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RIP
28-02-2019, 12:54 PM
Watch him throw out his right arm and mock stumble as he runs in front of Slivka.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/av/football/47397081

Brightside
28-02-2019, 01:04 PM
Exact same as Flo for the Pen. All players do it.

Hermit Crab
28-02-2019, 01:05 PM
Watch him throw out his right arm and mock stumble as he runs in front of Slivka.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/av/football/47397081


Eh did you see how bad Slivkas dive was for his first booking? Shocking.

Smartie
28-02-2019, 01:09 PM
Yep.

On a night when we had a player of our own booked for a shocking dive and got back into the game via a soft penalty I think we should be careful pointing the finger elsewhere.

theonlywayisup
28-02-2019, 01:10 PM
Yep.

On a night when we had a player of our own booked for a shocking dive and got back into the game via a soft penalty I think we should be careful pointing the finger elsewhere.

:agree:

Ringothedog
28-02-2019, 01:15 PM
Yep.

On a night when we had a player of our own booked for a shocking dive and got back into the game via a soft penalty I think we should be careful pointing the finger elsewhere.

There is no such thing as a soft penalty, it either is or isn’t. I agree that Slivkas dive was a disgrace as was Tony Watts

matty_f
28-02-2019, 01:18 PM
Remember everyone, don't discuss anything about the game unless you can be objective to the point of being absurd, do not criticise anyone unless you also criticise a Hibs player (or players) for something similar and remember that it absolutely not on to be partisan about anything.


Whoever it was that posted on another thread that they wouldn't celebrate scoring a goal becuase we wouldn't like it if we conceded a goal gets my nod for the best made point of the year.

Watt cheated, without even considering Slivka or Kamberi, I can happily call him out for it.

Smartie
28-02-2019, 01:21 PM
There is no such thing as a soft penalty, it either is or isn’t. I agree that Slivkas dive was a disgrace as was Tony Watts

I like your black and white thinking but disagree.

I saw the penalty decision from a few angles, a few times and struggled to see much contact. I'm not saying there wasn't any but in my opinion minimal fouling from defenders + theatrical fall from Flo = soft penalty.

About bloody time too, I'm sick of us not making the most of these situations.

Am I therefore going to criticise a Saints player for taking the opportunity to get one of our players sent off? No.

Pretty Boy
28-02-2019, 01:23 PM
Remember everyone, don't discuss anything about the game unless you can be objective to the point of being absurd, do not criticise anyone unless you also criticise a Hibs player (or players) for something similar and remember that it absolutely not on to be partisan about anything.


Whoever it was that posted on another thread that they wouldn't celebrate scoring a goal becuase we wouldn't like it if we conceded a goal gets my nod for the best made point of the year.

Watt cheated, without even considering Slivka or Kamberi, I can happily call him out for it.

:agree:

It's the same logic as folk who say you shouldn't blame a referee for losing a game if he makes a bad decision that influences the outcome because 'we were crap anyway and didn't deserve anything'.

Footballs tribal and it's emotive. For some reason people seem to forget that when there's moaning about us losing and they forget it when there's a bit enthusiasm and a siege mentality when we are winning.

Biggie
28-02-2019, 01:26 PM
aye , don't give me players would never "try to get a fellow professional sent off/booked etc"...its professional football, massive bonuses to be won/lost....players will try to take as many advantages as they can.

Same at any level, amateur, junior, senior level, its all about winning and some don't care how they go about it.

We've been on the end of some seriously dodgy decisions, but Slivka last night showed we're no angels.

jonty
28-02-2019, 01:27 PM
At least Slivka had something to avoid, in Davidsons raised foot.
Watt felt a tap on his shoulder and he went down like someone had gone through him.

danhibees1875
28-02-2019, 01:28 PM
Don't see it myself.

Looks like Slivka has tried his best to get back goal side realising a counter was on, in his haist and at full speed he's then collided with Watt who has ran inside. Watt has put himself between the man and ball and takes the contact - McGinn used to get applauded for it weekly.


I should add that I don't think Slivka should have been booked for diving initially though. Davidson has came at him with his boot high and reckless, Slivka should of course move his legs out of the way of contact - going down was the best way to achieve that. His arms been thrown up at the same time weren't necessary though. :greengrin:

Smartie
28-02-2019, 01:33 PM
You can be emotional and tribal without being hypocritical and you've often got to look at wider context.

If Watt's actions were the only dubious ones in a fairly uncontroversial game then fair enough, call him out on it.

I had the pleasure of living in Dundee when the Matty Jack incident happened and at that time probably knew more fans of Utd than any other club. The context of Matty Jack's actions were at that time Hibs were very good, United were guff. United had spend 90 minutes employing every dark art of football imaginable, so when Matty decided to win the game his way I was ecstatic.

United fans have always been hypocritical moaning bassas about that whole affair and their bitter, salty tears taste as good today as they ever did.

I'm not going to go down their route of turning a blind eye to my own team's misdeeds in attempting to win a game in order to make some sort of half-arsed point about a non-injustice.

CMurdoch
28-02-2019, 01:37 PM
Watch him throw out his right arm and mock stumble as he runs in front of Slivka.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/av/football/47397081

IMO Slivka received the 2nd yellow for consistent fouling.
Should have been replaced after his foul on Kane not long after his 1st booking.
That foul must have been a baw hair off a booking.
The slight foul on Watt just tipped the scales.

Watt didn't cheat. He cut on front of Slivka to stop him from being able to get the ball and went over when he felt the touch. Happens in every game.

FWIW the only controversial moment of the match, the penalty, fell our way massively.
The incident happened right in front of me and i didn't think it was a penalty.
Watched the match on ALBA when i got home and saw that Craig knocked into Slivka with his hip. Still didn't think it was a penalty but was delighted to get it.

matty_f
28-02-2019, 01:39 PM
You can be emotional and tribal without being hypocritical and you've often got to look at wider context.

If Watt's actions were the only dubious ones in a fairly uncontroversial game then fair enough, call him out on it.

I had the pleasure of living in Dundee when the Matty Jack incident happened and at that time probably knew more fans of Utd than any other club. The context of Matty Jack's actions were at that time Hibs were very good, United were guff. United had spend 90 minutes employing every dark art of football imaginable, so when Matty decided to win the game his way I was ecstatic.

United fans have always been hypocritical moaning bassas about that whole affair and their bitter, salty tears taste as good today as they ever did.

I'm not going to go down their route of turning a blind eye to my own team's misdeeds in attempting to win a game in order to make some sort of half-arsed point about a non-injustice.

You can be emotional etc without being hypocritical but this thread is about Tony Watt's actions, not about Slivka's.

If I wanted to rush to condemn Slivka I can start a different discussion about it. I don't need to caveat my criticism of Watt with a note about Slivka.

Bangkok Hibby
28-02-2019, 01:44 PM
The game has changed drastically over the years. Regardless of your views about muddy pitches, heavy balls, less skillful/more skillful players, the blatant cheating nowadays, pretty much accepted and even encouraged by some managers and pundits has ruined it for me. We still screamed abuse at an opponent when he sent our centre forward three feet in the air but the difference then was our player got up and carried on, more interested in trying to score than get an opponent sent off.

Hibbyradge
28-02-2019, 01:51 PM
You can be emotional etc without being hypocritical but this thread is about Tony Watt's actions, not about Slivka's.

If I wanted to rush to condemn Slivka I can start a different discussion about it. I don't need to caveat my criticism of Watt with a note about Slivka.

I agree.

And defending Kamberi abd Slivka's dives by saying Tony Watt did the same, is equally as whataboutery.

Alan62
28-02-2019, 01:54 PM
Yep.

On a night when we had a player of our own booked for a shocking dive and got back into the game via a soft penalty I think we should be careful pointing the finger elsewhere.

Don't think it was a 'soft' penalty. Liam Craig clearly barges Kamberi. Needless foul but a foul all the same and a foul in the box is a penalty.

Hibs1969
28-02-2019, 02:12 PM
I’ve only seen the incident once but to me Watt did what every other player does in that situation. He got himself in front of the defending player, waited for contact and went down. It happens countless times in every game and is so routine and accepted that it can’t count as cheating nowadays. It was never a yellow card though, let alone a second yellow.

Tynie01011973
28-02-2019, 02:18 PM
Don't think it was a 'soft' penalty. Liam Craig clearly barges Kamberi. Needless foul but a foul all the same and a foul in the box is a penalty.

Agree, Shaughnessy clearly pushes Flo into Liam Craigs challenge from the side

Keith_M
28-02-2019, 02:19 PM
Watt didn't cheat...... He cut on front of Slivka to stop him from being able to get the ball and went over when he felt the touch. Happens in every game.



The parts in bold surely contradict each other.

Throwing yourself to the ground simply because somebody has touched you IS cheating.

In the last home game against Aberdeen, their left-back did this as soon as Mallan went anywhere near him, and got a foul every time. The fact that lots of players cheat this way doesn't stop it being cheating.

bigwheel
28-02-2019, 02:31 PM
Hecky called it wrong with Slivka. He Was very lucky not to get a second yellow earlier. Should have been replaced then ....was not good call and would be a big topic on here had we gone on to lose...

Carheenlea
28-02-2019, 02:33 PM
Eh did you see how bad Slivkas dive was for his first booking? Shocking.

Didn’t enjoy seeing that again.

Smartie
28-02-2019, 02:40 PM
I’ve only seen the incident once but to me Watt did what every other player does in that situation. He got himself in front of the defending player, waited for contact and went down. It happens countless times in every game and is so routine and accepted that it can’t count as cheating nowadays. It was never a yellow card though, let alone a second yellow.

You can be in the last chance saloon regarding persistent fouling though - the next foul and you're off, even if it in itself it isn't a particularly bad foul. That's where Slivka was, and as a midfielder he was essentially a dead man walking.

Heckingbottom's not got much wrong so far but he should have taken Slivka off. As has been mentioned above, this would be a different conversation if we'd gone on to lose the game.

Smartie
28-02-2019, 02:48 PM
You can be emotional etc without being hypocritical but this thread is about Tony Watt's actions, not about Slivka's.

If I wanted to rush to condemn Slivka I can start a different discussion about it. I don't need to caveat my criticism of Watt with a note about Slivka.

I don't think it is fair to debate Watt's actions, Slivka's, Flo's or anyone else without any sort of context.

It is totally unreasonable and totally hypocritical to get hot under the collar about Watt but to condone (or make no comment on) exactly the same sort of gamesmanship from our own players.



What's it like with the boot on the other foot?

Saints fans and Tommy Wright are having a field day whining about the penalty and some of Slivka's "theatrics". Well you know what? Tough 5hit, it's part of the game. A similar bit of gamesmanship from your own player that reduced us to ten men would have led to a defeat for us if you weren't so pish at playing against ten men, so wind your necks and and get used to the fact that you'll be taking your tractors to games in Hamilton and Paisley this spring.

That's how to be emotional and tribal yet reasonable at the same time.

jacomo
28-02-2019, 02:59 PM
Hecky called it wrong with Slivka. He Was very lucky not to get a second yellow earlier. Should have been replaced then ....was not good call and would be a big topic on here had we gone on to lose...


He says he was about to sub him when he got his second booking.

It was a dumb clumsy challenge and a foul but not sure it warranted a yellow card.

scotiaf
28-02-2019, 03:05 PM
Have to say if your a player you play to advantages to help your team.Its part of the game now, it has been since UK players/teams started having foreign players in the games. After falling foul to it on the European games.

RIP
28-02-2019, 03:49 PM
I was at the game and unlike the referee have had the benefit of watching freeze by freeze slowmo on tv today. What this showed was that Slivka blatantly and embarrassingly dived, Craig shoved Flo with his left arm and Watt threw out his left arm in front of Slivka and applied the brakes.

The first and last were examples of cheating

lapsedhibee
28-02-2019, 03:57 PM
At least Slivka had something to avoid, in Davidsons raised foot.
Watt felt a tap on his shoulder and he went down like someone had gone through him.


I should add that I don't think Slivka should have been booked for diving initially though. Davidson has came at him with his boot high and reckless, Slivka should of course move his legs out of the way of contact - going down was the best way to achieve that. His arms been thrown up at the same time weren't necessary though. :greengrin:

Come on, guys!

hibbyfraelibby
28-02-2019, 04:00 PM
Vicki must be the only player to be sent off for two yellow cards where no physical contact was made in either incident.

Hermit Crab
28-02-2019, 04:15 PM
Didn’t enjoy seeing that again.


Nor did I but apparently you can't mention it on this thread as its about Watt cheating.

SChibs
28-02-2019, 04:15 PM
IMO Slivka received the 2nd yellow for consistent fouling.
Should have been replaced after his foul on Kane not long after his 1st booking.
That foul must have been a baw hair off a booking.
The slight foul on Watt just tipped the scales.

Watt didn't cheat. He cut on front of Slivka to stop him from being able to get the ball and went over when he felt the touch. Happens in every game.

FWIW the only controversial moment of the match, the penalty, fell our way massively.
The incident happened right in front of me and i didn't think it was a penalty.
Watched the match on ALBA when i got home and saw that Craig knocked into Slivka with his hip. Still didn't think it was a penalty but was delighted to get it.

Going down because you 'felt a touch' cheating imo.

NORTHERNHIBBY
28-02-2019, 04:30 PM
Does he drive a forty foot truck in his spare time?

Should we start a campaign for the first initial and the surname to go on the back of his team shirt?

Here’s Lucy!
28-02-2019, 05:17 PM
Watt played for Celtic and Hearts.

Greenbeard
28-02-2019, 05:52 PM
Don't see it myself.

Looks like Slivka has tried his best to get back goal side realising a counter was on, in his haist and at full speed he's then collided with Watt who has ran inside. Watt has put himself between the man and ball and takes the contact - McGinn used to get applauded for it weekly.


I should add that I don't think Slivka should have been booked for diving initially though. Davidson has came at him with his boot high and reckless, Slivka should of course move his legs out of the way of contact - going down was the best way to achieve that. His arms been thrown up at the same time weren't necessary though. :greengrin:
That's a bit desperate Dan. Defending the indefensible. In fact I'll go further and say that the only way to cut atrocious diving like that out of the game (when there is clearly no contact and no off-balance aspect to contribute to the tumble) is to make it a straight red card offence, or equivalent of via citing.

danhibees1875
28-02-2019, 06:02 PM
That's a bit desperate Dan. Defending the indefensible. In fact I'll go further and say that the only way to cut atrocious diving like that out of the game (when there is clearly no contact and no off-balance aspect to contribute to the tumble) is to make it a straight red card offence, or equivalent of via citing.

The way Slivka goes down is poor as he over eggs it (and it probably makes this not the best example), but he shouldn't have to take a lunging kick to the shins and risk injury to win a free kick. He's every right to get himself out of the way of that. Another good way to limit diving is for refs to give free kicks more readily even if the player stays on their feet after being fouled.

Good use of "desperate Dan" though. :wink:

Greenbeard
28-02-2019, 06:09 PM
The way Slivka goes down is poor as he over eggs it (and it probably makes this not the best example), but he shouldn't have to take a lunging kick to the shins and risk injury to win a free kick. He's every right to get himself out of the way of that. Another good way to limit diving is for refs to give free kicks more readily even if the player stays on their feet after being fouled.

Good use of "desperate Dan" though. :wink:
Like a 40-egg omelette - as DD would have as a snack!

xyz23jc
28-02-2019, 06:15 PM
Remember everyone, don't discuss anything about the game unless you can be objective to the point of being absurd, do not criticise anyone unless you also criticise a Hibs player (or players) for something similar and remember that it absolutely not on to be partisan about anything.


Whoever it was that posted on another thread that they wouldn't celebrate scoring a goal becuase we wouldn't like it if we conceded a goal gets my nod for the best made point of the year.

Watt cheated, without even considering Slivka or Kamberi, I can happily call him out for it.


Also keen to wave the imaginary card like most of the Saints players last night, tactic straight from the Dr. Football coaching manual.... Just in case the ref had any doubts! C***s! :confused:

Also love your 'advice'! :agree::thumbsup:

xyz23jc
28-02-2019, 06:17 PM
I like your black and white thinking but disagree.

I saw the penalty decision from a few angles, a few times and struggled to see much contact. I'm not saying there wasn't any but in my opinion minimal fouling from defenders + theatrical fall from Flo = soft penalty.

About bloody time too, I'm sick of us not making the most of these situations.

Am I therefore going to criticise a Saints player for taking the opportunity to get one of our players sent off? No.


They were at it the whole game though, obviously a tactic from the coach, no?

Eyrie
28-02-2019, 08:42 PM
There was more contact for our penalty than there was for Slivka's second booking.

Maybe Wright needs to look at how easily his own players go down before criticising others.

matty_f
28-02-2019, 09:24 PM
I don't think it is fair to debate Watt's actions, Slivka's, Flo's or anyone else without any sort of context.

It is totally unreasonable and totally hypocritical to get hot under the collar about Watt but to condone (or make no comment on) exactly the same sort of gamesmanship from our own players.



What's it like with the boot on the other foot?

Saints fans and Tommy Wright are having a field day whining about the penalty and some of Slivka's "theatrics". Well you know what? Tough 5hit, it's part of the game. A similar bit of gamesmanship from your own player that reduced us to ten men would have led to a defeat for us if you weren't so pish at playing against ten men, so wind your necks and and get used to the fact that you'll be taking your tractors to games in Hamilton and Paisley this spring.

That's how to be emotional and tribal yet reasonable at the same time.

When Tommy Wright was interviewed he made no mention of any of his players nonsense, and he probably has more responsibility to be balanced than you or I do.

It's not hypocritical to get wired into Watt and not mention Slivka. The thread is about Watt, why bring Slivka's dive into it?

I'm not condoning his dive, he got booked for it and rightly so, but I don't have to feel I should reference it when saying Watt cheated.

matty_f
28-02-2019, 09:33 PM
Nor did I but apparently you can't mention it on this thread as its about Watt cheating.

You can, it's just not necessary. :aok: