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Heisenberg
05-09-2019, 05:21 AM
http://ww.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/exclusive-hibs-graeme-mathie-front-19491254

Given how our last two summer transfer windows have gone would this be a massive loss? George Craig can go with him too.

JimBHibees
05-09-2019, 05:28 AM
http://ww.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/exclusive-hibs-graeme-mathie-front-19491254

Given how our last two summer transfer windows have gone would this be a massive loss? George Craig can go with him too.

Bit harsh I think he and George have been at the club at a time when our fortunes have improved immensely. There is only so much that this role can do IMO, you can recommend players however the coach will I am assuming have the final say. Think he is from through the west maybe this is just him getting a similar job closer to home. Given how we have started the season I think we should have concerns generally how things are going to work under Ron though.

Dmas
05-09-2019, 05:45 AM
Could someone copy and paste the article please?

Heisenberg
05-09-2019, 05:46 AM
Bit harsh I think he and George have been at the club at a time when our fortunes have improved immensely. There is only so much that this role can do IMO, you can recommend players however the coach will I am assuming have the final say. Think he is from through the west maybe this is just him getting a similar job closer to home. Given how we have started the season I think we should have concerns generally how things are going to work under Ron though.

I’m not sure any scrutiny can be directed at Ron just yet. There’s a football department in place which he put his trust in and they’ve failed massively by the looks of it.

I often find that if we sign a good player people put it down to the recruitment team but any poor players are often blamed on the manager. While I think there’s a chance Heckingbottom (and Lennon) signed a couple of their own the majority will be recruitment team recommendations. Doidge for example, I’m sure he was a target under Lennon as well. Heckingbottom also commented that Newell was one we were interested before he arrived.

Marvellous
05-09-2019, 05:56 AM
Could someone copy and paste the article please?

Graeme Mathie is the front-runner to become Kilmarnock (https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/all-about/kilmarnock-fc)’s new head of football operations.
The 36-year-old is currently head of player identification and recruitment at Hibs.
Mathie- whose dad Ross also played for Killie- was previously a scout at Celtic (https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/all-about/celtic-fc) before he headed to Easter Road.
The former Motherwell player has worked alongside several Hibs managers like Alan Stubbs, Neil Lennon (https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/all-about/neil-lennon)and now Paul Heckingbottom.
Mathie works strongly on data analysis and has also put together a number of presentations for in-coming transfers at Hibs.
Kilmarnock are looking to revamp their football operations department and Mathie is very much at the forefront of their thoughts.

NORTHERNHIBBY
05-09-2019, 06:46 AM
I would think that it would be a bettter job for him with a higher profile.

Since452
05-09-2019, 07:14 AM
http://ww.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/exclusive-hibs-graeme-mathie-front-19491254

Given how our last two summer transfer windows have gone would this be a massive loss? George Craig can go with him too.

I'll tell you in May

J-C
05-09-2019, 07:26 AM
Last 2 managers have ignored most of his recommendations, maybe feels time to go where his work is appropriated, plus it's a step up doing the same role as Craig.

My_Wife_Camille
05-09-2019, 07:29 AM
A good egg, a passionate and enthusiastic guy but well past his sell by date at Hibs.

George Craig and Paul Heckingbottom next please

Heisenberg
05-09-2019, 07:43 AM
Last 2 managers have ignored most of his recommendations, maybe feels time to go where his work is appropriated, plus it's a step up doing the same role as Craig.

I see this is going to be the regular defence of our recruitment team and those in charge of it. PH was brought in because he would work within our structure. He championed the structure and said he’d use it to its full effect. If he’s gone against that then someone within the club has to take the blame. There is of course no evidence to suggest the club and manager haven’t been working together on transfers.

SMAXXA
05-09-2019, 07:45 AM
Last 2 managers have ignored most of his recommendations, maybe feels time to go where his work is appropriated, plus it's a step up doing the same role as Craig.

How do you know this?

Baldy Foghorn
05-09-2019, 07:47 AM
Probably cheesed off at recent events surrounding signings

Heisenberg
05-09-2019, 07:48 AM
Probably cheesed off at recent events surrounding signings

What recent events?

Baldy Foghorn
05-09-2019, 07:50 AM
What recent events?

Signing players that were not recommended by scouts?

CentreLine
05-09-2019, 07:54 AM
Probably cheesed off at recent events surrounding signings

More likely just has an opportunity to move to a higher position within the game and he might accept it. Not getting at you specifically Baldy but I don’t get all the negativity about every possible change at our club. Every working person looks for opportunities to progress.
The article implies that he is only one of the people being considered for the position at Killie. If he does not get the position or decided not to move what will the negativity focus on then?

Heisenberg
05-09-2019, 07:55 AM
Signing players that were not recommended by scouts?

Which players were these out of interest?

As I’ve said, I’ve no doubt PH and NL will have signed a couple of their own players. The majority will be recommended by our absolutely fantastic “footballing department”.

calumhibee1
05-09-2019, 07:55 AM
How do you know this?

I’m going to hazard a guess that he doesn’t.

The 90+2
05-09-2019, 07:58 AM
Which players were these out of interest?

As I’ve said, I’ve no doubt PH and NL will have signed a couple of their own players. The majority will be recommended by our absolutely fantastic “footballing department”.

Goodness knows what he’s done recently to be headhunted to a high position then.

Heisenberg
05-09-2019, 07:59 AM
Goodness knows what he’s done recently to be headhunted to a high position then.

Ex Hibs boy has just joined the Killie board. Probably recommended someone he knows.

jeffers
05-09-2019, 08:01 AM
I don't know if the signings were recommended by the recruitment team or were players Heckingbottom wanted (you've got to imagine Jackson was a player he wanted) with GoalsMcGinlay saying Vela and Newell were two players Heckingbottom was advised against signing.

We've certainly taken a different approach in that all our initial signings came from the lower leagues of England, with none of them having experience of playing in Scotland. Contrast that with previous signings, who were typically players who had played up here, often young, with a point to prove, supplemented by some "exotic" signings like Malonga. The last three signings looking more like the type we had brought in previously.

The 90+2
05-09-2019, 08:02 AM
Ex Hibs boy has just joined the Killie board. Probably recommended someone he knows.

Thanks, didn’t know that. Helps with a potential shake up in any case.

Baldy Foghorn
05-09-2019, 08:30 AM
More likely just has an opportunity to move to a higher position within the game and he might accept it. Not getting at you specifically Baldy but I don’t get all the negativity about every possible change at our club. Every working person looks for opportunities to progress.
The article implies that he is only one of the people being considered for the position at Killie. If he does not get the position or chided not to move what will the negativity focus on then?

Fair enough reply. Think when some aspects aren't going well, negativity begins to breed. I'm beginning to be more negative than I was before. Maybe spending too much time with hermit crab?

The_Horde
05-09-2019, 08:37 AM
Get poaching staff from Motherwell and Livi please. Both seem to be able to pick up gems on a low budget.

Is It On....
05-09-2019, 09:23 AM
Last 2 managers have ignored most of his recommendations, maybe feels time to go where his work is appropriated, plus it's a step up doing the same role as Craig.

If we believe in the more scientific process for identifying players then I don't think the manager should be allowed to ignore the recommendations. I personally don't believe in mantra "the manager has an eye for a player". If we end up with the wrong players then, imo, there is something wrong with the process that needs to be improved. I am probably I'm a minority in that I want our player recruitment to be as much like the "moneyball approach" as possible.

J-C
05-09-2019, 10:05 AM
I don't know if the signings were recommended by the recruitment team or were players Heckingbottom wanted (you've got to imagine Jackson was a player he wanted) with GoalsMcGinlay saying Vela and Newell were two players Heckingbottom was advised against signing.

We've certainly taken a different approach in that all our initial signings came from the lower leagues of England, with none of them having experience of playing in Scotland. Contrast that with previous signings, who were typically players who had played up here, often young, with a point to prove, supplemented by some "exotic" signings like Malonga. The last three signings looking more like the type we had brought in previously.

Saves me writing this.

Stubbs used the scouting system perfectly and had a great eye for a player. Lennon used a few agents and players he already knew, some worked, some didn't. As above 2 of Heckingbottom's choices were flagged by the scouts as not good enough for the money being spent but he wanted them anyway, Hallberg looks a typical recruitment team signing, out of the blue unknown like Malonga and Slivka.

Anthony Soprano
05-09-2019, 11:26 AM
Saves me writing this.

Stubbs used the scouting system perfectly and had a great eye for a player. Lennon used a few agents and players he already knew, some worked, some didn't. As above 2 of Heckingbottom's choices were flagged by the scouts as not good enough for the money being spent but he wanted them anyway, Hallberg looks a typical recruitment team signing, out of the blue unknown like Malonga and Slivka.

Is this fact or speculation? Someone stated further up the thread that Newell was a player identified before Heckingbottom came in

Heisenberg
05-09-2019, 11:32 AM
Is this fact or speculation? Someone stated further up the thread that Newell was a player identified before Heckingbottom came in

https://youtu.be/gY4bnc5Zxrc

He specifically says that Newell was one he has known for years but the club had as well and “everyone was on board” with his signing. Couple of minutes in.

Brightside
05-09-2019, 11:35 AM
Vela was a recruitment team name. Last season.

lord bunberry
05-09-2019, 11:35 AM
If he’s doing such a bad job why are killie wanting him?

Anthony Soprano
05-09-2019, 11:42 AM
https://youtu.be/gY4bnc5Zxrc

He specifically says that Newell was one he has known for years but the club had as well and “everyone was on board” with his signing. Couple of minutes in.

Cheers for that. He must of been doing something right down south then. Frankly, he looks like a fish out of water in all the games I've seen him in this season so far.

My_Wife_Camille
05-09-2019, 11:51 AM
If he’s doing such a bad job why are killie wanting him?
Probably the same reason why we wanted Heckingbottom after he’d picked up 5 wins from his last 32 games.

jacomo
05-09-2019, 12:30 PM
https://youtu.be/gY4bnc5Zxrc

He specifically says that Newell was one he has known for years but the club had as well and “everyone was on board” with his signing. Couple of minutes in.


Yeah, that quote sounded slightly off to me at the time and still does.

You’d expect ‘everyone to be on board’, so why bother saying it?

Heisenberg
05-09-2019, 12:40 PM
Yeah, that quote sounded slightly off to me at the time and still does.

You’d expect ‘everyone to be on board’, so why bother saying it?

I think you’re maybe looking too much into it. He’s clearly stated that everyone was on board with signing him and I’ll take that over some random rumour which has only come to light because we aren’t playing well.

Heckingbottom, the recruitment team and LD/GC all need to take responsibility for our transfer windows to varying degrees. Last two haven’t been good enough in the summer and have required patch up jobs in January.

J-C
05-09-2019, 12:41 PM
Newell and Vela may well have been scouted and known to the recruitment team, still doesn't mean they recommended them.

Brightside
05-09-2019, 01:17 PM
Newell and Vela may well have been scouted and known to the recruitment team, still doesn't mean they recommended them.

Vela was recommended. 100% on that one.

calumhibee1
05-09-2019, 01:49 PM
Saves me writing this.

Stubbs used the scouting system perfectly and had a great eye for a player. Lennon used a few agents and players he already knew, some worked, some didn't. As above 2 of Heckingbottom's choices were flagged by the scouts as not good enough for the money being spent but he wanted them anyway, Hallberg looks a typical recruitment team signing, out of the blue unknown like Malonga and Slivka.

How do you know the scouts flagged two of our players as not being good enough for the money?

J-C
05-09-2019, 02:34 PM
How do you know the scouts flagged two of our players as not being good enough for the money?

Probably same contact the other poster has, someone from within the club. Look these guys have came from the Championship and would be on very decent money, I have a feeling Heckingbottom has forced these signings through, on longish deals and more money than they're worth, probably one of the reasons our budget is shot. Doidge is a real concern as he's older than expected for his relative experience but probably £250k too much,average players on top player wages. I think Jackson is half decent and probably within our wage structure as is James, Maxwell is a loan so we'll only be paying part of his.

Not In The Know
05-09-2019, 03:13 PM
I attended a Hibs net trip to East Mains. Graeme Mathie made a presentation to us. It was very impressive and he came over as a real assets to the club. Would be gutted to see him leave.

I believe he travels from the west everyday so wouldn't be surprised he did....

JimBHibees
05-09-2019, 03:14 PM
I attended a Hibs net trip to East Mains. Graeme Mathie made a presentation to us. It was very impressive and he came over as a real assets to the club. Would be gutted to see him leave.

I believe he travels from the west everyday so wouldn't be surprised he did....

Agree can remember watching him speak communicated very well.

PISTOL1875
05-09-2019, 05:48 PM
Fair enough reply. Think when some aspects aren't going well, negativity begins to breed. I'm beginning to be more negative than I was before. Maybe spending too much time with hermit crab?

Brockie , after seeing you after the St johnstone match I thought i was gonna have to give you a kiss and a cuddle..

stuart-farquhar
05-09-2019, 07:25 PM
Agree can remember watching him speak communicated very well.

Why do people travel so far. Personally I wouldn't as an employer want staff commuting long distances. Rarely works

Billy Whizz
05-09-2019, 07:43 PM
Why do people travel so far. Personally I wouldn't as an employer want staff commuting long distances. Rarely works

He doesn’t scout players at East Mains???
Him and his team travel all round the UK each week looking at players.

Not sure if there’s any foundation in this rumour, but I’ve met Graeme on a few occasions, and he’s always come across as someone who’s professional in their job, and has good people management skills. Wouldn’t be surprised if he wants to be a No 1 at another club

SquashedFrogg
05-09-2019, 07:55 PM
Why do people travel so far. Personally I wouldn't as an employer want staff commuting long distances. Rarely works

Not sure what industry you work in but that's really not a big commute.

B.H.F.C
05-09-2019, 07:55 PM
He doesn’t scout players at East Mains???
Him and his team travel all round the UK each week looking at players.


I’d imagine Mathie goes to games here and there but the bulk of his time will be at East Mains. He’s running the department.

I remember doing one of the East Mains visits and George Craig talking about how he commuted in every day.

SquashedFrogg
05-09-2019, 07:57 PM
Probably same contact the other poster has, someone from within the club. Look these guys have came from the Championship and would be on very decent money, I have a feeling Heckingbottom has forced these signings through, on longish deals and more money than they're worth, probably one of the reasons our budget is shot. Doidge is a real concern as he's older than expected for his relative experience but probably £250k too much,average players on top player wages. I think Jackson is half decent and probably within our wage structure as is James, Maxwell is a loan so we'll only be paying part of his.

'I have a feeling' suggests you don't actually know.

Brightside
05-09-2019, 08:37 PM
Commuting from Glasgow to Edinburgh is pretty normal. 😂

Phil MaGlass
05-09-2019, 08:41 PM
Probably cheesed off at recent events surrounding signings

Or maybe hes been asked to leave due to the pish signings that have recently been made?
I dont know likes, just saying

J-C
06-09-2019, 06:14 AM
'I have a feeling' suggests you don't actually know.


I have a feeling means it's something I was told by someone inside the club but not willing to share any names as that is something you don't tend to do, don't fancy getting anyone into trouble. GoalsMcGinley seems to have the same info I got.

Brooster
06-09-2019, 06:33 AM
Commuting from Glasgow to Edinburgh is pretty normal. 😂

Thousands commute from Glasgow to Tranent, it's a normal thing to do.

Greenworld
06-09-2019, 06:56 AM
Just a thought would it be an idea to remove George Craig from his post and promote Graham mathie ?

Sent from my SM-G903F using Tapatalk

Smartie
06-09-2019, 06:59 AM
Commuting from Glasgow to Edinburgh is pretty normal. 😂

Commuting from West of Glasgow to East of Edinburgh can be an absolute nightmare depending on when you do it, as you can hit 2 rush hours.

There's a lot can happen between home and work to make that particular journey a nightmare.

If you're at all unhappy at work and you have a bit of a trek to get there, it doesn't take long before you start asking yourself questions why you're spending so much of your life in a car.

Beefster
06-09-2019, 07:54 AM
Thousands commute from Glasgow to Tranent, it's a normal thing to do.

I used to commute from Tranent to Glasgow. If you train it from/to Wallyford, it’s not much worse that trying to battle your way home from Edinburgh in rush hour.

Costs a fortune, mind you.

Baldy Foghorn
06-09-2019, 11:04 AM
Brockie , after seeing you after the St johnstone match I thought i was gonna have to give you a kiss and a cuddle..

Haha you should have seen me after Motherwell

The Modfather
06-09-2019, 11:15 AM
I have a feeling means it's something I was told by someone inside the club but not willing to share any names as that is something you don't tend to do, don't fancy getting anyone into trouble. GoalsMcGinley seems to have the same info I got.

By all means folk should post what they’ve heard, but you’ve posted it so many times folk are starting to take it as fact. It may well be fact, but we saw what happened in January with the rumours of Dempster and Allan, which folk posted in good faith as there was a text doing the rounds by all accounts.

BlackSheep
06-09-2019, 11:18 AM
Why do people travel so far. Personally I wouldn't as an employer want staff commuting long distances. Rarely works

I've commuted from Edinburgh to Glasgow for 10 years... driving every working day. Its actually easier getting from East to West than it is commuting to work within Edinburgh!

The Modfather
06-09-2019, 11:19 AM
Back on topic, the recruitment and connection between hiring managers and the signing strategy seems to be off-kilter. Mathie might well be a loss if he was to leave, but I think a lot of areas within the club need a shake up or a re-set so might be time for someone new to come in with new ideas.

HAPPY HIBERNIAN
06-09-2019, 11:29 AM
hopefully he does go and he takes that oddball George craig with him

oneone73
06-09-2019, 11:41 AM
I've commuted from Edinburgh to Glasgow for 10 years... driving every working day. Its actually easier getting from East to West than it is commuting to work within Edinburgh!

Coming up for 29 years for me.

J-C
06-09-2019, 12:07 PM
By all means folk should post what they’ve heard, but you’ve posted it so many times folk are starting to take it as fact. It may well be fact, but we saw what happened in January with the rumours of Dempster and Allan, which folk posted in good faith as there was a text doing the rounds by all accounts.

The problem with the Dempster/Allan rumour was it wasn't checked 1st before posting, if it was they would've realised it was pulled due to Lawell moving the goalposts, Allan was very happy to sign up this summer, so no problems with him and Hibs.

greenlex
06-09-2019, 08:14 PM
Haha you should have seen me after Motherwell
I did.:agree:

BoyledEgg
07-09-2019, 11:10 AM
I attended a Hibs net trip to East Mains. Graeme Mathie made a presentation to us. It was very impressive and he came over as a real assets to the club. Would be gutted to see him leave.

I believe he travels from the west everyday so wouldn't be surprised he did....

Not sure if he stays in Glasgow or Ayrshire but he runs/takes a boys club in Ayrshire.

Hibby Bairn
07-09-2019, 12:48 PM
Not sure if he stays in Glasgow or Ayrshire but he runs/takes a boys club in Ayrshire.

He lives in Ayr.

brog
07-09-2019, 01:41 PM
Get poaching staff from Motherwell and Livi please. Both seem to be able to pick up gems on a low budget.

We tried that before with Butcher's scouting Svengali. That went well!

Hibees1973
07-09-2019, 05:15 PM
General consensus on here is we do not have a clue who has ultimate responsibility in signing new players...is it the recruitment team, it is the manager, who has final say on it. This is really confusing, although the way we recruit players is not uncommon and seems to be the way a lot of clubs do it. I get the feeling there are too many cooks.

Dempster, at the time of getting Heckingbottom in, went on and on about our current structure. And how the new manager must fit into it. Given we have been through three managers since Dempster came in, and that our transfer windows are getting progressively worse, maybe now is the time to break up Dempster’s precious ‘structure’. In any walk life it is difficult to slot new members of staff to a structure, especially at managerial level.

We are now at a seminal stage of Dempster’s tenure at Easter Road. I am the first to admit she has done a fabulous job. However, you only find out how good people are when things start to go wrong. It is early in the season, but signs are things are going wrong at Hibs on all kinds of levels, for example, recruitment, playing style and ultimately results.

Of all the things regarding football in Scotland it is my opinion that in Dempster, Hibs have the best Chief Executive in the country.

If results go tits up in September I hope Dempster has the bottle to make the appropriate and correct choices. Because if she doesn’t, Gordon will relieve her of the role in her structure.

tamig
07-09-2019, 05:46 PM
General consensus on here is we do not have a clue who has ultimate responsibility in signing new players...is it the recruitment team, it is the manager, who has final say on it. This is really confusing, although the way we recruit players is not uncommon and seems to be the way a lot of clubs do it. I get the feeling there are too many cooks.

Dempster, at the time of getting Heckingbottom in, went on and on about our current structure. And how the new manager must fit into it. Given we have been through three managers since Dempster came in, and that our transfer windows are getting progressively worse, maybe now is the time to break up Dempster’s precious ‘structure’. In any walk life it is difficult to slot new members of staff to a structure, especially at managerial level.

We are now at a seminal stage of Dempster’s tenure at Easter Road. I am the first to admit she has done a fabulous job. However, you only find out how good people are when things start to go wrong. It is early in the season, but signs are things are going wrong at Hibs on all kinds of levels, for example, recruitment, playing style and ultimately results.

Of all the things regarding football in Scotland it is my opinion that in Dempster, Hibs have the best Chief Executive in the country.

If results go tits up in September I hope Dempster has the bottle to make the appropriate and correct choices. Because if she doesn’t, Gordon will relieve her of the role in her structure.
The manager has ultimate responsibility and makes the final call on all signings. Just like almost every other club in the UK. And a lot of these clubs have recruitment structures similar to ours. Don’t understand your bashing of LD on this.

Hibees1973
07-09-2019, 05:59 PM
The manager has ultimate responsibility and makes the final call on all signings. Just like almost every other club in the UK. And a lot of these clubs have recruitment structures similar to ours. Don’t understand your bashing of LD on this.
Maybe I was over critical of Dempster. However, given the downturn in our fortunes I feel she should be analysing the jobs done by the recruitment staff, not just that of Heckingbottom. If Mathie is to leave it maybe time for an overhaul of several staff at East Mains, especially as the new recruits from England have not started well at all.

Brooster
08-09-2019, 06:19 AM
Haha you should have seen me after Motherwell

You were last seen getting attacked in the stairwell at halftime. Unprovoked assault.

Baldy Foghorn
08-09-2019, 07:14 AM
You were last seen getting attacked in the stairwell at halftime. Unprovoked assault.

Young tem getting younger......:greengrin