What was different under New Manager?

[HibsTalk]

LATEST PODCAST

Gav Dave & Craig*discuss

[emoji404]Club Structure & Transfer Policy
[emoji848]Hamilton Game
[emoji2955]Mallan's New Position
[emoji102]Horgan's Best League Game?
[emoji187]Dundee Preview w/ @provieroadpod (Dundee Podcast)

https://itunes.apple.com/gb/podcast/hibs-talk/id1236445811?mt=2&i=1000430219360

https://open.spotify.com/episode/2nQi4ZPxO07PqpavPyzFfY?si=3Vtyugc8T0KVO1qyMeQz2A

http://hibstalk.com/61-what-was-different-under-new-manager
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[04Sauzee]

Incredible to hear Hibs haven't put out the same 11 for 2 consecutive games

[Frazerbob]

Incredible to hear Hibs haven't put out the same 11 for 2 consecutive games

Yip that shocked me. Whilst we’ve obviously had a lot of injuries to deal with, that stat and the fact that the most commonly played formation was only used in 36% of games tells us why we are 8th and have a new manager.

[matty_f]

Yip that shocked me. Whilst we’ve obviously had a lot of injuries to deal with, that stat and the fact that the most commonly played formation was only used in 36% of games tells us why we are 8th and have a new manager.

To be fair to Lennon, and I'm like a stuck record with this point, injuries have been by far and away the biggest factor in our disappointing season.

It might not always have been a key player that was injured, but the amount of wee knocks or games missed here and there meant that we struggled to get a settled eleven on the pitch game to game.

Players improve when they get a run in the team with the same team mates around them and when everyone gets to stay in position. We've not had that luxury this season at all.

I reckon there will be plenty of times where the defence has been different game to game as well, and this is probably the most crucial area to have consistency in selection.

We've got a good squad, but a lot of them have been unavailable at the same time this season, and we have suffered as a result.

[bingo70]

To be fair to Lennon, and I'm like a stuck record with this point, injuries have been by far and away the biggest factor in our disappointing season.

It might not always have been a key player that was injured, but the amount of wee knocks or games missed here and there meant that we struggled to get a settled eleven on the pitch game to game.

Players improve when they get a run in the team with the same team mates around them and when everyone gets to stay in position. We've not had that luxury this season at all.

I reckon there will be plenty of times where the defence has been different game to game as well, and this is probably the most crucial area to have consistency in selection.

We've got a good squad, but a lot of them have been unavailable at the same time this season, and we have suffered as a result.

I don’t think it’s a coincidence he went so long without being able to play the same side in consecutive weeks yet the week after he’s replaced we’re on the verge of playing three games in a row with an unchanged side. Injuries have played a part of course but it’s not the only factor, there’s been times he could have played the same side but never.

In answer to the OP I think there were some small but noticeable differences. It was a flat 4 across the middle and not a diamond for a start. I think this helped with the opening goal.

I also think the high press was clear to see. He spoke about it a lot in the build up so it may be a bit lazy pointing it out but there were a number of occasions attackers won the ball high up the park so I think there was a clear intent to try that and the players obviously took it on board.

I also think we tried to be a bit better on the counter attack. There was one period in particular where we had a corner, PH was telling Horgan where to stand near the touch line, Marciano caught the corener and immediately set him free on the left wing and he had a number of attackers up with him quickly. We did that under Lennon sometimes as well tbf but I think it’s been missing of late.

Although Hamilton were poor I personally think it was a better start for PH than he’s getting credit for. People who are saying there was no changes as he was only there for a couple of days are wrong IMO.

[The 90+2]

LATEST PODCAST

Gav Dave & Craig*discuss

[emoji404]Club Structure & Transfer Policy
[emoji848]Hamilton Game
[emoji2955]Mallan's New Position
[emoji102]Horgan's Best League Game?
[emoji187]Dundee Preview w/ @provieroadpod (Dundee Podcast)

https://itunes.apple.com/gb/podcast/hibs-talk/id1236445811?mt=2&i=1000430219360

https://open.spotify.com/episode/2nQi4ZPxO07PqpavPyzFfY?si=3Vtyugc8T0KVO1qyMeQz2A

http://hibstalk.com/61-what-was-different-under-new-manager
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190220/d111c7af38f830f414ffbb6643e9ec45.jpg

Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk

To give the podcast its own identity perhaps?

[sahpaton]

Incredible to hear Hibs haven't put out the same 11 for 2 consecutive games
We played the same starting XI in consecutive games when we beat Celtic and drew with Rangers in December, albeit Rocky was substituted very early on

[matty_f]

I don’t think it’s a coincidence he went so long without being able to play the same side in consecutive weeks yet the week after he’s replaced we’re on the verge of playing three games in a row with an unchanged side. Injuries have played a part of course but it’s not the only factor, there’s been times he could have played the same side but never.

In answer to the OP I think there were some small but noticeable differences. It was a flat 4 across the middle and not a diamond for a start. I think this helped with the opening goal.

I also think the high press was clear to see. He spoke about it a lot in the build up so it may be a bit lazy pointing it out but there were a number of occasions attackers won the ball high up the park so I think there was a clear intent to try that and the players obviously took it on board.

I also think we tried to be a bit better on the counter attack. There was one period in particular where we had a corner, PH was telling Horgan where to stand near the touch line, Marciano caught the corener and immediately set him free on the left wing and he had a number of attackers up with him quickly. We did that under Lennon sometimes as well tbf but I think it’s been missing of late.

Although Hamilton were poor I personally think it was a better start for PH than he’s getting credit for. People who are saying there was no changes as he was only there for a couple of days are wrong IMO.

I would argue that it is coincidence, and that if Gauld was fit there's every chance that he'd find himself in the team, which would improve it (IMHO) but also mean a change - and if it didn't change it would be due to the new management team sticking with what they've seen in a very short space of time.

Not that there won't have been some instances throughout the season where the changes would have been tactical (I'm sure) but when you consider that we have had injuries to:

Bogdan
Marciano
Gray
Whittaker
Hanlon
McGregor
Porteous
Stevenson
Nelom
Mavrias
Milligan
Horgan
Boyle
Slivka
Bartley
Maclaren
Kamberi

(those are just off the top of my head so I'm guessing I've missed some)

then you think about that it's not just the injured player that is the issue - for instance we've seen Whittaker cover in the midfield (meaning a change in there), then the next week cover at right back (which is a change in two positions) etc, or we've had to flip between 3 and 4 at the back to accomodate...

They've had a huge impact this season - worse than any other that I can remember.


The rest of your post I agree with.

[04Sauzee]

I would argue that it is coincidence, and that if Gauld was fit there's every chance that he'd find himself in the team, which would improve it (IMHO) but also mean a change - and if it didn't change it would be due to the new management team sticking with what they've seen in a very short space of time.

Not that there won't have been some instances throughout the season where the changes would have been tactical (I'm sure) but when you consider that we have had injuries to:

Bogdan
Marciano
Gray
Whittaker
Hanlon
McGregor
Porteous
Stevenson
Nelom
Mavrias
Milligan
Horgan
Boyle
Slivka
Bartley
Maclaren
Kamberi

(those are just off the top of my head so I'm guessing I've missed some)

then you think about that it's not just the injured player that is the issue - for instance we've seen Whittaker cover in the midfield (meaning a change in there), then the next week cover at right back (which is a change in two positions) etc, or we've had to flip between 3 and 4 at the back to accomodate...

They've had a huge impact this season - worse than any other that I can remember.


The rest of your post I agree with.
There is no argument that injuries have played a huge part in us having to chop and change. It will be interesting to see if the number of injuries change with Heckingbottom in charge.

[matty_f]

There is no argument that injuries have played a huge part in us having to chop and change. It will be interesting to see if the number of injuries change with Heckingbottom in charge.

Yeah I agree, though I suppose the implication would be that Lennon's trading was a factor, I suppose. If that was the case then I'd have expected a trend in the type of injury which I don't think there is (but I could be wrong).

[bingo70]

Yeah I agree, though I suppose the implication would be that Lennon's trading was a factor, I suppose. If that was the case then I'd have expected a trend in the type of injury which I don't think there is (but I could be wrong).

I don’t want to turn this into a Lennon bashing thread (I did like him for the most part, honest), however I am of the opinion that it wasn’t a good environment for the players over the last few months and when that happens I’m not convinced players do all they can to get back on the pitch as quickly as possible.

Lennon said it himself when he said something along the lines of “what happened to players using a bit deep heat?” when he was criticising the players for calling off too easily. I think he was being critical of the players at that time but I don’t think it reflected well on the environment he had created at the club.

[Dashing Bob S]

Didn’t seem much difference to be honest. Accies were too poor to seriously test us but caused a few flaps in the last half hour when we tired/lost concentration.

[bingo70]

Didn’t seem much difference to be honest. Accies were too poor to seriously test us but caused a few flaps in the last half hour when we tired/lost concentration.

Surely playing with a flat four across the middle and only having two central midfielders is a pretty significant difference when I don’t think we did that once under Lennon?

Even more significant when I think the first goal came from the left back passing it to the left winger close to the touch line who then had two strikers in the box to aim for in the box.

There’s pros and cons to every formation and it’s too early to say this formation is better than any of the ones Lennon used, especially when Lennons side won 6 nil against them, I just can’t agree with people who say there was no real difference.

[Hibbyradge]

I think I noticed that we were getting crosses into the box a lot earlier than before.

If you look at the first goal, Horgan takes only one touch before whipping the ball in. I mentioned it to my mate at the time.

It happened again from the other side, although I can't remember who crossed.

Hecky (We're going to have to get used to using that name) said that his ideas had played a part in the first goal. I think it was that.

[04Sauzee]

Surely playing with a flat four across the middle and only having two central midfielders is a pretty significant difference when I don’t think we did that once under Lennon?

Even more significant when I think the first goal came from the left back passing it to the left winger close to the touch line who then had two strikers in the box to aim for in the box.

There’s pros and cons to every formation and it’s too early to say this formation is better than any of the ones Lennon used, especially when Lennons side won 6 nil against them, I just can’t agree with people who say there was no real difference.
Like you I'm not sure how people couldn't see much difference when we are playing a flat midfield 4. Although pretty sure we must have done it a few times last season when Boyle and Barker played with a full backs playing behind them. Could be wrong though.

[04Sauzee]

I think I noticed that we were getting crosses into the box a lot earlier than before.

If you look at the first goal, Horgan takes only one touch before whipping the ball in. I mentioned it to my mate at the time.

It happened again from the other side, although I can't remember who crossed.

Hecky (We're going to have to get used to using that name) said that his ideas had played a part in the first goal. I think it was that.

Pretty sure it says in the podcast the number of crosses we got into the box was a fair bit above our season average. Again this may be down to the opposition.

[Dashing Bob S]

Surely playing with a flat four across the middle and only having two central midfielders is a pretty significant difference when I don’t think we did that once under Lennon?

Even more significant when I think the first goal came from the left back passing it to the left winger close to the touch line who then had two strikers in the box to aim for in the box.

There’s pros and cons to every formation and it’s too early to say this formation is better than any of the ones Lennon used, especially when Lennons side won 6 nil against them, I just can’t agree with people who say there was no real difference.

Good points Bingo. I was perhaps a little blithe in my assessment.

[matty_f]

I don’t want to turn this into a Lennon bashing thread (I did like him for the most part, honest), however I am of the opinion that it wasn’t a good environment for the players over the last few months and when that happens I’m not convinced players do all they can to get back on the pitch as quickly as possible.

Lennon said it himself when he said something along the lines of “what happened to players using a bit deep heat?” when he was criticising the players for calling off too easily. I think he was being critical of the players at that time but I don’t think it reflected well on the environment he had created at the club.

Good points.


As for the podcast, what was the chat at the start about the manager not getting to pick the signings?

That's wrong - the manager (or head coach) has final say on all the signings.

[Danderhall Hibs]

I think I noticed that we were getting crosses into the box a lot earlier than before.

If you look at the first goal, Horgan takes only one touch before whipping the ball in. I mentioned it to my mate at the time.

It happened again from the other side, although I can't remember who crossed.

Hecky (We're going to have to get used to using that name) said that his ideas had played a part in the first goal. I think it was that.

Can we all agree that he goes by “the Heck”?

[Hibbyradge]

Can we all agree that he goes by “the Heck”?

What?

[DetroitHibs]

It will be more evident what the differences are after 4-5 games with the new gaffer in place.

[bingo70]

It will be more evident what the differences are after 4-5 games with the new gaffer in place.

Especially if we choose to just ignore the pretty significant differences in his first 4 or 5 games 😉

[Danderhall Hibs]

What?

New managers name...

[Hibbyradge]

New managers name...

Whoosh :wink:

[Danderhall Hibs]

Whoosh :wink:

It would appear so. Got to say it wasn’t that great though. :greengrin

[Hibbyradge]

It would appear so. Got to say it wasn’t that great though. :greengrin

It was exactly that great. No more, no less.

[BlackSheep]

Incredible to hear Hibs haven't put out the same 11 for 2 consecutive games

REALLY!! Half the posters on here had pointed this out!! A lot of criticism of Lennon was banded about in regard to this very issue!

[Sammy7nil]

I think I noticed that we were getting crosses into the box a lot earlier than before.

If you look at the first goal, Horgan takes only one touch before whipping the ball in. I mentioned it to my mate at the time.

It happened again from the other side, although I can't remember who crossed.

Hecky (We're going to have to get used to using that name) said that his ideas had played a part in the first goal. I think it was that.

Why not just call him bottom :greengrin

[04Sauzee]

REALLY!! Half the posters on here had pointed this out!! A lot of criticism of Lennon was banded about in regard to this very issue!

Yes really although it has since been pointed out we did start with the same team in 2 successive games so half the posters would be wrong 😁
Early Europe I hadn't realised the same 11 hadn't started.
As stated I'm well aware of our injury woes this season