European Parliamentary Elections May 23rd 2019

[MagicSwirlingShip]

Have seen big billboards all over town for the upcoming Elections on May 23rd

I've never voted in the European Elections before, and haven't had anything through the post or seen any materials around the city.

Does anyone have any links as to where I can find out info around the candidates, their manifesto's etc?

Ta in advance!

[lord bunberry]

Have seen big billboards all over town for the upcoming Elections on May 23rd

I've never voted in the European Elections before, and haven't had anything through the post or seen any materials around the city.

Does anyone have any links as to where I can find out info around the candidates, their manifesto's etc?

Ta in advance!
You’ll be lucky to find a proper manifesto. The brexit party who are currently in the lead in the polls are going to publish theirs after the election. The tories don’t want to fight the elections so they’re not bothering with a manifesto. Labour have published one, but they might as well haven’t as it tells us nothing as they don’t know what stance to take. Then you have the other remain parties who mostly can’t even agree who’s in charge and who’s going to be stepping down after said election and we have the SNP who have been reported to the electoral commission for a dodgy flyer. Take your pick.

[pollution]

Have seen big billboards all over town for the upcoming Elections on May 23rd

I've never voted in the European Elections before, and haven't had anything through the post or seen any materials around the city.

Does anyone have any links as to where I can find out info around the candidates, their manifesto's etc?

Ta in advance!


Don't waste your time. We are leaving anyway, so why bother?

[Scouse Hibee]

Have seen big billboards all over town for the upcoming Elections on May 23rd

I've never voted in the European Elections before, and haven't had anything through the post or seen any materials around the city.

Does anyone have any links as to where I can find out info around the candidates, their manifesto's etc?

Ta in advance!

My postal ballot paper arrived on Thursday.

[Smartie]

Don't waste your time. We are leaving anyway, so why bother?

That's where I am.

What point could possibly be made with a vote here?

The only point I could see in it would be that my vote will most certainly NOT be for the Brexit party, and if I don't vote then it will make their vote proportionally higher, and I don't want anyone to read much into a high vote for them.

[Pretty Boy]

I'll be voting Green or SNP for no other reason than to register a vote for someone other than one of the leave trio of Tory, Brexit and Labour.

[bingo70]

I'll be voting Green or SNP for no other reason than to register a vote for someone other than one of the leave trio of Tory, Brexit and Labour.

That’s where I’m at.

Not really any interest in this election but always vote for SNP, don’t agree with all their policies so wondering if this could be good opportunity to put a vote the Greens way, they’re the only two credible parties in Scotland just now IMO.

[wpj]

One of the remain parties, not sure who yet though

[lord bunberry]

I'll be voting Green or SNP for no other reason than to register a vote for someone other than one of the leave trio of Tory, Brexit and Labour.


That’s where I’m at.

Not really any interest in this election but always vote for SNP, don’t agree with all their policies so wondering if this could be good opportunity to put a vote the Greens way, they’re the only two credible parties in Scotland just now IMO.
On this occasion I think it would be better to side with the SNP if you believe in independence. A referendum is likely to be called before we have another election and a reduction in the SNP vote would be used by the unionist parties as a sign that independence isn’t what people want. Obviously I know the Greens are pro independence, but a split in the vote could allow a unionist remain party in.
This is the only occasion I would advise against voting for the greens.

[marinello59]

On this occasion I think it would be better to side with the SNP if you believe in independence. A referendum is likely to be called before we have another election and a reduction in the SNP vote would be used by the unionist parties as a sign that independence isn’t what people want. Obviously I know the Greens are pro independence, but a split in the vote could allow a unionist remain party in.
This is the only occasion I would advise against voting for the greens.

The Greens are solidly pro Indy, clearly remain and in with a chance of getting an MEP elected this time. They’ll probably get my vote this time.

[Moulin Yarns]

On this occasion I think it would be better to side with the SNP if you believe in independence. A referendum is likely to be called before we have another election and a reduction in the SNP vote would be used by the unionist parties as a sign that independence isn’t what people want. Obviously I know the Greens are pro independence, but a split in the vote could allow a unionist remain party in.
This is the only occasion I would advise against voting for the greens.

Be aware of how the EU election works, top party gets a seat, then their vote is halved for the next stage, next highest vote gets a seat, and their vote is halved. and so on until all six seats are allocated

predictions I have seen are SNP 3 seats, Green 1 seat and the other 2 are between Brexit and Tory

[Hibrandenburg]

We don't vote until the 26th. I'm seriously considering voting for the German Tories for the first and probably last time in my life. Mainly because I'd like to make a statement of support for Merkel's actions during the refugee crisis and as a counterbalance against the AfD. I'd normally vote Green over here and will do in the next general election.

[lord bunberry]

The Greens are solidly pro Indy, clearly remain and in with a chance of getting an MEP elected this time. They’ll probably get my vote this time.
Yes I’m well aware of that, but this election is largely irrelevant as those elected will either never take up their seat or only take up their seat for a short period. Therefore this vote is only really valid for sending a message to Westminster. I wouldn’t normally advise against voting for the greens, but in this instance I feel it’s vital not to split the independence vote. My worry is that a split in the vote might allow a brexit party candidate in. We don’t want another situation where Scotland returns an idiot to Europe like David Cockburn.

[lord bunberry]

Be aware of how the EU election works, top party gets a seat, then their vote is halved for the next stage, next highest vote gets a seat, and their vote is halved. and so on until all six seats are allocated

predictions I have seen are SNP 3 seats, Green 1 seat and the other 2 are between Brexit and Tory
I completely understand you and I respect what you stand for, but in this election more than any other I feel that it’s vital that we all speak with one voice. I believe it’s possible for the SNP to win all 6 seats. Normally I’d say that’s bad for democracy, but in this occasion it’s the forerunner to independence. Europe will get the message and if we’re denied a section 30 but we hold a referendum anyway, The EU are far more likely to recognise our result if it goes our way. We need to keep our eyes on the prize.

[Mibbes Aye]

I completely understand you and I respect what you stand for, but in this election more than any other I feel that it’s vital that we all speak with one voice. I believe it’s possible for the SNP to win all 6 seats. Normally I’d say that’s bad for democracy, but in this occasion it’s the forerunner to independence. Europe will get the message and if we’re denied a section 30 but we hold a referendum anyway, The EU are far more likely to recognise our result if it goes our way. We need to keep our eyes on the prize.

Remember that the majority of Scots voted not to leave the union. The sovereign will of the Scottish people and all that. The people spoke, it’s just a shame that the malcontents who wanted independence struggle to accept the democratic expression of the Scottish electorate. Using European results as a proxy wedge is lame. We said ‘no’ by a convincing majority.

As far as this thread goes, I’m on holiday, been in Denmark the last couple of days and Copenhagen is absolutely littered with posters for the election. In Prague now but in Denmark it really felt like a big deal. It’s curious because they have a somewhat ambivalent relationship with the EU and were, along with the UK, the only nation to secure a legal opt-out from the Euro. Nevertheless the European elections seemed to count for a lot there. Not sure what the status is in the Czech Republic but not seen any political advertising. The telling point for me is that MEPs are seen and treated differently across the nations and on the continent they probably have more affirmation and respect than they do in the U.K.

[lord bunberry]

Remember that the majority of Scots voted not to leave the union. The sovereign will of the Scottish people and all that. The people spoke, it’s just a shame that the malcontents who wanted independence struggle to accept the democratic expression of the Scottish electorate. Using European results as a proxy wedge is lame. We said ‘no’ by a convincing majority.

As far as this thread goes, I’m on holiday, been in Denmark the last couple of days and Copenhagen is absolutely littered with posters for the election. In Prague now but in Denmark it really felt like a big deal. It’s curious because they have a somewhat ambivalent relationship with the EU and were, along with the UK, the only nation to secure a legal opt-out from the Euro. Nevertheless the European elections seemed to count for a lot there. Not sure what the status is in the Czech Republic but not seen any political advertising. The telling point for me is that MEPs are seen and treated differently across the nations and on the continent they probably have more affirmation and respect than they do in the U.K.
I’m not disagreeing with the general point you make. I’m sure you realised that my last post wasn’t aimed at you.
Where I struggle on forums like this is when clearly educated people like yourself make comments like ‘the people spoke’ I have absolutely no doubt in my mind that you are more than aware that the circumstances have changed enough to at the very least respect the fact that people like me will want to ask the question again. Peace

[Mibbes Aye]

I’m not disagreeing with the general point you make. I’m sure you realised that my last post wasn’t aimed at you.
Where I struggle on forums like this is when clearly educated people like yourself make comments like ‘the people spoke’ I have absolutely no doubt in my mind that you are more than aware that the circumstances have changed enough to at the very least respect the fact that people like me will want to ask the question again. Peace

Good and reasoned post, cheers LB. It’s difficult because everything with the Indy Ref and with Brexit feels so polarised.

I think you make a good point in that both sides can and do make claim to ‘the people’ and their voice.

I suppose my concern is that do we keep having votes until the sizeable rump who want independence get their own way by pissing off those who don’t into not voting? Did we not get told this was once in a generation?

As for the circumstances changing, yes, you are absolutely right. At the time of the Indy Ref there was an economic case made by the separatists based on oil prices that turned out to be absolute bollocks. Notwithstanding the UN Declaration that we needed to move away from fossil fuels by 2020 to ensure the survival of the planet. Oil-rich Scotland, yay! Killing the planet, not so yay! It wasn’t you but I recall some Nat posters on here saying in an attempt at irony that Scotland must be cursed to have oil as a resource. Maybe, just maybe they might understand it now - oil and oil extraction and oil usage kills the planet and it is no blessing to have oil as a resource. It is morally indefensible.

[lord bunberry]

Good and reasoned post, cheers LB. It’s difficult because everything with the Indy Ref and with Brexit feels so polarised.

I think you make a good point in that both sides can and do make claim to ‘the people’ and their voice.

I suppose my concern is that do we keep having votes until the sizeable rump who want independence get their own way by pissing off those who don’t into not voting? Did we not get told this was once in a generation?

As for the circumstances changing, yes, you are absolutely right. At the time of the Indy Ref there was an economic case made by the separatists based on oil prices that turned out to be absolute bollocks. Notwithstanding the UN Declaration that we needed to move away from fossil fuels by 2020 to ensure the survival of the planet. Oil-rich Scotland, yay! Killing the planet, not so yay! It wasn’t you but I recall some Nat posters on here saying in an attempt at irony that Scotland must be cursed to have oil as a resource. Maybe, just maybe they might understand it now - oil and oil extraction and oil usage kills the planet and it is no blessing to have oil as a resource. It is morally indefensible.
I agree with most of what you say. Scotland’s problem is that we have oil, but we haven’t been able to take advantage of having oil. Most of the major oil producing nations have been able to use the proceeds of oil production to diverse into other industries. If you go to Dubai the major income is not from oil anymore. They have used the money they made from oil attract big business and that has attracted wealth to the region. In Scotland we are in a position to join these countries in innovation and use our natural resources to our advantage.



edit are you going on Tuesday to the grange?

[Mibbes Aye]

I agree with most of what you say. Scotland’s problem is that we have oil, but we haven’t been able to take advantage of having oil. Most of the major oil producing nations have been able to use the proceeds of oil production to diverse into other industries. If you go to Dubai the major income is not from oil anymore. They have used the money they made from oil attract big business and that has attracted wealth to the region. In Scotland we are in a position to join these countries in innovation and use our natural resources to our advantage.



edit are you going on Tuesday to the grange?

I’m not in the country, in Prague on Tuesday!

Going to a couple of the CWC games in Durham and a couple of days at the Ashes. Are you at any of those?

I wholeheartedly agree with your point about realising the gains. I think the U.K. went for short-term gains from the oil money, essentially selling off the rights to the oil fields along with future profits. It paid for the massive unemployment bills in the early to mid eighties. There is a deeper, and hopefully non-partisan conversation about how the U.K. fixed itself from the position it was in, in the late seventies. It maybe didn’t need Thatx

[Mibbes Aye]

I’m not in the country, in Prague on Tuesday!

Going to a couple of the CWC games in Durham and a couple of days at the Ashes. Are you at any of those?

I wholeheartedly agree with your point about realising the gains. I think the U.K. went for short-term gains from the oil money, essentially selling off the rights to the oil fields along with future profits. It paid for the massive unemployment bills in the early to mid eighties. There is a deeper, and hopefully non-partisan conversation about how the U.K. fixed itself from the position it was in, in the late seventies. It maybe didn’t need Thatx
Connection playing up...

It maybe didn’t need Thatcherism or neo-liberalism but left-centrist politics was outflanked by monetarist ideology and more classically socialist “command and control “ economics was stereotyped as not just weak but dangerously flawed

[James310]

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/may/15/majority-of-europeans-expect-end-of-eu-within-20-years

Majority of Europeans expect the EU to end within next 20 years.

[The Modfather]

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/may/15/majority-of-europeans-expect-end-of-eu-within-20-years

Majority of Europeans expect the EU to end within next 20 years.

Makes it all the better that the Tories are dragging us out with a no deal Brexit in that context 😒

[lord bunberry]

I’m not in the country, in Prague on Tuesday!

Going to a couple of the CWC games in Durham and a couple of days at the Ashes. Are you at any of those?

I wholeheartedly agree with your point about realising the gains. I think the U.K. went for short-term gains from the oil money, essentially selling off the rights to the oil fields along with future profits. It paid for the massive unemployment bills in the early to mid eighties. There is a deeper, and hopefully non-partisan conversation about how the U.K. fixed itself from the position it was in, in the late seventies. It maybe didn’t need Thatx
Sadly I’m not going to make it to any games in the World Cup or the ashes this year.

[Mibbes Aye]

Sadly I’m not going to make it to any games in the World Cup or the ashes this year.

Ach well, if we are both around for the Grange next summer I will maybe catch you then.

Hopefully you will get to see or listen to the cricket this summer regardless. I’m going to a couple of CWC ODIs, will see SAF and the Windies so hopefully get a bit of positive cricket.

Re the Ashes, got four days at Old Trafford and a day’s hospitality at Edgebaston, looking forward to it and will try and post updates inbetween the beers :greengrin

[JeMeSouviens]

Good and reasoned post, cheers LB. It’s difficult because everything with the Indy Ref and with Brexit feels so polarised.

I think you make a good point in that both sides can and do make claim to ‘the people’ and their voice.

I suppose my concern is that do we keep having votes until the sizeable rump who want independence get their own way by pissing off those who don’t into not voting? Did we not get told this was once in a generation?

As for the circumstances changing, yes, you are absolutely right. At the time of the Indy Ref there was an economic case made by the separatists based on oil prices that turned out to be absolute bollocks. Notwithstanding the UN Declaration that we needed to move away from fossil fuels by 2020 to ensure the survival of the planet. Oil-rich Scotland, yay! Killing the planet, not so yay! It wasn’t you but I recall some Nat posters on here saying in an attempt at irony that Scotland must be cursed to have oil as a resource. Maybe, just maybe they might understand it now - oil and oil extraction and oil usage kills the planet and it is no blessing to have oil as a resource. It is morally indefensible.

If you want to keep any oil "in the ground" under the north sea then independence is your only, albeit somewhat faint, hope.

Stay in the UK and every last drop is coming up, you can bet your last petrodollar on that.

[JeMeSouviens]

That's where I am.

What point could possibly be made with a vote here?

The only point I could see in it would be that my vote will most certainly NOT be for the Brexit party, and if I don't vote then it will make their vote proportionally higher, and I don't want anyone to read much into a high vote for them.

Your lack of vote will also be counted.

The main thing that's going to be measured in this election is public sentiment towards no deal, measured in votes for Farage, and public sentiment towards stopping Brexit, measured in votes for Lib+Green+SNP. The relative totals between these camps will be the narrative on Friday and will set the political weather for the summer.

If you want to push the Tories towards No deal - vote Fascist (or don't vote because there is surely a motivated band of zealots going to vote for him).

If you want to push Labour towards 2nd ref/Remain - vote for a Remain party.

[Moulin Yarns]

Your lack of vote will also be counted.

The main thing that's going to be measured in this election is public sentiment towards no deal, measured in votes for Farage, and public sentiment towards stopping Brexit, measured in votes for Lib+Green+SNP. The relative totals between these camps will be the narrative on Friday and will set the political weather for the summer.

If you want to push the Tories towards No deal - vote Fascist (or don't vote because there is surely a motivated band of zealots going to vote for him).

If you want to push Labour towards 2nd ref/Remain - vote for a Remain party.

The result of the election won't be known until after 10pm on Sunday.

[JeMeSouviens]

The result of the election won't be known until after 10pm on Sunday.

I didn't get where I am today by knowing wtf I'm talking about! :wink::greengrin

[Mibbes Aye]

I didn't get where I am today by knowing wtf I'm talking about! :wink::greengrin

:greengrin

[JeMeSouviens]

To all (but especially Remainers :wink:)- please do get out and vote tomorrow.

Farage's brexo-fascists on course to win 1 and possibly 2 of Scotland's 6 seats. :bitchy:

[wpj]

Had loads of stuff through the door (Cambridge) but the Brexit party one was addressed to me not just delivered by party activists. If they are doing that for everyone registered to vote it will be costing a fortune.

[Sylar]

Voted, but that was a grudged "X" this morning.

As an anti-Brexit, anti-Indy voter who vowed never to vote Lib Dem again after they ****ed over generations of students and supported the bedroom tax, placing an X was a near-impossible task.

[Pretty Boy]

Greens for me today. Latest polling suggest there is a chance of them taking a seat in Scotland as well.

The next 2 points may be somewhat contradictory but....... I wanted to show support for both remain and independence. However I also believe that half a decade of constitutional obsession in both Scotland and the UK as a whole has seen 2 issues dominate the political landscape at the expense of other pressing matters. Of those other matters the potential impact of climate change on both our lives and that of our children means it needs dealt with now. A strong Green support in Scotland, and the UK, keeps the discussion going where it matters.

[Bangkok Hibby]

Greens for me today. Latest polling suggest there is a chance of them taking a seat in Scotland as well.

The next 2 points may be somewhat contradictory but....... I wanted to show support for both remain and independence. However I also believe that half a decade of constitutional obsession in both Scotland and the UK as a whole has seen 2 issues dominate the political landscape at the expense of other pressing matters. Of those other matters the potential impact of climate change on both our lives and that of our children means it needs dealt with now. A strong Green support in Scotland, and the UK, keeps the discussion going where it matters.

Good post, if I was here I'd be voting SNP at every election until we had an independent Scotland and Greens thereafter.

[JeMeSouviens]

Voted, but that was a grudged "X" this morning.

As an anti-Brexit, anti-Indy voter who vowed never to vote Lib Dem again after they ****ed over generations of students and supported the bedroom tax, placing an X was a near-impossible task.

You could've *been* Scotland's CUK voter! Found their niche at last. :greengrin

[Sylar]

You could've *been* Scotland's CUK voter! Found their niche at last. :greengrin

Couldn't bring myself to do that either - like Pretty Boy, I went Green (I'm aware they support the SNP in their Independence march, but given my area of expertise, I support a lot of their "green" policies).

[JeMeSouviens]

Couldn't bring myself to do that either - like Pretty Boy, I went Green (I'm aware they support the SNP in their Independence march, but given my area of expertise, I support a lot of their "green" policies).

Genuinely interested - how do you reconcile that with regular journeys to SFO? Green is the closest party to me policy-wise but I love travel and find it hard to reconcile my own hypocrisy enough to vote for them.

[Sylar]

Genuinely interested - how do you reconcile that with regular journeys to SFO? Green is the closest party to me policy-wise but I love travel and find it hard to reconcile my own hypocrisy enough to vote for them.

An interesting question!

I offset a lot of travel here in the UK (attending seminars, committee meetings etc remotely, rather than attending in person), which helps a little. Rather than travelling over to California two or three times a year (which was how I started), I insisted last year that I start splitting my time thus that I can do one prolonged period out there. It's still not ideal, but the work I do with Stanford has real impacts in environmental areas for millions of people and I feel the trade-off of being there to be worth it.

Having a toddler has significantly reduced my "pleasure" travel, and I've switched to greener forms of personal travel.

[JeMeSouviens]

An interesting question!

I offset a lot of travel here in the UK (attending seminars, committee meetings etc remotely, rather than attending in person), which helps a little. Rather than travelling over to California two or three times a year (which was how I started), I insisted last year that I start splitting my time thus that I can do one prolonged period out there. It's still not ideal, but the work I do with Stanford has real impacts in environmental areas for millions of people and I feel the trade-off of being there to be worth it.

Having a toddler has significantly reduced my "pleasure" travel, and I've switched to greener forms of personal travel.

Interesting, thanks. Direct environmental benefits coming from the work you do when you're over there makes a big difference to the equation.

The tech for remote meetings has come on a lot. We have a telepresence system in the office here with direct connections to our locations in Reading and a couple of places in the Bay area. It's brilliant. By contrast our regular web/phone hosted meeting system I use if I'm at home is pretty dire. The thing you don't get with remote interactions is the personal, post-work social stuff that really helps if you're working long term with someone. But a small price to pay I guess.

Personal travel-wise I'm forever pricing up train journeys but by the time you try and co-ordinate via London or ferries or whatever it ends up just taking too long and/or being way too expensive. easyjet is like crack for travel :shocked: