibbydog]

Medals McKay wrote a tremendous piece in the evening news where he slams the lack of professionalism at the club and how ridiculous they are back to where they were before administration. Good on him for having the bottle to tell the truth. As I said there are many decent Hertz fans who are disgusted at what's happening. They don't deserve this. It's the moronic element of their support who shout loudest and are seen to represent the club. Budge is just an embodiment of all that's wrong at that club.

I agree but I don’t count Gary McKay as a decent hearts fan. Anyone who makes monkey noises at Kevin Harper is not a decent hearts fan.

[blackpoolhibs]

Apparently she's asked all the players to come to her door and talk about this situation, there is a big queue on the stair up to that door that goes nowhere.

[Onion]

I suspect they will get away with it again. The football authorities will rip up the rule book to prevent punishments such as points deductions and automatic relegation from depriving our top league of the biggest teams. They will use exceptional circumstances as justification for doing it and claim that it would be impossible to sell the scottish game to tv, sponsors etc (if any still exists once the crisis ends) without Edinburgh and Glasgow derbies.

If that becomes the case, then there's no incentive for financial prudence or punishment for recklessness.

The fact that it's The Rangers and Hearts that have got themselves into financial trouble TWICE in 8 years is no coincidence. Their off-field mismanagement is wholly consistent with the football ethos and their fans deluded sense of entitlement and self-importance.

[lord bunberry]

I’m starting to think that the main reason they’re doing what they’re doing is in order to preserve their budget for next season. While other clubs are concerned with doing the right thing and trying to make sure everyone at their club is paid, hearts are threatening players and sacking anyone who isn’t deemed essential. The fact that they’re already contacting agents about signing players for next season makes me even more convinced that’s what they’re up to.

[RoYO!]

If it were to happen then a wage cap and signing ban should be the next step.

You've pushed the boat out Hertz in a vain attempt to do what big clubs do.

House of cards more like.

Anyone can see that this is not sustainable.

Clubs of our size simply cant pay top players 6-10k week, no matter how much we want to. It isn't sustainable.

And oh look, it's all gone a bit wrong hasn't it?!

Lovely stuff. You reap what you sow.

[chrisski33]

Why don’t they furlough the players? ( or any other team for that matter)


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they could but the players and staff would have to down tools and not work if employers claim for it. however cannot see if players are at home and keep fit whether or not that is classed as working etc :-/

[tamig]

Medals McKay wrote a tremendous piece in the evening news where he slams the lack of professionalism at the club and how ridiculous they are back to where they were before administration. Good on him for having the bottle to tell the truth. As I said there are many decent Hertz fans who are disgusted at what's happening. They don't deserve this. It's the moronic element of their support who shout loudest and are seen to represent the club. Budge is just an embodiment of all that's wrong at that club.
He was only having a pop at the footballing side of things. He couldn’t help himself praising Budge for her magnificent work off the pitch. She is culpable of gross mismanagement across the piece. I don’t know why some of their fans can’t see that.

[tamig]

I see JKB have gone into full blown 'we owe it to ourselves' mode.

'Feels to me that Hearts are 'planning' and most others are 'hoping.'

'The rest of Scottish football are at the wash your hands for twenty minutes and you will be fine stage of acceptance., Hearts are at the stay the **** at home stage because they can see what's coming.'

'Just glad we still have Ann Budge at the helm during these times. Can only imagine the mess we’d be in right now and the actions (lack of?) we’d be taking'

'Its felt like we are a very easy target at the moment, pundits who want to make out that they are high and mighty'

It's scary to think that when we were allowed out these types walked among us. They are the people mythical Nigerian Princes and accident compensation scams dream of.

I’m sure these deluded fools must be in a minority and only surface on JKB. They really are the proverbial head in the sand brigade. They don’t seem very bright at all.

[tamig]

They could do but if you believe the figures then Liam Boyce for one is on around £6000 a week, that's £24000 a month.

The furlough scheme only provides for up to £2500 per month. Hearts would still need to pay the other £21500 per month and that's just for one player.
That’s not how it works. Boyce would only get his 2.5k a month. As he was furloughed, hertz wouldn’t have to pay anything else. I’m sure anyway.

[green day]

That’s not how it works. Boyce would only get his 2.5k a month. As he was furloughed, hertz wouldn’t have to pay anything else. I’m sure anyway.

Correct.

The £2.5k figure was designed as it replicated broadly the median salary of an employed person in the UK.

That some (in football or elsewhere) earn more is neither here nor there, thats the cap.

[Itsnoteasy]

Apparently she's asked all the players to come to her door and talk about this situation, there is a big queue on the stair up to that door that goes nowhere.

Wondered what the big queue was at Wester Coates.

[Deansy]

Wonder why the media isn't asking THE question - WHERE are Hearts 'Mystery benefactors' now ??

[mjhibby]

I’m starting to think that the main reason they’re doing what they’re doing is in order to preserve their budget for next season. While other clubs are concerned with doing the right thing and trying to make sure everyone at their club is paid, hearts are threatening players and sacking anyone who isn’t deemed essential. The fact that they’re already contacting agents about signing players for next season makes me even more convinced that’s what they’re up to.

My thoughts too. She's a cunning fox all right.😅

[CropleyWasGod]

Last time I looked it was approximately what she got for the IT company minus the mysterious donations.

She sold the company for £70 million having previously bought her partner, Ms Newell, out, in 2001. She owned 60% of tge share capital so she received £40 million. She has spenr £2.4 million on the initial take over, given a further £1.9 million loan and there are £ 11 million in mysterious donations. This leaves her with approximately £24.7 million. Forbes has her net wealth as £16 million in 2019. She could quite easily have spent £8 million on houses, yachts, gifts to family.

What I thinks is suspicious is that Hearts go into admin and there are no mysterious donations. Hearts are in trouble again and there are no mysterious donations. But Budge is there. They need money for a Budge vanity project and players to keep the club an attractive project and the mysterious donations appear.
Could be wrong and happy to proved so with some evidence and a logical argument.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/it-founder-ann-budge-nets-pound40m-after-sale-of-company-494197.html

Tax :cb

[Green Reaper]

Why don’t they furlough the players? ( or any other team for that matter)


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Is there not an issue of the furlough money having to be paid through a bank and none wanting to deal with them?

[hibbyfraelibby]

Hearts financial problems are nothing that a few cake bakes could not solve..,,,,

Except that...

...the Hibees panic bought all the flour and eggs?

[jacomo]

I see JKB have gone into full blown 'we owe it to ourselves' mode.

'Feels to me that Hearts are 'planning' and most others are 'hoping.'

'The rest of Scottish football are at the wash your hands for twenty minutes and you will be fine stage of acceptance., Hearts are at the stay the **** at home stage because they can see what's coming.'

'Just glad we still have Ann Budge at the helm during these times. Can only imagine the mess we’d be in right now and the actions (lack of?) we’d be taking'

'Its felt like we are a very easy target at the moment, pundits who want to make out that they are high and mighty'

It's scary to think that when we were allowed out these types walked among us. They are the people mythical Nigerian Princes and accident compensation scams dream of.


Rather than owing it to themselves, I think Hearts need saving from themselves.

Maybe they’ve been too hasty in knocking back the takeover approach from Barnsley. Best thing would be for Hearts to be bought by some other tin pot outfit, then given a strictly controlled budget to run the club.

Much in the same way you give a kid pocket money to help them learn about finances.

[vuefrom1875]

I agree but I don’t count Gary McKay as a decent hearts fan. Anyone who makes monkey noises at Kevin Harper is not a decent hearts fan.

Spot on buddy,he's not decent he's a rac#st!

[vuefrom1875]

Wonder why the media isn't asking THE question - WHERE are Hearts 'Mystery benefactors' now ??

Maybe ask Edinburgh city council 😉

[hibbyfraelibby]

It amazes me she was ever successful in business. Her man management skills appear to be zero and the way she handles contract negotiations are startling. Under her leadership the club have wasted millions including £10m from fans. If and when they go down Hearts fans should run her out of the city. On the other hand maybe she’s so clever that she runs them into administration again, buys the club herself for a pound, pays 1p in the pound to the debtors and remains Queen Ann.

Who said she was successful in business? Alison Newall was the brains.

[Sir David Gray]

That’s not how it works. Boyce would only get his 2.5k a month. As he was furloughed, hertz wouldn’t have to pay anything else. I’m sure anyway.

Fair enough I stand corrected. I thought it was the case that the government paid 80% of someone's wage, up to a maximum of £2500 per month, and the employer paid the other 20%.

There no way they'll go for that then, the players would be better taking the 50% pay cut.

[Ozyhibby]

Fair enough I stand corrected. I thought it was the case that the government paid 80% of someone's wage, up to a maximum of £2500 per month, and the employer paid the other 20%.

There no way they'll go for that then, the players would be better taking the 50% pay cut.

The players would be better saying that they have a contract and want it honoured in full.


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[Billy Whizz]

Gary Locke coming on Off the ball at 12.45
Wonder what he’ll have to say, to defend them

[Sir David Gray]

The players would be better saying that they have a contract and want it honoured in full.


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Yes but if the only alternative's a termination of the contract then maybe not.

[Ozyhibby]

Yes but if the only alternative's a termination of the contract then maybe not.

There will likely be legal recourse for the player. I would be going down that route before I took half my agreed contract. Especially for the likes of Boyce, where the ink is barely dry on the contract.
Everybody is different but I’m stubborn and would hate that ultimatum and would happily cut my nose if to spite my face in those circumstances.


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[calumhibee1]

They really are a ****ing cheating disgrace of a club. Spend more than they can afford, stop paying their players, go into admin, restart, spend more than they can afford, stop paying their players, go into admin, rinse and repeat.

[The Captain....]

I'm struggling to find one area of Budge's tenure at Hearts where she has has been average let alone excelled.

She has lurched from crisis to crisis while still having the arrogance to tell other clubs how they should be doing it.

They've required eye watering sums of external, mystery investors cash to achieve the dizzy heights of a league position below Hamilton and St Mirren..cut adrift at the bottom. The last desperate "hail mary" splurge of spending in the last window looks to have been in vain and has only exacerbated their deep financial difficulties.

Stadium development was an unmitigated disaster with costs doubling and her own fans questioning the way contracts were given out.

Levein is still in the building taking a wage..all be it 50% of his previous.. but it will still be a significant outlay. Again..much to their fans disgust.

Now we have the unedifying spectacle of her treating her employees disgracefully. The PFA in Scotland should be protecting their members thru legal action imo. I also feel for the ordinary staff at Tynecastle..they must be preparing themselves to look for new employment..I'd imagine there will be a huge round of cost cutting over the whole workforce.



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[green day]

Gary Locke coming on Off the ball at 12.45
Wonder what he’ll have to say, to defend them

He is trotting out the party line that Budge is simply ahead of the curve on this :aok:

[ekhibee]

They really are a ****ing cheating disgrace of a club. Spend more than they can afford, stop paying their players, go into admin, restart, spend more than they can afford, stop paying their players, go into admin, rinse and repeat.

Totally agree. And they should be relegated this time as well IMO. Same old cycle. But they'll probably get off with it, they've got plenty of friends in the media, particularly Sportsound.

[EI255]

It's a tough time for all clubs but she has handled this appalingly.

Contrast that with Hibs who have made fans aware of the difficulty of the situation whilst maintaining an air of calm and dignity.This is what living beyond your means looks like. Always been a Hearts and Rangers problem [emoji848]

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[Onion]

Hearts are more than happy to throw most of their players under the bus. Any suggestion that they're really concerned about their employees, like most employers, is laughable. They've dozens of overpaid players who have failed the club and put their Prem position in jeopardy. Hearts and their fans will shed no tears if most of their players were forced out of the club and they could save a few quid while doing it. Then, they'd miraculously find a load of more cash to spend on inflated wages.

And ... repeat.

[Joe6-2]

Apparently she's asked all the players to come to her door and talk about this situation, there is a big queue on the stair up to that door that goes nowhere.

Good offer for them, when we are in lockdown!!

[dchibs]

From the sun:

ANN BUDGE has warned Hearts players to take 50 per cent wage cuts by next week or she will SUSPEND their salaries.
The Tynecastle chairman sent an email to first-team stars telling them of her plan to invoke controversial clause 12 - just hours after SPFL lawyer Rod McKenzie told all clubs his judgement was they CAN use it if players refuse to drop their wages.
And now stars at other clubs are terrified their bosses will follow suit.
SunSport revealed last week how a little-known section of a standard, off-the-shelf SPFL deal makes provision for chairmen to halt agreements if the SFA suspend football.
McKenzie is clear that now that has happened, clubs have the contracts weighted in their favour and can suspend them if they need to.
And Hearts immediately jumped on his advice in a bid to force wavering players into accepting cuts.
In an email sent today, Budge said: “This suspension by the SFA automatically suspends the agreement between you and the club governing your employment as a player.
“The precise effects of the suspension of the agreement are an extremely complex matter which the club is considering carefully.
“In the meantime, the club has decided that up until 31 March 2020 it will continue to pay your remuneration under the agreement.
"However, any continued payments of remuneration will be paid under the express condition that this is without prejudice to the question of whether you are entitled to receive them under the agreement following its suspension.
“It may be that, as we have discussed previously, the continued payments mentioned above will need to be adjusted.
“We reserve the right to make those adjustments if and when it becomes clear that this is necessary for the future sustainability of the club.
“If you do not agree with the express condition mentioned above, then by Wednesday 1 April 2020 at the latest you should (1) inform the club in writing that you do not agree and (2) instruct your bank to return any payments received after 1 April 2020 from or on behalf of the club.
“If we do not hear from you by 5pm on April 1 2020, we will take it that you do agree with our express condition.”
PFA Scotland were contacted by concerned players when Hearts first asked players to take cuts and they looked at their own contracts.
They have a QC looking at clause 12 and have vowed to fight it in the courts.
And in a statement they urged clubs to avoid slashing wages before holding proper negotiation.
They said: "The union is firm in its position that clubs and players can more effectively face the challenges ahead by working together and ensuring that decisions are reached by agreement only.
"The union will assist in negotiating agreements between clubs and players.
"Clubs must not and should not be unilaterally imposing contractual changes such as wage cuts.
"Further, the pandemic cannot and should not be used as a reason for terminating contracts - time consuming and costly litigation in the civil courts and disputes before the League will not be in anyone’s interests at this difficult time.
"The union believes that the welfare of clubs, players and Scottish football is best served by all interested stakeholders coming together now to work through the formidable challenges presented by these extraordinary testing times."
Is Budge going to pop out on April the first and shout APRIL FOOL Iwas only kidding.

[grunt]

From the sun:

(2) instruct your bank to return any payments received after 1 April 2020 from or on behalf of the club.

I don't understand this one. Why is it the responsibility of the players to return payments made by the club? Wouldn't it be easier for the club just to not pay players in April who do not agree to the "express condition"?

[ekhibee]

I'm just listening to Sportsound, have I missed something, is Tom English an unofficial spokesman for Hearts?

[Joe6-2]

Saying on Sky they haven’t exercised right to cut players wages, they are trying to find other solutions to financial problems caused by Coronavirus!!!!
Lying bas*ards, back tracking because of the sh*it being thrown at them

[Frankhfc]

I'm just listening to Sportsound, have I missed something, is Tom English an unofficial spokesman for Hearts?

Yep, has been for at least the past couple of years now.

His blatant love in and bias towards them has been commented upon a number of times on here in the past.

When he first arrived on the scene he seemed like a breath of fresh air but that seems a long time ago now. He's become boring and irrelevant.

[The Captain....]

Can Tom English see further than the end of his nose. Applies absolutely no critical thinking to what he is told and regurgitates it like a parrot. Why do we have to suffer his guff on Radio Scotland...he adds absolutely nothing of worth. Stick to the rugger Tom eh.

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[JimBHibees]

I'm just listening to Sportsound, have I missed something, is Tom English an unofficial spokesman for Hearts?

Quite incredible to be honest. Not allowed to criticise her in any way. No context at all. She has appalling communication skills imo and has imo jumped the gun with her public comments rather than dealing in house with her employees.

[Aldo]

Saying on Sky they haven’t exercised right to cut players wages, they are trying to find other solutions to financial problems caused by Coronavirus!!!!
Lying bas*ards, back tracking because of the sh*it being thrown at them

The bit about the Coronavirus causing the issues is pretty galling imho. They keep rolling this out. The SC semi is an added bonus imho and would it should never be budgeted for at start of season.

Their financial plight is of their own doing, paying massive wages and not being able to afford to do so.


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[Alfred E Newman]

Can Tom English see further than the end of his nose. Applies absolutely no critical thinking to what he is told and regurgitates it like a parrot. Why do we have to suffer his guff on Radio Scotland...he adds absolutely nothing of worth. Stick to the rugger Tom eh.

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Tom English seems to be a self appointed wealth of knowledge about every sport in the land. An absolute slaver.

[The 90+2]

Tom English seems to be a self appointed wealth of knowledge about every sport in the land. An absolute slaver.

English is a egg chasing ****.

[Frankhfc]

The bit about the Coronavirus causing the issues is pretty galling imho. They keep rolling this out. The SC semi is an added bonus imho and would it should never be budgeted for at start of season.

Their financial plight is of their own doing, paying massive wages and not being able to afford to do so.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

100% correct.

This is a cull of their overpaid underachieving overpopulated squad that is solely the fault of the club themselves. Overspending and overstretching their budget and squad numbers. They have only themselves to blame.

Its certainly not the fault of the players who signed their club contracts in good faith and duly expected them to be honoured.

I'd like an explanation from the SPFL on the clause aspect that Rod Mackenzie stated allows clubs to terminate contracts if they don't agree to severe wage cuts. The clause doesn't specify what he's interpreting. Wage deferrals would be more likely a consequence of suspending contracts in my opinion. Hopefully, someone will clarify the issue.

[HoboHarry]

100% correct.

This is a cull of their overpaid underachieving overpopulated squad that is solely the fault of the club themselves. Overspending and overstretching their budget and squad numbers. They have only themselves to blame.

Its certainly not the fault of the players who signed their club contracts in good faith and duly expected them to be honoured.

I'd like an explanation from the SPFL on the clause aspect that Rod Mackenzie stated allows clubs to terminate contracts if they don't agree to severe wage cuts. The clause doesn't specify what he's interpreting. Wage deferrals would be more likely a consequence of suspending contracts in my opinion. Hopefully, someone will clarify the issue.
A legal opinion from Rod McKenzie won't prevent possible legal cases by players/agents who disagree.

[Deansy]

Bottom line is Hearts DEPEND on Hibs for their existence. Always have, always will.

They're a shamble of a club. You'd think what they went through just a few years ago would have taught them some important lessons and that the extra money they've pulled in through secret lovers and FOH would have been wisely invested / retained. But nope, they've pissed it all down a wall like a drunk.

For me, that's the main reason for their constant high-risk gambles finance-wise - they don't do it with a serious view to win the league or European titles, it's to make sure they have the upper-hand in the derby !. Any owner of Hearts knows that they'll get an easy ride from their fans as long as they win more derbies than us - this season's the ideal example of their 'mind-set' !. Despite almost certain relegation, Budge (& Stendel !)are still riding high in the popularity stakes and I reckon that's down to the derby-results this season !

No way would I want us to be like them, that the derby is the 'Reason for living' but what we have to do is to find a way to transfer our obvious off-field superiority at running a football-club, onto the field and start putting them in their rightful place in Edinburgh Football - third !

[Frankhfc]

A legal opinion from Rod McKenzie won't prevent possible legal cases by players/agents who disagree.

I agree. Some players are currently taking legal advice I believe, and that there may well be opposing counter legal opinion that could easily lead to cases being heard. I was surprised to hear Rod McKenzie's interpretation though. The clause is at best vague in my opinion. Hopefully, we'll get an explanation from the SPFL.

[mjhibby]

Saying on Sky they haven’t exercised right to cut players wages, they are trying to find other solutions to financial problems caused by Coronavirus!!!!
Lying bas*ards, back tracking because of the sh*it being thrown at them

Michael Stewart caught them out after it was leaked. A good chunk of the Hertz fans know he's right and should it go mammaries upwards they will come out of the woodwork. She really has some front though.Thetes lies,damn lies and a Queen Anne statement.😂😂😂

[SingaporeHibs]

When the league gets finished they will regret all this. They have a huge number of players out of contract at the end of the season. Whether they suspend paying players or not the chance of those players giving everything to save the club from relegation is now Long since gone. It’s going to be a painful experience for them.

[Ozyhibby]

When the league gets finished they will regret all this. They have a huge number of players out of contract at the end of the season. Whether they suspend paying players or not the chance of those players giving everything to save the club from relegation is now Long since gone. It’s going to be a painful experience for them.

League won’t be finished.


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[Aldo]

Michael Stewart caught them out after it was leaked. A good chunk of the Hertz fans know he's right and should it go mammaries upwards they will come out of the woodwork. She really has some front though.Thetes lies,damn lies and a Queen Anne statement.[emoji23][emoji23][emoji23]

She has the heckles up and when someone dares question her or what they are doing out pops a statement, justifying exactly why they are doing it.


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[Aldo]

When the league gets finished they will regret all this. They have a huge number of players out of contract at the end of the season. Whether they suspend paying players or not the chance of those players giving everything to save the club from relegation is now Long since gone. It’s going to be a painful experience for them.

They don’t and won’t regret it....their statements and actions confirm this. They are self sufficient and it’s the Coronavirus’s pandemic that’s caused their financial problems..,


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[jacomo]

Wow so the Hearts employees have been told that their current pay will continue all the way until the end of March. Which is in three days.

I am sure that is of great comfort to them at this worrying time.

[Deansy]

When the league gets finished they will regret all this. They have a huge number of players out of contract at the end of the season. Whether they suspend paying players or not the chance of those players giving everything to save the club from relegation is now Long since gone. It’s going to be a painful experience for them.


Likewise when trying to sign new players - only the most desperate of agents will now recommend Hearts to their clients because now, unlike Stendel, a lot of players will actually have heard about them - and none of it good !

[Cool_Hand_Luke]

I don't understand this one. Why is it the responsibility of the players to return payments made by the club? Wouldn't it be easier for the club just to not pay players in April who do not agree to the "express condition"?

Could be the payment process is already underway and too late to stop...if the process starts on the last day of the month, the payment might not reach the players bank account until the second or third, by which time they may have decided not to take up Anne’s generous offer...

[SingaporeHibs]

League won’t be finished.


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You might be right as the situation becomes clearer over the next few weeks. But for now they should be able to finish the league even if it’s played behind closed doors. I suspect England’s Premier league and EFL will do everything they can to have the leagues wrapped up in one format or another and Scotland will follow with a similar plan.
We’ll get our lives back bit by bit. For now, stay as safe as you can. GGTTH

[Sammy7nil]

Likewise when trying to sign new players - only the most desperate of agents will now recommend Hearts to their clients because now, unlike Stendel, a lot of players will actually have heard about them - and none of it good !

I think that is wrong look at the Vlad years during and after no problems what so ever recruiting players who will go were they are offered most money.

[Ozyhibby]

I think that is wrong look at the Vlad years during and after no problems what so ever recruiting players who will go were they are offered most money.

But if Hibs and Hearts are offering the same package then a player is more likely to trust Hibs. It means they have to pay a premium for players due to their untrustworthiness.


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[James Stephen]

You might be right as the situation becomes clearer over the next few weeks. But for now they should be able to finish the league even if it’s played behind closed doors. I suspect England’s Premier league and EFL will do everything they can to have the leagues wrapped up in one format or another and Scotland will follow with a similar plan.
We’ll get our lives back bit by bit. For now, stay as safe as you can. GGTTH

Apparently a growing doubt that the season can be finished

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2020/mar/28/premier-league-players-stop-training-uncertainty-coronavirus

[IWasThere2016]

Grim when your Chair - despite her name nearly being Budget - seems to have no grasp of fiscal prudence :greengrin

[WoreTheGreen]

But if Hibs and Hearts are offering the same package then a player is more likely to trust Hibs. It means they have to pay a premium for players due to their untrustworthiness.


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I heard they are losing north of 15k a DAY and that was a week ago

[lord bunberry]

The statement they made last night sums their whole club up imo. They deny giving the players an ultimatum to take a 50% pay cut while reminding them of the consequences of not accepting one. Budge can say what the hell she likes and the gullible hoards will swallow it, but everyone else can see exactly what’s going on.

[Deansy]

Not read the thread, but I'm sure many are enjoying (probably wrong word) that Hertz are in this position.

Me, there's much more important things happening in the world than worrying whether Hertz players get paid or whether Hertz get relegated.

My partner works in the NHS and already there's a work colleague that has the coronavirus. Has that person already passed it on to my partner? Am I already affected? My kids? In Italy, many of the health staff have already died due the virus - 46 doctors was what I read today. The current estimate in the UK is around 20,000 will die.

Apologies, but I couldn't care less about whether an overpaid footballer is not being paid or on reduced wages. What Ms Budge has suggested is what many football clubs will recommend in the weeks and months to come - this virus is going to affect us for a long, long time!

But how many clubs will be sending e-mails to top football agents telling them that there's money available for transfer-fees whilst asking their current staff to accept 50% pay-cuts ??

[lord bunberry]

Not read the thread, but I'm sure many are enjoying (probably wrong word) that Hertz are in this position.

Me, there's much more important things happening in the world than worrying whether Hertz players get paid or whether Hertz get relegated.

My partner works in the NHS and already there's a work colleague that has the coronavirus. Has that person already passed it on to my partner? Am I already affected? My kids? In Italy, many of the health staff have already died due the virus - 46 doctors was what I read today. The current estimate in the UK is around 20,000 will die.

Apologies, but I couldn't care less about whether an overpaid footballer is not being paid or on reduced wages. What Ms Budge has suggested is what many football clubs will recommend in the weeks and months to come - this virus is going to affect us for a long, long time!
All the best to you and your partner, but I don’t see the point of your post. Why come on and give your opinion if you couldn’t care less? Lots of us are having a hard time of things right now and these boards are a welcome distraction from things. We’re very much aware that there’s far more important things going on in the world without being reminded of it.

[superfurryhibby]

Not read the thread, but I'm sure many are enjoying (probably wrong word) that Hertz are in this position.

Me, there's much more important things happening in the world than worrying whether Hertz players get paid or whether Hertz get relegated.

My partner works in the NHS and already there's a work colleague that has the coronavirus. Has that person already passed it on to my partner? Am I already affected? My kids? In Italy, many of the health staff have already died due the virus - 46 doctors was what I read today. The current estimate in the UK is around 20,000 will die.

Apologies, but I couldn't care less about whether an overpaid footballer is not being paid or on reduced wages. What Ms Budge has suggested is what many football clubs will recommend in the weeks and months to come - this virus is going to affect us for a long, long time!

Aye, but coming onto a football forum to make those points is rather strange.

[ScottB]

Given the very real possibility of subsequent outbreaks of this disease, any club that throws their players to the wolves now is surely going to be a less attractive choice?

[Frankhfc]

Given the very real possibility of subsequent outbreaks of this disease, any club that throws their players to the wolves now is surely going to be a less attractive choice?

If Hearts do forge ahead and terminate contracts due to the vague clause I'd hope a show of unity breaks out at their rotten club and the rest of the players 'self terminate' their contracts also.

Nothing to stop them. If the clubs can rip up contracts so can the players. The clause is so vague that the players could interpret one out-all out.

I understand every club is under the cosh but the way in which Hearts have gone about it so far has been grim.

[Scouse Hibee]

Not read the thread, but I'm sure many are enjoying (probably wrong word) that Hertz are in this position.

Me, there's much more important things happening in the world than worrying whether Hertz players get paid or whether Hertz get relegated.

My partner works in the NHS and already there's a work colleague that has the coronavirus. Has that person already passed it on to my partner? Am I already affected? My kids? In Italy, many of the health staff have already died due the virus - 46 doctors was what I read today. The current estimate in the UK is around 20,000 will die.

Apologies, but I couldn't care less about whether an overpaid footballer is not being paid or on reduced wages. What Ms Budge has suggested is what many football clubs will recommend in the weeks and months to come - this virus is going to affect us for a long, long time!


That's a rather ironic post to be honest.

Anyway sorry to hear of your worries, I wish you and your family all the very best and hope everything turns out fine for your partner.

[tamig]

Can Tom English see further than the end of his nose. Applies absolutely no critical thinking to what he is told and regurgitates it like a parrot. Why do we have to suffer his guff on Radio Scotland...he adds absolutely nothing of worth. Stick to the rugger Tom eh.

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I’d love to ask him for examples of the magnificent business decisions Budge has made since taking over there. He trots that line out every time. Her tenure has been a succession of catastrophic mistakes which are all coming home to roost now.

[puff the dragon]

Why don’t they furlough the players? ( or any other team for that matter)


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i would assume not an option for the players.

I’d imagine the players are all self employed contractors - won’t be part of hertz PAYE processes and will file their own tax returns.

[Zazu62]

Relegate them now. Bye bye 👋

[tamig]

i would assume not an option for the players.

I’d imagine the players are all self employed contractors - won’t be part of hertz PAYE processes and will file their own tax returns.

Why would they be self employed contractors? They are employees of HMFC and will be subject to normal PAYE deductions from the club’s payroll.

[CropleyWasGod]

i would assume not an option for the players.

I’d imagine the players are all self employed contractors - won’t be part of hertz PAYE processes and will file their own tax returns.

They're absolutely not.

[Bobby's Cinema]

I remember a time long ago when ABs statements getting it up the OF were rightly praised. But now they seem to have been found out for what they are. Ranty nonsense creative essays. They are in bits whatever happens to this season

[FilipinoHibs]

All the best to you and your partner, but I don’t see the point of your post. Why come on and give your opinion if you couldn’t care less? Lots of us are having a hard time of things right now and these boards are a welcome distraction from things. We’re very much aware that there’s far more important things going on in the world without being reminded of it.

We need distractions from the daily avalanche of bad news. Hearts, as always, are providing wonderful entertainment.

[Scouse Hibee]

i would assume not an option for the players.

I’d imagine the players are all self employed contractors - won’t be part of hertz PAYE processes and will file their own tax returns.


:confused: Not sure why you would imagine that, they are employees, never heard of a self employed professional footballer in my life.

[ScottB]

I think there are instances of big name players controlling their own image rights, personal sponsorships etc via their own companies, but not their salary for playing football.

I doubt HMRC would tolerate an attempt at that for a minute!

[KingPat4]

Outside of Edinburgh nobody cares about them or us, it's all about the Old Firm.

However, when it comes to the crunch, it will be a case of, 'Hearts are quite a big club and take a number of away fans to matches, we don't really want to lose them to the Championship'.

They will not be relegated. Whatever happens.

[tamig]

:confused: Not sure why you would imagine that, they are employees, never heard of a self employed professional footballer in my life.

Jon Stark - matchwinner for hire. Scoop magazine back in the late 70s/early 80s.
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/stuffbypaulbrown.com/2011/10/31/jon-stark-footballer-of-the-future/amp/

[Waxy]

Outside of Edinburgh nobody cares about them or us, it's all about the Old Firm.

However, when it comes to the crunch, it will be a case of, 'Hearts are quite a big club and take a number of away fans to matches, we don't really want to lose them to the Championship'.

They will not be relegated. Whatever happens.Why not? They are bottom.No team will vote for reconstruction so they will go down.

[Marco G]

Spot on. An extra visit or two from hearts fans wont make up for reduced tv money when its split among more clubs in an expanded league. Plus makes it more difficult to qualify for europe. Voiding the league results cant happen without pissing off sponsors and fans. All thats left is playing to a finish (looks very unlikely) or ending season using current positions.

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[Springbank]

Spot on. An extra visit or two from hearts fans wont make up for reduced tv money when its split among more clubs in an expanded league. Plus makes it more difficult to qualify for europe. Voiding the league results cant happen without pissing off sponsors and fans. All thats left is playing to a finish (looks very unlikely) or ending season using current positions.

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Agree with Marco here.

In "normal circumstances" a Hamilton or Morherwell might vote to keep hearts up to get 800 or 900 more away fans through the gates the following season

But these aren't normal times & those extra 800 bums on seats next season pale into insignificance

It is all about "what do I need to do to access this season's sponsor money"

You cant void a season and get paid for it

So you play the season out or end it in current positions

Hearts down, Celtic champs, Hibs 6th, United up...and we all get paid

[we are hibs]

The people who keep repetitively posting that they "dont care about football at the moment" on football threads, on a football forum, should maybe just not post at all if they are that bothered.

[FilipinoHibs]

The people who keep repetitively posting that they "dont care about football at the moment" on football threads, on a football forum, should maybe just not post at all if they are that bothered.

Aye and Hearts are going down. It all helps to relieve the stress and boredom. What is happening is frightening. In the Philippines we are in a military lockdown and can only leave the house for food. Hearts have played a stunning lockdown. Let's hope there is more to come.

[Scouse Hibee]

Jon Stark - matchwinner for hire. Scoop magazine back in the late 70s/early 80s.
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/stuffbypaulbrown.com/2011/10/31/jon-stark-footballer-of-the-future/amp/ (https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/stuffbypaulbrown.com/2011/10/31/jon-stark-footballer-of-the-future/amp/)


:greengrin That was one of my regular comics/magazines, remember him well.

[Danderhall Hibs]

The people who keep repetitively posting that they "dont care about football at the moment" on football threads, on a football forum, should maybe just not post at all if they are that bothered.

I’m with you.

As for Tom English on the radio yesterday - it’s like his brain has gone to mush. He was saying it’s not a 50% pay cut across the board and couldn’t quite grasp that that’s only the case cos Hearts won’t pay anyone below the living wage.

[mjhibby]

English is a rugby man so isn't really that interested in rocking the boat with anyone. A totally pointless football journalist.

[bingo70]

English is a rugby man so isn't really that interested in rocking the boat with anyone. A totally pointless football journalist.

Even then I’m not sure he’s as knowledgable as he likes to think.

He basically benefits from being very articulate and I’m sure is a very intelligent man, strikes me as someone that’s learned about football from reading columns in the paper, doesn’t really get it though.

A lot of the pish he spouts doesn’t stand up to much scrutiny at all.

[Iggy Pope]

English is a rugby man so isn't really that interested in rocking the boat with anyone. A totally pointless football journalist.

When I hear him on the radio all I get is Dara O’ Briain taking the piss.

[Kato]

English is a rugby man so isn't really that interested in rocking the boat with anyone. A totally pointless football journalist.

:agree:

The BBC allots their pundits with different opinions to create "controversy". It's been editorial policy on Sportsound for years, one pundit takes one tack, another the opposite.

As a journalist and product of some hack factory English will be well used to the practice of saying things which he doesn't neccesarily agree with. One of his jobs on that show is to stick up for Hearts even when a stick-of-rock can see they are a ill-run, financial basket-case (again).

People getting annoyed with the tripe spouted or having their convictions confirmed is exactly what the show thrives on. A clear penalty incident will have someone saying they aren't sure. A clear dive and there will be a pundit deployed to say there might have been contact. Controversy is the currency.

If you want to have a clear, concise, factual picture of what is going on with Hearts you won't get it on that channel.

[Ozyhibby]

:agree:

The BBC allots their pundits with different opinions to create "controversy". It's been editorial policy on Sportsound for years, one pundit takes one tack, another the opposite.

As a journalist and product of some hack factory English will be well used to the practice of saying things which he doesn't neccesarily agree with. One of his jobs on that show is to stick up for Hearts even when a stick-of-rock can see they are a ill-run, financial basket-case (again).

People getting annoyed with the tripe spouted or having their convictions confirmed is exactly what the show thrives on. A clear penalty incident will have someone saying they aren't sure. A clear dive and there will be a pundit deployed to say there might have been contact. Controversy is the currency.

If you want to have a clear, concise, factual picture of what is going on with Hearts you won't get it on that channel.

Absolutely. English and Stewart would have agreed on opposing positions before the show. They have admitted as much in the past. It’s good radio.


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[Kato]

It’s good radio.

But poor information.