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angus hibby
18-08-2019, 09:13 AM
That’s our record this season and seems a good few of our “support” want Heckingbottom out....

Absolutely ridiculous.

I’ll settle for that win ratio throughout the season.

DarlingtonHibee
18-08-2019, 09:15 AM
That’s our record this season and seems a good few of our “support” want Heckingbottom out....����*♂️

Absolutely ridiculous.

I’ll settle for that win ratio throughout the season.

I agree with you, but you'll never win the argument.

Sammy7nil
18-08-2019, 09:23 AM
That’s our record this season and seems a good few of our “support” want Heckingbottom out....

Absolutely ridiculous.

I’ll settle for that win ratio throughout the season.

You have to take account of the quality of the opposition, the performances and the hope for the future.

Black and white it is a great record scratch below the surface and there are issues.

The truth probably lies some where in between the extremes on this board.

Right now no Hibs fans would relish an away trip anywhere let alone Ibrox, Celtic Park, Tyncastle which would strike a good deal of fear in most.

The 90+2
18-08-2019, 09:24 AM
This thread won’t lead to more arguing or anything.

weecounty hibby
18-08-2019, 09:26 AM
Yay, a positive thread. I will predict it lasting about 10 posts max. Good on you for trying though. You are right as well we're no where near as bad as a select few on here would have you believe

bingo70
18-08-2019, 09:26 AM
You have to take account of the quality of the opposition, the performances and the hope for the future.

Black and white it is a great record scratch below the surface and there are issues.

The truth probably lies some where in between the extremes on this board.

Right now no Hibs fans would relish an away trip anywhere let alone Ibrox, Celtic Park, Tyncastle which would strike a good deal of fear in most.

Spot on, completely agree with everything you say.

The 90+2
18-08-2019, 09:28 AM
Yay, a positive thread. I will predict it lasting about 10 posts max. Good on you for trying though. You are right as well we're no where near as bad as a select few on here would have you believe

You’ve already spoiled the positivity with a negative attitude.

weecounty hibby
18-08-2019, 09:30 AM
You’ve already spoiled the positivity with a negative attitude.

A negative attitude to the negativity equals a positive!!😉

flash
18-08-2019, 09:34 AM
This thread won’t lead to more arguing or anything.

I know. It supports the team. Plenty people not going to stand for that.

FilipinoHibs
18-08-2019, 09:35 AM
That’s our record this season and seems a good few of our “support” want Heckingbottom out....

Absolutely ridiculous.

I’ll settle for that win ratio throughout the season.

I heard we once had a manager with 1 in 13 and there was not a beep from fans.

04Sauzee
18-08-2019, 09:39 AM
That’s our record this season and seems a good few of our “support” want Heckingbottom out....

Absolutely ridiculous.

I’ll settle for that win ratio throughout the season.
Agreed I'm still behind the manager, the board and the team. Already looking forward to St J

neil7908
18-08-2019, 09:43 AM
The managers definitely needs more time but I'm not surprised if an extra time win at home against Morton after the shipping 3 goals doesn't turn around the doubters.

The_Horde
18-08-2019, 09:47 AM
That’s our record this season and seems a good few of our “support” want Heckingbottom out....

Absolutely ridiculous.

I’ll settle for that win ratio throughout the season.

I'd settle for that too. But if you want it to continue you're going to have to drop down a league or two.

Man Down Under
18-08-2019, 09:47 AM
We're a bit of a glass cannon at the moment. A threat infront of goal but a bit lost in defence too. I ain't too worried at this stage, I have faith we will get it together over the next few weeks.

Sent from my SM-A205GN using Tapatalk

Viva_Palmeiras
18-08-2019, 09:48 AM
Ah The ying and the yang of Hibs.net. Maybe a better way of referring to happy clappers and bed wetters.

Barman Stanton
18-08-2019, 09:49 AM
You have to take account of the quality of the opposition, the performances and the hope for the future.

Black and white it is a great record scratch below the surface and there are issues.

The truth probably lies some where in between the extremes on this board.

Right now no Hibs fans would relish an away trip anywhere let alone Ibrox, Celtic Park, Tyncastle which would strike a good deal of fear in most.

Totally agree with you there. Iv seen people labelled happy clappers by being fed up with the hysteria on here. I don’t think anyone is. Some are just willing to give the manager and new players a bit of time.

Agree that we are some where in between. We are certainly not firing on all cylinders, but we are also not as dreadful as a few noisy complainers on here would have you believe.

The_Horde
18-08-2019, 09:51 AM
Totally agree with you there. Iv seen people labelled happy clappers by being fed up with the hysteria on here. I don’t think anyone is. Some are just willing to give the manager and new players a bit of time.

Agree that we are some where in between. We are certainly not firing on all cylinders, but we are also not as dreadful as a few noisy complainers on here would have you believe.

I was willing to give Terry Butcher some time, he only needed to win one game to keep us up. Seen it all play out before.

Slavers
18-08-2019, 10:01 AM
I don't really get the overly negative reaction from some fans so early in the season, Hecky has not had 1 full season to show what he can do. He also came into the club at a time we were in freefall, players unmotivated, our star player in Kamberi almost walking out the club and playing well below his capability.

However, Hecky came in and steadied the ship and got us back onto the right direction heading up into the top 6. He had a big job this summer, he needed to rebuild the team after loosing the best midfield in the country. Im right in saying Hecky has had one window to improve the squad and already he has brought great balance to the squad granted it it still short in one or two areas, but we have a midfield trio of Vela, Mallan and Allan - If Hecky in the next window can secure a quality defensive midfielder then we are looking good in the middle of the park. Surely Vela has the potential to a very good player and we are still yet to see the very best of Allan and Mallan.

Look at Kamberi this season, surely Hecky has to take great credit for the way he is playing right now? Fans were wanting shot of Kamberi last season, get rid they were crying and now he is banging in the goals, looking fit and sharp and being touted for a 2m move to Basel.

Fraser Murray under the guidance of Hecky is now getting game time, being slowly introduced to the team in the proper manner also he plays Grey at right back (Did Lennon?).

Yes it is step up for Hecky and the players he has signed from where they have been before in their careers but for me, the signs are there that he can improve and improve the players in the squad.

I think Hecky wants to be here (unlike Lennon) he will do everything he can to improve us. It's a new team, players are still finding their feet and we need to support the during this time.

All this wanting Hecky out now is pathetic!!

B.H.F.C
18-08-2019, 10:05 AM
We're a bit of a glass cannon at the moment. A threat infront of goal but a bit lost in defence too.
Sent from my SM-A205GN using Tapatalk

That’s the way I see it.

The attack minded players are chipping in with goals and assists and there is scope for improvement there as well.

The other end of the pitch is miles away from where we need to be if we want to compete though. Whether or not Gray is ever going to be properly fit concerns me. McGregor will probably have a spell out now. Hanlon has been out of form for ages now. Porteous is coming back from a long term injury so we don’t know when he’ll be up to speed. Whittaker can provide reasonable cover but will probably end up playing more than we’d like him to. Stevenson had a bit of a nightmare yesterday but should come back and be steady. And the jury is out on whether Jackson and James will are upgrades on any of the above.

Chuck in the lack of midfield options in a more defensive sense as well.

PatHead
18-08-2019, 10:12 AM
I think we are one defensive midfielder away from a decent side from which to build on. Far from a crap team.

Since452
18-08-2019, 10:13 AM
Wonder how many more games we need to win before people stop panicking? We'll probably win on Saturday too. Still wont be good enough for some.

Brightside
18-08-2019, 10:14 AM
That’s our record this season and seems a good few of our “support” want Heckingbottom out....

Absolutely ridiculous.

I’ll settle for that win ratio throughout the season.

Yeh but the pies.

B.H.F.C
18-08-2019, 10:17 AM
Wonder how many more games we need to win before people stop panicking? We'll probably win on Saturday too. Still wont be good enough for some.

If we start beating a decent level of opposition consistently it’ll be good enough for plenty. We have failed to beat a couple of lower league teams over 90 minutes and suffered our worst league result in a number of years. It’s hardly surprising that there is a bit of discontent.

A win next week makes it a reasonable start to the season. Anything less, and the negativity will increase.

bigwheel
18-08-2019, 10:18 AM
Wonder how many more games we need to win before people stop panicking? We'll probably win on Saturday too. Still wont be good enough for some.

Think we have all seen Hibs enough to know we are not performing well..particularly defensively. the management team will be thinking the exact same ...I’m certainly not of the opinion the manager should go ..but it will take much more than one win next week for fans and the management team to trust the performance levels of our squad this season ...I think it will be towards the end of October before we really know what we are going to be getting this campaign..

The Spaceman
18-08-2019, 10:21 AM
Agreed. We are not nearly as bad as some of the absolute roasters on here would have you think.

Barman Stanton
18-08-2019, 10:21 AM
I was willing to give Terry Butcher some time, he only needed to win one game to keep us up. Seen it all play out before.

Damn are you even on this positive thread!? Have a look at the difference in the squads between then and now. Honestly don’t even think it’s comparable.

Yeah Butcher couldn’t win one game. We have a manager that came in and got us top 6 when it looked highly unlikely. This season we are in the qtr finals of the cup and sitting with 3 points out of 6. Butcher? Ffs, that’s absolute nonsense.

Shrekko
18-08-2019, 10:35 AM
I know. It supports the team. Plenty people not going to stand for that.

An unhealthy amount won’t.

The_Horde
18-08-2019, 10:38 AM
Damn are you even on this positive thread!? Have a look at the difference in the squads between then and now. Honestly don’t even think it’s comparable.

Yeah Butcher couldn’t win one game. We have a manager that came in and got us top 6 when it looked highly unlikely. This season we are in the qtr finals of the cup and sitting with 3 points out of 6. Butcher? Ffs, that’s absolute nonsense.

The squad then that everyone was convinced was one of the best in the league until it went t*** up?

007
18-08-2019, 10:46 AM
I don't really get the overly negative reaction from some fans so early in the season, Hecky has not had 1 full season to show what he can do. He also came into the club at a time we were in freefall, players unmotivated, our star player in Kamberi almost walking out the club and playing well below his capability.

However, Hecky came in and steadied the ship and got us back onto the right direction heading up into the top 6. He had a big job this summer, he needed to rebuild the team after loosing the best midfield in the country. Im right in saying Hecky has had one window to improve the squad and already he has brought great balance to the squad granted it it still short in one or two areas, but we have a midfield trio of Vela, Mallan and Allan - If Hecky in the next window can secure a quality defensive midfielder then we are looking good in the middle of the park. Surely Vela has the potential to a very good player and we are still yet to see the very best of Allan and Mallan.

Look at Kamberi this season, surely Hecky has to take great credit for the way he is playing right now? Fans were wanting shot of Kamberi last season, get rid they were crying and now he is banging in the goals, looking fit and sharp and being touted for a 2m move to Basel.

Fraser Murray under the guidance of Hecky is now getting game time, being slowly introduced to the team in the proper manner also he plays Grey at right back (Did Lennon?).

Yes it is step up for Hecky and the players he has signed from where they have been before in their careers but for me, the signs are there that he can improve and improve the players in the squad.

I think Hecky wants to be here (unlike Lennon) he will do everything he can to improve us. It's a new team, players are still finding their feet and we need to support the during this time.

All this wanting Hecky out now is pathetic!!

Exactly. There are too many keyboard Guardiolas that think they know it all because they've won things on Football Manager. I get the impression there are some wanting us to lose so they can say "I told you so."

Barman Stanton
18-08-2019, 10:50 AM
The squad then that everyone was convinced was one of the best in the league until it went t*** up?

Under Butcher? No one thought that. Your totally just making stuff up to suit your agenda. We had been hovering around relegation for years. No one thought that was one of the top squads in the league.

Percy Vere
18-08-2019, 11:09 AM
That’s our record this season and seems a good few of our “support” want Heckingbottom out....

Absolutely ridiculous.

I’ll settle for that win ratio throughout the season.

Absolutely right
Despite injuries and new players bedding in.
6 wins, 1 draw, 1 defeat.
Plus the amazing run last season which seems to have been forgotten.
Let’s give the manager and players some slack. Please.

Percy Vere
18-08-2019, 11:15 AM
Yay, a positive thread. I will predict it lasting about 10 posts max. Good on you for trying though. You are right as well we're no where near as bad as a select few on here would have you believe

Yeah but I think more of us who think this way need to speak up. All you see is the moaning and constant criticism.

The 90+2
18-08-2019, 11:15 AM
I know. It supports the team. Plenty people not going to stand for that.

I’ve never heard your point of view regarding team performances ever, just wee digs.

Captain Trips
18-08-2019, 11:17 AM
Absolutely right
Despite injuries and new players bedding in.
6 wins, 1 draw, 1 defeat.
Plus the amazing run last season which seems to have been forgotten.
Let’s give the manager and players some slack. Please.

2 of these matches are against clubs from our own league yes its good but come on. So if league Cup was 10 games we won all 10 but in SPL we lost both league games is that OK?

DTS
18-08-2019, 11:18 AM
I’m not entirely happy with the way things are going but I hold out hope that we’ll come good when the season properly settles down after next few games.

Heckingbottoms overall record with us in competitive games:
Played 21
Won 11
Drawn 5
Lost 5

The 5 defeats being a meaningless game against Aberdeen for us where it meant Europe for them(also by all accounts everyone was very happy with how we played and should have won) two polar opposite defeats at ibrox a defeat to Celtic in the cup where we were poor and Kilmarnock away.

52% win ratio, avoided defeat 76% of the games.

Not exactly terrible, win next 2 which we’re more than capable of then bring on hearts

bingo70
18-08-2019, 11:26 AM
I think we are one defensive midfielder away from a decent side from which to build on. Far from a crap team.

I agree with this to an extent. The problem is it doesn’t sound like we are going to get one.

The bigger problem is that it’s too important a position for us not to get someone. If I’m honest I think we are a pretty crap team just now, bring in a new defensive midfielder and it could just knit all the players together, don’t bring one in and I think it’ll continue to fall apart.

Suppose that means we’re as close to getting it right as we are as close to it going completely tits up, IMO the period between now and the end of the transfer window shutting will define how good a season we have and how long Heckingbottom ends up getting.

calumhibee1
18-08-2019, 11:27 AM
Totally agree with you there. Iv seen people labelled happy clappers by being fed up with the hysteria on here. I don’t think anyone is. Some are just willing to give the manager and new players a bit of time.

Agree that we are some where in between. We are certainly not firing on all cylinders, but we are also not as dreadful as a few noisy complainers on here would have you believe.

:agree:

Not much can be added to that. You can only beat what’s in front of you and other than Rangers we’ve mostly managed that this season. It’s not been vintage stuff but while we’re getting results it would seem mental that people want him gone.

Hibbyradge
18-08-2019, 11:27 AM
That’s our record this season and seems a good few of our “support” want Heckingbottom out....

Absolutely ridiculous.

I’ll settle for that win ratio throughout the season.

Are you convinced that we're a good team?

Are you convinced that Paul Heckingbottom is a good manager?

Are Hibs winning convincingly?

I'm definitely not convinced.

People are understandably looking for positives so are using the stats to mask the obvious deficiencies, imo, and shouting down the concerns of others.

As an aside, what do people think "high press" means?

bingo70
18-08-2019, 11:28 AM
I’m not entirely happy with the way things are going but I hold out hope that we’ll come good when the season properly settles down after next few games.

Heckingbottoms overall record with us in competitive games:
Played 21
Won 11
Drawn 5
Lost 5

The 5 defeats being a meaningless game against Aberdeen for us where it meant Europe for them(also by all accounts everyone was very happy with how we played and should have won) two polar opposite defeats at ibrox a defeat to Celtic in the cup where we were poor and Kilmarnock away.

52% win ratio, avoided defeat 76% of the games.

Not exactly terrible, win next 2 which we’re more than capable of then bring on hearts

At the risk of opening a can of worms, did you make the games against Stirling Albion and Morton wins or draws as they would have been after the 90 minutes?

cmcd
18-08-2019, 11:34 AM
I don't really get the overly negative reaction from some fans so early in the season, Hecky has not had 1 full season to show what he can do. He also came into the club at a time we were in freefall, players unmotivated, our star player in Kamberi almost walking out the club and playing well below his capability.

However, Hecky came in and steadied the ship and got us back onto the right direction heading up into the top 6. He had a big job this summer, he needed to rebuild the team after loosing the best midfield in the country. Im right in saying Hecky has had one window to improve the squad and already he has brought great balance to the squad granted it it still short in one or two areas, but we have a midfield trio of Vela, Mallan and Allan - If Hecky in the next window can secure a quality defensive midfielder then we are looking good in the middle of the park. Surely Vela has the potential to a very good player and we are still yet to see the very best of Allan and Mallan.

Look at Kamberi this season, surely Hecky has to take great credit for the way he is playing right now? Fans were wanting shot of Kamberi last season, get rid they were crying and now he is banging in the goals, looking fit and sharp and being touted for a 2m move to Basel.

Fraser Murray under the guidance of Hecky is now getting game time, being slowly introduced to the team in the proper manner also he plays Grey at right back (Did Lennon?).

Yes it is step up for Hecky and the players he has signed from where they have been before in their careers but for me, the signs are there that he can improve and improve the players in the squad.

I think Hecky wants to be here (unlike Lennon) he will do everything he can to improve us. It's a new team, players are still finding their feet and we need to support the during this time.

All this wanting Hecky out now is pathetic!!

Well said sir

angus hibby
18-08-2019, 11:37 AM
I don't really get the overly negative reaction from some fans so early in the season, Hecky has not had 1 full season to show what he can do. He also came into the club at a time we were in freefall, players unmotivated, our star player in Kamberi almost walking out the club and playing well below his capability.

However, Hecky came in and steadied the ship and got us back onto the right direction heading up into the top 6. He had a big job this summer, he needed to rebuild the team after loosing the best midfield in the country. Im right in saying Hecky has had one window to improve the squad and already he has brought great balance to the squad granted it it still short in one or two areas, but we have a midfield trio of Vela, Mallan and Allan - If Hecky in the next window can secure a quality defensive midfielder then we are looking good in the middle of the park. Surely Vela has the potential to a very good player and we are still yet to see the very best of Allan and Mallan.

Look at Kamberi this season, surely Hecky has to take great credit for the way he is playing right now? Fans were wanting shot of Kamberi last season, get rid they were crying and now he is banging in the goals, looking fit and sharp and being touted for a 2m move to Basel.

Fraser Murray under the guidance of Hecky is now getting game time, being slowly introduced to the team in the proper manner also he plays Grey at right back (Did Lennon?).

Yes it is step up for Hecky and the players he has signed from where they have been before in their careers but for me, the signs are there that he can improve and improve the players in the squad.

I think Hecky wants to be here (unlike Lennon) he will do everything he can to improve us. It's a new team, players are still finding their feet and we need to support the during this time.

All this wanting Hecky out now is pathetic!!

👏👏. Spot on.

Northernhibee
18-08-2019, 11:38 AM
The managers definitely needs more time but I'm not surprised if an extra time win at home against Morton after the shipping 3 goals doesn't turn around the doubters.

Two own goals is somewhat freakish though. A 3-1 win and most people are happy. Similar to the St Mirren game, never mind that they beat Aberdeen the week after and aren't pish like some people on here suggest they are, we hit the post twice, had a perfectly good goal disallowed. We have a few issues and could do with a DM but if it wasn't for bad luck we'd have none just now and we're still struggling through as it is.

My old man
18-08-2019, 11:57 AM
That’s our record this season and seems a good few of our “support” want Heckingbottom out....

Absolutely ridiculous.

I’ll settle for that win ratio throughout the season.

Tin hat 🎩 on
💣 💣 💣
GGTTH

Keith_M
18-08-2019, 12:05 PM
That’s our record this season and seems a good few of our “support” want Heckingbottom out....

Absolutely ridiculous.

I’ll settle for that win ratio throughout the season.


The stats for games against teams in our league is won 1, lost 1, scored 2, conceded 6.

We failed to beat Stirling in the LC group, but won the other three games (also against lower league sides).

We finally beat Morton (a championship team) after 120 minutes, after throwing away the lead twice.


It would have been a lot worse if we'd lost to any of those lower league teams, and I'm glad we're still in the League Cup, but we'll have to improve considerably if we we want to win regularly in league games.

calumhibee1
18-08-2019, 12:10 PM
The stats for games against teams in our league is won 1, lost 1, scored 2, conceded 6.

We failed to beat Stirling in the LC group, but won the other three games (also against lower league sides).

We finally beat Morton (a championship team) after 120 minutes, after throwing away the lead twice.


It would have been a lot worse if we'd lost to any of those lower league teams, and I'm glad we're still in the League Cup, but we'll have to improve considerably if we we want to win regularly in league games.

The stats for games against teams with smaller budgets than us is undefeated.

You can’t just remove the majority of decent results we’ve had to make things sound worse.

Borderhibbie76
18-08-2019, 12:14 PM
You have to take account of the quality of the opposition, the performances and the hope for the future.

Black and white it is a great record scratch below the surface and there are issues.

The truth probably lies some where in between the extremes on this board.

Right now no Hibs fans would relish an away trip anywhere let alone Ibrox, Celtic Park, Tyncastle which would strike a good deal of fear in most.Spot on...we aren't as bad as some are making out.. but we certainly aren't equipped to take on either of the ugly sisters Aberdeen or Hertz yet...not with that midfield as it currently stands

Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk

The 90+2
18-08-2019, 12:21 PM
I don't really get the overly negative reaction from some fans so early in the season, Hecky has not had 1 full season to show what he can do. He also came into the club at a time we were in freefall, players unmotivated, our star player in Kamberi almost walking out the club and playing well below his capability.

However, Hecky came in and steadied the ship and got us back onto the right direction heading up into the top 6. He had a big job this summer, he needed to rebuild the team after loosing the best midfield in the country. Im right in saying Hecky has had one window to improve the squad and already he has brought great balance to the squad granted it it still short in one or two areas, but we have a midfield trio of Vela, Mallan and Allan - If Hecky in the next window can secure a quality defensive midfielder then we are looking good in the middle of the park. Surely Vela has the potential to a very good player and we are still yet to see the very best of Allan and Mallan.

Look at Kamberi this season, surely Hecky has to take great credit for the way he is playing right now? Fans were wanting shot of Kamberi last season, get rid they were crying and now he is banging in the goals, looking fit and sharp and being touted for a 2m move to Basel.

Fraser Murray under the guidance of Hecky is now getting game time, being slowly introduced to the team in the proper manner also he plays Grey at right back (Did Lennon?).

Yes it is step up for Hecky and the players he has signed from where they have been before in their careers but for me, the signs are there that he can improve and improve the players in the squad.

I think Hecky wants to be here (unlike Lennon) he will do everything he can to improve us. It's a new team, players are still finding their feet and we need to support the during this time.

All this wanting Hecky out now is pathetic!!

Sorry, but it’s GRAY. How do people get that wrong while ripping into others ffs

Smartie
18-08-2019, 12:26 PM
Sorry, but it’s GRAY. How do people get that wrong while ripping into others ffs

Gray gets autocorrected to grey on some of my devices, it drives me nuts having to correct it.

I never pick folk up on spelling or grammar but even if I did I'd probably give the person the benefit of the doubt as it is so easily done.

The 90+2
18-08-2019, 12:28 PM
Gray gets autocorrected to grey on some of my devices, it drives me nuts having to correct it.

I never pick folk up on spelling or grammar but even if I did I'd probably give the person the benefit of the doubt as it is so easily done.

Yeah me neither, the Gray mistake/correction pisses me off though 😁 apologies if it was autocorrect. His name on here should be automatically be changed to God or legend imo :greengrin

Since452
18-08-2019, 12:30 PM
Ourselves Hearts and Aberdeen are all struggling for form at this time. Aberdeen have been awful yet beat Hearts. Hearts have been poor but had a good win on Friday although it was eye bleeding. I'll take 5 wins in 7 while finding our form though 👍

matty_f
18-08-2019, 12:36 PM
Are you convinced that we're a good team?

Are you convinced that Paul Heckingbottom is a good manager?

Are Hibs winning convincingly?

I'm definitely not convinced.

People are understandably looking for positives so are using the stats to mask the obvious deficiencies, imo, and shouting down the concerns of others.

As an aside, what do people think "high press" means?

By ‘shouting down’ do you mean offering an alternative point of view?

Northernhibee
18-08-2019, 12:36 PM
Ourselves Hearts and Aberdeen are all struggling for form at this time. Aberdeen have been awful yet beat Hearts. Hearts have been poor but had a good win on Friday although it was eye bleeding. I'll take 5 wins in 7 while finding our form though 👍

This is it. Our football needs to improve otherwise it'll be a long season but I'm slightly embarrassed about some of the vitriol that's been sent Heckingbottom's way. A wildly OTT reaction. Some fud on Twitter was saying "Another ****ing English FFS" when Doidge was signed. He's Welsh.

The 90+2
18-08-2019, 12:38 PM
By ‘shouting down’ do you mean offering an alternative point of view?

People post opinions and the reply from some relentlessly is “pish” or “garbage” or “another doom and gloom thread” without giving any reasoning behind logic.

Anyone posting things from the alternative point of view usually gets digs in about posters concerned and if there’s a reply as to why they disagree it’s usually a quite measured reply.

Sammy7nil
18-08-2019, 12:40 PM
I was willing to give Terry Butcher some time, he only needed to win one game to keep us up. Seen it all play out before.

Behave two games in with three points let's not get silly.


Are you convinced that we're a good team?

Are you convinced that Paul Heckingbottom is a good manager?

Are Hibs winning convincingly?

I'm definitely not convinced.

People are understandably looking for positives so are using the stats to mask the obvious deficiencies, imo, and shouting down the concerns of others.

As an aside, what do people think "high press" means?

I don't think many if any are convinced but way too early to push the panic button.

Northernhibee
18-08-2019, 12:45 PM
I was willing to give Terry Butcher some time, he only needed to win one game to keep us up. Seen it all play out before.

Imagine if you're George Craig or Leeann Dempster and you're interviewing managers after sacking Heckingbottom.

"Come on in"

"Hi, thanks for inviting me along. Interested in the job."

"No problem, any questions you have for us about the club?"

"Why did the last manager leave?"

"We sacked him. He lost a competitive game, badly, and the fans wanted rid".

"After one loss?"

"Yes"

"I'm no longer interested in the position".

H18S NX
18-08-2019, 12:50 PM
I have to be honest and say i am looking forward with fear,sorry if that offends anybody.

Keith_M
18-08-2019, 12:50 PM
The stats for games against teams with smaller budgets than us is undefeated.

You can’t just remove the majority of decent results we’ve had to make things sound worse.


I'm not removing anything, I'm just trying to present what I thought was a balanced view somewhere between "we're total rubbish" and "we've won 5 out of 7"... which are both extreme viewpoints.

Hibbyradge
18-08-2019, 12:54 PM
The stats for games against teams with smaller budgets than us is undefeated.

You can’t just remove the majority of decent results we’ve had to make things sound worse.

Using results against teams in lower divisions to make things sound better isn't right either.

calumhibee1
18-08-2019, 12:58 PM
Using results against teams in lower divisions to make things sound better isn't right either.

Where do we stop then? Rangers budget is probably about ten times ours, ours is probably about ten times Arbroath's. Arbroath can’t realistically compete with us, we can’t realistically compete with Rangers. We wouldn’t remove the Rangers result from the equation though. Maybe we should, if we can’t count all the wins against teams who are a lot smaller than us then surely we can’t count defeats to teams who are a lot ‘bigger’ than us.

bawheid
18-08-2019, 12:58 PM
Using results against teams in lower divisions to make things sound better isn't right either.

Ok, let’s not take into consideration any of the league cup games. In the league we’ve won one and lost won. The win was 1-0 against St Mirren but could have been more. The loss was a heavy defeat at Ibrox after playing the last half hour with ten men. Even ignoring all of the wins in the League Cup, I don’t see where the panic and hysteria comes from.

Hibbyradge
18-08-2019, 12:59 PM
By ‘shouting down’ do you mean offering an alternative point of view?

You know what I mean, Matty.

People being accused of bed wetting, of not being Hibs supporters and the likes.

I actually haven't read many actual "opinions', just folk spouting stats and hoping things will get better. I certainly haven't seen anyone saying that we're good.

theonlywayisup
18-08-2019, 01:00 PM
I don't have a lot of confidence in the Hibs team at the moment.

I think we are struggling in defence and in midfield. We'll do okay against the poorer teams in the league as I'm sure that we'll score goals, but we'll struggle against the better more organised teams.

Next week's game will be a good indicator of how our season will pan out. Saints have tended to be a bogey team for us. They've started poorly with bad results in the League Cup, a drubbing away to Celtic and were two nil down at home to Livingston before fighting back for a draw. We have to win next week to build some confidence.

angus hibby
18-08-2019, 01:01 PM
Using results against teams in lower divisions to make things sound better isn't right either.

Take those games away then, and we’ve played 2 games!! Won one & lost one. Sackable??

Since452
18-08-2019, 01:02 PM
What happens if we beat St Johnstone to make it 6 wins in 8 and 2 in 3 in the league? Shudder at the thought

The 90+2
18-08-2019, 01:04 PM
Take those games away then, and we’ve played 2 games!! Won one & lost one. Sackable??

Who has claimed its sackable territory? Stop making things up.

Keith_M
18-08-2019, 01:04 PM
What happens if we beat St Johnstone to make it 6 wins in 8 and 2 in 3 in the league? Shudder at the thought


What happens if we lose to St Johnstone to make it..... 1 in 3 in the league? Shudder at the thought



See, we can all play guessing games.

:wink:

calumhibee1
18-08-2019, 01:04 PM
What happens if we beat St Johnstone to make it 6 wins in 8 and 2 in 3 in the league? Shudder at the thought

Then we remove all the wins we’ve had from any statistics were about to quote and get back to bashing the club. Simples. :agree:

calumhibee1
18-08-2019, 01:05 PM
Who has claimed its sackable territory? Stop making things up.

Was there not a poll where about 40% of people wanted him sacked earlier in the week?

The 90+2
18-08-2019, 01:05 PM
What happens if we beat St Johnstone to make it 6 wins in 8 and 2 in 3 in the league? Shudder at the thought

If we win then we will get three points. What do you expect to happen?

The 90+2
18-08-2019, 01:06 PM
Was there not a poll where about 40% of people wanted him sacked earlier in the week?

I’m not sure mate, can’t view or post on polls on the iPhone.

calumhibee1
18-08-2019, 01:09 PM
I’m not sure mate, can’t view or post on polls on the iPhone.

Just went back and had a look. The question was “should Heckingbottom be Hibs manager” and 42% of people answered no.

I know the question wasn’t should he be sacked but it’s similar enough that you could presume a big chunk of them would want him binned.

Iggy Pope
18-08-2019, 01:09 PM
I'm not removing anything, I'm just trying to present what I thought was a balanced view somewhere between "we're total rubbish" and "we've won 5 out of 7"... which are both extreme viewpoints.

The latter isn’t so much a point of view as it is factual though.

Hibbyradge
18-08-2019, 01:10 PM
Where do we stop then? Rangers budget is probably about ten times ours, ours is probably about ten times Arbroath's. Arbroath can’t realistically compete with us, we can’t realistically compete with Rangers. We wouldn’t remove the Rangers result from the equation though. Maybe we should, if we can’t count all the wins against teams who are a lot smaller than us then surely we can’t count defeats to teams who are a lot ‘bigger’ than us.

That's fine, Calum. If you're happy with things as they are, then you're in a good place.

Losing to Sevco at Ibrox wasn't unexpected and, in itself, isn't a barometer of our abilities as a team so yes, it can be dismissed at this stage.

Losing a 2-0 lead at home to Morton, then losing the lead for a second time, is less easy to ignore. Same applies to the insipid displays against the teams in the LC group.

I'm giving PH the benefit of the doubt at the moment, but the doubt is significant.

Hibbyradge
18-08-2019, 01:11 PM
Take those games away then, and we’ve played 2 games!! Won one & lost one. Sackable??

I'm not suggesting he should be sacked.

Hibbyradge
18-08-2019, 01:12 PM
Then we remove all the wins we’ve had from any statistics were about to quote and get back to bashing the club. Simples. :agree:

Bashing the club? Behave.

Sammy7nil
18-08-2019, 01:12 PM
Where do we stop then? Rangers budget is probably about ten times ours, ours is probably about ten times Arbroath's. Arbroath can’t realistically compete with us, we can’t realistically compete with Rangers. We wouldn’t remove the Rangers result from the equation though. Maybe we should, if we can’t count all the wins against teams who are a lot smaller than us then surely we can’t count defeats to teams who are a lot ‘bigger’ than us.

Rangers could have and should have scored ten or more, we have never looked like doing that against lower league teams.

As I have said far too early to panic but right to have some concerns about the alarming rate we are conceding goals.

Keith_M
18-08-2019, 01:13 PM
The latter isn’t so much a point of view as it is factual though.


I know, but it's out of context.

If we had won 5 out of 7 in league games, that would be a different scenario entirely.

If we do reach 7 league games with 5 wins, I'd imagine there will be much less negativity.

calumhibee1
18-08-2019, 01:13 PM
That's fine, Calum. If you're happy with things as they are, then you're in a good place.

Losing to Sevco at Ibrox wasn't unexpected and, in itself, isn't a barometer of our abilities as a team so yes, it can be dismissed at this stage.

Losing a 2-0 lead at home to Morton, then losing the lead for a second time, us less easy to ignore. Same applies to the insipid displays against the teams in the LC group.

I'm giving PH the benefit of the doubt at the moment, but the doubt is significant.

Don’t get me wrong, I don’t think we’ve been great and there’s definitely improvement needed.

People just seem that desperate to put the boot in that they’re actively trying to remove good results from the equation. There was even a guy on the Morton match thread who was adamant we didn’t win yesterday such was his determination to paint a bleak picture.

bawheid
18-08-2019, 01:13 PM
That's fine, Calum. If you're happy with things as they are, then you're in a good place.

Losing to Sevco at Ibrox wasn't unexpected and, in itself, isn't a barometer of our abilities as a team so yes, it can be dismissed at this stage.

Losing a 2-0 lead at home to Morton, then losing the lead for a second time, us less easy to ignore. Same applies to the insipid displays against the teams in the LC group.

I'm giving PH the benefit of the doubt at the moment, but the doubt is significant.

We had similar performances in the early stages of the League Cup in previous seasons under previous managers though. What’s the difference this time?

calumhibee1
18-08-2019, 01:14 PM
Bashing the club? Behave.

You can’t honestly be telling me nobody has been doing that..

Hibbyradge
18-08-2019, 01:16 PM
Don’t get me wrong, I don’t think we’ve been great and there’s definitely improvement needed.

People just seem that desperate to put the boot in that they’re actively trying to remove good results from the equation. There was even a guy on the Morton match thread who was adamant we didn’t win yesterday such was his determination to paint a bleak picture.

I realise that it's semantics, but we haven't had any "good" results since we beat Hearts. We've had satisfactory results from substandard performances.

Hibbyradge
18-08-2019, 01:17 PM
You can’t honestly be telling me nobody has been doing that..

I think people are commenting on our team's performances.

Hibbyradge
18-08-2019, 01:19 PM
We had similar performances in the early stages of the League Cup in previous seasons under previous managers though. What’s the difference this time?

I don't know, but something isn't right. It feels different. It feels crap.

Iggy Pope
18-08-2019, 01:19 PM
I know, but it's out of context.

If we had won 5 out of 7 in league games, that would be a different scenario entirely.

If we do reach 7 league games with 5 wins, I'd imagine there will be much less negativity.

We can only play the games in front of us. I don’t see the context if I’m honest. We might’ve been rubbish but we’ve won 5 of them and lost one. Looking into the future doesn’t apply any context at all does it? Winning losing or drawing the next 5 league games will only embellish the facts. Jeez we might be looking at 10 wins out of 12 while still playing ‘rubbish’.

calumhibee1
18-08-2019, 01:21 PM
I think people are commenting on our team's performances.

They are.

There’s also plenty others who are putting the boot in. Like I said in my other post, there was even a poster yesterday who was that desperate to put the boot in that he/she point blank refused to accept we won.

bawheid
18-08-2019, 01:21 PM
I don't know, but something isn't right. It feels different. It feels crap.

I’m not feeling that. We’ve new players in defence, midfield and attack. Im prepared to give them more than two League games before writing them off (bearing in mind we’re to ignore the League Cup progression).

Iggy Pope
18-08-2019, 01:21 PM
was it yourself who started a poll asking if he should be hibs manager or not?

tko......

Northernhibee
18-08-2019, 01:23 PM
tko......

TBF - it wasn't. My bad.

But some posters just seem to want to be constantly negative about this team.

Iggy Pope
18-08-2019, 01:24 PM
TBF - it wasn't. My bad.

But some posters just seem to want to be constantly negative about this team.

Ah well. Survived the count.

Northernhibee
18-08-2019, 01:25 PM
Ah well. Survived the count.


However, posted on this:

We're still talking about if it's logical to punt him. Just now it's not about giving PH a "fighting chance". It's giving him the courtesy of proper time for the team to develop, settle in and improve.

Our one loss this season was a thumping but why on earth the topic of conversation has turned to if he should be here has arisen baffles me.

11-08-2019 06:48 PM
#5 (https://www.hibs.net/showthread.php?341147-Should-Paul-Heckingbottom-Be-Manager&p=5882058&viewfull=1#post5882058)

90+2 (https://www.hibs.net/member.php?35519-90-2)
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Yes. If he’s going to make an arse of it then at least give him a fighting chance of not to. With a new owner there’s every reason logically to punt him mind you.

tonyrougier123
18-08-2019, 01:26 PM
People post opinions and the reply from some relentlessly is “pish” or “garbage” or “another doom and gloom thread” without giving any reasoning behind logic.

Anyone posting things from the alternative point of view usually gets digs in about posters concerned and if there’s a reply as to why they disagree it’s usually a quite measured reply.
👍

Hibbyradge
18-08-2019, 01:27 PM
They are.

There’s also plenty others who are putting the boot in. Like I said in my other post, there was even a poster yesterday who was that desperate to put the boot in that he/she point blank refused to accept we won.

You understand his point, though.

We shipped 3 goals to a team mid table in the league below us, losing the lead twice to end up drawing after 90 minutes.

We needed extra time to beat them.

Cataplana
18-08-2019, 01:28 PM
I don't know, but something isn't right. It feels different. It feels crap.

I tend to agree. We can't ignore the fact that the new guys don't look up to the job, and that the likes of MacGregor and Gray are past it. I can definitely understand why people are worrying at the moment.

I am the eternal optimist though, I like Hecky and think that he has the man management skills to sort this out. All he really needs, to keep his job, is to finish above Hearts, and that doesn't look to hard a test at the moment.

Northernhibee
18-08-2019, 01:30 PM
You understand his point, though.

We shipped 3 goals to a team mid table in the league below us, losing the lead twice to end up drawing after 90 minutes.

We needed extra time to beat them.

Only one team yesterday didn't need extra time, and that included Celtic against lower league opposition. It happens, and the reaction from other fan groups isn't as extreme.

Other managers got far more of a time for their players to bed in than PH has had. The searing negativity in this forum in the last two weeks has been unbearable. I don't quite understand why.

Hibbyradge
18-08-2019, 01:32 PM
I’m not feeling that. We’ve new players in defence, midfield and attack. Im prepared to give them more than two League games before writing them off (bearing in mind we’re to ignore the League Cup progression).

And you're right not to write them off.

On a positivity scale of 1 to 10, I'm probably about a 5.

A convincing 3-0 win next week might raise that to a 7/8, but that's exactly what we need.

calumhibee1
18-08-2019, 01:33 PM
You understand his point, though.

We shipped 3 goals to a team mid table in the league below us, losing the lead twice to end up drawing after 90 minutes.

We needed extra time to beat them.

I understand the point he’s trying to make. I think it’s incorrect and I think it was a deliberate attempt to make things out to be even worse.

I think it’s pretty safe to say that if we won the Scottish Cup in extra time nobody would have been going around telling folk we won the cup by drawing with Rangers. People would have correctly been saying we beat Rangers to win the cup.

Saying we drew yesterday is a deliberate attempt to avoid saying that we won because it doesn’t tie in with the desperation to have a go at everything Hibs for some posters.

Since452
18-08-2019, 01:34 PM
Then we remove all the wins we’ve had from any statistics were about to quote and get back to bashing the club. Simples. :agree:

People love to be outraged by something

bawheid
18-08-2019, 01:34 PM
You understand his point, though.

We shipped 3 goals to a team mid table in the league below us, losing the lead twice to end up drawing after 90 minutes.

We needed extra time to beat them.

Under Neil Lennon we failed to beat Morton with a side containing Ambrose, McGinn, Boyle and McGeoch. I don’t remember folk losing their **** then?

Iggy Pope
18-08-2019, 01:36 PM
I understand the point he’s trying to make. I think it’s incorrect and I think it was a deliberate attempt to make things out to be even worse.

I think it’s pretty safe to say that if we won the Scottish Cup in extra time nobody would have been going around telling folk we won the cup by drawing with Rangers.

A semi final win on penalties took us there too so let’s make it an even better six out of seven :greengrin

Since452
18-08-2019, 01:37 PM
Under Neil Lennon we failed to beat Morton with a side containing Ambrose, McGinn, Boyle and McGeoch. I don’t remember folk losing their **** then?

And didn't score 1 never mind 3

The 90+2
18-08-2019, 01:37 PM
Don’t get me wrong, I don’t think we’ve been great and there’s definitely improvement needed.

People just seem that desperate to put the boot in that they’re actively trying to remove good results from the equation. There was even a guy on the Morton match thread who was adamant we didn’t win yesterday such was his determination to paint a bleak picture.

People aren’t desperate to put the boot in though mate, everyone would rather the team was in a lot better place than it is and it’s a concerning time on the pitch.

B.H.F.C
18-08-2019, 01:37 PM
Only one team yesterday didn't need extra time, and that included Celtic against lower league opposition. It happens, and the reaction from other fan groups isn't as extreme.

Other managers got far more of a time for their players to bed in than PH has had. The searing negativity in this forum in the last two weeks has been unbearable. I don't quite understand why.

I bet the reactions are exactly the same from other supports. Celtic were booed yesterday for instance. And a lot of their support were sticking the boot in to Lennon before they’d even played a game under him. Hearts fans can’t stand Levein. Go back to last year and you had Martin Canning’s dad getting abuse in the stand.

I think Hibs fans are actually quite patient given we largely under achieve.

The 90+2
18-08-2019, 01:38 PM
Under Neil Lennon we failed to beat Morton with a side containing Ambrose, McGinn, Boyle and McGeoch. I don’t remember folk losing their **** then?

Was that a one off while seeing that we had a good capable side that could go for promotion?

Morton, like last week was brutal, not as brutal but it’s major warning signs.

The 90+2
18-08-2019, 01:39 PM
I bet the reactions are exactly the same from other supports. Celtic were booed yesterday for instance. And a lot of their support were sticking the boot in to Lennon before they’d even played a game under him. Hearts fans can’t stand Levein. Go back to last year and you had Martin Canning’s dad getting abuse in the stand.

I think Hibs fans are actually quite patient given we largely under achieve.

Extremely patient but at the same time negative and worried because of events that’s happened pretty recently.

The_Horde
18-08-2019, 01:40 PM
Under Neil Lennon we failed to beat Morton with a side containing Ambrose, McGinn, Boyle and McGeoch. I don’t remember folk losing their **** then?

Probably because you knew fine well it was just an off day then and so far this season we've had more off days than on days.

calumhibee1
18-08-2019, 01:40 PM
People aren’t desperate to put the boot in though mate, everyone would rather the team was in a lot better place than it is and it’s a concerning time on the pitch.

I don’t doubt that everyone wants that and I’m not saying that everyone who has posted something negative falls into that category. Both yourself and HR have been fairly negative if I may say so but I wouldn’t class you two in that category, or even the majority of posters.

When you have people refusing to acknowledge that we even won yesterday and claiming we drew through then imo they’re trying to manufacture something to have a go at the club about. And if you’re doing that then that makes you desperate to put the boot in imo.

Iggy Pope
18-08-2019, 01:41 PM
Under Neil Lennon we failed to beat Morton with a side containing Ambrose, McGinn, Boyle and McGeoch. I don’t remember folk losing their **** then?

They annihilated us at Easter Road under Stubbs the season before too. And we were all losing our **** then.....landmark season though.

bawheid
18-08-2019, 01:42 PM
Was that a one off while seeing that we had a good capable side that could go for promotion?

Morton, like last week was brutal, not as brutal but it’s major warning signs.

Was it a one off? Both Stubbs and Lennon had plenty of dodgy performances / results during their time at the club. How does Heckingbottom’s record so far compare?

Since452
18-08-2019, 01:42 PM
Probably because you knew fine well it was just an off day then and so far this season we've had more off days than on days.

We had 17 off days that season against worse teams than Morton

Hibbyradge
18-08-2019, 01:42 PM
Only one team yesterday didn't need extra time, and that included Celtic against lower league opposition. It happens, and the reaction from other fan groups isn't as extreme.

Other managers got far more of a time for their players to bed in than PH has had. The searing negativity in this forum in the last two weeks has been unbearable. I don't quite understand why.

I've never been one to jump on a defeat and cry that the sky is falling down, but my opinion hasn't been formed on the back of a single game.

We've shown nothing since we beat Hearts on 6 April and it's not just the results that give rise to concern.

I think that our run from 8th to 5th place had more to do with the positive effect of Lennon leaving than Hecky arriving, because I didn't see any difference in the way we approached games.

Let me be clear, I'm not calling for anyone's head and I've no option but to wait to see if the new players can gell, but currently I'm unconvinced.

bawheid
18-08-2019, 01:43 PM
Probably because you knew fine well it was just an off day then and so far this season we've had more off days than on days.

Have we? No, we haven’t.

bawheid
18-08-2019, 01:44 PM
I've never been one to jump on a defeat and cry that the sky is falling down, but my opinion has been formed on the back of a single game.

We've shown nothing since we beat Hearts on 6 April and it's not just the results that give rise to concern.

I think that our run from 8th to 5th place had more to do with the positive effect of Lennon leaving than Hecky arriving, because I didn't see any difference in the way we approached games.

Let me be vlearI'm not calling for anyone's head and I've no option but to wait to see if the new players can fell, but currently I'm unconvinced.

We will win.

Hibs for the Cup.

One Day Soon
18-08-2019, 01:47 PM
Ah The ying and the yang of Hibs.net. Maybe a better way of referring to happy clappers and bed wetters.

I've always been more of a Happy Clapper than a Bed Wetter. These days though I feel more at home as a kind of Bed Clapper.

Hibbyradge
18-08-2019, 01:48 PM
We will win.

Hibs for the Cup.

:hilarious :thumbsup:

Hibbyradge
18-08-2019, 01:48 PM
I've always been more of a Happy Clapper than a Bed Wetter. These days though I feel more at home as a kind of Bed Clapper.

I'm a happy wetter. That's more fun.

Iggy Pope
18-08-2019, 01:49 PM
We will win.

Hibs for the Cup.

Vintage stuff :top marks

The 90+2
18-08-2019, 01:53 PM
Was it a one off? Both Stubbs and Lennon had plenty of dodgy performances / results during their time at the club. How does Heckingbottom’s record so far compare?

Let’s be totally honest, under Stubbs and Lennon we seen a team being shaped and performed brilliantly at times. There’s nothing apart from stats to say any team since Tynie we’ve put out is getting there or evidence to be optimistic.

matty_f
18-08-2019, 01:55 PM
I'm not removing anything, I'm just trying to present what I thought was a balanced view somewhere between "we're total rubbish" and "we've won 5 out of 7"... which are both extreme viewpoints.

“We’ve won 5 out of 7” can’t, by any stretch of the imagination, be presented as an extreme viewpoint.

bawheid
18-08-2019, 01:56 PM
Let’s be totally honest, under Stubbs and Lennon we seen a team being shaped and performed brilliantly at times. There’s nothing apart from stats to say any team since Tynie we’ve put out is getting there or evidence to be optimistic.

Apart from stats? :faf:

Ok then...

The 90+2
18-08-2019, 01:57 PM
“We’ve won 5 out of 7” can’t, by any stretch of the imagination, be presented as an extreme viewpoint.

Neither could be the statement that we’ve struggled in 5 out 7 games, regardless of victory. And in 6 of they seven games they have been against a lot smaller sides than us and the one bigger club demolished us.

The 90+2
18-08-2019, 01:58 PM
Apart from stats? :faf:

Ok then...

Yes. It’s been a struggle regardless. Otherwise people wouldn’t be concerned, moaning, bedwetting or whatever else.

We drew with Morton when almost promoted, why on earth would people have been worried or complained or whatever then?

Northernhibee
18-08-2019, 02:03 PM
“We’ve won 5 out of 7” can’t, by any stretch of the imagination, be presented as an extreme viewpoint.

It's not even a viewpoint. It's fact.

Percy Vere
18-08-2019, 02:21 PM
2 of these matches are against clubs from our own league yes its good but come on. So if league Cup was 10 games we won all 10 but in SPL we lost both league games is that OK?

You can only play what’s in front of you!

Tully
18-08-2019, 02:30 PM
5 out of 7 but the football is eye bleeding

Percy Vere
18-08-2019, 02:31 PM
2 of these matches are against clubs from our own league yes its good but come on. So if league Cup was 10 games we won all 10 but in SPL we lost both league games is that OK?

You can only play what’s in front of you!

calumhibee1
18-08-2019, 02:31 PM
5 out of 7 but the football is eye bleeding

We scored 5 goals yesterday. Defensively we were a bit shambolic but it wasn’t eye bleeding.

I also thought we played some decent stuff against St Mirren.

Northernhibee
18-08-2019, 02:31 PM
5 out of 7 but the football is eye bleeding

Weirdly, I don't think it is. We have the ability to pass the ball about nicely, our link up play is improving as players get used to each other and I think we - in patches - play some nice stuff. Looking forward to that becoming more consistent.

greenlex
18-08-2019, 02:48 PM
Using results against teams in lower divisions to make things sound better isn't right either.

They are facts tho. There’s better teams than this been beaten by lower league opposition. Using these performances as a negative is baffling to be honest. There weren’t two games on the bounce where he played the same team. Heckingbottom himself said he was using them for players match fitness. We came through the group stages unscathed. it was his gamble ( not one I personally was happy with) but it achieved the goal. Now it’s a stick to beat him with as we didn’t run over them? Bizarre.
Yesterday we dominated and whilst it wasn’t clever at times we were comfortable winners.
One deffeat at Ibrox where when it was 11?v11 we competed.aye they had chances but that’s what going there is all about. Nobody’s going there to. boss them.
The negativity is unjust. Be concerned by all means but we have so called fans writing off new players, old players and a management team that have done just fine. This place is mental and getting more mental by the day.

greenlex
18-08-2019, 02:49 PM
5 out of 7 but the football is eye bleeding

What absolute nonsense.

Since452
18-08-2019, 02:56 PM
Apart from stats? :faf:

Ok then...

Pesky stats

Hibbyradge
18-08-2019, 03:01 PM
They are facts tho. There’s better teams than this been beaten by lower league opposition. Using these performances as a negative is baffling to be honest. There weren’t two games on the bounce where he played the same team. Heckingbottom himself said he was using them for players match fitness. We came through the group stages unscathed. it was his gamble ( not one I personally was happy with) but it achieved the goal. Now it’s a stick to beat him with as we didn’t run over them? Bizarre.
Yesterday we dominated and whilst it wasn’t clever at times we were comfortable winners.
One deffeat at Ibrox where when it was 11?v11 we competed.aye they had chances but that’s what going there is all about. Nobody’s going there to. boss them.
The negativity is unjust. Be concerned by all means but we have so called fans writing off new players, old players and a management team that have done just fine. This place is mental and getting more mental by the day.

At first glance, that looks like a fair argument, but what have you seen that gives you confidence that performances will improve? :dunno:

I'm not saying that they won't, but I don't see any signs of progress. I'm only watching games on Hibs TV when I already know the result, so maybe that skews my viewpoint, but I'm really not sure what Hecky's trying to achieve.

By the way, I've not written anyone off yet, but that day isn't as far away as it should be.

It'll be time for PH to go when someone trots out the "Alex Ferguson nearly got sacked before they won the FA Cup" line. :greengrin

B.H.F.C
18-08-2019, 03:01 PM
They are facts tho. There’s better teams than this been beaten by lower league opposition. Using these performances as a negative is baffling to be honest. There weren’t two games on the bounce where he played the same team. Heckingbottom himself said he was using them for players match fitness. We came through the group stages unscathed. it was his gamble ( not one I personally was happy with) but it achieved the goal. Now it’s a stick to beat him with as we didn’t run over them? Bizarre.
Yesterday we dominated and whilst it wasn’t clever at times we were comfortable winners.
One deffeat at Ibrox where when it was 11?v11 we competed.aye they had chances but that’s what going there is all about. Nobody’s going there to. boss them.
The negativity is unjust. Be concerned by all means but we have so called fans writing off new players, old players and a management team that have done just fine. This place is mental and getting more mental by the day.

An issue for me is that he was very clear that the group games were to be used as ‘pre season’ games. I didn’t agree with it but we got through unscathed, so fair enough.

However, pre season should prepare you for the season and I don’t think we look prepared. I think we look disjointed and he still doesn’t have a clue what his best team is. As for competing at Ibrox 11v11, I’d hate to have seen how the game went had we not competed. It was a miracle we were still in the game at all. And I’m not sure about being comfortable winners yesterday either, although we did score some good goals.

PeeJay
18-08-2019, 03:14 PM
That’s our record this season and seems a good few of our “support” want Heckingbottom out....

Absolutely ridiculous.

I’ll settle for that win ratio throughout the season.

You think this "win" ratio is something that this team can maintain throughout the season? We don't have what you could meaningfully refer to as a defence: so I see some problems ahead unless that gets sorted quickly.

Borderhibbie76
18-08-2019, 03:16 PM
We had similar performances in the early stages of the League Cup in previous seasons under previous managers though. What’s the difference this time?Yup that's very true last year against Ross Co where we scraped a 3 2 win and I think Livi at home the year before where we needed a last min Stokes pen to win??

And the year before that Lennons hibs were beaten at ER by QOS

Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk

calumhibee1
18-08-2019, 03:40 PM
You think this "win" ratio is something that this team can maintain throughout the season? We don't have what you could meaningfully refer to as a defence: so I see some problems ahead unless that gets sorted quickly.

The defence is much the same as the one that finished last season with our best defensive record for nearly 20 years. (I’m sure I read that somewhere anyway).

I wouldn’t write off the likes of Hanlon etc just yet but they do need to improve.

greenlex
18-08-2019, 03:44 PM
At first glance, that looks like a fair argument, but what have you seen that gives you confidence that performances will improve? :dunno:

I'm not saying that they won't, but I don't see any signs of progress. I'm only watching games on Hibs TV when I already know the result, so maybe that skews my viewpoint, but I'm really not sure what Hecky's trying to achieve.

By the way, I've not written anyone off yet, but that day isn't as far away as it should be.

It'll be time for PH to go when someone trots out the "Alex Ferguson nearly got sacked before they won the FA Cup" line. :greengrin
I’m not confident they will improve but they should. To be honest how much do they need to improve? They aren’t that bad imo. Take ibrox out it. Defend the goals better in the other games and I don’t think we would be having the negative vibes at all. There a lot of new players and older ones coming back from injury. The point I’m trying to make is they aren’t as bad as being painted. I think once he knows his starting 11 and get in that elusive defensive midfielder we will be just fine. (I’m not buying the line we’re finished in the transfer front as I think that’s bluff for negotiating.) If things start to fall to bits pre break I’ll be shouting for his removal but we are far away from that as far as results in particular go.

Brightside
18-08-2019, 03:49 PM
We scored 5 goals yesterday. Defensively we were a bit shambolic but it wasn’t eye bleeding.

I also thought we played some decent stuff against St Mirren.

Our goals have all been decent football and we’ve created a load of chances. This nonsense about the football being rubbish is weird.

greenlex
18-08-2019, 03:51 PM
An issue for me is that he was very clear that the group games were to be used as ‘pre season’ games. I didn’t agree with it but we got through unscathed, so fair enough.

However, pre season should prepare you for the season and I don’t think we look prepared. I think we look disjointed and he still doesn’t have a clue what his best team is. As for competing at Ibrox 11v11, I’d hate to have seen how the game went had we not competed. It was a miracle we were still in the game at all. And I’m not sure about being comfortable winners yesterday either, although we did score some good goals.

Yesterday’s stats.

hibs 62% possession
17 shots with 9 on target to 15 and 4 for Morton
12 corners to 4
19 fouls to 12


seems cut n dried to me.

calumhibee1
18-08-2019, 03:53 PM
Yesterday’s stats.

hibs 62% possession
17 shots with 9 on target to 15 and 4 for Morton
12 corners to 4
19 fouls to 12


seems cut n dried to me.

I wouldn’t go as far as saying we were comfortable but we certainly deserved to win :agree:

Barman Stanton
18-08-2019, 03:53 PM
Our goals have all been decent football and we’ve created a load of chances. This nonsense about the football being rubbish is weird.

Some have made so much noise about us being terrible, you get the feeling they don’t want to be proven wrong. It’s hard to imagine Hibs fans wanting us to fail but...

calumhibee1
18-08-2019, 03:55 PM
Some have made so much noise about us being terrible, you get the feeling they don’t want to be proven wrong. It’s hard to imagine Hibs fans not wanting us to fail but...

:agree:

It’s definitely the case with some posters. Yesterday was the best case scenario for them. We still won but they still get to hammer the team and manager for it.

B.H.F.C
18-08-2019, 04:00 PM
Yesterday’s stats.

hibs 62% possession
17 shots with 9 on target to 15 and 4 for Morton
12 corners to 4
19 fouls to 12


seems cut n dried to me.

What about 90 minutes, 3-3?

Did we deserve to win, aye. Did we win comfortably, naw.

And if you’re keen on stats, take a look at the stats from last week when we were apparently competing.

Barman Stanton
18-08-2019, 04:01 PM
:agree:

It’s definitely the case with some posters. Yesterday was the best case scenario for them. We still won but they still get to hammer the team and manager for it.

Indeed. Some refuse to accept we even won yesterday ffs. Hey form is patchy at the moment and there is definitely some question marks about some of the new players. But the market we are in there are never guarantees. Get behind them and you never know, it may turn out good.

The_Horde
18-08-2019, 04:03 PM
What about 90 minutes, 3-3?

Did we deserve to win, aye. Did we win comfortably, naw.

And if you’re keen on stats, take a look at the stats from last week when we were apparently competing.

Deary me.

Sensible, positive opinions only please.

calumhibee1
18-08-2019, 04:04 PM
Indeed. Some refuse to accept we even won yesterday ffs. Hey form is patchy at the moment and there is definitely some question marks about some of the new players. But the market we are in there are never guarantees. Get behind them and you never know, it may turn out good.

The refusal to accept we won sums it up for me. An absolutely ridiculous stance to take.

An example I gave earlier was if we had went to extra time against the Huns and won the cup. You can guarantee nobody would be saying we won the cup by drawing with Rangers.

greenlex
18-08-2019, 04:12 PM
What about 90 minutes, 3-3?

Did we deserve to win, aye. Did we win comfortably, naw.

And if you’re keen on stats, take a look at the stats from last week when we were apparently competing.
What about 3-3 in 90 mins. What’s your point here? We won the tie comfortably. The stats tell you that. We created plenty and scored 5 over the 120 mins. A couple of defensive blunders and it went to extra time.
I also keep hearing how pish Morton are. Two games in and sitting third in the Championship. Scoring plenty goals this season too overall.

Are there 11 v 11 stats available for last week? I’d be interested in them. I know what the full game ones are and overall it’s a bit one sided.

B.H.F.C
18-08-2019, 04:43 PM
What about 3-3 in 90 mins. What’s your point here? We won the tie comfortably. The stats tell you that. We created plenty and scored 5 over the 120 mins. A couple of defensive blunders and it went to extra time.
I also keep hearing how pish Morton are. Two games in and sitting third in the Championship. Scoring plenty goals this season too overall.

Are there 11 v 11 stats available for last week? I’d be interested in them. I know what the full game ones are and overall it’s a bit one sided.

My point is that you can’t draw a game over 90 minutes and say we won comfortably. The fact it went to extra time despite us scoring three goals shows we were anything but comfortable.

If there were stats available for 11v11 last week, they wouldn't make great reading. I know we’d mustered two shots on goal. Our goal itself and a 30 yard effort from Mallan. Rangers had probably had 15-20 shots with at least 6 or 7 clear cut chances. We didn’t compete at all.

greenlex
18-08-2019, 04:48 PM
My point is that you can’t draw a game over 90 minutes and say we won comfortably. The fact it went to extra time despite us scoring three goals shows we were anything but comfortable.

If there were stats available for 11v11 last week, they wouldn't make great reading. I know we’d mustered two shots on goal. Our goal itself and a 30 yard effort from Mallan. Rangers had probably had 15-20 shots with at least 6 or 7 clear cut chances. We didn’t compete at all.
Have to disagree about yesterday then. I think we were mugged over 90 mins after being comfortable. Only one winner in extra time. Comfortable.

Last week at 2- 1 with 11 on the park we weren’t out if it and by definition competing. We were obviously under the cosh but still competing.

Hibbyradge
18-08-2019, 04:51 PM
Some have made so much noise about us being terrible, you get the feeling they don’t want to be proven wrong. It’s hard to imagine Hibs fans wanting us to fail but...

People don't want Hibs to fail and it's s cheap shot to suggest they do.

Brightside
18-08-2019, 04:56 PM
People don't want Hibs to fail and it's s cheap shot to suggest they do.

I’d suggest a few on here revel in misery.

calumhibee1
18-08-2019, 04:59 PM
People don't want Hibs to fail and it's s cheap shot to suggest they do.

I have no doubt in my mind that yesterday was the perfect result for some. They want rid of PH but will still want Hibs to progress in the cup. They got the progression and they also in their mind still have reason to moan about him.

oldbutdim
18-08-2019, 06:02 PM
I’d suggest a few on here revel in misery.

A few?

I can think of hordes.

:cb

greenlex
18-08-2019, 06:03 PM
A few?

I can think of hordes.

:cb
:thumbsup:

Allant1981
18-08-2019, 06:03 PM
A few?

I can think of hordes.

:cb

😁

Sammy7nil
18-08-2019, 06:34 PM
People don't want Hibs to fail and it's s cheap shot to suggest they do.

I know a few people that would accept defeats in the short term if Hecky was sacked i am not one of them.

KDY Hibs
18-08-2019, 06:46 PM
You have to take account of the quality of the opposition, the performances and the hope for the future.

Black and white it is a great record scratch below the surface and there are issues.

The truth probably lies some where in between the extremes on this board.

Right now no Hibs fans would relish an away trip anywhere let alone Ibrox, Celtic Park, Tyncastle which would strike a good deal of fear in most.

I certainly don't fear a trip to tynecastle.

Sammy7nil
18-08-2019, 06:47 PM
I certainly don't fear a trip to tynecastle.

Congratulations :greengrin

Hibbyradge
18-08-2019, 06:56 PM
I know few people that would accept defeats in the short term if Hecky was sacked i am not one of them.

You know few?

I know none. :wink:

The_Horde
18-08-2019, 07:14 PM
A few?

I can think of hordes.

:cb

Very clever. I bet you're so proud of yourself. I see your personal vendetta continues, do you ever post about anything other than me?

Iggy Pope
18-08-2019, 07:18 PM
Very clever. I bet you're so proud of yourself. I see your personal vendetta continues, do you ever post about anything other than me?

He’s very entertaining and often spot on but 14,000 posts from you will tell you that he’s not always posting about you. What did you call yourself before?

Actually, scratch that I’ve worked it out.

The_Horde
18-08-2019, 07:21 PM
I’d suggest a few on here revel in misery.

I'd suggest a few on here are happy to accept mediocrity. It's the kind of straw clutching attitude that got us relegated actually.

KDY Hibs
18-08-2019, 07:25 PM
Congratulations :greengrin

Thank you!

sadtom
18-08-2019, 07:26 PM
Or alternatively...1 win. 2 draws. 4 defeats in our last 7 league games. Scored 4 conceded 11.
Statistics eh?

The_Horde
18-08-2019, 07:30 PM
Or alternatively...1 win. 2 draws. 4 defeats in our last 7 league games. Scored 4 conceded 11.
Statistics eh?

These are the stats that count.

Funny how the people who argue the league cup group stages should be counted are quite happy to disregard the performances in them.

greenlex
18-08-2019, 07:33 PM
These are the stats that count.

Funny how the people who argue the league cup group stages should be counted are quite happy to disregard the performances in them.
I see. So only the stats you agree with count. How far do you want to go back? I’m sure you could go back to the beginning and find we have been **** for most of our existence. We should just shut the doors and give up.

The_Horde
18-08-2019, 07:37 PM
Anyway, it seems once again we're going down the path of unfounded accusations. It's quite clear that a certain few won't accept that things aren't always rosy and a (so called) negative opionion or criticism can ever be justified.

I'll leave you all to enjoy a wonderfully over the top positive debate.

angus hibby
18-08-2019, 07:49 PM
Or alternatively...1 win. 2 draws. 4 defeats in our last 7 league games. Scored 4 conceded 11.
Statistics eh?

Seeing as you are counting last season, did you have doubts about Heckingbottom in the summer?

matty_f
18-08-2019, 07:50 PM
Or alternatively...1 win. 2 draws. 4 defeats in our last 7 league games. Scored 4 conceded 11.
Statistics eh?

Why just the last 7? Why not take it back to Hecky’s first league game?

matty_f
18-08-2019, 07:51 PM
These are the stats that count.

Funny how the people who argue the league cup group stages should be counted are quite happy to disregard the performances in them.

Who has argued that?

Heisenberg
18-08-2019, 07:55 PM
I'd suggest a few on here are happy to accept mediocrity. It's the kind of straw clutching attitude that got us relegated actually.

The reason we got relegated was because we weren’t willing to accept mediocrity surely? If we’d kept Fenlon we would’ve finished 5th/6th/7th. Instead we went all out for what was a high profile appointment and got relegated. The fans chased out Fenlon for being boring and mediocre.

Billy Whizz
18-08-2019, 07:56 PM
Vela as an alleged DM, has now scored more goals for Hibs, than Bartley and Milligan did for Hibs. Just saying like

Diclonius
18-08-2019, 08:02 PM
Vela as an alleged DM, has now scored more goals for Hibs, than Bartley and Milligan did for Hibs. Just saying like

He should be defending, not scoring! :grr:

I'm no longer totally convinced by the manager, and that's because of our performances as opposed to the results. However, if we won our next five games - which are all more than winnable - a lot of the criticism would disappear.

A striker and DM before the window closes also wouldn't do any harm!

green day
18-08-2019, 08:09 PM
Or alternatively...1 win. 2 draws. 4 defeats in our last 7 league games. Scored 4 conceded 11.
Statistics eh?

Ah, so now we are playing the "cant use league cup matches" even though that is obviously part of any managers stats?

How about.............just for fun................we use the whole league record of Hecky and Stockdale at Hibs? After all, its not a large number?

Played 15, won 7 drawn 4 lost 4

(Full) Statistics, eh?:rolleyes:

Billy Whizz
18-08-2019, 08:14 PM
He should be defending, not scoring! :grr:

I'm no longer totally convinced by the manager, and that's because of our performances as opposed to the results. However, if we won our next five games - which are all more than winnable - a lot of the criticism would disappear.

A striker and DM before the window closes also wouldn't do any harm!

He’s not a DM though, who said he was?

04Sauzee
18-08-2019, 08:25 PM
A few?

I can think of hordes.

:cb

👌😂

greenlex
18-08-2019, 08:26 PM
Vela as an alleged DM, has now scored more goals for Hibs, than Bartley and Milligan did for Hibs. Just saying like


He’s not a DM though, who said he was?
unless I’m going mental you did?:confused:

oldbutdim
18-08-2019, 08:32 PM
Very clever. I bet you're so proud of yourself. I see your personal vendetta continues, do you ever post about anything other than me?

I just checked.
Over 2200 posts.

Despite your obvious sense of self worth I doubt they are all about you.

But I suppose you’ll have to add this one to your list.



It’s not all about you, you know.
This is a Hibs site.

Apart from the odd Livingston or Hearts fan obviously.

007
18-08-2019, 08:53 PM
Ah, so now we are playing the "cant use league cup matches" even though that is obviously part of any managers stats?

How about.............just for fun................we use the whole league record of Hecky and Stockdale at Hibs? After all, its not a large number?

Played 15, won 7 drawn 4 lost 4

(Full) Statistics, eh?:rolleyes:

Ah, but what about their record against the top 6? :greengrin

Brightside
18-08-2019, 09:20 PM
He should be defending, not scoring! :grr:

I'm no longer totally convinced by the manager, and that's because of our performances as opposed to the results. However, if we won our next five games - which are all more than winnable - a lot of the criticism would disappear.

A striker and DM before the window closes also wouldn't do any harm!

If we win the next 5 games he should get an contract extension. We don’t want much as Hibs fans eh.

Sammy7nil
18-08-2019, 10:11 PM
You know few?

I know none. :wink:

Ha ha punctuation, grammar and typing never been strengths. Luckily they are only essential in my current job. :greengrin

basehibby
18-08-2019, 10:38 PM
That’s our record this season and seems a good few of our “support” want Heckingbottom out....

Absolutely ridiculous.

I’ll settle for that win ratio throughout the season.

It's a fair point that it's far too early to determine where we really are as a team and the overall capabilities of our manager.

However - fans are concerned about the quality of Hecky's signings and his style of play. This is a Hibs internet forum so of course these concerns are going to be expressed here.

I certainly hope that he will come good, that the skelping at the hands of the huns was just a blip and we'll have a scorcher of a season. I'm certainly willing to give him a chance - much improvement needed to shut up the critics though.

Captain Trips
18-08-2019, 10:51 PM
That’s our record this season and seems a good few of our “support” want Heckingbottom out....

Absolutely ridiculous.

I’ll settle for that win ratio throughout the season.

We will all accept that ratio however we don't play 5 of those teams on a regular basis "throughout the season". I don't want him out but I am quite pissed off at his approach vs Sevco and Celtic. His ratio in the cup is excellent this season his ratio in league not so however 2 games into league campaign is not going to suggest how will end.

monktonharp
18-08-2019, 11:11 PM
I have no doubt in my mind that yesterday was the perfect result for some. They want rid of PH but will still want Hibs to progress in the cup. They got the progression and they also in their mind still have reason to moan about him. to sheer myself up, I think of the last 2 games as 8 goal thrillers. and, we actually scored 7 in the last game.:wink:

basehibby
18-08-2019, 11:22 PM
Only one team yesterday didn't need extra time, and that included Celtic against lower league opposition. It happens, and the reaction from other fan groups isn't as extreme.

Other managers got far more of a time for their players to bed in than PH has had. The searing negativity in this forum in the last two weeks has been unbearable. I don't quite understand why.

It's easy to understand why:

1) None of Heckys signings have thus far set the heather on fire making us look distinctly average (this perception may yet change but that's how it is at the mo)
2) We got utterly horsed off the Rangers last week - in a way even the happiest of clappers should deem unacceptable.
3) This is Hibs.net which once upon a time morphed onto the internet from a fanzine called Mass Hibsteria - so what else do you expect FFS?!?

Fife-Hibee
18-08-2019, 11:35 PM
I’ll settle for that win ratio throughout the season.

I reckon we all would.

But that's not going to be our win ratio throughout the season based on the quality of the performances so far.

basehibby
18-08-2019, 11:36 PM
Yesterday’s stats.

hibs 62% possession
17 shots with 9 on target to 15 and 4 for Morton
12 corners to 4
19 fouls to 12


seems cut n dried to me.

Not cut and dried at all - Morton had much less possession but managed to look dangerous just about every time they went forward and scored three goals. I think that's a real concern as the teams in our league are likely to have a lot more going forward than Morton.

We won which is what matters but it was very far from cut and dried.

monktonharp
18-08-2019, 11:42 PM
yesterdays stats. Hibs players score 7 . Morton player nick's 1. I know, I know

MWHIBBIES
19-08-2019, 05:48 AM
5 out of 7 but the football is eye bleeding

15 goals in 7 games with 3 more perfectly good ones disallowed. Eye bleeding stuff.

Since452
19-08-2019, 05:49 AM
15 goals in 7 games with 3 more perfectly good ones disallowed. Eye bleeding stuff.

If you want goals go to Easter Road!

Since452
19-08-2019, 06:01 AM
If we win again on Saturday the turnstiles and food kiosks will be getting it tight from me. Love being outraged.

Phil MaGlass
19-08-2019, 06:40 AM
5 from 7 not bad going. Might be a struggle but still 5 from 7, onwards and upwards

Allant1981
19-08-2019, 06:46 AM
5 from 7 not bad going. Might be a struggle but still 5 from 7, onwards and upwards

Yip, dont think anyone has said the football has been pretty but a manager has never been sacked as far as I know for playing boring football and we certainly cant say we haven't seen goals recently!! Unfortunately some fans cant take to the manager no matter what, there always seems to be another reason to have a go at him

Brightside
19-08-2019, 07:28 AM
Yip, dont think anyone has said the football has been pretty but a manager has never been sacked as far as I know for playing boring football and we certainly cant say we haven't seen goals recently!! Unfortunately some fans cant take to the manager no matter what, there always seems to be another reason to have a go at him

The football has been pretty. Go watch the highlights of our last 10 goals. Crackers.

Allant1981
19-08-2019, 07:45 AM
The football has been pretty. Go watch the highlights of our last 10 goals. Crackers.

Our attacking play yes but let's not kid on that we have been playing like barcelona, there has been very sloppy play in a lot of our games, especially from the defenders. I've defended the team to the hilt on here but we havent been pretty in quite a few. But I'll say it again its results that matter

neil7908
19-08-2019, 07:52 AM
A win against St Johnstone and I think a lot will calm down down. Yes we've won most of our games but 1 against SPL opposition.

We got through against Morton which is the main thing. But no one watching that will surely not have come away without some big reservations given we shipped some very easy goals for the 2nd game running.

RIP
19-08-2019, 08:05 AM
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Hibernian_F.C._managers


14 managers in 21 years - 1998-2019
Each new manager persuades the Hibs board he needs to build his own team
Squad overhaul every summer - weeks/months of each season wasted getting new players to 'gel'
Millions of pounds wasted in signing fees, agent commission and new contracts for temporary players
Few new signings make a permanent difference / stay more than 2 years.
Next manager bins many of previous manager's recruits.
Manager's new favourites preferred over youth development.
Young players see no future, want away


Is this just the world of football these days or is there a better way? When considering a director of football, was the George Craig role the right answer to the managerial and player merry-go-round?

Those of you who've watch the cabbage since the Alex Miller days - be interested to hear your views?

bingo70
19-08-2019, 08:10 AM
A win against St Johnstone and I think a lot will calm down down. Yes we've won most of our games but 1 against SPL opposition.

We got through against Morton which is the main thing. But no one watching that will surely not have come away without some big reservations given we shipped some very easy goals for the 2nd game running.

Having calmed down from the weekend I agree.

We’ve got 5 winnable games ahead of us as well as the transfer window being open until the end of the month. Right now I’ve got alarm bells ringing but it won’t be full on panic mode until we see how we do over the next few games.

Big month ahead for Heckers and I do think we’ll struggle in the bigger games if we don’t sort out that midfield and add some steel to it.

Since452
19-08-2019, 08:15 AM
Next week is another week down the line for Stevenson and Gray fitness wise. Anothe week of gelling for the new lads etc. We'll get there in terms of performances. We're definitely in transition but we're winning thats the main thing.

calumhibee1
19-08-2019, 08:22 AM
Having calmed down from the weekend I agree.

We’ve got 5 winnable games ahead of us as well as the transfer window being open until the end of the month. Right now I’ve got alarm bells ringing but it won’t be full on panic mode until we see how we do over the next few games.

Big month ahead for Heckers and I do think we’ll struggle in the bigger games if we don’t sort out that midfield and add some steel to it.

I’ve backed the team and manager the last couple of games and I think this is a reasonable position you’ve taken. If we beat St J we’ll have actually had a great start to the season. If we got beat then I’m not going to go mental but it would maybe start to give me a slight doubt about where we’re headed.

From the sounds of things with the King rumour it certainly sounds like we’re not done and PH is in the market for a CM. Thats encouraging.

jeffers
19-08-2019, 08:23 AM
Next week is another week down the line for Stevenson and Gray fitness wise. Anothe week of gelling for the new lads etc. We'll get there in terms of performances. We're definitely in transition but we're winning thats the main thing.

Not seen it mentioned anywhere so I'm maybe imagining it, but I thought Gray went off injured again on Saturday ?

Since452
19-08-2019, 08:28 AM
I’ve backed the team and manager the last couple of games and I think this is a reasonable position you’ve taken. If we beat St J we’ll have actually had a great start to the season. If we got beat then I’m not going to go mental but it would maybe start to give me a slight doubt about where we’re headed.

From the sounds of things with the King rumour it certainly sounds like we’re not done and PH is in the market for a CM. Thats encouraging.

And with one of the Glasgow teams out the way too. We could find ourselves 5 points ahead of Hearts already with them being at Celtic Park

B.H.F.C
19-08-2019, 08:31 AM
Not seen it mentioned anywhere so I'm maybe imagining it, but I thought Gray went off injured again on Saturday ?

He did take a couple of knocks, which seems to happen to him most weeks! I thought he looked a fair bit away from being fit, hopefully the hour and a bit he played will have helped him.

ian cruise
19-08-2019, 08:35 AM
Yip, dont think anyone has said the football has been pretty but a manager has never been sacked as far as I know for playing boring football and we certainly cant say we haven't seen goals recently!! Unfortunately some fans cant take to the manager no matter what, there always seems to be another reason to have a go at him

Couldn't make the game on Saturday unfortunately but the match day thread was crackers, when we were ahead initially we were apparently playing great football, then we went behind and it was eye bleeding stuff, then we went ahead again and we were totally in control until the equaliser and it read like we were terrible all game. Absolute Jekyll and Hyde stuff.

I am a big fan of Monkton Harp's "we scored 7 goals" point of view, was perfect response for Jambo in my team this morning, he didnt see it coming.

Allant1981
19-08-2019, 08:42 AM
Couldn't make the game on Saturday unfortunately but the match day thread was crackers, when we were ahead initially we were apparently playing great football, then we went behind and it was eye bleeding stuff, then we went ahead again and we were totally in control until the equaliser and it read like we were terrible all game. Absolute Jekyll and Hyde stuff.

I am a big fan of Monkton Harp's "we scored 7 goals" point of view, was perfect response for Jambo in my team this morning, he didnt see it coming.

Going forward we are doing ok, if the defence get their act together then I think we will have a good season, no point in having a good attack if we are rotten at the back, arsenal have been a good example of that in recent years

IWasThere2016
19-08-2019, 08:46 AM
You have to take account of the quality of the opposition, the performances and the hope for the future.

Black and white it is a great record scratch below the surface and there are issues.

The truth probably lies some where in between the extremes on this board.

Right now no Hibs fans would relish an away trip anywhere let alone Ibrox, Celtic Park, Tyncastle which would strike a good deal of fear in most.

:agree: I read one post yesterday said "we've only beaten St Mirren - that's it" .. err.. we've only lost to Rangers (with ten men) - there's little balance on here.

Since452
19-08-2019, 08:46 AM
I cant help but think we're going to have a good season. Like the poster above says we are decent going forward. Defence will sort itself out once Gray and Louis are up to speed and everyone has settled in. We played some really good stuff on Saturday which seems to have beem overlooked with the defensive mistakes.

FilipinoHibs
19-08-2019, 08:47 AM
Couldn't make the game on Saturday unfortunately but the match day thread was crackers, when we were ahead initially we were apparently playing great football, then we went behind and it was eye bleeding stuff, then we went ahead again and we were totally in control until the equaliser and it read like we were terrible all game. Absolute Jekyll and Hyde stuff.

I am a big fan of Monkton Harp's "we scored 7 goals" point of view, was perfect response for Jambo in my team this morning, he didnt see it coming.

I watched on Hibs TV and thought we played nice passing football. We did look nervous and vulnerable every time Morton attacked. Even though they had a lot less pocession. Was same for ST Mirren game although we were ponderous.

calumhibee1
19-08-2019, 08:47 AM
And with one of the Glasgow teams out the way too. We could find ourselves 5 points ahead of Hearts already with them being at Celtic Park

Yup. If you work on the basis that away to the OF is pretty much a free hit, which imo it is then we’ve had a great start results wise.

I realise that I’m using selective stats which I’ve moaned at others for doing btw :greengrin

Brightside
19-08-2019, 08:50 AM
Going forward we are doing ok, if the defence get their act together then I think we will have a good season, no point in having a good attack if we are rotten at the back, arsenal have been a good example of that in recent years

We aren’t defending as a team as tight as we have done in the past. Wide players have to provide more support to the FB and at least one of CMs should be working back to support the CBs. It’s basic stuff but it’s not quite working right now.

Allant1981
19-08-2019, 08:55 AM
We aren’t defending as a team as tight as we have done in the past. Wide players have to provide more support to the FB and at least one of CMs should be working back to support the CBs. It’s basic stuff but it’s not quite working right now.

Yip and this is where the coaching staff earn their wage, if we get a settled defence and midfield then I think it will be fine

Since452
19-08-2019, 08:57 AM
Yup. If you work on the basis that away to the OF is pretty much a free hit, which imo it is then we’ve had a great start results wise.

Definitely. I'm not saying Hearts are the barometer but getting a gap on them early is good. They did it to us last season which was frustrating and left us playing catch up until late on. 5 points ahead after 3 games would be a great start and gets us a bit of momentum. If we beat St Johnstone I'll be quite optimistic going forward.

IWasThere2016
19-08-2019, 08:58 AM
We aren’t defending as a team as tight as we have done in the past. Wide players have to provide more support to the FB and at least one of CMs should be working back to support the CBs. It’s basic stuff but it’s not quite working right now.

Yup - watched City v Spuds and Poch hooked Harry Winks for not tracking v City. It is the basics.

B.H.F.C
19-08-2019, 09:01 AM
I cant help but think we're going to have a good season. Like the poster above says we are decent going forward. Defence will sort itself out once Gray and Louis are up to speed and everyone has settled in. We played some really good stuff on Saturday which seems to have beem overlooked with the defensive mistakes.

Going forward definitely shouldn’t be an issue. You could argue that the forward players already have some decent numbers against their names in terms of goals and assists (Kamberi, Allan and Horgan whilst Doidge has actually made a couple of important contributions).

Concern defensively is that we will be saying the same things in a few months time. Stevenson will be fine as he’s rarely injured but Gray getting fit and staying fit is a concern. And if we don’t sign anybody else in midfield, the defence will continue to be exposed.

calumhibee1
19-08-2019, 09:04 AM
Going forward definitely shouldn’t be an issue. You could argue that the forward players already have some decent numbers against their names in terms of goals and assists (Kamberi, Allan and Horgan whilst Doidge has actually made a couple of important contributions).

Concern defensively is that we will be saying the same things in a few months time. Stevenson will be fine as he’s rarely injured but Gray getting fit and staying fit is a concern. And if we don’t sign anybody else in midfield, the defence will continue to be exposed.

Another deeper midfielder is an absolute necessity, it’s as simple as that. If the budget is gone then it needs to be increased to allow one more.

Another striker and/or winger would be lovely aswell but we can get by without them imo.

Since452
19-08-2019, 09:04 AM
Going forward definitely shouldn’t be an issue. You could argue that the forward players already have some decent numbers against their names in terms of goals and assists (Kamberi, Allan and Horgan whilst Doidge has actually made a couple of important contributions).

Concern defensively is that we will be saying the same things in a few months time. Stevenson will be fine as he’s rarely injured but Gray getting fit and staying fit is a concern. And if we don’t sign anybody else in midfield, the defence will continue to be exposed.

Hard to disagree with that. We'd definitely benefit from another DM coming in unless we try Jackson in there. Might be an option.

Smartie
19-08-2019, 09:07 AM
I cant help but think we're going to have a good season. Like the poster above says we are decent going forward. Defence will sort itself out once Gray and Louis are up to speed and everyone has settled in. We played some really good stuff on Saturday which seems to have beem overlooked with the defensive mistakes.

I have absolutely no idea what sort of season we're going to have, as it looks to me like it might go any one of a few ways.

We have already played some great stuff at times, and we've managed to dig deep to get good results at others.

Some of the defending was dreadful at the weekend and at Ibrox but that is reasonably out of character. I like all of our defenders and both the goalkeepers.

The window being open is a double edged sword. If we were to add another attacking option and a bit of nastiness to the midfield then I'd have to say that I'd be very happy with our strongest team. We're very vulnerable to the injury of key players right now though (Allan, Vela, Flo) and the lack of squad depth is very concerning although I am normally in favour of young players getting an opportunity where possible.

The other thing about the transfer window is that we are a cheeky bid for Marciano or Flo away from being in deep trouble.

I wouldn't say I'm confident as there is so much that could so easily derail us but there are definitely reasons to be optimistic. There are also areas of concern though so we'll need to wait and see.

This season is a tough one to call, especially as all of the other teams are so hard to read at this point.

Since452
19-08-2019, 09:22 AM
I have absolutely no idea what sort of season we're going to have, as it looks to me like it might go any one of a few ways.

We have already played some great stuff at times, and we've managed to dig deep to get good results at others.

Some of the defending was dreadful at the weekend and at Ibrox but that is reasonably out of character. I like all of our defenders and both the goalkeepers.

The window being open is a double edged sword. If we were to add another attacking option and a bit of nastiness to the midfield then I'd have to say that I'd be very happy with our strongest team. We're very vulnerable to the injury of key players right now though (Allan, Vela, Flo) and the lack of squad depth is very concerning although I am normally in favour of young players getting an opportunity where possible.

The other thing about the transfer window is that we are a cheeky bid for Marciano or Flo away from being in deep trouble.

I wouldn't say I'm confident as there is so much that could so easily derail us but there are definitely reasons to be optimistic. There are also areas of concern though so we'll need to wait and see.

This season is a tough one to call, especially as all of the other teams are so hard to read at this point.

Yeah an injury to Scotty or Flo would be a bit of a disaster. They're our two stand out players. Crucial they stay fit and avaliable.

neil7908
19-08-2019, 09:56 AM
Having calmed down from the weekend I agree.

We’ve got 5 winnable games ahead of us as well as the transfer window being open until the end of the month. Right now I’ve got alarm bells ringing but it won’t be full on panic mode until we see how we do over the next few games.

Big month ahead for Heckers and I do think we’ll struggle in the bigger games if we don’t sort out that midfield and add some steel to it.

This is where I am as well.

Gun to my head I'm not sure he'll be here in 12 months but I think our start has been OK but we've displayed some alarming weaknesses that won't just magically fix themselves.

ekhibee
20-08-2019, 06:01 PM
Having calmed down from the weekend I agree.

We’ve got 5 winnable games ahead of us as well as the transfer window being open until the end of the month. Right now I’ve got alarm bells ringing but it won’t be full on panic mode until we see how we do over the next few games.

Big month ahead for Heckers and I do think we’ll struggle in the bigger games if we don’t sort out that midfield and add some steel to it.

Yes, totally agree with you, every word, but remember, if there's even the slightest hint of criticism you'll get shot down by the happy clappers.