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GORDONSMITH7
12-07-2019, 02:47 PM
Well we met Wee Ron!

As mentioned in our last update 3 St Pats committee members along with the HSA and other Branch officials were invited to attend a Ďget to know youí session at ER hosted by Ron Gordon and Leann Dempster, 10th July. We were also pleased to be accompanied by Branch Member and Board Member Kieran Power

As a lot of members have rightly shown interest in this item and we thought it best to update the full Branch as quickly as possible.

Remembering the man has only been in the club a week or so, I guess this session was more about pressing the flesh and ticking the box in meeting the fan representation; sorry that sounds a bit negative and it was far from it, See Brian Duffyís bullet points from the session below.

RG is looking to grow the club organisationally / infrastructure wise as much as he is looking to build on pitch growth

He believes we should be consistently challenging at top end of league , similar to Aberdeen
He feels that we already have a competitive and healthy transfer budget and need to operate creatively.

RG appears to want to focus on development from grassroots / academy up and is committed to building an indoor training facility alongside existing EM facilities. He suggested this might cost 3 - 4 million

RG is looking to the fans to "pony up" and contribute financially to this project

The original HSL objective of achieving 51% club ownership is dead and buried, RG owns 67% of shares , HSL and others 33%. There are no additional shares available for sale. RG doesn't view majority fan ownership as a desirable thing for various reasons.

RG talked a lot about community and giving back to the community which was good to hear and very much in tune with our branch ethos

Dougie asked what RG wants from us and he said our continued support.

Theres been internet speculation about stadium naming rights. I asked RG and he said there are no plans for this, it would take "big money " for us to go down that route he would want Easter Road to remain in any new stadium name.

We invited RG to a Branch meeting and he responded very positively asking us to arrange it via Leeann Dempster.
When we introduced ourselves it was good to know that he was already aware of the roots of the club.

We also caught up with LD, she too was very positive and as always took interest in our Branches view. She agreed to speak at a further full branch meeting in the future
Our observation is he sees himself as a servant to the club and wider community and he does not see his involvement as a means to make money.

Overall impression was that he is both enthusiastic and excited.

Dougie McLeod

St Patrick's Branch Chair

GGTTH

Keith_M
12-07-2019, 02:52 PM
He feels that we already have a competitive and healthy transfer budget and need to operate creatively.

RG appears to want to focus on development from grassroots / academy up and is committed to building an indoor training facility alongside existing EM facilities. He suggested this might cost 3 - 4 million
RG is looking to the fans to "pony up" and contribute financially to this project

The original HSL objective of achieving 51% club ownership is dead and buried, RG owns 67% of shares , HSL and others 33%. There are no additional shares available for sale. RG doesn't view majority fan ownership as a desirable thing for various reasons.




Discuss!

:devil:

Man Down Under
12-07-2019, 02:55 PM
Sounds pretty positive. Glad he wants to build from the youth, it's good for Scottish football as a whole.

Sent from my SM-T510 using Tapatalk

Dazzling Doidge
12-07-2019, 02:57 PM
Surely he isn't expecting the fans to cough up 3-4million for the indoor pitch facility :confused:

Please tell me im taking that the wrong way.

Iain G
12-07-2019, 02:58 PM
Surely he isn't expecting the fans to cough up 3-4million for the indoor pitch facility :confused:

Please tell me im taking that the wrong way.

I took it to mean that we keep attending the games in numbers to help fund this?

Since452
12-07-2019, 02:59 PM
Good information thanks. Excited about the expansion of East Mains. The more i hear about his ideas the more comfortable i feel about him being the custodian of our club.

90+2
12-07-2019, 02:59 PM
The phrase for the fans to pony up is coming up far too much for my liking, as if we havenít given enough.

AgentDaleCooper
12-07-2019, 03:01 PM
Does that mean HSL can't acquire enough shares to get a seat on the board? Bad news if do.

Hibee Mac
12-07-2019, 03:06 PM
Think you need to clarify the pony up statement, doesn't come across too well?...

lord bunberry
12-07-2019, 03:09 PM
The only way weíre going to consistently challenge at the top of the league is by having the best or one of the best academies in Scotland. I would hope that the work thatís already gone into the academy has us up there already. The extra push will hopefully see us become the best. Thereís still far too many youngsters heading west from Edinburgh.

Pretty Boy
12-07-2019, 03:10 PM
Is too much being made of the 'pony up' comment by some?

In the limited context it's hard to tell whether it was said as a throwaway line implying the fans should continue to buy tickets etc or whether it was a 'get your hands in your pockets' type comment. I'm sure he will have been made well aware of what Hibs fans have done for the club over the years so I'd lean towards the former whilst again acknowledging that's based on nothing more than a couple of reports from the meeting with little wider context.

Maybe there's a cultural clash at play here as well. It's not uncommon for Americans to be a bit less reserved than we are used to when it comes to talking about money.

Either way nothing from the above post sets any alarm bells ringing, quite the opposite actually.

Hibernia&Alba
12-07-2019, 03:11 PM
Discuss!

:devil:

Wee Ron oot! :greengrin

Seriously though, we can only wait to see the details as they emerge. It's very early days. No doubt some things we'll like, other moves might not be so popular, but we need to hang fire until full plans are put forward.

Cheers G for the update.

90+2
12-07-2019, 03:15 PM
Is too much being made of the 'pony up' comment by some?

In the limited context it's hard to tell whether it was said as a throwaway line implying the fans should continue to buy tickets etc or whether it was a 'get your hands in your pockets' type comment. I'm sure he will have been made well aware of what Hibs fans have done for the club over the years so I'd lean towards the former whilst again acknowledging that's based on nothing more than a couple of reports from the meeting with little wider context.

Maybe there's a cultural clash at play here as well. It's not uncommon for Americans to be a bit less reserved than we are used to when it comes to talking about money.

Either way nothing from the above post sets any alarm bells ringing, quite the opposite actually.

If it was a one off comment then probably. This ďpony upĒ the fans have to do seems to be a big message coming out of all these different meetings.

neil7908
12-07-2019, 03:17 PM
Think you need to clarify the pony up statement, doesn't come across too well?...

That's important. Whatever the meaning the guy has cleared £3m debt and put more into the club. I'm not expecting him to shove millions more in every year to fund players and infrastructure but I'm uncomfortable with any plea for fans to do more when we're already putting lots in.

I'm not sure I share his desire for an indoor training centre, although I appreciate better facilities are unlikely to be a bad thing.

I'm jumping to conclusions and it's natural he'll need time to get up to speed with the club, fans structures etc but I do think it's important for someone to clarify this soon.

Aberdeen are not the 3rd force in Scotland due to better infrastructure. They pay more than us, simple as that. That's the key gap for us to close.

Mikey
12-07-2019, 03:18 PM
The phrase for the fans to pony up is coming up far too much for my liking, as if we havenít given enough.

RG probably only said it once, it's just being repeated.

Mikey
12-07-2019, 03:19 PM
If it was a one off comment then probably. This ďpony upĒ the fans have to do seems to be a big message coming out of all these different meetings.

Hasn't there just been one meeting?

90+2
12-07-2019, 03:21 PM
Hasn't there just been one meeting?

One with the supporters club and one with hsl? I thought this meeting was a new meeting because it was a separate thread, it perhaps was one meeting and in that case the message from RG isnít as thorough, sorry 👍

90+2
12-07-2019, 03:21 PM
RG probably only said it once, it's just being repeated.

Starting to realise that now....doh.

ancient hibee
12-07-2019, 03:23 PM
If it was a one off comment then probably. This ďpony upĒ the fans have to do seems to be a big message coming out of all these different meetings.

What different meetings was this said at?

ancient hibee
12-07-2019, 03:24 PM
What different meetings was this said at?

Forget it.:greengrin

AgentDaleCooper
12-07-2019, 03:26 PM
The phrase for the fans to pony up is coming up far too much for my liking, as if we havenít given enough.

Yeah, if it's not via ticket sales or in exchange for shares then i don't know what that means

Steve20
12-07-2019, 03:33 PM
He might think we have a competitive budget. But if the story of this Ojo is true, we are obviously still not competing with them wages wise. Donít get me wrong, Iím not too fussed about this guy in particular but letís not claim to compete with Aberdeen if players still choose to sign for them over us.

neil7908
12-07-2019, 03:34 PM
That's important. Whatever the meaning the guy has cleared £3m debt and put more into the club. I'm not expecting him to shove millions more in every year to fund players and infrastructure but I'm uncomfortable with any plea for fans to do more when we're already putting lots in.

I'm not sure I share his desire for an indoor training centre, although I appreciate better facilities are unlikely to be a bad thing.

I'm jumping to conclusions and it's natural he'll need time to get up to speed with the club, fans structures etc but I do think it's important for someone to clarify this soon.

Aberdeen are not the 3rd force in Scotland due to better infrastructure. They pay more than us, simple as that. That's the key gap for us to close.

Looking like Ojo signing with Aberdeen. Case in point really. The manager, allure of Edinburgh, better facilities etc make very little difference if a player can get more money somewhere else.

The Captain....
12-07-2019, 03:35 PM
Sick to death of infrastructure projects tbh..we desperately need some quality on the park as a prioirty, lets hope the budget is as competitive as we're being told.

Hibernia&Alba
12-07-2019, 03:39 PM
Sick to death of infrastructure projects tbh..we desperately need some quality on the park as a prioirty, lets hope the budget is as competitive as we're being told.

I'm hopeful we will; and I fully agree with you, that what fans want most of all is a good side to watch, with, hopefully, a bit of success. That'sthe key to keeping a committed fanbase.

we are hibs
12-07-2019, 03:47 PM
Sick to death of infrastructure projects tbh..we desperately need some quality on the park as a prioirty, lets hope the budget is as competitive as we're being told.


Not as competitive as Aberdeen, clearly.

Golden Bear
12-07-2019, 04:07 PM
If I want to "pony up" towards the indoor pitch then I will, other fans will think differently which is their entitlement .

Personal choice is important.

dalkeith stu
12-07-2019, 04:14 PM
The phrase for the fans to pony up is coming up far too much for my liking, as if we havenít given enough.

I dont think we have tbh!! You just need to look at FoH and AberDNA to see how they are doing more than us unfortunately!!

Keith_M
12-07-2019, 04:20 PM
Wee Ron oot! :greengrin

Seriously though, we can only wait to see the details as they emerge. It's very early days. No doubt some things we'll like, other moves might not be so popular, but we need to hang fire until full plans are put forward.

Cheers G for the update.


So no pitchforks yet then?

Dissapointing

Power
12-07-2019, 04:33 PM
Well we met Wee Ron!

As mentioned in our last update 3 St Pats committee members along with the HSA and other Branch officials were invited to attend a Ďget to know youí session at ER hosted by Ron Gordon and Leann Dempster, 10th July. We were also pleased to be accompanied by Branch Member and Board Member Kieran Power

As a lot of members have rightly shown interest in this item and we thought it best to update the full Branch as quickly as possible.

Remembering the man has only been in the club a week or so, I guess this session was more about pressing the flesh and ticking the box in meeting the fan representation; sorry that sounds a bit negative and it was far from it, See Brian Duffyís bullet points from the session below.

RG is looking to grow the club organisationally / infrastructure wise as much as he is looking to build on pitch growth

He believes we should be consistently challenging at top end of league , similar to Aberdeen
He feels that we already have a competitive and healthy transfer budget and need to operate creatively.

RG appears to want to focus on development from grassroots / academy up and is committed to building an indoor training facility alongside existing EM facilities. He suggested this might cost 3 - 4 million

RG is looking to the fans to "pony up" and contribute financially to this project

The original HSL objective of achieving 51% club ownership is dead and buried, RG owns 67% of shares , HSL and others 33%. There are no additional shares available for sale. RG doesn't view majority fan ownership as a desirable thing for various reasons.

RG talked a lot about community and giving back to the community which was good to hear and very much in tune with our branch ethos

Dougie asked what RG wants from us and he said our continued support.

Theres been internet speculation about stadium naming rights. I asked RG and he said there are no plans for this, it would take "big money " for us to go down that route he would want Easter Road to remain in any new stadium name.

We invited RG to a Branch meeting and he responded very positively asking us to arrange it via Leeann Dempster.
When we introduced ourselves it was good to know that he was already aware of the roots of the club.

We also caught up with LD, she too was very positive and as always took interest in our Branches view. She agreed to speak at a further full branch meeting in the future
Our observation is he sees himself as a servant to the club and wider community and he does not see his involvement as a means to make money.

Overall impression was that he is both enthusiastic and excited.

Dougie McLeod

St Patrick's Branch Chair

GGTTH

Cheers G ✅

VivaPalmeiras
12-07-2019, 05:00 PM
Whatís Spanish for ďpony upĒ?
Did he seriously use this phrase ? Apols if covered before but this is the first time
I heard of the use. Is it an interpretation of what he said or a direct quote?

Baldy Foghorn
12-07-2019, 05:14 PM
Whatís Spanish for ďpony upĒ?
Did he seriously use this phrase ? Apols if covered before but this is the first time
I heard of the use. Is it an interpretation of what he said or a direct quote?

Direct quote from RG

southern hibby
12-07-2019, 05:19 PM
For anyone interested I Just google American meaning for the phrase Pony Up.

comes back with pay up or to settle what you owe.

Obviously there may be other meanings out there but this is the meaning that came up for
me.

GGTTH

Lago
12-07-2019, 05:59 PM
Discuss!

:devil:
Ok, 51% fan ownership dead, great news! Pony up is an Americanism that I'm not reading too much into it.

A Hi-Bee
12-07-2019, 06:05 PM
I have no great expectations from Hibs, no miracleís but would hope for steady growth year on year. Keep growing the support, perhaps with a larger amount coming in from HSL (in whatever format it takes in the future) Higher league position, getting into Europe most if not every year.
Perhaps a cup win or two, better quality players as we go along. Pretty relaxed that RG is the man to do this along with time.

madhatter
12-07-2019, 06:16 PM
Community club where normal people pay for the club's betterment...on top of ST, shirts, etc.

I know nothing about where this is going but the snippets coming out of meetings don't fill me with great enthusiasm. We maintained an expensive ST price when in the championship so we could come back up quickly and in a stable manner. Who gets credit? Managers, George Craig and Leeann Dempster and the teams at the club. We did get a thank you sign mind you but this is my problem... the true accolades go to the owners and the football department. Why should fans fund a new £3-4m indoor training facility when we are not the majority shareholder. That's crazy talk tbh. Feed more money into the club that Ron is majority shareholder of and who could ultimately benefit from - buy club, get fans to fund improvement, sell shares in club for more money. Great arrangement for Ron that one, especially since he got the club for relatively cheap.

Many things can be exaggerated but choice of words in small meetings need to be very careful when you haven't got your message out to the masses.

The way this is being mentioned/talked about, its almost like Ron is going to do a crowdfunding scheme. £200 ensures your name is mentioned on the wall of the new indoor training facility and will remain there as long as the building stays. £200,000 ensures one of the training pitches is named after you etc.

Hope this doesn't go the way I'm thinking it might...

jeffers
12-07-2019, 06:31 PM
While it’s only one quote, I found the one about our playing budget interesting. While I’d expect him to be aware of the actual figures, what is it being “competitive” based on and competitive with who ?

Lago
12-07-2019, 08:25 PM
Oh oh, the natives are getting restless, time for a L D address to the nation. :greengrin

lord bunberry
12-07-2019, 08:35 PM
Oh oh, the natives are getting restless, time for a L D address to the nation. :greengrin

Someone probably needs to come out and clarify things. Ron saying he needs the fans to pony up is a very strange thing to say when youíve just bought a football club. Most fans Iíd assume would be thinking that if a new owner came in heíd have the funds in place to realise his ambitions, but it seems thatís not the case. Iím hoping the pony up reference has been misinterpreted by me and he means fans turning up for games and buying merchandise.

Pagan Hibernia
12-07-2019, 08:45 PM
Community club where normal people pay for the club's betterment...on top of ST, shirts, etc.

I know nothing about where this is going but the snippets coming out of meetings don't fill me with great enthusiasm. We maintained an expensive ST price when in the championship so we could come back up quickly and in a stable manner. Who gets credit? Managers, George Craig and Leeann Dempster and the teams at the club. We did get a thank you sign mind you but this is my problem... the true accolades go to the owners and the football department. Why should fans fund a new £3-4m indoor training facility when we are not the majority shareholder. That's crazy talk tbh. Feed more money into the club that Ron is majority shareholder of and who could ultimately benefit from - buy club, get fans to fund improvement, sell shares in club for more money. Great arrangement for Ron that one, especially since he got the club for relatively cheap.

Many things can be exaggerated but choice of words in small meetings need to be very careful when you haven't got your message out to the masses.

The way this is being mentioned/talked about, its almost like Ron is going to do a crowdfunding scheme. £200 ensures your name is mentioned on the wall of the new indoor training facility and will remain there as long as the building stays. £200,000 ensures one of the training pitches is named after you etc.

Hope this doesn't go the way I'm thinking it might...

totally agree. Seems to me some want it both ways. ďYou had your chance and blew it HSL, get over it.... by the way HSL, these new players, academy and indoor pitch wonít buy themselves, pony up!!Ē

Hibernia&Alba
12-07-2019, 08:45 PM
While itís only one quote, I found the one about our playing budget interesting. While Iíd expect him to be aware of the actual figures, what is it being ďcompetitiveĒ based on and competitive with who ?

Fair questions.

Weegreenman
12-07-2019, 09:07 PM
Sick to death of infrastructure projects tbh..we desperately need some quality on the park as a prioirty, lets hope the budget is as competitive as we're being told.

Nothing much will change Iíd say. Any hopes I had of a sugar daddy helping us compete in the transfer/wage department are fast disappearing.

barcahibs
12-07-2019, 09:08 PM
Everyone's going to have a different opinion for what they want from a new owner but for me, so far, I'm totally behind everything he's saying.

No 51% fan ownership
Investment in infrastructure at East Mains
Prioritise youth development
Develop and promote the community aspects of the club
No living beyond our means (my interpretation of the 'pony up' statement.)
Player budget to make us competitive for 3rd place.

To be honest if I'd won the lottery and bought Hibs that's how I'd be prioritising my cash too.

Still need a lot more info obviously, and the guy has only been here five minutes but I like him so far.

madhatter
12-07-2019, 09:22 PM
Everyone's going to have a different opinion for what they want from a new owner but for me, so far, I'm totally behind everything he's saying.

No 51% fan ownership
Investment in infrastructure at East Mains
Prioritise youth development
Develop and promote the community aspects of the club
No living beyond our means (my interpretation of the 'pony up' statement.)
Player budget to make us competitive for 3rd place.

To be honest if I'd won the lottery and bought Hibs that's how I'd be prioritising my cash too.

Still need a lot more info obviously, and the guy has only been here five minutes but I like him so far.

Not living beyond our means makes sense but lets not forget that any 'pony up' statement by a majority shareholder in reference to fans putting more money into the club is not "prioritising my cash" as you put it, it is the club's cash which largely (beyond Ron's "investments") is generated from the fans. Maybe I should prioritise my cash and put it to good use in my own life rather than pay £400 for a ST, HSL funds, transport costs to go to games etc. and leave the 'ponying up' to the new majority shareholder. After all, I donate, he invests. He can prioritise his cash the way he likes. He cannot prioritise the money being brought into the club the way he likes...least I hope that's not the case because then we are in real trouble...if he has ability to bypass/overpower the board then we are in trouble.

I'm exaggerating above, I'm obviously going to go to the games but any initiatives to raise funds for the club are likely to be well off my radar and my HSL membership is likely to cease.

Community club which takes more money from it's community members to fund it's own infrastructure doesn't sit right with me. Hope this all gets clarified because there is some stuff going about at the moment which doesn't sound/look great.

barcahibs
12-07-2019, 09:47 PM
Not living beyond our means makes sense but lets not forget that any 'pony up' statement by a majority shareholder in reference to fans putting more money into the club is not "prioritising my cash" as you put it, it is the club's cash which largely (beyond Ron's "investments") is generated from the fans. Maybe I should prioritise my cash and put it to good use in my own life rather than pay £400 for a ST, HSL funds, transport costs to go to games etc. and leave the 'ponying up' to the new majority shareholder. After all, I donate, he invests. He can prioritise his cash the way he likes. He cannot prioritise the money being brought into the club the way he likes...least I hope that's not the case because then we are in real trouble...if he has ability to bypass/overpower the board then we are in trouble.

I'm exaggerating above, I'm obviously going to go to the games but any initiatives to raise funds for the club are likely to be well off my radar and my HSL membership is likely to cease.

Community club which takes more money from it's community members to fund it's own infrastructure doesn't sit right with me. Hope this all gets clarified because there is some stuff going about at the moment which doesn't sound/look great.

I disagree, I don't want our club to be some rich persons plaything. If we as fans want more, we as fans should pay for it. That's living within our means. Great if Ron wants to put in a bit extra now and again or front up cash for us to repay - but if we want something and can't afford it, then we just can't have it, we shouldn't expect someone else to pay for it.

There can be many ways for fans to contribute the money we need, for the majority it might just be continue to turn up to games in good numbers. For others it might be contributing extra cash via an HSL like organisation, for still others it might mean larger donations if they can afford it the Duncans and Aberdeen both get donations from wealthy fans I think?)

madhatter
12-07-2019, 10:12 PM
I disagree, I don't want our club to be some rich persons plaything. If we as fans want more, we as fans should pay for it. That's living within our means. Great if Ron wants to put in a bit extra now and again or front up cash for us to repay - but if we want something and can't afford it, then we just can't have it, we shouldn't expect someone else to pay for it.

There can be many ways for fans to contribute the money we need, for the majority it might just be continue to turn up to games in good numbers. For others it might be contributing extra cash via an HSL like organisation, for still others it might mean larger donations if they can afford it the Duncans and Aberdeen both get donations from wealthy fans I think?)


Here in lies the problem though when it goes through this crowdfunding type approach then fans don't get what they want, the club do what they want/need with the money. I don't want a £3-4million indoor training facility if we were able to raise that money. Aberdeen have been performing well in the league for years, building their club and now getting new stadium and training centre. Did Aberdeen fans fund that? Possibly, certainly not the common fans anyway. Nevertheless, whats the difference in Aberdeen being a rich Aberdeen fan's plaything and Hibs being a rich non-fan plaything?

"If we as fans want more, we as fans should pay for it." - I understand the point you were making here but is this a great slogan for a football club touting itself as a community club with "Hibernian Community Foundation" on their shirts? As I raised before, club, board, owner etc. get the plaudits when the club do something good for the community etc. but vast proportions of that money is actually coming from fans within the community. It is nice that the club are a vehicle for this but taking money from people in the community to fund the playing budget or the training centre doesn't directly help the community.

I wanted Hibs to avoid relegation and start signing better players, I was paying £385 for the ST then (I think). I wanted more, I wanted better. I got to experience relegation. Should fans pay for mismanagement? This is the problem, if fans are funding the club to a larger extent then we would need substantial representation on the board, not the current arrangement.

Personally I'm not keen to build the club using fans money so that Ron can sell it at a profit. That's not some moral fibre stuff, that's being taken for a ride. I'd rather the club were a plaything for a rich person to invest proper money in rather than it being viewed as an opportunity to make money. This stinks of a build and sell job and I'm not willing to fund that.

barcahibs
12-07-2019, 10:33 PM
Here in lies the problem though when it goes through this crowdfunding type approach then fans don't get what they want, the club do what they want/need with the money. I don't want a £3-4million indoor training facility if we were able to raise that money. Aberdeen have been performing well in the league for years, building their club and now getting new stadium and training centre. Did Aberdeen fans fund that? Possibly, certainly not the common fans anyway. Nevertheless, whats the difference in Aberdeen being a rich Aberdeen fan's plaything and Hibs being a rich non-fan plaything?

"If we as fans want more, we as fans should pay for it." - I understand the point you were making here but is this a great slogan for a football club touting itself as a community club with "Hibernian Community Foundation" on their shirts? As I raised before, club, board, owner etc. get the plaudits when the club do something good for the community etc. but vast proportions of that money is actually coming from fans within the community. It is nice that the club are a vehicle for this but taking money from people in the community to fund the playing budget or the training centre doesn't directly help the community.

I wanted Hibs to avoid relegation and start signing better players, I was paying £385 for the ST then (I think). I wanted more, I wanted better. I got to experience relegation. Should fans pay for mismanagement? This is the problem, if fans are funding the club to a larger extent then we would need substantial representation on the board, not the current arrangement.

Personally I'm not keen to build the club using fans money so that Ron can sell it at a profit. That's not some moral fibre stuff, that's being taken for a ride. I'd rather the club were a plaything for a rich person to invest proper money in rather than it being viewed as an opportunity to make money. This stinks of a build and sell job and I'm not willing to fund that.

I do understand what you're getting at and I can sympathise with the view.

But I'm happy that Ron is contributing, he's taken a risk with - so far - about £4 million of his own money. I've no idea what his goals are for that money, but even if it is build and sell, he's still taken the risk. For the vast, vast majority of 'investors' in Scottish football there is no financial return on that investment.

To be honest if he does manage to build and sell us then all credit to him. And I would imagine most fans will be pretty happy because making us attractive enough to sell at a profit suggests we'll have moved forward greatly as a club.

madhatter
12-07-2019, 10:48 PM
I do understand what you're getting at and I can sympathise with the view.

But I'm happy that Ron is contributing, he's taken a risk with - so far - about £4 million of his own money. I've no idea what his goals are for that money, but even if it is build and sell, he's still taken the risk. For the vast, vast majority of 'investors' in Scottish football there is no financial return on that investment.

To be honest if he does manage to build and sell us then all credit to him. And I would imagine most fans will be pretty happy because making us attractive enough to sell at a profit suggests we'll have moved forward greatly as a club.

I understand your point here but I think Ron got Hibs on the cheap because of the situation. You are stating £4m of his own money - virtually all of the stands at ER cost more to construct. The training centre cost more to construct. He is the majority shareholder of this, and the additional land at East Mains, ticketing office etc.

The part in bold I've highlighted as it touches on what I was saying about plaudits. You are saying all credit to him even though the current rumours is any successful build to the club will require fan involvement (likely through money). If he is due credit in a build and sell job then he is due making a few entries in the cheque book as far as I'm concerned. Credit gets thrown around to everyone but the fans but yet we are the ones that continually get asked for more money etc.

I take a risk buying my ST, I take a risk transferring money to HSL on a monthly basis, I take a risk subscribing to HibsTV. These are all riskier since the club was taken over by an unknown entity. My risk isn't as capital heavy but is emotional in nature so being frank I do not care about Ron's risk. Always found it funny that via HSL, fans were viewed as donors and that their money was donations towards playing budget. Funnier even now when a majority shareholder putting any money into the club is being viewed as investments.

NAE NOOKIE
12-07-2019, 10:51 PM
I disagree, I don't want our club to be some rich persons plaything. If we as fans want more, we as fans should pay for it. That's living within our means. Great if Ron wants to put in a bit extra now and again or front up cash for us to repay - but if we want something and can't afford it, then we just can't have it, we shouldn't expect someone else to pay for it.

There can be many ways for fans to contribute the money we need, for the majority it might just be continue to turn up to games in good numbers. For others it might be contributing extra cash via an HSL like organisation, for still others it might mean larger donations if they can afford it the Duncans and Aberdeen both get donations from wealthy fans I think?)

In deference to 'Madhatter's' post who has already addressed this.

I pay £400 for a season ticket, I go to practically every home game I cant use my ST for, I buy stuff from the food kiosks, I buy stuff from the Hibs shop. I pay £10 a month to HSL ( may it rest in peace ) and petrol costs me £10 or so for every game I attend.

When I have a commitment like that which is decades long I'm sorry mate, but if a guy buys my football club and especially when his very first action is to make it clear that he is in charge by putting a stop to the previous owners initiative that was supposed to at least give the fans some influence in the club, then I expect him to not only provide the initial cash to buy out the previous owners, but also to have a commitment to fund the club out of his own pocket to a reasonable extent .. and not as is seeming more and more likely to be the case, to expect the fans he has just sidelined / put in their place to pay for everything.

If that's the extent of his commitment to funding the club on and off the park going forward then sorry but I'm becoming less and less impressed by the minute with Mr Gordon :bitchy:

I said at the beginning that the jury was out for me until I saw evidence of what his ownership of the club was going to be like and so far I'm still waiting to be won over.

barcahibs
12-07-2019, 11:30 PM
I say all credit to him because we still need leadership, same goes for why LD, RP Sir Tom got the credit for the good things they did/do. I believe fan ownership would be a disaster. A figurehead owner with the ability to successfully manage and grow the club is still vital. If he has the skills to do that then good on him, it'll only benefit us all in the end.

I don't think a fan 'investment' of a ST can be compared. no matter what happens you'll get everything you were promised for your ST money - access to Easter Road to watch Hibs. Ron could walk away from this in a few years time with nothing - he may as well have piled all his money up and set fire to it.

Yeah the stands may have cost much more than £4 million but they're not worth anything in pure monetary terms. Who are you going to sell them to? Same goes for the training ground, I doubt there's many buyers out there for a football training centre - except maybe hertz.

But anyway we're completely speculating on his intentions, he may be looking to build and sell, he may be looking for a return on his investment, he may just want to enjoy owning a club and see the money he spends as effectively his ST money or he may want to leave a community asset that is in a better shape than he started.

Or a million other possibilities. I just want to record some positive views among the negative, I'm extremely relaxed and positive about everything he's done so far. He has a lot of credit in his column with me - but as someone who remembers the Mercer times of course I'll always have my eyes open.

Book of Kamberi
12-07-2019, 11:59 PM
In deference to 'Madhatter's' post who has already addressed this.

I pay £400 for a season ticket, I go to practically every home game I cant use my ST for, I buy stuff from the food kiosks, I buy stuff from the Hibs shop. I pay £10 a month to HSL ( may it rest in peace ) and petrol costs me £10 or so for every game I attend.

When I have a commitment like that which is decades long I'm sorry mate, but if a guy buys my football club and especially when his very first action is to make it clear that he is in charge by putting a stop to the previous owners initiative that was supposed to at least give the fans some influence in the club, then I expect him to not only provide the initial cash to buy out the previous owners, but also to have a commitment to fund the club out of his own pocket to a reasonable extent .. and not as is seeming more and more likely to be the case, to expect the fans he has just sidelined / put in their place to pay for everything.

If that's the extent of his commitment to funding the club on and off the park going forward then sorry but I'm becoming less and less impressed by the minute with Mr Gordon :bitchy:

I said at the beginning that the jury was out for me until I saw evidence of what his ownership of the club was going to be like and so far I'm still waiting to be won over.There were far too many whooping going on, including myself on the initial buyout. We need to remember he is an American Republican, so any man of the people bull**** is likely to be just that. We've just been undercut with HSL and are now expected to pay for that which he should be investing in. We've just lost out on a signing too, this may be colouring my scepticism.

Sent from my LYA-L09 using Tapatalk

hfc rd
13-07-2019, 12:24 AM
ďPony upĒ

Didnít have a clue what that meant until I just googled it and itís an American phrase - pony up means to pay what you owe or settle your debt.

Apologies, I might sound stupid here but Ron wants us to cough up the cash to pay for the £3M/£4M indoor training facility? Surely he mustíve been told how much money the fans have put into this club and regularly continue to do so on a daily basis.

007
13-07-2019, 01:02 AM
Maybe something along the lines of the AberDNA scheme is what Ron had in mind.

Greencore
13-07-2019, 01:09 AM
So let me get this straight.....

We are to help fund the £3M/£4M indoor training facility?

We have just lost out on a player who chose Aberdeen £££££

But we are told its exciting times to be a Hibee.... How?

tonyrougier123
13-07-2019, 01:20 AM
So let me get this straight.....

We are to help fund the £3M/£4M indoor training facility?

We have just lost out on a player who chose Aberdeen £££££

But we are told its exciting times to be a Hibee.... How?
Gathering 3-4million thru hsl would take some time naw?
When is the pitch being built??
I think we there might be some miscommunication on that one surely.?

kaimendhibs
13-07-2019, 01:54 AM
In deference to 'Madhatter's' post who has already addressed this.

I pay £400 for a season ticket, I go to practically every home game I cant use my ST for, I buy stuff from the food kiosks, I buy stuff from the Hibs shop. I pay £10 a month to HSL ( may it rest in peace ) and petrol costs me £10 or so for every game I attend.

When I have a commitment like that which is decades long I'm sorry mate, but if a guy buys my football club and especially when his very first action is to make it clear that he is in charge by putting a stop to the previous owners initiative that was supposed to at least give the fans some influence in the club, then I expect him to not only provide the initial cash to buy out the previous owners, but also to have a commitment to fund the club out of his own pocket to a reasonable extent .. and not as is seeming more and more likely to be the case, to expect the fans he has just sidelined / put in their place to pay for everything.

If that's the extent of his commitment to funding the club on and off the park going forward then sorry but I'm becoming less and less impressed by the minute with Mr Gordon :bitchy:

I said at the beginning that the jury was out for me until I saw evidence of what his ownership of the club was going to be like and so far I'm still waiting to be won over.[emoji122][emoji122][emoji122]

Sent from my VTR-L09 using Tapatalk

MagicSwirlingShip
13-07-2019, 02:03 AM
The dots are beginning to add up for me.

First there were whispers of an indoor facility being built, with the idea of making the facilities available to the local community.

Then we announced the Hibernian Community Foundation as our shirt sponsors, with an initiative to donate directly to the foundation to support Hibernian community projects.

Next, our new owner mentions he expects the Hibs fans to help find the community project.

It wouldnít surprise me to see our new owner pay to fund the new facility at the outset, with Hibs fans being asked to contribute through donations to the Community Foundation.

FilipinoHibs
13-07-2019, 02:45 AM
Someone probably needs to come out and clarify things. Ron saying he needs the fans to pony up is a very strange thing to say when you’ve just bought a football club. Most fans I’d assume would be thinking that if a new owner came in he’d have the funds in place to realise his ambitions, but it seems that’s not the case. I’m hoping the pony up reference has been misinterpreted by me and he means fans turning up for games and buying merchandise.

Having spent 12 years working for two US companies, I think he means make a contribution to the cost of the indoor facility. This will reduce what Hibs need to borrow from him. He will be looking to increased merchandising, attendances and competition revenues to repay the loan. Problem here is the fans have nothing to show for it terms of shares and influence/voice on the board.

One thing about US businessmen, at first sign of failure on and off the pitch they will make changes quickly. We might be in for a bumpy ride.

ian cruise
13-07-2019, 03:07 AM
It's far too early in the relationship between Hibs and RG for everyone to have all the answers so patience definitely required in the short term while everyone finds their feet in this new era. I keep seeing people fixated on the "pony up" part but I feel it's just an unfortunate turn of phrase. It doesn't mean we're being asked to put in any more than we already do, just that Ron Gordon isn't going to pay for it outright out of his own pocket. Probably good that fan expectations are tempered a bit as some were getting a bit over excited about his supposed wealth and imaginations were running wild in some quarters.

Most who were there seemed to find it positive so that can only be a good thing. His focus on us growing within the community and living off of what we bring in seems like a sensible continuation of groundwork STF put in place.

scott_b_
13-07-2019, 04:01 AM
http://www.hibernianfc.co.uk/news/9287

"Cash balance 30th June 2018 £4.2m"

For the financial types out there does that mean we have £4.2m sat in the bank? And that's before the SJM transfer fee or add-on? Surely enough for a covered pitch at EM.

If the club have committed to an indoor pitch as a result of our commitment to Project Brave surely they'll have funding in place doesn't directly involve the fans. Admittedly getting into debt over it with no guarantees return doesn't seem the best either.

MagicSwirlingShip
13-07-2019, 04:19 AM
http://www.hibernianfc.co.uk/news/9287

"Cash balance 30th June 2018 £4.2m"

For the financial types out there does that mean we have £4.2m sat in the bank? And that's before the SJM transfer fee or add-on? Surely enough for a covered pitch at EM.

If the club have committed to an indoor pitch as a result of our commitment to Project Brave surely they'll have funding in place doesn't directly involve the fans. Admittedly getting into debt over it with no guarantees return doesn't seem the best either.

If I'm not mistaken that £4.2m is made mostly up of last seasons season ticket sales which will now be gone on wages, general running of the club etc.

scott_b_
13-07-2019, 04:23 AM
If I'm not mistaken that £4.2m is made mostly up of last seasons season ticket sales which will now be gone on wages, general running of the club etc.

Fair enough - that makes sense. Did think it was alot of money for a club our size to be sitting on.

cocteautwin
13-07-2019, 04:40 AM
http://www.hibernianfc.co.uk/news/9287

"Cash balance 30th June 2018 £4.2m"

For the financial types out there does that mean we have £4.2m sat in the bank? And that's before the SJM transfer fee or add-on? Surely enough for a covered pitch at EM.

If the club have committed to an indoor pitch as a result of our commitment to Project Brave surely they'll have funding in place doesn't directly involve the fans. Admittedly getting into debt over it with no guarantees return doesn't seem the best either.

Most of that was season ticket money that needed to be used for the running costs of the club for the coming season. The SJM fee hadn't yet been received at that stage. Most clubs should have decent cash balances in the summer time due to season ticket sales for the season approaching. Unless you are Hearts though and your season ticket money was all spent in advance, only had £199k in the bank last summer and needed an injection of cash of £3.25m from their anonymous donor.

Forza Fred
13-07-2019, 07:28 AM
Nothing much will change Iíd say. Any hopes I had of a sugar daddy helping us compete in the transfer/wage department are fast disappearing.

Tom Farmer had to relinquish control at some point.

If Ďnothing much changesí then we are no worse off...same horse, different jockey as they say.

We all hope for a ĎFitba Sugar Daddyí but they are few and far between.

As for the ĎPony Upí comment....I assume it is meant that the expectation on his part is they will..ícontinue to do their bití..as they have been doing.

Donít see anything sinister in it.....

MountcastleHibs
13-07-2019, 08:43 AM
Gathering 3-4million thru hsl would take some time naw?
When is the pitch being built??
I think we there might be some miscommunication on that one surely.?

In order to maintain our status as an elite academy through Project Brave, we need to have the facility built by 2020. I donít know if thereís a timescale within 2020, but it needs to be there for us to have that status. Obviously, Ronís plans seem to be heavily leaning towards the academy and youth development which is why this has been identified as a priority. I see others above have said they donít want to spend the money that is required for an indoor facility, but it is a major requirement for us if we want to keep our elite status as an academy, which we need to in order to fulfil Ronís vision. Swings and roundabouts...

Forza Fred
13-07-2019, 09:17 AM
I know we must develop our youth players, but I donít see the path to riches or glory through a conveyer belt of youngsters capable at performing at SPFL level being produced.

The churn rate indicates that relatively few come through to be regular first team players, Even less so, first team players who other clubs are willing to pay a substantial fee for.

Even if they do have the required talent, and it is a big if, they donít immediately go from Academy player to serious transfer target overnight, so any return on investment is potentially years away.

If Ron thinks he will increase the revenue stream through youth development, methinks he will end up disappointed.

heid the baw
13-07-2019, 09:28 AM
Not convinced by the pony up bit. E.R stands and training facilities were mostly funded through player sales which were enhanced by petrie's hardball tactics. Surely the best way to do Infrastructure is to invest these large gains if and when they come along as opposed to *****ing them on one season of big wage earners.
Ponying up small amounts to support the playing budget is an easier sell to fans than infrastructure
.

Turkish Green
13-07-2019, 01:03 PM
When Petrie went I thought I'd be happy as I never waivered in my dislike of the 'tache. I am not sure about the new guy but will give him my backing in the short term.

Antifa Hibs
15-07-2019, 10:35 AM
Not living beyond our means makes sense but lets not forget that any 'pony up' statement by a majority shareholder in reference to fans putting more money into the club is not "prioritising my cash" as you put it, it is the club's cash which largely (beyond Ron's "investments") is generated from the fans. Maybe I should prioritise my cash and put it to good use in my own life rather than pay £400 for a ST, HSL funds, transport costs to go to games etc. and leave the 'ponying up' to the new majority shareholder. After all, I donate, he invests. He can prioritise his cash the way he likes. He cannot prioritise the money being brought into the club the way he likes...least I hope that's not the case because then we are in real trouble...if he has ability to bypass/overpower the board then we are in trouble.

I'm exaggerating above, I'm obviously going to go to the games but any initiatives to raise funds for the club are likely to be well off my radar and my HSL membership is likely to cease.

Community club which takes more money from it's community members to fund it's own infrastructure doesn't sit right with me. Hope this all gets clarified because there is some stuff going about at the moment which doesn't sound/look great.

Community club stuff is a marketing ploy - most clubs are at it. We offer no discounts to local poor or unemployed supporters. Charge obscene amounts for kids entry. Charge even worse amounts for half time kickabouts or mascots etc.

One of the biggest community contributions is the leith links season ticket stuff which is fan led and fan funded.

"Come on in children to our wonderful community club were we'll charge a tenner for a glorified freindly and 3 quid for a capri sun that costs 50p doon the road".

matty_f
15-07-2019, 10:38 AM
Community club stuff is a marketing ploy - most clubs are at it. We offer no discounts to local poor or unemployed supporters. Charge obscene amounts for kids entry. Charge even worse amounts for half time kickabouts or mascots etc.

One of the biggest community contributions is the leith links season ticket stuff which is fan led and fan funded.

"Come on in children to our wonderful community club were we'll charge a tenner for a glorified freindly and 3 quid for a capri sun that costs 50p doon the road".

Hibs give out loads of tickets to schools for many matches during the season, have very good pricing on kidsí season tickets with the family season ticket, as well as the Hibs Kids scheme that gives 5 matches per season as part of the membership.

I think thereís also community football on offer at East Mains through the season etc.

Selectively picking bits of information the chin the club about isnít fair, imho.

They are also very good with menís mental health initiatives, the football fans in training, diabetes awareness etc

green day
15-07-2019, 11:49 AM
Hibs give out loads of tickets to schools for many matches during the season, have very good pricing on kidsí season tickets with the family season ticket, as well as the Hibs Kids scheme that gives 5 matches per season as part of the membership.

I think thereís also community football on offer at East Mains through the season etc.

Selectively picking bits of information the chin the club about isnít fair, imho.

They are also very good with menís mental health initiatives, the football fans in training, diabetes awareness etc

I don't disagree, however the Helping Hands guys (Brad Welsh helped set this up) do things like Free Football all over Edinburgh in the summer.

Hibs (like all clubs, tbf) charge for kids summer football. Of course we are a business, but we can always do more.

The Captain....
15-07-2019, 11:54 AM
In deference to 'Madhatter's' post who has already addressed this.

I pay £400 for a season ticket, I go to practically every home game I cant use my ST for, I buy stuff from the food kiosks, I buy stuff from the Hibs shop. I pay £10 a month to HSL ( may it rest in peace ) and petrol costs me £10 or so for every game I attend.

When I have a commitment like that which is decades long I'm sorry mate, but if a guy buys my football club and especially when his very first action is to make it clear that he is in charge by putting a stop to the previous owners initiative that was supposed to at least give the fans some influence in the club, then I expect him to not only provide the initial cash to buy out the previous owners, but also to have a commitment to fund the club out of his own pocket to a reasonable extent .. and not as is seeming more and more likely to be the case, to expect the fans he has just sidelined / put in their place to pay for everything.

If that's the extent of his commitment to funding the club on and off the park going forward then sorry but I'm becoming less and less impressed by the minute with Mr Gordon :bitchy:

I said at the beginning that the jury was out for me until I saw evidence of what his ownership of the club was going to be like and so far I'm still waiting to be won over.

Actions speak louder than words is obviously a trite saying but it applies here for me..its far too early for me to be proclaiming the new owner a good thing or not as I've yet to see any substantial plans. The cleverly worded soundbites so far give no indication that our playing budget will increase signifcantly (within our structure before the old "we wont spend £1m posts start") in size and thats what would impress me most. In fact its quite the reverse with the plan seemingly to focus on bringing thru youth with the attendant increase in infrastructure costs that brings at East Mains.

We will not challenge Aberdeen or Celtic or Rangers with the current level of player we are bringing to the club..anyone who believes we will is deluded. To be fair Ron has said we would challenge further up the league in time so maybe he expects a few lower finishes while we embark on yet more infrastructure spending. I actually feel quite downbeat about the next couple of season tbh.

tamig
15-07-2019, 12:00 PM
In order to maintain our status as an elite academy through Project Brave, we need to have the facility built by 2020. I donít know if thereís a timescale within 2020, but it needs to be there for us to have that status. Obviously, Ronís plans seem to be heavily leaning towards the academy and youth development which is why this has been identified as a priority. I see others above have said they donít want to spend the money that is required for an indoor facility, but it is a major requirement for us if we want to keep our elite status as an academy, which we need to in order to fulfil Ronís vision. Swings and roundabouts...

Is that definitely a Project Brave condition - you need to have a full size indoor pitch? Do the hun and Celtc even have that?

K Kay
15-07-2019, 02:32 PM
Is that definitely a Project Brave condition - you need to have a full size indoor pitch? Do the hun and Celtc even have that?

Sure I'm right in saying Ron purchased an additional piece of land at East Mains as well as the ticket office. This must have been bought with the intent to build the indoor facility so surely its a goer. :agree:

WhileTheChief..
15-07-2019, 02:54 PM
If I'm not mistaken that £4.2m is made mostly up of last seasons season ticket sales which will now be gone on wages, general running of the club etc.

Thing is, the club will be sitting on roughly the same amount of cash just now from this season ST sales.

He's paid a few million for the club only to find out that the cub has a few million in the bank anyways.

Basically he got us for nowt and now wants us to pony up more!

Caversham Green
15-07-2019, 03:31 PM
Thing is, the club will be sitting on roughly the same amount of cash just now from this season ST sales.

He's paid a few million for the club only to find out that the cub has a few million in the bank anyways.

Basically he got us for nowt and now wants us to pony up more!

That is seriously skewed thinking. Ron Gordon has no more claim on the club's money than you or I do.

WhileTheChief..
15-07-2019, 03:46 PM
Tongue in cheek comment.

But there's a basis of truth in it :wink:

Caversham Green
15-07-2019, 03:53 PM
Tongue in cheek comment.

But there's a basis of truth in it :wink:

You need to put smileys in then or some folk will believe it.

And there's nae truth whatsoever in it.

WhileTheChief..
15-07-2019, 04:59 PM
My first two sentences were 100% accurate! ;)

(Canít do proper smilies from the phone, sorry!)

Caversham Green
15-07-2019, 05:15 PM
My first two sentences were 100% accurate! ;)

(Canít do proper smilies from the phone, sorry!)

Aye fair enough, your not wrong there.

.Sean.
15-07-2019, 05:52 PM
Community club stuff is a marketing ploy - most clubs are at it. We offer no discounts to local poor or unemployed supporters. Charge obscene amounts for kids entry. Charge even worse amounts for half time kickabouts or mascots etc.

One of the biggest community contributions is the leith links season ticket stuff which is fan led and fan funded.

"Come on in children to our wonderful community club were we'll charge a tenner for a glorified freindly and 3 quid for a capri sun that costs 50p doon the road".
The charging of the mascot package is ludicrous IMO

Used to be open to all Hibs Kids, nowadays it discriminates against Hibs daft children from families who perhaps can't afford the mascot package. I don't like it.

barcahibs
15-07-2019, 06:53 PM
Hibs give out loads of tickets to schools for many matches during the season, have very good pricing on kidsí season tickets with the family season ticket, as well as the Hibs Kids scheme that gives 5 matches per season as part of the membership.

I think thereís also community football on offer at East Mains through the season etc.

Selectively picking bits of information the chin the club about isnít fair, imho.

They are also very good with menís mental health initiatives, the football fans in training, diabetes awareness etc

I think the club do a fair amount of community work and we should be proud of it.

But we also have to be aware that we play in a competitive sport set up and the fans, to a greater or lesser extent, demand at least relative sporting success in order to maintain their interest levels.

That sporting success comes at a cost, we have to spend at least as much as our rivals - and more than most.

Where does that money come from?

A constant mantra from the fans is that the club is more than the possession of its titular owner, Sir Tom and Rod understood that I think, and always had one eye on their legacy - who is to say Ron won't be the same? We simply don't know his motives at this point.

But again we hear the call that this or that is too expensive and the club expects the fans to fork out (or pony up) too much.

So how do we square this circle? The club is the fans, the fans are the club. But the fans shouldn't have to pay for it.

Maybe Ron intends to fund the gap from his own pocket. Great if he does. But why should he? And if he does are those who shout loudest that the fans are the true custodians of Hibs going to pipe down and let Hibs be his play thing? He would have bought and paid for us after all.

Personally I would love to see Hibs really expand the fan and community aspects of the club. I'd like to see subsidised tickets for those less fortunate. I'd like all kids tickets to be free, I'd like the mascot packages to be free, I'd love there to be free sports education, summer schools, fitness programmes, a fully paid for professional woman's team. I'd like Easter Road and Hibs to be a hub of the community.

And I can already hear the howls of protest from those that see every penny spent on things like that as a penny stolen from the managers playing fund.

Maybe Ron can fund that difference. It would be great if he could. But again why should he?

Maybe we the community should fund it. Maybe that could be the new purpose of HSL, a fund to run the community side of the club, paid for by those fans who can afford it, voluntarily, and each according yo what they personally feel they can contribute.

That would be my goal if I won the lottery and bought over Hibs.

But I doubt Ron thinks the same.

Torto7
15-07-2019, 08:30 PM
I think the club do a fair amount of community work and we should be proud of it.

But we also have to be aware that we play in a competitive sport set up and the fans, to a greater or lesser extent, demand at least relative sporting success in order to maintain their interest levels.

That sporting success comes at a cost, we have to spend at least as much as our rivals - and more than most.

Where does that money come from?

A constant mantra from the fans is that the club is more than the possession of its titular owner, Sir Tom and Rod understood that I think, and always had one eye on their legacy - who is to say Ron won't be the same? We simply don't know his motives at this point.

But again we hear the call that this or that is too expensive and the club expects the fans to fork out (or pony up) too much.

So how do we square this circle? The club is the fans, the fans are the club. But the fans shouldn't have to pay for it.

Maybe Ron intends to fund the gap from his own pocket. Great if he does. But why should he? And if he does are those who shout loudest that the fans are the true custodians of Hibs going to pipe down and let Hibs be his play thing? He would have bought and paid for us after all.

Personally I would love to see Hibs really expand the fan and community aspects of the club. I'd like to see subsidised tickets for those less fortunate. I'd like all kids tickets to be free, I'd like the mascot packages to be free, I'd love there to be free sports education, summer schools, fitness programmes, a fully paid for professional woman's team. I'd like Easter Road and Hibs to be a hub of the community.

And I can already hear the howls of protest from those that see every penny spent on things like that as a penny stolen from the managers playing fund.

Maybe Ron can fund that difference. It would be great if he could. But again why should he?

Maybe we the community should fund it. Maybe that could be the new purpose of HSL, a fund to run the community side of the club, paid for by those fans who can afford it, voluntarily, and each according yo what they personally feel they can contribute.

That would be my goal if I won the lottery and bought over Hibs.

But I doubt Ron thinks the same.

The women's team being professional doesn't belong on the list with those other things. If the ladies are to go pro then there needs to be the demand for it which currently doesn't exist. Too many professional teams is a big part of the problem in the men's game too. Any resources would be better being spent on improved coaching/sports science access etc and in time hopefully the appetite will be there for it to be fully pro. Central funding might be a better route for the women's game for the foreseeable.

In terms of the other points in an ideal world I'd agree with you. We don't live in an ideal world though and the standard in the SPL is already awful imo. If we cut back on the first team budget to pay for these things the type of players we could attract would likely lead to dropped revenue due to poorer performance. Then everyone loses out.

tamig
16-07-2019, 09:16 AM
Sure I'm right in saying Ron purchased an additional piece of land at East Mains as well as the ticket office. This must have been bought with the intent to build the indoor facility so surely its a goer. :agree:

Its a goer but is it a Project Brave requirement to retain Elite Academy status?

Since452
16-07-2019, 09:19 AM
Its a goer but is it a Project Brave requirement to retain Elite Academy status?

No it's not a requirement for that just an improvement for the club. Don't think many clubs in Scotland have the funds for an indoor pitch. Not sure if Aberdeen are building one, they might just try and hijack ours 😉

tamig
16-07-2019, 09:22 AM
No it's not a requirement for that just an improvement for the club. Don't think many clubs in Scotland have the funds for an indoor pitch. Not sure if Aberdeen are building one, they might just try and hijack ours 😉

Cheers. One poster seemed to indicate we were building it to meet PB requirements which I found surprising. Hence the question.

Edina Erin
16-07-2019, 10:10 AM
Plans to build the indoor facility and arranging the finance, has been something thatís been in place for sometime - long before RG arrived.

Thereís definitely some mutually beneficial arrangement to exploit here, whereby the community foundation, in its capacity as a charity and community football club, unlocks grants/funding form other parties/bodies.

Hibs have always been keen to highlight that the Community Foundation operates completely independently from the football club - The ladies team effectively had to rent Easter Road from the football club when the European game against Bayern was played - but I think STF, RP and LD have been good at maximising the benefit that the Community Foundation can bring to the Football Club - when it suits.

underscore
16-07-2019, 10:18 AM
Hibs give out loads of tickets to schools for many matches during the season, have very good pricing on kidsí season tickets with the family season ticket, as well as the Hibs Kids scheme that gives 5 matches per season as part of the membership.

I think thereís also community football on offer at East Mains through the season etc.

Selectively picking bits of information the chin the club about isnít fair, imho.

They are also very good with menís mental health initiatives, the football fans in training, diabetes awareness etc

What do you mean by community football at east mains? Itís certainly not free or even discounted.

underscore
16-07-2019, 10:22 AM
The women's team being professional doesn't belong on the list with those other things. If the ladies are to go pro then there needs to be the demand for it which currently doesn't exist. Too many professional teams is a big part of the problem in the men's game too. Any resources would be better being spent on improved coaching/sports science access etc and in time hopefully the appetite will be there for it to be fully pro. Central funding might be a better route for the women's game for the foreseeable.

In terms of the other points in an ideal world I'd agree with you. We don't live in an ideal world though and the standard in the SPL is already awful imo. If we cut back on the first team budget to pay for these things the type of players we could attract would likely lead to dropped revenue due to poorer performance. Then everyone loses out.

How have Glasgow city managed to give one of our ex players a Pro contract? We donít have to go fully pro but there is plenty that should be happening. The chief exec of Glasgow City appears to be pretty switched on with how to make this happen.

Edina Erin
16-07-2019, 10:24 AM
Sure I'm right in saying Ron purchased an additional piece of land at East Mains as well as the ticket office. This must have been bought with the intent to build the indoor facility so surely its a goer. :agree:

The existing HTC footprint only occupies about have on the land ďavailableĒ.
Didnít STF originally buy the whole area and sold part to the Football Club? I suspect that the ďadditionalĒ land that RG Bought was the part still owned by STF.

underscore
16-07-2019, 10:25 AM
Cheers. One poster seemed to indicate we were building it to meet PB requirements which I found surprising. Hence the question.

An indoor facility was on the list for project brave. Good luck finding any details about this with the SFA. Another shambles of a project. Reduce the cost of coaching, increase the accessibility of coaching and stop wasting money of paper exercises. Then we might see an improvement.

Edina Erin
16-07-2019, 10:32 AM
How have Glasgow city managed to give one of our ex players a Pro contract? We donít have to go fully pro but there is plenty that should be happening. The chief exec of Glasgow City appears to be pretty switched on with how to make this happen.

Iíve always found it bizarre that one of the architects of Glasgow City, works for Hibs!

underscore
16-07-2019, 10:34 AM
Iíve always found it bizarre that one of the architects of Glasgow City, works for Hibs!

And brilliant at developing a professional approach to womenís football at City?!

tamig
16-07-2019, 12:41 PM
An indoor facility was on the list for project brave. Good luck finding any details about this with the SFA. Another shambles of a project. Reduce the cost of coaching, increase the accessibility of coaching and stop wasting money of paper exercises. Then we might see an improvement.

Aye I tried seeing what I could find online but the SFA updates are pretty rank. Its a shame clubs are cutting their youth development as a result of this ďimprovementĒ.

K Kay
16-07-2019, 12:45 PM
The existing HTC footprint only occupies about have on the land ďavailableĒ.
Didnít STF originally buy the whole area and sold part to the Football Club? I suspect that the ďadditionalĒ land that RG Bought was the part still owned by STF.

I think 15 acres was the amount of land mentioned.

Steve-O
17-07-2019, 01:54 AM
He might think we have a competitive budget. But if the story of this Ojo is true, we are obviously still not competing with them wages wise. Donít get me wrong, Iím not too fussed about this guy in particular but letís not claim to compete with Aberdeen if players still choose to sign for them over us.

But we did 'compete', we just didn't win...

I think the reality is that most fans want to hear that we HAVE the third biggest budget in the league. Not sure if that's what we're gonna hear though.

Glory Lurker
22-07-2019, 12:28 PM
I see the club's granted Bydand a standard security over ground at HTC.

Mikey
22-07-2019, 12:38 PM
I see the club's granted Bydand a standard security over ground at HTC.

Wasn't that done on Day 2, or is this something else?

Glory Lurker
22-07-2019, 06:22 PM
Wasn't that done on Day 2, or is this something else?

It's a different type of charge, but guessing it's part of the same package.

MountcastleHibs
22-07-2019, 06:30 PM
Its a goer but is it a Project Brave requirement to retain Elite Academy status?

Iím fairly certain it is, or at least was when Project Brave was announced. Iím sure itís a major part of why the likes of Falkirk stopped their academies as they couldnít afford the requirements the SFA were looking for.

ancient hibee
22-07-2019, 06:47 PM
It's a different type of charge, but guessing it's part of the same package.

Yes ,over a specific piece of property.In any event only comes into play if Hibs borrow money from Bidand and canít pay it back.