Nations League

[theonlywayisup]

Ignoring how Scotland are performing and the fact it disrupts the domestic football season, I actually like the idea of the Nations League. As we've seen this week there are a lot of interesting games and even the minnows have something to play for.

The BBC summarise all the permutations here.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/46154317

In the top tier, England and Croatia can go into the game with both teams capable of finishing first in their group and going into the Nations League semi or could be relegated. Netherlands could win their group of they avoid defeat at relegated Germany and pipping France for the top spot.

Loads of other permutations. Great for the football fan.

Pity Scotland are not in a higher league but maybe that will change this weekend.

Apologies, can't get link to work.

[danhibees1875]

I agree. I like it. Adds something a bit extra, gives teams a realistic chance of qualifying for something by playing teams of a similar standard to them. This weekend is the start of Scotland's best chance to qualify for something in many years.

The semis and finals get played after regular qualifying, but does the nations league get played through every 2 years? I'm not sure if it also has a route for world cup qualifying or if it's just euro qualifying.

[EH54]

I like the idea of it, but we are still playing friendly matches, this nations league was supposed to be instead of friendly's. There is far too many internationals. No need for it, Most people put clubs before country, with all these internationals it's easy to get fed up and frustrated. Must be the same for the players. Very boring, not a novelty anymore.

[Sir David Gray]

I agree. I like it. Adds something a bit extra, gives teams a realistic chance of qualifying for something by playing teams of a similar standard to them. This weekend is the start of Scotland's best chance to qualify for something in many years.

The semis and finals get played after regular qualifying, but does the nations league get played through every 2 years? I'm not sure if it also has a route for world cup qualifying or if it's just euro qualifying.

Yes it is every two years, the next one will be in 2020/21 and it is proposed that this competition will allow for European teams to qualify for the 2022 World Cup although there has been no confirmation of this yet.


I like the idea of it, but we are still playing friendly matches, this nations league was supposed to be instead of friendly's. There is far too many internationals. No need for it, Most people put clubs before country, with all these internationals it's easy to get fed up and frustrated. Must be the same for the players. Very boring, not a novelty anymore.

It's designed to reduce the number of friendlies, not cut them out altogether.

[Ozyhibby]

Hard to get excited by anything the SFA is up to to be honest although I have a 12 year old and he is gutted by how terrible we are, so it can’t say I don’t care. Wish I didn’t though.


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[EH54]

Yes it is every two years, the next one will be in 2020/21 and it is proposed that this competition will allow for European teams to qualify for the 2022 World Cup although there has been no confirmation of this yet.



It's designed to reduce the number of friendlies, not cut them out altogether.

If your playing nations league and euro/World Cup qualifiers that should be more than enough. Piece of nonsense all these internationals.

[H18 SFR]

I'm delighted to see so many players pulling out, international football should be WC and EC. The nations league is simply a way to generate more money and in doing so take money out of every day fans pockets.

[Keith_M]

It's a League for crappy wee teams, and despite that Scotland still look crap in comparison.

[we are hibs]

International friendlies are a complete waste of time. The nations league is our best chance of qualifying for a tournament and we should be taking it seriously. We won't qualify for the euros though. We won't even get to the next phase of this imo. A loss tonight and a draw on Tuesday.

[Keith_M]

International friendlies are a complete waste of time. The nations league is our best chance of qualifying for a tournament and we should be taking it seriously. We won't qualify for the euros though. We won't even get to the next phase of this imo. A loss tonight and a draw on Tuesday.


So what's the point?

:dunno:


Not a dig at you, by the way.

[we are hibs]

So what's the point?

:dunno:


Not a dig at you, by the way.


If we ever have a decent football team again we will have a better chance of qualifying. If we weren't so bad atm people would view this tournament differently.

[Moulin Yarns]

It's a League for crappy wee teams, and despite that Scotland still look crap in comparison.

Tell that to Germany, just relegated in their group.

[G B Young]

Ignoring how Scotland are performing and the fact it disrupts the domestic football season, I actually like the idea of the Nations League. As we've seen this week there are a lot of interesting games and even the minnows have something to play for.

The BBC summarise all the permutations here.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/46154317

In the top tier, England and Croatia can go into the game with both teams capable of finishing first in their group and going into the Nations League semi or could be relegated. Netherlands could win their group of they avoid defeat at relegated Germany and pipping France for the top spot.

Loads of other permutations. Great for the football fan.

Pity Scotland are not in a higher league but maybe that will change this weekend.

Apologies, can't get link to work.

I don't get the point of it to be honest. I'd suggest the point of World Cups and European Championships is to showcase the best teams around. By grouping the Nations League teams together in terms of their stature (eg Scotland along with fellow fourth-tier nations Israel and Albania) it seems to offer a back door route for some really poor teams to qualify at the expense of those who play the best football. There are already too many teams at the major championships. Quantity does not equate to quality.

[Frazerbob]

I'm delighted to see so many players pulling out, international football should be WC and EC. The nations league is simply a way to generate more money and in doing so take money out of every day fans pockets.

You need to qualify for those somehow. What about the fans who love following their country?

Edit: posted from the road from Tirana to Shkoder on a bus full of pals having a magic time in Albania.

[H18 SFR]

You need to qualify for those somehow. What about the fans who love following their country?

Edit: posted from the road from Tirana to Shkoder on a bus full of pals having a magic time in Albania.

Previously a ten pointer myself back in the day so fully understand the magic time with pals aspect. Sadly I'm not convinced you'd have any worse a time of you were there with mates not for a Scotland game.

[Leith Green]

I don't get the point of it to be honest. I'd suggest the point of World Cups and European Championships is to showcase the best teams around. By grouping the Nations League teams together in terms of their stature (eg Scotland along with fellow fourth-tier nations Israel and Albania) it seems to offer a back door route for some really poor teams to qualify at the expense of those who play the best football. There are already too many teams at the major championships. Quantity does not equate to quality.


It has been really good for the smaller nations to actually play competitive games which they have a chance of winning.

[BS44]

Just caught the end of Chick Young on Sportsound, did I pick him up correctly that if we lose today we drop down a pot and would be in the same seeding's as Lichtenstein, San Marino and other not so good football countries

[danhibees1875]

Just caught the end of Chick Young on Sportsound, did I pick him up correctly that if we lose today we drop down a pot and would be in the same seeding's as Lichtenstein, San Marino and other not so good football countries

No. Even if we lose, we could still beat Israel on Tuesday and end up top of the group once head to heads are considered.

Winning the group would put us up to league B with teams such as Poland, Germany, and England/Croatia. Where we'd get relegated promptly back down. :greengrin following that trend of yo-yo-ing would be advantageous to our qualification prospects every 4 years though.

[bingo70]

Just caught the end of Chick Young on Sportsound, did I pick him up correctly that if we lose today we drop down a pot and would be in the same seeding's as Lichtenstein, San Marino and other not so good football countries

I read earlier that the result of this game is largely irrelevant. Regardless of the result we’ll still need to beat Israel next week.

Only exception to that would be if we get pumped 3 nil.

[Hibbyradge]

I'm delighted to see so many players pulling out, international football should be WC and EC. The nations league is simply a way to generate more money and in doing so take money out of every day fans pockets.

They're not taking any more money out of my pocket.

Not yours, presumably.

It's a choice thing. :wink:

[Frazerbob]

Previously a ten pointer myself back in the day so fully understand the magic time with pals aspect. Sadly I'm not convinced you'd have any worse a time of you were there with mates not for a Scotland game.

That very topic has been discussed but there’s no way the extended group of mates from all corners of the country and all walks of life would get their act together without the focal point of the game. It just doesn’t happen in ‘normal life’.

[CMurdoch]

Short and sweet.
Nations League is much better than playing friendlies.
All friendlies are a waste of time for all concerned, including those played by Hibs, and should be avoided by players and supporters like the plague.

[BILLYHIBS]

Are we relegated yet?

[SJNB Hibby]

I like the idea of it, but we are still playing friendly matches, this nations league was supposed to be instead of friendly's. There is far too many internationals. No need for it, Most people put clubs before country, with all these internationals it's easy to get fed up and frustrated. Must be the same for the players. Very boring, not a novelty anymore.

Because we are in (1 of many) group(s) of 3:confused:
If UEFA want to get rid of friendly's, all groups should consist of 4 teams

[danhibees1875]

Because we are in (1 of many) group(s) of 3:confused:
If UEFA want to get rid of friendly's, all groups should consist of 4 teams

Would they want to get rid of friendlies? Countries would be limited to only playing teams they were drawn against and only from their continent - I guess that would be something new to moan about at least.

[SJNB Hibby]

Would they want to get rid of friendlies? Countries would be limited to only playing teams they were drawn against and only from their continent - I guess that would be something new to moan about at least.

Plenty of opportunities for friendly's, play-off weeks for countries not involved(every other year) immediate lead up to competitions(every other year) summers when there's no competitions(every other year)
I'm getting fed up with a bunch of no names getting 1 or 2 caps on the basis of a mass second half swathe of substitutions

[danhibees1875]

Plenty of opportunities for friendly's, play-off weeks for countries not involved(every other year) immediate lead up to competitions(every other year) summers when there's no competitions(every other year)
I'm getting fed up with a bunch of no names getting 1 or 2 caps on the basis of a mass second half swathe of substitutions

Maybe I've misunderstood - I thought the argument was that people didn't want friendlies? :confused:

Don't see the issue with players getting a run out - everyone was pretty happy for Stevenson recently.

[The 90+2]

For the first time in my life I hope Scotland lose both games tonget a new manager in. At least that way we may still have a pop at the Euros. 3-1 Albania

[Billy Whizz]

For the first time in my life I hope Scotland lose both games tonget a new manager in. At least that way we may still have a pop at the Euros. 3-1 Albania

Should never want your National or club team to lose, in a competitive game

[CMurdoch]

Should never want your National or club team to lose, in a competitive game

Definitely not, I have only just got over losing to St Johnstone!
A loss tonight could set me back weeks

[EH54]

Considering taking back my previous comments. It's great when your winning eh..🙄

[Lancs Harp]

For the first time in my life I hope Scotland lose both games tonget a new manager in. At least that way we may still have a pop at the Euros. 3-1 Albania

Hope your night isnt too bad. I've quite enjoyed Scotlands performance and I'm English :greengrin (albeit pretty pro Anglo Scot). Played very well tonight.

[ionahibby]

Decent performance against a pretty Poor Albania. I genuinely think having all the call offs has allowed some players to shine a bit. Can anyone confirm so if we win group we go into a playoff to go into the Euro 2020 playoff? Or is it straight into euro 2020 playoff?

[danhibees1875]

Decent performance against a pretty Poor Albania. I genuinely think having all the call offs has allowed some players to shine a bit. Can anyone confirm so if we win group we go into a playoff to go into the Euro 2020 playoff? Or is it straight into euro 2020 playoff?

It depends if we qualify from the normal qualification process. If we don't (which lets face it, we won't :greengrin ) then us and the 3 other league C group winners would play in a semi final and then final for a place in Euro 2020.

[MWHIBBIES]

It hadn't disrupted the season, same amount of breaks as last season and the one before.

[PatHead]

It depends if we qualify from the normal qualification process. If we don't (which lets face it, we won't :greengrin ) then us and the 3 other league C group winners would play in a semi final and then final for a place in Euro 2020.

Just now the three other league leaders are Finland, Serbia and Norway.

[Moulin Yarns]

The 3 team groups make for interesting possibilities. England win and they top the group, lose and they will be relegated.

Edit :winner takes all game, draw suits nobody.

C'mon Croatia 🇭🇷

[neil7908]

Decent performance against a pretty Poor Albania. I genuinely think having all the call offs has allowed some players to shine a bit. Can anyone confirm so if we win group we go into a playoff to go into the Euro 2020 playoff? Or is it straight into euro 2020 playoff?

I think we're seeing the benefits of not shoehorning Tierney into the team. Yes he's a very good player but we're playing him out of position and it's a square peg in a round hole.

It feels like last night we had players that really want to play for Scotland and are generally in they're preferred positions. That can make a world of difference.

IMO anyone who pulled out of the squad for dubious reasons should not be getting let back in easily.

[Green Man]

The 3 team groups make for interesting possibilities. England win and they top the group, lose and they will be relegated.

Edit :winner takes all game, draw suits nobody.

C'mon Croatia 🇭🇷

If I’ve worked it out correctly, a goalless draw relegates Croatia, a score draw relegates England.

[Moulin Yarns]

If I’ve worked it out correctly, a goalless draw relegates Croatia, a score draw relegates England.

Think so. 😁

[Sir David Gray]

If I’ve worked it out correctly, a goalless draw relegates Croatia, a score draw relegates England.

Correct.

England win - They top the group and Croatia are relegated.
Croatia win - They top the group and England are relegated.
0-0 draw - Spain top, England 2nd and Croatia relegated.
Score draw - Spain top, Croatia 2nd and England relegated.

[PatHead]

I see Northern Ireland lost again today. 2 wins in their last 13 games.

Maybe we dodged a bullet with Michael O’Neill?

[bingo70]

I see Northern Ireland lost again today. 2 wins in their last 13 games.

Maybe we dodged a bullet with Michael O’Neill?

Think that’s just a result of them punching above their weight under him. I’m sure if they’d been in a lower pool they’d have had a better record. Pool C is probably a fairer reflection of their abilities.

FWIW I also watched their home game against Bosnia on the tele a month or two back and they absolutely battered them, they somehow ended up getting beat but it was one of the most unfortunate losses I’ve ever seen.

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

Good game on SKY just now, Switzerland 2 Spain 2 after half an hour.

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

3-2 to The Swiss.

[Iggy Pope]

Good game on SKY just now, Switzerland 2 Spain 2 after half an hour.

Bloody Spain desperate to sneak into any old group! Belgium 3-2 down.

[The_Horde]

Disrupting our season IMO but I do like it.

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

Bloody Spain desperate to sneak into any old group! Belgium 3-2 down.

Oops! 😄

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

4-2

[Lancs Harp]

Great game between Switzerland and Belgium. To be fair a great initiative from UEFA, there have been some great and entertaining games, much better than next to meaningless friendlies. Scotland even won 4-0 away FFS :wink::greengrin

[HUTCHYHIBBY]

5-2

[harpo]

What a performance by the Swiss

[CMurdoch]

What a performance by the Swiss

Swiss Rolled them

[The 90+2]

Swiss Rolled them

Belgium left with Brussel sprout.

[G B Young]

It has been really good for the smaller nations to actually play competitive games which they have a chance of winning.

That would be fine if the smaller nations (including Scotland) were playing in an international equivalent of the Irn-Bru Cup which didn't involve the top nations. However, if I'm reading things right, the Nations League gives these teams a potential back door route to the European Championships by winning an easy group and then a play-off. Why reward that kind of mediocrity at the expense of better sides who would enhance, rather than reduce the quality of the main tournament? Rewarding mediocrity is surely not the way to improve the quality of football across the board.

[Diclonius]

I'm far more interested in (non-Scotland) Nations League games than I am the Euro/WC qualifiers. Something to play for in almost every game and between teams of similar stature so they're always competitive. A welcome addition to the calendar, as long as England don't ****ing win it. :grr:

[Sylar]

So what happens if we manage to win tomorrow night and win Group C1? Do we get promoted into Group B1, or does our landing spot get drawn out of some hat?

[Oscar T Grouch]

So what happens if we manage to win tomorrow night and win Group C1? Do we get promoted into Group B1, or does our landing spot get drawn out of some hat?

From my understanding we get promoted to Group B, which will be drawn again in the next Nations Cup. We win and don't qualify through normal channels we go into a semi final against another Group C winner then subsequently into a final game against the winner of the other semi final, the winner of that qualifies for Euro 2020. I think this is how it works anyway :greengrin

Edit, if we come 2nd and Israel qualify thru normal channels we go into the play off semi final but we stay in Group C for the next nations cup.

[CropleyWasGod]

From my understanding we get promoted to Group B, which will be drawn again in the next Nations Cup. We win and don't qualify through normal channels we go into a semi final against another Group C winner then subsequently into a final game against the winner of the other semi final, the winner of that qualifies for Euro 2020. I think this is how it works anyway :greengrin

Presumably, it will affect our seedings for the coming Euro draw, no?

Which means we would avoid Germany :greengrin

[Oscar T Grouch]

Presumably, it will affect our seedings for the coming Euro draw, no?

Which means we would avoid Germany :greengrin

My depth of knowledge on the Nations Cup is as deep as a puddle CWG, beyond what I typed I am as ever a bit confused :wink:

[Golden Bear]

This is all very well but ultimately the interruptions will have an adverse effect on the domestic leagues. Attendance at football games is a habit thing and when the habit is interrupted then my guess is that the international weekends will have a detrimental effect on future season ticket sales. I can't imagine that Club Managers will welcome additional games either.

[Diclonius]

Presumably, it will affect our seedings for the coming Euro draw, no?

Which means we would avoid Germany :greengrin

To be guaranteed pot 3 for the main qualifying draw we have to win the group. If we come second then it's down to how the other second placed teams do - if we have less points than two of them, we're in pot 4.

[PatHead]

This is all very well but ultimately the interruptions will have an adverse effect on the domestic leagues. Attendance at football games is a habit thing and when the habit is interrupted then my guess is that the international weekends will have a detrimental effect on future season ticket sales. I can't imagine that Club Managers will welcome additional games either.
On the whole I would agree with you, but a successful international team would help stimulate interest in Scottish football generally.

[CropleyWasGod]

To be guaranteed pot 3 for the main qualifying draw we have to win the group. If we come second then it's down to how the other second placed teams do - if we have less points than two of them, we're in pot 4.

Scoobied now.

If we win our group, we're promoted. Does that not mean we're in the second top group?

Or is that irrelevant?

[Frazerbob]

This is all very well but ultimately the interruptions will have an adverse effect on the domestic leagues. Attendance at football games is a habit thing and when the habit is interrupted then my guess is that the international weekends will have a detrimental effect on future season ticket sales. I can't imagine that Club Managers will welcome additional games either.

The international breaks stil happened pre Nations League. The FIFA dates are set years in advance. They’re now being used better.

[PatHead]

Scoobied now.

If we win our group, we're promoted. Does that not mean we're in the second top group?

Or is that irrelevant?

Yes we will be in the second top group of teams but the section will not be drawn until the next tournament. There will be 4 sections.

[CropleyWasGod]

Yes we will be in the second top group of teams but the section will not be drawn until the next tournament. There will be 4 sections.

...but but but... I'm talking about the draw for the upcoming Euro qualifiers.

Does promotion to G2 not put us in the second pot ?

[PatHead]

...but but but... I'm talking about the draw for the upcoming Euro qualifiers.

Does promotion to G2 not put us in the second pot ?

Thought that was based on ranking
S?

[hibby6270]

A wee bit more info. Forget about Nations League for now. More later.

Euro 2020 qualifier groups are drawn in 2nd December 2018. Not sure what ‘pot’ Scotland will be in though but it’s not really important.

There will be 10 groups. 5 rounds of double games in March, June, Sept, Oct & Nov 2019.
Simple qualification. 1st & 2nd from each group go straight to Euro 2020.
That’s 20 teams in total but we need 24, so where do the other 4 come from?

Simples!!

The ‘top’ teams from each of the Nations League Groups who DON’T QUALIFY DIRECT in the 20 teams above will play-off (2 Semis and a Final) in March 2020. So 1 team from each of Leagues 1 to 4 will have this ‘back door’ second chance of qualifying for Euro 2020 in to be played in June 2020 across 12 various venues in 12 different countries. Hampden is one of those venues. If Scotland were to qualify though, they couldn’t play their games at Hampden as I understand it.

There you go. Think that about covers it. Plain as mud. Double simples!!!!:greengrin:greengrin

[Sir David Gray]

A wee bit more info. Forget about Nations League for now. More later.

Euro 2020 qualifier groups are drawn in 2nd December 2018. Not sure what ‘pot’ Scotland will be in though but it’s not really important.

There will be 10 groups. 5 rounds of double games in March, June, Sept, Oct & Nov 2019.
Simple qualification. 1st & 2nd from each group go straight to Euro 2020.
That’s 20 teams in total but we need 24, so where do the other 4 come from?

Simples!!

The ‘top’ teams from each of the Nations League Groups who DON’T QUALIFY DIRECT in the 20 teams above will play-off (2 Semis and a Final) in March 2020. So 1 team from each of Leagues 1 to 4 will have this ‘back door’ second chance of qualifying for Euro 2020 in to be played in June 2020 across 12 various venues in 12 different countries. Hampden is one of those venues. If Scotland were to qualify though, they couldn’t play their games at Hampden as I understand it.

There you go. Think that about covers it. Plain as mud. Double simples!!!!:greengrin:greengrin

I do actually understand that.

[CropleyWasGod]

Thought that was based on ranking
S?Here we go.

https://www.uefa.com/european-qualifiers/draws/index.html?iv=true

It's based on the rankings from the current tournament, which will be established later this week.

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[poulton hibs]

This is a good explanation of the seedings and pots.

https://www.footballseeding.com/international-tournaments/euro-2020/

[hibsbollah]

Timo Werner scores an unbelievable volley, Germans 2-0 up first half against the Dutch.

Zee reports ov der demise hev been greatly exaggerated, yes?

[BILLYHIBS]

Timo Werner scores an unbelievable volley, Germans 2-0 up first half against the Dutch.

Zee reports ov der demise hev been greatly exaggerated, yes?
Auchtung! Auchtung! Schitezen! Schitezen! Drie Drie!!

[worcesterhibby]

Auchtung! Auchtung! Schitezen! Schitezen! Drie Drie!!

Mein Gott im Himmel ! 2-2 Relegation Die Shande, Die Shande

[007 Mickey Weir]

So if we win group we will will get moved up into better seeding for draw as well as the chance in a play off?

[Green Man]

So if we win group we will will get moved up into better seeding for draw as well as the chance in a play off?

If we win the group we’re in pot 3. If we finish second we’re in 3 or 4 depending on the final standings of the other second placed teams in league C.

[hibsbollah]

Mein Gott im Himmel ! 2-2 Relegation Die Shande, Die Shande

Du sprecht Shan.

[PatHead]

Just been looking through all the groups and noticed:

France have not qualified for the finals. The top seeds are

Netherlands, Switzerland, Portugal and England.

Second seeds : Ukraine, Bosnia and Denmark with one other place to be decided.

Looks like England have a real chance in the tournament

The other countries in our play off, if we make it would be:

Finland and Norway with either Serbia or Romania.

On a final note Luxembourg finished second in their group with 10 points. Doubt that has ever happened before.

[hibsbollah]

Just been looking through all the groups and noticed:

France have not qualified for the finals. The top seeds are

Netherlands, Switzerland, Portugal and England.

Second seeds : Ukraine, Bosnia and Denmark with one other place to be decided.

Looks like England have a real chance in the tournament

The other countries in our play off, if we make it would be:

Finland and Norway with either Serbia or Romania.

On a final note Luxembourg finished second in their group with 10 points. Doubt that has ever happened before.

The Germans were cruising at 2-0 on 80 mins when I started doing something else, the Dutch scored two late goals to steal it and send the French out! Smash and grab but it's nice seeing them doing well again. Some great volleys from Van dijk, Tino Werner and the other Dutch guy who's name escapes me, worth watching again.

[bubblesmorrison]

On a final note Luxembourg finished second in their group with 10 points. Doubt that has ever happened before.[/QUOTE]

Of course it's never happened this is the first year! Also they are in a group of 4 not 3 like most other groups

[hibby6270]

I do actually understand that.

You’re welcome SDG. :greengrin

Must admit though, it’s taken weeks... no months....to get it worked out in my head. It was even harder to put it down in writing in as simple a way to explain LOL.

[hfc rd]

Apologies if this question has already been posted - if we beat Israel tonight, in terms of the play-off for Euro 2020 will we be drawn against one of the other Section C winners (Norway, Finland, Serbia or Romania) or can we draw a nation from one of the other winning group sections like Denmark, Georgia etc?

[CropleyWasGod]

Apologies if this question has already been posted - if we beat Israel tonight, in terms of the play-off for Euro 2020 will we be drawn against one of the other Section C winners (Norway, Finland, Serbia or Romania) or can we draw teams from other sections like Denmark, Georgia etc?The first.

And the chances are that we would get a home tie.

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[hibby6270]

Apologies if this question has already been posted - if we beat Israel tonight, in terms of the play-off for Euro 2020 will we be drawn against one of the other Section C winners (Norway, Finland, Serbia or Romania) or can we draw a nation from one of the other winning group sections like Denmark, Georgia etc?

But remember, the play-offs would be irrelevant if we qualify direct next year.
My assumption then is that the 2nd placed country in our Nations League group would be in the Play off - again assuming that country don’t qualify direct.

It is all a bit confusing and won’t really be clear until this time next year once the Euro 2020 qualifiers are complete.

[hfc rd]

The first.

And the chances are that we would get a home tie.

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How is that we would get a home tie? Would it not be two legs (Home and Away) as what the play-offs normally are?

[CropleyWasGod]

How is that we would get a home tie? Would it not be two legs (Home and Away) as what the play-offs normally are?It's a one-off game. Highest ranked team is at home to the lowest ranked one. 2nd vs 3rd.

As is the final, which is in Portugal I believe.

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[Diclonius]

It's a one-off game. Highest ranked team is at home to the lowest ranked one. 2nd vs 3rd.

As is the final, which is in Portugal I believe.

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Nope, just the Nations League finals are in Portugal. The semi finals for the playoffs are held at the highest ranked team's stadium. The final is held at a random venue from the two semi final winners.

At the moment, if we win our game against Israel we'll be the highest ranked of all the Group C winners on points and goal difference, and therefore would definitely play our semi final at home (as if the other teams qualify directly for Euro 2020 then the teams that take our place will definitely have less points than us), should we not otherwise qualify. Our semi final wil also be the lowest ranked team of the four qualifiers.

[poulton hibs]

It's a one-off game. Highest ranked team is at home to the lowest ranked one. 2nd vs 3rd.

As is the final, which is in Portugal I believe.

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I think Portugal are just hosting the group A semis and final ie Portugal, England, Switzerland and Holland. I assume thats because the nations league winner will come from one of those 4. For Groups B, C and D i think its one off games with seed 1 at home to seed 4, seed 2 at home to seed 3 and the final venue determined by a toss of coin for the semi winners.

[CropleyWasGod]

Nope, just the Nations League finals are in Portugal. The semi finals for the playoffs are held at the highest ranked team's stadium. The final is held at a random venue from the two semi final winners.

At the moment, if we win our game against Israel we'll be the highest ranked of all the Group C winners on points and goal difference, and therefore would definitely play our semi final at home (as if the other teams qualify directly for Euro 2020 then the teams that take our place will definitely have less points than us), should we not otherwise qualify. Our semi final wil also be the lowest ranked team of the four qualifiers.But it is a one-off game, which is the point that was being queried.

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[bingo70]

Nope, just the Nations League finals are in Portugal. The semi finals for the playoffs are held at the highest ranked team's stadium. The final is held at a random venue from the two semi final winners.

At the moment, if we win our game against Israel we'll be the highest ranked of all the Group C winners on points and goal difference, and therefore would definitely play our semi final at home (as if the other teams qualify directly for Euro 2020 then the teams that take our place will definitely have less points than us), should we not otherwise qualify. Our semi final wil also be the lowest ranked team of the four qualifiers.

Sorry for not keeping up here but i thought i had it understood until i read your first paragraph.

Are the two bits I've highlighted in bold not contradictory? Are they in Portugal or at a random venue from the two semi final winners?

Do you mean the Nations league finals are just the winners from Pool A are in Portugal?

[Diclonius]

Sorry for not keeping up here but i thought i had it understood until i read your first paragraph.

Are the two bits I've highlighted in bold not contradictory? Are they in Portugal or at a random venue from the two semi final winners?

Do you mean the Nations league finals are just the winners from Pool A are in Portugal?

The Nations League final is a separate tournament unrelated to the playoffs. There are four sets of playoffs with four teams from each league, confusingly including one from League A which is unrelated to the Nations League final, but could theoretically contain the same teams.

[hibby6270]

Sorry for not keeping up here but i thought i had it understood until i read your first paragraph.

Are the two bits I've highlighted in bold not contradictory? Are they in Portugal or at a random venue from the two semi final winners?

Do you mean the Nations league finals are just the winners from Pool A are in Portugal?

Yep. That’s exactly what it means. The games in Portugal will determine who wins the Nations League. Only 4 teams will take part in June (or is it July) 2019.

The play offs for Euro 2020 will take place in March 2020 and will comprise the best of the rest from the various Leagues/Groups being contested just now (see my earlier post).

[jonny]

A wee bit more info. Forget about Nations League for now. More later.

Euro 2020 qualifier groups are drawn in 2nd December 2018. Not sure what ‘pot’ Scotland will be in though but it’s not really important.

There will be 10 groups. 5 rounds of double games in March, June, Sept, Oct & Nov 2019.
Simple qualification. 1st & 2nd from each group go straight to Euro 2020.
That’s 20 teams in total but we need 24, so where do the other 4 come from?

Simples!!

The ‘top’ teams from each of the Nations League Groups who DON’T QUALIFY DIRECT in the 20 teams above will play-off (2 Semis and a Final) in March 2020. So 1 team from each of Leagues 1 to 4 will have this ‘back door’ second chance of qualifying for Euro 2020 in to be played in June 2020 across 12 various venues in 12 different countries. Hampden is one of those venues. If Scotland were to qualify though, they couldn’t play their games at Hampden as I understand it.

There you go. Think that about covers it. Plain as mud. Double simples!!!!:greengrin:greengrin

That does explain the qualification well and to be honest it's given me a much clearer picture of how it works.
Can you answer this one though - what if all the group A winners qualify through the normal route? What happens with their extra allocated space.
Also, if one of the group B teams qualifies automatically how is it decided who gets a bye through the semi final?
Presumably they still need 4 teams from the Nation's league to make up the 24 for the Euro's.

[The 90+2]

I think Portugal are just hosting the group A semis and final ie Portugal, England, Switzerland and Holland. I assume thats because the nations league winner will come from one of those 4. For Groups B, C and D i think its one off games with seed 1 at home to seed 4, seed 2 at home to seed 3 and the final venue determined by a toss of coin for the semi winners.

I’m sure Portugal was announced the venue before the tournament started. They are also hosting the 3rd place playoff and final the same week in the summer.

[The 90+2]

Yep. That’s exactly what it means. The games in Portugal will determine who wins the Nations League. Only 4 teams will take part in June (or is it July) 2019.

The play offs for Euro 2020 will take place in March 2020 and will comprise the best of the rest from the various Leagues/Groups being contested just now (see my earlier post).

The playoffs will comprise of the teams topping their leagues the now only if they don’t qualify properly in the normal groups.

[Sir David Gray]

That does explain the qualification well and to be honest it's given me a much clearer picture of how it works.
Can you answer this one though - what if all the group A winners qualify through the normal route? What happens with their extra allocated space.
Also, if one of the group B teams qualifies automatically how is it decided who gets a bye through the semi final?
Presumably they still need 4 teams from the Nation's league to make up the 24 for the Euro's.

The place will be given to the next best team in that Nations League group which hasn't already qualified through the normal qualification process.

[hibby6270]

That does explain the qualification well and to be honest it's given me a much clearer picture of how it works.
Can you answer this one though - what if all the group A winners qualify through the normal route? What happens with their extra allocated space.
Also, if one of the group B teams qualifies automatically how is it decided who gets a bye through the semi final?
Presumably they still need 4 teams from the Nation's league to make up the 24 for the Euro's.

You’re right. They need 4 teams from the play-offs.
This is where my understanding isn’t 100% nailed down BUT my assumption is as follows.

Let’s take Scotland’s group. If we win that group AND qualify direct from the Euro qualifiers next year, then the play-off place will go to Israel UNLESS Israel also qualify direct, in which case the Play off place would go to Albania. And this is where I’m not quite sure. If Albania were to qualify direct (unlikely but you never know), who would take that place in the play offs?

Blimey, just when I thought I’d got the hang of it, another imponderable crops up. Answers on a postcard please!!

[calumhibee1]

You’re right. They need 4 teams from the play-offs.
This is where my understanding isn’t 100% nailed down BUT my assumption is as follows.

Let’s take Scotland’s group. If we win that group AND qualify direct from the Euro qualifiers next year, then the play-off place will go to Israel UNLESS Israel also qualify direct, in which case the Play off place would go to Albania. And this is where I’m not quite sure. If Albania were to qualify direct (unlikely but you never know), who would take that place in the play offs?

Blimey, just when I thought I’d got the hang of it, another imponderable crops up. Answers on a postcard please!!

I thought it was that if we win our group we go into the playoff. The playoff then has a winner, runner up and a 3rd/4th place play off. Winner goes into the Euros unless they qualify by conventional means, then it'll be the runner up of the play offs, then 3rd place then 4th place etc. The bit I'm not sure about is if say 1st, 2nd, 3rd and 4th place in League A all qualify, where does that space go? To League B 2nd place then work it's way down?

[The 90+2]

I thought it was that if we win our group we go into the playoff. The playoff then has a winner, runner up and a 3rd/4th place play off. Winner goes into the Euros unless they qualify by conventional means, then it'll be the runner up of the play offs, then 3rd place then 4th place etc. The bit I'm not sure about is if say 1st, 2nd, 3rd and 4th place in League A all qualify, where does that space go? To League B 2nd place then work it's way down?

Nah our playoffs will be after the European Qualifiers in 2020 god knows when the draw for the actual 2020 tournament will be though.

[The 90+2]

👍

[hfc rd]

But remember, the play-offs would be irrelevant if we qualify direct next year.
My assumption then is that the 2nd placed country in our Nations League group would be in the Play off - again assuming that country don’t qualify direct.

It is all a bit confusing and won’t really be clear until this time next year once the Euro 2020 qualifiers are complete.


I agree with your last paragraph. Once the qualifiers for the Euros are done, everything will look much more clearer. From there, will probably understand how this damn Nations League works.

[Diclonius]

You’re right. They need 4 teams from the play-offs.
This is where my understanding isn’t 100% nailed down BUT my assumption is as follows.

Let’s take Scotland’s group. If we win that group AND qualify direct from the Euro qualifiers next year, then the play-off place will go to Israel UNLESS Israel also qualify direct, in which case the Play off place would go to Albania. And this is where I’m not quite sure. If Albania were to qualify direct (unlikely but you never know), who would take that place in the play offs?

Blimey, just when I thought I’d got the hang of it, another imponderable crops up. Answers on a postcard please!!

The place wouldn't necessarily go to Israel. It's based on ranking within the whole of League C, NOT the individual mini-leagues. Therefore, the slot would go to the best-ranked second placed team from the mini leagues (assuming all the other group winners don't qualify), which at the current moment is Hungary.

If everyone in a league somehow qualifies/is in the playoff and there's spaces left over, they just allocate remaining places from overall league ranking (i.e. League A and down) - but realistically this isn't going to happen, especially not in League B and below.

[Hibernian Verse]

This explains that scenario

https://youtu.be/Vn3pWjave3A

[hibby6270]

The place wouldn't necessarily go to Israel. It's based on ranking within the whole of League C, NOT the individual mini-leagues. Therefore, the slot would go to the best-ranked second placed team from the mini leagues (assuming all the other group winners don't qualify), which at the current moment is Hungary.

If everyone in a league somehow qualifies/is in the playoff and there's spaces left over, they just allocate remaining places from overall league ranking (i.e. League A and down) - but realistically this isn't going to happen, especially not in League B and below.

Aw man!! That really puts a spanner in the works. Just when I thought I’d sorted it out in my head.
A perfectly plausible explanation and makes sense.

As I say, best to wait until the actual qualifiers are complete to see who qualifies by right.
Then we can worry about the participants in the play offs.
Suffice to say that if Scotland have any chance of qualifying by either method we’ll stuff it up and continue to be the glorious failures we’ve been for the last 20 years.:rolleyes::rolleyes:

[hibby6270]

This explains that scenario

https://youtu.be/Vn3pWjave3A

It does but it doesn’t go into the nitty gritty of how countries will be chosen for the play offs if they haven’t qualified direct. That’s the bit I’m now still not sure about.

You have my thoughts above on how it will work.
Equally, the explanation in the post from Diclonius is just as feasible.

Which one is it? Is it a completely different scenario?

Anyone got Sepp Blatter’s phone number? :greengrin:greengrin