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View Full Version : NHC You never see a poor bookie: Bet365 owner's salary



Lendo
22-11-2018, 12:30 PM
(admin's please move to the Holy Ground if not allowed, but kinda football related)

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46289499 (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46289499)

The boss of Bet365 took home an annual salary of £265,000,000 in 2017 (net? gross?). This is obscene and just highlights the issue of gambling in the UK.

Any idea whether she is taxed in the UK or is she paid off-shore?

Jones28
22-11-2018, 12:37 PM
That is a daily salary of £726,027.

Daily.

Hibee87
22-11-2018, 12:39 PM
(admin's please move to the Holy Ground if not allowed, but kinda football related)

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46289499 (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46289499)

The boss of Bet365 took home an annual salary of £265,000,000 in 2017 (net? gross?). This is obscene and just highlights the issue of gambling in the UK.

Any idea whether she is taxed in the UK or is she paid off-shore?

Bet365 is a worldwide bookmaker is it not? or at least available in a lot of countries online. Wither you agree with bookmaking or not, if she has founded a company and thats what she earns, so what?

Bill Gate, Steve Jobs, Stev Wozniaki, Richard Brason etc etc are or were worth how many billions for their own companies. Why is this woman any different or less entitled to have that much?

I guarantee no one on here would reject that wage.

Wonder what the 'womans equal pay' cult think about it all :greengrin

Devonhibs
22-11-2018, 12:52 PM
And pay themselves a 'dividend' thereby paying no tax. Yippee for some

bingo70
22-11-2018, 12:58 PM
(admin's please move to the Holy Ground if not allowed, but kinda football related)

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46289499 (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46289499)

The boss of Bet365 took home an annual salary of £265,000,000 in 2017 (net? gross?). This is obscene and just highlights the issue of gambling in the UK.

Any idea whether she is taxed in the UK or is she paid off-shore?

She is the founder of the company isn't she?

If so i don't see the problem. She's started and created a very successful business, it's not coming out of public funds so why shouldn't she get paid such a significant sum?

Lendo
22-11-2018, 01:05 PM
Bet365 is a worldwide bookmaker is it not? or at least available in a lot of countries online. Wither you agree with bookmaking or not, if she has founded a company and thats what she earns, so what?

Bill Gate, Steve Jobs, Stev Wozniaki, Richard Brason etc etc are or were worth how many billions for their own companies. Why is this woman any different or less entitled to have that much?

I guarantee no one on here would reject that wage.

Wonder what the 'womans equal pay' cult think about it all :greengrin

I agree with you. She has done very very very well for herself and i am hugely jealous.

BUT

There was national outrage at the boss of Persimmon Homes paying himself a £100m bonus, which he later reduced to £75m (on top of his £40m salary). Why no moral outrage at Denise Coates inflated salary?

She is no different to these people. She in fact vastly outearns Stev Wozniaki and Richard Branson (in terms of declared salary, perhaps not Net Worth). She paid herself over double what her whole business paid in tax in the UK last year (£130m). Gambling addiction costs the UK about £1.2b a year. Bet365 have made a massive donation of 0.144% of their turnover to gambling charities.

tam4hibs
22-11-2018, 01:07 PM
And pay themselves a 'dividend' thereby paying no tax. Yippee for some

Not so im afraid. I know most will want to paint her as corporate fat cat who reduces tax through legitimate means, however Dividends are taxed up to 38% - similar to income tax thresholds.

JeMeSouviens
22-11-2018, 01:14 PM
She is the founder of the company isn't she?

If so i don't see the problem. She's started and created a very successful business, it's not coming out of public funds so why shouldn't she get paid such a significant sum?

No, it's her Dad's company. Still family owned though I think. They also own Stoke City.

Renfrew_Hibby
22-11-2018, 01:18 PM
She's done well for herself, well it was her fathers business she converted from an old fashioned high street bookies to an online only giant. A smart cookie it would seem.
The Coates family own Stoke City so although they got relegated I doubt they will ever get into serious financial trouble while they are in charge.
Bet365 is a global player so only a proportion of her earnings will be off the back of UK gamblers and I heard somewhere that she has personally donated around £70M to various charities over the last few years so its not all bad.

CapitalGreen
22-11-2018, 01:18 PM
No, it's her Dad's company. Still family owned though I think. They also own Stoke City.

Her Dad owned a chain of High Street bookies, she was responsible for setting up Bet365.

JeMeSouviens
22-11-2018, 01:18 PM
I agree with you. She has done very very very well for herself and i am hugely jealous.

BUT

There was national outrage at the boss of Persimmon Homes paying himself a £100m bonus, which he later reduced to £75m (on top of his £40m salary). Why no moral outrage at Denise Coates inflated salary?

She is no different to these people. She in fact vastly outearns Stev Wozniaki and Richard Branson (in terms of declared salary, perhaps not Net Worth). She paid herself over double what her whole business paid in tax in the UK last year (£130m). Gambling addiction costs the UK about £1.2b a year. Bet365 have made a massive donation of 0.144% of their turnover to gambling charities.

He didn't really pay himself a £100M bonus. He was signed up to an incentive plan that gave him access to discounted shares. Because the share price soared he (and other execs in the scheme) made that level of fortune. If the share price had tanked he'd have got nothing. It was impossible for the company to know how much he'd get when he was given the incentive.

JeMeSouviens
22-11-2018, 01:20 PM
Her Dad owned a chain of High Street bookies, she was responsible for setting up Bet365.

Ah right, thanks for the correction. Either way it's a privately held company so they can pretty much do what they like.

Future17
22-11-2018, 01:20 PM
I agree with you. She has done very very very well for herself and i am hugely jealous.

BUT

There was national outrage at the boss of Persimmon Homes paying himself a £100m bonus, which he later reduced to £75m (on top of his £40m salary). Why no moral outrage at Denise Coates inflated salary?

She is no different to these people. She in fact vastly outearns Stev Wozniaki and Richard Branson (in terms of declared salary, perhaps not Net Worth). She paid herself over double what her whole business paid in tax in the UK last year (£130m). Gambling addiction costs the UK about £1.2b a year. Bet365 have made a massive donation of 0.144% of their turnover to gambling charities.

I think the Persimmon story caused more outrage as the company had essentially benefitted from public money, due to their partnership in "Help-to-Buy" schemes and the like.

The comparison re: Bet365 would probably be a moral one regarding whether the company profits from addiction.

Kojock
22-11-2018, 01:37 PM
And pay themselves a 'dividend' thereby paying no tax. Yippee for some

Company employs 4000 people and it pays all it taxes.

Northernhibee
22-11-2018, 01:41 PM
Depends. If those at the lowest end of the company can’t afford to pay their bills that salary can get ****ed.

CropleyWasGod
22-11-2018, 01:48 PM
I think the Persimmon story caused more outrage as the company had essentially benefitted from public money, due to their partnership in "Help-to-Buy" schemes and the like.

The comparison re: Bet365 would probably be a moral one regarding whether the company profits from addiction....and also the moral argument as to whether the State profits from it.

That's another thread though [emoji38]

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green day
22-11-2018, 01:48 PM
Rather ironically, this story broke on the same day it was reported that there are 50000 children gambling in the UK.

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-46286945

So, whatever your thoughts on gambling (I gamble a little) there is definitely an issue when the owner of an online bookies makes over £4m a week in profit, pretty much every football team is sponsored by online bookies, and we have that many kids gambling illegally.

cabbageandribs1875
22-11-2018, 01:54 PM
odds of 1/25 she'll be a multi-billionaire in the next few years

Brightside
22-11-2018, 01:55 PM
Its her own company. She built it from scratch. It employs 1000s of staff. Well done to her.

Future17
22-11-2018, 01:58 PM
...and also the moral argument as to whether the State profits from it.

That's another thread though [emoji38]

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Good point!

Onceinawhile
22-11-2018, 01:58 PM
It wasn't a salary - it was her total remuneration e.g. a mixture of salary and dividends.

As for the dividends not being taxable, that's certainly true of the first £2,000. The remainder however would mostly have been taxed at 38.1%, saving her 6.9% tax compared to if she had taken it all as salary. Of course, there's also the 2% NIC saving, meaning she saved 8.9% on it. That's hardly mass tax avoidance or evasion though.

Brightside
22-11-2018, 02:00 PM
And pay themselves a 'dividend' thereby paying no tax. Yippee for some

Paying no Tax? Im assuming you arent self employed? Those that are pay a shed load of tax on Dividends.

Onceinawhile
22-11-2018, 02:02 PM
Paying no Tax? Im assuming you arent self employed? Those that are pay a shed load of tax on Dividends.

Technically, people who are self-employed can't pay dividends.

Owners of their own LTD company can though. :greengrin

Pete
22-11-2018, 02:08 PM
It’s absolutely disgusting that someone has that amount of wealth when you consider the poverty that so many people live in.

Something is fundamentally wrong.

delbert
22-11-2018, 02:08 PM
(admin's please move to the Holy Ground if not allowed, but kinda football related)

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46289499 (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46289499)

The boss of Bet365 took home an annual salary of £265,000,000 in 2017 (net? gross?). This is obscene and just highlights the issue of gambling in the UK.

Any idea whether she is taxed in the UK or is she paid off-shore?

Any mug who goes online and forks over their cash at least now sees where it’s going, transparency and all that, don’t see the problem, she has done well for herself !

SChibs
22-11-2018, 02:40 PM
It’s absolutely disgusting that someone has that amount of wealth when you consider the poverty that so many people live in.

Something is fundamentally wrong.

Capitalism?

flash
22-11-2018, 03:05 PM
Fortunes made on the back of feeding people's addiction.

bookert
22-11-2018, 03:50 PM
It’s absolutely disgusting that someone has that amount of wealth when you consider the poverty that so many people live in.

Something is fundamentally wrong.

Especially when the industry she is part of is responsible for at least part of that poverty.

Devonhibs
22-11-2018, 04:20 PM
Paying no Tax? Im assuming you arent self employed? Those that are pay a shed load of tax on Dividends.

Clearly I misunderstood the role of dividends and wasnt a dig at the majority of self employed

Tornadoes70
22-11-2018, 04:49 PM
Betfred hiding behind an excuse that the machine had a 'glitch' in not paying out 1.7 million. As the man says how many times was there a 'glitch' when it took his losing money? Pay the man its not his fault the machine allegedly had a 'glitch'. Shocking and hope he wins his day in court but I suspect he'll be offered a huge sum before any legal ruling. No wonder the bookies are mega rolling in the stuff.

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/betfred-refuses-to-pay-out-%C2%A317mlllion-to-punter-who-blew-thousands-celebrating/ar-BBPZgxG

hibsbollah
22-11-2018, 05:09 PM
The majority view on here seems to be 'you own your business, it's yours, you can pay yourself whatever you want'. I've noticed it on previous similar threads too. I find it massively depressing that I'm in the minority that thinks it's morally wrong.

Who creates the wealth? Is it solely this woman? Do not the hundreds of employees that work in the organisation have some input? In what sense is it 'her' wealth? Have we reached a point where the progress we've made from feudal times, when the landowning class owned everything and everyone else was in perpetual servitude, means nothing anymore?

We need to invest in some guillotines.

Dashing Bob S
22-11-2018, 05:15 PM
These guys do a great and vital social service providing hope and inspiration to the aspirational working man who wants to better himself. Worth every penny.

Hibbyradge
22-11-2018, 05:19 PM
And pay themselves a 'dividend' thereby paying no tax. Yippee for some

That's not the case.

CropleyWasGod
22-11-2018, 05:24 PM
The majority view on here seems to be 'you own your business, it's yours, you can pay yourself whatever you want'. I've noticed it on previous similar threads too. I find it massively depressing that I'm in the minority that thinks it's morally wrong.

Who creates the wealth? Is it solely this woman? Do not the hundreds of employees that work in the organisation have some input? In what sense is it 'her' wealth? Have we reached a point where the progress we've made from feudal times, when the landowning class owned everything and everyone else was in perpetual servitude, means nothing anymore?

We need to invest in some guillotines.

... and there's a career opportunity right there.

Time for the sans-culotties to go potty again. :greengrin

neil7908
22-11-2018, 05:27 PM
The majority view on here seems to be 'you own your business, it's yours, you can pay yourself whatever you want'. I've noticed it on previous similar threads too. I find it massively depressing that I'm in the minority that thinks it's morally wrong.

Who creates the wealth? Is it solely this woman? Do not the hundreds of employees that work in the organisation have some input? In what sense is it 'her' wealth? Have we reached a point where the progress we've made from feudal times, when the landowning class owned everything and everyone else was in perpetual servitude, means nothing anymore?

We need to invest in some guillotines.

I agree with you 100%. Inequality is getting worse and worse and it's all feeding anger in our society. No one needs this amount of money. To the previous poster who said no one would refuse it I can say I certainly would.

This isn't just someone being wealthy, this is obscene. I wonder what their lowest earners receive and whether we the public are paying any benefits to their staff?

Keith_M
22-11-2018, 05:32 PM
Technically, people who are self-employed can't pay dividends.

Owners of their own LTD company can though. :greengrin

Being Self Employed and being paid through a Limited Company are not the same. The former generally pay higher taxes than the latter (personal taxation v dividends)

Ozyhibby
22-11-2018, 05:42 PM
He didn't really pay himself a £100M bonus. He was signed up to an incentive plan that gave him access to discounted shares. Because the share price soared he (and other execs in the scheme) made that level of fortune. If the share price had tanked he'd have got nothing. It was impossible for the company to know how much he'd get when he was given the incentive.

The company has benefited massively from taxpayers money through the ridiculous help to buy scheme.


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Ozyhibby
22-11-2018, 05:47 PM
I agree with you 100%. Inequality is getting worse and worse and it's all feeding anger in our society. No one needs this amount of money. To the previous poster who said no one would refuse it I can say I certainly would.

This isn't just someone being wealthy, this is obscene. I wonder what their lowest earners receive and whether we the public are paying any benefits to their staff?

If anyone can show me a better system than capitalism then I’m all ears.



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neil7908
22-11-2018, 05:57 PM
If anyone can show me a better system than capitalism then I’m all ears.



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I agree but capitalism doesn't have to be this Darwinian, winner takes all system. There can be checks and balances in how economies operate to reduce inequality. Both USA and Sweden are capitalist but work very differently.

jacomo
22-11-2018, 06:08 PM
I’ve no problem with people getting filthy rich, but gambling addiction is a huge issue now and these companies are leaving the state (us taxpayers) to pick up the bill: health issues, homelessness, crime etc.

Is this a fair deal? I don’t think so.

WhileTheChief..
22-11-2018, 06:18 PM
Typical Scottish way of thinking.

Anyone who creates a successful company is immediately branded a fat cat who earns too much.

Anywhere else in the world and she’d be applauded for creating massive wealth which benefits thousands of employees, suppliers, the tax man and the economy in general.

Not here though. Would have been better if her dad’s business had gone bust due to the influx of online betting companies from around the world, staff made redundant and less money being generated eh!

We could do with a few more companies like hers in Scotland.

Got to create the wealth to spend on services somehow, so if it’s not through successful businesses how else do we do it?!

MyJo
22-11-2018, 06:24 PM
I’ve no problem with people getting filthy rich, but gambling addiction is a huge issue now and these companies are leaving the state (us taxpayers) to pick up the bill: health issues, homelessness, crime etc.

Is this a fair deal? I don’t think so.

You realise that she is also a taxpayer and out of that yearly income she has probably paid more in tax to the government than all of us will do in our entire life, combined. Even with the use of tax saving schemes.

She also created a highly successful, international company that employs thousands of staff which is headquartered in the UK, improving our economy and paying a load of tax on all those profits they are making as well.

They are operating legally, compliantly and paying their dues. It's hardly their fault that some individuals have an uncontrollable compulsion to gamble and ultimately wreck their lives feeding that addiction.

Malthibby
22-11-2018, 06:49 PM
Trouble with capitalism is that it's based on greed, & you need checks & balances which have been stripped away over the years.
Go back to the 70's & the top earners earned around 20x those at the wrong end. Now it's x hundreds. Are these captains of industry
worth countless millions more than the folk who ran industry back then? All of them?
It's morally bankrupt, unlike those at the top.
Noddy Holder didn't like paying 90% supertax, but he could at least laugh about it. And he'd have done a better job at RBS than Fred Goodwin,
whose still earning millions despite having proven to be utterly, utterly incompetent.
And as far as BET365 is concerned, as the OP says, you don't see poor bookies, just poor punters. It's a simple one-way transfer & I don't
feel like praising someone who has just got better at speeding up that transfer.

calumhibee1
22-11-2018, 06:56 PM
Betfred hiding behind an excuse that the machine had a 'glitch' in not paying out 1.7 million. As the man says how many times was there a 'glitch' when it took his losing money? Pay the man its not his fault the machine allegedly had a 'glitch'. Shocking and hope he wins his day in court but I suspect he'll be offered a huge sum before any legal ruling. No wonder the bookies are mega rolling in the stuff.

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/betfred-refuses-to-pay-out-%C2%A317mlllion-to-punter-who-blew-thousands-celebrating/ar-BBPZgxG

Is paying out any bet not down to the bookies ‘discretion’? Ridiculous that they can just turn round and decide that it’ll cost them a bit of money so they’ll no bother. The punter would never have that opportunity.

Bookmakers should be banned. I know people like a flutter and some people can deal with it alright but the percentages that can’t handle it are so ridiculously high that the whole thing should be outlawed.

Ozyhibby
22-11-2018, 06:59 PM
Trouble with capitalism is that it's based on greed, & you need checks & balances which have been stripped away over the years.
Go back to the 70's & the top earners earned around 20x those at the wrong end. Now it's x hundreds. Are these captains of industry
worth countless millions more than the folk who ran industry back then? All of them?
It's morally bankrupt, unlike those at the top.
Noddy Holder didn't like paying 90% supertax, but he could at least laugh about it. And he'd have done a better job at RBS than Fred Goodwin,
whose still earning millions despite having proven to be utterly, utterly incompetent.
And as far as BET365 is concerned, as the OP says, you don't see poor bookies, just poor punters. It's a simple one-way transfer & I don't
feel like praising someone who has just got better at speeding up that transfer.

Yes but during the 70’s Britain was on its knees, miles behind the rest of Europe and America and the electricity only worked three days a week.
RBS was the opposite of capitalism. They would have went under in a capatilist system. Their losses were socialised.


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Ozyhibby
22-11-2018, 07:01 PM
Is paying out any bet not down to the bookies ‘discretion’? Ridiculous that they can just turn round and decide that it’ll cost them a bit of money so they’ll no bother. The punter would never have that opportunity.

Bookmakers should be banned. I know people like a flutter and some people can deal with it alright but the percentages that can’t handle it are so ridiculously high that the whole thing should be outlawed.

Prohibition you mean? Because that works so well with drugs? The thought of armed bookmaking gangs is not something I would like to see.


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Since90+2
22-11-2018, 07:11 PM
Prohibition you mean? Because that works so well with drugs? The thought of armed bookmaking gangs is not something I would like to see.


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Bookies in this country literally can't lose.

If they see a pattern of a punter winning they simply close the account and don't allow them to bet anymore. It happened to a mate of mine who won a relatively small amount of a few thousand over a couple of months and they closed the account. How often do bookies close your account if you are losing? Never. You can lose millions and they will be quite happy to keep taking your money. If you are winning? Sorry we don't want you business , goodbye.

It's illegal in countries in Europe for bookmakers to close accounts of winning players but for some reason it's perfectly acceptable in this country and it's a disgrace to be honest.

Killiehibbie
22-11-2018, 07:11 PM
Prohibition you mean? Because that works so well with drugs? The thought of armed bookmaking gangs is not something I would like to see.


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A bit like Peaky Blinders?

I reckon the government should introduce laws to make them take a decent bet from everybody instead the bookies being able to restrict or ban unprofitable punters. I doubt it would make that much difference the huge profits they make.

calumhibee1
22-11-2018, 07:34 PM
Prohibition you mean? Because that works so well with drugs? The thought of armed bookmaking gangs is not something I would like to see.


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True. I just absolutely hate it. Not a gambler myself but I’m always astounded whenever you read the figures behind it. Sure i read somewhere like half of people who use the machines are gambling addicts. This is also where the vast majority of their income comes from. Scandalous.

danhibees1875
22-11-2018, 07:52 PM
If anyone can show me a better system than capitalism then I’m all ears.



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I don't think we'll be seeing the back of capitalism anytime soon - but I wonder if there's a way to allow capitalism to live within boundaries of minimum and maximum incomes. Eradicate the extremes where people are impoverished or have too much money than they could possibly need.

Tornadoes70
22-11-2018, 07:56 PM
Is paying out any bet not down to the bookies ‘discretion’? Ridiculous that they can just turn round and decide that it’ll cost them a bit of money so they’ll no bother. The punter would never have that opportunity.

Bookmakers should be banned. I know people like a flutter and some people can deal with it alright but the percentages that can’t handle it are so ridiculously high that the whole thing should be outlawed.

Probably the 'glitch' was that the betting game the guy had been betting upon was never supposed to pay out the jackpot. I've bet large sums in the past and as most gamblers will tell you winning is such a high and losing large sums can set one into deep depression.

The trouble is there's vastly so much more to bet on with the machines, cartoon racing, spread betting, foreign races being shown, bookies open to late and seven days a week, online betting etc that gambling is virtually unrecognisable compared to yesteryear when it was really only mainly a football coupon, horses and dogs that were bet upon.

I agree that its become too big and is causing extreme poverty and death in some cases and should at least be railed in with a return to the past when it was mainly limited to football, horses and the dogs but I doubt it will as there's far too much profit in it.

Gloucester Hibs
22-11-2018, 08:04 PM
The U.K. must have the most de-regulated gambling industry in the world. Anything goes. Reckon there are now thousands of online gambling sites available to U.K. citizens, we’re bombarded with gambling adverts during fitba matches, the gambling commission itself is toothless in so much as the tail wags the dog. Slight chink of light with regards the new regulation coming to do with max bets on the FOBTs.

Tornadoes70
22-11-2018, 08:14 PM
The U.K. must have the most de-regulated gambling industry in the world. Anything goes. Reckon there are now thousands of online gambling sites available to U.K. citizens, we’re bombarded with gambling adverts during fitba matches, the gambling commission itself is toothless in so much as the tail wags the dog. Slight chink of light with regards the new regulation coming to do with max bets on the FOBTs.

Saw a young guy about early twenties in the bookies shouting at and kicking a Fobt recently. I was bit alarmed as he was getting more and more aggressive as he seemed to be losing every spin. About twenty minutes later he suddenly became overcome with elation and overjoyed. Someone asked him if he'd got his money back and the reply was that he had put £2000 in and had recouped back to £1700 and was walking out with it 'delighted' he was 'only' £300 down. Didn't look like a guy that you'd expect to have £2000 cash to put in a betting machine.

Pete
22-11-2018, 08:23 PM
If anyone can show me a better system than capitalism then I’m all ears.



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Better system for who exactly?

Ozyhibby
22-11-2018, 08:32 PM
Better system for who exactly?

The poorest people in our society?


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Onceinawhile
22-11-2018, 08:33 PM
Being Self Employed and being paid through a Limited Company are not the same. The former generally pay higher taxes than the latter (personal taxation v dividends)

I know. That's why I said people who are self employed can't pay themselves dividends.

Ozyhibby
22-11-2018, 08:36 PM
The U.K. must have the most de-regulated gambling industry in the world. Anything goes. Reckon there are now thousands of online gambling sites available to U.K. citizens, we’re bombarded with gambling adverts during fitba matches, the gambling commission itself is toothless in so much as the tail wags the dog. Slight chink of light with regards the new regulation coming to do with max bets on the FOBTs.

Australia has the most deregulated gambling in the world and also the biggest gambling problem. The average Aussie loses more than double what the average Scot loses each year.
The new max bet rules are a good idea.


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Gloucester Hibs
22-11-2018, 08:45 PM
Australia has the most deregulated gambling in the world and also the biggest gambling problem. The average Aussie loses more than double what the average Scot loses each year.
The new max bet rules are a good idea.


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I’ve worked in Perth a lot this year and have to say my own personal experiences don’t tally with this. Never saw a high street bookie, occasional advert on the telly for an online bookies but nothing like the 4 or 5 you get each commercial break here. Maybe the Aussies have actually cracked down on it?

Ozyhibby
22-11-2018, 08:50 PM
I’ve worked in Perth a lot this year and have to say my own personal experiences don’t tally with this. Never saw a high street bookie, occasional advert on the telly for an online bookies but nothing like the 4 or 5 you get each commercial break here. Maybe the Aussies have actually cracked down on it?

I haven’t been to WA but I know in NSW that ‘pokies’ (gambling machines) are in every pub. Only Nevada has more gambling machines than NSW and Australia is 6th in the world for the number of machines despite only having 20 million people.
There are no private high street bookie. Sports gambling is done through the TAB which has terminals in every pub.


https://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/mar/24/gaming-machine-count-puts-nsw-second-in-the-world


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Gloucester Hibs
22-11-2018, 08:57 PM
I haven’t been to WA but I know in NSW that ‘pokies’ (gambling machines) are in every pub. Only Nevada has more gambling machines than NSW and Australia is 6th in the world for the number of machines despite only having 20 million people.
There are no private high street bookie. Sports gambling is done through the TAB which has terminals in every pub.


https://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/mar/24/gaming-machine-count-puts-nsw-second-in-the-world


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Fair play mate, sounds like a similar problem, albeit done through slightly different channels as the U.K

Pete
22-11-2018, 09:03 PM
The poorest people in our society?


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Well I’d rather be homeless in Cuba than homeless in the Uk. Have you seen the weather?

stu in nottingham
22-11-2018, 09:16 PM
I'm not here to change anyone's opinion but here's a little insight into the other side of things which may or may not be ofinterest. I am employed by a registered charity as a psychologist, counselling gamblers and their families.

Each and every working day I see broken lives coming through my office, gamblers and their loved ones too who are innocently experiencing the fallout of a family member's addiction, children very much included. Outcomes for many include bankruptcy, loss of relationships and children, homelessness and prison sentences. Suicide is the ultimate tragedy occasionally and I have to say I have counselled many individuals who have attempted to take their own lives. General symptoms can include:

Criminal Activity
Feeling Isolated
Mental Health Problems
Domestic Abuse
Financial Difficulties
School/University Difficulties
Drug Misuse
General Health
Suicidal
Alcohol Misuse
Family/Relationship Difficulties
Housing Problems
Work Difficulties
Anxiety/Stress

These symptoms are not rare but everyday.

Gambling companies not only feed addiction but actively create and enhance them, often surreptitiously in my view, by carefully considered psychological strategies that induce people to gamble and relapse. It is not enough to only say that people are responsible for themselves (which they are). People are often only as 'good' as they can be in difficult circumstances. We may consider here unconditional positive regard for an individual. We have possibly all found ourselves doing inadvisable things in our lives and so judging on that is not appropriate in my view. Perhaps one of the greatest ironies is that a significant section of gamblers bet simply because they don't have enough money to live on - which of course never works and there follows an inevitable slide deeper into addiction and its negative effects on their lives. In what must now be thousands of clients I've treated I have never witnessed one single client bet their way out of trouble permanently. Not one.

What help is available? Well the casinos in the city I live in make huge reported profits and fixed-odds betting terminals (FOBTs) in betting shops contribute approximately fifty per cent of the gambling industry's profits. Ever wondered incidentally why there are just so many betting shops on the high street these days? It's because the law regulates each shop to a maximum of four FOBT machines only. They therefore open shop after shop with four more machines. In the meantime and by comparison, currently, I am the only individual in the East Midlands of England and parts of Lincolnshire (approx four million people catchment area) offering free funded help. You may imagine that many gamblers, deep into their addiction become unable to afford other professional treatment at around fifty pounds per hour. A classic catch-22 situation.

You can possibly understand what my attitude to the Bet365 owner making such huge profits might be - at the expense of much human suffering and even deaths - most often not just by the gamblers themselves but their innocent families.

Should anybody in Scotland require free help and support they can contact RCA Trust. Your best first port of call generally is the Gamcare Helpine or Netline which can be found at: www.gamcare.org.uk

For those finding things getting out of control with their online gambling I can thorughly recommend self exclusion via a scheme that began in May 2018 called Gamstop. www.gamstop.co.uk The scheme is completely free and takes around ten minutes to register to it online from their website.

As we say, if you should have a problem 'the worst thing to do is nothing'.

hibsbollah
22-11-2018, 09:21 PM
I'm not here to change anyone's opinion but here's a little insight into the other side of things which may or may not be ofinterest. I am employed by a registered charity as a psychologist, counselling gamblers and their families.

Each and every working day I see broken lives coming through my office, gamblers and their loved ones too who are innocently experiencing the fallout of a family member's addiction, children very much included. Outcomes for many include bankruptcy, loss of relationships and children, homelessness and prison sentences. Suicide is the ultimate tragedy occasionally and I have to say I have counselled many individuals who have attempted to take their own lives. General symptoms can include:

Criminal Activity
Feeling Isolated
Mental Health Problems
Domestic Abuse
Financial Difficulties
School/University Difficulties
Drug Misuse
General Health
Suicidal
Alcohol Misuse
Family/Relationship Difficulties
Housing Problems
Work Difficulties
Anxiety/Stress

These symptoms are not rare but everyday.

Gambling companies not only feed addiction but actively create and enhance them, often surreptitiously in my view, by carefully considered psychological strategies that induce people to gamble and relapse. It is not enough to only say that people are responsible for themselves (which they are). People are often only as 'good' as they can be in difficult circumstances. We may consider here unconditional positive regard for an individual. We have possibly all found ourselves doing inadvisable things in our lives and so judging on that is not appropriate in my view. Perhaps one of the greatest ironies is that a significant section of gamblers bet simply because they don't have enough money to live on - which of course never works and there follows an inevitable slide deeper into addiction and its negative effects on their lives. In what must now be thousands of clients I've treated I have never witnessed one single client bet their way out of trouble permanently. Not one.

What help is available? Well the casinos in the city I live in make huge reported profits and fixed-odds betting terminals (FOBTs) in betting shops contribute approximately fifty per cent of the gambling industry's profits. Ever wondered incidentally why there are just so many betting shops on the high street these days? It's because the law regulates each shop to a maximum of four FOBT machines only. They therefore open shop after shop with four more machines. In the meantime and by comparison, currently, I am the only individual in the East Midlands of England and parts of Lincolnshire (approx four million people catchment area) offering free funded help. You may imagine that many gamblers, deep into their addiction become unable to afford other professional treatment at around fifty pounds per hour. A classic catch-22 situation.

You can possibly understand what my attitude to the Bet365 owner making such huge profits might be - at the expense of much human suffering and even deaths - most often not just by the gamblers themselves but their innocent families.

Should anybody in Scotland require free help and support they can contact RCA Trust. Your best first port of call generally is the Gamcare Helpine or Netline which can be found at: www.gamcare.org.uk

For those finding things getting out of control with their online gambling I can thorughly recommend self exclusion via a scheme that began in May 2018 called Gamstop. www.gamstop.co.uk The scheme is completely free and takes around ten minutes to register to it online from their website.

As we say, if you should have a problem 'the worst thing to do is nothing'.

:top marks Thanks for the work you do.

Tornadoes70
22-11-2018, 09:22 PM
I'm not here to change anyone's opinion but here's a little insight into the other side of things which may or may not be ofinterest. I am employed by a registered charity as a psychologist, counselling gamblers and their families.

Each and every working day I see broken lives coming through my office, gamblers and their loved ones too who are innocently experiencing the fallout of a family member's addiction, children very much included. Outcomes for many include bankruptcy, loss of relationships and children, homelessness and prison sentences. Suicide is the ultimate tragedy occasionally and I have to say I have counselled many individuals who have attempted to take their own lives. General symptoms can include:

Criminal Activity
Feeling Isolated
Mental Health Problems
Domestic Abuse
Financial Difficulties
School/University Difficulties
Drug Misuse
General Health
Suicidal
Alcohol Misuse
Family/Relationship Difficulties
Housing Problems
Work Difficulties
Anxiety/Stress

These symptoms are not rare but everyday.

Gambling companies not only feed addiction but actively create and enhance them, often surreptitiously in my view, by carefully considered psychological strategies that induce people to gamble and relapse. It is not enough to only say that people are responsible for themselves (which they are). People are often only as 'good' as they can be in difficult circumstances. We may consider here unconditional positive regard for an individual. We have possibly all found ourselves doing inadvisable things in our lives and so judging on that is not appropriate in my view. Perhaps one of the greatest ironies is that a significant section of gamblers bet simply because they don't have enough money to live on - which of course never works and there follows an inevitable slide deeper into addiction and its negative effects on their lives. In what must now be thousands of clients I've treated I have never witnessed one single client bet their way out of trouble permanently. Not one.

What help is available? Well the casinos in the city I live in make huge reported profits and fixed-odds betting terminals (FOBTs) in betting shops contribute approximately fifty per cent of the gambling industry's profits. Ever wondered incidentally why there are just so many betting shops on the high street these days? It's because the law regulates each shop to a maximum of four FOBT machines only. They therefore open shop after shop with four more machines. In the meantime and by comparison, currently, I am the only individual in the East Midlands of England and parts of Lincolnshire (approx four million people catchment area) offering free funded help. You may imagine that many gamblers, deep into their addiction become unable to afford other professional treatment at around fifty pounds per hour. A classic catch-22 situation.

You can possibly understand what my attitude to the Bet365 owner making such huge profits might be - at the expense of much human suffering and even deaths - most often not just by the gamblers themselves but their innocent families.

Should anybody in Scotland require free help and support they can contact RCA Trust. Your best first port of call generally is the Gamcare Helpine or Netline which can be found at: www.gamcare.org.uk (http://www.gamcare.org.uk)

For those finding things getting out of control with their online gambling I can thorughly recommend self exclusion via a scheme that began in May 2018 called Gamstop. www.gamstop.co.uk (http://www.gamstop.co.uk) The scheme is completely free and takes around ten minutes to register to it online from their website.

As we say, if you should have a problem 'the worst thing to do is nothing'.

:top marks

Great post. Every part of it makes complete sense and applaud you for trying to help folk who're at their wits end. :aok:

Gloucester Hibs
22-11-2018, 09:22 PM
Great post Stu.

Ozyhibby
22-11-2018, 09:42 PM
I'm not here to change anyone's opinion but here's a little insight into the other side of things which may or may not be ofinterest. I am employed by a registered charity as a psychologist, counselling gamblers and their families.

Each and every working day I see broken lives coming through my office, gamblers and their loved ones too who are innocently experiencing the fallout of a family member's addiction, children very much included. Outcomes for many include bankruptcy, loss of relationships and children, homelessness and prison sentences. Suicide is the ultimate tragedy occasionally and I have to say I have counselled many individuals who have attempted to take their own lives. General symptoms can include:

Criminal Activity
Feeling Isolated
Mental Health Problems
Domestic Abuse
Financial Difficulties
School/University Difficulties
Drug Misuse
General Health
Suicidal
Alcohol Misuse
Family/Relationship Difficulties
Housing Problems
Work Difficulties
Anxiety/Stress

These symptoms are not rare but everyday.

Gambling companies not only feed addiction but actively create and enhance them, often surreptitiously in my view, by carefully considered psychological strategies that induce people to gamble and relapse. It is not enough to only say that people are responsible for themselves (which they are). People are often only as 'good' as they can be in difficult circumstances. We may consider here unconditional positive regard for an individual. We have possibly all found ourselves doing inadvisable things in our lives and so judging on that is not appropriate in my view. Perhaps one of the greatest ironies is that a significant section of gamblers bet simply because they don't have enough money to live on - which of course never works and there follows an inevitable slide deeper into addiction and its negative effects on their lives. In what must now be thousands of clients I've treated I have never witnessed one single client bet their way out of trouble permanently. Not one.

What help is available? Well the casinos in the city I live in make huge reported profits and fixed-odds betting terminals (FOBTs) in betting shops contribute approximately fifty per cent of the gambling industry's profits. Ever wondered incidentally why there are just so many betting shops on the high street these days? It's because the law regulates each shop to a maximum of four FOBT machines only. They therefore open shop after shop with four more machines. In the meantime and by comparison, currently, I am the only individual in the East Midlands of England and parts of Lincolnshire (approx four million people catchment area) offering free funded help. You may imagine that many gamblers, deep into their addiction become unable to afford other professional treatment at around fifty pounds per hour. A classic catch-22 situation.

You can possibly understand what my attitude to the Bet365 owner making such huge profits might be - at the expense of much human suffering and even deaths - most often not just by the gamblers themselves but their innocent families.

Should anybody in Scotland require free help and support they can contact RCA Trust. Your best first port of call generally is the Gamcare Helpine or Netline which can be found at: www.gamcare.org.uk

For those finding things getting out of control with their online gambling I can thorughly recommend self exclusion via a scheme that began in May 2018 called Gamstop. www.gamstop.co.uk The scheme is completely free and takes around ten minutes to register to it online from their website.

As we say, if you should have a problem 'the worst thing to do is nothing'.

Great work. I would never ban gambling but I would restrict its advertising in the same way we do for cigarettes.


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neil7908
22-11-2018, 10:06 PM
I'm not here to change anyone's opinion but here's a little insight into the other side of things which may or may not be ofinterest. I am employed by a registered charity as a psychologist, counselling gamblers and their families.

Each and every working day I see broken lives coming through my office, gamblers and their loved ones too who are innocently experiencing the fallout of a family member's addiction, children very much included. Outcomes for many include bankruptcy, loss of relationships and children, homelessness and prison sentences. Suicide is the ultimate tragedy occasionally and I have to say I have counselled many individuals who have attempted to take their own lives. General symptoms can include:

Criminal Activity
Feeling Isolated
Mental Health Problems
Domestic Abuse
Financial Difficulties
School/University Difficulties
Drug Misuse
General Health
Suicidal
Alcohol Misuse
Family/Relationship Difficulties
Housing Problems
Work Difficulties
Anxiety/Stress

These symptoms are not rare but everyday.

Gambling companies not only feed addiction but actively create and enhance them, often surreptitiously in my view, by carefully considered psychological strategies that induce people to gamble and relapse. It is not enough to only say that people are responsible for themselves (which they are). People are often only as 'good' as they can be in difficult circumstances. We may consider here unconditional positive regard for an individual. We have possibly all found ourselves doing inadvisable things in our lives and so judging on that is not appropriate in my view. Perhaps one of the greatest ironies is that a significant section of gamblers bet simply because they don't have enough money to live on - which of course never works and there follows an inevitable slide deeper into addiction and its negative effects on their lives. In what must now be thousands of clients I've treated I have never witnessed one single client bet their way out of trouble permanently. Not one.

What help is available? Well the casinos in the city I live in make huge reported profits and fixed-odds betting terminals (FOBTs) in betting shops contribute approximately fifty per cent of the gambling industry's profits. Ever wondered incidentally why there are just so many betting shops on the high street these days? It's because the law regulates each shop to a maximum of four FOBT machines only. They therefore open shop after shop with four more machines. In the meantime and by comparison, currently, I am the only individual in the East Midlands of England and parts of Lincolnshire (approx four million people catchment area) offering free funded help. You may imagine that many gamblers, deep into their addiction become unable to afford other professional treatment at around fifty pounds per hour. A classic catch-22 situation.

You can possibly understand what my attitude to the Bet365 owner making such huge profits might be - at the expense of much human suffering and even deaths - most often not just by the gamblers themselves but their innocent families.

Should anybody in Scotland require free help and support they can contact RCA Trust. Your best first port of call generally is the Gamcare Helpine or Netline which can be found at: www.gamcare.org.uk

For those finding things getting out of control with their online gambling I can thorughly recommend self exclusion via a scheme that began in May 2018 called Gamstop. www.gamstop.co.uk The scheme is completely free and takes around ten minutes to register to it online from their website.

As we say, if you should have a problem 'the worst thing to do is nothing'.

But capitalism, they provide jobs, it's all legal etc.

Seriously though, you do a excellent work in what sounds like incredibly challenging circumstances. Please keep going.

Ozyhibby
22-11-2018, 10:50 PM
But capitalism, they provide jobs, it's all legal etc.

Seriously though, you do a excellent work in what sounds like incredibly challenging circumstances. Please keep going.

I’d happily ban it if I thought it would work but it wouldn’t and an underground gambling market in the hands of criminal gangs would be infinitely worse.


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Speedy
22-11-2018, 10:59 PM
Bookies in this country literally can't lose.

If they see a pattern of a punter winning they simply close the account and don't allow them to bet anymore. It happened to a mate of mine who won a relatively small amount of a few thousand over a couple of months and they closed the account. How often do bookies close your account if you are losing? Never. You can lose millions and they will be quite happy to keep taking your money. If you are winning? Sorry we don't want you business , goodbye.

It's illegal in countries in Europe for bookmakers to close accounts of winning players but for some reason it's perfectly acceptable in this country and it's a disgrace to be honest.

Bet365 are particularly bad with this.

Pretty Boy
22-11-2018, 11:34 PM
I'm a bit conflicted with how I feel about gambling and it's regulation.

For a long while I was a compulsive gambler, I hesitate to use the word addict. Online gambling never held much appeal for me; I just loved being in the bookies and would happily spend hours reading form, chatting to people and placing bets. When my girlfriend worked weekends I could happily sped whole Saturdays and Sundays in various bookies as well as the odd couple of hours here and there during the week. I was never under the illusion that I could 'beat' the bookies, when a CEO is walking away with £265M you'd have to be a fool to believe that. However I did live for the days I walked away with a few hundred pound in my pocket; I paid for a 2 week holiday from 2 weekends of 'successful' betting although I'm certain if I added things up gambling prevented a few more holidays than it paid for. The FOBTs never really captivated me although I did play them. I always regarded myself as a 'typical gambler' in that I bet on almost anything; on a Saturday I'd jump from horses to dogs to football to boxing and back again. It was actually a post by Stu in the Holy Ground on here that taught me I'm actually quite atypical of the problem gambler and it's far more usual for people to be drawn to one particular area of gambling. I think that's where the dangers lie with FOBTs in particular, they play so quickly that it's easy to lose hundreds in minutes. With a bad day on the horses there's always a few minutes breathing space between races to take stock.

I still enjoy a bet from time to time and being totally honest I wouldn't like to see gambling banned although I accept tighter regulation is definitely required. I couldn't tell you when I last had a bet (a 4 team acca at some point this season rings a bell) but with the NH season upon us I'll have 1 or 2 punts over the winter and Cheltenham is still a highlight of my year. I can't think of any particular reason why my gambling slowed down to almost nothing. I didn't lose a house, my family or whatever and the ads and temptations are still there. If I took a guess it's probably because I like being in control; there was an element of wanting to feel like I was in control when I started gambling and when it started to become a problem trying to wrestle back control was probably the buzz. I suppose I'm just lucky I was able to do that before I reached a stage where I had a real problem on my hands.

stu in nottingham
23-11-2018, 12:09 AM
Interesting comments PB, many thanks. One thing I am reminded of by what you say (and I really don't personally enjoy labels or find them helpful) is a comment by a prominent Professor in addiction I have been acquainted with. He attempted to define the difference between 'addiction' and 'habit'. In his view, addiction always takes away from one's life whilst habit does not necessarily do that, (think of drinking, say, five cups of tea/coffee a day for example as a habit).

Gambling can be that way too of course, unfortunately it's a very unpredictable outcome where it might lead. I tend to attempt to add a little perspective in these things and consider the potential gains (i.e. winning some cash) as against the potential losses (feeding and encouraging a potentially life-long and life-wrecking addiction.) Interestingly, I find that many gamblers have lost sight of this perspective and balance.



I'm a bit conflicted with how I feel about gambling and it's regulation.

For a long while I was a compulsive gambler, I hesitate to use the word addict. Online gambling never held much appeal for me; I just loved being in the bookies and would happily spend hours reading form, chatting to people and placing bets. When my girlfriend worked weekends I could happily sped whole Saturdays and Sundays in various bookies as well as the odd couple of hours here and there during the week. I was never under the illusion that I could 'beat' the bookies, when a CEO is walking away with £265M you'd have to be a fool to believe that. However I did live for the days I walked away with a few hundred pound in my pocket; I paid for a 2 week holiday from 2 weekends of 'successful' betting although I'm certain if I added things up gambling prevented a few more holidays than it paid for. The FOBTs never really captivated me although I did play them. I always regarded myself as a 'typical gambler' in that I bet on almost anything; on a Saturday I'd jump from horses to dogs to football to boxing and back again. It was actually a post by Stu in the Holy Ground on here that taught me I'm actually quite atypical of the problem gambler and it's far more usual for people to be drawn to one particular area of gambling. I think that's where the dangers lie with FOBTs in particular, they play so quickly that it's easy to lose hundreds in minutes. With a bad day on the horses there's always a few minutes breathing space between races to take stock.

I still enjoy a bet from time to time and being totally honest I wouldn't like to see gambling banned although I accept tighter regulation is definitely required. I couldn't tell you when I last had a bet (a 4 team acca at some point this season rings a bell) but with the NH season upon us I'll have 1 or 2 punts over the winter and Cheltenham is still a highlight of my year. I can't think of any particular reason why my gambling slowed down to almost nothing. I didn't lose a house, my family or whatever and the ads and temptations are still there. If I took a guess it's probably because I like being in control; there was an element of wanting to feel like I was in control when I started gambling and when it started to become a problem trying to wrestle back control was probably the buzz. I suppose I'm just lucky I was able to do that before I reached a stage where I had a real problem on my hands.

The 90+2
23-11-2018, 01:04 AM
A part of me lives for gambling to be honest and the thought of stopping frightens the **** out of me. I don’t gamble as nearly as much as I used to because I have children and they’re provided for but after that I’m raging when I can’t put a bet on over a weekend or at night. Take just now, I’m up at 6.30 for work but I’m still up contemplating more bets on the next NFL game. Bet365 is the best out there also to be honest. I even use their app to check scores when no bets are on, which usually leads to a cheeky wee bet.

Ozyhibby
23-11-2018, 09:27 AM
A part of me lives for gambling to be honest and the thought of stopping frightens the **** out of me. I don’t gamble as nearly as much as I used to because I have children and they’re provided for but after that I’m raging when I can’t put a bet on over a weekend or at night. Take just now, I’m up at 6.30 for work but I’m still up contemplating more bets on the next NFL game. Bet365 is the best out there also to be honest. I even use their app to check scores when no bets are on, which usually leads to a cheeky wee bet.

It’s your money and your entitled to spend it how you wish. Lots of harm can be caused by gambling but lots of people thoroughly enjoy it with no harm at all. Much like alcohol. I’ve never really gambled but I know lots that do who love putting on a bet.
I would restrict the advertising but banning gambling would be a disaster.


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stu in nottingham
23-11-2018, 11:05 AM
A part of me lives for gambling to be honest and the thought of stopping frightens the **** out of me. I don’t gamble as nearly as much as I used to because I have children and they’re provided for but after that I’m raging when I can’t put a bet on over a weekend or at night. Take just now, I’m up at 6.30 for work but I’m still up contemplating more bets on the next NFL game. Bet365 is the best out there also to be honest. I even use their app to check scores when no bets are on, which usually leads to a cheeky wee bet.

The part I've emboldened above really resonates with many of the clients I see. There is an (understable) fear of stopping felt by many. A significant section of client I see arrive at their initial session very tense and anxious (occasionally, some have a wee bet on the way there!) A fraction of that might be attributed to wondering what they're going to face, will they be given a hard time etc. (absolutely the opposite is true) but much more it's about finally facing up to a difficult problem which I can really empathise with.

People who gamble can be quite frightened of their urges and cravings, they can feel threatened by them and that the urges will always be in control of them. This is far from the truth in actually it though. To begin with, for the majority of people the cravings last a relatively short period of time - maybe 1-5 minutes or even just seconds. People sometimes feel it's longer because they tend to arrive in waves throughout a period of time, especially during inactivity.

Here's the good news though.

I often ask clients what do they feel creates gambling urges and seldom do they understand why. Basically though, urges and cravings are simply caused by reinforced gambling behaviour - it's the gambling itself that creates further urges to gamble and therefor a person becomes trapped in a vicious cycle of gambling-urges-gambling.

An intervention is usually necessary intitially that takes of the following away:

Money - (say by having your cash looked after for a period
The Means - (your phone/ betting shop/casino etc.)
Time - (Distracting yourself and keeping busy with other activities can help hugely.)

When the cycle becomes broken by behavioural changes such as the above the urges begin to decrease, you are not doing the very thing that creates the urges. Statistically this might be a decreasing pattern for say, a few months, people often tell me that the urges decrease quite drastically after a bout four weeks though. It becomes easier and easier, there's just a need to agree to that intervention and life quickly changes for the better.

Liam6270
23-11-2018, 02:00 PM
Fair play to her, she’s worked hard and is now reaping the rewards.

Killiehibbie
23-11-2018, 02:11 PM
Fair play to her, she’s worked hard and is now reaping the rewards.Nothing fair in the way they operate. They should be made to offer fair play for all punters.

KWJ
23-11-2018, 02:28 PM
I haven’t been to WA but I know in NSW that ‘pokies’ (gambling machines) are in every pub. Only Nevada has more gambling machines than NSW and Australia is 6th in the world for the number of machines despite only having 20 million people.
There are no private high street bookie. Sports gambling is done through the TAB which has terminals in every pub.



https://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/mar/24/gaming-machine-count-puts-nsw-second-in-the-world


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But they are closed off in their own rooms or behind a curtain that are generally pretty dingy. You may get free tea and coffee though.

TABs in the pub are a bit mental and don't help anyone. But (and I'm going back a couple years here) they remain a bit old school in that it's football, dogs and horses as well as being rather complicated with the 3 totes. It's far less enticing.

Not sure where you live now but UK is a considerably worse environment for betting.

KWJ
23-11-2018, 02:34 PM
I'm glad this thread has returned to the major problem and issue that I took from the OP. Gambling in this country is mental and completely out of control.

EA sports and other games I'm less aware of can build up gambling appetites and give kids and adults that "one more pack" mentality. Nowhere I've been in the world (I've not been to Vegas!) Pushes you more into gambling and provides that platform than the UK. It is inescapable here.

Even the latest sky bet ad which is showing you ways you can control your gambling is done in a see how good we are, lose your money to us way.

"When the fun stops, stop." Too late for that when you're addicted eh.