unpopular or controversial opinion thread.

[Just Jimmy]

admin please move to dugout if it's more fitting.

doesn't need to be football or Hibs related but what is one thing (per post) that you believe but others might find controversial or at least is an unpopular opinion?

I'll start with;

Sunshine on Leith at 2007 league cup final was better than at the 2016 Scottish cup final.

next?

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[Bangkok Hibby]

ALL television people wearing poppies because they're told to. Just devalues it for me and makes it insincere.

[Caversham Green]

Based on the times I've seen him playing against Reading, Shelton Martis was an excellent centre half.

[makaveli1875]

Craig Leveins a winner

[Peevemor]

Lennon's aeroplane celebration was cringeworthy.

[Fife-Hibee]

The world is reaching a tipping point due to ever increasing radicalization and the doomsday clock is about to strike 12.

[Pretty Boy]

People who get all maudlin about shops, pubs, cafes etc closing are often hypocrites who are part of the problem. They will happily share memories of 'the great nights in there' or 'buying X Y and Z from there' whilst at the same time slurping a £5 supermarket wine and browsing Amazon for their latest purchase.

Businesses going bust and people losing their jobs is horrible but if you are unwilling to be a part of the solution then deal with it.

[easty]

Gender-fluid is bull****.

You can be a man or a woman. You can change if you think you were born into the wrong sex. You can’t pick and choose if you’re male or female depending how you feel each day. It’s nonsense.

[heretoday]

I quite enjoy watching Donald Trump in action.

[Greentinted]

Other people’s bairns are a pain in the arse.

[MagicSwirlingShip]

Quite enjoy the sporadic nature of Scottish football’s fixture list and would find regular, predictable 3pm Saturday kick offs boring in the extreme.

[Scouse Hibee]

I have no sympathy what so ever for any injuries incurred fatal or otherwise by these erseholes who ride motorbikes against the traffic, pulling wheelies and terrorising people with their faces covered by scarves and wear no helmets.

[we are hibs]

We should build a wall between Edinburgh and Glasgow to keep the weegies and their horrendously bad accent and "famous weegie patter" out.

[weecounty hibby]

Rod Petrie is a moustachioed god who we will miss when he's gone!

[danhibees1875]

The buzz around the takeover threads, whether there's anything in it or not, goes against a lot of what HSL has been building towards for the last couple of years. A majority fan ownership won't help entice a rich person to buy into the club which there seems to be an appetite for.

It might be time to pause, and have a think/consult about what the fans would like to achieve between ownership stakes and external investment.

If the investment is what is wanted and a majority shareholding for fans is a stumbling block then I'm sure there would still be a place for HSL - I think it might just need a tweak to it's objectives from there.

[Hibrandenburg]

The British electorate is too stupid to vote. :tin hat:

[Fife-Hibee]

The British electorate is too stupid to vote. :tin hat:

Unpopular? Yes.
Controversial? Not in the slightest.

[Bangkok Hibby]

The British electorate is too stupid to vote. :tin hat:

Post of the year :agree:

[NORTHERNHIBBY]

I don't mind the seagulls

[lapsedhibee]

Hearts' glass wall thing is ok.

[JeMeSouviens]

Global warming will introduce a new mediterranean cafe culture to Edinburgh.

[Killiehibbie]

Laws, no matter how ridiculous, must not be challenged. They are all there for a good reason and history shows that.

[Fife-Hibee]

Laws, no matter how ridiculous, must not be challenged. They are all there for a good reason and history shows that.

Why do laws keep on changing throughout history then? :wink:

[Killiehibbie]

Why do laws keep on changing throughout history then? :wink:

But but the laws the law and must be obeyed.

[Onceinawhile]

All drugs - including alcohol, caffeine and nicotine - should either be legal and taxed, or illegal.

The fact that alcohol causes so many deaths, problems in hospitals and in towns on a Friday or Saturday night, whilst other drugs are illegal is bonkers.

[Pretty Boy]

Another few from me:

A lot of craft beer is vastly overrated and is a success of marketing and hype rather than product.

Japan and the USA is currently producing vastly superior whisky/whiskey compared to Scotland and Ireland.

Taylor Swift, whilst undoubtedly annoying, has some superb pop songs and I quite enjoy hearing them on the radio. See also Little Mix and Katy Perry.

Glasgow is in many ways a superior city to Edinburgh. Better pubs, better music venues, comparable eating choices, better sporting venues and you don't have to take out a 2nd mortgage to drink in the city centre.

[Bangkok Hibby]

Phil Neville saying defeat to the USA in World cup tonight will be failure is English arrogance surfacing again. OK talk that way amongst yourselves but don't put it out to the media.

[Scouse Hibee]

Phil Neville saying defeat to the USA in World cup tonight will be failure is English arrogance surfacing again. OK talk that way amongst yourselves but don't put it out to the media.

When you read the article it gives you context that blows your arrogance theory out the water.

[StevesFamau5]

Another few from me:

A lot of craft beer is vastly overrated and is a success of marketing and hype rather than product.

Japan and the USA is currently producing vastly superior whisky/whiskey compared to Scotland and Ireland.

Taylor Swift, whilst undoubtedly annoying, has some superb pop songs and I quite enjoy hearing them on the radio. See also Little Mix and Katy Perry.

Glasgow is in many ways a superior city to Edinburgh. Better pubs, better music venues, comparable eating choices, better sporting venues and you don't have to take out a 2nd mortgage to drink in the city centre.


FFS! I thought I was alone on that one :greengrin

[StevesFamau5]

Lewis Capaldi is not funny, or entertaining and should stop with the honking patter.... :brickwall

[Cataplana]

Unionists and Seperatists are two cheeks of the same totalitarian arse, and have a common objective of promoting their own self glory, rather than any altruistic desite to better society.

[Bangkok Hibby]

When you read the article it gives you context that blows your arrogance theory out the water.


I've read it..everyone wants to win, but to say (to the media) defeat to the World's number 1 team would be failure is (in my opinion) arrogant. Of course this thread is all about opinions which others may not agree with. I like it.



"My players now want to win," he added. "If we don't get the right result, we'll feel the disappointment and we'll see that as a failure.
"That's not me being negative, that's just our expectations, our belief and our confidence."

[Hibernia&Alba]

We need to dismantle our current way of life and re-build towards a sustainable anarchist society.


Just a thought.

[Fife-Hibee]

Life is fundamentally meaningless. We lie to ourselves to give our lives a false sense of purpose. But the reality is, we're nothing but bacteria on a microscopic pebble surrounded by darkness. Our planet doesn't even make up 0.0000000000000000000000000000000000001% of the total matter in the observable universe. The closest star to our sun is over 25,000,000,000,000 (25 trillion) miles away. A feat we'll more than likely never reach by person and the likelihood of life being there is one in many billions anyway. We're all secretly and quietly terrified of death so take comfort in the lie that there must be something else after this, even although there was nothing before it. The only certainty in life is death. There is no certainty of living again after death.

[Bristolhibby]

Life is fundamentally meaningless. We lie to ourselves to give our lives a false sense of purpose. But the reality is, we're nothing but bacteria on a microscopic pebble surrounded by darkness. Our planet doesn't even make up 0.0000000000000000000000000000000000001% of the total matter in the observable universe. The closest star to our sun is over 25,000,000,000,000 (25 trillion) miles away. A feat we'll more than likely never reach by person and the likelihood of life being there is one in many billions anyway. We're all secretly and quietly terrified of death so take comfort in the lie that there must be something else after this, even although there was nothing before it. The only certainty in life is death. There is no certainty of living again after death.

Valar Morghulis

[Fife-Hibee]

Valar Morghulis

Drēje

[1875godsgift]

Life is fundamentally meaningless. We lie to ourselves to give our lives a false sense of purpose. But the reality is, we're nothing but bacteria on a microscopic pebble surrounded by darkness. Our planet doesn't even make up 0.0000000000000000000000000000000000001% of the total matter in the observable universe. The closest star to our sun is over 25,000,000,000,000 (25 trillion) miles away. A feat we'll more than likely never reach by person and the likelihood of life being there is one in many billions anyway. We're all secretly and quietly terrified of death so take comfort in the lie that there must be something else after this, even although there was nothing before it. The only certainty in life is death. There is no certainty of living again after death.

And the bad news is......?

[we are hibs]

You must have a severe lack of brain cells if you watch that love island. Genuinely garbage and watched by those wee spice boys with their pink gins and hair spray. Cannot think of anything worse. Would rather watch every hearts game last season for the full 90 on dvd back to back than suffer the raging simpletons on that programme or those who watch it. Ruining twitter and Facebook too with it.



Half way through posting that I realised that might be not the most unpopular opinion on here as I don't envisage many love island zombies on here. But anyway..

[danhibees1875]

Love island is quality entertainment. :greengrin

[MrRobot]

Love island is quality entertainment. :greengrin

Spice boy :greengrin

[Fife-Hibee]

You must have a severe lack of brain cells if you watch that love island. Genuinely garbage and watched by those wee spice boys with their pink gins and hair spray. Cannot think of anything worse. Would rather watch every hearts game last season for the full 90 on dvd back to back than suffer the raging simpletons on that programme or those who watch it. Ruining twitter and Facebook too with it.


You're doing it wrong. :tsk tsk:


Love island is quality entertainment. :greengrin

You're doing it right. :aok:

[Pretty Boy]

The NHS and the government need to take the kid gloves off when it comes to dealing with obesity. It's a public health crisis that rivals smoking and alcohol misuse but there seems to be a lack of desire to call it out for what it is for fear of offending people. I'm not suggesting we go about 'fat shaming' people but pretending someone who is severely overweight is simply 'promoting a positive/confident body image' is every bit as dangerous as fashion companies suggesting a size zero model is how all women should look.

[MrRobot]

People only look to get offended by things for attention.

Cyclists love to provoke drivers then play the victim.

[Fife-Hibee]

The NHS and the government need to take the kid gloves off when it comes to dealing with obesity. It's a public health crisis that rivals smoking and alcohol misuse but there seems to be a lack of desire to call it out for what it is for fear of offending people. I'm not suggesting we go about 'fat shaming' people but pretending someone who is severely overweight is simply 'promoting a positive/confident body image' is every bit as dangerous as fashion companies suggesting a size zero model is how all women should look.

I agree. More money should be put into ad campaigns warning people of the dangers of obesity and the onset of diabetes and encouraging them to lose weight. It would cost a fair whack in the short term, but if it helps to save lifes and takes a significant amount of pressure off the national health service, then it would be a worthwhile investment.

Too bad the tories don't want the pressure to be taken off it. They want it to fail.

[pollution]

Life is fundamentally meaningless. We lie to ourselves to give our lives a false sense of purpose. But the reality is, we're nothing but bacteria on a microscopic pebble surrounded by darkness. Our planet doesn't even make up 0.0000000000000000000000000000000000001% of the total matter in the observable universe. The closest star to our sun is over 25,000,000,000,000 (25 trillion) miles away. A feat we'll more than likely never reach by person and the likelihood of life being there is one in many billions anyway. We're all secretly and quietly terrified of death so take comfort in the lie that there must be something else after this, even although there was nothing before it. The only certainty in life is death. There is no certainty of living again after death.


I hope you feel better now.

Your certainty is absolute.

[The Pointer]

We need to do something about the obesity crisis. It's obscene.

We've got sports centres, facilities, Jog Scotland, we get encouraged to walk, run, jump, play sport, walk up the stairs, take part, watch your diet, eat tofu, five a day etc, etc, etc.

All that's left is fat shaming (you fat bstrds)!

[heretoday]

Why do laws keep on changing throughout history then? :wink:

The law evolves as different cases and circumstances arise.

[Weegreenman]

You would have thought that Noel Gallagher would have grown up by now, apparently not. I’m a big fan btw:not worth

[Weegreenman]

Those folk that fill the comments pages with their hate filled anger because they think they know Gerry & Kate are guilty as sin. :rolleyes: How do they know for sure, how can they know 100%? Does my nut right in :cb

[Pretty Boy]

Conrad Logan was a bang average goalkeeper, at best, who had one absolutely outstanding game for us. Had Mark Oxley made a comparable mistake to the one Logan made in the play offs against Falkirk, which played a big part in us spending a 3rd year in the Championship, there would have been people calling for him to be crucified.

Obviously a legend but there's an element of rose tinted glasses when assessing his overall performance level at Hibs.

[Future17]

Those folk that fill the comments pages with their hate filled anger because they think they know Gerry & Kate are guilty as sin. :rolleyes: How do they know for sure, how can they know 100%? Does my nut right in :cb

Think this is more for the Pet Peeves thread than controversial opinions.

[Ozyhibby]

Conrad Logan was a bang average goalkeeper, at best, who had one absolutely outstanding game for us. Had Mark Oxley made a comparable mistake to the one Logan made in the play offs against Falkirk, which played a big part in us spending a 3rd year in the Championship, there would have been people calling for him to be crucified.

Obviously a legend but there's an element of rose tinted glasses when assessing his overall performance level at Hibs.

100% agree. He very much was a bang average goalie. Oxley was even that good though.


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[Fife-Hibee]

The law evolves as different cases and circumstances arise.

Which requires those laws at the time to be broken. :wink:

[WeeRussell]

Hibs should try and get Stokesy back.

[heretoday]

This is the best thread on Hibs Net.

[Just Jimmy]

This is the best thread on Hibs Net.thanks? [emoji23]

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[Tomsk]

Kilts are utterly ridiculous.

[Scouse Hibee]

All drivers over 70 should take a practical assessment test to see if they are safe to drive on the road, similar to the test taken by stroke sufferers etc when they have to prove they are fit to resume driving.

[Fife-Hibee]

The UK Government is about to pull a spain on us by sending up the tasers and batons if we don't fall into line.

[McD]

Stokes took the piss out of Hibs in his last stint here, and had it not been for one monumental match, probably wouldn’t have been such a clamour amongst us fans to get him back for that 3rd time


Some people are hypochondriacs and a drain on the NHS, and should be challenged as such and not mollycoddled as they are/can be


MPs should be paid a reasonable wage (say, £35-40k), and Parliament should maintain block(s) of flats as residences for those who need to travel. Each MP has a flat to decorate as they see fit (on their own shilling), and when voted out/retire, they hand the keys back. The only expenses covered should be travel to and from their own home to London for parliament. Any travel out with flights/trains to London for parliament should be self funded, as they are for everyone else.


Hibs will never get a shirt manufacturer that will be met with universal approval


certain players are given a very easy time by fans, others given a much much harder time, based on perceptions which aren’t often based on much reality, more so on green tinted specs :greengrin


People aren’t taught to drive, they’re taught to pass the driving test, which isn’t the same thing.


some of the blame for increasing costs to watch sport on tv lies with fans/viewers who complained that sky had a monopoly and demanded more providers in the market, which leads to having to pay multiple providers at significantly increased costs to the consumer.


The independence debate is effectively broken because so many on both sides are entrenched and completely polarised, and not only aren’t interested in listening to anything the other side has to say, but also prefer point scoring and petty insults, further damaging any opportunities to engage in meaningful conversation.


There is no problem at all in having a Scottish team and an English team (or any other club team from elsewhere).


when you’re having a baby, no one at all is ‘entitled’ to be told what the gender is, what names you’ve picked, or any other information you choose to keep private between you and your partner.

[Tomsk]

The demise of the newspaper industry is a disaster for democracy.

BBC Scotland has been bullied into supine submission by the nationalist movement.

[Pretty Boy]

Contrary to a post above I'd say MPs are, in terms of basic salary, underpaid for the job they do. Long, long hours, a lot of time spent away from home and big responsibly for less than £80K a year. No one is going to do that job for £30K a year.

It's very popular to jump on MPs pay and point out all the people who earn less than them but there are many comparatively qualified people earning a hell of a lot more as well.

[The Modfather]

The majority of the Monty Python stuff isn’t funny, particularly the often quoted scene about the Judain Peoples Front.

Happened to catch half an hour of The Meaning Of Life and had no idea what I was watching.

[Jones28]

Over 75's shouldn't be allowed to vote in referendums. They (and indeed anyone else - but they are more likely to) may not wake up the next day and will have played a part in casting a vote that people with decades of life to live will have to live with the decision - see Brexit.

[McD]

Contrary to a post above I'd say MPs are, in terms of basic salary, underpaid for the job they do. Long, long hours, a lot of time spent away from home and big responsibly for less than £80K a year. No one is going to do that job for £30K a year.

It's very popular to jump on MPs pay and point out all the people who earn less than them but there are many comparatively qualified people earning a hell of a lot more as well.


considering what you’ve said here PB, you make a some good points, and making me reconsider my position :aok:

[lapsedhibee]

Over 75's shouldn't be allowed to vote in referendums. They (and indeed anyone else - but they are more likely to) may not wake up the next day and will have played a part in casting a vote that people with decades of life to live will have to live with the decision - see Brexit.

Quite a few 75 year olds today have two decades of life ahead.

[CloudSquall]

The argument for keeping "No Deal" on the table because removing it weakens your negotiating position is valid.

(I'm someone that would now vote remain given the deal that is about to go through with South America).

[Smartie]

The amount of time wasted on this site discussing "filling in the corners".

2 of the corners are totally unsuitable due to lack of space (see the shape of 2 of the stands behind the goals) for starters.

We currently have record season ticket sale levels but it is still very rare (to the point that it never happens) that someone who REALLY wants a ticket for a game cannot buy one. There is ample opportunity plenty of time in advance of matches and if you leave it too late and the match sells out, tough.

Our last regime were so into infrastructure projects (excellent, very much justified projects) that we as a support now seem to have nesting indoctrinated into our football club's soul.

Our home ground is excellent. Our training ground is excellent and those who worked hard to get it to this standard deserve enormous credit.

How much money do we want to spend on a bigger barn in East Lothian to train in once every 2 or 3 years when the weather is bad, just to get a badge from the SFA?

In time there might be infrastructure projects that need to be carried out.

Right now, we don't need to pay attention to anything other than our team.

[Weegreenman]

Freedom of movement was something created by evil rich people so that the workers pay and conditions that have been fought for over the last century could be eroded. Hence the bullying culture in many of our work places today by management. The employer is king and if you don’t like it, there’s the door :cb

[Weegreenman]

I’m bewildered by the amount of foreign nationals who now call Edinburgh their home. I don’t think it’s a good thing. Controversial? YES! Racist ? He’ll no!

[Smartie]

I’m bewildered by the amount of foreign nationals who now call Edinburgh their home. I don’t think it’s a good thing. Controversial? YES! Racist ? He’ll no!

Well, I suppose without this sort of thinking we wouldn't have had any need for anyone to start our football club, so in some ways we should be grateful.

And FWIW your opinion is most certainly racist and sadly not all that controversial in Brexit Britain.

[Jones28]

Quite a few 75 year olds today have two decades of life ahead.

Some will, some won't. It sounds a bit harsh but 75 years is a long time to exercise democratic rights - why not bow out and let younger generations influence their own future? Fwiw I have 3 of my 4 grandparents still with us thankfully, and none of them have voted since the 2016 refrendum, they just find it to be a pain in the arse in their 80's.

[Jones28]

I’m bewildered by the amount of foreign nationals who now call Edinburgh their home. I don’t think it’s a good thing. Controversial? YES! Racist ? He’ll no!

Why does it bewilder you? Edinburgh is a beautiful city and we should be proud to have so many people wanting to be here, setting up homes for their families.

What is negative about it?

[Fife-Hibee]

Quite a few 75 year olds today have two decades of life ahead.

Probably not a good idea to screw over the younger people that they rely on to take care of them then.

[Fife-Hibee]

Why does it bewilder you? Edinburgh is a beautiful city and we should be proud to have so many people wanting to be here, setting up homes for their families.

What is negative about it?

Dae took our jerbs!

[Fife-Hibee]

The demise of the newspaper industry is a disaster for democracy.

BBC Scotland has been bullied into supine submission by the nationalist movement.

Doesn't really help when the newspapers put themselves in a position where they are forced to apologize for their blatant misinformation and lies - https://www.express.co.uk/news/clarifications-corrections/1146141/Correction-Scottish-nationalists-march-in-Glasgow-27-June-2019?fbclid=IwAR27DqVcXr8-uj1EjMiq76co1xi87sC7XZWeQyRIKaB4Cy5XrqBZ4Xnppso (Just a shame the law doesn't require them to print their apologies in big bold letters on the front pages of their papers like they do when they're lying. Otherwise it may just pressure them to stop doing so.)

Doesn't really help when BBC Scotland (funded by the public) use blatant propaganda to serve private politicial interests either.

[Weegreenman]

Why does it bewilder you? Edinburgh is a beautiful city and we should be proud to have so many people wanting to be here, setting up homes for their families.

What is negative about it?

Ok, I’m no looking for a big debate but have you tried getting a doctors appointment lately? Before welcoming any more people to live here, could we possibly sort out basic needs for the people that already live here?

[Fife-Hibee]

Ok, I’m no looking for a big debate but have you tried getting a doctors appointment lately? Before welcoming any more people to live here, could we possibly sort out basic needs for the people that already live here?

Or instead of chasing fully qualified doctors away because they're migrants. We should welcome more people here, thus giving us more available doctors.

Perhaps you haven't noticed. But a large bulk of doctors in Scotland aren't white British people.

[Weegreenman]

[QUOTE=Smartie;5833102]Well, I suppose without this sort of thinking we wouldn't have had any need for anyone to start our football club, so in some ways we should be grateful.

And FWIW your opinion is most certainly racist and sadly not all that controversial in Brexit Britain.[/QUOTE

It’s the vast numbers of foreign nationals that have arrived in a short period of time that concerns me and our lack of infrastructure to cope with the huge numbers in which they have arrived. This opinion doesn’t make me a racist. I’m not prejudiced against any other race nor do I think I’m superior in anyway shape or form. I happen to think that there’s conspiracy of the highest order going on here but just you keep calling everyone who’s concerned about not being able to get a doctors appointment and other such things racist. This makes you an idiot!

[Fife-Hibee]

[QUOTE=Smartie;5833102]Well, I suppose without this sort of thinking we wouldn't have had any need for anyone to start our football club, so in some ways we should be grateful.

And FWIW your opinion is most certainly racist and sadly not all that controversial in Brexit Britain.[/QUOTE

It’s the vast numbers of foreign nationals that have arrived in a short period of time that concerns me and our lack of infrastructure to cope with the huge numbers in which they have arrived. This opinion doesn’t make me a racist. I’m not prejudiced against any other race nor do I think I’m superior in anyway shape or form. I happen to think that there’s conspiracy of the highest order going on here but just you keep calling everyone who’s concerned about not being able to get a doctors appointment and other such things racist. This makes you an idiot!

Scotland population 2019 - 5,440,000
Scotlands population 1971 - 5,229,000

Aye, our population is growing rapidly out of control right enough.

[Weegreenman]

Or instead of chasing fully qualified doctors away because they're migrants. We should welcome more people here, thus giving us more available doctors.

Perhaps you haven't noticed. But a large bulk of doctors in Scotland aren't white British people.

Tell me this, why are there such a large number of foreign doctors in the UK working and studying here?

Your right we should welcome more people here but first we need to make sure it’s not to the detriment of the people who already live here and that’s just not the case I’m afraid.? I believe this decision to allow FOM wasn’t taken on the basis of helping poor immigrants, no I think it was an economic decision made to make it easier for big business to ride rough shot over employee’s working rights and conditions. Pay is stagnant, bullying in the workplace is becoming more and more common, we have a zero hour culture that’s now become what’s called the gig economy.

[Fife-Hibee]

Tell me this, why are there such a large number of foreign doctors in the UK working and studying here?

Your right we should welcome more people here but first we need to make sure it’s not to the detriment of the people who already live here and that’s just not the case I’m afraid.? I believe this decision to allow FOM wasn’t taken on the basis of helping poor immigrants, no I think it was an economic decision made to make it easier for big business to ride rough shot over employee’s working rights and conditions. Pay is stagnant, bullying in the workplace is becoming more and more common, we have a zero hour culture that’s now become what’s called the gig economy.

By all means, point me to Doctors who are working under such horrific conditions and on zero hour contracts.

The issue of zero hour contracts and workers rights in this country has nothing to do with net migration figures and everything to do with UK Government policy.

[Jones28]

Tell me this, why are there such a large number of foreign doctors in the UK working and studying here?

Your right we should welcome more people here but first we need to make sure it’s not to the detriment of the people who already live here and that’s just not the case I’m afraid.? I believe this decision to allow FOM wasn’t taken on the basis of helping poor immigrants, no I think it was an economic decision made to make it easier for big business to ride rough shot over employee’s working rights and conditions. Pay is stagnant, bullying in the workplace is becoming more and more common, we have a zero hour culture that’s now become what’s called the gig economy.

Because we are desperately in need of the doctors to prop up our underfunded healthcare system!

The gig economy has developed because of government policy, not because of foreign nationals coming into the systems. They are so concerned with making sure they can post the highest "in employment" figures that it has taken the ball out of the court of workers and put in the hands of companies who hand out zero hours contracts like sweeties.

[lapsedhibee]

I have 3 of my 4 grandparents still with us thankfully, and none of them have voted since the 2016 refrendum, they just find it to be a pain in the arse in their 80's.

No evidence in general that people lose interest in voting when they reach their 80s. In 2015 GE, proportion voting increased and in 2017 GE stayed level. (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-42747342)

[bigwheel]

Ok, I’m no looking for a big debate but have you tried getting a doctors appointment lately? Before welcoming any more people to live here, could we possibly sort out basic needs for the people that already live here?

That’s about the chronic underfunding of the NHS, not to do with immigration..

Scotland isn’t a vastly growing country in terms of population.

[we are hibs]

Stokes done more than people give him credit for in his 2nd and 3rd spells.

[Hibrandenburg]

Jeremy Corbyn is a nice and decent man who will undoubtedly sweep Labour to power and reunite the broken union.

[bigwheel]

Jeremy Corbyn is a nice and decent man who will undoubtedly sweep Labour to power and reunite the broken union.

Lol. That’s more an “unpopular and high unlikely “opinion [emoji6]

[danhibees1875]

Tell me this, why are there such a large number of foreign doctors in the UK working and studying here?

Your right we should welcome more people here but first we need to make sure it’s not to the detriment of the people who already live here and that’s just not the case I’m afraid.? I believe this decision to allow FOM wasn’t taken on the basis of helping poor immigrants, no I think it was an economic decision made to make it easier for big business to ride rough shot over employee’s working rights and conditions. Pay is stagnant, bullying in the workplace is becoming more and more common, we have a zero hour culture that’s now become what’s called the gig economy.

The why? Because our services wouldn't cope without being propped up by skilled immigration. Particularly in big cities, we need skilled people from across the world in all sectors. The NHS is well documented for that. I've never really had any problems getting an appointment, but I'll assume you're right and it's hard to get one; it would be significantly harder without immigration.

Are working rights and conditions not at an all time high? Health and safety, paid leave, sick pay, minimum wage etc - I've grown up in an era with all this where people are well cared for and as far as I can tell it used to be a lot worse. :dunno:

Pay? With minimum wage introduced in 99 at £3.60 and steadily growing over 20 years to £8.21 it beats inflation, and according to this pay in the UK is growing quite quickly at the moment Vs a chunk of that time: https://www.theguardian.com/business/2019/apr/16/uk-pay-grows-at-fastest-rate-since-financial-crisis-ons

Bullying in the workplace isn't something I've ever seen, but I won't pretend it doesn't exist. I would have thought it would be on the decline given the employees rights that have been coming in over the years though.

Zero hour contracts are a problem for those on them who don't want to be on them, but great for people on them who want zero hour commitments. I'm not sure how reliable the study was, but this suggests up to 68% of people are happy with their zero hour contracts(I'd have been part of that a few years ago): https://fullfact.org/economy/how-many-people-zero-hours-contracts-want-more-hours/

There's definitely problems in the working sector, people are over paid and people are underpaid and the gap is widening. So many are over worked putting in lots of hours for minimal reward and under pressure of having their roles automated. I don't think any of these issues are down to levels of immigration, and painting them as such doesn't do them justice. It also ignores the many positives of immigration.


To think I was going to come here to give the unpopular opinion that long posts look unappealing and are too easy to skip over. :rolleyes:

[Jones28]

No evidence in general that people lose interest in voting when they reach their 80s. In 2015 GE, proportion voting increased and in 2017 GE stayed level. (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-42747342)

No, probably not. Just basing it on personal experience.

[Glory Lurker]

Stokes done more than people give him credit for in his 2nd and 3rd spells.

Steady now. There's some pretty extreme comments on this thread, but this surely warrants a ban? :-)

[Ozyhibby]

Poverty is actually falling and has been for the last 50 years. That’s why they have had to start measuring relative poverty which is great for the poverty industry because mathematically it can never be solved.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Smartie]

[QUOTE=Smartie;5833102]Well, I suppose without this sort of thinking we wouldn't have had any need for anyone to start our football club, so in some ways we should be grateful.

And FWIW your opinion is most certainly racist and sadly not all that controversial in Brexit Britain.[/QUOTE

It’s the vast numbers of foreign nationals that have arrived in a short period of time that concerns me and our lack of infrastructure to cope with the huge numbers in which they have arrived. This opinion doesn’t make me a racist. I’m not prejudiced against any other race nor do I think I’m superior in anyway shape or form. I happen to think that there’s conspiracy of the highest order going on here but just you keep calling everyone who’s concerned about not being able to get a doctors appointment and other such things racist. This makes you an idiot!

Would you care to share what sort of conspiracy you think is going on, so we can take some action to protect ourselves?

If you are having problems getting a doctor's appointment then you have my sympathy, I hope you manage to get one soon. As far as I see it the biggest problem this country (and many others around the world) has is the level of denial that is going on regarding the challenges of taking care of an ageing population. Folk live longer and expect "free" healthcare of an increasing standard to an older age. There is only so much to go round, and our politicians are less than honest with us about it. We have 2 sensible choices - raise more in taxes (we can argue all day long about how to do this) or cut services in order to make ends meet. Neither are vote winners, and our politicians continue to make ridiculous promises (see this week's news where the chancellor is rubbishing the promises being made by the 2 eejits currently vying to be PM).

In recent years we've had a third option put to us - populism. Rather than face a difficult truth, we have politicians telling us that "others" are coming here and taking stuff away, which is bollocks. The "others" might be some mythical, hard to define "elite" or it might be a group of immigrants. The reality is that the "others" who come here are providing a valuable sticking plaster whilst we fail to deal with important underlying issues, and without that sticking plaster we would be far worse off (which we'll know all about and soon). This message is particularly popular amongst the stupid and the racist, and these days it is sadly becoming more acceptable to come away with openly racist and bigoted comments under the guise of being "concerned about immigration". Modern populism is a cancer that needs to be fought against every step of the way, as the actions it encourages makes living standards poorer for all of us.

Apologies if all of this is a bit idiotic.

[Smartie]

The problems currently facing this country are not going to go away until every single one of us accepts that we're going to have to put a little bit more in and take a little bit less out.

Free education, buying your own house in your twenties and watching it multiply in value many times over during your lifetime, 2 foreign holidays per year, free healthcare for decades after retirement, running gas guzzling cars, someone else paying for your nursing home so you can leave a sizeable chunk behind for your relatives cannot all be paid for from a 30-40 year working career.

[Weegreenman]

[QUOTE=Weegreenman;5833149]

Would you care to share what sort of conspiracy you think is going on, so we can take some action to protect ourselves?

If you are having problems getting a doctor's appointment then you have my sympathy, I hope you manage to get one soon. As far as I see it the biggest problem this country (and many others around the world) has is the level of denial that is going on regarding the challenges of taking care of an ageing population. Folk live longer and expect "free" healthcare of an increasing standard to an older age. There is only so much to go round, and our politicians are less than honest with us about it. We have 2 sensible choices - raise more in taxes (we can argue all day long about how to do this) or cut services in order to make ends meet. Neither are vote winners, and our politicians continue to make ridiculous promises (see this week's news where the chancellor is rubbishing the promises being made by the 2 eejits currently vying to be PM).

In recent years we've had a third option put to us - populism. Rather than face a difficult truth, we have politicians telling us that "others" are coming here and taking stuff away, which is bollocks. The "others" might be some mythical, hard to define "elite" or it might be a group of immigrants. The reality is that the "others" who come here are providing a valuable sticking plaster whilst we fail to deal with important underlying issues, and without that sticking plaster we would be far worse off (which we'll know all about and soon). This message is particularly popular amongst the stupid and the racist, and these days it is sadly becoming more acceptable to come away with openly racist and bigoted comments under the guise of being "concerned about immigration". Modern populism is a cancer that needs to be fought against every step of the way, as the actions it encourages makes living standards poorer for all of us.

Apologies if all of this is a bit idiotic.


You need to be be more careful regards calling people out to be racist. I’ve explained what my thoughts and opinions are and why. You may not agree but that doesn’t give you the right to call me a racist because I have concerns. You make some very good points regards an aging population in which I would agree with but please don’t call people racist without good reason. One of my biggest concerns regards FOM is the lack of proper vetting. We have allowed criminal gangs from across Europe to infiltrate this country. It’s costing the tax payer to investigate those responsible for the crime that they are involved with. We have British officers being sent to all corners of Europe to investigate those people responsible. All this could and should have been avoided if the correct vetting procedures had been put in place from day one. I’d go even further and say we shouldn’t be allowing known criminals, rapists, gang members and such like to travel across borders. I would totally welcome and I do in the job I have on a daily basis welcome anyone who is hard working and here to contribute and not be leach on our society’s good natured benefits system.

[Craig_HFC]

My opinion is that the majority of posts on here that refer to a 'yam colleague' or 'yam friend' etc are completely made up or exaggerated to such an extent that they may as well be made up.

Also, the term 'Yam' is totally and utterly cringeworthy.

[JeMeSouviens]

People who are anti-immigration are generally racists. They usually lack the courage to own their racism.

[Fife-Hibee]

Those anti-immigration people in the past who denied their own racism have gradually become more forward and open about their hatred of foreigners. A growing number of xenophobic politicians can take applause for that.

[Pretty Boy]

There's absolutely no reason why the vast majority of over 75s shouldn't pay for a TV license.

[Killiehibbie]

The why? Because our services wouldn't cope without being propped up by skilled immigration. Particularly in big cities, we need skilled people from across the world in all sectors. The NHS is well documented for that. I've never really had any problems getting an appointment, but I'll assume you're right and it's hard to get one; it would be significantly harder without immigration.

Are working rights and conditions not at an all time high? Health and safety, paid leave, sick pay, minimum wage etc - I've grown up in an era with all this where people are well cared for and as far as I can tell it used to be a lot worse. :dunno:

Pay? With minimum wage introduced in 99 at £3.60 and steadily growing over 20 years to £8.21 it beats inflation, and according to this pay in the UK is growing quite quickly at the moment Vs a chunk of that time: https://www.theguardian.com/business/2019/apr/16/uk-pay-grows-at-fastest-rate-since-financial-crisis-ons

Bullying in the workplace isn't something I've ever seen, but I won't pretend it doesn't exist. I would have thought it would be on the decline given the employees rights that have been coming in over the years though.

Zero hour contracts are a problem for those on them who don't want to be on them, but great for people on them who want zero hour commitments. I'm not sure how reliable the study was, but this suggests up to 68% of people are happy with their zero hour contracts(I'd have been part of that a few years ago): https://fullfact.org/economy/how-many-people-zero-hours-contracts-want-more-hours/

There's definitely problems in the working sector, people are over paid and people are underpaid and the gap is widening. So many are over worked putting in lots of hours for minimal reward and under pressure of having their roles automated. I don't think any of these issues are down to levels of immigration, and painting them as such doesn't do them justice. It also ignores the many positives of immigration.


To think I was going to come here to give the unpopular opinion that long posts look unappealing and are too easy to skip over. :rolleyes:

They are definitely being eroded. One example is the biggest drinks company in the country and the way they are reducing their direct workforce in favour of contractors. People now doing the same job but instead of earning 30 grand for 38 hours a week they get 22 for close to 50 hours, no sick pay, minimum holidays and absolutely no benefits.

[Fife-Hibee]

Anyone who pays a TV licence because they still believe they have no choice is a clown and deserves to be mugged off and brainwashed by the privately ran broadcaster.

[Onceinawhile]

The state pension should be means tested and anyone who is of pensionable age and has personal income of over £50,000 should not receive it. It should be withdrawn in the same manners as child benefit when a parent of the household earns over £50,000.

[Bristolhibby]

Ok, I’m no looking for a big debate but have you tried getting a doctors appointment lately? Before welcoming any more people to live here, could we possibly sort out basic needs for the people that already live here?

More Doctors and nurses required, no? (Of which immigrants are many).

Blame austerity for gutting the health service and a chronic lack of investment.

[stoneyburn hibs]

Baby boomers had their cake and are still eating it.

[Pretty Boy]

To enter the NHS debate I think where they excel is in emergency treatment and the treatment and management of 'acute conditions'.

As an example I have a mole on my arm that I'm not happy about. I called my GP and asked for an appointment but stressed I didn't think it was majorly urgent. I was told they don't offer appointments in advance anymore and a GP would call me back and discuss whether I needed to be seen. I was called back within the hour, had a chat and was told to come in that day. GP examined it, said he thinks it's just a benign but abnormal looking mole but it needed referred because it scored on the ABCDE index. It was referred under the NICE guidelines on the cancer pathway and I have an appointment with a consultant dermatologist next week, just over 2 weeks after 1st contact. If there is further examination required I'll have a biopsy within a week and if it's bad news I'll begin any further treatment within 4 weeks. That's brilliant imo.

I think where the NHS struggles, and funding must play a huge part in this, is when it comes to preventative medicine and examination. I know people who live in various European countries with various different healthcare systems and most of them have some kind of 'MOT' type appointment at regular intervals (usually annually or bi annually). It's not something we really seem to have here as a matter of course; obviously there is the bowel screening self tests, routine mammograms etc but an annual sit down with a Doctor or nurse to get a quick once over doesn't seem to be on the radar. I also think the fact that social care falls under a different remit means that many people who require care at home don't always get the best care possible or the care they receive is very disjointed. It's also not uncommon to have people who could be discharged having to remain in hospital, essentially bed blocking, because of delays in putting a suitable care package in place. That seems to particularly effect elderly people dealing with chronic conditions.

My opinion, possibly unpopular, is that any discussion about the NHS quickly becomes hysterical and there is an almost palpable phobia that change means privatisation. I 100% believe that healthcare should be free at the point of delivery. However we need to examine how the NHS remains sustainable as demographics change and have an adult conversation about it. People are living longer and as such diseases such as cancer, dementia, arthritis are more common. Breakthroughs in medicine also mean that people who would once have had a short life expectancy are now living for many years with conditions that require ongoing management and treatment.

There is no easy answer but we need to have a serious conversation about it. An acceptance that as great as the NHS is as a system, it isn't infallible and it's arrogant in the extreme to assume we have it right and absolutely everyone else has it wrong would be a start.

[Bangkok Hibby]

The term "eye bleeding" commonly used on here to describe non entertaining football is overused and a bit silly.

[Peevemor]

I’m bewildered by the amount of foreign nationals who now call Edinburgh their home. I don’t think it’s a good thing. Controversial? YES! Racist ? He’ll no!I've lived in Brittany for almost 15 years. I'm a partner in my firm and employ people. My daughters were born here. I'm heavily involved in a local associations and was recently asked to stand for the local council (which I refused due to a lack of time).

Where do you think I should call home?

[McD]

To enter the NHS debate I think where they excel is in emergency treatment and the treatment and management of 'acute conditions'.

As an example I have a mole on my arm that I'm not happy about. I called my GP and asked for an appointment but stressed I didn't think it was majorly urgent. I was told they don't offer appointments in advance anymore and a GP would call me back and discuss whether I needed to be seen. I was called back within the hour, had a chat and was told to come in that day. GP examined it, said he thinks it's just a benign but abnormal looking mole but it needed referred because it scored on the ABCDE index. It was referred under the NICE guidelines on the cancer pathway and I have an appointment with a consultant dermatologist next week, just over 2 weeks after 1st contact. If there is further examination required I'll have a biopsy within a week and if it's bad news I'll begin any further treatment within 4 weeks. That's brilliant imo.

I think where the NHS struggles, and funding must play a huge part in this, is when it comes to preventative medicine and examination. I know people who live in various European countries with various different healthcare systems and most of them have some kind of 'MOT' type appointment at regular intervals (usually annually or bi annually). It's not something we really seem to have here as a matter of course; obviously there is the bowel screening self tests, routine mammograms etc but an annual sit down with a Doctor or nurse to get a quick once over doesn't seem to be on the radar. I also think the fact that social care falls under a different remit means that many people who require care at home don't always get the best care possible or the care they receive is very disjointed. It's also not uncommon to have people who could be discharged having to remain in hospital, essentially bed blocking, because of delays in putting a suitable care package in place. That seems to particularly effect elderly people dealing with chronic conditions.

My opinion, possibly unpopular, is that any discussion about the NHS quickly becomes hysterical and there is an almost palpable phobia that change means privatisation. I 100% believe that healthcare should be free at the point of delivery. However we need to examine how the NHS remains sustainable as demographics change and have an adult conversation about it. People are living longer and as such diseases such as cancer, dementia, arthritis are more common. Breakthroughs in medicine also mean that people who would once have had a short life expectancy are now living for many years with conditions that require ongoing management and treatment.

There is no easy answer but we need to have a serious conversation about it. An acceptance that as great as the NHS is as a system, it isn't infallible and it's arrogant in the extreme to assume we have it right and absolutely everyone else has it wrong would be a start.


:top marks

[beensaidbefore]

Some will, some won't. It sounds a bit harsh but 75 years is a long time to exercise democratic rights - why not bow out and let younger generations influence their own future? Fwiw I have 3 of my 4 grandparents still with us thankfully, and none of them have voted since the 2016 refrendum, they just find it to be a pain in the arse in their 80's.

What about banning under 25s too? Too many kids making voting decisons based on what mum and dad do or what their pals say. Too young to fully understabd what they are voting for....

[beensaidbefore]

The state pension should be means tested and anyone who is of pensionable age and has personal income of over £50,000 should not receive it. It should be withdrawn in the same manners as child benefit when a parent of the household earns over £50,000.

Disagree with this. I work with elderly and i think the system is quite unfair. Person a has gone to work for years and saved hard, bought their own home and invested wisely in a private pension.
Person b for whatever reason has chosen not to work/save/pay a pension yet they get free care forever more whilst person a has to pay for the lot.

This week a lady i work with is moving to a care home. Over £1500 per week to pay for her digs, whereas her workshy pub going neighbour will get the same for free, having taken from the systen for years.

Unfair imo.

[beensaidbefore]

We look for excuses to absolve people of responsibility far too easily these days.

[Hibee87]

I hate all religions and everyone should come to realise we are not some special species put here for a purpose. Prayers do not come true, praying to 'God' for a loved one to survive a illness i.e cancer is not answered if they survive. The doctors and years of scientific research saved them.
Everlasting life in paradise that Jehovah's and other religions believe sounds like it would be *****! imagine being imortal and living for 'eternity'. WTF would you do all day?

[Fife-Hibee]

Disagree with this. I work with elderly and i think the system is quite unfair. Person a has gone to work for years and saved hard, bought their own home and invested wisely in a private pension.
Person b for whatever reason has chosen not to work/save/pay a pension yet they get free care forever more whilst person a has to pay for the lot.

This week a lady i work with is moving to a care home. Over £1500 per week to pay for her digs, whereas her workshy pub going neighbour will get the same for free, having taken from the systen for years.

Unfair imo.

Person B isn't getting the opportunities that person A got to save, buy their home and invest in private pensions. Because Person A keeps voting in a government that actively prevents these opportunities for person B with a low wage economy and extortionate housing prices.

In a few decades from now, Person B won't have any money, or a care home to go to.

[RyeSloan]

Because we are desperately in need of the doctors to prop up our underfunded healthcare system!

The gig economy has developed because of government policy, not because of foreign nationals coming into the systems. They are so concerned with making sure they can post the highest "in employment" figures that it has taken the ball out of the court of workers and put in the hands of companies who hand out zero hours contracts like sweeties.

Zero hours contracts make up 2.4% of the employed workforce. Or roughly 800k.

68% of zero hour contractors who expressed an option in the ONS survey stated they didn’t want more hours.

Total numbers employed has risen by over 3m since 2010. 2.2m of them employees.

So basically zero hours contracts are in no way responsible for the sustained rise in employment figures. And in fact full fact state the following:

“the employment rate (the proportion of people aged 16-64 who are in work) would still be at a record high even if every worker on a zero hours contract was excluded from the data”

[beensaidbefore]

Person B isn't getting the opportunities that person A got to save, buy their home and invest in private pensions. Because Person A keeps voting in a government that actively prevents these opportunities for person B with a low wage economy and extortionate housing prices.

In a few decades from now, Person B won't have any money, or a care home to go to.


Such as the labour party from 97 onwards you mean?

[Tomsk]

Cats are better than dogs.*


* Speaking as a non-cat owning dog-owner.

[Tomsk]

Fresh air is grossly overrated. As is walking, hill-walking, climbing, mountaineering, camping or indeed any outdoor pursuit type activity. Anyone who would choose to holiday in a tent rather a hotel is probably certifiable.

[Just Jimmy]

Cats are better than dogs.*


* Speaking as a non-cat owning dog-owner.having one of each, I flip flop between. often my mood suits the cat best. we just sit in the same room in silence and leave each other alone. the dog is too needy [emoji23]

Sent from my SM-A520F using Tapatalk

[Just Jimmy]

Fresh air is grossly overrated. As is walking, hill-walking, climbing, mountaineering, camping or indeed any outdoor pursuit type activity. Anyone who would choose to holiday in a tent rather a hotel is probably certifiable.usually these activities are 'enjoyed' by people who only do them to to brag about it.

no one actually enjoys it.

Sent from my SM-A520F using Tapatalk

[Fife-Hibee]

Such as the labour party from 97 onwards you mean?

If you're daft enough to refer to them as the "Labour Party".

[Glory Lurker]

A patriot does not try to avoid tax.

[beensaidbefore]

If you're daft enough to refer to them as the "Labour Party".

What do you call them? :confused:

[Fife-Hibee]

What do you call them? :confused:

Red tories, because that's exactly what they were.

[marinello59]

Red tories, because that's exactly what they were.

Red Tories? Tartan Tories? Same thing I guess. 😃

[makaveli1875]

Everyone's a Tory.

[Speedy]

The state pension should be means tested and anyone who is of pensionable age and has personal income of over £50,000 should not receive it. It should be withdrawn in the same manners as child benefit when a parent of the household earns over £50,000.

Disagree. It would waste a lot of time/resource that would erode any benefit and would also discourage people from saving privately (meaning more reliance on the state long term).

[Speedy]

What about banning under 25s too? Too many kids making voting decisons based on what mum and dad do or what their pals say. Too young to fully understabd what they are voting for....

There are idiots of all ages who are entitled to vote. 16 year olds shouldn't be excluded based on a lack of life experience.

[MyJo]

Minutes applauses at specific times during a match are crap. People asking for one at Easter road for random supporters who have died is cringeworthy.

All religions are nonsense.

There should be some form of test and licence for people to obtain before they are allowed to have kids.

[McD]

Equality should mean exactly that. No affirmative action, no quotas for gender/religion/race/etc. No women’s only aquarobics/exercise classes, baby changing facilities available to men and women, no men’s only clubs, no men’s only sports clubs, no insurance companies that only insure women (this may now have changed but not long again was a thing), no differing taxes on health/sanitary products, no sneering at men who want to be the stay at home parent or take their baby to their swimming lessons, no differing standards as to how a man and a woman are punished for the same crimes, and so on.


We are seeing progress in this direction, much still to do. It’s the prejudice of all of these groups, internally and externally, that slow and stunt that progress.

[Tomsk]

Equality should mean exactly that. No affirmative action, no quotas for gender/religion/race/etc. No women’s only aquarobics/exercise classes, baby changing facilities available to men and women, no men’s only clubs, no men’s only sports clubs, no insurance companies that only insure women (this may now have changed but not long again was a thing), no differing taxes on health/sanitary products, no sneering at men who want to be the stay at home parent or take their baby to their swimming lessons, no differing standards as to how a man and a woman are punished for the same crimes, and so on.


We are seeing progress in this direction, much still to do. It’s the prejudice of all of these groups, internally and externally, that slow and stunt that progress.

On that subject, the emasculation of men as a consequence of current dimly understood mores is a source of endless regret. Whenever I see a man walking along with a baby strapped to his chest in some sort of harness I think to myself that is beyond embarrassing, if you ever had it you've chucked it now.

[Fife-Hibee]

Equality should mean exactly that. No affirmative action, no quotas for gender/religion/race/etc. No women’s only aquarobics/exercise classes, baby changing facilities available to men and women, no men’s only clubs, no men’s only sports clubs, no insurance companies that only insure women (this may now have changed but not long again was a thing), no differing taxes on health/sanitary products, no sneering at men who want to be the stay at home parent or take their baby to their swimming lessons, no differing standards as to how a man and a woman are punished for the same crimes, and so on.


We are seeing progress in this direction, much still to do. It’s the prejudice of all of these groups, internally and externally, that slow and stunt that progress.

That's terrifying.

[The Modfather]

Equality should mean exactly that. No affirmative action, no quotas for gender/religion/race/etc. No women’s only aquarobics/exercise classes, baby changing facilities available to men and women, no men’s only clubs, no men’s only sports clubs, no insurance companies that only insure women (this may now have changed but not long again was a thing), no differing taxes on health/sanitary products, no sneering at men who want to be the stay at home parent or take their baby to their swimming lessons, no differing standards as to how a man and a woman are punished for the same crimes, and so on.

We are seeing progress in this direction, much still to do. It’s the prejudice of all of these groups, internally and externally, that slow and stunt that progress.

Re the bit in bold, is there still a stigma to Dad’s doing the swimming lessons? I took my baby daughter to swimming lessons and half the class were Dads. I now take Isla swimming at our gym Saturday & Sunday mornings just us two and have only encountered positive reactions.

[The Modfather]

On that subject, the emasculation of men as a consequence of current dimly understood mores is a source of endless regret. Whenever I see a man walking along with a baby strapped to his chest in some sort of harness I think to myself that is beyond embarrassing, if you ever had it you've chucked it now.

Out of curiosity what do you find embarrassing? I often take my daughter out for a walk and if she’s tired I’ll take the pram so she can sleep. Otherwise I’ll take her in the papoose, and actually prefer that, as can talk to her and interact with her more than when she’s in the pram.

[Hibrandenburg]

The problems currently facing this country are not going to go away until every single one of us accepts that we're going to have to put a little bit more in and take a little bit less out.

Free education, buying your own house in your twenties and watching it multiply in value many times over during your lifetime, 2 foreign holidays per year, free healthcare for decades after retirement, running gas guzzling cars, someone else paying for your nursing home so you can leave a sizeable chunk behind for your relatives cannot all be paid for from a 30-40 year working career.

This. Almost half of what I earn goes to the taxman and my employer has to duplicate that what I pay for health insurance and social security insurance. It's a price worth paying though because the public services and health care is excellent over here.

[Killiehibbie]

Re the bit in bold, is there still a stigma to Dad’s doing the swimming lessons? I took my baby daughter to swimming lessons and half the class were Dads. I now take Isla swimming at our gym Saturday & Sunday mornings just us two and have only encountered positive reactions.


Never encountered any negativity and that was 20 years ago. A few guys wished they had the time but drew the line at going on the nightshift to make the time.

[McD]

Re the bit in bold, is there still a stigma to Dad’s doing the swimming lessons? I took my baby daughter to swimming lessons and half the class were Dads. I now take Isla swimming at our gym Saturday & Sunday mornings just us two and have only encountered positive reactions.


My daughter will be born in the next few days, and I really hope I get the same experience as you, thanks for sharing.


i took one of my nephews to his swimming class several years ago to help out my sister, and heard quite a few muttered snidey comments amongst some of the attending mothers about a man being there.

[McD]

Equality should mean exactly that. No affirmative action, no quotas for gender/religion/race/etc. No women’s only aquarobics/exercise classes, baby changing facilities available to men and women, no men’s only clubs, no men’s only sports clubs, no insurance companies that only insure women (this may now have changed but not long again was a thing), no differing taxes on health/sanitary products, no sneering at men who want to be the stay at home parent or take their baby to their swimming lessons, no differing standards as to how a man and a woman are punished for the same crimes, and so on.


We are seeing progress in this direction, much still to do. It’s the prejudice of all of these groups, internally and externally, that slow and stunt that progress.


That's terrifying.


I typed out a reply here, then considered if I had misunderstood exactly what it is that you find terrifying, so before I respond, I’d like to ask if you can clarify what you find terrifying please?

[Fife-Hibee]

I typed out a reply here, then considered if I had misunderstood exactly what it is that you find terrifying, so before I respond, I’d like to ask if you can clarify what you find terrifying please?

It's terrifying because it's so unbelievably artifical. Humans discriminate, it's part of what makes us human. This equilibrium idea comes straight out of George Orwell's 1984.

Unless we start policing peoples thoughts, there will never be this absolute level of equality. It just isn't human.

[McD]

It's terrifying because it's so unbelievably artifical. Humans discriminate, it's part of what makes us human. This equilibrium idea comes straight out of George Orwell's 1984.

Unless we start policing peoples thoughts, there will never be this absolute level of equality. It just isn't human.


So I did understand you correctly.

You think its ok for women to have to pay tax on health products they need? To assess applicants for a job based on their colour or gender? That people should be excluded or made to feel uncomfortable just because you think it’s ok?
You have no issue with YOU being discriminated against, just because someone someone thinks you aren’t worthy, or the right colour, or gender?

Wow! That is what is terrifying. Or actually, more like sad. Thanks for sharing your Neanderthal beliefs.


For what it’s worth, at no time did I suggest (or think!) that people’s thoughts should be policed. Thinking about something isn’t a crime. Carrying out or acting on those thoughts could be.

What I did suggest is that any person should be treated with the same respect, and with the same rights, as any other. Compatibility for a job is not determined by colour. Ability to parent is not determined by gender. A person’s gender should not preclude them from playing golf on certain courses, or drinking/eating in certain places, or prevent them from spending time and partaking in activities with their family and children. I accept people for who they are, not for their gender, colour, religion, or any other manner of discriminating against them. Apparently you believe differently.

[Fife-Hibee]

So I did understand you correctly.

You think its ok for women to have to pay tax on health products they need? To assess applicants for a job based on their colour or gender? That people should be excluded or made to feel uncomfortable just because you think it’s ok?
You have no issue with YOU being discriminated against, just because someone someone thinks you aren’t worthy, or the right colour, or gender?

Wow! That is what is terrifying. Or actually, more like sad. Thanks for sharing your Neanderthal beliefs.


For what it’s worth, at no time did I suggest (or think!) that people’s thoughts should be policed. Thinking about something isn’t a crime. Carrying out or acting on those thoughts could be.

What I did suggest is that any person should be treated with the same respect, and with the same rights, as any other. Compatibility for a job is not determined by colour. Ability to parent is not determined by gender. A person’s gender should not preclude them from playing golf on certain courses, or drinking/eating in certain places, or prevent them from spending time and partaking in activities with their family and children. I accept people for who they are, not for their gender, colour, religion, or any other manner of discriminating against them. Apparently you believe differently.

This isn't about right or wrong. It's about natural human behaviours. Who decides whats really fair in the world or not? Who should have the power to dictate over everybody else over where to draw the line on equality?

You call my beliefs "neanderthal". Completely arrogant to the fact that your view of what is fair, isn't necessarily shared far and wide.

[Future17]

It's terrifying because it's so unbelievably artifical. Humans discriminate, it's part of what makes us human. This equilibrium idea comes straight out of George Orwell's 1984.

Unless we start policing peoples thoughts, there will never be this absolute level of equality. It just isn't human.

What a strange post. It reads like you're suggesting we should accept discrimination because the alternative is "terrifying".

It's arguably human nature for humans to make war; should we just accept that and not try to prevent conflicts that kill thousands?

[Fife-Hibee]

What a strange post. It reads like you're suggesting we should accept discrimination because the alternative is "terrifying".

It's arguably human nature for humans to make war; should we just accept that and not try to prevent conflicts that kill thousands?

We have no choice but to accept discrimination, whether you agree with it or not. People will always discriminate. We can try as hard as we like, it's never really going to stop.

We even use war to "prevent war".

[Future17]

This isn't about right or wrong. It's about natural human behaviours. Who decides whats really fair in the world or not? Who should have the power to dictate over everybody else over where to draw the line on equality?

You call my beliefs "neanderthal". Completely arrogant to the fact that your view of what is fair, isn't necessarily shared far and wide.

You called the previous poster's beliefs "terrifying". Completely arrogant to the fact that your view of what is fair isn't necessarily shared far and wide.

[Fife-Hibee]

You called the previous poster's beliefs "terrifying". Completely arrogant to the fact that your view of what is fair isn't necessarily shared far and wide.

I never gave a view on what I consider to be fair. I just know that one mans vision, isn't the vision of the world.

[Future17]

We have no choice but to accept discrimination, whether you agree with it or not. People will always discriminate. We can try as hard as we like, it's never really going to stop.

We even use war to "prevent war".

That may or may not be true, but we can and should take steps to prevent or mitigate the symptoms of discrimination.

We've done it before and it has worked.

[Tomsk]

If they so choose, men should be able to form male-only clubs and societies without stigmatisation.

It's incredible that opinion would actually be deemed controversial.

[McD]

This isn't about right or wrong. It's about natural human behaviours. Who decides whats really fair in the world or not? Who should have the power to dictate over everybody else over where to draw the line on equality?

You call my beliefs "neanderthal". Completely arrogant to the fact that your view of what is fair, isn't necessarily shared far and wide.


Who decides? Well on that basis, let’s do away with laws and government then, since that would be some people dictating to others then.


Given the number of laws against discrimination, civil rights, equality acts, etc, I think it’s fair to say that your opinion is in the minority, and that many governments, organisations and groups disagree with you.


By the way, the irony in your comment “who should have the power to dictate to anyone else” - if no one had the power to dictate to anyone else, as you’re suggesting, doesn’t that lead to - equality? You’ve just made my point. No one should have the power over another to discriminate.


Arrogant I may be, but you’ve made it clear that you see no issue with discrimination, and by extension sexism, racism, etc. Perhaps Alf Garnett would have been a better description rather than Neanderthal. I know who I’d rather be.



What a strange post. It reads like you're suggesting we should accept discrimination because the alternative is "terrifying".

It's arguably human nature for humans to make war; should we just accept that and not try to prevent conflicts that kill thousands?



:aok:

[Future17]

I never gave a view on what I consider to be fair. I just know that one mans vision, isn't the vision of the world.

I didn't say you did, but the poster was entitled to hold the opinion of your view as Neanderthal if you're entitled to consider his terrifying. If one view is arrogant, so is the other.

[Fife-Hibee]

That may or may not be true, but we can and should take steps to prevent or mitigate the symptoms of discrimination.

We've done it before and it has worked.

When have we done it before?

"Symptoms" of discrimation as you put it, are symptoms of being human. We all discriminate, including yourself.

[Fife-Hibee]

Who decides? Well on that basis, let’s do away with laws and government then, since that would be some people dictating to others then.


Given the number of laws against discrimination, civil rights, equality acts, etc, I think it’s fair to say that your opinion is in the minority, and that many governments, organisations and groups disagree with you.


By the way, the irony in your comment “who should have the power to dictate to anyone else” - if no one had the power to dictate to anyone else, as you’re suggesting, doesn’t that lead to - equality? You’ve just made my point. No one should have the power over another to discriminate.


Arrogant I may be, but you’ve made it clear that you see no issue with discrimination, and by extension sexism, racism, etc. Perhaps Alf Garnett would have been a better description rather than Neanderthal. I know who I’d rather be.

You're still not getting it. It's not a question of whether i'm personally ok with it or not. It's simply what is and what isn't. You go on about how wrong discrimination is, then discriminate against me by calling me a neanderthal for the crime of pointing out that everybody discriminates.

All these "groups" that disagree with me.... guess what. They all discriminate.

[Smartie]

My daughter will be born in the next few days, and I really hope I get the same experience as you, thanks for sharing.


i took one of my nephews to his swimming class several years ago to help out my sister, and heard quite a few muttered snidey comments amongst some of the attending mothers about a man being there.

Me and my partner take our daughter to swimming together. My partner goes in and does the swimming whilst I'm at the side, then I get my daughter ready so my partner can get changed in peace.

It might just be our class, but I honestly didn't think twice about who should do what. Pretty much all of the mums and dads have done a stint in the pool, all have done a stint on the side, and all have done a stint where they do it all on their own.

My daughter is now 16 months old and has been doing the swimming for just under a year. My daughter is better now, but the "getting changed after swimming" thing used to be hilarious - all these dads trying, with varying levels of success, to control excitable tots as they tried to get them changed after swimming. It's a riot, especially if you're trying to get changed yourself at the same time, as the kids learn to roll over, crawl walk, climb etc etc etc. It's one of the highlights of my week and whilst it has had me tearing my hair out at times, I think it is one of the times I'll look back on most fondly when I'm on my deathbed.


And re the papoose thing - rather than sort of status symbol about being a modern, effeminate man, they're simply quite practical. We've upgraded from the papoose to this sort of rucksack thing that holds our daughter, and we're going out for a wander with it to North Berwick today. They're great because they allow you to walk places you can't take a pram/ buggy, remain active, interact with your child etc etc. I tend to take turns with my partner carrying the wee one and it works well. It hasn't really registered with me that folk would be looking and judging me negatively, and if they are - stuff them.

And all the best of luck with your imminent arrival over the next few days and beyond.

[McD]

You're still not getting it. It's not a question of whether i'm personally ok with it or not. It's simply what is and what isn't. You go on about how wrong discrimination is, then discriminate against me by calling me a neanderthal for the crime of pointing out that everybody discriminates.

All these "groups" that disagree with me.... guess what. They all discriminate.


Disagreeing with you means they discriminate :faf:

guess what? I really don’t care. I don’t get your view of the world, I don’t care, nor do I care that you choose to view the world in a different way.

[McD]

Me and my partner take our daughter to swimming together. My partner goes in and does the swimming whilst I'm at the side, then I get my daughter ready so my partner can get changed in peace.

It might just be our class, but I honestly didn't think twice about who should do what. Pretty much all of the mums and dads have done a stint in the pool, all have done a stint on the side, and all have done a stint where they do it all on their own.

My daughter is now 16 months old and has been doing the swimming for just under a year. My daughter is better now, but the "getting changed after swimming" thing used to be hilarious - all these dads trying, with varying levels of success, to control excitable tots as they tried to get them changed after swimming. It's a riot, especially if you're trying to get changed yourself at the same time, as the kids learn to roll over, crawl walk, climb etc etc etc. It's one of the highlights of my week and whilst it has had me tearing my hair out at times, I think it is one of the times I'll look back on most fondly when I'm on my deathbed.


And re the papoose thing - rather than sort of status symbol about being a modern, effeminate man, they're simply quite practical. We've upgraded from the papoose to this sort of rucksack thing that holds our daughter, and we're going out for a wander with it to North Berwick today. They're great because they allow you to walk places you can't take a pram/ buggy, remain active, interact with your child etc etc. I tend to take turns with my partner carrying the wee one and it works well. It hasn't really registered with me that folk would be looking and judging me negatively, and if they are - stuff them.

And all the best of luck with your imminent arrival over the next few days and beyond.



Firstly, thank you :aok: I’m really looking forward to her arriving :greengrin

the rucksack thing sounds really interesting, I’ll keep my eyes open for that, for the exact reasons you’ve described, not needing or unable to take the pram or buggy, and being able to interact with her.

:aok:


PS - apologies for thread hijack everyone

[Tomsk]

Firstly, thank you :aok: I’m really looking forward to her arriving :greengrin

the rucksack thing sounds really interesting, I’ll keep my eyes open for that, for the exact reasons you’ve described, not needing or unable to take the pram or buggy, and being able to interact with her.

:aok:


PS - apologies for thread hijack everyone


Yip - let's get back to the unpopular or controversial opinions.

Men over the age of 21 should not be allowed to wear shorts unless they are playing sport.

[Fife-Hibee]

Disagreeing with you means they discriminate :faf:

guess what? I really don’t care. I don’t get your view of the world, I don’t care, nor do I care that you choose to view the world in a different way.

Yes. Disagreement requires discrimination. If you can't disriminate against a person or their views, then how can you determine whether you disagree with them or not?

I would say based on your reactionary responses on here, clearly you do care. Saying everybody discriminates isn't a "view" though. It's indisputable fact.

[Hibee87]

Yip - let's get back to the unpopular or controversial opinions.

Men over the age of 21 should not be allowed to wear shorts unless they are playing sport.

What's wrong with wearing shorts, on a hot day? What do you wear in the sun or when on holiday?

[Hibee87]

Just cause something offends you/someone doesn't make it wrong.
'blackface' is a prime example. It's not racist if your dressing up as someone. I've been to fancy dress where people have dressed as Mr T and blacked their face, that's dressing as a character. If you were to dress as Golliwog then yeah, that's racist and I can see why, and I can also see the difference in the 2.
People will always bring up the history of blackface, which again I get. However you can't say because x y z done this or that how ever many years ago means it's a blanked ban on someone dressing as a character still.

[McD]

Yes. Disagreement requires discrimination. If you can't disriminate against a person or their views, then how can you determine whether you disagree with them or not?

I would say based on your reactionary responses on here, clearly you do care. Saying everybody discriminates isn't a "view" though. It's indisputable fact.



Unless you have personally met and assessed every single person on the planet, you cannot state it’s a fact. It’s an opinion. and that is a fact.


Secondly, I can have a rational conversation with someone and determine if I agree or disagree with their view, that doesn’t mean I am discriminating against them. It’s called accepting that people can have different views than me, that they and I can discuss and debate, without either of us resorting to discrimination.

Disagreement requires discussion to share views. It does not require discrimination.

Here is the definition of discrimination: the unjust or prejudicial treatment of different categories of people, especially on the grounds of race, age, or sex.

if you're fine with doing that, crack on. Either way, I’m out, partly because it’s sidetracking the thread, and mostly because you’re either trolling or you are a bigot - which isn’t discrimination, it’s a description of your what you’ve said, which is also a fact.

[McD]

Just cause something offends you/someone doesn't make it wrong.
'blackface' is a prime example. It's not racist if your dressing up as someone. I've been to fancy dress where people have dressed as Mr T and blacked their face, that's dressing as a character. If you were to dress as Golliwog then yeah, that's racist and I can see why, and I can also see the difference in the 2.
People will always bring up the history of blackface, which again I get. However you can't say because x y z done this or that how ever many years ago means it's a blanked ban on someone dressing as a character still.


i think there’s also an extension of this, where someone is trying identify someone/something, that is wrongly interpreted as racism.

for example, if there is a crowd of people and I am trying to direct you to speak a specific person, it’s not racist to say ‘it’s the black gentleman that you need to speak to’. It’s a way of identifying (in that moment) who I am referring to, in the same way as ‘talk the lady with ginger hair’, or ‘the fellow with the yellow shirt’. I’m not being racist, just trying to provide accurate information.

It would be racist to add a derogatory theme to the same sentence, but if it’s to direct someone to a specific person in a large group, it’s not.

[Future17]

Yes. Disagreement requires discrimination. If you can't disriminate against a person or their views, then how can you determine whether you disagree with them or not?

I would say based on your reactionary responses on here, clearly you do care. Saying everybody discriminates isn't a "view" though. It's indisputable fact.

This isn't the first time you and I have disagreed on this forum where it seems to me you don't have a proper understanding of the language you use. That may come across as condescending, but that isn't my intent; it's just that I'm now at the point of reading your posts trying to interpret if we're talking about the same thing.

Disagreement does not require discrimination and, to be honest, the suggestion that it does is one of the strangest things I've read on here.

Discrimination, in the negative sense, is prejudicial. By definition, a person discriminates by forming an opinion without seeking to understand the other person's point of view and it's not possible to disagree with someone without knowing what their point of view is.

[CloudSquall]

Serena Williams is hot.

[easty]

Serena Williams is hot.

Nope

[Bostonhibby]

You get a brilliant view of the castle.

Sent from my SM-A750FN using Tapatalk

[Onceinawhile]

Disagree. It would waste a lot of time/resource that would erode any benefit and would also discourage people from saving privately (meaning more reliance on the state long term).

It wouldn't really. It's already done for child benefit through the high income child benefit charge. It just means a few more people have to do tax returns.

Anyone who earns over 60k either pays it all back or chooses not to receive it.

Of course it would be susceptible to abuse due to the flexible draw down you get on pensions.

Also, I don't think it would discourage people from saving - there's already the auto enrollment rules so anyone employed should have a decent pension anyway.

[heretoday]

I've always supported Chelsea FC. The fans get a bad reputation but they're no worse than Spurs or Arsenal in my experience - and certainly better than West Ham.

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

Serena Williams is hot.

She should buy a fan.

[hibs#1]

Billy Connolly isn't very funny.

[GlesgaeHibby]

Serena Williams is hot.

Ha - was going to post that.

[Crunchie]

Anyone who has watched more than 2 episodes of Eastenders, or any soap for that matter, shouldn't be allowed to vote.

[StevesFamau5]

James Corden is an unfunny annoying prick of a man, Gavin and Stacey is pish as well.

[brianmc]

James Corden is an unfunny annoying prick of a man, Gavin and Stacey is pish as well.

Surely this is neither a controversial or unpopular opinion?

[lyonhibs]

In most cases, what gets called gentrification is an overwhelmingly good thing for the area involved, with the occasional exception of housing stock issues. Sticks in the mud or NIMBYism are the only folk who oppose it.

[Ozyhibby]

In most cases, what gets called gentrification is an overwhelmingly good thing for the area involved, with the occasional exception of housing stock issues. Sticks in the mud or NIMBYism are the only folk who oppose it.

100% agree with this.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Ozyhibby]

James Corden is an unfunny annoying prick of a man, Gavin and Stacey is pish as well.

I think Gavin and Stacey is excellent. [emoji3]


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[weecounty hibby]

Ed Sheeran is brutal, hyped up to the max by the press but just not very good.

[Jones28]

Zero hours contracts make up 2.4% of the employed workforce. Or roughly 800k.

68% of zero hour contractors who expressed an option in the ONS survey stated they didn’t want more hours.

Total numbers employed has risen by over 3m since 2010. 2.2m of them employees.

So basically zero hours contracts are in no way responsible for the sustained rise in employment figures. And in fact full fact state the following:

“the employment rate (the proportion of people aged 16-64 who are in work) would still be at a record high even if every worker on a zero hours contract was excluded from the data”

I can’t argue with that I suppose!

[danhibees1875]

We probably need some overly intrusive government policies to help enforce positive environmental action in the next few decades. Quotas on air travel, rations on meat products, stronger taxes on vehicles etc.

It can work as both a carrot and stick approach, as well as any restrictions on things there should be incentives on other things. Subsidised meat free alternatives, cheaper in season British fruit and veg (this should have came in along with a sugar tax imo), better and more accessible public transport systems and cycle paths, etc.

These things would have to be aimed at organisations as well as the individual and I've no idea how you get cross country agreement to make them work effectively though.

[WeeRussell]

Yes. Disagreement requires discrimination. If you can't disriminate against a person or their views, then how can you determine whether you disagree with them or not?

I would say based on your reactionary responses on here, clearly you do care. Saying everybody discriminates isn't a "view" though. It's indisputable fact.

Mate, I don't think you know what discriminate means.

[MrRobot]

Once your child has reached 1 year of age you should no longer refer to their age in months.

[Future17]

Mate, I don't think you know what discriminate means.

You're wasting your time. I told him/her this 4 days ago and they haven't returned to this thread since.

[heretoday]

Ed Sheeran is brutal, hyped up to the max by the press but just not very good.

Every song is the same. mind you, that's what my dad said about the Stones!

[Killiehibbie]

Once your child has reached 1 year of age you should no longer refer to their age in months.

23 months then it's years.

[danhibees1875]

Once your child has reached 1 year of age you should no longer refer to their age in months.

As someone who's about to turn 334 months old, I completely agree.

[StevesFamau5]

The Big Bang Theory should have been punted years ago, The Simpsons needs to end now, Family Guy is getting worse and Rick + Morty is utterly woeful :doh::doh:

[Jones28]

The Big Bang Theory should have been punted years ago, The Simpsons needs to end now, Family Guy is getting worse and Rick + Morty is utterly woeful :doh::doh:

Agree with this

[Jones28]

What about banning under 25s too? Too many kids making voting decisons based on what mum and dad do or what their pals say. Too young to fully understabd what they are voting for....

My angle is more that someone in their twenties has possibly 60/70 years of life ahead of them - they have longer to live on this planet than someone in their 70/80’s, the understanding element is entirely different.

[WeeRussell]

You're wasting your time. I told him/her this 4 days ago and they haven't returned to this thread since.

Haha I just seen your explanation to them now, not sure how I missed it before. You went to more effort than I intend to :aok:

[Bangkok Hibby]

23 months then it's years.

So I need to stop telling people I'm 744 months old then?

[Killiehibbie]

So I need to stop telling people I'm 744 months old then?

Depends if you want them to get confused and think that's only 50 odds:greengrin. It's amazing how many people can't do a quick division.

[matty_f]

The Foo Fighters are guff.

[Pretty Boy]

The Foo Fighters are guff.

I thought it was only me.

Rock for people who don't like rock.

[Scouse Hibee]

Assisted suicide should be available and legal for the terminally ill.

[wpj]

Me and my partner take our daughter to swimming together. My partner goes in and does the swimming whilst I'm at the side, then I get my daughter ready so my partner can get changed in peace.

It might just be our class, but I honestly didn't think twice about who should do what. Pretty much all of the mums and dads have done a stint in the pool, all have done a stint on the side, and all have done a stint where they do it all on their own.

My daughter is now 16 months old and has been doing the swimming for just under a year. My daughter is better now, but the "getting changed after swimming" thing used to be hilarious - all these dads trying, with varying levels of success, to control excitable tots as they tried to get them changed after swimming. It's a riot, especially if you're trying to get changed yourself at the same time, as the kids learn to roll over, crawl walk, climb etc etc etc. It's one of the highlights of my week and whilst it has had me tearing my hair out at times, I think it is one of the times I'll look back on most fondly when I'm on my deathbed.


And re the papoose thing - rather than sort of status symbol about being a modern, effeminate man, they're simply quite practical. We've upgraded from the papoose to this sort of rucksack thing that holds our daughter, and we're going out for a wander with it to North Berwick today. They're great because they allow you to walk places you can't take a pram/ buggy, remain active, interact with your child etc etc. I tend to take turns with my partner carrying the wee one and it works well. It hasn't really registered with me that folk would be looking and judging me negatively, and if they are - stuff them.

And all the best of luck with your imminent arrival over the next few days and beyond.

Been there, done that, to make matters worse the changing rooms were mixed (showers weren't) seeing me trying to catch my girl in my undies scared a few mums

[Jones28]

The Foo Fighters are guff.

Oh that’s a belter, they are a bit pish.

[Fife-Hibee]

Our "national broadcaster" is an echo chamber for the Israeli apartheid regime and has been for quite some time now.

[MrRobot]

The Big Bang Theory should have been punted years ago, The Simpsons needs to end now, Family Guy is getting worse and Rick + Morty is utterly woeful :doh::doh:

South Park however is as strong as ever.

[Just Jimmy]

film characters or book characters made into a film should be played by actors who are as close to their original discripton as possible.

For example. JAMES Bond should never be played by a woman as he is a man and should remain as such. certain parts of a character should never be tweaked and this is one.

there are obviously other characters, such as doctor who, which lends itself more to flexibility and can be tweaked in this way.

Sent from my SM-A520F using Tapatalk

[Fife-Hibee]

film characters or book characters made into a film should be played by actors who are as close to their original discripton as possible.

For example. JAMES Bond should never be played by a woman as he is a man and should remain as such. certain parts of a character should never be tweaked and this is one.

there are obviously other characters, such as doctor who, which lends itself more to flexibility and can be tweaked in this way.

Sent from my SM-A520F using Tapatalk

Even the change in Doctor Who was farcical. It had already been well established that the doctor couldn't change gender. So it was always going to anger fans of the show.

Another one is character gender switches in historical plays. Because apparently historical accuracy no longer applies.

[heretoday]

I can't abide The Proclaimers.

[RyeSloan]

Even the change in Doctor Who was farcical. It had already been well established that the doctor couldn't change gender. So it was always going to anger fans of the show.

Another one is character gender switches in historical plays. Because apparently historical accuracy no longer applies.

The Doctor is a fictional alien who merely takes on a human like appearance...to describe the transition of said alien to a female form as farcical and that a non gender change had been ‘well established’ is rather odd.

Indeed putting aside the fact that you are describing a fictional alien, a gender change had been mooted for a long time and even by the creator (with the rather punnish name!) Sydney Newman as far back as the mid 80’s.

His exact words were recorded in a letter to Michael Grade “At a later stage, Doctor Who should be metamorphosed into a woman”

[Bostonhibby]

The Doctor is a fictional alien who merely takes on a human like appearance...to describe the transition of said alien to a female form as farcical and that a gender change had been ‘well established’ is rather odd.

Indeed putting aside the fact that you are describing a fictional alien, a gender change had been mooted for a long time and even by the creator (with the rather punnish name!) Sydney Newman as far back as the mid 80’s.

His exact words were recorded in a letter to Michael Grade “At a later stage, Doctor Who should be metamorphosed into a woman”WTF? Doctor Who is a fictional alien? Please tell me it's not true, after all these years....

I blame Petrie. What next? You'll be expecting me to believe Batman is actually just some rich do-gooder in a fancy costume, or that Craig Levein is still getting away with the old football manager act.



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[RyeSloan]

WTF? Doctor Who is a fictional alien? Please tell me it's not true, after all these years....

I blame Petrie. What next? You'll be expecting me to believe Batman is actually just some rich do-gooder in a fancy costume, or that Craig Levein is still getting away with the old football manager act.



Sent from my SM-A750FN using Tapatalk

Hee hee maybe Levein is the alien and Batman defo exists?

[The Pointer]

film characters or book characters made into a film should be played by actors who are as close to their original discripton as possible.

For example. JAMES Bond should never be played by a woman as he is a man and should remain as such. certain parts of a character should never be tweaked and this is one.
there are obviously other characters, such as doctor who, which lends itself more to flexibility and can be tweaked in this way.

Sent from my SM-A520F using Tapatalk

One of our graduates told me today that the next 'Bond', after Daniel Craig's final film, is to be a black female. I just happened to have a copy of a James Bond paperback from 1965 at my desk (as you do) which suggests this is impossible, so I think that'll be the end of the franchise.

[Fife-Hibee]

One of our graduates told me today that the next 'Bond', after Daniel Craig's final film, is to be a black female. I just happened to have a copy of a James Bond paperback from 1965 at my desk (as you do) which suggests this is impossible, so I think that'll be the end of the franchise.

It'll certainly flop. To most people it just reeks of politicial manipulation. Why change a winning working formula, just for the purpose of appearing politically correct?

[Bostonhibby]

Hee hee maybe Levein is the alien and Batman defo exists?[emoji106]

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[Just Jimmy]

One of our graduates told me today that the next 'Bond', after Daniel Craig's final film, is to be a black female. I just happened to have a copy of a James Bond paperback from 1965 at my desk (as you do) which suggests this is impossible, so I think that'll be the end of the franchise.which is what I was reading to spark my post if I'm being honest. it's ridiculous.

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[calumhibee1]

film characters or book characters made into a film should be played by actors who are as close to their original discripton as possible.

For example. JAMES Bond should never be played by a woman as he is a man and should remain as such. certain parts of a character should never be tweaked and this is one.

there are obviously other characters, such as doctor who, which lends itself more to flexibility and can be tweaked in this way.

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This 100%.

[Bangkok Hibby]

It'll certainly flop. To most people it just reeks of politicial manipulation. Why change a winning working formula, just for the purpose of appearing politically correct?

it'll flop certainly and it won't be the actress fault. Political correctness taken to utterly nonsensical levels.

[Bangkok Hibby]

Bojo and The Donald often just say what loads of people are thinking

[yonder1875]

Fry up breakfasts aren’t nice.

[Jones28]

Bojo and The Donald often just say what loads of people are thinking

They are, it scares the **** out of me.

[JeMeSouviens]

One of our graduates told me today that the next 'Bond', after Daniel Craig's final film, is to be a black female. I just happened to have a copy of a James Bond paperback from 1965 at my desk (as you do) which suggests this is impossible, so I think that'll be the end of the franchise.

Not quite. It’s happening in Craig’s final film. Bond will be phased out and the new agent 007 is a black female.

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

Not quite. It’s happening in Craig’s final film. Bond will be phased out and the new agent 007 is a black female.

What makes it worse is she's going to be portrayed as an Essex Girl, Basildon Bond! 😯

[heretoday]

MPs should have backed May's Brexit deal. It could always have been tweaked in years to come.

[James310]

MPs should have backed May's Brexit deal. It could always have been tweaked in years to come.

Too right, would have stopped all the nonsense we have now.

[Northernhibee]

The SNP are the worst advert for Scottish independence.

[21.05.2016]

Love Island is the biggest load of utter garbage. The people on it are cringeworthy attention seekers who absolutely love themselves.


Tea and Coffee are unbelievably overrated as are Sunday roasts


That Limmy guy is the most embarrassingly unfunny guy going

[Fife-Hibee]

That Limmy guy is the most embarrassingly unfunny guy going

Constantly knocks grandad British culture. Hilarious imo.

[21.05.2016]

Anthony Stokes is a class A ****er of the highest order and vastly over romanticized by the hibs support.


Yes, I'm grateful for his cup final goals, they gave me the greatest day of my life but the guy as a person is a total walloper and Lennon was 100% correct to punt him. Turning up late to training, fighting with the manager, not to mention causing constant bother when hes goes out and has a drink etc - just an immature arse who thinks he's bigger and better than everyone else.

As for the player. Great first time around but when we brought him back on loan Jan 2016, up until the SC final he was in general pretty poor. The cup final goals make a lot of people forget that and if it hadn't been for those final goals I bet hardly any hibs fans would have wanted us to sign him that summer. The cup final heroics gave so many people rose tinted glasses when it came to Stokes and probably fuelled Stokes idea that because he was a hero he now had a free pass to do whatever the hell he wanted.

Shame because he is a hero for his goals but he left under a cloud because of the way he decided to behave.

[Future17]

Tea and Coffee are unbelievably overrated...

This made me laugh out loud. I'm not the biggest fan of tea and coffee, but I'm not sure you can say they're "overrated" - surely you just like them or you don't?

[CloudSquall]

Apart from the influx of attractive women, opening the borders to Eastern Europe when we did had a negative impact on poorer sections of society due to the downward wage pressure.

[CloudSquall]

We would be in a far better position regarding Brexit if we had had Donald Trump leading negotiations.

[heretoday]

Love Island is the biggest load of utter garbage. The people on it are cringeworthy attention seekers who absolutely love themselves.


Tea and Coffee are unbelievably overrated as are Sunday roasts


That Limmy guy is the most embarrassingly unfunny guy going

I'm very bored with tea and coffee. They very seldom hit the spot. That redbush tea is quite good as a change.

[Northernhibee]

Ben & Jerry’s ice cream is *****.

[The Pointer]

Apart from the influx of attractive women, opening the borders to Eastern Europe when we did had a negative impact on poorer sections of society due to the downward wage pressure.

When they were thinking about re-introducing beavers to Knapdale a few years ago I was discussing it with a mate. His comment was, "Jeez, we've got enough European beaver in Tarbert."

[Northernhibee]

Apart from the influx of attractive women, opening the borders to Eastern Europe when we did had a negative impact on poorer sections of society due to the downward wage pressure.

Statistics say otherwise.

[Fife-Hibee]

The general public are idiots and prove it by getting all emotionally triggered when it's pointed out that they are.

[Lester B]

The general public are idiots and prove it by getting all emotionally triggered when it's pointed out that they are.

:taxi

[Hibrandenburg]

The general public are idiots and prove it by getting all emotionally triggered when it's pointed out that they are.

See post 6897 on the pet peeves thread.

[Lester B]

See post 6897 on the pet peeves thread.

Yes, a most fascinating read. Worth looking at. Definitely.

[Hibrandenburg]

Yes, a most fascinating read. Worth looking at. Definitely.

:wink:

[HappyAsHellas]

Safari parks are boring - watching some lions lying about and then wander over to where their food has been dropped is just wrong. The cat and dog home have to put down lots of animals every year. How much more entertaining would it be to see the lions chase and run down an utterly terrified mongrel. Instant winner with the paying public, the lions are fitter - win win all round.

[HappyAsHellas]

Obesity is an unnecessary waste on NHS resources. All fast food outlets should be installed with BMI/weight detectors and if you're fat a trapdoor opens and you fall down a chute to a series of bicycles with their back wheels rigged up to the national grid. After supplying a pre determined amount of electricity you're allowed out to get your burger.

[Smartie]

Obesity is an unnecessary waste on NHS resources. All fast food outlets should be installed with BMI/weight detectors and if you're fat a trapdoor opens and you fall down a chute to a series of bicycles with their back wheels rigged up to the national grid. After supplying a pre determined amount of electricity you're allowed out to get your burger.

A slightly disappointing conclusion, as I thought it was going to involve outrunning lions.

[HappyAsHellas]

All modern TV's are to be fitted with a small amount of explosives which detonate when you change channel to love island, big brother etc. (Only for the unemployed obviously)
Future TV's will be able to be upgraded on a personal level to include Tory political party broadcasts etc.

[Just Jimmy]

very few managers or senior decision makers in an organisation ever consider anything except what makes their life easier, first.

that includes the aims or the business or organisation or staff welfare.

most couldn't give a **** about those things as along as it doesn't impact them.

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[RyeSloan]

very few managers or senior decision makers in an organisation ever consider anything except what makes their life easier, first.

that includes the aims or the business or organisation or staff welfare.

most couldn't give a **** about those things as along as it doesn't impact them.

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Christ...can I work in one of those organisations please!

My experience of execs are to make things as difficult and as complicated as possible...

[Just Jimmy]

Christ...can I work in one of those organisations please!

My experience of execs are to make things as difficult and as complicated as possible...but their life or the impact for them will be better for it. yours is inconvenienced which is the point.

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[heretoday]

There are too many female voices in the football media. Is there a quota that has to be filled or something?
They try and sound laddish but it's not convincing. Enough already!

[Fife-Hibee]

There are too many female voices in the football media. Is there a quota that has to be filled or something?
They try and sound laddish but it's not convincing. Enough already!

If there's considerably less than 50%, how can there be too many?

I agree about the laddish thing though. Just speak normally.