Bigger issues than Hecky?

[Hibee Mac]

Like most I think Heckingbottom needs to go. However, as the title suggests, do we have further underlying issues at the club that go deeper than just a poor manager?

It's amazing how far we have declined in 18 months as a football club, that decline started before Heckingbottom. Our recruitment has been poor for a while now too. Attendances are beginning to slip and fan engagement is not as good as it used to be under Stubbs era and partly Lennon.
Remember the days of Tom Zinelli? He was brilliant but clearly not high enough on the list of priorities for Hibs as a club.

The list could go on...

Yes Heckingbottom must go, but I worry that will not solve our problems as they may be deeper rooted that that.

[Hibeesforever]

Like most I think Heckingbottom needs to go. However, as the title suggests, do we have further underlying issues at the club that go deeper than just a poor manager?

It's amazing how far we have declined in 18 months as a football club, that decline started before Heckingbottom. Our recruitment has been poor for a while now too. Attendances are beginning to slip and fan engagement is not as good as it used to be under Stubbs era and partly Lennon.
Remember the days of Tom Zinelli? He was brilliant but clearly not high enough on the list of priorities for Hibs as a club.

The list could go on...

Yes Heckingbottom must go, but I worry that will not solve our problems as they may be deeper rooted that that.

Comes back to leadership, the owner and CEO need to take responsibility and communicate properly with the fans. The owner has a chance still to buy a couple of players to halt this slide, ball in his court as to whether fans stay onside.

[jeffers]

Like most I think Heckingbottom needs to go. However, as the title suggests, do we have further underlying issues at the club that go deeper than just a poor manager?

It's amazing how far we have declined in 18 months as a football club, that decline started before Heckingbottom. Our recruitment has been poor for a while now too. Attendances are beginning to slip and fan engagement is not as good as it used to be under Stubbs era and partly Lennon.
Remember the days of Tom Zinelli? He was brilliant but clearly not high enough on the list of priorities for Hibs as a club.

The list could go on...

Yes Heckingbottom must go, but I worry that will not solve our problems as they may be deeper rooted that that.

Not having a go at you, but this or similar posts always crop up when the team are poor on the park. No doubt things off field haven't been great recently, but appoint a decent manager, back him to the best of our ability and all the off field stuff becomes far less of an issue.

We've got the managerial appointment badly wrong (not for the first time.) We still have close to our highest ever number of season ticket holders, so the appetite was there and will return IMO with a decent team on the park.

[GreenCastle]

Like most I think Heckingbottom needs to go. However, as the title suggests, do we have further underlying issues at the club that go deeper than just a poor manager?

It's amazing how far we have declined in 18 months as a football club, that decline started before Heckingbottom. Our recruitment has been poor for a while now too. Attendances are beginning to slip and fan engagement is not as good as it used to be under Stubbs era and partly Lennon.
Remember the days of Tom Zinelli? He was brilliant but clearly not high enough on the list of priorities for Hibs as a club.

The list could go on...

Yes Heckingbottom must go, but I worry that will not solve our problems as they may be deeper rooted that that.

I do feel the club have taken their eye of the ball in several areas.

Of course if we were doing well on the pitch it wouldn’t be as obvious but I feel as a fan we are being taking for granted.

The fans rep - Kieran is putting up a brave fight trying to answer issues but I don’t see much change and just a lot of lip service.

We can’t get the basics right like entry to the stadium and basic match day experience what hope do we have?

Other areas of the club need looked at also but with a lot of stubbornness in people in jobs that are untouchable then questions should be asked.

Too many staff comfortable and ideally we would find someone to review everyone and get the best staff in for the jobs both in the club and community foundation.

[Cataplana]

There seem to be an awful lot of worriers at the moment. The club has had fantastic attendances in the past few seasons, has put our city rivals into a tailspin of despair, and yet some are trying to say we are in a mess?

What's it all about Paddy?

[A Hi-Bee]

Like most I think Heckingbottom needs to go. However, as the title suggests, do we have further underlying issues at the club that go deeper than just a poor manager?

It's amazing how far we have declined in 18 months as a football club, that decline started before Heckingbottom. Our recruitment has been poor for a while now too. Attendances are beginning to slip and fan engagement is not as good as it used to be under Stubbs era and partly Lennon.
Remember the days of Tom Zinelli? He was brilliant but clearly not high enough on the list of priorities for Hibs as a club.

The list could go on...

Yes Heckingbottom must go, but I worry that will not solve our problems as they may be deeper rooted that that.

Hit the nail on the head Mac, things are not right down E.R. way and people are still making big money while we dither and slid down once more.

[hibbie02]

There seem to be an awful lot of worriers at the moment. The club has had fantastic attendances in the past few seasons, has put our city rivals into a tailspin of despair, and yet some are trying to say we are in a mess?

What's it all about Paddy?

Are you for real? Heetz are in their own mess of their own making. Yes we have had fantastic attendances IN THE PAST. That should have helped us as a club, but the money and good will have been pished away this year. The product on the pitch is poor, the focus of the Board seems to be on training pitches and community projects, which is all well and good when we are doing well but we are not. People have reasons to worry. If you're not, you are deluded.

[Viva_Palmeiras]

I do feel the club have taken their eye of the ball in several areas.

Of course if we were doing well on the pitch it wouldn’t be as obvious but I feel as a fan we are being taking for granted.

The fans rep - Kieran is putting up a brave fight trying to answer issues but I don’t see much change and just a lot of lip service.

We can’t get the basics right like entry to the stadium and basic match day experience what hope do we have?

Other areas of the club need looked at also but with a lot of stubbornness in people in jobs that are untouchable then questions should be asked.

Too many staff comfortable and ideally we would find someone to review everyone and get the best staff in for the jobs both in the club and community foundation.


If you’re local why not get involved with Working Together? Or maybe you are already doing so to get such insights about staff being comfortable?

[Keith_M]

Most of these 'issues' are when certain groups don't get what they want and call LD stubborn. The only genuine issues I know of are as follows:


Like many other clubs, we're having problems with a new ticketing system - Big deal, it'll get sorted

Poor food/service at the snack bars - Come on, just how major is that in the grand scheme of things?



We own a fully completed stadium, with a decent training ground and have NO debt.

The only real issues of any importance are what's happening on the park.

[Captain Trips]

No I think the problems on this occasion are mostly on the pitch.

[blackpoolhibs]

Sort the team out, give us a team that challenges for Europe and nobody will give a toss if the turnstiles are poor, or we have nobody to sell the golden goal tickets.

[Henderson2Del]

What about the major failings in the commercial side?

To say the budget is spent and turning down sponsorship deals just don’t add up.


Most of these 'issues' are when certain groups don't get what they want and call LD stubborn. The only genuine issues I know of are as follows:


Like many other clubs, we're having problems with a new ticketing system - Big deal, it'll get sorted

Poor food/service at the snack bars - Come on, just how major is that in the grand scheme of things?



We own a fully completed stadium, with a decent training ground and have NO debt.

The only real issues of any importance are what's happening on the park.

[Since452]

Starting to wonder why Appleton said thanks but no thanks. You'd think he'd have walked to Edinburgh for the job

[Davy Mac]

What about the major failings in the commercial side?

To say the budget is spent and turning down sponsorship deals just don’t add up.


Correct, LD is no Commercial Manager that's for sure, very re-active in this area in my opinion and wont listen to good advice from experienced people.

Lacks warmth, approachability and lacks assertiveness particularly when it comes to the catering etc.

[SlickShoes]

This thread reminds me of around the time we got relegated and there was a witch hunt for Tam McCourt because people were just looking for anyone to blame.

The problems at hibs are on the pitch and in the dugout, everything else is about as good as it's ever been. The food has always been beyond terrible and everyone is having ticketing issues with the new tech.

[Henderson2Del]

Do you genuinely believe this?

we have no shirt sponsor, half of the advertising boards are available to sponsor and a high number of forthcoming games needs sponsors.

The much talked about NHS deal seems dead, our in stadium bookie kiosks aren’t renting out and this all reduces income. We are told the budget is done but we are not maximising our potential.





This thread reminds me of around the time we got relegated and there was a witch hunt for Tam McCourt because people were just looking for anyone to blame.

The problems at hibs are on the pitch and in the dugout, everything else is about as good as it's ever been. The food has always been beyond terrible and everyone is having ticketing issues with the new tech.

[Smartie]

This thread reminds me of around the time we got relegated and there was a witch hunt for Tam McCourt because people were just looking for anyone to blame.

The problems at hibs are on the pitch and in the dugout, everything else is about as good as it's ever been. The food has always been beyond terrible and everyone is having ticketing issues with the new tech.

I agree - other than on the pitch, folk are making too much out of minor gripes.

The reason we should be so unhappy about the team and the manager is because the other stuff has been so good for so long. We're set up to have a good team and manager and we don't.

All of these other issues will sort themselves out one way or another.

[green day]

Starting to wonder why Appleton said thanks but no thanks. You'd think he'd have walked to Edinburgh for the job

That was clarified months ago

[The 90+2]

I agree - other than on the pitch, folk are making too much out of minor gripes.

The reason we should be so unhappy about the team and the manager is because the other stuff has been so good for so long. We're set up to have a good team and manager and we don't.

All of these other issues will sort themselves out one way or another.

To be fair it’s a massive issue the club failed to find a shirt sponsor.

[BILLYHIBS]

Starting to wonder why Appleton said thanks but no thanks. You'd think he'd have walked to Edinburgh for the job

Discussions broke down on his Severance Package before he even joined us

Simples!

[eastmainsmsh]

Ron needs to come out and state his intentions instead of having leann trying to play the Peruvian panpipes

[Smartie]

To be fair it’s a massive issue the club failed to find a shirt sponsor.

It is, I'll give you that.

But how unreasonable is it? I'm led to believe Marathonbet were expected to take up an extension and only let Hibs know at the last minute they weren't taking it. On the back foot from then on, Hibs had to sort something and decided to go with the community thing.

Costly yes, but it sounds unfortunate rather than culpable from those at Hibs.

Do we know how much a year without a shirt sponsor is likely to cost us? Is the amount of money how far we are away from being a good team?

[Since452]

That was clarified months ago

Was it though? Nobody has confirmed it was because of a severance package. Find it strange that a guy out of work would turn down one of the biggest jobs in Scotland because of a severance package. He was quoted as saying he will continue looking for a club that shares the same ambition as him after he walked away

[Barney McGrew]

The problems at hibs are on the pitch and in the dugout, everything else is about as good as it's ever been

With respect, if you think our commercial activities are as good as they’ve ever been then you’re living in cloud cuckoo land.

We’re light years behind our closest rivals in that side of the business, and like it or not all the income generated has a direct impact on what’s on the pitch. No money coming in means no money to spend on the squad. The marketing from the club that was very strong for years is almost non-existent and we’ve seen a lot of people leave over the last few years to go elsewhere, many of whom in my experience dealing with were very very good. We seem now to have a Sales and Sponsorship department who aren’t achieving either.

It needs sorted pronto, or we’ll find the gaps between the Aberdeen’s and Hertz of this world in off the field activity will continue to grow.

[superfurryhibby]

Whilst the received information seems to be that the club have spent plenty of money this window, I have my doubts. All guesswork, just like the supposed 350,000k for Doidge, but I can’t help thinking that the previous ownership didn’t invest as much in the current window as they have done in recent seasons. Stands to reason really, doesn’t it?

The commercial side of the club does seem to have been less robust this year too, the shirt sponsor fiasco etc.

Usually new owners make investment in the playing side, it’s a statement of intent thing. Has wee Ron really done this? I think not.

The calibre of signing this window says a lot to me, the off the field “ issues”, well maybe there is room for improvement there too, but it’s the football that really matters to me.

[Captain Trips]

Lets say there are many other issues ok the point is PH was given the ammunition to go ahead and assemble a team that should:

Be going to Ibrox and making a game of it and making Sevco work, 6-1 is unacceptable.
Being strong at home taking the game to the opposition.
Not being gubbed by Motherwell with no answers.

There shouldn't be these big issues on the pitch but there are and they are not looking like being resolved as from the St Johnstone game you think that was a warning and it was not taken.

[SlickShoes]

Usually new owners make investment in the playing side, it’s a statement of intent thing. Has wee Ron really done this? I think not.



He paid off all of our debt. Most of the players were already in place and so was a relatively new manager, it would be stupid to throw money at the situation when you are just in the door.

The amount of money we have we will always be shopping in the leagues below the championship level of England because without an actual billionaire funding us we can't afford anything close to what fees are being paid in that league and wages they pay even in League 1 sometimes. People think because we have a few hundred thousand a year more than other teams its going to open up some sort of massive gap.

[The 90+2]

It is, I'll give you that.

But how unreasonable is it? I'm led to believe Marathonbet were expected to take up an extension and only let Hibs know at the last minute they weren't taking it. On the back foot from then on, Hibs had to sort something and decided to go with the community thing.

Costly yes, but it sounds unfortunate rather than culpable from those at Hibs.

Do we know how much a year without a shirt sponsor is likely to cost us? Is the amount of money how far we are away from being a good team?

There should always be a back up for the main club sponsor. I’ve no idea how much it’s costing us but it’s shocking regardless and just looks unprofessional.

Then we have the “recruitment team” who don’t actually recruit the players under the last 2 head coaches when we were told the players coming in was all to do with succession planning playing a specific way, not three year deals to lower league journeymen on the say so of a guy who’s never been in Scottish football. What’s the point in employing them?

[The 90+2]

He paid off all of our debt. Most of the players were already in place and so was a relatively new manager, it would be stupid to throw money at the situation when you are just in the door.

The amount of money we have we will always be shopping in the leagues below the championship level of England because without an actual billionaire funding us we can't afford anything close to what fees are being paid in that league and wages they pay even in League 1 sometimes. People think because we have a few hundred thousand a year more than other teams its going to open up some sort of massive gap.

You know what happens next season eh? Tickets will be down and we will be trying to pay off the players on long deals or loaning them out after sacking Hecky and we will be told to be patient because there’s less money to spend but back the team as success is right around the corner.

[Sioux]

Correct, LD is no Commercial Manager that's for sure, very re-active in this area in my opinion and wont listen to good advice from experienced people.

Lacks warmth, approachability and lacks assertiveness particularly when it comes to the catering etc.

Anything else you want to make up?

[HibeeHibernian4]

What happens off the pitch at Hibs is always far more important than what happens on it. Has been the case since we won the Scottish Cup in 2016. Some Hibs fans work themselves into such a state over whether we finish 5th or 6th — it surprises me.

I would rather have a club who weren’t “successful” (which by some people’s metric is finishing third and having zero silverware to show for it) but looked after their fans properly. Respect and keep the traditions of our club in tact (stadium, colours, name etc) and reduce season ticket and matchday ticket prices drastically to make us accessible for the community. No adult or their child should be priced out of going to Easter Road.

While that might be a bit wishful to some, on the smaller fan issues such as loyalty points and safe standing, Dempster has failed miserably. Stubbornly dug herself in on the wrong (and unpopular) side of debates and now won’t change her mind.

Hibs fans, like supporters of every other British club, have their loyalty routinely taken for granted in the name of money. We as a community founded this club and yet we now have to pay £400+ for the privilege of watching them play 19 times a season. This isn’t limited to football, marketisation of almost everything is sadly now a reality. Universities were once establishments in which people could learn and help better society with their knowledge. Nowadays it is a gravy train and your degree is viewed on its monetary worth.

I believe that this model is built on sand and will eventually crumble. We’ve seen it with Bury and Bolton in the past few weeks, it is unsustainable to be paying people the sort of wages that football clubs do. We need to get back to basics and look to countries like Germany, where clubs are run by the people, for the people.

Some people don’t think about the bigger picture here, but for me whatever problems we have with PH are a drop in the ocean compared to the problems us (and modern football more widely) have.

[andyf5]

Correct, LD is no Commercial Manager that's for sure, very re-active in this area in my opinion and wont listen to good advice from experienced people.

Lacks warmth, approachability and lacks assertiveness particularly when it comes to the catering etc.

Ive heard LD speak on a few occassions and she was the complete opposite to your description. Overall doing a good job imho.

[Davy Mac]

Anything else you want to make up?

Sorry, I don't know you. why would I make this up?

Have you had any dealings with her like?

[Coco Bryce]

Like most I think Heckingbottom needs to go. However, as the title suggests, do we have further underlying issues at the club that go deeper than just a poor manager?

It's amazing how far we have declined in 18 months as a football club, that decline started before Heckingbottom. Our recruitment has been poor for a while now too. Attendances are beginning to slip and fan engagement is not as good as it used to be under Stubbs era and partly Lennon.
Remember the days of Tom Zinelli? He was brilliant but clearly not high enough on the list of priorities for Hibs as a club.

The list could go on...

Yes Heckingbottom must go, but I worry that will not solve our problems as they may be deeper rooted that that.

Everyone seems to be jumping ship right enough. Lennon, Petrie, STF, the two commercial people can't mind their names, rumours of LD getting a new gig.

Something's clearly not right.

[Fogzie]

Everyone seems to be jumping ship right enough. Lennon, Petrie, STF, the two commercial people can't mind their names, rumours of LD getting a new gig.

Something's clearly not right.

Unless HMRC were after us, why would the people you mention all have jumped ship? They were all in charge

[Jim44]

Discussions broke down on his Severance Package before he even joined us

Simples!

........ which gives us some hope that PH accepted a lowish severance package which will ease the financial pain when he eventually leaves. Remember that he is quoted as saying that “ a manager’s situation is only as strong as the value of his severance package.” ..... or words to that effect.

[Eaststand]

Sorry, I don't know you. why would I make this up?

Have you had any dealings with her like?

I've had dealings with her and your description is well off the mark bud.
She's very good at what she does for us and we'd be very hard pushed to find somebody better. I reckon we're lucky to have her at our club.

GGTTH

[Nutmegged]

It all started with the loss of Lennon, I was a buge fan of his and he was a leader that could've continued taking the club forward, fully appreciate the loss of form, it was dire at the time but with the loss of McGinn, McGeouch, Allan and Jamie MacLaren his task was always going to be tough, I know MacLaren came back but he was nowhere near the same player, lacked fitness and the quality of midfield behind him.

We were never going to bring in like for like replacements for the quality that we lost from the 2017-18 squad so our only hope was to nurture the new players and hopefully they developed into players of that standard, I still believed we'd have finished in the top half last season, the results Heckingbottom got with Lennon's squad showed we had the the talent capable but I'm convinced the club didn't have the ambition to hang with Lennon longterm so allowed things to fester.

Heckingbottom talks a good game and can be ludicrously over dramatic at times too, if Lennon said some of the things he said the papers would've had a field day but he lacks that positive aura, I don't believe in him and I don't think I'm in a minoroty either, when we had Lennon I felt we could win every single game we went into, no fears be it Celtic Park, Ibrox, Tynecastle or Hampden, we didn't always get a good result but we always went there confident, and now under Heckingbottom? hide behind the couch time.

[Heisenberg]

It all started with the loss of Lennon, I was a buge fan of his and he was a leader that could've continued taking the club forward, fully appreciate the loss of form, it was dire at the time but with the loss of McGinn, McGeouch, Allan and Jamie MacLaren his task was always going to be tough, I know MacLaren came back but he was nowhere near the same player, lacked fitness and the quality of midfield behind him.

We were never going to bring in like for like replacements for the quality that we lost from the 2017-18 squad so our only hope was to nurture the new players and hopefully they developed into players of that standard, I still believed we'd have finished in the top half last season, the results Heckingbottom got with Lennon's squad showed we had the the talent capable but I'm convinced the club didn't have the ambition to hang with Lennon longterm so allowed things to fester.

Heckingbottom talks a good game and can be ludicrously over dramatic at times too, if Lennon said some of the things he said the papers would've had a field day but he lacks that positive aura, I don't believe in him and I don't think I'm in a minoroty either, when we had Lennon I felt we could win every single game we went into, no fears be it Celtic Park, Ibrox, Tynecastle or Hampden, we didn't always get a good result but we always went there confident, and now under Heckingbottom? hide behind the couch time.

While I fully appreciate that Lennon had us producing some unbelievable football for 6 months, I can’t say I was sad to see him leave. He’d lost it at Hibs. Constantly ridiculous team selections and placing blame fully on the players (usually Flo) led to an awful run that he didn’t look capable of fixing.

Heckingbottom is proving now that he isn’t the answer and whoever posted that the good run after he came in could be more attributed to Lennon leaving than his management could be right. It was also a backs to the wall situation with the small group of players we had available for selection due to injury.

Recruitment has been rotten since we were in the championship minus a couple of quality additions. That area needs addressed.

[The Modfather]

It all started with the loss of Lennon, I was a buge fan of his and he was a leader that could've continued taking the club forward, fully appreciate the loss of form, it was dire at the time but with the loss of McGinn, McGeouch, Allan and Jamie MacLaren his task was always going to be tough, I know MacLaren came back but he was nowhere near the same player, lacked fitness and the quality of midfield behind him.

We were never going to bring in like for like replacements for the quality that we lost from the 2017-18 squad so our only hope was to nurture the new players and hopefully they developed into players of that standard, I still believed we'd have finished in the top half last season, the results Heckingbottom got with Lennon's squad showed we had the the talent capable but I'm convinced the club didn't have the ambition to hang with Lennon longterm so allowed things to fester.

Heckingbottom talks a good game and can be ludicrously over dramatic at times too, if Lennon said some of the things he said the papers would've had a field day but he lacks that positive aura, I don't believe in him and I don't think I'm in a minoroty either, when we had Lennon I felt we could win every single game we went into, no fears be it Celtic Park, Ibrox, Tynecastle or Hampden, we didn't always get a good result but we always went there confident, and now under Heckingbottom? hide behind the couch time.

I never had any confidence going to Tynecastle under Lennon, nor playing Aberdeen, and to a lesser extent St Johnstone. The narrative that Hibs somehow weren’t able to match the ambition of Lennon doesn’t bare scrutiny. Lennon himself wasn’t able to match was own supposed ambition as Hibs manager.

[McD]

Was it though? Nobody has confirmed it was because of a severance package. Find it strange that a guy out of work would turn down one of the biggest jobs in Scotland because of a severance package. He was quoted as saying he will continue looking for a club that shares the same ambition as him after he walked away


What did you expect him to say?

“I’ll continue looking for a club that will give me a huge payoff when I fail”?

[Nutmegged]

I never had any confidence going to Tynecastle under Lennon, nor playing Aberdeen, and to a lesser extent St Johnstone. The narrative that Hibs somehow weren’t able to match the ambition of Lennon doesn’t bare scrutiny. Lennon himself wasn’t able to match was own supposed ambition as Hibs manager.


Highest Finish in 10 years, record point total, regularly swatting the big two and holding our own against Hearts, we were robbed of a win at Tynecastle, I think his record there was P5 W0 D3 L2 but not once did I go there not believing we could get something, the 2-1 game was what it was, at 1-1 we'd normally be the team jn the ascendancy but because it was must win for us a draw was never going to be enough, by comparison, this was Hearts only game left going into the split, their whole focus and attention was on stopping us.

As for Aberdeen, like it or not but they're the benchmark for clubs like Hibs, McInnes has been there for six years and has established them as a top three side, they won't alwwys finish in the top three but more often than not they will, so of course they would've been one of our hardest fixtures, they saw us as the club who wanted their spot.

The difference is when they go through a bad patch, and last year they were hovering around 7th for a good while, their board won't pull the trigger on him and he gets more stick off his fans than Lennon ever got off Hibs fans.

[Nutmegged]

While I fully appreciate that Lennon had us producing some unbelievable football for 6 months, I can’t say I was sad to see him leave. He’d lost it at Hibs. Constantly ridiculous team selections and placing blame fully on the players (usually Flo) led to an awful run that he didn’t look capable of fixing.

Heckingbottom is proving now that he isn’t the answer and whoever posted that the good run after he came in could be more attributed to Lennon leaving than his management could be right. It was also a backs to the wall situation with the small group of players we had available for selection due to injury.

Recruitment has been rotten since we were in the championship minus a couple of quality additions. That area needs addressed.

I think a lot of people, myself included allowed ourselves not to be too bothered when Lennon left, I don't think he'd lost it at Hibs though, I just think he needed time to properly rebuild, it's impossible to replace what we lost at the end of 2017-18 in one window, the fact that he went out and got Scott Allan on a pre-contract gave a little insight into how he was going to go about addressing what we needed.

He probably was overly harsh on Kamberi, MacLaren wasn't anywhere near fit, he lost that midfield trinity that made us so exciting and Flo was phoning it in so he gets it in the neck for still being at Hibs and being fit enough to actually make a difference, it seems to be a trait of his and probably why he's with us.

Recruitment has been an issue, the latest scatter gun approach of signing English League 1 & 2 players was always going to be a disaster and highlights for me how little Heckingbottom understands our game

[Crab apple]

I think the biggest and most immediate issue is have we got the right manager. I don’t think we have.

[The Modfather]

Highest Finish in 10 years, record point total, regularly swatting the big two and holding our own against Hearts, we were robbed of a win at Tynecastle, I think his record there was P5 W0 D3 L2 but not once did I go there not believing we could get something, the 2-1 game was what it was, at 1-1 we'd normally be the team jn the ascendancy but because it was must win for us a draw was never going to be enough, by comparison, this was Hearts only game left going into the split, their whole focus and attention was on stopping us.

As for Aberdeen, like it or not but they're the benchmark for clubs like Hibs, McInnes has been there for six years and has established them as a top three side, they won't alwwys finish in the top three but more often than not they will, so of course they would've been one of our hardest fixtures, they saw us as the club who wanted their spot.

The difference is when they go through a bad patch, and last year they were hovering around 7th for a good while, their board won't pull the trigger on him and he gets more stick off his fans than Lennon ever got off Hibs fans.

Agree with a lot of what you say, especially about Aberdeen.I just felt he struggled up against McInnes, Tommy Wright and Levein at Tynecastle. Nothing outrageous in that in itself, it’s just then a bit difficult to correlate to the talk about Hibs not matching Lennons ambitions. I would expect more future managers than not to achieve a 4th place finish, which would be a good finish but not earth shattering.

Lennon inherited a good squad, took it up a level or two for a season, then when it was dismantled left an imbalanced squad with little quality. In the same way as Heckingbottom, I didn’t have trust in Lennon in the transfer market.

[The 90+2]

What did you expect him to say?

“I’ll continue looking for a club that will give me a huge payoff when I fail”?

What he did say is he didn’t want to come across as arrogant by revealing why he turned it down. That doesn’t seem to indicate payoff issues being the main part.

[Cataplana]

Interesting comments, but a lot of them seem to be unsubstantiated and are based on the writers own experiences, or perceptions.

If this was Wikipedia, a lot of them would be littered with "citation needed." It's not to say they aren't touching in the truth though.(citation needed)

I think people really need to get hard and fast information before panicking myself. As far as I can see Hibs have performed rather well since Leanne arrived, with attendances as good as they have been since the 70s.

Perhaps her low profile approach is much more effective than people realise?

[Captain Trips]

The issues are on pitch. Things off pitch do not detract from tactics and decent tools to do job nor does it detract from piss poor play from players who know better.

[tamig]

The issues are on pitch. Things off pitch do not detract from tactics and decent tools to do job nor does it detract from piss poor play from players who know better.

Well said.

[Not So Young]

Most of these 'issues' are when certain groups don't get what they want and call LD stubborn. The only genuine issues I know of are as follows:


Like many other clubs, we're having problems with a new ticketing system - Big deal, it'll get sorted

Poor food/service at the snack bars - Come on, just how major is that in the grand scheme of things?



We own a fully completed stadium, with a decent training ground and have NO debt.

The only real issues of any importance are what's happening on the park.

Pretty much nails it for me

Get the product on the park right and everything else is just a hiccup

[B.H.F.C]

What happens off the pitch at Hibs is always far more important than what happens on it.

Should never be the case. We’re a football club first and foremost and success on the pitch sees everything else take care of itself. There is no point in us merely surviving, because if that’s the case nobody (outwith the traditional hardcore support) will actually watch or engage with the club.

[MrSmith]

Our game against hearts will determine change in the club. Hearts are as poor as us but I fully expect a drubbing from them given our tippy tappy sideways backwards play. They are physical and we have surrendered! I hate saying the what I have but cannot see anything from this manager or team to change my mind. If we do get a drubbing, fans will flock off in their thousands and all the work done to entice them back, will be undone. Think about this LD & Ron.

[Cataplana]

Our game against hearts will determine change in the club. Hearts are as poor as us but I fully expect a drubbing from them given our tippy tappy sideways backwards play. They are physical and we have surrendered! I hate saying the what I have but cannot see anything from this manager or team to change my mind. If we do get a drubbing, fans will flock off in their thousands and all the work done to entice them back, will be undone. Think about this LD & Ron.

It's a results based business, it really doesn't matter how good or bad things are off the pitch, people are attracted by a winning team on the park.

[Since452]

Our game against hearts will determine change in the club. Hearts are as poor as us but I fully expect a drubbing from them given our tippy tappy sideways backwards play. They are physical and we have surrendered! I hate saying the what I have but cannot see anything from this manager or team to change my mind. If we do get a drubbing, fans will flock off in their thousands and all the work done to entice them back, will be undone. Think about this LD & Ron.

Luckiy for us Hearts aren't capable of drubbing anyone. I expect us to win the derby

[Hibs4185]

If we had had an amazing start to the season then the chat would be about our fantastic new owner, LD is the best CEO in the country etc etc, but due to a few iffy signings and a terrible style of football, it’s a total Armageddon.

Players that we know and trust are struggling never mind the new signings.

Get rid of the manager and the rest will fall back into place.

[hibbydog]

Someone has to take responsibility for signing so many players that have no experience of the Scottish game.

How many have previous experience of the premier league in Scotland? 2 out of 10?

I know these players might come good eventually, but it’s way too risky to gamble on so many SPL rookies, and a major factor in our poor start.

So the recruitment team need looking at

[Blurhibee]

We should have never got rid of Neil lennon the man was a winner and didn't except anything less than 2nd best, there was players who were too soft who couldn't except that which Neil couldn't except which now has us in the situation we are in. Really disappointing we are in this situation

[supermcginn]

We should have never got rid of Neil lennon the man was a winner and didn't except anything less than 2nd best, there was players who were too soft who couldn't except that which Neil couldn't except which now has us in the situation we are in. Really disappointing we are in this situation

Lol a winner who had us 8th

[bingo70]

We should have never got rid of Neil lennon the man was a winner and didn't except anything less than 2nd best, there was players who were too soft who couldn't except that which Neil couldn't except which now has us in the situation we are in. Really disappointing we are in this situation

https://www.nottheoldfirm.com/news/davie-provan-makes-bizarre-hibs-management-claim/

[McD]

We should have never got rid of Neil lennon the man was a winner and didn't except anything less than 2nd best, there was players who were too soft who couldn't except that which Neil couldn't except which now has us in the situation we are in. Really disappointing we are in this situation


Stretching the truth here a fair bit. You don’t whine about quitting twice when your team doesn’t get a result, largely because of your own poor tactics, if you’re a winner.

NL was good for Hibs in many ways, as Hibs were for him. There was many fans pushing for his removal before it came

[Heisenberg]

We should have never got rid of Neil lennon the man was a winner and didn't except anything less than 2nd best, there was players who were too soft who couldn't except that which Neil couldn't except which now has us in the situation we are in. Really disappointing we are in this situation

Just because Heckingbottom is struggling now doesn’t mean we should’ve kept Neil Lennon. Lennon had a rotten summer transfer window last season as well and had us only going one way after guiding us to 8th.

[Michael]

Lennon had to go when he did - his first two seasons were great though.

I don't think there's too much wrong at the club as a whole - but I think the manager probably has far too much influence on signings. Hecky might not be that bad as a manager - he's just not got a good eye for a player (which would be fine if we didn't give him such a large say in these matters).

[bingo70]

Lennon had to go when he did - his first two seasons were great though.

I don't think there's too much wrong at the club as a whole - but I think the manager probably has far too much influence on signings. Hecky might not be that bad as a manager - he's just not got a good eye for a player (which would be fine if we didn't give him such a large say in these matters).

His first season wasn’t great.

Got the job done but it wasn’t great.

[B.H.F.C]

Lennon had to go when he did - his first two seasons were great though.

I don't think there's too much wrong at the club as a whole - but I think the manager probably has far too much influence on signings. Hecky might not be that bad as a manager - he's just not got a good eye for a player (which would be fine if we didn't give him such a large say in these matters).

IMO, the manager should a absolutely be the main influence on the signings. He is the one who has to work out how to fit them together at the end of the day. And if he can’t, which he isn’t at the moment, he’ll get the sack.

Managers are only as good as their players, so if they can’t spot one, they’re basically screwed.

[The 90+2]

We should have never got rid of Neil lennon the man was a winner and didn't except anything less than 2nd best, there was players who were too soft who couldn't except that which Neil couldn't except which now has us in the situation we are in. Really disappointing we are in this situation

Lennon was a **** come the end and it’s great he left. We didn’t get rid either, he made himself unemployable.

[Broken Gnome]

Is it just the sackable results that have kept Lennon from the same widely-rumoured 'other circumstances' logic that saw Stubbs moved on?

[Michael]

Is it just the sackable results that have kept Lennon from the same widely-rumoured 'other circumstances' logic that saw Stubbs moved on?

I'd say there was far more 'other circumstance' talk with Lennon compared to Stubbs. Lennon was suspended for a couple days which added even more fuel.

[One Day Soon]

We should have never got rid of Neil lennon the man was a winner and didn't except anything less than 2nd best, there was players who were too soft who couldn't except that which Neil couldn't except which now has us in the situation we are in. Really disappointing we are in this situation

I thought Lennon was excellent. Levein is crap though and Hearts are utterly minging.Wouldn't you agree?

[Broken Gnome]

I'd say there was far more 'other circumstance' talk with Lennon compared to Stubbs. Lennon was suspended for a couple days which added even more fuel.

Not now seemingly, often just reverts to results. Makes it an utter waste of time for someone like Davie Proven to make out we should've stuck with him.

[Cataplana]

Not now seemingly, often just reverts to results. Makes it an utter waste of time for someone like Davie Proven to make out we should've stuck with him.

Man is a knobber, and is ignoring the sacking had nothing to do with results.

[MrSmith]

Wasn't it a mutual agreement with Hibs and Lennon? I'm sure it was all set up to ensure easy passage to Celtic.

[FilipinoHibs]

His first season wasn’t great.

Got the job done but it wasn’t great.

First half of second season poor too as was third season. So in 3 seasons he had half a good season and mainly because we had McGinn, Dylan and Scott in midfield firing up Flo or McLaren.

[B.H.F.C]

First half of second season poor too as was third season. So in 3 seasons he had half a good season and mainly because we had McGinn, Dylan and Scott in midfield firing up Flo or McLaren.

Always read that the first half of the first season back up was poor and it wasn’t. We won at Ibrox, beat Hearts and had a brilliant performance at Parkhead. It was a wee bit mixed but I’d settle for us being that poor now.

[ancient hibee]

First half of second season poor too as was third season. So in 3 seasons he had half a good season and mainly because we had McGinn, Dylan and Scott in midfield firing up Flo or McLaren.

And having these players was nothing to do with Lennon?

[My_Wife_Camille]

It is, I'll give you that.

But how unreasonable is it? I'm led to believe Marathonbet were expected to take up an extension and only let Hibs know at the last minute they weren't taking it. On the back foot from then on, Hibs had to sort something and decided to go with the community thing.

Costly yes, but it sounds unfortunate rather than culpable from those at Hibs.

Do we know how much a year without a shirt sponsor is likely to cost us? Is the amount of money how far we are away from being a good team?
Marathonbet notified Hibs of their intention to pull out of the deal in October 2018, 8 months before the end of the season. Their most recent deal was worth £250kp/a

GM being back in the interim is a huge boost. Hopefully he finds himself back for the long term.

[Badge]

Marathonbet notified Hibs of their intention to pull out of the deal in October 2018, 8 months before the end of the season. Their most recent deal was worth £250kp/a

GM being back in the interim is a huge boost. Hopefully he finds himself back for the long term.
Who is GM?

[Alex Trager]

Marathonbet notified Hibs of their intention to pull out of the deal in October 2018, 8 months before the end of the season. Their most recent deal was worth £250kp/a

GM being back in the interim is a huge boost. Hopefully he finds himself back for the long term.

Who’s GM and what does he do?

[Henderson2Del]

GM is gregg mailer. Previously at hibs andi think is back in a consultancy basis. Garry O’Hagan May also be back

[Alex Trager]

GM is gregg mailer. Previously at hibs andi think is back in a consultancy basis. Garry O’Hagan May also be back

What does he do?

[My_Wife_Camille]

Who’s GM and what does he do?
Greig Mailer. He was head of marketing and commercial (can’t remember the exact title).

[Alex Trager]

Greig Mailer. He was head of marketing and commercial (can’t remember the exact title).

I see. When was he before?
Wonder why he left

[My_Wife_Camille]

I see. When was he before?
Wonder why he left
Not sure about exact dates but his time at Hibs more or less coincided with us getting relegated up until we got promoted.

He left for a well deserved step up to the SFA

[Alex Trager]

Not sure about exact dates but his time at Hibs more or less coincided with us getting relegated up until we got promoted.

He left for a well deserved step up to the SFA

I see.
Well here’s hoping he remains here

[Billy Whizz]

Not sure about exact dates but his time at Hibs more or less coincided with us getting relegated up until we got promoted.

He left for a well deserved step up to the SFA

Joined after we got relegated. Was the brains and the drive behind the “Persevere” tour after we won the Big Cup

[Greenworld]

Greig Mailer. He was head of marketing and commercial (can’t remember the exact title).Has there been any announcement on this

Sent from my SM-G903F using Tapatalk

[My_Wife_Camille]

Has there been any announcement on this

Sent from my SM-G903F using Tapatalk
Not to my knowledge, no

[FilipinoHibs]

And having these players was nothing to do with Lennon?

McGinn and Dylan Stubbs signings.

[Henderson2Del]

Not to my knowledge, no

I think at the moment it’s a contracted consultant so I wouldn’t really expect an announcement??

[oldbutdim]

GM is gregg mailer. Previously at hibs andi think is back in a consultancy basis. Garry O’Hagan May also be back

Is he not fulfilling a role at Kilmarnock now?

[Vault Boy]

Is he not fulfilling a role at Kilmarnock now?

You're thinking of Graeme Mathie, who is still with us. Paper talk a few weeks back that he was front of the queue for a DoF position at Killie.

[Jamesie]

What I still can't get my head round is how Hecky can go from having, I think, the second best start to a Hibs managerial career in history (Hugh Shaw being the first) to where we find ourselves now in such a short period of time. Bit of a mystery to me. It's actually probably weirder than the 1997/98 season where Jim Duffy had a phenomenal start to the term only for us to end up relegated.