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View Full Version : If we were playing with 7 or 8 as Parker said, who's for the chop?



Greenbeard
06-12-2018, 10:27 AM
I'm excluding Bogdan so that leaves 6 or 7 of the outfield players, in other words at least 3 non-performers in the starting line-up last night. Who are they? (And after what has been said, presumably highly unlikely to start v Hamilton.)
I'd go (in order):
1. Kamberi
2. Boyle
3. Mallan

A few other contenders for that fourth spot, but too many borderline cases that I can't distinguish. Some might say Lennon. But I don't blame him for last night's performance. All down to the players, not the selection or set-up.

Excused from my list (as well as Bogdan) are
Ambrose, Stevenson, Porteous (a few poor moments but the good outweighed the bad). And of the subs, Slivka.

MartinfaePorty
06-12-2018, 10:39 AM
Cant really argue with that. Boyle, to me, looks like he really needs a rest. Last season we had the options to do that, but we're hampered with injuries, so no real replacements available and I'll think he'll continue to start until the winter break. Slivka also seems better when coming on as a sub. He's athletic, which is a good attribute when the opposition are tiring, but when he starts he never really stamps his authority on the midfield as he should. Efe continues to be consistent. If he was better in the final 3rd he'd be world class!

calumhibee1
06-12-2018, 10:41 AM
I'm excluding Bogdan so that leaves 6 or 7 of the outfield players, in other words at least 3 non-performers in the starting line-up last night. Who are they? (And after what has been said, presumably highly unlikely to start v Hamilton.)
I'd go (in order):
1. Kamberi
2. Boyle
3. Mallan

A few other contenders for that fourth spot, but too many borderline cases that I can't distinguish. Some might say Lennon. But I don't blame him for last night's performance. All down to the players, not the selection or set-up.

Excused from my list (as well as Bogdan) are
Ambrose, Stevenson, Porteous (a few poor moments but the good outweighed the bad). And of the subs, Slivka.

From last nights team they 3 are the obvious. Shaw would probably have been in there aswell if he hadn’t got his goal.

From last nights team the only ones that could have any complaints at not starting on Saturday for me would be Efe, Slivka and Porteous definitely and probably Bogdan aswell.

Blaster
06-12-2018, 10:42 AM
Kamberi
Horgan
Boyle

MWHIBBIES
06-12-2018, 10:48 AM
Definitely not Kamberi. Do folk want Shaw and Maclaren dealing with those aimless punts?

BILLYHIBS
06-12-2018, 10:57 AM
The fact Kamberi got hooked for not doing his job shows that Lenny and Parker are not best pleased with him

H18 SFR
06-12-2018, 11:12 AM
Horgan is so unfortunate. He gets no luck at all.

Greenbeard
06-12-2018, 11:28 AM
From last nights team they 3 are the obvious. Shaw would probably have been in there aswell if he hadn’t got his goal.

From last nights team the only ones that could have any complaints at not starting on Saturday for me would be Efe, Slivka and Porteous definitely and probably Bogdan aswell.
With you on Shaw. E.G. for the loss of possession for their first goal, at the time I blamed Mallan for firing a pass to Shaw who was not well positioned surrounded by three or four opponents and easily dispossessed. However, on seeing the BBC highlights, it is actually a great pass to make, taking out the three St M players and anticipating a simple lay-off by Shaw for a one-two with Mallan, who goes in the space to get it back. But Shaw just doesn't see that, miscontrols and boof, 0-1. Outstanding goal mind you.

Ozyhibby
06-12-2018, 11:36 AM
Kamberi
Horgan
Boyle

I actually thought Horgan and Boyle were our only threat last night.


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B.H.F.C
06-12-2018, 11:38 AM
I actually thought Horgan and Boyle were our only threat last night.


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Aye I thought Horgan was involved in most of the chances we created. No the fittest though.

theonlywayisup
06-12-2018, 11:39 AM
The depressing fact is the if we did drop Mallan, Horgan, Kamberi etc, who exactly are we going to bring into the team right now to replace them.

Our lack of summer transfer activity prior to the Livi game has come back to bite us in the derriere.

If only we could unearth a Riordan or a Brown like we did yonks ago when losing to Aberdeen years ago.

Springbank
06-12-2018, 11:41 AM
Cant really argue with that. Boyle, to me, looks like he really needs a rest. Last season we had the options to do that, but we're hampered with injuries, so no real replacements available and I'll think he'll continue to start until the winter break. Slivka also seems better when coming on as a sub. He's athletic, which is a good attribute when the opposition are tiring, but when he starts he never really stamps his authority on the midfield as he should. Efe continues to be consistent. If he was better in the final 3rd he'd be world class!

I don't think Boyle needs a rest - he needs the team's tactics to work to his strengths.

What does that mean - it means when we win the ball deep in midfield, last season the ball was quickly recycled to McGinn who would ping a 70 yarder into open space behind the left back for Boyle to run onto, the idea being Boyle just needs to take a touch and slide it across goal, to a Maclaren/Flo who then only needed one touch, goal. The opposition couldn't play too high up the field (leaving space) and it changed the whole shape of the game for us. We terrorised opponents that way.

Now, we play slow, daft, tip-tap across the middle, eventually slowly passing to Boyle on the halfway line, with 10 opponents in front of him, asking him to use some trickery (instead of pace). A ball goes into Flo, who lets it bounce off him. Maclaren doesn't even get on for 83 minutes. Mallan can play the McGinn hail-Mary 70 yarder pass, but isn't being encouraged to. We end up slow, ponderous, easy to defend against, looking clueless.

But that's not the players fault.

That's the manager.

Change the tactics. He has the players. He is just not using them to their strengths.

Ozyhibby
06-12-2018, 11:45 AM
Maybe we could get a A league team to take Milligan? He’s not good enough to start here and hopefully he does want to finish his career on the bench.


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BILLYHIBS
06-12-2018, 11:50 AM
Maybe we could get a A league team to take Milligan? He’s not good enough to start here and hopefully he does want to finish his career on the bench.


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The way things are shaping up he could have his swan song there after 12 months

oldbutdim
06-12-2018, 12:02 PM
I don't think Boyle needs a rest - he needs the team's tactics to work to his strengths.

What does that mean - it means when we win the ball deep in midfield, last season the ball was quickly recycled to McGinn who would ping a 70 yarder into open space behind the left back for Boyle to run onto, the idea being Boyle just needs to take a touch and slide it across goal, to a Maclaren/Flo who then only needed one touch, goal. The opposition couldn't play too high up the field (leaving space) and it changed the whole shape of the game for us. We terrorised opponents that way.

Now, we play slow, daft, tip-tap across the middle, eventually slowly passing to Boyle on the halfway line, with 10 opponents in front of him, asking him to use some trickery (instead of pace). A ball goes into Flo, who lets it bounce off him. Maclaren doesn't even get on for 83 minutes. Mallan can play the McGinn hail-Mary 70 yarder pass, but isn't being encouraged to. We end up slow, ponderous, easy to defend against, looking clueless.

But that's not the players fault.

That's the manager.

Change the tactics. He has the players. He is just not using them to their strengths.


Have to agree.
Boyle can still be one of the most feared attackers in the top division, but only if he is allowed/encouraged to utilise his main asset - his blistering pace.
The slow build ups just aren't working. We may retain possession a bit longer (sometimes) but there's no end product.

Heckys Wheel
06-12-2018, 12:06 PM
Definitely not Kamberi. Do folk want Shaw and Maclaren dealing with those aimless punts?

Exactly my thoughts although I don’t think we can continue with Kamberi.

Dare I say it, the only striker who’s shown any signs of being able to lead the line is Lewis Allen at Livi.

Keith_M
06-12-2018, 12:07 PM
I've defended Kamberi before but I'm finding it harder to do that recently.


Passing a ball to him is like kicking it at a bouncy castle. You know it's going to bounce off but you can never be sure in which direction.

MWHIBBIES
06-12-2018, 12:12 PM
Exactly my thoughts although I don’t think we can continue with Kamberi.

Dare I say it, the only striker who’s shown any signs of being able to lead the line is Lewis Allen at Livi.

Kamberi has 7 goals this season, including an absolute incredible solo effort Vs Celtic, but Lewis Allan has shown more in his 2 appearances?

🤔🤔

J-C
06-12-2018, 12:13 PM
Kambri
Boyle
Horgan
Mallan

Bring in Lewis Allan, Murray, Slivka and Gullan.

where'stheslope
06-12-2018, 12:14 PM
What we need to look at was when we were sitting in 2nd place in the league, we had a goal difference of something like +16, now we are only +6!
So its not hard to say that the defence needs tightened up, we cried out for Hanlon to come back and as yet he is nothing like he was before injury!
In midfield Mallan has scored some cracking goals but again they have dried up, and he's not infuencing the games like he was before!
Kamberi looked a world beater early in the season, yet again his form has dropped away and goals have stopped coming!
To me they make up the spine of the team, and until we strenghten that spine we will just keep on suffering!!!!!

heretoday
06-12-2018, 12:15 PM
Kenny Miller! Come back to Easter Road!

MWHIBBIES
06-12-2018, 12:20 PM
Kambri
Boyle
Horgan
Mallan

Bring in Lewis Allan, Murray, Slivka and Gullan.

What has Gullan, Murray or Allan done to show they would make a positive difference and not just get pushed around and bullied?

J-C
06-12-2018, 12:24 PM
What has Gullan, Murray or Allan done to show they would make a positive difference and not just get pushed around and bullied?


What have the players being talked about showed or offered?

Porteous was one of the few players last night to show any kind of fight and at only 19, lets give 2-3 youngsters a chance, getting fed up with some of these so called more senior players doing the square root of nowt.

Biggie
06-12-2018, 12:29 PM
Kenny Miller! Come back to Easter Road!

That ships sailed mate....

MWHIBBIES
06-12-2018, 12:33 PM
What have the players being talked about showed or offered?

Porteous was one of the few players last night to show any kind of fight and at only 19, lets give 2-3 youngsters a chance, getting fed up with some of these so called more senior players doing the square root of nowt.
They've offered far more than the youngsters? Nearly 20 goals between Mallan and Kamberi. How is 3 players without a goal between them going to improve us Vs Rangers and Celtic?

pacoluna
06-12-2018, 12:34 PM
Boyle - out
Stevenson - out
Porteous - out
Kamberi - out
Shaw - out

Hanlon - in
Nelom - in
Maclaren - in
Allan - in
Slivka - in

Blaster
06-12-2018, 12:36 PM
I actually thought Horgan and Boyle were our only threat last night.


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To be honest Ozy it was my take on who Parker was on about not doing their jobs properly. I agree they were a threat but didn’t think their effort levels were high enough without the ball

So many of our players don’t look fit enough. I think we should be making better use of our reserve games for overall fitness

J-C
06-12-2018, 12:39 PM
They've offered far more than the youngsters? Nearly 20 goals between Mallan and Kamberi. How is 3 players without a goal between them going to improve us Vs Rangers and Celtic?


Dear god man we're not denying that, Parker stated that certain players are not doing enough and what they are told, we're speculating on here as to who he was talking about. I've given my views as to who it is and offered up some names as to who can maybe come in to replace them. I don't know if you've noticed but on the bench last night we had Nelom, McGregor, Milligan, Slivka, McLaren and Gullan as the outfield players to choose from. Hyndman, Agyepong, Gray, Hanlon are not available, so who do you think we have to come in and replace any of the 3-4 players who are not cutting it just now?

Keith_M
06-12-2018, 12:41 PM
Boyle - out
Stevenson - out
Porteous - out
Kamberi - out
Shaw - out

Hanlon - in
Nelom - in
Maclaren - in
Allan - in
Slivka - in


Why Porteous?


:confused:

Wilson
06-12-2018, 12:51 PM
That ships sailed mate....

Hopefully it hits an iceberg and sinks with all souls who sail on it.

superfurryhibby
06-12-2018, 12:53 PM
Boyle continues to give his all and is behind most of our attacking threat. As mentioned by a few of our more savvy posters, he needs decent service and proper support from elsewhere. Just because a few have started a Boyle bashing campaign on here, don’t be fooled.

I would say that Kamberi, Mallan and Milligan are offering very little just now. Kamberi is supposedly carrying an injury and this may well be a factor in his recent poor performances. Mallan just isn’t ver6 athletic. For a young guy he’s fairly slow and despite his dead ball prowess, I’ve felt from early doors that he needs to develop his game. Milligan is tidy enough on the ball, but very immobile. I would take a fit Bartley over him everytime.

Slivka needs a run in his favoured position. He offered energy and some positive momentum when he came on.

Hanlon ( didn’t make the bench last night) and Gray are sorely missed. Unfortunately, it seems both are struggling. I can only imagine McGregor is in also feeling his long term injury issues too, otherwise he would be starting.

So, we have three guys who have contributed a helluva lot to our success these past few years not contributing much this season. Chuck in the loss of the central midfield trio and our main strikers carrying/ recovering from injuries and you have conditions for a perfect Hibees storm.

Brightside
06-12-2018, 12:54 PM
Boyle - out
Stevenson - out
Porteous - out
Kamberi - out
Shaw - out

Hanlon - in
Nelom - in
Maclaren - in
Allan - in
Slivka - in

I dont think we will see Hanlon rushing back. Porteous makes mistakes but he does have the right mind set for what we are going through at the moment. Slivka is a must start for the next 4/5 games for me.

MWHIBBIES
06-12-2018, 12:55 PM
Dear god man we're not denying that, Parker stated that certain players are not doing enough and what they are told, we're speculating on here as to who he was talking about. I've given my views as to who it is and offered up some names as to who can maybe come in to replace them. I don't know if you've noticed but on the bench last night we had Nelom, McGregor, Milligan, Slivka, McLaren and Gullan as the outfield players to choose from. Hyndman, Agyepong, Gray, Hanlon are not available, so who do you think we have to come in and replace any of the 3-4 players who are not cutting it just now?

It doesn't really get fixed by just dropping them and playing kids. Parker and Lennon should be motivating them, teaching them etc. They're not in great form but neither are our coaching team. Bad decisions being made all around. Chucking kids into a struggling team would make it worse.

matty_f
06-12-2018, 12:57 PM
I think before we consider who's getting dropped for the team, there's a greater need for having a settled team and system for a bit. We're chopping and changing every week and the team look less and less like they know what they're doing with each game.

We need some stability and continuity and then if players need dropped do it one at a time and let players get some confidence back, and some sense of having a team back.

SChibs
06-12-2018, 01:02 PM
I think the problem with boyle these days is teams are wise to him and they double or triple up on him on that side. They know his main threat is knocking it past and beating his man for pace. If you nullify that then he isn't very effective. Imo that's exactly what teams have been doing to counter him

superfurryhibby
06-12-2018, 01:03 PM
I dont think we will see Hanlon rushing back. Porteous makes mistakes but he does have the right mind set for what we are going through at the moment. Slivka is a must start for the next 4/5 games for me.

Has Hanlon’s injury returned? Key player, when fit.

CockneyRebel
06-12-2018, 01:07 PM
[QUOTE=Keekaboo;5622640]Why Porteous?

Perhaps because he is not looking as good as we all thought he was going to be? Daft, unnecessary fouls and diving in too quick at times? Maybe we are expecting too much too soon? Just a thought.

Hibby Kay-Yay
06-12-2018, 01:18 PM
It looks like a confidence issue impacting both players and mgmt.

The team were doing well at the start of the season, even for a few games post McGinn. We definitely miss SDG in the team and our injuries have been very frustrating this season so far.

Hannah_hfc
06-12-2018, 01:21 PM
If Boyle was one of the ones lacking effort I’d be surprised, would have thought he would be aiming for another Australia call up in Jan


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Jones28
06-12-2018, 01:25 PM
Horgan - headless chicken for me, although he played some decent balls in too often he takes the ball into danger before trying to dance out of it. If he used his pace better and only wanted to beat a man once instead of sending him to the shop for milk he would be a much better asset.

Boyle - think he needs a rest.

Shaw - I like him but, as he showed last night - he's a finisher, not a hold up player.

Incoming:

Allen - big, strong, just what we need.

Slivka - showed last night he is a clever footballer. Always has time on the ball and rarely misplaces passes. He's also scored on a few occasions.

I don't know who would come in for Horgan - Gullane perhaps? Or Fraser Murray?

hibsforeurope
06-12-2018, 02:12 PM
If Boyle was one of the ones lacking effort I’d be surprised, would have thought he would be aiming for another Australia call up in Jan


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Boyle seems more focused on getting in this Asian cup squad than he is playing well for Hibs. He's not kicked a ball consistently for us since his call up was mentioned.

BSEJVT
06-12-2018, 05:02 PM
Whilst I would certainly drop Kamberi right now, I would hope that he is suffering through an injury and sacrificing himself for the team.

If that is the case I would get it fixed, whatever it is and how long it would take as he has been awful for weeks.

Boyle has also been poor and seems to be burning on a really short fuse at the moment as some of his petulance last night was of no help / use at all, but having said that despite being poor most of our good things came through him.

Horgan is an enigma, he is like a 70% player, in that much of what he does is good / fine but the other 30% is useless. He doesn't track back as well as he should and if I had to guess I would guess that if he were being criticised by Parker it would be for lack of positional discipline rather than effort

Much of what is wrong with that team could be fixed by a settled defence and 2 strong CM's

However it looks like the sands of time are slipping away from McGregor & Bartley whom we would have otherwise relied on to assist. After a bright start Milligan has been embarrassingly poor and if he were my player / teammate I would have booted his arse after he chucked it against Killie. He is not what we need right now.

The sad thing is that we seem to have signed a lot of similar players / similar standard players and that there isn't a game changer such as Allan or Barker available.

Its blindingly obvious that we are missing the desire, determination and physicality of McGinn more than I had hoped we would.

It looks sadly similar to the Fenlon / Butcher era where the players weren't as bad as the results they achieved, but they have completely retreated into their shells and everything is ponderous and play is far to slow and they look terrified to make mistakes and are shot of confidence when they do.

I honestly couldn't believe after we got it back to 2-2 that they retreated back on top of the defence and allowed St Mirren to fanny about with the ball amongst their back four and midfield

They should have pushed up and got right in about them.

Viva_Palmeiras
06-12-2018, 05:15 PM
Knee-jerkometer dial just cranked up.

RossScott1991
06-12-2018, 05:56 PM
Kamberi
Boyle
Mallan
Milligan
Horgan

In that order. Letting us down.

Milligan has looked wasteful and off the pace after a bright start. Horgan confuses life out me, signed as a left winger yet everytime Stevenson lifts his head he’s standing inside. Got a feeling he’s a waste of a jersey and abit of a one trick pony.

Mallan is toiling in his general play, midfield combinations yet to bring the best out him. Over powered.

Boyle well off the pace, he’s gone from a high flying winger riding challenges and looking to beat his man everytime to forgetting about all these things, though he hasn’t had a sustained period of time wide right.

Kamberi has been awful, everytime ball is played up to him he jumps behind the defender or tries a tippy tappy flip. Needs to start being a more vocal point spearheading attacks.

jodjam
06-12-2018, 06:01 PM
Boyle seems more focused on getting in this Asian cup squad than he is playing well for Hibs. He's not kicked a ball consistently for us since his call up was mentioned.

But surely his best chance of getting in the squad is playing well for us

Dr_Regal
06-12-2018, 06:02 PM
Boyle - out
Stevenson - out
Porteous - out
Kamberi - out
Shaw - out

Hanlon - in
Nelom - in
Maclaren - in
Allan - in
Slivka - in

Oh boy....board meltdown in 3...2....1.....

Hi Heid Yin
06-12-2018, 09:40 PM
I've defended Kamberi before but I'm finding it harder to do that recently.


Passing a ball to him is like kicking it at a bouncy castle. You know it's going to bounce off but you can never be sure in which direction.

:tee hee::tee hee: You come up with some corkers.
We need to laugh during the present gloom.

AgentDaleCooper
06-12-2018, 09:49 PM
Whilst I would certainly drop Kamberi right now, I would hope that he is suffering through an injury and sacrificing himself for the team.

If that is the case I would get it fixed, whatever it is and how long it would take as he has been awful for weeks.

Boyle has also been poor and seems to be burning on a really short fuse at the moment as some of his petulance last night was of no help / use at all, but having said that despite being poor most of our good things came through him.

Horgan is an enigma, he is like a 70% player, in that much of what he does is good / fine but the other 30% is useless. He doesn't track back as well as he should and if I had to guess I would guess that if he were being criticised by Parker it would be for lack of positional discipline rather than effort

Much of what is wrong with that team could be fixed by a settled defence and 2 strong CM's

However it looks like the sands of time are slipping away from McGregor & Bartley whom we would have otherwise relied on to assist. After a bright start Milligan has been embarrassingly poor and if he were my player / teammate I would have booted his arse after he chucked it against Killie. He is not what we need right now.

The sad thing is that we seem to have signed a lot of similar players / similar standard players and that there isn't a game changer such as Allan or Barker available.

Its blindingly obvious that we are missing the desire, determination and physicality of McGinn more than I had hoped we would.

It looks sadly similar to the Fenlon / Butcher era where the players weren't as bad as the results they achieved, but they have completely retreated into their shells and everything is ponderous and play is far to slow and they look terrified to make mistakes and are shot of confidence when they do.

I honestly couldn't believe after we got it back to 2-2 that they retreated back on top of the defence and allowed St Mirren to fanny about with the ball amongst their back four and midfield

They should have pushed up and got right in about them.
Spot on :aok:

Lang Toun hibby
06-12-2018, 10:07 PM
Whilst I would certainly drop Kamberi right now, I would hope that he is suffering through an injury and sacrificing himself for the team.

If that is the case I would get it fixed, whatever it is and how long it would take as he has been awful for weeks.

Boyle has also been poor and seems to be burning on a really short fuse at the moment as some of his petulance last night was of no help / use at all, but having said that despite being poor most of our good things came through him.

Horgan is an enigma, he is like a 70% player, in that much of what he does is good / fine but the other 30% is useless. He doesn't track back as well as he should and if I had to guess I would guess that if he were being criticised by Parker it would be for lack of positional discipline rather than effort

Much of what is wrong with that team could be fixed by a settled defence and 2 strong CM's

However it looks like the sands of time are slipping away from McGregor & Bartley whom we would have otherwise relied on to assist. After a bright start Milligan has been embarrassingly poor and if he were my player / teammate I would have booted his arse after he chucked it against Killie. He is not what we need right now.

The sad thing is that we seem to have signed a lot of similar players / similar standard players and that there isn't a game changer such as Allan or Barker available.

Its blindingly obvious that we are missing the desire, determination and physicality of McGinn more than I had hoped we would.

It looks sadly similar to the Fenlon / Butcher era where the players weren't as bad as the results they achieved, but they have completely retreated into their shells and everything is ponderous and play is far to slow and they look terrified to make mistakes and are shot of confidence when they do.

I honestly couldn't believe after we got it back to 2-2 that they retreated back on top of the defence and allowed St Mirren to fanny about with the ball amongst their back four and midfield

They should have pushed up and got right in about them.

We must have been separated at birth as I agree entirely with the above. Boyle kicking the ball away twice and not playing for the team, should bollocked for that. Excellent post.