What if...

[we are hibs]

I am completly bored and a random thougnt popped into my head.. terry butcher took over in 2013. We ended up in the play offs and went down. A week later is the Scottish cup final and we go on to win. How would he be remembered then? Tbh I don't think he would take charge of the final if we went down the week before but it would have been interesting to see the reaction had we won it under a manager and went down at the same time. After all most hibs fans said they didn't care what happened as long as they got to see us win the cup.

[SirDavidsNapper]

I am completly bored and a random thougnt popped into my head.. terry butcher took over in 2013. We ended up in the play offs and went down. A week later is the Scottish cup final and we go on to win. How would he be remembered then? Tbh I don't think he would take charge of the final if we went down the week before but it would have been interesting to see the reaction had we won it under a manager and went down at the same time. After all most hibs fans said they didn't care what happened as long as they got to see us win the cup.

I think most would have taken relegation if it ment winning the Scottish Cup. Sounds mad but that's how much it ment to everyone associated with Hibs. Good question though. In time he'd have been remembered as the man that won the cup not the man who took us down. Stubbs jumped ship at the first opportunity after winning it but nobody really thinks about that. Pat Fenlon almost became a legend twice.

[calumhibee1]

He’d be a legend to an extent but taking us down would have blemished it.

[Time For Heroes]

He’d be a legend to an extent but taking us down would have blemished it.

You think? You could argue the same about Stubbsy not getting us promoted.
For me, regardless of relegation, if we had won the cup I wouldn't have cared about being relegated

[Iggy Pope]

I am completly bored and a random thougnt popped into my head.. terry butcher took over in 2013. We ended up in the play offs and went down. A week later is the Scottish cup final and we go on to win. How would he be remembered then? Tbh I don't think he would take charge of the final if we went down the week before but it would have been interesting to see the reaction had we won it under a manager and went down at the same time. After all most hibs fans said they didn't care what happened as long as they got to see us win the cup.

Fenlon was in charge of the 2013 cup side though? We never got past round 4 under Butcher. Would wee Pat have been looked on as heroic if we'd been relegated under him (rather than avoiding the Play Offs as we did, finishing 7th I think) and somehow then managed to win the cup with his relegated side? That should be the question. Like you say, he'd probably have been pumped by then.
Reality is Butcher got us nowhere near a final and got us relegated via play offs. He can't really be remembered for much else.

[jacomo]

This is such an impossibility it makes my head hurt.

[Bostonhibby]

Pat Butcher had a better chance of winning the Holy Grail than him and she had to cover for Dot Cotton at the laundrette at the same time.

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[Ozyhibby]

I was delighted we won the cup with Stubbs but at the same time I was happy when he left and more so when we got Lennon. Wasn’t a popular opinion but the fact is that Stubbs had a terrible league campaign his 2nd season and I’m not sure he could have got us up the next season.

Stubbs joins the (now) reasonably long list of managers who thrive under Leeann Dempster (where she lightens their workload so that all they have to do look after the first team) and then fail miserably when they go back into the real world.
Mark McGhee, Craig Brown, Stuart McCall and now Stubbs.


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[G B Young]

This is such an impossibility it makes my head hurt.

Indeed. We would never have won the cup under Butcher. I was at the Scottish Cup tie at Easter Road where Raith knocked us out and having initially been excited by Butcher's appointment I thought this game was the one where the alarm bells started ringing about his ability as a manager. I'd taken a group of kids to the game and we were sitting behind the dugout so I was party to his (and Malpas') tactical instructions, which primarily seemed to consist of Butcher shouting at the referee over perceived injustices and Malpas shouting 'Boozy' at Alex Harris on numerous occasions. We lost 3-2 but Raith were the better team. The lad we had on loan from Sunderland (Watmore?) was a bright spark but was pretty much a one-man task force.

As an aside, I recall several English clubs winning cups the same season they were relegated. Norwich, Birmingham and Wigan. McLeish kept his job at Birmingham but not sure about the other managers.

[calumhibee1]

You think? You could argue the same about Stubbsy not getting us promoted.
For me, regardless of relegation, if we had won the cup I wouldn't have cared about being relegated

I think so. I had thought the same as what you said but the way we went out against Falkirk was incredibly harsh on us. The way we got relegated however was thoroughly deserved.

[HibsNutter]

He would be a legend but he wouldn't deserve it so I'm glad we waited another two years.

[Baader]

Pat Butcher had a better chance of winning the Holy Grail than him and she had to cover for Dot Cotton at the laundrette at the same time.

Even if we'd faced Albion Rovers under 12s ladies team we'd have lost the final with that clown in charge.

[Hibbyradge]

What if Hibs hadn't beaten Hearts 7 0 in 1973, would we still revere Eddie Turnbull?

[CentreLine]

What if Hibs hadn't beaten Hearts 7 0 in 1973, would we still revere Eddie Turnbull?

Yes we would. He was much more than one result. Consistent, highly entertaining football with quality results across Europe and taking no **** from Jock Stein or Jock Wallace, anybody really, that was Eddie Turnbull. And the first national trophy at ER for over 2 decades. Legend regardless of that result at Tynecastle, which I was lucky enough to be present at.

All that said, I believe Eddie Turnbull was fortunate to inherit a team already in the making under Willie MacFarlane. I am convinced MacFarlane would have gone on to bigger and better things, even than ET, if he had been allowed to continue in post but we’ll never know now.

[Bostonhibby]

What if Hibs hadn't beaten Hearts 7 0 in 1973, would we still revere Eddie Turnbull?Yes. No doubt about it, there were quite a few other results as well and for the most part his teams played the best football of my time watching Hibs.

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[BILLYHIBS]

What if Hibs hadn't beaten Hearts 7 0 in 1973, would we still revere Eddie Turnbull?
It is difficult to explain to the younger generation how good Turnbulls Tornadoes were.You really had to see them in the flesh to truly appreciate how good they really were. Turnbull obviously drilled them and drilled them very hard in training attack against defence set pieces etc. Every man jack of them knew their job where the should be on the pitch their individual roles as part of the overall unit and what was expected of them. They played to a system the goalkeeper would very rarely kick the ball aimlessly up the park he would roll the ball out to the full backs. If a move broke down they would simply start again.Even the subs Smith, Bremner, Munro Hazel and Hamilton would walk into most top flight teams at that time knew their roles. The football was truly a joy to watch it was like watching a game of chess watching them made the beautiful game truly beautiful.

Listening to myself rambling on here reminds me of my old man going on about Gordon Smith and the famous five I am not old enough to have seen them play but like the Tornadoes I suppose you would actually had have to have seen them play to truly appreciate them.

[Hibbyradge]

I can't multi quote on the hibs.net lite, but I agree with the last 3 posters.

The Tornadoes were much more than just one game.

As for the initial question, any manager who won us the cup would have become a legend.

The fact that Alan Stubbs managed it with a championship side makes it even more special, a fact that a lot of folk seem to forget, but it's the stuff of real legend.

Stubbs will be spoken of by Hibs fans for a long, long time.