Sectarianism

[Ozyhibby]

http://www.thefa.com/news/2020/feb/21/barnsley-action-plan-and-fined-210220

I see Barnsley have been fined for anti catholic sectarianism by the FA in England. Shame it’s allowed up here.


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[Keith_M]

Is it definitely for sectarianism?

:dunno:

I couldn't see in the article what it was they actually sung/chanted.

[DaveF]

I'd imagine it will be for abuse directed at James MacLean seeing as it was against Stoke.

[Ozyhibby]

Is it definitely for sectarianism?

:dunno:

I couldn't see in the article what it was they actually sung/chanted.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200222/276b69b07e46c82117c53a5ee5400ec7.png



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[DaveF]

Good on the FA. Meanwhile the Spl/SFA loof the other way.

[Vini1875]

Good for James McClean. Our players should be doing the same thing, instead of just brushing it off.

[Keith_M]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200222/276b69b07e46c82117c53a5ee5400ec7.png



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Thanks Ozy. I still can't see it in the article but it's probably my Browser :)

:aok:


Wouldn't it be great if the Scottish authorities took the same kind of action.




EDIT: I just noticed there's an attachment on the page

[NORTHERNHIBBY]

Barnsley should have hired James Traynor for a heritgage statement to get them off. They could have recouped the cost with Barnsley and Rangers half scarfes.

[Keith_M]

Barnsley should have hired James Traynor for a heritgage statement to get them off. They could have recouped the cost with Barnsley and Rangers half scarves.


Don't give them ideas!

[MWHIBBIES]

Good for James McClean. Our players should be doing the same thing, instead of just brushing it off.

Thing is players down here mainly support Rangers or Celtic or would accept a move there in seconds so they don't want to upset them. Same as any official or politician would never be elected again if they actually stood up to it.

[Sir David Gray]

Rangers and Celtic would be bankrupt after 6 months if similar measures were brought in up here which is why it will never happen.

[Pretty Boy]

We don't have a problem with sectarianism in Scotland. Football is for everyone and anyone up here.

[Keith_M]

We don't have a problem with sectarianism in Scotland. Football is for everyone and anyone up here.


"Everyone Anyone"

"Everybody Welcome"

[Cataplana]

Abhorrent as this is, it sounds like a couple of ex pat Bluenoses pitched up and put on a show to impress those around them.

In future, Barnsley just to keep a closer eye 5' 4" men with bowler hats and cheap trainers at the gate, and theyll be fine.

[Cataplana]

Abhorrent as this is, it sounds like a couple of ex pat Bluenoses pitched up and put on a show to impress those around them.

In future, Barnsley just to keep a closer eye 5' 4" men with bowler hats and cheap trainers at the gate, and theyll be fine.

[Keith_M]

Abhorrent as this is, it sounds like a couple of ex pat Bluenoses pitched up and put on a show to impress those around them.

In future, Barnsley just to keep a closer eye 5' 4" men with bowler hats and cheap trainers at the gate, and theyll be fine.


Chelsea supporters, obviously

[Antifa Hibs]

Good for James McClean. Our players should be doing the same thing, instead of just brushing it off.

Scottish fitba needs The Rangers. Co-efficient on the up, new larger TV deal, high profile gaffer - they yield all the power and there is no chance anyone in Scottish football is going to risk upsetting the "bears".

Hibs are as complicit as anyone. 4000 huns singing fenian this and that towards Lennon and Stubbs - nothing to see here sweep sweep.

[truehibernian]

Yet there are ex players and now mainstream pundits that think The Rangers play in orange because of their previous connection to Dutch players and an ex manager and don't see a link to sectarianism :faf::faf::faf:

Football is the main driver of it up here and until the authorities really clamp down it'll remain.

Will teams ever line up before an Old Firm game with 'Show Sectarianism The Red Card" :cb

[660]

Catholic players should start walking off if they hear abuse related to their religion. Would be interesting watching every single rangers game descend into farce.

[Ozyhibby]

Abhorrent as this is, it sounds like a couple of ex pat Bluenoses pitched up and put on a show to impress those around them.

In future, Barnsley just to keep a closer eye 5' 4" men with bowler hats and cheap trainers at the gate, and theyll be fine.

None of that is which is important. The important thing is the zero tolerance approach of the English FA compared with the Scottish FA. Just another area in the game where they are failing. No doubt Hibs will be happy to see them bring their hate to Easter road next time out as well.


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[h1bs4life]

Catholic players should start walking off if they hear abuse related to their religion. Would be interesting watching every single rangers game descend into farce.

If that happened sevco wouldn't have a team.

The old firm can do what they want in Scottish Football , as much as they are supposed to hate each other they need each other to bring in the cash.
You only had to see when UEFA pulled up the Huns earlier this season and closed down part of the stadium they s##t themselves and statements came out that sectarian behaviour would not be tolerated at Hunbrox only for the songs to start again next leauge game.
It needs UEFA to get involved in domestic football for any change to happen.

[Cataplana]

Chelsea supporters, obviously

They seem to get everywhere.

[truehibernian]

None of that is which is important. The important thing is the zero tolerance approach of the English FA compared with the Scottish FA. Just another area in the game where they are failing. No doubt Hibs will be happy to see them bring their hate to Easter road next time out as well.


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There are 40 other professional teams Ozy that, combined, could be doing a lot more to pressure the football governing bodies into action.

I agree with you - but inaction fuels it. Just as The Rangers are masters at statements, we should be calling it out each and every time it happens at Easter Road :aok: as should other clubs.

[RoxburghHibs]

maybe add NHC to the title :thumbsup:

[Cataplana]

There are 40 other professional teams Ozy that, combined, could be doing a lot more to pressure the football governing bodies into action.

I agree with you - but inaction fuels it. Just as The Rangers are masters at statements, we should be calling it out each and every time it happens at Easter Road :aok: as should other clubs.

We are appalled. We keep going to games featuring them to remind ourselves how appalled we are, and spend the money they give us so they can apall us even more.

In addition, we are so appalled that we sell them players, presumably sent there as missionaries to ensure we are appalled less in future.

There are a lot of words about sectarianism, but the truth is most fans love the pantomime villain. Why else do they tolerate it?

[DH1875]

Catholic players should start walking off if they hear abuse related to their religion. Would be interesting watching every single rangers game descend into farce.

Be quite funny when their own players walk off.

[truehibernian]

We are appalled. We keep going to games featuring them to remind ourselves how appalled we are, and spend the money they give us so they can apall us even more.

In addition, we are so appalled that we sell them players, presumably sent there as missionaries to ensure we are appalled less in future.

There are a lot of words about sectarianism, but the truth is most fans love the pantomime villain. Why else do they tolerate it?

I go to games to watch Hibs and hopefully Hibs winning. I don't go to hear bile. I do kind of agree with your point, however you (we) have to separate the business side of football (transfers between the clubs) from moral attitudes and acceptable behaviour in society (and the game). We can still trade and also challenge another club's (fans) behaviour.

Don't get me wrong, every league has the same issues, particularly (at present) around racism in European leagues. But there are five protected characteristics in law, and in Scotland we stand by and allow bigotry and sectarianism to flourish, with football being the main platform for it to he heard publicly and across television and radio. We support action against racism, we are supporting LGBTI rights across the game, we are throwing support and money (and not before time) towards disability and mental health (in football), yet we are pretty redundant when it comes to challenges those with religious intolerance which is prevalent each and very time we play them. I find it depressing.

[Vault Boy]

I'm glad the EFA took action. The abuse McLean gets is grim.

[Cataplana]

I go to games to watch Hibs and hopefully Hibs winning. I don't go to hear bile. I do kind of agree with your point, however you (we) have to separate the business side of football (transfers between the clubs) from moral attitudes and acceptable behaviour in society (and the game). We can still trade and also challenge another club's (fans) behaviour.

Don't get me wrong, every league has the same issues, particularly (at present) around racism in European leagues. But there are five protected characteristics in law, and in Scotland we stand by and allow bigotry and sectarianism to flourish, with football being the main platform for it to he heard publicly and across television and radio. We support action against racism, we are supporting LGBTI rights across the game, we are throwing support and money (and not before time) towards disability and mental health (in football), yet we are pretty redundant when it comes to challenges those with religious intolerance which is prevalent each and very time we play them. I find it depressing.

Is there more that we can do?

When faced with the demand of removing the Irish flag from Parkhead in the early 50s, Celtic seriously considered the idea of closing the club down, rather than give in.

IMO, it is for the clubs now to say, "if your fans cannot behave in a decent way, then they are not welcome at our ground.'

[truehibernian]

Is there more that we can do?

When faced with the demand of removing the Irish flag from Parkhead in the early 50s, Celtic seriously considered the idea of closing the club down, rather than give in.

IMO, it is for the clubs now to say, "if your fans cannot behave in a decent way, then they are not welcome at our ground.'

I totally agree with your last comment :aok:

[Ozyhibby]

Is there more that we can do?

When faced with the demand of removing the Irish flag from Parkhead in the early 50s, Celtic seriously considered the idea of closing the club down, rather than give in.

IMO, it is for the clubs now to say, "if your fans cannot behave in a decent way, then they are not welcome at our ground.'

Why should Celtic be made to take down an Irish flag? There is nothing sectarian about an Irish flag, or a union flag for that matter. It’s the singing of songs of hate and threatening behaviour to other religions that is the problem.


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[Cataplana]

Why should Celtic be made to take down an Irish flag? There is nothing sectarian about an Irish flag, or a union flag for that matter. It’s the singing of songs of hate and threatening behaviour to other religions that is the problem.


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Google is your friend. It was in the early fifties. I brought the example up to show what integrity is.

If you have principles you will not compromise them for anything.

[cabbageandribs1875]

I'm glad the EFA took action. The abuse McLean gets is grim.

and that's just from stoke fans

shower of ignorant er*ewipes at the best of times

[hibbysam]

Why should Celtic be made to take down an Irish flag? There is nothing sectarian about an Irish flag, or a union flag for that matter. It’s the singing of songs of hate and threatening behaviour to other religions that is the problem.


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Fairly sure there wouldn’t be uproar if rangers started flying a red hand outside of ibrox right enough 😂 two cheeks of the same arse, as wrong as derogatory shouts about catholics is, the same applies to equally derogatory shouts regarding Protestants and their beliefs. Neither should be anywhere near Scottish football. Neither should we be pandering around the use of flags ‘just because there’s nothing illegal about them’ when we all know it’s a massive points scoring, point pushing exercise by both clubs/support.

[Cataplana]

Fairly sure there wouldn’t be uproar if rangers started flying a red hand outside of ibrox right enough 😂 two cheeks of the same arse, as wrong as derogatory shouts about catholics is, the same applies to equally derogatory shouts regarding Protestants and their beliefs. Neither should be anywhere near Scottish football. Neither should we be pandering around the use of flags ‘just because there’s nothing illegal about them’ when we all know it’s a massive points scoring, point pushing exercise by both clubs/support.

The episode we are talking about was in the early fifties. The fact that Celtic were threatened with sanctions for the offence of flying a flag, tells you lot about how ingrained sectarianism was at the time.

[Green_one]

SFA should read this report and hang their heads in shame. The incidents referred to are weekly activities in Scotland. Well done the FA

Interesting that they acknowledged the difficulty in the club controlling this but that the club had simply not done enough to prevent it. Now they have two actions to help address in. Let’s see the sfa copy the English.

At £20k a pop it would be all over very quickly So why do we not do exactly the same?:confused:

[Ozyhibby]

Flags at Ibrox have never been a problem for the SFA.

https://youtu.be/85Q2vYEYQvw



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[Kato]

The episode we are talking about was in the early fifties. The fact that Celtic were threatened with sanctions for the offence of flying a flag, tells you lot about how ingrained sectarianism was at the time.That's not quite what happened though. Have you done any reading on what went on?

https://foot.ie/threads/11886-Hibernian-FC-and-there-place-in-Irish-History

[Cataplana]

That's not quite what happened though. Have you done any reading on what went on?

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I read about it in Celtic, "Just Because You are Paranoid .."
many years ago, but I'm sketchy on the detail now.

[Keith_M]

This has nothing to do with whether or not Celtc had an Irish flag on the roof of the Jungle in the 1950s.

[Kato]

I read about it in Celtic, "Just Because You are Paranoid .."
many years ago, but I'm sketchy on the detail now.Sorry bud, I edited in a link in the post above, here you go and worth reading the whole thing.

https://foot.ie/threads/11886-Hibernian-FC-and-there-place-in-Irish-History

A great thread, written in a good spirit. Weirdly in the middle of it Celtc published an article full of the usual lies about Hibs. Slov Sam subsequently had a letter published in reply by the Celtc View, complete with an apology for misrepresenting Harry Swan.

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[Cataplana]

Sorry bud, I edited in a link in the post above, here you go and worth reading the whole thing.

https://foot.ie/threads/11886-Hibernian-FC-and-there-place-in-Irish-History

A great thread, written in a good spirit. Weirdly in the middle of it Celtc published an article full of the usual lies about Hibs. Slov Sam subsequently had a letter published in reply by the Celtc View, complete with an apology for misrepresenting Harry Swan.

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Thanks, sounds interesting.

[CentreLine]

Sorry bud, I edited in a link in the post above, here you go and worth reading the whole thing.

https://foot.ie/threads/11886-Hibernian-FC-and-there-place-in-Irish-History

A great thread, written in a good spirit. Weirdly in the middle of it Celtc published an article full of the usual lies about Hibs. Slov Sam subsequently had a letter published in reply by the Celtc View, complete with an apology for misrepresenting Harry Swan.

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Perfect example of how a well written piece of fake news can linger in the memory while the truth is forgotten

[Cataplana]

Sorry bud, I edited in a link in the post above, here you go and worth reading the whole thing.

https://foot.ie/threads/11886-Hibernian-FC-and-there-place-in-Irish-History

A great thread, written in a good spirit. Weirdly in the middle of it Celtc published an article full of the usual lies about Hibs. Slov Sam subsequently had a letter published in reply by the Celtc View, complete with an apology for misrepresenting Harry Swan.

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Harry Swan founded Protestant Action? And at the same time he bought Hibs?

All I can say is, if he wanted to destroy the Irish connection, he seems to have been playing a long game.

[Kato]

Harry Swan founded Protestant Action? And at the same time he bought Hibs?

All I can say is, if he wanted to destroy the Irish connection, he seems to have been playing a long game.

I suppose in a tenuous link to the OP it shows what anyone is up against when tackling sectarianism in Scotland, paranoia, sheer vindictiveness, whataboutery and pure fiction.



Perfect example of how a well written piece of fake news can linger in the memory while the truth is forgotten


Back when "fake news" was pronounced "loady p*sh".


I miss Slov Sam around these parts, dry sense of humour, gravitas and common sense.

[KingPat4]

There was a good programme on BBC Scotland last night about footie.

However, I was amazed when Tom Devine said he believed sectarianism and religious bigotry was on the decline.