Dutch and Belgian leagues to merge? [Archive]

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Ozyhibby

19-10-2018, 09:47 PM

https://inews.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/dutch-belgian-football-superleague-cross-border-uefa-proposal/amp/?__twitter_impression=true

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Ozyhibby

19-10-2018, 10:16 PM

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181019/6fd094047d1baa99e21b44e29338800f.jpg

I hope we get involved.

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CB_NO3

19-10-2018, 10:25 PM

Doubt we would get involved. Its in order to keep the best players in the region and compete with Europes top 5 leagues. The ones that will lose out are the smaller clubs.

Sir David Gray

19-10-2018, 10:27 PM

Folk complain when we get an early kick off up in Aberdeen. I can't wait to see the reaction when we have a 12pm kick off in Brussels.

oneone73

19-10-2018, 10:27 PM

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181019/6fd094047d1baa99e21b44e29338800f.jpg

I hope we get involved.

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Ha. How many loyalty points for an away game at Ghent or Utrecht?

Ozyhibby

19-10-2018, 10:30 PM

Doubt we would get involved. Its in order to keep the best players in the region and compete with Europes top 5 leagues. The ones that will lose out are the smaller clubs.

If it’s an 18 team league then Hibs are big enough to compete in that. There are only about 14 Dutch and Belgian teams with bigger crowds than us.

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HibeeHibernian4

19-10-2018, 10:32 PM

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181019/6fd094047d1baa99e21b44e29338800f.jpg

I hope we get involved.

Why on earth would you want Hibs travelling hundreds of miles every other week? If you want us to become like England all watching it on TV, then this is the way to go about it. Count me out.

bingo70

19-10-2018, 10:35 PM

IberianHibernian

19-10-2018, 10:37 PM

Don`t think Netherlands / Belgium league would affect TV money much but having clubs from different national leagues competing together would make it much easier for UEFA to negociate TV deals for Barcelona ( within an independent Catalonia ) to continue in Spanish League or Celtic to play in England .

CB_NO3

19-10-2018, 10:37 PM

If it’s an 18 team league then Hibs are big enough to compete in that. There are only about 14 Dutch and Belgian teams with bigger crowds than us.

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The proposal is for 9 Dutch and 9 Belgian clubs.

SteveHFC

19-10-2018, 10:44 PM

Why on earth would you want Hibs travelling hundreds of miles every other week? If you want us to become like England all watching it on TV, then this is the way to go about it. Count me out.

Hibs playing in some sort super of league will be the final straw for many fans. Who would be able to afford travelling away hundreds of miles every other week.

bingo70

19-10-2018, 10:51 PM

Hibs playing in some sort super of league will be the final straw for many fans. Who would be to afford travelling away hundreds of miles every other week.

The authorities generally don’t care that much about the average fan, it’s all about the tv deals, sponsorship and hospitality etc....

Hopefully one day they’ll realise they need the average fan to have a product, I’m not sure that message has hit home in England yet.

B.H.F.C

19-10-2018, 10:52 PM

Hibs playing in some sort super of league will be the final straw for many fans. Who would be to afford travelling away hundreds of miles every other week.

No loyalty scheme required.

SteveHFC

19-10-2018, 11:38 PM

No loyalty scheme required.

No AST too :hyper

Baader

20-10-2018, 12:11 AM

Might make sense for those two countries to do it. Not for Scottish clubs to be involved though, which isn't the proposal anyway.

Ozyhibby

20-10-2018, 12:12 AM

I think I’d prefer having Ajax, PSV, Anderlecht etc visiting Easter road regularly.

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southern hibby

20-10-2018, 01:28 AM

Half of me wants to know if it will be Away Season Ticket or Loyalty Points.
Either way I’d be daft enough to go.

Big Bird ( girlfriend ) might decide she’s had enough and dump me 😉. Well the wife did, because ( in her words not mine ) you love that fxxxing team more than me.
Probably the only thing the two of us agreed on.

GGTTH

SouthMoroccoStu

20-10-2018, 04:53 AM

Austinho

20-10-2018, 05:28 AM

Might make sense for those two countries to do it. Not for Scottish clubs to be involved though, which isn't the proposal anyway.Would make more geographical sense to have a league with Ireland and Northern Ireland. Although the Challenge Cup has shown how weak those leagues are - more Scottish lower league level. The Old Firm couldn’t be trusted to behave in away trips either.

B.H.F.C

20-10-2018, 06:33 AM

I think I’d prefer having Ajax, PSV, Anderlecht etc visiting Easter road regularly.

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The novelty factor of something like that would be great initially.

Football free weekends are crap though and having to miss the majority of away games would be no fun,

chippy

20-10-2018, 08:05 AM

I think I’d prefer having Ajax, PSV, Anderlecht etc visiting Easter road regularly.

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1) A Belgian/Dutch League seems an easy negotiation and geographical deal. TV money must be good.
2) I doubt our SFA/SPFL could get involved at this stage even if they wanted to
3) Still can’t see any big clubs in England sacrificing themselves to allow the Old Firm in
4) Can’t see a full on British league either, nothing in it for the English
5) We could explore the feasibility of a Nordic/Celtic league though as theses countries may well be interested. If we had a United say 2 division league with Norway, Sweden, Denmark, Finland, Iceland and all Ireland we’d have a population of 40 million for a TV deal. If a 2 division set up it could accommodate 32-40 clubs. Scotland, Norway, Denmark having 7 clubs, Sweden 9, Ireland and Finland 4 each and Iceland 2.
6) Run this league in parallel with our own premier league. Summer football?
7) the whole project would stand for fall on what level of TV deal could be obtained. The Scandics are among the best supported clubs in Europe. So would we like to see Rosenburg, Malmo (ouch), Brondby, Copenhagen, Molde, Norrkoping, AIK, at Easter Road on a regular basis as well as Old Firm, Jambos , Dons etc

Ozyhibby

20-10-2018, 08:10 AM

Would make more geographical sense to have a league with Ireland and Northern Ireland. Although the Challenge Cup has shown how weak those leagues are - more Scottish lower league level. The Old Firm couldn’t be trusted to behave in away trips either.

Ireland and Northern Ireland just don’t have clubs big enough to make it worthwhile unfortunately.

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blackpoolhibs

20-10-2018, 08:14 AM

I'm always glad when we qualify for Europe, this year showed that we can compete with a few clubs of similar or less quality.

I'm not sure getting pumped from the likes of Ajax PSV and the likes along with a resurgent sevco and Celtic would get the juices flowing for long.

If we were to merge football associations, our merge would need to probably be with the the scandinavian leagues?

I'm not keen.

IGRIGI

20-10-2018, 08:17 AM

Ozyhibby

20-10-2018, 08:18 AM

1) A Belgian/Dutch League seems an easy negotiation and geographical deal. TV money must be good.
2) I doubt our SFA/SPFL could get involved at this stage even if they wanted to
3) Still can’t see any big clubs in England sacrificing themselves to allow the Old Firm in
4) Can’t see a full on British league either, nothing in it for the English
5) We could explore the feasibility of a Nordic/Celtic league though as theses countries may well be interested. If we had a United say 2 division league with Norway, Sweden, Denmark, Finland, Iceland and all Ireland we’d have a population of 40 million for a TV deal. If a 2 division set up it could accommodate 32-40 clubs. Scotland, Norway, Denmark having 7 clubs, Sweden 9, Ireland and Finland 4 each and Iceland 2.
6) Run this league in parallel with our own premier league. Summer football?
7) the whole project would stand for fall on what level of TV deal could be obtained. The Scandics are among the best supported clubs in Europe. So would we like to see Rosenburg, Malmo (ouch), Brondby, Copenhagen, Molde, Norrkoping, AIK, at Easter Road on a regular basis as well as Old Firm, Jambos , Dons etc

Or we could go the whole hog with the Dutch, Belgians, Swedes, Danes and Norwegians.
Create and strong 2 divisions with a tv market to compete with the big leagues.

2/ 18 team leagues

Ajax 49,403
Feyenoord 45,419
Celtic 44,849
New Rangers 45,415
PSV 32,465
FC Twente 28,518
Hammarby (Sweden) 25,507
Club Brugge (Belguim) 24,430
Herenveen 24,314
AIK (Sweden) 20,983
Anderlecht 20,675
Genk (Belguim) 20,590
Standard Liege (Belguim) 20,415
Groningen 20,193
NAC Breda 18,112
Rosenborg (Norway) 18,039
Hibs 18,000
Hearts 18,000
Malmo (Sweden) 17,332
Vitesse 17,212
Utrecht 16,646
AZ Alkmaar 15,512
Djurgardens IF (Sweden) 15,484
FC Copenhagen (Denmark) 15,448
Brondby (Denmark) 15,143
IFK Gothenborg (Sweden) 14,350
Aberdeen 13,094
PEC Zwolle 12,213
Willem II 12,099
ADO Den Haag 11,976
IFK Norkoping (Sweden) 10,296
Viking FK (Norway) 10,272
SK Brann (Norway) 10,124
KV Mechelan (Belguim)10,160
Valerenga IF (Norway) 10,099
KAA Gent (Belguim) 10,090

Tv market
Holland 17m
Belguim 11m
Sweden 10m
Denmark 5.6m
Scotland 5.5m
Norway 5.1m
Total 52mi

Would mean we no longer have to lose our best players to the championship in England. I’m certain the glamour of such a league would bring in extra fans as well. Us and the yams might have to fill in the corners of our stadiums. [emoji6]

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Ozyhibby

20-10-2018, 08:23 AM

Makes sense for the Dutch and Belgians given geographical and cultural links along with the facts that they are two relatively similar sized nations both in a population sense and football sense.

I don't really see a feasible option for Scotland, cost of travel would prohibit joining a Benelux/Celtic/ Scandinavian league and a lifetime of yoyoing between the bottom of the Championship and the top of League 1 would do the likes of Hibs no good.

Cost of travel won’t even come into it, most big leagues in Europe don’t have large numbers of away supports.
From a business sense, the only teams who bring a considerable support to Easter road would all be involved anyway.

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superfurryhibby

20-10-2018, 08:28 AM

Or we could go the whole hog with the Dutch, Belgians, Swedes, Danes and Norwegians.
Create and strong 2 divisions with a tv market to compete with the big leagues.

2/ 18 team leagues

Ajax 49,403
Feyenoord 45,419
Celtic 44,849
New Rangers 45,415
PSV 32,465
FC Twente 28,518
Hammarby (Sweden) 25,507
Club Brugge (Belguim) 24,430
Herenveen 24,314
AIK (Sweden) 20,983
Anderlecht 20,675
Genk (Belguim) 20,590
Standard Liege (Belguim) 20,415
Groningen 20,193
NAC Breda 18,112
Rosenborg (Norway) 18,039
Hibs 18,000
Hearts 18,000
Malmo (Sweden) 17,332
Vitesse 17,212
Utrecht 16,646
AZ Alkmaar 15,512
Djurgardens IF (Sweden) 15,484
FC Copenhagen (Denmark) 15,448
Brondby (Denmark) 15,143
IFK Gothenborg (Sweden) 14,350
Aberdeen 13,094
PEC Zwolle 12,213
Willem II 12,099
ADO Den Haag 11,976
IFK Norkoping (Sweden) 10,296
Viking FK (Norway) 10,272
SK Brann (Norway) 10,124
KV Mechelan (Belguim)10,160
Valerenga IF (Norway) 10,099
KAA Gent (Belguim) 10,090

Tv market
Holland 17m
Belguim 11m
Sweden 10m
Denmark 5.6m
Scotland 5.5m
Norway 5.1m
Total 52mi

Would mean we no longer have to lose our best players to the championship in England. I’m certain the glamour of such a league would bring in extra fans as well. Us and the yams might have to fill in the corners of our stadiums. [emoji6]

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Tragic suggestion really. Hibs would be in the bottom league, travel to away games would be ridic and it would end more than a century of tradition. Never going to happen anyway.

Ozyhibby

20-10-2018, 08:29 AM

Tragic suggestion really. Hibs would be in the bottom league, travel to away games would be ridic and it would end more than a century of tradition. Never going to happen anyway.

Why would we be in the bottom league? And ‘never going to happen’? I’m absolutely certain change is on the way. Clubs like Ajax, PSV etc don’t want to keep losing their best young players just because they are from a small country. Football is a business and that format above would bring more money to all of those business’s above. When money is involved, change is inevitable. What stopped it before was uefa opposition and now uefa are in favour.

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superfurryhibby

20-10-2018, 08:39 AM

Why would we be in the bottom league? And ‘never going to happen’? I’m absolutely certain change is on the way. Clubs like Ajax, PSV etc don’t want to keep losing their best young players just because they are from a small country. Football is a business and that format above would bring more money to all of those business’s above. When money is involved, change is inevitable. What stopped it before was uefa opposition and now uefa are in favour.

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Just speculating, but based on crowd size and intuition.

Football is more than just a business and the Glasgow teams can go if they like. I’ve no interest in Hibs v mid ranking Dutch and Belgian teams, sorry.

My_Wife_Camille

20-10-2018, 08:45 AM

Merged leagues are inevitable imo. It’s only a matter of time and when it comes it will be the end of football for me

IGRIGI

20-10-2018, 08:49 AM

Cost of travel won’t even come into it, most big leagues in Europe don’t have large numbers of away supports.
From a business sense, the only teams who bring a considerable support to Easter road would all be involved anyway.

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I was meaning more in terms of cost for the club, away games across Europe every two weeks.

I guess TV money and other income that could come from a bigger league could cover that though.

Hibby Kay-Yay

20-10-2018, 08:57 AM

With SFA/SPFL in charge we would probably make a mess of it and merge with Wales, Northern Ireland and Iceland.

Ozyhibby

20-10-2018, 09:14 AM

With SFA/SPFL in charge we would probably make a mess of it and merge with Wales, Northern Ireland and Iceland.

That’s my fear. We are well capable of sitting on our hands and missing the boat as other leagues around us strengthen, taking away more of our best players.

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weecounty hibby

20-10-2018, 09:22 AM

With SFA/SPFL in charge we would probably make a mess of it and merge with Wales, Northern Ireland and Iceland.
And end up as the minor partner. I have zero confidence that those in charge of our game could negotiate what's best for us. They constantly focus on the negative and not the positive side of our game. The fact that we have the highest pet capita attendance levels in Europe shows the potential but these twats manage to **** up at every turn

hibbyfraelibby

20-10-2018, 09:28 AM

It could work depending on how it is structured. You would retain a "domestic" element by using your games against teams in your own country to decide European qualification.

Look at the way Rugby's Celtic League evolved into the Pro12 by bringing in the Italians and now into the Pro14 when the South African teams joined and you see a model that would work for the smaller North Sea nations in Football.

Billy Whizz

20-10-2018, 09:57 AM

Saw this too

https://europeanleagues.com/european-leagues-present-proposals-for-uefa-club-competitions/

chippy

20-10-2018, 10:01 AM

Or we could go the whole hog with the Dutch, Belgians, Swedes, Danes and Norwegians.
Create and strong 2 divisions with a tv market to compete with the big leagues.

2/ 18 team leagues

Ajax 49,403
Feyenoord 45,419
Celtic 44,849
New Rangers 45,415
PSV 32,465
FC Twente 28,518
Hammarby (Sweden) 25,507
Club Brugge (Belguim) 24,430
Herenveen 24,314
AIK (Sweden) 20,983
Anderlecht 20,675
Genk (Belguim) 20,590
Standard Liege (Belguim) 20,415
Groningen 20,193
NAC Breda 18,112
Rosenborg (Norway) 18,039
Hibs 18,000
Hearts 18,000
Malmo (Sweden) 17,332
Vitesse 17,212
Utrecht 16,646
AZ Alkmaar 15,512
Djurgardens IF (Sweden) 15,484
FC Copenhagen (Denmark) 15,448
Brondby (Denmark) 15,143
IFK Gothenborg (Sweden) 14,350
Aberdeen 13,094
PEC Zwolle 12,213
Willem II 12,099
ADO Den Haag 11,976
IFK Norkoping (Sweden) 10,296
Viking FK (Norway) 10,272
SK Brann (Norway) 10,124
KV Mechelan (Belguim)10,160
Valerenga IF (Norway) 10,099
KAA Gent (Belguim) 10,090

Tv market
Holland 17m
Belguim 11m
Sweden 10m
Denmark 5.6m
Scotland 5.5m
Norway 5.1m
Total 52mi

Would mean we no longer have to lose our best players to the championship in England. I’m certain the glamour of such a league would bring in extra fans as well. Us and the yams might have to fill in the corners of our stadiums. [emoji6]

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Ok Ozy your plan is better than mine. Sounds brilliant. We would be able to keep the McGinns, 30k crowds at expanded Easter Road even if at this Times we were in the 2nd Division. We have to be in on this at the start. Clubs like ours would really grow in this environment.

chippy

20-10-2018, 10:03 AM

Ozyhibby

20-10-2018, 10:06 AM

Ok Ozy your plan is better than mine. Sounds brilliant. We would be able to keep the McGinns, 30k crowds at expanded Easter Road even if at this Times we were in the 2nd Division. We have to be in on this at the start. Clubs like ours would really grow in this environment.

That’s how I look at it. Why should Bournemouth be able to afford better players than Hibs?

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Ozyhibby

20-10-2018, 10:07 AM

Meant to say that a merged Dundee club would have a shout to be a 6th Scottish club

Haha, hard enough to win over fans to this without that kind of talk. [emoji23][emoji6]

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Onceinawhile

20-10-2018, 10:08 AM

What Luxembourg teams are involved?

hibstag

20-10-2018, 10:09 AM

I don’t think there’s any chance of us joining that league, the relevance to the story for us is that it could set a precedent for the Scottish and English leagues merging, or at least for the old firm to join the English leagues.

Yep as the TV revenues begin to flatline letting the gruesome twosome (and others to be fair) into the English football set up will be seen as a way of rejuvenating the product

superfurryhibby

20-10-2018, 10:11 AM

Ok Ozy your plan is better than mine. Sounds brilliant. We would be able to keep the McGinns, 30k crowds at expanded Easter Road even if at this Times we were in the 2nd Division. We have to be in on this at the start. Clubs like ours would really grow in this environment.

You really think we would get 30k crowds v the teams listed in the second tier of this imagined league. Remind me as to our criwds v Molde, Asteras and Runavik this season? Never going to happen.

A two tier expanded Euefa league is much more of a goer.

Ozyhibby

20-10-2018, 10:13 AM

You really think we would get 30k crowds v the teams listed in the second tier of this imagined league. Remind me as to our criwds v Molde, Asteras and Runavik this season? Never going to happen.

A two tier expanded Euefa league is much more of a goer.

Why would we need to be in the 2nd tier?

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chippy

20-10-2018, 10:14 AM

hibsdaft

20-10-2018, 10:17 AM

No chance we'll be invited to join - Belgian and Dutch fans would have a fit. More significantly this is going to put out clubs at further disadvantage as there should be no doubt that this will bring a big economic boost to the the club's involved. Economies of scale.

Personally I'd be very reluctant to give up on a hundred years of Scottish football history and continuity just because of the current malaise and TV deal economics (which could change rapidly in years to come with Web based sports coverage)

What we should be exploring perhaps is a merged League Cup, be that with NI, Irish, English, Scandanavian or Benelux clubs, whatever

superfurryhibby

20-10-2018, 10:28 AM

Why would we need to be in the 2nd tier?

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Guessing, but based on there being 16 teams on the list with bigger average crowds than us? Even if we allow ourselves to drift into the realms of fantasy, why would a combined League want 2 teams from Edinburgh? Would it not be more likely to include the Sheep, who have a better European pedigree than us these past 40 years.

30k crowds are fantasy stuff. Even in Turnbull’s era we never got more than 30k v Leeds, Liverpool, Juventus, Sporting Lisbon.

Albanian Hibs

20-10-2018, 10:32 AM

Folk complain when we get an early kick off up in Aberdeen. I can't wait to see the reaction when we have a 12pm kick off in Brussels.

Imagine the carry out 🍻🍻🍻

SirDavidsNapper

20-10-2018, 10:33 AM

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20181019/6fd094047d1baa99e21b44e29338800f.jpg

I hope we get involved.

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No thanks. Struggle to afford Aberdeen away never mind Antwerp

Keith_M

20-10-2018, 10:33 AM

After Brexit, there'll be no free travel between the UK and Europe, so travelling to away games won't only be expensive, you'll likely need to arrange a Visa (or whatever agreement they come up with).

Ozyhibby

20-10-2018, 10:33 AM

Guessing, but based on there being 16 teams on the list with bigger average crowds than us? Even if we allow ourselves to drift into the realms of fantasy, why would a combined League want 2 teams from Edinburgh? Would it not be more likely to include the Sheep, who have a better European pedigree than us these past 40 years.

30k crowds are fantasy stuff. Even in Turnbull’s era we never got more than 30k v Leeds, Liverpool, Juventus, Sporting Lisbon.

It’s an 18 team league though.

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Dashing Bob S

20-10-2018, 10:49 AM

We should be involved but we won’t. As can be seen from the posts here too many fans would rather have us playing at the level of the League of Ireland rather than the premiership if it cost them more to go to games. Fair enough.

The real stumbling block however would be the football authorities here. They won’t want to relinquish their power as those jokers are pretty much unemployable in any other context.

I’m sure though we will have to endure a constant OF money led campaign through the suppine Scottish sports media on ‘when are Rantic going to be invited into this league...’

Keith_M

20-10-2018, 10:55 AM

I take it the proposed North Atlantic League is a non-starter then.

IIRC, it was Denmark, Netherlands, Belgium and Scotland... although my old memory's not what it used to be.

---
Actually, it was Denmark, Netherlands Belgium, Ranjurs and Sellik.

Smartie

20-10-2018, 11:00 AM

Meant to say that a merged Dundee club would have a shout to be a 6th Scottish club

Morning Wallace.

Is it hot down there?

Haymaker

20-10-2018, 01:32 PM

That’s how I look at it. Why should Bournemouth be able to afford better players than Hibs?

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Because Bournemouth have a billionaire owner happy to spend lots of his money to get to the EPL.

nonshinyfinish

20-10-2018, 01:47 PM

Meant to say that a merged Dundee club would have a shout to be a 6th Scottish club

I'm sure the people of Dundee will be delighted.

Now that you mention it, I reckon a merged Hibs and Hearts could challenge the Old Firm. Why has no one thought of this before?

lucky

20-10-2018, 01:56 PM

Why would we be in the bottom league? And ‘never going to happen’? I’m absolutely certain change is on the way. Clubs like Ajax, PSV etc don’t want to keep losing their best young players just because they are from a small country. Football is a business and that format above would bring more money to all of those business’s above. When money is involved, change is inevitable. What stopped it before was uefa opposition and now uefa are in favour.

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Spot on. Change is definitely coming it just a case of what that looks like. I’d prefer a British league but a new European league is something which is clearly going to happen.

Michael

20-10-2018, 02:06 PM

I think an Atlantic league would be great. Think of all the different teams you'd get to see Hibs play with your season ticket.

Eyrie

20-10-2018, 02:17 PM

I'm sure the people of Dundee will be delighted.

Now that you mention it, I reckon a merged Hibs and Hearts could challenge the Old Firm. Why has no one thought of this before?

I think a merged Ugly Sisters could compete in the Champions League.

nonshinyfinish

20-10-2018, 02:20 PM

I think a merged Ugly Sisters could compete in the Champions League.

Now that's just silly.

Eyrie

20-10-2018, 07:17 PM

Now that's just silly.

OK then, the Europa League.

pacorosssco

21-10-2018, 09:58 AM

Ha. How many loyalty points for an away game at Ghent or Utrecht?

two of the best cities you could have an away day trip

BullsCloseHibs

21-10-2018, 10:18 AM

I think that's a great idea. I can see why they'd do this.

Ozyhibby

21-10-2018, 11:27 AM

I think that's a great idea. I can see why they'd do this.

If we can be involved in something like this then we can keep players like John McGinn.

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