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LaMotta
04-12-2019, 10:03 PM
All keepers will have off days and make mistakes. Even the best.

Very few will make top class unbelievable saves regularly that can win you points though.

Rocky is one of those keepers who can make those saves consistently and one of the few who has done so over the last 50 years for us. The criticism he has had on here has been puzzling to say the least.

MacGruber
04-12-2019, 10:05 PM
Totally agree

Bogdan is also class though I give a slight edge to Rocky.

Maxwell hasn't got that same quality - he is who we play though

Hibeesmad
04-12-2019, 10:05 PM
Maxwell has done nothing wrong though..

Smartie
04-12-2019, 10:05 PM
All keepers will have off days and make mistakes. Even the best.

Very few will make top class unbelievable saves regularly that can win you points though.

Rocky is one of those keepers who can make those saves consistently and one of the few who has done so over the last 50 years. The criticism he has had on here has been puzzling to say the least.

The criticism he was taking earlier this season was entirely justified and he deserved to be dropped.

He reacted well to losing his place last season and played brilliantly when he got back in. He deserves to get back in and I think he’ll do the same again this time.

Unseen work
04-12-2019, 10:06 PM
Rocky also made numerous blunders this season.

Whilst I agree he’s a good keeper he was rightly dropped.

Hopefully Bogdan gets up to speed and in the team

Sammy7nil
04-12-2019, 10:09 PM
All keepers will have off days and make mistakes. Even the best.

Very few will make top class unbelievable saves regularly that can win you points though.

Rocky is one of those keepers who can make those saves consistently and one of the few who has done so over the last 50 years for us. The criticism he has had on here has been puzzling to say the least.

Very strange post he deserved to be dropped. Goram , Rough, Leighton, Colgan and Anderson may argue with you.

LaMotta
04-12-2019, 10:09 PM
The criticism he was taking earlier this season was entirely justified and he deserved to be dropped.

He reacted well to losing his place last season and played brilliantly when he got back in. He deserves to get back in and I think he’ll do the same again this time.

I think the criticism was way over the top though.

He had one bad error vs St Johnstone, and a couple of 'should have done betters' v motherwell and the huns.

We should have stuck with him IMO, given his previous fantastic showings for us.

BILLYHIBS
04-12-2019, 10:12 PM
Maxwell has done little wrong

Did he make any serious mistakes tonight?

Serious question not fishing or anything just curious as to how this old chestnut keeps popping up after every defeat

I was not at the game tonight and I have not seen any highlights

If a change is needed why not give Bogdan a chance?

Edit:

Rocky played 4 lost 13 and loads of unforced errors

LaMotta
04-12-2019, 10:12 PM
Very strange post he deserved to be dropped. Goram , Rough, Leighton, Colgan and Anderson may argue with you.

Very strange post from you if you think Anderson and Colgan have made better saves consistently than Rocky for Hibs.

The other three did but then thats exactly what im saying there has only been a few like that.

Youve never liked Rocky though.

Heisenberg
04-12-2019, 10:14 PM
For Maxwell see Mark Oxley. Quite a steady keeper but never seems to make saves and has the odd error in him (as seen tonight). I’d drop him for Bogdan.

Sammy7nil
04-12-2019, 10:16 PM
Very strange post from you if you think Anderson and Colgan have made better saves consistently than Rocky for Hibs.

The other three did but then thats exactly what im saying there has only been a few like that.

Youve never liked Rocky though.

I think your memory has gone :greengrin

percy veer
04-12-2019, 10:17 PM
For Maxwell see Mark Oxley. Quite a steady keeper but never seems to make saves and has the odd error in him (as seen tonight). I’d drop him for Bogdan.

was a god send when Oxley got booked for time wasting against Inverness and forced stubbs hand to change the keeper

Smartie
04-12-2019, 10:18 PM
I think the criticism was way over the top though.

He had one bad error vs St Johnstone, and a couple of 'should have done betters' v motherwell and the huns.

We should have stuck with him IMO, given his previous fantastic showings for us.

Other factors were that he continued to shell the ball out the park regularly, the whole defensive unit was disorganised and all over the place, and we had a new and untested goalkeeper waiting in the wings.

The criticism may have been OTT but I maintain he deserved to lose his place and until now Maxwell hasn’t really deserved to have been dropped.

Rocky is a top keeper most of the time though and I’d be glad to see him get another chance.

LaMotta
04-12-2019, 10:18 PM
Maxwell has done little wrong

Did he make any serious mistakes tonight?

Serious question not fishing or anything just curious as to how this old chestnut keeps popping up after every defeat

I was not at the game tonight and I have not seen any highlights

If a change is needed why not give Bogdan a chance?

Edit:

Rocky played 4 lost 13 and loads of unforced errors

Maxwell blunder for the equaliser tonight.

Rocky lost 6 against Rangers when we were down to ten men, and he actually kept the score down that day. He got pelters for the first goal that day when the defence were far more at fault not tracking Defoe.

If Maxwell had been in *** knows what the score would have been.

Sooner Bogdan or Rocky is back in the better.

Hibeesmad
04-12-2019, 10:19 PM
His performance against Celtic towards the end of last season was one of the best I’ve seen.

LaMotta
04-12-2019, 10:19 PM
Other factors were that he continued to shell the ball out the park regularly, the whole defensive unit was disorganised and all over the place, and we had a new and untested goalkeeper waiting in the wings.

The criticism may have been OTT but I maintain he deserved to lose his place and until now Maxwell hasn’t really deserved to have been dropped.

Rocky is a top keeper most of the time though and I’d be glad to see him get another chance.

I can agree with all that:greengrin

Vault Boy
04-12-2019, 10:19 PM
Rocky is the best keeper I've seen play for Hibs. I certainly think there's something more to the story than form for him to be on the bench.

LaMotta
04-12-2019, 10:20 PM
I think your memory has gone :greengrin

I think you need new specs :greengrin

Pretty Boy
04-12-2019, 10:22 PM
Maxwell is a strange one. He looks confident, he's comfortable with the ball at his feet, he distributes the ball well and he hasn't made many glaring errors.

I just don't think he ever looks like making a breathtaking save like Rocky can nor does he look anywhere near as commanding or assured as Bogdan does. Bogdan in particular just oozed confidence after a sticky start and it was obvious the defence trusted him implicitly. Him and Rocky just pushed each other on to be better when they were in direct competition as they both knew any dip in form would see them replaced.

I just don't think Maxwell has that level in him. Rocky was in poor form when he was, arguably deservedly, dropped but I'm not convinced Maxwell has really done enough to cement the number 1 spot as his own.

LaMotta
04-12-2019, 10:25 PM
Maxwell is a strange one. He looks confident, he's comfortable with the ball at his feet, he distributes the ball well and he hasn't made many glaring errors.

I just don't think he ever looks like making a breathtaking save like Rocky can nor does he look anywhere near as commanding or assured as Bogdan does. Bogdan in particular just oozed confidence after a sticky start and it was obvious the defence trusted him implicitly. Him and Rocky just pushed each other on to be better when they were in direct competition as they both knew any dip in form would see them replaced.

I just don't think Maxwell has that level in him. Rocky was in poor form when he was, arguably deservedly, dropped but I'm not convinced Maxwell has really done enough to cement the number 1 spot as his own.

Having just seen the equalising goal tonight I'd be amazed if Maxwell starts on Saturday.

CapitalGreen
04-12-2019, 10:27 PM
Horror show from Maxwell a for the first County goal.

This is reminiscent of when Graeme Smith was our keeper when we had two better goalies in reserve.

BILLYHIBS
04-12-2019, 10:39 PM
Maxwell blunder for the equaliser tonight.

Rocky lost 6 against Rangers when we were down to ten men, and he actually kept the score down that day. He got pelters for the first goal that day when the defence were far more at fault not tracking Defoe.

If Maxwell had been in *** knows what the score would have been.

Sooner Bogdan or Rocky is back in the better.

Still to see the Maxwell blunder

My laddie was at Ibrox and he said if it wisnae for Rocky it was 6 going on 20

I still thought he might have done better at a couple of the goals :greengrin

It must have affected his confidence as he was all over the shop versus St Johnstone rushing out of his box to smash into OHalloran getting beat too easily at his near post constantly booting the ball out of play or to the opposition

I have just watched the replay of Motherwell away 0-3 a shocker and Killie away 0-2 it is don’t watch alone viewing

As others have said he deserved to lose his place maybe he can come back and play as well as he did this time last season where I must admit he was undroppable but I suspect we have not brought Bogdan back to sit in the stand :greengrin

ancient hibee
04-12-2019, 10:54 PM
Since Maxwell came in it seems to me that practically every attempt on target goes in.That doesn’t mean I expect him to save them all but it’s almost that he saves none.He has no command of his area,let’s crosses go or like tonight gets nowhere near it and doesn’t organise the defence(nobody does).He’s not to blame for the biggest blunder which was the non signing of a defensive midfielder.

Hibeesmad
04-12-2019, 11:06 PM
Since Maxwell came in it seems to me that practically every attempt on target goes in.That doesn’t mean I expect him to save them all but it’s almost that he saves none.He has no command of his area,let’s crosses go or like tonight gets nowhere near it and doesn’t organise the defence(nobody does).He’s not to blame for the biggest blunder which was the non signing of a defensive midfielder.

Spot on

Causewayside PR
04-12-2019, 11:10 PM
Manager's fault for playing Maxwell ahead of two high quality goalkeepers. He is miles off Marciano and Bogdan. How the manager cannot see that is beyond me.
I agree Marciano had a few bad ones at the start of the season but Hibs would have at least 4 more points now if we had stuck with him.

BoyledEgg
04-12-2019, 11:15 PM
was a god send when Oxley got booked for time wasting against Inverness and forced stubbs hand to change the keeper

He was injured.

hibbysam
04-12-2019, 11:22 PM
was a god send when Oxley got booked for time wasting against Inverness and forced stubbs hand to change the keeper

Wouldn’t change it now, but we win that play off semi final with Oxley in goals.

BILLYHIBS
04-12-2019, 11:27 PM
Always thought that Oxley picked up a second tournament booking versus Caley in the quarter final and that is why he missed the semi
He tried to tell the Ref he had lost a contact lens but the sympathetic Ref booked him for time wasting
We eventually had to take him off and put on a young laddie to see out the game

Cod Boy
04-12-2019, 11:41 PM
Always thought that Oxley picked up a second tournament booking versus Caley in the quarter final and that is why he missed the semi
He tried to tell the Ref he had lost a contact lens but the sympathetic Ref booked him for time wasting
We eventually had to take him off and put on a young laddie to see out the game

Yes your right

lord bunberry
05-12-2019, 12:06 AM
We have three good keepers, but the weakest of the three is starting every week. Rocky is the best keeper I’ve seen in a long time and Bogdan is not far behind him. Maxwell is solid enough, but as the op says he’s not a match winner. Top class keepers can turn draws into victories and losses into draws.

BILLYHIBS
05-12-2019, 12:09 AM
Give Bogdan a try

Over to JR

😁

BILLYHIBS
05-12-2019, 12:27 AM
Just seen Maxwells howler will be surprised if he is in the team for Saturday

Next!

Lex7zero
05-12-2019, 12:34 AM
Just seen Maxwells howler will be surprised if he is in the team for Saturday

Next!

Maxwell is a joke. Bogdan or Rocky any day of the week.

Man Down Under
05-12-2019, 12:35 AM
I agree Rocky is our best keeper just now, but I think he was talking about moving on too much for Hibs liking and was punished for it.

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Lex7zero
05-12-2019, 01:47 AM
I agree Rocky is our best keeper just now, but I think he was talking about moving on too much for Hibs liking and was punished for it.

Sent from my SM-A205GN using Tapatalk

Yup I think Rocky has talked his way out of a game. Give me Bogdan though as Maxwell has cost us a few points.

Weegreenman
05-12-2019, 06:33 AM
Very strange post he deserved to be dropped. Goram , Rough, Leighton, Colgan and Anderson may argue with you.

Not a strange post at all tbf. Bang on the money I’d say. Rocky is a great shot stopper. He saves spectacularly but let’s the side down with the basics like catching a ball from a corner, his kicking and his decision making are very poor to say the least. Rocky doesn’t deserve to be mentioned in the same breath as those keepers you mention.

SMAXXA
05-12-2019, 06:51 AM
Maxwell is a joke. Bogdan or Rocky any day of the week.

He’s hardly a joke he made a mistake last night and one against Celtic and I suspect he will be lucky to start on Saturday but calling him a joke is just poor. It’s some Hibs fans all over soon as someone makes a mistake or we lose a game we slaughter our own players.

I’ve seen many more joke keepers than him in my years of watching Hibs. He deserves criticism for last night not denying that but let’s not go OTT.

Tyler Durden
05-12-2019, 07:23 AM
Maxwell should have been dropped weeks ago and it’s no surprise at all that he cost us last night.

His stats are appalling and he’s made more obvious blunders in recent weeks for the “he’s done nothing wrong” brigade.

Rocky was poor early in the season but he was playing when the team were an utter shambles.

Johnny_Leith
05-12-2019, 07:43 AM
I can't agree Maxwell hasn't done much wrong, I can name about 2 good saves from his run in the team and a good few goals he should've done better at. I'm surprised he doesn't get more peters on here for the goals conceded. He's certainly not a gk who will win you points in the mould of rocky or Bogdan.

GaryOsCheerios
05-12-2019, 07:54 AM
Still yet to see him make a save.

Also who was tracking the boy for countys first? Thats the reason he had to come for it which I think he realised too late as the boy would have had a free header due to non existent marking.

Since452
05-12-2019, 09:55 AM
If Bogdan doesn't start on Saturday I'm calling the police

Anthony Soprano
05-12-2019, 09:57 AM
Heard a few people say that Marciano allegedly has some sort of clause in his contract where we have to pay Ashdod a fee once he reaches a certain amount of appearances for us, would say this is unlikely as he probably wouldn't be on the bench if this was the case but who knows.

Whilst Maxwell hasn't been horrendous he hasn't been brilliant either, looked shaky the past few weeks and made a bad error for county's equaliser last night, completely misjudged the ball into the box and left looking like a right c***.

Maxwell's only a loan and rocky will likely be away come January so I reckon this would be a good time to bring Bogdan back in to give him a run of games.

J-C
05-12-2019, 10:15 AM
I remember Shankly saying something like Clemence was like having 12 points in the bag because of how good he was.

Peevemor
05-12-2019, 10:19 AM
Heard a few people say that Marciano allegedly has some sort of clause in his contract where we have to pay Ashdod a fee once he reaches a certain amount of appearances for us, would say this is unlikely as he probably wouldn't be on the bench if this was the case but who knows.

Whilst Maxwell hasn't been horrendous he hasn't been brilliant either, looked shaky the past few weeks and made a bad error for county's equaliser last night, completely misjudged the ball into the box and left looking like a right c***.

Maxwell's only a loan and rocky will likely be away come January so I reckon this would be a good time to bring Bogdan back in to give him a run of games.

Bogdan's only signed until January too.

BILLYHIBS
05-12-2019, 10:26 AM
I remember Shankly saying something like Clemence was like having 12 points in the bag because of how good he was.

You could say the same about Leighton Goram and Roughie

I reckon I have just been spoilt 😁

hibbie02
05-12-2019, 10:28 AM
Has Maxwell made a save? Has he managed a clean sheet? His distribution is better than Rocky, that doesn’t say much. Maxwell is probably better at taking in crosses but thats about it. As a shot stopper I’d take Rocky, but as an all round keeper I’d take Bogdan.


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Anthony Soprano
05-12-2019, 10:29 AM
Bogdan's only signed until January too.

Thought it was till end of season, my mistake.

Would be surprised if we don't extend it as like i said rocky looks like he could leave and maxwell's not good enough

scoopyboy
05-12-2019, 10:37 AM
Has Maxwell made a save? Has he managed a clean sheet? His distribution is better than Rocky, that doesn’t say much. Maxwell is probably better at taking in crosses but thats about it. As a shot stopper I’d take Rocky, but as an all round keeper I’d take Bogdan.


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Agree 100%, saved me a fair bit of typing

Heisenberg
05-12-2019, 11:02 AM
Bogdan and Marciano saved us numerous points last season with outstanding saves. Give me that over a goalie who saves nothing but can kick the ball a wee bit more accurately.

1875M
05-12-2019, 11:12 AM
Bogdan and Marciano saved us numerous points last season with outstanding saves. Give me that over a goalie who saves nothing but can kick the ball a wee bit more accurately.

This. Goalkeepers main job is to make saves, claim crosses, organise defence then focus on distribution. Maybe I'm just old fashioned? :confused:

hibbie02
06-12-2019, 07:45 AM
This. Goalkeepers main job is to make saves, claim crosses, organise defence then focus on distribution. Maybe I'm just old fashioned? :confused:

Exactly!

Just_Jimmy
06-12-2019, 09:04 AM
I'm on record as saying rocky is out best keeper and it's not close. Bogdan resigning changed that a bit but I'd still play rocky ATM.

Maxwell sums us up. Not awful but just not good enough for the next step.

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hibbysam
06-12-2019, 10:47 AM
The fact his ‘pros’ in his early days was kicking to Doidge’s head, and ‘commanding his box’ says it all. He’s so slow to distribute the ball, he’s started making basic errors from crosses, he doesn’t make saves... average on his good days, a liability on his bad days, and he’s having more and more of those.

BILLYHIBS
06-12-2019, 10:52 AM
The gloves are up for grabs

Let’s see what happens

JDHibs
06-12-2019, 11:10 AM
Rocky deserved to be dropped. A point alot of fans have forgotten.

Maxwell came in, & after Hearts we went 9 games unbeaten until Wednesday. A point also forgotten by fans.

That being said, Bogdan is better overall than both. Rockys been talking himself up for a move recently which i suspect will happen in January.

End of the day, the main issue is our defence, which of the 3 keepers we use isnt going to make a massive difference in reality.

hibsbollah
06-12-2019, 11:13 AM
I remember Shankly saying something like Clemence was like having 12 points in the bag because of how good he was.

Indeed :agree:

And using the expected goals against stat, De Gea was given a +18 point differential under Mourinho at Man Utd. Without those eighteen points Mourinhos tenure would've been a bottom half Man U team.

There are different types of goalie though. The ones who come for every cross, start attacks, play under managers who instruct their keepers to play out from the back everytime, will contribute more to the rest of the team but will make more mistakes (Hugo Lloris, David James' going back a few years). That famous De Gea Season, Lloris was one of the worst ranked keepers under the expected saves stat (-8 iirc) but his distribution, claimed crosses and rate of intercepted through balls etc was probably much better than de geas, but isnt an attribute that gets much airtime in the studio. As a result, he's probably underrated.

My feeling on our keepers is Rocky is a safety first, on his line, great shot stopper with 'rocky' distribution who would do well on the stat lines, but was rightfully dropped because he was making mistakes. Maxwell is similar but with less capacity for reaction saves and better distribution (but I haven't seen him for a few weeks now and I understand he's not on great form and making mistakes). Neither is the risk taking, dominating his box type keeper type.

And please. Stop with the 'has Maxwell made a save' chat. Celtic.

Keith_M
06-12-2019, 12:07 PM
Rocky certainly has his strengths, his spectacular saves being very noticable, but his kick outs are among the worst I've seen in any Hibs Goalie.

angus hibby
06-12-2019, 12:16 PM
Unless I'm mistaken, Wednesday night was Maxwell's first mistake which has cost us a goal. Bit harsh IMO to drop him after one mistake. Bogdan probably not up to speed yet so imagine Maxwell will be in goals tomorrow

Barman Stanton
06-12-2019, 12:22 PM
Rocky certainly has his strengths, his spectacular saves being very noticable, but his kick outs are among the worst I've seen in any Hibs Goalie.

This was also Leightons issue. In fact I seem to remember defenders taking bye kicks for him. And we have probably never had a better keeper since. I would always play the better shot stopper first, and worry about distribution after.

rodhibs55
06-12-2019, 12:25 PM
The thread is titled "Goalkeepers Winning Points". In my opinion a goalkeeper is more likely to win you points by pulling off saves rather than good distribution. In that scenario Rocky wins hands down.
Get him back in.

B.H.F.C
06-12-2019, 12:26 PM
Unless I'm mistaken, Wednesday night was Maxwell's first mistake which has cost us a goal. Bit harsh IMO to drop him after one mistake. Bogdan probably not up to speed yet so imagine Maxwell will be in goals tomorrow

Badly at fault for a goal in the semi final as well, also failing to deal with a cross.

Just a guess on my part, but must average about two goals against per game since he’s been in goals. Can’t think of many times where I’ve really felt he made a difference to the outcome in a positive sense.

Smartie
06-12-2019, 12:27 PM
This was also Leightons issue. In fact I seem to remember defenders taking bye kicks for him. And we have probably never had a better keeper since. I would always play the better shot stopper first, and worry about distribution after.

There was a thread recently about getting a "touch of the ball" at games.

For a year or so we positioned ourselves on the halfway line at the front of the East. When kicking up the slope Leighton had a habit of hooking quite a few goal kicks straight out of play, giving us a decent chance of getting a touch of the ball, which we did on a good few occasions.

He was still a fantastic keeper mind, a bit like Rocky......

matty_f
06-12-2019, 12:30 PM
Maxwell doesn't do much wrong, he made a mistake for Ross County's first goal, no question, but he's not really had much blame put at his door for other goals conceded - and rightly so.

I think he's like Oxley, in that he's not that hard to beat with a good finish. Maxwell, like Oxley, makes the saves you'd expect him to make but rarely makes saves that you wouldn't expect him to make - that, for me, is the difference between Maxwell and Marciano and Bogdan. Both Marciano and Bogdan pull out top drawer saves at times, and crucial saves as well. Generally, the finish has to be excellent to beat them.

Our issue isn't with the keeper, though (IMHO). Our issue starts further up the pitch with the system we're playing. We've sacrificed defensive solidity in favour of attacking creativity - we're scoring more goals but still conceding, because we leave the full backs exposed too frequently.

I expect Ross will change the shape for tomorrow's game and we'll look at a stronger defensive shape.

I would say that all of our keepers are adequate for the level we play at, I acknowledge that even the best goalkeepers make mistakes and so there will always be evidence to support a view that a certain keeper isn't up to it (and we could pull out goals that all three of our keepers have conceded to highlight why they're not up to it). I think hanging Maxwell out to dry is putting attention on a problem that isn't really there.

Peevemor
06-12-2019, 12:30 PM
Rocky deserved to be dropped. A point alot of fans have forgotten.

Maxwell came in, & after Hearts we went 9 games unbeaten until Wednesday. A point also forgotten by fans.

That being said, Bogdan is better overall than both. Rockys been talking himself up for a move recently which i suspect will happen in January.

End of the day, the main issue is our defence, which of the 3 keepers we use isnt going to make a massive difference in reality.


Badly at fault for a goal in the semi final as well, also failing to deal with a cross.

Just a guess on my part, but must average about two goals against per game since he’s been in goals. Can’t think of many times where I’ve really felt he made a difference to the outcome in a positive sense.

Was he not fouled?

Maxwell is averaging less goals against per match than Rocky. People criticise him for not making saves, but surely losing less goals is all that counts? Maybe there's a reason why he has less saves to make?

In any case, I'm happy with any of our 3 keepers.

lord bunberry
06-12-2019, 12:44 PM
Rocky deserved to be dropped. A point alot of fans have forgotten.

Maxwell came in, & after Hearts we went 9 games unbeaten until Wednesday. A point also forgotten by fans.

That being said, Bogdan is better overall than both. Rockys been talking himself up for a move recently which i suspect will happen in January.

End of the day, the main issue is our defence, which of the 3 keepers we use isnt going to make a massive difference in reality.
I disagree that changing the keeper won’t make a difference, a keeper that makes saves will give confidence to the players in front of him. It won’t solve all our problems, but right now it seems almost every error results in a goal.

Heisenberg
06-12-2019, 12:46 PM
I thought Maxwell was really slow to try and save the second too but would need to see the highlights again.

easty
06-12-2019, 12:47 PM
Maxwell doesn't do much wrong, he made a mistake for Ross County's first goal, no question, but he's not really had much blame put at his door for other goals conceded - and rightly so.

I think he's like Oxley, in that he's not that hard to beat with a good finish. Maxwell, like Oxley, makes the saves you'd expect him to make but rarely makes saves that you wouldn't expect him to make - that, for me, is the difference between Maxwell and Marciano and Bogdan. Both Marciano and Bogdan pull out top drawer saves at times, and crucial saves as well. Generally, the finish has to be excellent to beat them.

Our issue isn't with the keeper, though (IMHO). Our issue starts further up the pitch with the system we're playing. We've sacrificed defensive solidity in favour of attacking creativity - we're scoring more goals but still conceding, because we leave the full backs exposed too frequently.

I expect Ross will change the shape for tomorrow's game and we'll look at a stronger defensive shape.

I would say that all of our keepers are adequate for the level we play at, I acknowledge that even the best goalkeepers make mistakes and so there will always be evidence to support a view that a certain keeper isn't up to it (and we could pull out goals that all three of our keepers have conceded to highlight why they're not up to it). I think hanging Maxwell out to dry is putting attention on a problem that isn't really there.

He's very like Oxley. Nae better, nae worse. I said that to someone the other day.

lord bunberry
06-12-2019, 12:51 PM
He's very like Oxley. Nae better, nae worse. I said that to someone the other day.
I agree, the difference now is that we have two other top drawer keepers at the club.

easty
06-12-2019, 12:53 PM
I agree, the difference now is that we have two other top drawer keepers at the club.

Absolutley

whiskas
06-12-2019, 01:02 PM
Unless I'm mistaken, Wednesday night was Maxwell's first mistake which has cost us a goal. Bit harsh IMO to drop him after one mistake. Bogdan probably not up to speed yet so imagine Maxwell will be in goals tomorrow

Erased the Celtic game from memory?

BILLYHIBS
06-12-2019, 01:06 PM
Maxwell doesn't do much wrong, he made a mistake for Ross County's first goal, no question, but he's not really had much blame put at his door for other goals conceded - and rightly so.

I think he's like Oxley, in that he's not that hard to beat with a good finish. Maxwell, like Oxley, makes the saves you'd expect him to make but rarely makes saves that you wouldn't expect him to make - that, for me, is the difference between Maxwell and Marciano and Bogdan. Both Marciano and Bogdan pull out top drawer saves at times, and crucial saves as well. Generally, the finish has to be excellent to beat them.

Our issue isn't with the keeper, though (IMHO). Our issue starts further up the pitch with the system we're playing. We've sacrificed defensive solidity in favour of attacking creativity - we're scoring more goals but still conceding, because we leave the full backs exposed too frequently.

I expect Ross will change the shape for tomorrow's game and we'll look at a stronger defensive shape.

I would say that all of our keepers are adequate for the level we play at, I acknowledge that even the best goalkeepers make mistakes and so there will always be evidence to support a view that a certain keeper isn't up to it (and we could pull out goals that all three of our keepers have conceded to highlight why they're not up to it). I think hanging Maxwell out to dry is putting attention on a problem that isn't really there.

Good post

Agree with this

Anthony Soprano
06-12-2019, 03:26 PM
Maxwell doesn't do much wrong, he made a mistake for Ross County's first goal, no question, but he's not really had much blame put at his door for other goals conceded - and rightly so.

I think he's like Oxley, in that he's not that hard to beat with a good finish. Maxwell, like Oxley, makes the saves you'd expect him to make but rarely makes saves that you wouldn't expect him to make - that, for me, is the difference between Maxwell and Marciano and Bogdan. Both Marciano and Bogdan pull out top drawer saves at times, and crucial saves as well. Generally, the finish has to be excellent to beat them.

Our issue isn't with the keeper, though (IMHO). Our issue starts further up the pitch with the system we're playing. We've sacrificed defensive solidity in favour of attacking creativity - we're scoring more goals but still conceding, because we leave the full backs exposed too frequently.

I expect Ross will change the shape for tomorrow's game and we'll look at a stronger defensive shape.

I would say that all of our keepers are adequate for the level we play at, I acknowledge that even the best goalkeepers make mistakes and so there will always be evidence to support a view that a certain keeper isn't up to it (and we could pull out goals that all three of our keepers have conceded to highlight why they're not up to it). I think hanging Maxwell out to dry is putting attention on a problem that isn't really there.

Forgot about Oxley, he was murder

Tyler Durden
06-12-2019, 04:39 PM
Was he not fouled?

Maxwell is averaging less goals against per match than Rocky. People criticise him for not making saves, but surely losing less goals is all that counts? Maybe there's a reason why he has less saves to make?

In any case, I'm happy with any of our 3 keepers.

He was not fouled, no.

Maxwell didn’t have to play at Ibrox with 10 men and Whittaker at full back. That’s the main reason that Rocky lost so many goals.

Maxwell is miles behind the other 2.

Tyler Durden
06-12-2019, 04:41 PM
Maxwell doesn't do much wrong, he made a mistake for Ross County's first goal, no question, but he's not really had much blame put at his door for other goals conceded - and rightly so.

I think he's like Oxley, in that he's not that hard to beat with a good finish. Maxwell, like Oxley, makes the saves you'd expect him to make but rarely makes saves that you wouldn't expect him to make - that, for me, is the difference between Maxwell and Marciano and Bogdan. Both Marciano and Bogdan pull out top drawer saves at times, and crucial saves as well. Generally, the finish has to be excellent to beat them.

Our issue isn't with the keeper, though (IMHO). Our issue starts further up the pitch with the system we're playing. We've sacrificed defensive solidity in favour of attacking creativity - we're scoring more goals but still conceding, because we leave the full backs exposed too frequently.

I expect Ross will change the shape for tomorrow's game and we'll look at a stronger defensive shape.

I would say that all of our keepers are adequate for the level we play at, I acknowledge that even the best goalkeepers make mistakes and so there will always be evidence to support a view that a certain keeper isn't up to it (and we could pull out goals that all three of our keepers have conceded to highlight why they're not up to it). I think hanging Maxwell out to dry is putting attention on a problem that isn't really there.

Maxwell doesn’t actually save the ones you’d expect him to. He saves fewer that the average expected saves in the league. He’s objectively worse than average based on his performances to date.

Marciano was poor earlier in the year but we’ve had evidence in the past that he can recover strongly from some poor form.

theonlywayisup
07-12-2019, 08:43 AM
For me, I have never come away from the game thinking about a wonder Maxwell save. He's made good routine saves, but can't recall many wonder saves.

IMO, he's a couple of inches too small and doesn't seem to get across his goals quick enough.I don't think he's a bad goalie, just limited in capability.

Smartie
07-12-2019, 09:25 AM
For me, I have never come away from the game thinking about a wonder Maxwell save. He's made good routine saves, but can't recall many wonder saves.

IMO, he's a couple of inches too small and doesn't seem to get across his goals quick enough.I don't think he's a bad goalie, just limited in capability.

I’ve come away from a decent number of games happy with his overall performance though. No mistakes, coming out to claim crosses competently, the defence having been solid enough and his distribution good.

There’s more to goalkeeping than just making saves.

Maxwell has done well since he came into the side but I’d be happy to see us make a change as on their day I do think the other 2 are better.

I_Love_Latapy
07-12-2019, 09:43 AM
I remember Shankly saying something like Clemence was like having 12 points in the bag because of how good he was.

Brian Clough said that the two highest paid players in your team should be the centre forward and the keeper as they are the guys who can win or lose you games.

I think he was justifying buying Trevor Francis and Peter Shilton, mind you, not a pair of welsh lads from Preston & Forest Green.

(I actually like Maxwell & Doidge BTW, its just the other keepers/strikers are too exotic to make the gag work. Modern football, huh)

hibbysam
07-12-2019, 11:07 AM
I’ve come away from a decent number of games happy with his overall performance though. No mistakes, coming out to claim crosses competently, the defence having been solid enough and his distribution good.

There’s more to goalkeeping than just making saves.

Maxwell has done well since he came into the side but I’d be happy to see us make a change as on their day I do think the other 2 are better.

The least you expect is decent saves. He doesn’t make decent saves. He makes average routine saves that I would make. His distribution is slow, and the majority of them are punts up the park, so now we’re happy that our keeper can kick a ball to a half decent area. He’s lost at least 2 shockers from failing to claim crosses, Celtic and Wednesday night. Give me a keeper that stands on his line but makes the save any day. Most keepers are like that these days. He also flapped one big time against Motherwell which we got away with.