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NAE NOOKIE
02-09-2018, 02:14 PM
As it says on the tin :greengrin

After months of humming and hawing I've finally taken the plunge at £10 per month. Funnily enough the main catalyst for my decision has been Hertz successful start to the season. After 5 years where they have barely made a penny from domestic cup runs or Europe and where they have committed over 10 million quid to ground redevelopment they are still competitive and IMO there is no doubt that FOH are the main, in fact the only, reason for that.

Its not being over dramatic to surmise that if and when that new stand is paid for and the FOH donations continue to roll in we are going to find ourselves at a considerable disadvantage to them financially … HSL currently has 1,700 members … FOH has 8,000 members …. If they are contributing an average of £10 each that's a difference of £750,000 every year, which in Scottish football terms is a substantial amount of money.

Like every football fan I live in hope that some disgustingly rich white knight is going to ride over the horizon and turn Hibs into Scotland's Man City …. but the truth is that's a million to one shot at best and until it happens its going to be up to the folk who love this club to ante up and keep us in the race.

I know we all contribute a lot already through season tickets and the like, but the truth is so do the Hearts fans, so the difference is going to be how much more we are willing to do over and above that … as things stand we are lagging miles behind and unless we recognise that fact now in a few years time we will have to face up to the reality of what that means …. the current mini meltdown over a mediocre start to the season has been compounded by their good start to it ……. how much worse will that be if they continue to challenge and we don't?

If that's not enough to convince folk then just think of the smug feeling joining HSL will give you, knowing you are far far better than most of our fans. Don't worry if you have to cut the kids food budget to make the payments either, you will be contributing to the fight against Scotland's rampant obesity crisis …. its a win, win.

GGTTH :greengrin

:flag:

judas
02-09-2018, 02:18 PM
Yes I’ve been thinking about this a lot. I may have to bump my Private Eye subscription and weekly bottle of wine, because the idea of Hearts having this advantage over us makes me feel physically sick.

Good post.

Gerard
02-09-2018, 02:20 PM
As it says on the tin :greengrin

After months of humming and hawing I've finally taken the plunge at £10 per month. Funnily enough the main catalyst for my decision has been Hertz successful start to the season. After 5 years where they have barely made a penny from domestic cup runs or Europe and where they have committed over 10 million quid to ground redevelopment they are still competitive and IMO there is no doubt that FOH are the main, in fact the only, reason for that.

Its not being over dramatic to surmise that if and when that new stand is paid for and the FOH donations continue to roll in we are going to find ourselves at a considerable disadvantage to them financially … HSL currently has 1,700 members … FOH has 8,000 members …. If they are contributing an average of £10 each that's a difference of £750,000 every year, which in Scottish football terms is a substantial amount of money.

Like every football fan I live in hope that some disgustingly rich white knight is going to ride over the horizon and turn Hibs into Scotland's Man City …. but the truth is that's a million to one shot at best and until it happens its going to be up to the folk who love this club to ante up and keep us in the race.

I know we all contribute a lot already through season tickets and the like, but the truth is so do the Hearts fans, so the difference is going to be how much more we are willing to do over and above that … as things stand we are lagging miles behind and unless we recognise that fact now in a few years time we will have to face up to the reality of what that means …. the current mini meltdown over a mediocre start to the season has been compounded by their good start to it ……. how much worse will that be if they continue to challenge and we don't?

If that's not enough to convince folk then just think of the smug feeling joining HSL will give you, knowing you are far far better than most of our fans. Don't worry if you have to cut the kids food budget to make the payments either, you will be contributing to the fight against Scotland's rampant obesity crisis …. its a win, win.

GGTTH :greengrin

:flag:
The more people who join HSL the more money our club will have to spend on players.

judas
02-09-2018, 02:26 PM
Actually can someone explain the mechanism here. I mean if we pay toward the club and that is spent on the club (players etc) then how does that go toward the final objective of fan ownership.

And when we say fan ownership is that +50% of the shares. How would the board then be selected?

Billy Whizz
02-09-2018, 02:38 PM
Actually can someone explain the mechanism here. I mean if we pay toward the club and that is spent on the club (players etc) then how does that go toward the final objective of fan ownership.

And when we say fan ownership is that +50% of the shares. How would the board then be selected?

We can only achieve 49% I believe
Someone else will explain how the donations etc, get turned into share holding

BILLYHIBS
02-09-2018, 02:39 PM
How much is it a month?

Do you get a share certificate?

NAE NOOKIE
02-09-2018, 02:43 PM
Actually can someone explain the mechanism here. I mean if we pay toward the club and that is spent on the club (players etc) then how does that go toward the final objective of fan ownership.

And when we say fan ownership is that +50% of the shares. How would the board then be selected?

Every penny that goes into HSL goes towards buying shares in the club and that money is directed by the club towards the playing budget. Eventually HSL will have a substantial shareholding in the club, second only to STF as a block, with the rest being owned by individual shareholders and a few disparate groups, the members of whom remain a mystery.

Your final question is one I have asked many times on here and I have yet to be provided with a satisfactory answer. As yet Hibs have made no announcements as to their vision for how the club will operate post the 51% being achieved. If they aren't discussing this with HSL and other interested parties by this point, with 36% of shares already in supporters hands I suggest they get the finger out.

Billy Whizz
02-09-2018, 02:44 PM
How much is it a month?

Do you get a share certificate?

Think min is £7.73 per month, and no you don’t get a share certificate

green day
02-09-2018, 02:47 PM
How much is it a month?

Do you get a share certificate?

Once you have contributed the requisite amount, you can download something, but its not a share cert

I have not bothered, as far as I am concerned, its all about giving cash to the club to buy better players, dont give a monkeys about shares or owning the club.

Sir David Gray
02-09-2018, 02:47 PM
How much is it a month?

Do you get a share certificate?

You get a membership certificate but no share certificate as you don't personally own the shares yourself.

NAE NOOKIE
02-09-2018, 02:53 PM
How much is it a month?

Do you get a share certificate?

I think the minimum is £7.75 a month … For that you become a member of HSL which is the group owning the shares, you do not directly become a Hibs shareholder as an individual, but as a stakeholder in the group owning the shares IE, HSL.

Once your contribution to HSL reaches £225 I think it is you get a certificate saying you are a fully paid up member of HSL a vehicle whose sole purpose is to accrue shares in Hibernian FC.

But a rose by any other name as they say … to all intents and purposes you do own a part of the club, just as a member of HSL rather than as an individual.

HSL's aim is that once the 51% of shares are gone and there are no more to purchase contributions still keep rolling in in much the same way as FOH do currently.

A Hi-Bee
02-09-2018, 02:58 PM
As it says on the tin :greengrin

After months of humming and hawing I've finally taken the plunge at £10 per month. Funnily enough the main catalyst for my decision has been Hertz successful start to the season. After 5 years where they have barely made a penny from domestic cup runs or Europe and where they have committed over 10 million quid to ground redevelopment they are still competitive and IMO there is no doubt that FOH are the main, in fact the only, reason for that.

Its not being over dramatic to surmise that if and when that new stand is paid for and the FOH donations continue to roll in we are going to find ourselves at a considerable disadvantage to them financially … HSL currently has 1,700 members … FOH has 8,000 members …. If they are contributing an average of £10 each that's a difference of £750,000 every year, which in Scottish football terms is a substantial amount of money.

Like every football fan I live in hope that some disgustingly rich white knight is going to ride over the horizon and turn Hibs into Scotland's Man City …. but the truth is that's a million to one shot at best and until it happens its going to be up to the folk who love this club to ante up and keep us in the race.

I know we all contribute a lot already through season tickets and the like, but the truth is so do the Hearts fans, so the difference is going to be how much more we are willing to do over and above that … as things stand we are lagging miles behind and unless we recognise that fact now in a few years time we will have to face up to the reality of what that means …. the current mini meltdown over a mediocre start to the season has been compounded by their good start to it ……. how much worse will that be if they continue to challenge and we don't?

If that's not enough to convince folk then just think of the smug feeling joining HSL will give you, knowing you are far far better than most of our fans. Don't worry if you have to cut the kids food budget to make the payments either, you will be contributing to the fight against Scotland's rampant obesity crisis …. its a win, win.

GGTTH :greengrin

:flag:

Good man, I have been saying for ages now that the only people who can effect change at our great club is us the supporters. No good moaning in a few years time if we are left behind, more cash means better players.:aok:
HSL have been quite on hear for a wee while, but this is an ongoing process that we just cannot afford to ignore.

A Hi-Bee
02-09-2018, 03:02 PM
Once you have contributed the requisite amount, you can download something, but its not a share cert

I have not bothered, as far as I am concerned, its all about giving cash to the club to buy better players, dont give a monkeys about shares or owning the club.

Same thoughts, its all about helping the club put better players on the park

OfficialHSL
02-09-2018, 03:04 PM
As it says on the tin :greengrin

After months of humming and hawing I've finally taken the plunge at £10 per month. Funnily enough the main catalyst for my decision has been Hertz successful start to the season. After 5 years where they have barely made a penny from domestic cup runs or Europe and where they have committed over 10 million quid to ground redevelopment they are still competitive and IMO there is no doubt that FOH are the main, in fact the only, reason for that.

Its not being over dramatic to surmise that if and when that new stand is paid for and the FOH donations continue to roll in we are going to find ourselves at a considerable disadvantage to them financially … HSL currently has 1,700 members … FOH has 8,000 members …. If they are contributing an average of £10 each that's a difference of £750,000 every year, which in Scottish football terms is a substantial amount of money.

Like every football fan I live in hope that some disgustingly rich white knight is going to ride over the horizon and turn Hibs into Scotland's Man City …. but the truth is that's a million to one shot at best and until it happens its going to be up to the folk who love this club to ante up and keep us in the race.

I know we all contribute a lot already through season tickets and the like, but the truth is so do the Hearts fans, so the difference is going to be how much more we are willing to do over and above that … as things stand we are lagging miles behind and unless we recognise that fact now in a few years time we will have to face up to the reality of what that means …. the current mini meltdown over a mediocre start to the season has been compounded by their good start to it ……. how much worse will that be if they continue to challenge and we don't?

If that's not enough to convince folk then just think of the smug feeling joining HSL will give you, knowing you are far far better than most of our fans. Don't worry if you have to cut the kids food budget to make the payments either, you will be contributing to the fight against Scotland's rampant obesity crisis …. its a win, win.

GGTTH :greengrin

:flag:

Nae Nookie

Thank you for joining and we could not have put it better ourselves.

We try hard not to get too engaged in Fans Forums as we don't want to be constantly " begging for money". Having said this I had a number of conversations with fellow supporters in Molde who were not HSL members ( you know who you are ) and while everyone was aware of HSL the majority were not members. A discussion took place and as a result a number of supporters joined there and then. They said to me they did not fully appreciate what HSL was about and what we were trying to do. They suggested that I try to repeat the story to others.

You refer to FOH in your thread so allow me to add to that. At the moment FOH members are contributing around £1.4m per year. They have already handed over almost £7m. They only have around 19 months to go until the purchase transaction is complete, after that the £1.4m will be available to the Manager to spend on players. In 19 months time the supporters will own the Club therefore it is hard to believe that they will simply walk away at that time.

Aberdeen launched a similar scheme in April of this year. They publicly declared their rationale was to compete with Hibs and Hearts. They refer specifically to FOH and HSL and they urged their fans to get right behind AberDNA to help their Manager. Since April they have attracted over 6000 members and continue to grow.

This is the reality of our competition. We continue to debate what our Board are doing but we need to be aware that they cannot spend what they do not have. The majority of the Club's income can only come from us, the supporters. They, the Board, can only invest what we give them. Aberdeen and Hearts are making more money available to their Manager.

We must decide what we want. Neither of those groups have any "marketing or sales " to speak of, just a simple call to their fans to get behind their Club.

Our plea is equally simple, let's get behind Hibs and make sure we do not get left behind.

https://hiberniansupporters.co.uk/donate/

HSL

Lemonade
02-09-2018, 03:14 PM
Ive just signed up and would like to apologise for not doing so much sooner.

Its a simple process and it took me about 3 minutes.

:nlgwa

Leith's finest
02-09-2018, 03:23 PM
Not trying to put a downer on anybody doing this but if it goe's to the manager where doe's the sjm money go? I don't put money in but i'm a st holder and also buy a happy hibee ticket when i can, so tin helmet on

Lemonade
02-09-2018, 03:27 PM
Not trying to put a downer on anybody doing this but if it goe's to the manager where doe's the sjm money go? I don't put money in but i'm a st holder and also buy a happy hibee ticket when i can, so tin helmet on
That's for at different thread I think.

ST's are nothing to do with HSL

NAE NOOKIE
02-09-2018, 03:30 PM
Nae Nookie

Thank you for joining and we could not have put it better ourselves.

We try hard not to get too engaged in Fans Forums as we don't want to be constantly " begging for money". Having said this I had a number of conversations with fellow supporters in Molde who were not HSL members ( you know who you are ) and while everyone was aware of HSL the majority were not members. A discussion took place and as a result a number of supporters joined there and then. They said to me they did not fully appreciate what HSL was about and what we were trying to do. They suggested that I try to repeat the story to others.

You refer to FOH in your thread so allow me to add to that. At the moment FOH members are contributing around £1.4m per year. They have already handed over almost £7m. They only have around 19 months to go until the purchase transaction is complete, after that the £1.4m will be available to the Manager to spend on players. In 19 months time the supporters will own the Club therefore it is hard to believe that they will simply walk away at that time.

Aberdeen launched a similar scheme in April of this year. They publicly declared their rationale was to compete with Hibs and Hearts. They refer specifically to FOH and HSL and they urged their fans to get right behind AberDNA to help their Manager. Since April they have attracted over 6000 members and continue to grow.

This is the reality of our competition. We continue to debate what our Board are doing but we need to be aware that they cannot spend what they do not have. The majority of the Club's income can only come from us, the supporters. They, the Board, can only invest what we give them. Aberdeen and Hearts are making more money available to their Manager.

We must decide what we want. Neither of those groups have any "marketing or sales " to speak of, just a simple call to their fans to get behind their Club.

Our plea is equally simple, let's get behind Hibs and make sure we do not get left behind.

https://hiberniansupporters.co.uk/donate/

HSL

Bloody hell, that is impressive you have to say :confused:

This is something we should all be aware of … Its clear that 'fan power' is going to end up being a big factor in the years to come, and the likes of Aberdeen have clearly recognised that fact, especially when they are directly using HSL and FOH as a motivator, hell lets face it a scare tactic, to get their supporters to see how important they are going to be to the clubs ability to compete.

In the grand scheme of things Hearts had a motivating factor that we don't and at a guess Aberdeen ( Hearts too ) probably have a richer fan base economically than us, both factors as to why we are so far behind both of them in this area.

But even so, its becoming increasingly clear that the writing is on the wall as to how much of a factor fans contributions are going to be in Scottish football in the years to come …. we really need to significantly up the ante so far as HSL goes or we are going to regret it ….. on that note, even though its been mentioned on here a number of times … Why doesn't Hibs.Net have a sticky inviting folk to join HSL?

NAE NOOKIE
02-09-2018, 03:41 PM
Not trying to put a downer on anybody doing this but if it goe's to the manager where doe's the sjm money go? I don't put money in but i'm a st holder and also buy a happy hibee ticket when i can, so tin helmet on

The HSL contribution to Hibs is ( correct me if I'm wrong ) running at under £250,000 per annum, though obviously very welcome to Hibs I'm sure it hardly makes much of a dent in the overall playing budget.

That aside, Hibs have committed to putting all of the ST and HSL money into the playing budget … but it costs a fortune to actually run the club with office staff, ground staff, maintaining the stadium and maintaining East Mains all to pay for ……… not to mention our desire ( one I approve of ) to build a full sized indoor pitch ….. oh and the unexpected costs to be covered, like UEFA fines, eh lads? :greengrin

That's where the SJM money goes, it simply cant all go into the squad. But the more money HSL can put in the less of a strain it is on the club having to divert transfer fees and other commercial income into the day to day running of the club.

CropleyWasGod
02-09-2018, 03:44 PM
The HSL contribution to Hibs is ( correct me if I'm wrong ) running at under £250,000 per annum, though obviously very welcome to Hibs I'm sure it hardly makes much of a dent in the overall playing budget.

That aside, Hibs have committed to putting all of the ST and HSL money into the playing budget … but it costs a fortune to actually run the club with office staff, ground staff, maintaining the stadium and maintaining East Mains all to pay for ……… not to mention our desire ( one I approve of ) to build a full sized indoor pitch ….. oh and the unexpected costs to be covered, like UEFA fines, eh lads? :greengrin

That's where the SJM money goes, it simply cant all go into the squad. But the more money HSL can put in the less of a strain it is on the club having to divert transfer fees and other commercial income into the day to day running of the club.Is it as much as that?

Last time I looked on the Companies House website, it looked like we had raised about £80k since the start of the calendar year.

Sent from my SM-A520F using Tapatalk

tynehibs
02-09-2018, 04:05 PM
Good posts NN I've been in since 2015 and I urge all of us to do so if you can afford it, as as been suggested why not a sticky where you can just stick in a single donation be it a £1 or £100?

green day
02-09-2018, 04:12 PM
Good posts NN I've been in since 2015 and I urge all of us to do so if you can afford it, as as been suggested why not a sticky where you can just stick in a single donation be it a £1 or £100?

Think OfficialHSL boy gave instructions on how to do that a week or so back - search his posts

NAE NOOKIE
02-09-2018, 04:12 PM
Is it as much as that?

Last time I looked on the Companies House website, it looked like we had raised about £80k since the start of the calendar year.

Sent from my SM-A520F using Tapatalk

It was just a general figure I was sure it couldn't be more than that I plucked out of the air to show how insignificant the amount being contributed by HSL currently is in terms of the clubs overall spending requirements CWG.

If it is as low as 80K in an 8 month period it just shows how far we have to go before HSL's input into the club can make anything like a significant impact …. all the more reason to try a lot harder to get folk to join IMO.

I had no idea about the AberDNA scheme until HSL mentioned it on here. I see constant arguments as to whether their fanbase is bigger than ours, maybe it is, maybe it isn't, but surely to goodness it isn't so much bigger that in 5 months they have already attracted 4,300 hundred more members to their version of HSL than HSL has managed in over two years …. and that's without their club being in danger of oblivion like Hearts were or with the promise of majority fan ownership like Hibs.

Its a question for HSL, Hibs and the Hibs support in general ….. what are Aberdeen doing that we are not? … I simply cant believe that its down to them having a more committed fanbase than us.

HH81
02-09-2018, 04:15 PM
I increased my amount recently.

green day
02-09-2018, 04:18 PM
Its a question for HSL, Hibs and the Hibs support in general ….. what are Aberdeen doing that we are not? … I simply cant believe that its down to them having a more committed fanbase than us.

Perhaps because Aberdeen didnt have influential fannies spreading lies on social media at the beginning saying that all the money went into the owners pockets?

I am an HSL member, but unfortunately it has been hamstrung since the beginning and I am not sure how or if it can recover properly.

Lancs Harp
02-09-2018, 04:29 PM
Does the HSL get its message across? Do enough Hibs fans know what it is and what it is about? If it wasnt for this site I wouldn't know it existed. Thats not a criticism just an observation. I'd suggest selling itself isnt the HSLs strongest suit, comparisons to the fledgling Aberdeen equivalent and the more established FOH I think would tend to back that up.

Personally at this moment in time Im "between jobs" when I'm sorted I'll be signing up.

Bangkok Hibby
02-09-2018, 04:34 PM
Does the HSL get its message across? Do enough Hibs fans know what it is and what it is about? If it wasnt for this site I wouldn't know it existed. Thats not a criticism just an observation. I'd suggest selling itself isnt the HSLs strongest suit, comparisons to the fledgling Aberdeen equivalent and the more established FOH I think would tend to back that up.

Personally at this moment in time Im "between jobs" when I'm sorted I'll be signing up.

I didn't know about it until today on here. I live in Thailand and work offshore so only in the country 3 days per six weeks. Chances to see a game are few and far between so if I can do something financially to help the club I will. Maybe some advertising "sticky" on here and other sites eg "Hibs Direct" and "Hibs TV" would be a good way to get the word out there.

oldbutdim
02-09-2018, 04:40 PM
I've already got a share certificate, but I feel quite good about my 18.75 DD

:greengrin



That's my monthly contribution by the way, nothing to do with my moobs.

CMac1988
02-09-2018, 04:41 PM
AberDNA also has a fair few incentives in regards to savings on season tickets and merchandise etc.

I'd be more inclined to sign up for HSL if it meant a few pound saved here and there in the club shop, for Hibernian TV and also a 10% saving on my season ticket.

Another thing worth mentioning is how AberDNA is run by the club and is heavily tied in to their marketing. Dedicated pages on their website and marketing around the stadium help with awareness.

A bigger emphasis from the Club itself in helping to promote HSL would go a long way. A news post on the website once in a blue moon isn't enough.

EDIT

Should also note however that their membership scheme has nothing to do in regards to buying shares in the club.

OfficialHSL
02-09-2018, 04:48 PM
Ive just signed up and would like to apologise for not doing so much sooner.

Its a simple process and it took me about 3 minutes.

:nlgwa

Welcome aboard, you don't owe anyone an apology, just spread the word to other supporters.

HSL

OfficialHSL
02-09-2018, 04:51 PM
Bloody hell, that is impressive you have to say :confused:

This is something we should all be aware of … Its clear that 'fan power' is going to end up being a big factor in the years to come, and the likes of Aberdeen have clearly recognised that fact, especially when they are directly using HSL and FOH as a motivator, hell lets face it a scare tactic, to get their supporters to see how important they are going to be to the clubs ability to compete.

In the grand scheme of things Hearts had a motivating factor that we don't and at a guess Aberdeen ( Hearts too ) probably have a richer fan base economically than us, both factors as to why we are so far behind both of them in this area.

But even so, its becoming increasingly clear that the writing is on the wall as to how much of a factor fans contributions are going to be in Scottish football in the years to come …. we really need to significantly up the ante so far as HSL goes or we are going to regret it ….. on that note, even though its been mentioned on here a number of times … Why doesn't Hibs.Net have a sticky inviting folk to join HSL?

That's a good idea, how do we go about getting a sticky thread ?


HSL

OfficialHSL
02-09-2018, 05:01 PM
Bloody hell, that is impressive you have to say :confused:

This is something we should all be aware of … Its clear that 'fan power' is going to end up being a big factor in the years to come, and the likes of Aberdeen have clearly recognised that fact, especially when they are directly using HSL and FOH as a motivator, hell lets face it a scare tactic, to get their supporters to see how important they are going to be to the clubs ability to compete.

In the grand scheme of things Hearts had a motivating factor that we don't and at a guess Aberdeen ( Hearts too ) probably have a richer fan base economically than us, both factors as to why we are so far behind both of them in this area.

But even so, its becoming increasingly clear that the writing is on the wall as to how much of a factor fans contributions are going to be in Scottish football in the years to come …. we really need to significantly up the ante so far as HSL goes or we are going to regret it ….. on that note, even though its been mentioned on here a number of times … Why doesn't Hibs.Net have a sticky inviting folk to join HSL?

Nae Nookie

The point you raise about Hearts having a motivating factor ( saving their Club ) is a point often raised by our supporters. While it is true to say that the FOH raised just under £4m to save their Club that is now history. Just over two years ago their Members were invited to stall the purchase transaction with a view to providing £3m to build a new stand. The voted in favour by 97%. Their Club had already been saved. They have made this contribution and continue to contribute about £130,000 every month. One can only conclude that they continue with their donations because they want a better Club.

Our view is that we need to look forward and think about what we want for our Club. All of us know many supporters who are aware of HSL, financially able, but choose not to donate. The question is why not.

Our best guess is apathy. Supporters don't realise what is going on around us. Some also feel that everything is ok and there is no need to help. Yes, it is true that our Club is financially stable but if we do not invest in it who will ?

HSL

Bangkok Hibby
02-09-2018, 05:02 PM
Maybe admin can help with this

OfficialHSL
02-09-2018, 05:08 PM
AberDNA also has a fair few incentives in regards to savings on season tickets and merchandise etc.

I'd be more inclined to sign up for HSL if it meant a few pound saved here and there in the club shop, for Hibernian TV and also a 10% saving on my season ticket.

Another thing worth mentioning is how AberDNA is run by the club and is heavily tied in to their marketing. Dedicated pages on their website and marketing around the stadium help with awareness.

A bigger emphasis from the Club itself in helping to promote HSL would go a long way. A news post on the website once in a blue moon isn't enough.

EDIT

Should also note however that their membership scheme has nothing to do in regards to buying shares in the club.

CMac1988

You raise some interesting points.

You are right to say that AberDNA offer some goodies but this comes at a price. Is there much point in offering £5 to attract £10 in return if the £5 is spent on Admin. HSL is run by volunteers and the proposition is simple and straight forward, whatever you can afford will go straight to help the team.

We welcome whatever support the Club can give us to promote the HSL message but we at the end of the day it always boils down to the goodwill of our supporters and what ambition they have for our team.


HSL

Lancs Harp
02-09-2018, 05:20 PM
CMac1988

You raise some interesting points.

You are right to say that AberDNA offer some goodies but this comes at a price. Is there much point in offering £5 to attract £10 in return if the £5 is spent on Admin. HSL is run by volunteers and the proposition is simple and straight forward, whatever you can afford will go straight to help the team.

We welcome whatever support the Club can give us to promote the HSL message but we at the end of the day it always boils down to the goodwill of our supporters and what ambition they have for our team.


HSL

Well if those figures regarding AberDNA are true then clearly there is. They have grown their membership remarkably quickly and this will lead to increase income funds. HSL is run by volunteers, like any Hibs fan I appreciate the time effort and desire needed to do something like this but like I pointed out in an earlier post the HSL doesnt know how to sell itself. If it did we wouldnt be having this conversation. Its a great concept, just needs to be sold.

Golden Bear
02-09-2018, 05:34 PM
It's a pity there is not a mechanism whereby fans can make contributions directly to the Club. I have no desire to get involved in fan ownership as I'm not convinced it will result in any tangible benefits for the Club.
I'm another who likes the sound of the Dons scheme.

Iggy Pope
02-09-2018, 05:42 PM
It was just a general figure I was sure it couldn't be more than that I plucked out of the air to show how insignificant the amount being contributed by HSL currently is in terms of the clubs overall spending requirements CWG.

If it is as low as 80K in an 8 month period it just shows how far we have to go before HSL's input into the club can make anything like a significant impact …. all the more reason to try a lot harder to get folk to join IMO.

I had no idea about the AberDNA scheme until HSL mentioned it on here. I see constant arguments as to whether their fanbase is bigger than ours, maybe it is, maybe it isn't, but surely to goodness it isn't so much bigger that in 5 months they have already attracted 4,300 hundred more members to their version of HSL than HSL has managed in over two years …. and that's without their club being in danger of oblivion like Hearts were or with the promise of majority fan ownership like Hibs.

Its a question for HSL, Hibs and the Hibs support in general ….. what are Aberdeen doing that we are not? … I simply cant believe that its down to them having a more committed fanbase than us.



HSL has been running for several years and you're subscribing only now. Maybe they are indeed that wee bit more committed than some?

Or maybe the whole HSL initiative has been poorly marketed from the start where only the truly committed lumped in right away like they always do.

OfficialHSL
02-09-2018, 05:46 PM
Well if those figures regarding AberDNA are true then clearly there is. They have grown their membership remarkably quickly and this will lead to increase income funds. HSL is run by volunteers, like any Hibs fan I appreciate the time effort and desire needed to do something like this but like I pointed out in an earlier post the HSL doesnt know how to sell itself. If it did we wouldn't be having this conversation. Its a great concept, just needs to be sold.

Lancs Harp

You are right it's a great concept and in our view a great proposition for our supporters. Why do we say this :

- by donating via HSL your donation does not have any VAT implications, all funds go to the team

- donators do get something in return, via HSL an ownership stake in the Club

- we are currently trying to arrange some "goodies" for donators but of course trying to ensure we get the right balance mindful of the whole purpose of the exercise

Do keep in mind that our reason for being is to receive voluntary donations from supporters and while some encouragement is helpful we have many supporters who complain if we try to "sell" to them. It's a really difficult balancing act.



HSL

green day
02-09-2018, 05:51 PM
[/B]


HSL has been running for several years and you're subscribing only now. Maybe they are indeed that wee bit more committed than some?

Or maybe the whole HSL initiative has been poorly marketed from the start where only the truly committed lumped in right away like they always do.

Like I said on the last page - there were also people spreading lies on social media at the beginning saying that all the HSL money went into the STF pocket, remember the Ponzi scheme nonsense dreamed up by some people?

Aberdeen and Hearts simply didnt have that

Kojock
02-09-2018, 05:51 PM
Perhaps because Aberdeen didnt have influential fannies spreading lies on social media at the beginning saying that all the money went into the owners pockets?

I am an HSL member, but unfortunately it has been hamstrung since the beginning and I am not sure how or if it can recover properly.

Folk calling it a ponzie scheme at the launch didn’t help. I donate £18.75 per month and have contributed over £700. I am in the fortunate position that I can afford it but would encourage anyone to contribute whatever you can. GGTTH

A Hi-Bee
02-09-2018, 05:53 PM
It's a pity there is not a mechanism whereby fans can make contributions directly to the Club. I have no desire to get involved in fan ownership as I'm not convinced it will result in any tangible benefits for the Club.
I'm another who likes the sound of the Dons scheme.

As I have said on other threads perhaps its time to look at this whole thing from another angle, perhaps time for a bunch of supporters to set up something brand new, one without the baggage that HSL is associated with rightly or wrongly. One that does not take anything away from HSL (They do a brilliant job) but a supporter led transfer fund initiative.
Money going into the playing side of the club only with nothing back, just the possibility of a better team on the park.
It is just a suggestion but it would be starting from a clean slate so to speak. Many wish to put money in to the club just not through the existing vehicle.
I don’t know how this could be set up, but it could even be run by some of the same people from HSL to run side by side with HSL.
Whatever way we do things we need to be looking at it now as the unwashed and the sheep are already leaving us well behind in the funding of their clubs.

:flag::flag::flag:

Lancs Harp
02-09-2018, 05:58 PM
This a reply to HSLOfficial, for some reason I cant send a direct reply response. Regarding some members not liking the direct sales approach.

To be honest mate I'd go for the sell. Too many Hibs fans, as maybe this thread shows on a site where the HSL and it aims are known, dont know the story or dont know it well enough. It benefits the club so maybe the club could help out, a match day presence perhaps, local news, social media, the programme, social events ..... get the message in lights, be bold.

heid the baw
02-09-2018, 05:59 PM
Nae Nookie

All of us know many supporters who are aware of HSL, financially able, but choose not to donate. The question is why not.

Our best guess is apathy. Supporters don't realise what is going on around us. Some also feel that everything is ok and there is no need to help. Yes, it is true that our Club is financially stable but if we do not invest in it who will ?

HSL


I am firmly of the opinion that football clubs should be self sustaining. That is not apathy, just a belief. What would I get in return for giving £120 a year?
Hibs are not a charitable organisation. They are a professional sports club, selling a product. If you want to donate to that then that is your choice, but I can see no purpose to HSL.

CropleyWasGod
02-09-2018, 06:05 PM
I am firmly of the opinion that football clubs should be self sustaining. That is not apathy, just a belief. What would I get in return for giving £120 a year?
Hibs are not a charitable organisation. They are a professional sports club, selling a product. If you want to donate to that then that is your choice, but I can see no purpose to HSL.It's not just about being self-sustaining. It's also about competing with our rivals.

And It's also about ensuring that no asset-stripper can ever threaten the existence of the club. For many, this is what you get "in return" for your money.

Sent from my SM-A520F using Tapatalk

tynehibs
02-09-2018, 06:06 PM
Think OfficialHSL boy gave instructions on how to do that a week or so back - search his posts

Sorry must have missed it

Radium
02-09-2018, 06:07 PM
I am firmly of the opinion that football clubs should be self sustaining. That is not apathy, just a belief. What would I get in return for giving £120 a year?
Hibs are not a charitable organisation. They are a professional sports club, selling a product. If you want to donate to that then that is your choice, but I can see no purpose to HSL.

Get 26% of the shares and be in a position to stop takeovers by charlatans


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

The Modfather
02-09-2018, 06:10 PM
[/B]


HSL has been running for several years and you're subscribing only now. Maybe they are indeed that wee bit more committed than some?

Or maybe the whole HSL initiative has been poorly marketed from the start where only the truly committed lumped in right away like they always do.

As an aside, there has been lots of good ideas over the years that could be implemented. Maybe HSL could start a thread looking for innovative ideas. I liked the one someone said about bringing the pie stands out of the dark ages and offering chip & pin/contactless and copying what other clubs do in having an option to round up the cost to the nearest pound with the difference going into HSL.

OfficialHSL
02-09-2018, 06:11 PM
It's a pity there is not a mechanism whereby fans can make contributions directly to the Club. I have no desire to get involved in fan ownership as I'm not convinced it will result in any tangible benefits for the Club.
I'm another who likes the sound of the Dons scheme.

Golden Bear

There is a means by which you can donate to the Club directly, just send a cheque to ER payable to Hibernian Football Club. The issue however is that the Club will have to pay 20% VAT on that and many supporters may not be happy about that. Obviously we have no idea why you are against fan ownership but it is important to point out that HSL isn't about taking over the Club and that hs been clear from the start. The Club however are keen for supporters to have an ownership stake and our aim is to get to 25.1 %. It has already delivered tangible benefits if the form of almost £650,000 which helped to bring valuable players to the Club.

You can choose not to take Membership of HSL and your donation will still go right to where you want it, the football Dept.

In our view one of the reasons for the success at FOH is it's simplicity. One entity simply receiving donations from fans who want to see their team improve.


HSL

Golden Bear
02-09-2018, 06:21 PM
Golden Bear

There is a means by which you can donate to the Club directly, just send a cheque to ER payable to Hibernian Football Club. The issue however is that the Club will have to pay 20% VAT on that and many supporters may not be happy about that. Obviously we have no idea why you are against fan ownership but it is important to point out that HSL isn't about taking over the Club and that hs been clear from the start. The Club however are keen for supporters to have an ownership stake and our aim is to get to 25.1 %. It has already delivered tangible benefits if the form of almost £650,000 which helped to bring valuable players to the Club.

You can choose not to take Membership of HSL and your donation will still go right to where you want it, the football Dept.

In our view one of the reasons for the success at FOH is it's simplicity. One entity simply receiving donations from fans who want to see their team improve.


HSL

Thanks for the reply. I have a nominal share ownership which dates back to the days of the Mercer takeover bid. I'll investigate further re the direct monthly contributions route.

Iggy Pope
02-09-2018, 06:23 PM
Rather than say nothing, or better yet applaud the guy for signing up you thought it better to make a snide comment, with Uber fan undertones, about “only now subscribing”. Well done you.

As an aside, there has been lots of good ideas over the years that could be implemented. Maybe HSL could start a thread looking for innovative ideas. I liked the one someone said about bringing the pie stands out of the dark ages and offering chip & pin/contactless and copying what other clubs do in having an option to round up the cost to the nearest pound with the difference going into HSL.

Bollocks. The poster made a comment about commitment of other fans when the HSL scheme has been running for years. I responded in a manner miles from snide. If you're looking for a scrap, look elsewhere.

Chuck Rhoades
02-09-2018, 06:24 PM
What are Aberdeen/Hearts doing differently that’s resulting in such success? Hearts riding the survival wave presumably. We have just as, if not more of a loyal fan base than them.

hibbydad
02-09-2018, 07:17 PM
I welcome Nae Nookie initiating this discussion I have tried to do this on a number occasions. The stark reality is that if we don't get behind this initiative those on the dark side of the city are going to pull away from us in footballing terms. Do any of us want that I hope not

Lago
02-09-2018, 07:21 PM
What are Aberdeen/Hearts doing differently that’s resulting in such success? Hearts riding the survival wave presumably. We have just as, if not more of a loyal fan base than them.
I am at a bit of a loss as to why they appear to be more successful at securing donations, but one think does strike me is that both the Hearts & Don's schemes seem more closely integrated into their club structure whereas HSL seems to be a standalone scheme run by volunteers rather than the club professionals.

CropleyWasGod
02-09-2018, 07:21 PM
What are Aberdeen/Hearts doing differently that’s resulting in such success? Hearts riding the survival wave presumably. We have just as, if not more of a loyal fan base than them.I'm not sure that Aberdeen are doing better than us. As HSL have said, their scheme involves give-aways and incentives. Those will be affecting the club's income in other areas, and there will be VAT implications as well.

Our scheme is pure profit to the club.

Sent from my SM-A520F using Tapatalk

The Modfather
02-09-2018, 07:23 PM
Bollocks. The poster made a comment about commitment of other fans when the HSL scheme has been running for years. I responded in a manner miles from snide. If you're looking for a scrap, look elsewhere.

To be fair I only seen your reply, so my fault for not reading what you were responding to in your reply. In the proper context it wasn’t the response I thought it was.

So apologies, I picked it up wrong end of the stick which then wrongly got my back up. Sorry, I’ll delete my first paragraph as no longer relevant 👍🍻

matty_f
02-09-2018, 07:27 PM
What are Aberdeen/Hearts doing differently that’s resulting in such success? Hearts riding the survival wave presumably. We have just as, if not more of a loyal fan base than them.

I think the biggest difference was that there was little or no opposition to Aberdeen or Hearts' schemes.

When HSL launched it was slated very publicly and very vocally. Enough to put doubt in a lot of people's minds.

hibbydad
02-09-2018, 07:30 PM
You are right Matty sadly this was true and the people doing it have done our club a disservice

lyonhibs
02-09-2018, 07:34 PM
Does the ABERDna scheme not include, in exchange for your monthly contributions, a range of wee benefits like money off the home strip and some priority level for tickets above general sale?

Or am I imagining that?

CropleyWasGod
02-09-2018, 07:35 PM
Does the ABERDna scheme not include, in exchange for your monthly contributions, a range of wee benefits like money off the home strip and some priority level for tickets above general sale?

Or am I imagining that?It does, which in turn affects their profit in those areas.

Sent from my SM-A520F using Tapatalk

jacomo
02-09-2018, 07:37 PM
AberDNA also has a fair few incentives in regards to savings on season tickets and merchandise etc.

I'd be more inclined to sign up for HSL if it meant a few pound saved here and there in the club shop, for Hibernian TV and also a 10% saving on my season ticket.

Another thing worth mentioning is how AberDNA is run by the club and is heavily tied in to their marketing. Dedicated pages on their website and marketing around the stadium help with awareness.

A bigger emphasis from the Club itself in helping to promote HSL would go a long way. A news post on the website once in a blue moon isn't enough.

EDIT

Should also note however that their membership scheme has nothing to do in regards to buying shares in the club.


Yes, the Aberdeen scheme is very different, more like a membership with loads of incentives and discounts. If members take advantage of those - and given the take-up, I imagine a lot will - then the net benefit to Aberdeen FC will be a lot lower than the headline figure.

Having said that, I think a discount on Hibs TV for HSL members would be a very good idea. It seems to me that HSL is a great way to support the club for Hibbies like me who don’t live in Edinburgh, and likewise Hibs TV is a great way to stay connected to the club and see some games.

G B Young
02-09-2018, 07:39 PM
Good thread.

I joined HSL when it launched and paid a tenner a month until I hit (I think) £250 at which point my donations were automatically brought to an end, which I assume was the same for everyone who joined? I never got round to restarting my donations, which I'd guess has also been the case for a quite a few folk.

Anyway, this thread has jogged my memory so I'm going to check out the website and see how to start donating again.

I thought the Europa League travel competitions HSL ran over the summer were a good idea for generating income and more of this sort of thing might spark more interest. Is there any mileage in a monthly prize draw or something similar?

For folk like myself who simply can't justify a season ticket (on grounds not only of cost, but due to the fact I'm prevented by work from going to many games), perhaps HSL could be marketed as a way for us to make a difference to the club. OK, unlike buying a season ticket you don't get to see the games as a perk of your investment, but maybe there could be other incentives for signing up eg one free match ticket per season for non-category A games, a Hibs Kids membership, club shop vouchers etc?

OfficialHSL
02-09-2018, 07:41 PM
Maybe admin can help with this
Yes, would be grateful if an Admin can help us with this .?

HSL

OfficialHSL
02-09-2018, 07:45 PM
Like I said on the last page - there were also people spreading lies on social media at the beginning saying that all the HSL money went into the STF pocket, remember the Ponzi scheme nonsense dreamed up by some people?

Aberdeen and Hearts simply didnt have that

You are correct and such interventions have made things difficult for us and have not helped our Club at all.
HSL

OfficialHSL
02-09-2018, 07:49 PM
As an aside, there has been lots of good ideas over the years that could be implemented. Maybe HSL could start a thread looking for innovative ideas. I liked the one someone said about bringing the pie stands out of the dark ages and offering chip & pin/contactless and copying what other clubs do in having an option to round up the cost to the nearest pound with the difference going into HSL.
We agree, we welcome any ideas and suggestions and will try our best to implement.
HSL

scooby
02-09-2018, 07:53 PM
1700 HSL contributors is really disappointing given our fan base, and the length of time the scheme has been running.
It seems to me that many "supporters" are looking for reasons not to contribute, or maybe Hibs fans are just tighter than our rivals.
The whole share issue has muddied the water, and I think it's time for HSL to consider setting up a simple charitable donation scheme to run alongside the current one.

coldingham hibs
02-09-2018, 08:00 PM
I’m not sure if it’s been mentioned before or what the link with HSL & the club is but I receive ‘The Hibee’ email each week from the club which I would suspect everyone who is on the club database recieves. Would it not be possible to include a piece/video within that email possibly with Neil Lennon, Andy Murray, The Proclaimers etc making an appeal of sorts for fans to join up to HSL.

For what it’s worth I’ve donated £10 a month for a few years & haven’t noticed it, but I know that’s not the case for everyone.

OfficialHSL
02-09-2018, 08:02 PM
I am at a bit of a loss as to why they appear to be more successful at securing donations, but one think does strike me is that both the Hearts & Don's schemes seem more closely integrated into their club structure whereas HSL seems to be a standalone scheme run by volunteers rather than the club professionals.
Lago

FOH are the same as HSL in as much as they are a separate entity from the Club run by ordinary supporters. As stated earlier they came from a different starting point but what has helped is :

- single, simple proposition without competing and confusing share offers
- no resistance from other supporter groups spreading misinformation
- some worthy, but not costly incentives
- supporters seeing their donations making a difference to their Club

Aberdeen scheme is too early to comment but there are costs deducted from donations.

HSL

JimboHibs
02-09-2018, 08:03 PM
1700 HSL contributors is really disappointing given our fan base, and the length of time the scheme has been running.
It seems to me that many "supporters" are looking for reasons not to contribute, or maybe Hibs fans are just tighter than our rivals.
The whole share issue has muddied the water, and I think it's time for HSL to consider setting up a simple charitable donation scheme to run alongside the current one.

In your opinion as you've stated what do you think the reasons supporters are looking for not to contribute ?

scooby
02-09-2018, 08:32 PM
In your opinion as you've stated what do you think the reasons supporters are looking for not to contribute ?

As i said in the next paragraph, i think the share issue is the main reason, and definitely a distraction.
I've been paying £18.75 since the early days, but it's the old 80/20 scenario at play.
What are your thoughts?

Jamesconnolly
02-09-2018, 09:08 PM
As it says on the tin :greengrin

After months of humming and hawing I've finally taken the plunge at £10 per month. Funnily enough the main catalyst for my decision has been Hertz successful start to the season. After 5 years where they have barely made a penny from domestic cup runs or Europe and where they have committed over 10 million quid to ground redevelopment they are still competitive and IMO there is no doubt that FOH are the main, in fact the only, reason for that.

Its not being over dramatic to surmise that if and when that new stand is paid for and the FOH donations continue to roll in we are going to find ourselves at a considerable disadvantage to them financially … HSL currently has 1,700 members … FOH has 8,000 members …. If they are contributing an average of £10 each that's a difference of £750,000 every year, which in Scottish football terms is a substantial amount of money.

Like every football fan I live in hope that some disgustingly rich white knight is going to ride over the horizon and turn Hibs into Scotland's Man City …. but the truth is that's a million to one shot at best and until it happens its going to be up to the folk who love this club to ante up and keep us in the race.

I know we all contribute a lot already through season tickets and the like, but the truth is so do the Hearts fans, so the difference is going to be how much more we are willing to do over and above that … as things stand we are lagging miles behind and unless we recognise that fact now in a few years time we will have to face up to the reality of what that means …. the current mini meltdown over a mediocre start to the season has been compounded by their good start to it ……. how much worse will that be if they continue to challenge and we don't?

If that's not enough to convince folk then just think of the smug feeling joining HSL will give you, knowing you are far far better than most of our fans. Don't worry if you have to cut the kids food budget to make the payments either, you will be contributing to the fight against Scotland's rampant obesity crisis …. its a win, win.

GGTTH :greengrin

:flag:Does Vicky know...........:na na:

Lago
02-09-2018, 09:26 PM
Lago

FOH are the same as HSL in as much as they are a separate entity from the Club run by ordinary supporters. As stated earlier they came from a different starting point but what has helped is :

- single, simple proposition without competing and confusing share offers
- no resistance from other supporter groups spreading misinformation
- some worthy, but not costly incentives
- supporters seeing their donations making a difference to their Club

Aberdeen scheme is too early to comment but there are costs deducted from donations.

HSL
Again thank you.

Jamesconnolly
02-09-2018, 09:30 PM
As it says on the tin :greengrin

After months of humming and hawing I've finally taken the plunge at £10 per month. Funnily enough the main catalyst for my decision has been Hertz successful start to the season. After 5 years where they have barely made a penny from domestic cup runs or Europe and where they have committed over 10 million quid to ground redevelopment they are still competitive and IMO there is no doubt that FOH are the main, in fact the only, reason for that.

Its not being over dramatic to surmise that if and when that new stand is paid for and the FOH donations continue to roll in we are going to find ourselves at a considerable disadvantage to them financially … HSL currently has 1,700 members … FOH has 8,000 members …. If they are contributing an average of £10 each that's a difference of £750,000 every year, which in Scottish football terms is a substantial amount of money.

Like every football fan I live in hope that some disgustingly rich white knight is going to ride over the horizon and turn Hibs into Scotland's Man City …. but the truth is that's a million to one shot at best and until it happens its going to be up to the folk who love this club to ante up and keep us in the race.

I know we all contribute a lot already through season tickets and the like, but the truth is so do the Hearts fans, so the difference is going to be how much more we are willing to do over and above that … as things stand we are lagging miles behind and unless we recognise that fact now in a few years time we will have to face up to the reality of what that means …. the current mini meltdown over a mediocre start to the season has been compounded by their good start to it ……. how much worse will that be if they continue to challenge and we don't?

If that's not enough to convince folk then just think of the smug feeling joining HSL will give you, knowing you are far far better than most of our fans. Don't worry if you have to cut the kids food budget to make the payments either, you will be contributing to the fight against Scotland's rampant obesity crisis …. its a win, win.

GGTTH :greengrin

:flag:Does Vicky know...........:na na:

Scotty Leither
02-09-2018, 10:47 PM
Nae Nookie

Thank you for joining and we could not have put it better ourselves.

We try hard not to get too engaged in Fans Forums as we don't want to be constantly " begging for money". Having said this I had a number of conversations with fellow supporters in Molde who were not HSL members ( you know who you are ) and while everyone was aware of HSL the majority were not members. A discussion took place and as a result a number of supporters joined there and then. They said to me they did not fully appreciate what HSL was about and what we were trying to do. They suggested that I try to repeat the story to others.

You refer to FOH in your thread so allow me to add to that. At the moment FOH members are contributing around £1.4m per year. They have already handed over almost £7m. They only have around 19 months to go until the purchase transaction is complete, after that the £1.4m will be available to the Manager to spend on players. In 19 months time the supporters will own the Club therefore it is hard to believe that they will simply walk away at that time.

Aberdeen launched a similar scheme in April of this year. They publicly declared their rationale was to compete with Hibs and Hearts. They refer specifically to FOH and HSL and they urged their fans to get right behind AberDNA to help their Manager. Since April they have attracted over 6000 members and continue to grow.

This is the reality of our competition. We continue to debate what our Board are doing but we need to be aware that they cannot spend what they do not have. The majority of the Club's income can only come from us, the supporters. They, the Board, can only invest what we give them. Aberdeen and Hearts are making more money available to their Manager.

We must decide what we want. Neither of those groups have any "marketing or sales " to speak of, just a simple call to their fans to get behind their Club.

Our plea is equally simple, let's get behind Hibs and make sure we do not get left behind.

https://hiberniansupporters.co.uk/donate/

HSL

You must be the best-kept secret in Scottish football, and I speak as an HSL contributor.

When are you ever on Sportsound for example, or out and about amongst the fans on matchday?

What budget are you afforded by the club to push the scheme?

Genuine questions btw, not looking to have a dig or undermine you in any way.

Criswell
02-09-2018, 11:05 PM
1700 HSL contributors is really disappointing given our fan base, and the length of time the scheme has been running.
It seems to me that many "supporters" are looking for reasons not to contribute, or maybe Hibs fans are just tighter than our rivals.
The whole share issue has muddied the water, and I think it's time for HSL to consider setting up a simple charitable donation scheme to run alongside the current one.

I thought we recently passed the 2000 membership mark. I admit that is still a modest total. The emphasis should be on getting members to sign up on a long term basis and not fall out the scheme once they have paid the initial commitment. (£220 I think) HSL could be more proactive on this issue.

Pagan Hibernia
02-09-2018, 11:15 PM
I thought we recently passed the 2000 membership mark. I admit that is still a modest total. The emphasis should be on getting members to sign up on a long term basis and not fall out the scheme once they have paid the initial commitment. (£220 I think) HSL could be more proactive on this issue.

From what I remember we have over 2200 fans who have donated money to HSL, of which 1700 or so are still either actively donating every month or have reached the £225 required for full membership. Maybe Official HSL can clarify this?

over £620,000 has been raised for the club since the start, which isn’t bad but needs to be better.

And while I appreciate not everyone cares about the share issue, some of us certainly do, and we have now got 16% of the clubs shares safely tucked away from the predatory hands of chancers and asset strippers

NAE NOOKIE
02-09-2018, 11:37 PM
[/B]


HSL has been running for several years and you're subscribing only now. Maybe they are indeed that wee bit more committed than some?

Or maybe the whole HSL initiative has been poorly marketed from the start where only the truly committed lumped in right away like they always do.

I retired from my job just before HSL started which reduced my disposable monthly income by nearly half …. I used some of my pay off to buy shares directly.

I recently started a part time job, which I have taken up purely so I can afford to keep going to Easter Road … IE buy my season ticket and afford the 80 mile round trip two or three times a month … If it wasn't for my commitment to Hibs I could bin the car I need to get to games and the cost of keeping it on the road and save myself the money I spend on season tickets, trips to the odd away game and the other costs that surround going to see Hibs and sit on my fat arse all day living happily on my pension drinking tea, eating cake and watching the telly.

Instead I slave for 10 hours a week mopping up puke and cleaning lavvies just so I can keep going to Easter Road .... with a side effect of that increase in my monthly disposable income meaning I can finally afford to start contributing to HSL at the lower end of the scale.

Does that answer your question? :aok:

NAE NOOKIE
02-09-2018, 11:44 PM
Does Vicky know...........:na na:

She was sitting beside me when I got my card out to fill in the payment details on the DD form ….. she just sighed and looked at the ceiling :greengrin

NAE NOOKIE
03-09-2018, 01:34 AM
[QUOTE=scooby;5541623]1700 HSL contributors is really disappointing given our fan base, and the length of time the scheme has been running.
It seems to me that many "supporters" are looking for reasons not to contribute, or maybe Hibs fans are just tighter than our rivals.
The whole share issue has muddied the water, and I think it's time for HSL to consider setting up a simple charitable donation scheme to run alongside the current one.[/QUOTE

The message that needs to get across is that HSL gets shares in return for its members contributions and that the aim is to keep contributing to the club even after there are no shares left to buy. At which time I presume there will be a change of name to 'friends of Hibs' or something like that.

In all honesty its a pretty simple message and I'm at a loss as to why folk 'allegedly' find it so hard to understand …. there seems to me to be a real failure in publicising it effectively. Even the official site has a link to 'Hibs supporters 1875' … not Hibs supporters Ltd. There is no sticky on a fans forum with over 2000 members. Is there any advert or advice about HSL in the matchday programme?

What about a gimmick …. perhaps after he scores Kamberi could lift his shirt to reveal a T Shirt with JOIN HSL on it. Why don't the club or HSL themselves print a huge banner that could go in the top deck of the south which is empty for most games with 'SUPPORT THE HIBEES' … 'OWN THE HIBEES' .. 'JOIN HSL' on it … folk tend to turn a blind eye to pitchside adverts, a banner in the south would be far more effective IMO.

Hell, the club played a European tie with no advert on our shirts because of local restrictions … why couldn't they have had JOIN HSL on them?

There appears to be very little imagination going into this.

Steve-O
03-09-2018, 02:14 AM
That's for at different thread I think.

ST's are nothing to do with HSL

But the point is kind of similar.

If we can't see where the McGinn money has gone, then how would we know where the HSL money goes?

I haven't read the rest of the thread yet, but I just don't think the message from HSL is simple enough at this stage.

I appreciate HSL don't want to really spend money on marketing, but surely better use of Facebook / Twitter etc with more regular updates would be of use, and not massively time consuming or costly?

It was easy for Hearts to get the message out - "Want to stop the team from being liquidated? Donate to FOH!". And, to be fair, their message was strongly pushed for a long time. I noticed it here in NZ based on rudimentary catch ups on Scottish / Edinburgh news, so they got the marketing right.

I just can't really say the same for HSL at this stage. Videos of The Proclaimers looking sour-pussed and asking for money every now and then aren't going to cut it.

Austinho
03-09-2018, 02:39 AM
Unfortunately I wouldn’t know what HSL was if I didn’t read Hibs.net.

I can only imagine the number of fans unaware of the scheme. Needs a bit of an overhaul, a change of name and a bigger push to get people donating imo. What is the club’s involvement? Surely with their marketing reach they could be offering more help.

GlesgaeHibby
03-09-2018, 05:53 AM
Unfortunately I wouldn’t know what HSL was if I didn’t read Hibs.net.

I can only imagine the number of fans unaware of the scheme. Needs a bit of an overhaul, a change of name and a bigger push to get people donating imo. What is the club’s involvement? Surely with their marketing reach they could be offering more help.

Agree on the name. I was subjected to watching some utter dross called tipping point in the waiting room at kirkwall airport a few weeks back - sponsored by HSL, chair specialists.

Iggy Pope
03-09-2018, 07:52 AM
I retired from my job just before HSL started which reduced my disposable monthly income by nearly half …. I used some of my pay off to buy shares directly.

I recently started a part time job, which I have taken up purely so I can afford to keep going to Easter Road … IE buy my season ticket and afford the 80 mile round trip two or three times a month … If it wasn't for my commitment to Hibs I could bin the car I need to get to games and the cost of keeping it on the road and save myself the money I spend on season tickets, trips to the odd away game and the other costs that surround going to see Hibs and sit on my fat arse all day living happily on my pension drinking tea, eating cake and watching the telly.

Instead I slave for 10 hours a week mopping up puke and cleaning lavvies just so I can keep going to Easter Road .... with a side effect of that increase in my monthly disposable income meaning I can finally afford to start contributing to HSL at the lower end of the scale.

Does that answer your question? :aok:

My post was not intended as a dig although it reads that way. You asked about the commitment of our fans vs Aberdeen's and I used your late arrival to HSL to make a point.
I'm glad you're contributing don't take it personal.

mutley
03-09-2018, 08:13 AM
I have to say I am in the "not sure yet" camp. I agree with some of the comments on this thread that the share issue is a confusing point. My reason for not joining so far, is that I have already bought shares, in the old scheme and the new one, so when I saw the formation of HSL to buy shares to go towards fan Ownership, I thought to myself that I have bought enough shares already.

It is annoying how much Hearts are gaining through FOH, and it has already been covered that they were formed out of necessity or they probably wouldn't exist right now.

It maybe my perception of the 2 schemes but to me, Hearts seem to push FOH a lot more than Hibs push HSL, maybe it's something that can be looked at, a bit more advertising at the stadium/Club website/Hibs TV etc.

I will have to give it more serious thought, but I hope I am not alone when I say I could probably be persuaded to join.

murray26
03-09-2018, 08:25 AM
One incentive should be that your ahead of joe public when it comes to buying tickets for big games.. derbys Sevco/ Celtic away and hampden appearances.. not to much to ask for someone who is donating every month..

tamig
03-09-2018, 08:26 AM
I have to say I am in the "not sure yet" camp. I agree with some of the comments on this thread that the share issue is a confusing point. My reason for not joining so far, is that I have already bought shares, in the old scheme and the new one, so when I saw the formation of HSL to buy shares to go towards fan Ownership, I thought to myself that I have bought enough shares already.

It is annoying how much Hearts are gaining through FOH, and it has already been covered that they were formed out of necessity or they probably wouldn't exist right now.

It maybe my perception of the 2 schemes but to me, Hearts seem to push FOH a lot more than Hibs push HSL, maybe it's something that can be looked at, a bit more advertising at the stadium/Club website/Hibs TV etc.

I will have to give it more serious thought, but I hope I am not alone when I say I could probably be persuaded to join.
The difference with contributing to HSL is that all money goes directly to the football department. If you can afford to do it, please do so.

marinello59
03-09-2018, 08:26 AM
One incentive should be that your ahead of joe public when it comes to buying tickets for big games.. derbys Sevco/ Celtic away and hampden appearances.. not to much to ask for someone who is donating every month..

Ahead of Season ticket holders?

hibbydad
03-09-2018, 09:16 AM
You are right Tamig I wish some people on here would smell the coffee. Sadly there are no white knights on the horizon and HSL remains the best way to bring fresh finance into the club. If we don't waken up we are going to fall behind our main rivals

murray26
03-09-2018, 09:29 AM
Ahead of Season ticket holders?

No definitely not.. just a small window between S/T holders and public sale..

OfficialHSL
03-09-2018, 09:44 AM
I have to say I am in the "not sure yet" camp. I agree with some of the comments on this thread that the share issue is a confusing point. My reason for not joining so far, is that I have already bought shares, in the old scheme and the new one, so when I saw the formation of HSL to buy shares to go towards fan Ownership, I thought to myself that I have bought enough shares already.

It is annoying how much Hearts are gaining through FOH, and it has already been covered that they were formed out of necessity or they probably wouldn't exist right now.

It maybe my perception of the 2 schemes but to me, Hearts seem to push FOH a lot more than Hibs push HSL, maybe it's something that can be looked at, a bit more advertising at the stadium/Club website/Hibs TV etc.

I will have to give it more serious thought, but I hope I am not alone when I say I could probably be persuaded to join.

Mutley

This is where the FOH had an advantage, there was only one proposition put to fans which involved a small, my long term commitment to the cause which of course is proving to be the most attractive to all involved.

It's not too late for us, all we need is fans like you, if you can afford it, to join HSL for a small amount that you feel you wont miss.

We would love to have you on board.


HSL

cocteautwin
03-09-2018, 09:51 AM
To further highlight just how far ahead HMFC are ahead of HFC when it comes to financing their club, HMFC benefactors have pumped at least £8m of cash in to “Project Hearts” (since Admin) in addition to the £7m pumped in by the 8000 or whatever fans at FoH. This £8m includes Budge donations, Anonymous donations etc. They’ve also taken out bank loans of £2m to help finance the project and they also have some anonymous guys paying for the sponsorship deal with Save the Children.

This lot totals anywhere between £16-18m. That’s at least £16m in addition to the normal football club income such as season tickets, walk up tickets, club shop, pies etc. £SIXTEEN MILLION POUNDS! Put that in a glass with ice, swirl it around and have a sniff.

When HMFC don’t have a new main stand to pay for, they are going to be the third best financed club in Scotland. Absolutely miles ahead of us.

Lago
03-09-2018, 10:29 AM
To further highlight just how far ahead HMFC are ahead of HFC when it comes to financing their club, HMFC benefactors have pumped at least £8m of cash in to “Project Hearts” (since Admin) in addition to the £7m pumped in by the 8000 or whatever fans at FoH. This £8m includes Budge donations, Anonymous donations etc. They’ve also taken out bank loans of £2m to help finance the project and they also have some anonymous guys paying for the sponsorship deal with Save the Children.

This lot totals anywhere between £16-18m. That’s at least £16m in addition to the normal football club income such as season tickets, walk up tickets, club shop, pies etc. £SIXTEEN MILLION POUNDS! Put that in a glass with ice, swirl it around and have a sniff.

When HMFC don’t have a new main stand to pay for, they are going to be the third best financed club in Scotland. Absolutely miles ahead of us.
Frightening.

BILLYHIBS
03-09-2018, 10:59 AM
Just joined! We can’t afford to be left behind Hearts. Fair play to them their supporters have put their money where their mouths are maybe they got a big fright after administration it is a road we don’t want to go down. We need to increase awareness and subscriptions to HSL and who knows with enough subscribers Scott Allan might now be a HIBS player?

murray26
03-09-2018, 11:01 AM
Time to push this hard or it could be more years of trailing them .. not a pleasant thought..

WhileTheChief..
03-09-2018, 11:19 AM
Under 2000 subscribers when he have 13k plus ST holders tells its own story.

It’s not that people are not aware of HSL or don’t know how to sign up.

The simple fact is that the vast majority of us, for whatever reasons, don’t want to.

I know this annoys some of you but you have to accept that those of you who are so passionate about HSL and fan ownership are absolutely in the minority compared to the rest of the fan base.

Sorry, but that’s just the way it is. I have no idea how you hope to somehow entice another 6000 or so folk to join.

matty_f
03-09-2018, 11:21 AM
Under 2000 subscribers when he have 13k plus ST holders tells its own story.

It’s not that people are not aware of HSL or don’t know how to sign up.

The simple fact is that the vast majority of us, for whatever reasons, don’t want to.

I know this annoys some of you but you have to accept that those of you who are so passionate about HSL and fan ownership are absolutely in the minority compared to the rest of the fan base.

Sorry, but that’s just the way it is. I have no idea how you hope to somehow entice another 6000 or so folk to join.

Just because it's like that now didn't mean it'll always be like that.

We need more people to sign up, unless we're content to fall behind our rivals.

Chic Murray
03-09-2018, 11:23 AM
Nothing like a knee jerk reaction.

If we trail Hearts at the end of the season, and they keep up their form, there may be something in all this. I'll wait and see.

I much prefer clubs to make their money trading players, and getting punters through the gate. It focuses the "football department"'s brain better.

SirDavidsNapper
03-09-2018, 11:41 AM
Nothing like a knee jerk reaction.

If we trail Hearts at the end of the season, and they keep up their form, there may be something in all this. I'll wait and see.

I much prefer clubs to make their money trading players, and getting punters through the gate. It focuses the "football department"'s brain better.

Was thinking the same. I cant beleive some of the overreaction. I guess its normal after a poor defeat and performance. Its been that long I'd forgotten what it's like.

WhileTheChief..
03-09-2018, 12:13 PM
We need more people to sign up, unless we're content to fall behind our rivals.

If we are relying on HSL donations to keep up with Hearts then our business model is all wrong.

If what you say is true then, yup, we will fall behind and just have to deal with it.

hibbydad
03-09-2018, 12:23 PM
People are just not understanding this it is about creating working capital for the club to invest in the playing staff. I am just so amazed at Hibs supporters who will readily accept the yams being ahead of us

matty_f
03-09-2018, 12:28 PM
If we are relying on HSL donations to keep up with Hearts then our business model is all wrong.

If what you say is true then, yup, we will fall behind and just have to deal with it.

How would the club keep up with Hearts without this help, when hearts are getting around £160k/month from their fans via FoH?

I'd be amazed if a business model exists for us to bring in that amount to keep up.

hibbydad
03-09-2018, 12:34 PM
You are perfectly correct Matty I can't understand what is wrong with people they are so Opposed to HSL

hibbymac
03-09-2018, 12:35 PM
People are just not understanding this it is about creating working capital for the club to invest in the playing staff. I am just so amazed at Hibs supporters who will readily accept the yams being ahead of us

:confused: I thought the FOH was set up to "save the club" by building up enough money to pay back Ann Budge. Also some of the funds being diverted to help pay for their new stand.

I didn't think they were contributing to the clubs "working capital".

CropleyWasGod
03-09-2018, 12:38 PM
:confused: I thought the FOH was set up to "save the club" by building up enough money to pay back Ann Budge. Also some of the funds being diverted to help pay for their new stand.

I didn't think they were contributing to the clubs "working capital.

They did in the early (2 or 3?) years.

Then the money was diverted to the new stand.

When that's done, they will revert to Plan A, to repay Dr. B.

And then... they will be contributing to working capital.

Lago
03-09-2018, 12:40 PM
Just joined! We can’t afford to be left behind Hearts. Fair play to them their supporters have put their money where their mouths are maybe they got a big fright after administration it is a road we don’t want to go down. We need to increase awareness and subscriptions to HSL and who knows with enough subscribers Scott Allan might now be a HIBS player?
I have to say that because of the ongoing discussion I had a look at the Aberdeen membership against the HSL offering & here are few thoughts.
1) finding info on Don's web site so straight forward, easily found on the top banner, click on it & a full menu of costs & awards. Attractive easily understood, it sold itself immediately. I'd join if I supported them.

2) HSL had to navigate Hibernian web site & missed it first time round, then ok found it. All about share ownership, fan ownership of the club, fan appointed Directors, a photo of David Grey signing up & a statement that all funds go to support the team.
A FAQ section talking about why & where, what would happen should S.Tom Farmer sell,etc etc etc. Sorry but HSL didn't sell itself & that shows in the fact there are 2200 subcribers after being on the go for some time.
Aberdeen 6000 after just being launched.
Perhaps HSL is too complicated, not focused not everyone is interested in fan ownership, I have my doubts. Whether you like it or not Budge has promoted, push on & put money into Hearts, I know she expects to get it back.
Same with Stewart Milne, money actively pushing promoting Dons.
Sir Tom doesn't like football a benign saviour.
Anyway just my thoughts.

WhileTheChief..
03-09-2018, 12:47 PM
How would the club keep up with Hearts without this help, when hearts are getting around £160k/month from their fans via FoH?

I'd be amazed if a business model exists for us to bring in that amount to keep up.

We can’t, that’s my point.

Unless something happens that threatens our existence then there is zero chance of Hibs fans collectively donating £160k a month.

That’s a huge figure and enormous credit should be given to Hearts fans for continuing to donate.

Mind how everyone here told us that the direct debits would stop once they were out of admin, got promoted, had a few bad results etc?!

That was all wishful thinking.

As another poster said, the way we compete is by being astute in the transfer market and trading players for profit.

Increased commercial activity off the pitch and continued good performances on it and we will do just fine.

A few more folk donating a couple of quid a month won’t do diddly squat.

hibbymac
03-09-2018, 12:47 PM
They did in the early (2 or 3?) years.

Then the money was diverted to the new stand.

When that's done, they will revert to Plan A, to repay Dr. B.

And then... they will be contributing to working capital.

:aok: That's my take on it, the way some are making out, it is as though the money is going straight to the team/playing budget.

tamig
03-09-2018, 01:01 PM
Nothing like a knee jerk reaction.

If we trail Hearts at the end of the season, and they keep up their form, there may be something in all this. I'll wait and see.

I much prefer clubs to make their money trading players, and getting punters through the gate. It focuses the "football department"'s brain better.
Don’t take this personally but compacency like this is a huge threat. Times are changing and schemes like HSL and FOH are the way ahead. Did you read the figures quoted by cocteautwin? Is that comfortable reading for you? If not, you can do something about it. Its not hard.

hibbydad
03-09-2018, 01:12 PM
Hibby Mac you are missing the point once the budgie has been paid off it will all be going to working capital. When you look at the size of their squad it already looks as though some of the money is being diverted to pay wages.

hibbymac
03-09-2018, 01:19 PM
Hibby Mac you are missing the point once the budgie has been paid off it will all be going to working capital. When you look at the size of their squad it already looks as though some of the money is being diverted to pay wages.

Don't think I'm missing any point, you stated... "People are just not understanding this it is about creating working capital for the club to invest in the playing staff."

FOH/Hearts are not doing that at the moment, they are paying for a stand and repaying Budge. As CWG said earlier, once that is all paid, then if they are still contributing to FOH, that money would more than likely be put straight into the "working capital" of the club

tamig
03-09-2018, 01:37 PM
Don't think I'm missing any point, you stated... "People are just not understanding this it is about creating working capital for the club to invest in the playing staff."

FOH/Hearts are not doing that at the moment, they are paying for a stand and repaying Budge. As CWG said earlier, once that is all paid, then if they are still contributing to FOH, that money would more than likely be put straight into the "working capital" of the club

They are also being propped up by their mystery benefactors which will no doubt help with their playing budget.

Eaststandee
03-09-2018, 01:44 PM
Will a sticky be placed on the forum to encourage/help people to sign up? Seems like the obvious thing to do.

:flag:

Austinho
03-09-2018, 01:46 PM
Will a sticky be placed on the forum to encourage/help people to sign up? Seems like the obvious thing to do.

:flag:Do people read the stickys? I tend to skip right past them.

cocteautwin
03-09-2018, 01:53 PM
Do people read the stickys? I tend to skip right past them.

Same as you. I’m completely blind to the stickies. My eyes go straight down to the main forum.


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Eaststandee
03-09-2018, 02:00 PM
Do people read the stickys? I tend to skip right past them.

Well there is only 3 of them, 2 are beautiful and one is for fundraising.

But a thread where someone can read what HSL is about (without muddying comments) and a link to the website and explanation on how it all works would be a good thing, especially going by the amount of questions that every HSL thread has on it.

I think it was yourself that said if it wasn't for .net you wouldn't know about HSL, that's exactly why there should be a sticky IMO. :aok:

Leithenhibby
03-09-2018, 02:07 PM
Don't think I'm missing any point, you stated... "People are just not understanding this it is about creating working capital for the club to invest in the playing staff."

FOH/Hearts are not doing that at the moment, they are paying for a stand and repaying Budge. As CWG said earlier, once that is all paid, then if they are still contributing to FOH, that money would more than likely be put straight into the "working capital" of the club

Do you honestly think that FoH would object to a % of their cash going towards a signing? There are many ways to slice a pie within a budget.

GGTTH

hhibs
03-09-2018, 02:13 PM
As it says on the tin :greengrin

After months of humming and hawing I've finally taken the plunge at £10 per month. Funnily enough the main catalyst for my decision has been Hertz successful start to the season. After 5 years where they have barely made a penny from domestic cup runs or Europe and where they have committed over 10 million quid to ground redevelopment they are still competitive and IMO there is no doubt that FOH are the main, in fact the only, reason for that.

Its not being over dramatic to surmise that if and when that new stand is paid for and the FOH donations continue to roll in we are going to find ourselves at a considerable disadvantage to them financially … HSL currently has 1,700 members … FOH has 8,000 members …. If they are contributing an average of £10 each that's a difference of £750,000 every year, which in Scottish football terms is a substantial amount of money.

Like every football fan I live in hope that some disgustingly rich white knight is going to ride over the horizon and turn Hibs into Scotland's Man City …. but the truth is that's a million to one shot at best and until it happens its going to be up to the folk who love this club to ante up and keep us in the race.

I know we all contribute a lot already through season tickets and the like, but the truth is so do the Hearts fans, so the difference is going to be how much more we are willing to do over and above that … as things stand we are lagging miles behind and unless we recognise that fact now in a few years time we will have to face up to the reality of what that means …. the current mini meltdown over a mediocre start to the season has been compounded by their good start to it ……. how much worse will that be if they continue to challenge and we don't?

If that's not enough to convince folk then just think of the smug feeling joining HSL will give you, knowing you are far far better than most of our fans. Don't worry if you have to cut the kids food budget to make the payments either, you will be contributing to the fight against Scotland's rampant obesity crisis …. its a win, win.

GGTTH :greengrin

:flag:


Well done and welcome to the HSL

hhibs
03-09-2018, 02:27 PM
I do think one of the reasons was the break down in trust with boards of the past and ,to some extent the continued,if figurehead, involvement of Rod Petrie in the club.

I am by no means saying that there should be a connection,as an HSL member myself,but ,I do think this is a strong underlying reason,trust when lost can be incredibly hard to recover.

That covers the fans that know about it, but ,there are still a large number of fans who have only have a vague and probably inaccurate view of HSL

I do think HSL might benefit from an allowance from the funds being allowed to used for marketing and promotion, marketing is a little better than in the past but is still pretty poor. IMO.

hibbymac
03-09-2018, 02:28 PM
Do you honestly think that FoH would object to a % of their cash going towards a signing? There are many ways to slice a pie within a budget.

GGTTH

:confused::confused: where did I say FOH "would object to a % of their cash going towards a signing"? I am simply stating the reason for FOH and its contributions.

21.05.2016
03-09-2018, 04:16 PM
I contribute £18.75 a month, its not much but the more supporters that sign up and even give even the min payment, it all adds up.

I'd like to see the HSL put more into rallying support up. I get what was said in HSL's earlier post on here about not wanting to bombard this forum with posts as it seems like they are constantly rattling the begging bowls which is fair enough but perhaps for example on match days they could set up stalls or something and give the supporters a chance to ask questions etc and hopefully get a few more folk signed up.

Hearts have done well to rally a lot of support behind FoH but I wish we would stop comparing the HSL to them. They HAD to get as many supporters signed up as possible as they were in dire straights and dangerously close to losing their club due to financial disaster. We, thankfully, aren't in such a desperate do or die position, this is simply to create bigger funds for the manager, not to save the club.

Leithenhibby
03-09-2018, 04:21 PM
Hibby Mac you are missing the point once the budgie has been paid off it will all be going to working capital. When you look at the size of their squad it already looks as though some of the money is being diverted to pay wages.


Don't think I'm missing any point, you stated... "People are just not understanding this it is about creating working capital for the club to invest in the playing staff."

FOH/Hearts are not doing that at the moment, they are paying for a stand and repaying Budge. As CWG said earlier, once that is all paid, then if they are still contributing to FOH, that money would more than likely be put straight into the "working capital" of the club


:confused::confused: where did I say FOH "would object to a % of their cash going towards a signing"? I am simply stating the reason for FOH and its contributions.

The way I read your post was you stating that they (FoH) were paying for a stand & Ann Budge. As far as I'm concerned, they can divvy it up any way they like as my only concern is what we can do at ER. I may well have misunderstood your point, it's no big deal. :aok:

Ozyhibby
03-09-2018, 04:21 PM
HSL need to copy this. It works.

https://www.foundationofhearts.org/about-the-fan-rewards-scheme/


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Leithenhibby
03-09-2018, 04:26 PM
HSL need to copy this. It works.

https://www.foundationofhearts.org/about-the-fan-rewards-scheme/


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Aw, you mean like, 'loyalty points'... :stirrer::greengrin

Ozyhibby
03-09-2018, 04:42 PM
Aw, you mean like, 'loyalty points'... :stirrer::greengrin

Exactly but without the ticket access. [emoji23]
Have a read at that though. There is nothing of any value given away as a reward at any of the levels. A framed photo seems to be it.
But the yam I chat with in the pub can’t wait till he gets the full set. He’s told me exactly where they are going to be hung in his house, the lot.
When they get to a certain level they get invited into Tynecastle on a lunchtime where a buffet is put on and there is a pay bar and Gary Locke is there to present with their latest reward.
By the time my mate gets the last one he will have contributed the best part of £2k.
Does he care that the framed photos could prob be bought for £50 for the lot? Does he heck.
Have we got fans like that? Have we got fans that would like to be invited into the hospitality at Easter road to be presented with their framed 1991 League cup limited edition framed photo by Keith Wright? Absolutely we have, loads of them.
Rewards like that cost nothing but mean a lot to football fans.

We don’t need to offer discounts on tickets or for the shop etc like Aberdeen.
Football fans just like feeling like they belong. Give them that and they will gladly give money for the privilege.



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Lago
03-09-2018, 04:43 PM
HSL need to copy this. It works.

https://www.foundationofhearts.org/about-the-fan-rewards-scheme/


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Your right, hate to say it but really professional presentation. As you say just copy it.

Iggy Pope
03-09-2018, 04:51 PM
I worry that there's too much talk again about HSL, what it means, where the money goes. Badly marketed from the start, (fairly) high profile opposition, crap communications and a fair bit of fudging when it came to re-engaging on the back of this European campaign.
Scottish Cup win, great campaign last year, big crowds same old stuff from HSL who seem happy to spraff about the ****ing Hearts model.. Seriously. What is the percentage of season holders against contributors? In other words, 13,000 vs what?
Can debate it to death on here with anonymous usernames and you'll never know who you're conversing with as this site represents a fraction of the demographic. I go to games with 4 other non .net users and 3 of them are non-HSL.

OfficialHSL
03-09-2018, 05:17 PM
You must be the best-kept secret in Scottish football, and I speak as an HSL contributor.

When are you ever on Sportsound for example, or out and about amongst the fans on matchday?

What budget are you afforded by the club to push the scheme?

Genuine questions btw, not looking to have a dig or undermine you in any way.

Scotty

We appreciate that you are not intending to have a dig and we will of course continue to make efforts to raise our profile. Here a couple of things we have tried in the past :

- We wrote to everyone on the Club database ( 30,000 + ) making them aware of HSL and what we were trying to achieve

- as recently as May we were on Sky Sports live and throughout the day promoting the HSL message

- we have had pop up stands in all sections of the ground at various points but general feedback suggested that fans simply did not want to engage on match day

- we have had numerous articles in the Edinburgh Evening News who have been very generous towards us

- we have distributed 20000 leaflets on match days ( twice )

- we have done presentations to a number of supporter Branches at the Hibs Club

- the Club have promoted us numerous times on their web site


We have presented to a room of 60 Hibs fans and had a Q & A session afterwards to ensure that everything is understood and walked out with one Member Application Form

As we have said on other occasions it would seem that supporters know we are there but we believe that the biggest hurdle is apathy, the feeling that there isn't really any need to do anything.

Having said all of that, our Membership continues to grow and we really do believe that the tide is turning and more and more supporters see HSL for what it is - a simple way to financially assist our Club, in the same way that FOH are assisting their Club.

We will be on all evening and are happy to debate any issues raised.


HSL

OfficialHSL
03-09-2018, 05:42 PM
Under 2000 subscribers when he have 13k plus ST holders tells its own story.

It’s not that people are not aware of HSL or don’t know how to sign up.

The simple fact is that the vast majority of us, for whatever reasons, don’t want to.

I know this annoys some of you but you have to accept that those of you who are so passionate about HSL and fan ownership are absolutely in the minority compared to the rest of the fan base.

Sorry, but that’s just the way it is. I have no idea how you hope to somehow entice another 6000 or so folk to join.

While the Chief

Couldn't agree more.

The only point we would want to add is to remind everyone that HSL isn't some abstract third party ( we know you weren't suggesting this ), it is us, the ordinary supporters. We can assure you that your current Directors are not rampant fanatics demanding 100% fan ownership. The Board decided that the wanted supporters to own part of the Club and we agreed that this made sense and would help in the long run. Our primary target is to achieve a meaningful stake of 25.1 %. After that it is for supporters to decide. If there isn't an appetite for more then there won't be any more.
The great thing about HSL and how things are structured is that it provides a simple, efficient means by which fans can financially assist our Club. The money donated is not going to any existing shareholders it is going to the football dept. We bring to the attention of our supporters what is going on around us and it is then up to them to decide what they want for our Club. We have no desire to coerce, embarrass or indeed "sell". Just help if you can and you want to.


HSL

Chuck Rhoades
03-09-2018, 06:22 PM
One of the biggest issues was the DD stopping after 12 months. I would have kept contributing, but never got round to doing it again. I did send a couple of one-off donations during European offering.

That said, I’ve finally got round to registering again but the website is saying im already registered when im trying to set up a new DD. Can anyone help?

Chuck Rhoades
03-09-2018, 06:23 PM
While the Chief

Couldn't agree more.

The only point we would want to add is to remind everyone that HSL isn't some abstract third party ( we know you weren't suggesting this ), it is us, the ordinary supporters. We can assure you that your current Directors are not rampant fanatics demanding 100% fan ownership. The Board decided that the wanted supporters to own part of the Club and we agreed that this made sense and would help in the long run. Our primary target is to achieve a meaningful stake of 25.1 %. After that it is for supporters to decide. If there isn't an appetite for more then there won't be any more.
The great thing about HSL and how things are structured is that it provides a simple, efficient means by which fans can financially assist our Club. The money donated is not going to any existing shareholders it is going to the football dept. We bring to the attention of our supporters what is going on around us and it is then up to them to decide what they want for our Club. We have no desire to coerce, embarrass or indeed "sell". Just help if you can and you want to.


HSL


Could the website not get the % bought up, working like a bit of a count? Always feel that gets the debate going, people see it increasing etc. Similar to the ticket dot counts in here.

OfficialHSL
03-09-2018, 06:39 PM
One of the biggest issues was the DD stopping after 12 months. I would have kept contributing, but never got round to doing it again. I did send a couple of one-off donations during European offering.

That said, I’ve finally got round to registering again but the website is saying im already registered when im trying to set up a new DD. Can anyone help?

Please email us at info@hiberniansupporters.co.uk and we will be happy to help.


HSL

OfficialHSL
03-09-2018, 06:49 PM
Exactly but without the ticket access. [emoji23]
Have a read at that though. There is nothing of any value given away as a reward at any of the levels. A framed photo seems to be it.
But the yam I chat with in the pub can’t wait till he gets the full set. He’s told me exactly where they are going to be hung in his house, the lot.
When they get to a certain level they get invited into Tynecastle on a lunchtime where a buffet is put on and there is a pay bar and Gary Locke is there to present with their latest reward.
By the time my mate gets the last one he will have contributed the best part of £2k.
Does he care that the framed photos could prob be bought for £50 for the lot? Does he heck.
Have we got fans like that? Have we got fans that would like to be invited into the hospitality at Easter road to be presented with their framed 1991 League cup limited edition framed photo by Keith Wright? Absolutely we have, loads of them.
Rewards like that cost nothing but mean a lot to football fans.

We don’t need to offer discounts on tickets or for the shop etc like Aberdeen.
Football fans just like feeling like they belong. Give them that and they will gladly give money for the privilege.




Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkOzy

We agree completely and intend to progress these things. Circumstances in the past have prevented us moving some of these things forward but perhaps that now that HSL have more members there will be an appetite to do some if not all of these things.


HSL

Chuck Rhoades
03-09-2018, 07:10 PM
Please email us at info@hiberniansupporters.co.uk and we will be happy to help.


HSL

Done.

WhileTheChief..
03-09-2018, 07:22 PM
While the Chief

Couldn't agree more.

The only point we would want to add is to remind everyone that HSL isn't some abstract third party ( we know you weren't suggesting this ), it is us, the ordinary supporters. We can assure you that your current Directors are not rampant fanatics demanding 100% fan ownership. The Board decided that the wanted supporters to own part of the Club and we agreed that this made sense and would help in the long run. Our primary target is to achieve a meaningful stake of 25.1 %. After that it is for supporters to decide. If there isn't an appetite for more then there won't be any more.
The great thing about HSL and how things are structured is that it provides a simple, efficient means by which fans can financially assist our Club. The money donated is not going to any existing shareholders it is going to the football dept. We bring to the attention of our supporters what is going on around us and it is then up to them to decide what they want for our Club. We have no desire to coerce, embarrass or indeed "sell". Just help if you can and you want to.


HSL

I genuinely admire what you guys do and agree with what you say above.

I think it’s important that folk realise you guys are just ordinary fans like the rest of us and do this in your own time.

The concept is simple and as you say it gives people who want to own a part of the club a way to do so. Everyone and their granny should know by now that the funds raised are given to the club and that no one else benefits financially.

I’ve mentioned before about my concerns with fan ownership so won’t repeat myself again.

The latest fashion though appears to be that whenever we have a bad result the cry will be that we need the fans to donate more money.

I strongly disagree with this and when I see folk say “donate a tenner, ever little helps” I think it sucks.

It just won’t.

Whether Hibs have my £10 a month or not makes not one iota of a difference to anything.

OfficialHSL
03-09-2018, 07:27 PM
As it says on the tin :greengrin

After months of humming and hawing I've finally taken the plunge at £10 per month. Funnily enough the main catalyst for my decision has been Hertz successful start to the season. After 5 years where they have barely made a penny from domestic cup runs or Europe and where they have committed over 10 million quid to ground redevelopment they are still competitive and IMO there is no doubt that FOH are the main, in fact the only, reason for that.

Its not being over dramatic to surmise that if and when that new stand is paid for and the FOH donations continue to roll in we are going to find ourselves at a considerable disadvantage to them financially … HSL currently has 1,700 members … FOH has 8,000 members …. If they are contributing an average of £10 each that's a difference of £750,000 every year, which in Scottish football terms is a substantial amount of money.

Like every football fan I live in hope that some disgustingly rich white knight is going to ride over the horizon and turn Hibs into Scotland's Man City …. but the truth is that's a million to one shot at best and until it happens its going to be up to the folk who love this club to ante up and keep us in the race.

I know we all contribute a lot already through season tickets and the like, but the truth is so do the Hearts fans, so the difference is going to be how much more we are willing to do over and above that … as things stand we are lagging miles behind and unless we recognise that fact now in a few years time we will have to face up to the reality of what that means …. the current mini meltdown over a mediocre start to the season has been compounded by their good start to it ……. how much worse will that be if they continue to challenge and we don't?

If that's not enough to convince folk then just think of the smug feeling joining HSL will give you, knowing you are far far better than most of our fans. Don't worry if you have to cut the kids food budget to make the payments either, you will be contributing to the fight against Scotland's rampant obesity crisis …. its a win, win.

GGTTH :greengrin

:flag:

Nae Nookie

Once again thank you for launching this thread. In that last few hours alone we have had 10 new supporters join HSL.

It takes about one minute to join and while you may not feel £10 pm adds up to much as others have shown when many thousands pay the same amount it adds millions to our Managers budget.

Thank you


HSL

Blaster
03-09-2018, 07:27 PM
Ozy

We agree completely and intend to progress these things. Circumstances in the past have prevented us moving some of these things forward but perhaps that now that HSL have more members there will be an appetite to do some if not all of these things.


HSL

Even encouraging existing members to pay just an extra £1 a month if they can. Yes try and get many new members as we can but see what existing members could maybe add too.

If 20% do it, it would be around an extra £300+ a month

Eyrie
03-09-2018, 07:40 PM
I genuinely admire what you guys do and agree with what you say above.

I think it’s important that folk realise you guys are just ordinary fans like the rest of us and do this in your own time.

The concept is simple and as you say it gives people who want to own a part of the club a way to do so. Everyone and their granny should know by now that the funds raised are given to the club and that no one else benefits financially.

I’ve mentioned before about my concerns with fan ownership so won’t repeat myself again.

The latest fashion though appears to be that whenever we have a bad result the cry will be that we need the fans to donate more money.

I strongly disagree with this and when I see folk say “donate a tenner, ever little helps” I think it sucks.

It just won’t.

Whether Hibs have my £10 a month or not makes not one iota of a difference to anything.
If everyone took the attitude that their tenner won't make a difference, then there would be no money going into Hibs.

If a thousand people took the attitude that their tenner can help make a difference, then that would be £120k extra per year in cash for the club. And as that money has not been budgeted for, it goes straight into the playing budget.

Scale that up - if four thousand people did that we'd have an extra £480k per year, and that's assuming everyone is paying a tenner a month. Some will pay more.

Of course, if all four thousand took the view that their tenner wouldn't make a difference, then our club would have £480k less each year.

That is the iota of difference that we can make together.

Ozyhibby
03-09-2018, 07:46 PM
If everyone took the attitude that their tenner won't make a difference, then there would be no money going into Hibs.

If a thousand people took the attitude that their tenner can help make a difference, then that would be £120k extra per year in cash for the club. And as that money has not been budgeted for, it goes straight into the playing budget.

Scale that up - if four thousand people did that we'd have an extra £480k per year, and that's assuming everyone is paying a tenner a month. Some will pay more.

Of course, if all four thousand took the view that their tenner wouldn't make a difference, then our club would have £480k less each year.

That is the iota of difference that we can make together.

And £480k is enough for three players at the top of our wage structure.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

WhileTheChief..
03-09-2018, 07:51 PM
^ That kinda goes without saying though!

The point being that around 11000 fans do share that attitude apparently.

There can’t be a Hibs fan alive that isn’t aware of HSL. We’ve had numerous discussions on here with people suggesting ways to increase take up etc over the last few years.

We won the Cup and with all the euphoria that brought and increased attendances etc yet hardly any new members have signed up. Why do you think that is?

Dream up as many incentives or initiatives that you like but I’ll bet that the demand just won’t be there and there will never be 4000 subscribers.

You’d be as well hoping for an Arab billionaire buying us. Probably more chance of that happening!

Eyrie
03-09-2018, 08:01 PM
^ That kinda goes without saying though!

The point being that around 11000 fans do share that attitude apparently.

There can’t be a Hibs fan alive that isn’t aware of HSL. We’ve had numerous discussions on here with people suggesting ways to increase take up etc over the last few years.

We won the Cup and with all the euphoria that brought and increased attendances etc yet hardly any new members have signed up. Why do you think that is?

Dream up as many incentives or initiatives that you like but I’ll bet that the demand just won’t be there and there will never be 4000 subscribers.

You’d be as well hoping for an Arab billionaire buying us. Probably more chance of that happening!

HSL has about half that number at present, so 4000 shouldn't be impossible.

Worth noting that our two comparable rivals Hearts and Aberdeen have been able to persuade thousands of their fans to sign up to pay cash each month.

I don't have the answer why they can do it but we can't. I do know that I can do my bit to help and hope that others will realise that they can also do their bit which, when added together, will make a difference.

Lancs Harp
03-09-2018, 08:01 PM
^ That kinda goes without saying though!

The point being that around 11000 fans do share that attitude apparently.

There can’t be a Hibs fan alive that isn’t aware of HSL. We’ve had numerous discussions on here with people suggesting ways to increase take up etc over the last few years.

We won the Cup and with all the euphoria that brought and increased attendances etc yet hardly any new members have signed up. Why do you think that is?

Dream up as many incentives or initiatives that you like but I’ll bet that the demand just won’t be there and there will never be 4000 subscribers.

You’d be as well hoping for an Arab billionaire buying us. Probably more chance of that happening!

Not sure I agree with that WTC, if I didn't read this message board I'm pretty sure I wouldn't have a clue about what HSL was about, and I'd guess the vast majority of Hibs fans never read Hibs.net. Who knows how many subscribers HSL would have with a sustained recruitment campaign behind it, we really don't know do we we are just casting our opinions. It doesnt sound like HSL are particularly interested in pushing things on that front from what has been said on this thread so its immaterial anyway.

GlesgaeHibby
03-09-2018, 08:07 PM
If everyone took the attitude that their tenner won't make a difference, then there would be no money going into Hibs.

If a thousand people took the attitude that their tenner can help make a difference, then that would be £120k extra per year in cash for the club. And as that money has not been budgeted for, it goes straight into the playing budget.

Scale that up - if four thousand people did that we'd have an extra £480k per year, and that's assuming everyone is paying a tenner a month. Some will pay more.

Of course, if all four thousand took the view that their tenner wouldn't make a difference, then our club would have £480k less each year.

That is the iota of difference that we can make together.

If we didn't have a clown like Neil Doncaster in charge of the SPFL we would have a tv deal worth 2-3 x the current package (just look at what other similarly sized nations get). That would be potentially worth £1.5-£4m more for a hibs team finishing top 4. We have a great product, best supported top league per capita in Europe and we sell ourself short by having a balloon like Doncaster in charge. The potential money from a decent (fair) tv deal is way more than the money you suggested from HSL.

I'm not meaning that as a dig at HSL, I think it's great there is a group that want to do something to help Hibs grow and improve. I just wish we had competent people running our game in Scotland as increased TV money would be a massive boost to the (already good imo) product.

007 Mickey Weir
03-09-2018, 08:07 PM
As it says on the tin :greengrin

After months of humming and hawing I've finally taken the plunge at £10 per month. Funnily enough the main catalyst for my decision has been Hertz successful start to the season. After 5 years where they have barely made a penny from domestic cup runs or Europe and where they have committed over 10 million quid to ground redevelopment they are still competitive and IMO there is no doubt that FOH are the main, in fact the only, reason for that.

Its not being over dramatic to surmise that if and when that new stand is paid for and the FOH donations continue to roll in we are going to find ourselves at a considerable disadvantage to them financially … HSL currently has 1,700 members … FOH has 8,000 members …. If they are contributing an average of £10 each that's a difference of £750,000 every year, which in Scottish football terms is a substantial amount of money.

Like every football fan I live in hope that some disgustingly rich white knight is going to ride over the horizon and turn Hibs into Scotland's Man City …. but the truth is that's a million to one shot at best and until it happens its going to be up to the folk who love this club to ante up and keep us in the race.

I know we all contribute a lot already through season tickets and the like, but the truth is so do the Hearts fans, so the difference is going to be how much more we are willing to do over and above that … as things stand we are lagging miles behind and unless we recognise that fact now in a few years time we will have to face up to the reality of what that means …. the current mini meltdown over a mediocre start to the season has been compounded by their good start to it ……. how much worse will that be if they continue to challenge and we don't?

If that's not enough to convince folk then just think of the smug feeling joining HSL will give you, knowing you are far far better than most of our fans. Don't worry if you have to cut the kids food budget to make the payments either, you will be contributing to the fight against Scotland's rampant obesity crisis …. its a win, win.

GGTTH :greengrin

:flag:

Great post! This is the exact reason I started my DD in the summer. I have it coming off on pay day and never notice it. Great way to add a little extra. GGTTH

Eyrie
03-09-2018, 08:09 PM
If we didn't have a clown like Neil Doncaster in charge of the SPFL we would have a tv deal worth 2-3 x the current package (just look at what other similarly sized nations get). That would be potentially worth £1.5-£4m more for a hibs team finishing top 4. We have a great product, best supported top league per capita in Europe and we sell ourself short by having a balloon like Doncaster in charge. The potential money from a decent (fair) tv deal is way more than the money you suggested from HSL.

I'm not meaning that as a dig at HSL, I think it's great there is a group that want to do something to help Hibs grow and improve. I just wish we had competent people running our game in Scotland as increased TV money would be a massive boost to the (already good imo) product.

Imagine what could happen if we could combine that improved TV deal with a much larger HSL membership?

However only the increased HSL membership is in our own hands.

WhileTheChief..
03-09-2018, 08:11 PM
Between the internet, the Evening News and fans talking its nigh on impossible not to have heard of HSL by now if you’re a Hibs fan.

Let me ask you this, do you know of anyone that isn’t aware?

Now let’s open it up to the board in general, does anyone on here that’s read this thread know of a Hibs fan that hasn’t heard of HSL?!!!

If your answer is yes then you’ve clearly not been doing your job! Get talking about it!

These things need to have an initial impact. Start with a bang and get folk clamouring to join. That ship has well and truly sailed I’m afraid.

The best they can hope for now is a handful of new subscribers a season unless, god forbid, we lurch into financial disaster, or face Armageddon!

murray26
03-09-2018, 08:23 PM
Between the internet, the Evening News and fans talking its nigh on impossible not to have heard of HSL by now if you’re a Hibs fan.

Let me ask you this, do you know of anyone that isn’t aware?

Now let’s open it up to the board in general, does anyone on here that’s read this thread know of a Hibs fan that hasn’t heard of HSL?!!!

If your answer is yes then you’ve clearly not been doing your job! Get talking about it!

These things need to have an initial impact. Start with a bang and get folk clamouring to join. That ship has well and truly sailed I’m afraid.

The best they can hope for now is a handful of new subscribers a season unless, god forbid, we lurch into financial disaster, or face Armageddon!

Your right.. let’s do nothing and watch Hearts and Aberdeen pull further and further away from us.. you then may have your scenario where we are on our knees because fans start drifting away again.. now is the time to push this hard ..

GlesgaeHibby
03-09-2018, 08:27 PM
Imagine what could happen if we could combine that improved TV deal with a much larger HSL membership?

However only the increased HSL membership is in our own hands.

Your right, we can have frustrations about the guys running the game but have no control and can only work with what we can control.

Chuck Rhoades
03-09-2018, 08:49 PM
Please email us at info@hiberniansupporters.co.uk and we will be happy to help.


HSL

Thanks for your help. Now contributing what I can afford again.

Hopefully this thread encourages others to do the same.

mutley
03-09-2018, 09:12 PM
Has HSL thought about a flyer/application form to get sent out with the ST renewal letters? Then that way every current ST holder would have no reason to not know about it. (Ok, I know the renewal letters and about 6 months away, but just a thought)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

mutley
03-09-2018, 09:15 PM
Mutley

This is where the FOH had an advantage, there was only one proposition put to fans which involved a small, my long term commitment to the cause which of course is proving to be the most attractive to all involved.

It's not too late for us, all we need is fans like you, if you can afford it, to join HSL for a small amount that you feel you wont miss.

We would love to have you on board.


HSL

OK, you've finally got me!! Ive just signed up :flag:

Hibbyradge
03-09-2018, 09:30 PM
OK, you've finally got me!! Ive just signed up :flag:

:thumbsup:

Danderhall Hibs
03-09-2018, 10:02 PM
Exactly but without the ticket access. [emoji23]
Have a read at that though. There is nothing of any value given away as a reward at any of the levels. A framed photo seems to be it.
But the yam I chat with in the pub can’t wait till he gets the full set. He’s told me exactly where they are going to be hung in his house, the lot.
When they get to a certain level they get invited into Tynecastle on a lunchtime where a buffet is put on and there is a pay bar and Gary Locke is there to present with their latest reward.
By the time my mate gets the last one he will have contributed the best part of £2k.
Does he care that the framed photos could prob be bought for £50 for the lot? Does he heck.
Have we got fans like that? Have we got fans that would like to be invited into the hospitality at Easter road to be presented with their framed 1991 League cup limited edition framed photo by Keith Wright? Absolutely we have, loads of them.
Rewards like that cost nothing but mean a lot to football fans.

We don’t need to offer discounts on tickets or for the shop etc like Aberdeen.
Football fans just like feeling like they belong. Give them that and they will gladly give money for the privilege.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Good post ozy.

Mental that DDs were automatically stopped after the first 12 months as well. Can those DDs not be started again or at least those folk be contacted to ask if they want to restart?

mutley
03-09-2018, 10:15 PM
Good post ozy.

Mental that DDs were automatically stopped after the first 12 months as well. Can those DDs not be started again or at least those folk be contacted to ask if they want to restart?

As I’ve just signed up, I got a message stating that my DD will remain indefinitely until I choose to cancel it, so I assume that the auto-cancel has been changed now.


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Danderhall Hibs
03-09-2018, 10:23 PM
As I’ve just signed up, I got a message stating that my DD will remain indefinitely until I choose to cancel it, so I assume that the auto-cancel has been changed now.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

:aok: good. Must’ve been a good few “lost” to HSL though from the initial batch? Can HSLofficial give us numbers and/or a plan on how to get those members back? They were the first group that bought into the concept and you’d think would be the easiest to keep on the hook?

duffers
04-09-2018, 06:17 AM
:aok: good. Must’ve been a good few “lost” to HSL though from the initial batch? Can HSLofficial give us numbers and/or a plan on how to get those members back? They were the first group that bought into the concept and you’d think would be the easiest to keep on the hook?

Mines stopped after the initial 12 months as many others would have. I wasn’t even aware at the time it was going to be stopped, but I’ve not signed back up since. I did try around 3/4 months ago but it wasn’t letting me as I already had an account set-up. I tried using the email option but not convinced it sent. I will get back round to it, and admittedly I could have been a lot more proactive, but the 12 month roll was a bit of an own goal. Glad HSL have realised this and changed it to “rolling”.

But in the mean time, if anyone from HSL can advise how I go about kick starting my DD, that would be great.

Pagan Hibernia
04-09-2018, 07:11 AM
the 12 month roll was a bit of an own goal.

it certainly was. I’m a supporter of HSL but this was a massive error... how many thousands of pounds have we missed out on from people who would have been only to keen to let their direct debits continue...

initial teething problems but the whole thing seems to function better now

Just Alf
04-09-2018, 07:36 AM
it certainly was. I’m a supporter of HSL but this was a massive error... how many thousands of pounds have we missed out on from people who would have been only to keen to let their direct debits continue...

initial teething problems but the whole thing seems to function better nowI'm sure it was mentioned on here when people started to see their payments stop that it was originally set up the way it was due to a legal issue. This was later clarified and the change made to the rolling contribution, you're right though, the horses have bolted re the 1st lot and it's that wee bit harder to round them back up again.

One good thing about this thread, my mate has no interest in shares and now that HSL have confirmed they'll take the cash and hand it over to Hibs with no shares coming the other way he's seriously considering it again. :agree

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SirDavidsNapper
04-09-2018, 09:10 AM
I'm not able to buy a season ticket due to work and family commitments so HSL payments are great as i still feel i'm contributing to the club every month. Stupidly decided to get married :rolleyes: but once that is out the way i'll definitely up my DD. Everyone's circumstances are different and we all know money is tight but even if all our season ticket holders could contribute a couple quid a month then that would probably cover a wage for the likes of Scott Allan. Crazy when you think of it like that. Is there a minimum you can pay every month or can you pay anything?

WhileTheChief..
04-09-2018, 10:21 AM
I'm not able to buy a season ticket due to work and family commitments so HSL payments are great as i still feel i'm contributing to the club every month. Stupidly decided to get married :rolleyes: but once that is out the way i'll definitely up my DD. Everyone's circumstances are different and we all know money is tight but even if all our season ticket holders could contribute a couple quid a month then that would probably cover a wage for the likes of Scott Allan. Crazy when you think of it like that. Is there a minimum you can pay every month or can you pay anything?

It used to be that buying a ST was good enough.

Now you want all of us who buy one to donate an extra couple of quid each month?

This is unbelievable.

Why not just increase ticket prices for everyone and be done with the whole damn thing.

Leithenhibby
04-09-2018, 10:49 AM
I'm not able to buy a season ticket due to work and family commitments so HSL payments are great as i still feel i'm contributing to the club every month. Stupidly decided to get married :rolleyes: but once that is out the way i'll definitely up my DD. Everyone's circumstances are different and we all know money is tight but even if all our season ticket holders could contribute a couple quid a month then that would probably cover a wage for the likes of Scott Allan. Crazy when you think of it like that. Is there a minimum you can pay every month or can you pay anything?

Brilliant, welcome to feeling part of the Hibs family, before too long you'll have your own family by the sounds of it. :wink::greengrin


It used to be that buying a ST was good enough.

Now you want all of us who buy one to donate an extra couple of quid each month?

This is unbelievable.

Why not just increase ticket prices for everyone and be done with the whole damn thing.

I agree, buying a ST was possibly enough, but the game in Scotland has (throughout Europe) changed hugely over the years.

That would probably affect way more fans as some are possibly already struggling to meet the cost of a ST.

HSL, has always stressed that this is only if your finances allow you to donate, like SallyCinnamon, and many others.

https://hiberniansupporters.co.uk/

Blaster
04-09-2018, 11:12 AM
It used to be that buying a ST was good enough.

Now you want all of us who buy one to donate an extra couple of quid each month?

This is unbelievable.

Why not just increase ticket prices for everyone and be done with the whole damn thing.

It is enough for most folk. This is just reaching out to those of us who can give a little more and other fans who can’t make games etc but would still like to contribute

My family have 5 season tickets. 2 adults, 1 senior and 1 youth/1 child. Out of the 3 who could possibly pay into HSL finances dictate that only I do. Luckily I can afford to and want to but others can’t.

Focus has to be on those who can afford it and not adding costs to those who can’t

pollution
04-09-2018, 11:16 AM
Do Hibs directors contribute to HSL?

WhileTheChief..
04-09-2018, 11:25 AM
It is enough for most folk. This is just reaching out to those of us who can give a little more and other fans who can’t make games etc but would still like to contribute

My family have 5 season tickets. 2 adults, 1 senior and 1 youth/1 child. Out of the 3 who could possibly pay into HSL finances dictate that only I do. Luckily I can afford to and want to but others can’t.

Focus has to be on those who can afford it and not adding costs to those who can’t

I totally get that.

What I don’t get is someone who isn’t a ST holder suggesting that all ST holders should donate more!!

Enough is enough.

Donate if you want but stop ****** pestering the rest of us, especially when we already do our bit.

Leithenhibby
04-09-2018, 11:43 AM
I totally get that.

What I don’t get is someone who isn’t a ST holder suggesting that all ST holders should donate more!!

Enough is enough.

Donate if you want but stop ****** pestering the rest of us, especially when we already do our bit.

Not sure that's the case, certainly not from where I'm sitting.

Have a nice day :aok:

Chuck Rhoades
04-09-2018, 12:15 PM
Be good to get an answer on the DD expiring piece and how this audience could be targetted to restart. A key failure and missed opportunity.

Chuck Rhoades
04-09-2018, 12:16 PM
Mines stopped after the initial 12 months as many others would have. I wasn’t even aware at the time it was going to be stopped, but I’ve not signed back up since. I did try around 3/4 months ago but it wasn’t letting me as I already had an account set-up. I tried using the email option but not convinced it sent. I will get back round to it, and admittedly I could have been a lot more proactive, but the 12 month roll was a bit of an own goal. Glad HSL have realised this and changed it to “rolling”.

But in the mean time, if anyone from HSL can advise how I go about kick starting my DD, that would be great.

Same problem. Email them and they trigger the reactivation for your R, done the same last night👍🏻

Ozyhibby
04-09-2018, 12:47 PM
I totally get that.

What I don’t get is someone who isn’t a ST holder suggesting that all ST holders should donate more!!

Enough is enough.

Donate if you want but stop ****** pestering the rest of us, especially when we already do our bit.

Who's pestering who? You have more posts on this thread than most.

If you are not interested then thats fine, but why give those who want to give a bit more a hard time?

SirDavidsNapper
04-09-2018, 01:06 PM
It used to be that buying a ST was good enough.

Now you want all of us who buy one to donate an extra couple of quid each month?

This is unbelievable.

Why not just increase ticket prices for everyone and be done with the whole damn thing.

Keep your hair on. The question at the end wasn't directed at ST holders it was a question to HSL

hibbydad
04-09-2018, 01:09 PM
If you are prepared to pay extra for ticket prices why not just donate to HSL

SRHibs
04-09-2018, 01:18 PM
The difference with contributing to HSL is that all money goes directly to the football department. If you can afford to do it, please do so.

Is there something we can see to show that this is the case? What stops Hibs from shifting money they had allocated to the football department and replacing it with the HSL money?

Is there an observable increase in budget from HSL donations?

Ozyhibby
04-09-2018, 01:43 PM
Is there something we can see to show that this is the case? What stops Hibs from shifting moment they had allocated to the football department and replacing it with the HSL money?

Is there an observable increase in budget from HSL donations?

Usually the clubs accounts show no obvious signs of waste.
This summers transfer window activity feels like we may not have spent all we could have though but there is no real way of knowing until the accounts come out.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

hibbydad
04-09-2018, 02:03 PM
The big transactions of this window won't appear till the 2019 accounts Oz. Why are people so untrusting of the club. If any of you have been a director of a company you will realise that company law is very strict on such matters. I just feel it is any excuse to avoid contributing to HSL

Ozyhibby
04-09-2018, 02:06 PM
The big transactions of this window won't appear till the 2019 accounts Oz. Why are people so untrusting of the club. If any of you have been a director of a company you will realise that company law is very strict on such matters. I just feel it is any excuse to avoid contributing to HSL

I’m not saying any law has been broken.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

WhileTheChief..
04-09-2018, 02:07 PM
Who's pestering who? You have more posts on this thread than most.

If you are not interested then thats fine, but why give those who want to give a bit more a hard time?

Hang on, I was responding to the poster who wants all ST holders to pay a bit more.

I have never given anyone a hard time that does donate and I wouldn’t want to discourage those that do.

SirDavidsNapper
04-09-2018, 02:29 PM
Hang on, I was responding to the poster who wants all ST holders to pay a bit more.

I have never given anyone a hard time that does donate and I wouldn’t want to discourage those that do.

Who on here wants all season ticket holders to pay more? That isn't what i said.

I said "even if all our season ticket holders could contribute a couple quid a month then that would probably cover a wage for the likes of Scott Allan. Crazy when you think of it like that" It was a generalisation not an instruction.

hibbydad
04-09-2018, 02:34 PM
I know you are not Oz when I referred to you it was about the accounts which we will have to wait for next year to see the figures. The reference to the law was because others appear to be questioning the integrity of the directors. As I said before for some it's any excuse to avoid contributing to HSL but they will be the first ones to shout when our rivals march ahead of us

OfficialHSL
04-09-2018, 04:17 PM
Good post ozy.

Mental that DDs were automatically stopped after the first 12 months as well. Can those DDs not be started again or at least those folk be contacted to ask if they want to restart?

The fixed term DD's only operated for a short period at the start, from Feb 15 until Aug 15. At the outset we did not want to presume that contributors would want to pay long term and we were worried that many would be put off from joining if we set up indefinite DD's. We quickly realised that most Members fully intended to continue paying and we altered things. We have just checked our records and we note that we have contacted this group on no less than 8 occasions asking if they would consider resuming their DD. You will appreciate we don't want to keep pestering them.


HSL

OfficialHSL
04-09-2018, 04:18 PM
:aok: good. Must’ve been a good few “lost” to HSL though from the initial batch? Can HSLofficial give us numbers and/or a plan on how to get those members back? They were the first group that bought into the concept and you’d think would be the easiest to keep on the hook?

Please see reply above.

HSL

OfficialHSL
04-09-2018, 04:20 PM
Mines stopped after the initial 12 months as many others would have. I wasn’t even aware at the time it was going to be stopped, but I’ve not signed back up since. I did try around 3/4 months ago but it wasn’t letting me as I already had an account set-up. I tried using the email option but not convinced it sent. I will get back round to it, and admittedly I could have been a lot more proactive, but the 12 month roll was a bit of an own goal. Glad HSL have realised this and changed it to “rolling”.

But in the mean time, if anyone from HSL can advise how I go about kick starting my DD, that would be great.

No problem, just sent us an email to info@hiberniansupporters.co.uk telling us how much you want to pay and we will do the rest.


HSL

OfficialHSL
04-09-2018, 04:26 PM
it certainly was. I’m a supporter of HSL but this was a massive error... how many thousands of pounds have we missed out on from people who would have been only to keen to let their direct debits continue...

initial teething problems but the whole thing seems to function better now

Easter Rising

You are right, with hindsight it would have been better to set these up on an indefinite basis however all 7 of the HSL Directors were concerned that seeking such an open ended commitment would have put many off. Please bear in mind how things were at that time. We had just been relegated, two fan "groups" were voicing concerns and there wasn't a great deal of trust or goodwill around at the time. We did however quickly change this and of course followed up that group on many occasions to resume payments with some success.

HSL

OfficialHSL
04-09-2018, 04:27 PM
I'm not able to buy a season ticket due to work and family commitments so HSL payments are great as i still feel i'm contributing to the club every month. Stupidly decided to get married :rolleyes: but once that is out the way i'll definitely up my DD. Everyone's circumstances are different and we all know money is tight but even if all our season ticket holders could contribute a couple quid a month then that would probably cover a wage for the likes of Scott Allan. Crazy when you think of it like that. Is there a minimum you can pay every month or can you pay anything?

£7.73 per month, nice number that.


HSL

OfficialHSL
04-09-2018, 04:32 PM
Be good to get an answer on the DD expiring piece and how this audience could be targetted to restart. A key failure and missed opportunity.

Trust you will have noted our response. Please note that this represents a few hundred and while obviously very important our biggest challenge is to encourage 000's of fellow supporters to join in if they can. We hope we have just as many supporters as other Clubs who can afford some additional financial support for the Club.


HSL

OfficialHSL
04-09-2018, 04:38 PM
Is there something we can see to show that this is the case? What stops Hibs from shifting money they had allocated to the football department and replacing it with the HSL money?

Is there an observable increase in budget from HSL donations?

SRHibs

We have the assurance from Leeann and the rest of the Board that our funding is directed to the football Dept. You will of course recall Leeann confirming after winning the Scottish Cup that there were players in that squad who simply would not have been there without HSL contributions ( and of course the private shareholder monies ).


HSL

BILLYHIBS
04-09-2018, 05:01 PM
Don’t know if already mentioned but how about an article in a match programme explaining the point and purpose of HSL with testimonials and detailing how fans however small can make contributions and highlighting the good that these contributions do by quoting past successes. Anything just to put it out there!

OfficialHSL
04-09-2018, 05:21 PM
Don’t know if already mentioned but how about an article in a match programme explaining the point and purpose of HSL with testimonials and detailing how fans however small can make contributions and highlighting the good that these contributions do by quoting past successes. Anything just to put it out there!

Billy

Thank you for your interest and suggestion. It's on the list of items to discuss when we meet with Leeann.


HSL

Danderhall Hibs
04-09-2018, 05:42 PM
The fixed term DD's only operated for a short period at the start, from Feb 15 until Aug 15. At the outset we did not want to presume that contributors would want to pay long term and we were worried that many would be put off from joining if we set up indefinite DD's. We quickly realised that most Members fully intended to continue paying and we altered things. We have just checked our records and we note that we have contacted this group on no less than 8 occasions asking if they would consider resuming their DD. You will appreciate we don't want to keep pestering them.


HSL

:aok: absolutely - any more would be pestering them. Real missed opportunity as the initial sign ups were likely to be the easiest to stay “in”.

Can you start the dds again and let the individuality stop them if they want to cancel?

OfficialHSL
04-09-2018, 06:02 PM
:aok: absolutely - any more would be pestering them. Real missed opportunity as the initial sign ups were likely to be the easiest to stay “in”.

Can you start the dds again and let the individuality stop them if they want to cancel?

Not sure I fully understand your question ?


HSL

Danderhall Hibs
04-09-2018, 06:11 PM
Not sure I fully understand your question ?


HSL

Sorry. When direct debits are set up they usually remain active until the individual cancels. So could you start to collect from those that set the DD up again?

Send a notification out saying “thanks for your support - we intend to start collecting the payments on 1st October.”

OfficialHSL
04-09-2018, 07:06 PM
Sorry. When direct debits are set up they usually remain active until the individual cancels. So could you start to collect from those that set the DD up again?

Send a notification out saying “thanks for your support - we intend to start collecting the payments on 1st October.”


Danderhal Hibs

Ok , got it now.

DD's can be set up for an indefinite period or a specified period. As a result of the circumstances at all 7 of the HSL Directors concluded that it would be too presumptuous and indeed potentially off putting if we asked for an indefinite period. As stated earlier this only lasted for six months and all DD's from Aug 15 onwards are on an indefinite basis.

We cannot collect from those DD's with a defined period but we have invited on many occasions those Members to start a new one. We are not allowed to take an "opt out" approach as you suggest as this does not comply with the Direct Debit system.

We will however write again to these Members given the increasing profile of HSL.

For those that feel that HSL has been a failure can we remind everyone that we now own over 16% of the Club and are less than 4% away from a Board appointment. More importantly we have made an impact and have allowed players to join our Club who would not have joined without our contribution. To the 2000 + supporters who have donated, thank you so much and well done.

To the 10,000 + potential supporters can we say please help us and come and join HSL. Don't let us fall behind.



HSL

Danderhall Hibs
04-09-2018, 08:18 PM
Danderhal Hibs

Ok , got it now.

DD's can be set up for an indefinite period or a specified period. As a result of the circumstances at all 7 of the HSL Directors concluded that it would be too presumptuous and indeed potentially off putting if we asked for an indefinite period. As stated earlier this only lasted for six months and all DD's from Aug 15 onwards are on an indefinite basis.

We cannot collect from those DD's with a defined period but we have invited on many occasions those Members to start a new one. We are not allowed to take an "opt out" approach as you suggest as this does not comply with the Direct Debit system.

We will however write again to these Members given the increasing profile of HSL.

For those that feel that HSL has been a failure can we remind everyone that we now own over 16% of the Club and are less than 4% away from a Board appointment. More importantly we have made an impact and have allowed players to join our Club who would not have joined without our contribution. To the 2000 + supporters who have donated, thank you so much and well done.

To the 10,000 + potential supporters can we say please help us and come and join HSL. Don't let us fall behind.



HSL

Fair enough - it did feel a bit dodgy as I was typing it!

Iggy Pope
05-09-2018, 02:52 PM
Danderhal Hibs


For those that feel that HSL has been a failure can we remind everyone that we now own over 16% of the Club and are less than 4% away from a Board appointment. More importantly we have made an impact and have allowed players to join our Club who would not have joined without our contribution. To the 2000 + supporters who have donated, thank you so much and well done.

To the 10,000 + potential supporters can we say please help us and come and join HSL. Don't let us fall behind.



HSL

I'm sorry it's always a long debate when it comes to HSL and it really shouldn't be after all this time. It's a wee bit further up the thread but I asked how the ST database weighed against the HSL subscription.
Does the 10,000 + potential support quoted here refer to ST holders who haven't yet subscribed and how many perpetual subscribers are there in amongst that 2,000 that we do have?

I'm genuinely intrigued, and ask as a continuing subscriber. Still trying to get to 5 out of every 6 season ticket holders (and I know there are kids in there) doesn't sound great neither does 16% ownership given the original target that was striven for.

hibbydad
05-09-2018, 02:57 PM
There is a real need to keep this issue to the forefront of everyone's minds in the hope that we can get a much larger uptake of subscribers

OfficialHSL
05-09-2018, 03:08 PM
I'm sorry it's always a long debate when it comes to HSL and it really shouldn't be after all this time. It's a wee bit further up the thread but I asked how the ST database weighed against the HSL subscription.
Does the 10,000 + potential support quoted here refer to ST holders who haven't yet subscribed and how many perpetual subscribers are there in amongst that 2,000 that we do have?

I'm genuinely intrigued, and ask as a continuing subscriber. Still trying to get to 5 out of every 6 season ticket holders (and I know there are kids in there) doesn't sound great neither does 16% ownership given the original target that was striven for.

Iggy

Sorry if we have missed a question.

We don't know with any certainty what our actual penetration of the Season Ticket database is as the Club hold that database. It is of course the entire Hibs family database we are trying to penetrate rather than any particular segment, or rather that segment with surplus funds. This can be Season Ticket holders, elderly who can no longer attend, supporters no longer living close to Edinburgh etc. What we do know is that there are 000's of supporters who have not yet joined.

It's difficult to give an accurate number of regular donators because many are contributing but not necessarily every month. The monthly subscribers is around 1700.

Our principal target was 25.1 % and given that our next subscription is likely to take us to 17% were are not far away. As stated on many occasions our biggest motivation is to get extra funds to our Manager to help improve the product on the park.

As noted elsewhere we have had many hurdles to confront but we remain focussed on trying to help our Team.

HSL

Iggy Pope
05-09-2018, 03:11 PM
Iggy

Sorry if we have missed a question.

We don't know with any certainty what our actual penetration of the Season Ticket database is as the Club hold that database. It is of course the entire Hibs family database we are trying to penetrate rather than any particular segment, or rather that segment with surplus funds. This can be Season Ticket holders, elderly who can no longer attend, supporters no longer living close to Edinburgh etc. What we do know is that there are 000's of supporters who have not yet joined.

It's difficult to give an accurate number of regular donators because many are contributing but not necessarily every month. The monthly subscribers is around 1700.

Our principal target was 25.1 % and given that our next subscription is likely to take us to 17% were are not far away. As stated on many occasions our biggest motivation is to get extra funds to our Manager to help improve the product on the park.

As noted elsewhere we have had many hurdles to confront but we remain focussed on trying to help our Team.

HSL

Same focus.
Lots of work to do and good luck with it.
Stevie.

mutley
05-09-2018, 03:25 PM
I think one of the real issues is the general understanding of HSL. That is why it took me so long to sign up, I didn't fully understand the whole concept, (and I don't think the name helped either, sorry), I know it has been mentioned to death, but the way FOH has gone about their business seems to be the way to go. All the hearts fans understood it and went for it, which kept them afloat and now seems to be giving them a huge financial advantage, maybe not immediately, but it will in the future.

I also think that the club could do more to promote this too though, some advertising inside the stadium, Tanoy announcements on match days, better adverts on the club website etc.

The other "fan" groups that fought against this didn't help either, but that's seems to be a bit more settled and I think there could be ideas that push for more membership. There is a lot of talk on this thread referencing ST holders, but that shouldn't necessarily be the case. Yes that is a good way to encourage more to join (as I previously mentioned a flyer/application form in the ST renewal letters could help) but HSL should also be looking towards non ST holders as a way to contribute to the club.(Yes I know that they are already doing this).

I understand that publicity and advertising all costs money, and I hate to use the phrase "speculate to accumulate" but maybe there could be a meeting with some HSL members to get some ideas together to boost membership. There has already been some great suggestions on this thread I just hope that numbers continue to grow, but as I see it right now, there just isn't enough of us to make any significant difference in the same way that FOH is doing over the road.

There must be a lot of fans out there, who are like me, sitting on the fence thinking "will I? won't I?" and just need that little push over to the edge.

Lang Toun hibby
05-09-2018, 03:31 PM
Billy

Thank you for your interest and suggestion. It's on the list of items to discuss when we meet with Leeann.


HSL

My suggestion would be to announce weekly (all Hibs mediaoutlets) the take up for HSL. It’s a bit like the season ticket count or thenumber of tickets selling for a game. i.e. people are interested, and I believeit would encourage more to join.

OfficialHSL
05-09-2018, 05:13 PM
I think one of the real issues is the general understanding of HSL. That is why it took me so long to sign up, I didn't fully understand the whole concept, (and I don't think the name helped either, sorry), I know it has been mentioned to death, but the way FOH has gone about their business seems to be the way to go. All the hearts fans understood it and went for it, which kept them afloat and now seems to be giving them a huge financial advantage, maybe not immediately, but it will in the future.

I also think that the club could do more to promote this too though, some advertising inside the stadium, Tanoy announcements on match days, better adverts on the club website etc.

The other "fan" groups that fought against this didn't help either, but that's seems to be a bit more settled and I think there could be ideas that push for more membership. There is a lot of talk on this thread referencing ST holders, but that shouldn't necessarily be the case. Yes that is a good way to encourage more to join (as I previously mentioned a flyer/application form in the ST renewal letters could help) but HSL should also be looking towards non ST holders as a way to contribute to the club.(Yes I know that they are already doing this).

I understand that publicity and advertising all costs money, and I hate to use the phrase "speculate to accumulate" but maybe there could be a meeting with some HSL members to get some ideas together to boost membership. There has already been some great suggestions on this thread I just hope that numbers continue to grow, but as I see it right now, there just isn't enough of us to make any significant difference in the same way that FOH is doing over the road.

There must be a lot of fans out there, who are like me, sitting on the fence thinking "will I? won't I?" and just need that little push over to the edge.

Mutley

Thank you for your thoughts they are appreciated.

Perhaps you wouldn't mind being a guinea pig. Given that you are sitting on the fence it would really help us if we can understand why ?

Why have you not joined so far ?

HSL

tynehibs
05-09-2018, 05:29 PM
I thought he had signed up?

mutley
05-09-2018, 05:42 PM
Mutley

Thank you for your thoughts they are appreciated.

Perhaps you wouldn't mind being a guinea pig. Given that you are sitting on the fence it would really help us if we can understand why ?

Why have you not joined so far ?

HSL


I thought he had signed up?

I have signed up, done it last night, ( I went for the £18.75 as it was a nice touch).

BUT my point is that I had to sit and think about it. And to be honest, if it wasn't for Nae Nookie starting this thread, I probably wouldn't have. So my point is that Yes a lot of fans know about HSL, but it soon drifts to the back of your mind, then you forget about it. (I HATE saying this BUT if you look at the way the yams got behind FOH, and the fact that they see it everywhere/all talking about it etc)

I don't think HSL has that In-Your-Face approach that FOH had.

Probably most of our fans know of or have heard of the name HSL without knowing much else about it.

El Gubbz
05-09-2018, 06:48 PM
I have signed up, done it last night, ( I went for the £18.75 as it was a nice touch).

BUT my point is that I had to sit and think about it. And to be honest, if it wasn't for Nae Nookie starting this thread, I probably wouldn't have. So my point is that Yes a lot of fans know about HSL, but it soon drifts to the back of your mind, then you forget about it. (I HATE saying this BUT if you look at the way the yams got behind FOH, and the fact that they see it everywhere/all talking about it etc)

I don't think HSL has that In-Your-Face approach that FOH had.

Probably most of our fans know of or have heard of the name HSL without knowing much else about it.

Different ball game with our friends across the city. They were blackmailed into a direct debit for an undefined period of time or the risk of losing their club...

The kind of threat turns a £20 a month donator into a £50 a month donator and force a non donator to go fetch their sort code and account number. I know quite a few jambos who were £50 a month donators and just kept it going as once they started they barely noticed it coming out. Thankfully Cathro forced a few to cancel their DD's...

Hibs started their HSL campaign in the championship after fans had been subjected to guff after guff watching our best players leave without the income making it's way back on to the pitch so was never gonna drum up the same level of support. Think HSL are doing all the right thinks - kinda - but I hate that most sales pitches end with a guilt trip statement like "Can you afford not to" or "Don't let us lag behind" that kind of stuff only sells in politics, they need to be more positive and sell all the benefits of being in the scheme and paint a proper picture of how the future looks with the extra investment IMO.

Hearts fans lap up any kind of positive propaganda propelled from the PBS whereas we're a much more savvy bunch, backing the team to no end when things are going good but as soon as the wheels start to come off our gate seems to drop off in a way unique to Hibs. Things on (despite saturday) and off the pitch at the moment are the healthiest in my life time but I do worry how sustainable it will be after one poor season...

SirDavidsNapper
05-09-2018, 06:48 PM
I have signed up, done it last night, ( I went for the £18.75 as it was a nice touch).

BUT my point is that I had to sit and think about it. And to be honest, if it wasn't for Nae Nookie starting this thread, I probably wouldn't have. So my point is that Yes a lot of fans know about HSL, but it soon drifts to the back of your mind, then you forget about it. (I HATE saying this BUT if you look at the way the yams got behind FOH, and the fact that they see it everywhere/all talking about it etc)

I don't think HSL has that In-Your-Face approach that FOH had.

Probably most of our fans know of or have heard of the name HSL without knowing much else about it.

FOH was set up to literally save Hearts from liquidation. Thank our lucky stars HSL didn't need that In-Your-face approach! If HSL was for the same reason it would have similar numbers to Hearts. Im more interested in how Aberdeen have gone about their scheme. They have a few thousand less season ticket holders than us so maybe more of their fans want to contribute in another way where as we're maxing out on season tickets and maybe some are reluctant to pay more.

Eyrie
05-09-2018, 08:04 PM
FOH was set up to literally save Hearts from liquidation. Thank our lucky stars HSL didn't need that In-Your-face approach! If HSL was for the same reason it would have similar numbers to Hearts. Im more interested in how Aberdeen have gone about their scheme. They have a few thousand less season ticket holders than us so maybe more of their fans want to contribute in another way where as we're maxing out on season tickets and maybe some are reluctant to pay more.

I think the Aberdeen scheme offers various discounts, which makes it attractive to their fans but will reduce the overall money raised.

Scotty Leither
05-09-2018, 10:35 PM
Have you ever considered selling batch shares? EffectiveLy becoming a de facto broker...I think what puts a lot of folk off is it's a bit mystifying at the moment what goes where in terms of purchase of shares?

It's too "bitty" for me at the moment, and it needs the club to get more on board to what the end game is.

Pagan Hibernia
06-09-2018, 04:37 AM
Have you ever considered selling batch shares? EffectiveLy becoming a de facto broker...I think what puts a lot of folk off is it's a bit mystifying at the moment what goes where in terms of purchase of shares?

It's too "bitty" for me at the moment, and it needs the club to get more on board to what the end game is.

HSL holds shares in the club on behalf of its members, I would imagine they would need the consent of the membership to sell any off again...

Personally I want them to get to the 25.1% stake to safeguard the club, so I wouldn’t support such a proposal.

do you mind me asking what’s mystifying? As far as I know every month people donate money to HSL and every month they hand that money to HFC. They get newly issued shares in return, and their shareholding grows. The club get more investment for the team. HSLs members, while not technically shareholders themselves, are the co-owners of a company that is now a major shareholder. Have I got that right Official HSL?

hibbydad
06-09-2018, 07:14 AM
You are totally tight Easter Rising it never fails to amaze me the excuses people come up with to avoid joining HSL yet they will be the first to moan when the yams steal a march on us

SirDavidsNapper
06-09-2018, 07:22 AM
I think the Aberdeen scheme offers various discounts, which makes it attractive to their fans but will reduce the overall money raised.

Thanks wasn't aware of that. Would be interesting to know the net amount it generates fr them per month.

jodjam
06-09-2018, 07:28 AM
You are totally tight Easter Rising it never fails to amaze me the excuses people come up with to avoid joining HSL yet they will be the first to moan when the yams steal a march on us

You say it never fails to amaze you. So my excuse will amaze you also. I feel I contribute enough in the season tickets i buy. Nothing really amazing in that statement.

And im not one of the first to moan if Hertz steal a march on us. Its sport. There are many factors where one team can be better than another and not just cash. And i still reckon we will finish higher than that mob this year

BILLYHIBS
06-09-2018, 07:33 AM
I get that the purpose of HSL is to give the fans a say at board level and achieve a 25.1% holding of shares in order that the club is never sold from under us but I wonder how the Hibernian Lotto is doing as that is advertised as being in aid of the Managers Players Fund ? Does anyone know? That must surely be a money spinner. I cannot remember the last time I had three numbers up yet alone the jackpot! :confused:

Ozyhibby
06-09-2018, 08:10 AM
I get that the purpose of HSL is to give the fans a say at board level and achieve a 25.1% holding of shares in order that the club is never sold from under us but I wonder how the Hibernian Lotto is doing as that is advertised as being in aid of the Managers Players Fund ? Does anyone know? That must surely be a money spinner. I cannot remember the last time I had three numbers up yet alone the jackpot! :confused:

A small fraction of the lotto money goes to Hibs. With HSL it all goes to Hibs.


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SirDavidsNapper
06-09-2018, 08:10 AM
I've been quite impressed at the way HSL has gone about promoting the scheme of late. Night and day from when it kicked off. It's definitely become more high profile than a couple years back.

I'm not sure if it's already been done but if not, promoting HSL on match day might help? A piece from the stadium announcer, advertising boards, a stall outside the ground for sign ups, posters in the local boozers if allowed. Being brutally honest i think most people (not all) are more interested in our payments going to the playing budget rather than buying shares and fan ownership etc and maybe that's the biggest issue for the slow uptake. If it had been driven at increasing the playing budget it may have been bigger at this point.

The communication on here is great and like i've said it's definitely gathering a bit of momentum now so massive well done. Keep up the good work.

hibbydad
06-09-2018, 08:13 AM
I was talking about 2 or 3 years down the line jodjam. Surely it is about taking the club on to the next level and yes cash is crucial to that

Iggy Pope
06-09-2018, 08:41 AM
You are totally tight Easter Rising it never fails to amaze me the excuses people come up with to avoid joining HSL yet they will be the first to moan when the yams steal a march on us

Freudian slip?

Chuck Rhoades
06-09-2018, 01:01 PM
HSL,

Can you get a ownership clock added to your website and this title thread so we can see ownership increasing weekly - helps with positive momentum. Works well with ST sales and dot count activity.

CropleyWasGod
06-09-2018, 01:29 PM
HSL,

Can you get a ownership clock added to your website and this title thread so we can see ownership increasing weekly - helps with positive momentum. Works well with ST sales and dot count activity.The ownership only increases when shares are issued by the Club. From memory, that's dependent on the frequency of the Board meetings to approve the issues.

Although a clock is a good idea, it wouldn't be moving as quickly as you would like.

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BishopstonHibby
06-09-2018, 06:47 PM
My uncle (Pars fan) says Dunfermline get about £200,000 a year from fans who contribute to their Centenary Club Lifeline initiative. They have about 1,000 subscribers contributing £20 a month, with about a quarter of what’s put in coming back in prizes.


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Golden Bear
06-09-2018, 07:19 PM
My uncle (Pars fan) says Dunfermline get about £200,000 a year from fans who contribute to their Centenary Club Lifeline initiative. They have about 1,000 subscribers contributing £20 a month, with about a quarter of what’s put in coming back in prizes.


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Now we're talking!

BILLYHIBS
06-09-2018, 09:36 PM
That’s almost a week now. We’ve all signed up! Do we have enough to get Scott Allan to sign a precontract in January yet? :thumbsup:

kennyh
07-09-2018, 02:48 PM
I had to cancel my subscription last year when finding cash for other things, all good now so back on board.


Any chance that everyone entering the ground for a number of consecutive matches are given a leaflet/application explaining what the key factors are behind HSL and pointing fans to the areas where they can hand in application forms or come and ask any questions.

I have seen a desk in the FF Lower at game with two people standing there but without advertising what HSL was at the time I doubt the uptake was very high but it doesn't mean it shouldn't be tried again. That was a good while ago and I am sure that more fans now know about HSL and how important it will become in months and years ahead especially as there has been no significant drop off in Yams paying in so they are possibly only a year away from having a huge financial advantage.

NAE NOOKIE
08-09-2018, 12:50 PM
Its good to see a few folk joining or re joining HSL as a result of this thread. For my part I'm with a lot of folk in that I'm not too bothered about the actual share ownership angle, I'll just keep the contributions going for as long as I can, it cant but make a difference to Hibs and if and when HSL get to the over 25% ownership the fact that actual Hibs fans will be in a position to safeguard the club against anybody trying to asset strip it cant be a bad thing.

As for overall fan ownership, I still have to say I remain to be convinced it will be all positive. Especially in the absence of any information from HSL or the Easter Road board regarding the future running of the club.

hibbydad
08-09-2018, 01:05 PM
Nae Nookie I don't think total fan ownership is a good thing. We need to keep room for the possibility of a major investor coming in. At the same time we need to keep this thread going in the hope that more people will be persuaded to join HSL

NAE NOOKIE
08-09-2018, 02:05 PM
Nae Nookie I don't think total fan ownership is a good thing. We need to keep room for the possibility of a major investor coming in. At the same time we need to keep this thread going in the hope that more people will be persuaded to join HSL

My thoughts exactly ….. I know I've flogged this to death on here, but IMO it bares repeating. Individuals or businesses looking to pump money into football clubs usually do so knowing there will be little or no profit in it for them in monetary terms, the main attraction is in being able to say they own it …. if we remove that incentive it vastly reduces the prospect that one day we might be able to attract an owner willing to invest in the club and the team on the park.

That is why I feel having enough of the club in supporters hands to ensure we have a veto on sale of its assets and infrastructure is the ideal scenario.

In the same ballpark is the question of what will happen to STF's shareholding when nature inevitably takes its course …. if his family lacks the enthusiasm for the club and football in general that was the openly professed situation he was in when he saved us then what happens to it? Held in trust by some anonymous firm of solicitors or trustees who have absolutely no emotional attachment to the on field fortunes of the club? That idea does not fill me with hope for the future in all honesty.

Without giving anything away I have had an assurance that things are in hand, but as a fan of this club, not to mention one of its many shareholders, I do feel the time is approaching where Hibs have at least a moral responsibility to give us some idea of what the future direction of it will be, IE how will it be run and how it proposes to attract major outside investment …. fan ownership or not its my view that cutting off the possibility, no matter how remote, of outside investment in the form of unearned income isn't the best starting point for a new era at any football club.

hibbydad
08-09-2018, 04:18 PM
I agree totally Nae Nookie.I have also heard assurances all will be well whenSTF goes. We must continue to flog this issue to death as we need as many subscribers as possible for HSL

Rocky
08-09-2018, 11:18 PM
I appreciate that the Aberdeen scheme has some issues in that the provision of benefits means that the subscription attracts vat plus there's the cost of providing those benefits in the first place. However I think there's an opportunity in creating a link to Hibs TV for HSL members.

Hibs TV is interesting as it's essentially fixed cost but theoretically unlimited revenue. At the moment it's £5.99 for UK subscribers (I'm not talking about international subscribers as the dynamic is totally different for them).

I'd like to see HSL and Hibs TV do a detailed cost benefit analysis of what the impact would be of throwing in a Hibs TV subscription for free for people who donate above a certain amount (£18.75 a month for argument's sake). Would it, for example, generate sufficient extra subscribers to mitigate the VAT cost (which I assume would be £1.20 per subscriber given that published cost of Hibs TV is £5.99).

I don't really understand the tax implications, but it seems to me that Hibs TV is essential zero marginal cost per subscriber so there's potentially something to work with here.

Not to mention that I sometimes feel like a bit of a tube chucking £18.75 at the club every month for nothing and still not having access to the various interviews / replays etc that go out on Hibs tv.

hibbydad
09-09-2018, 07:32 AM
You shouldn't feel a tube Rocky your £18.75 like mine is going to help improve the playing squad. If only there was more of us

BILLYHIBS
09-09-2018, 08:05 AM
Tried to get one of my fellow HIBS diehard mates to join he been supporting HIBS for 60 years his excuse he been a ST holder for that long and buys a Happy Hibby half time draw for 60 years and won diddly squat and the prize money been going down even though crowds going up.

Anyone remember the old guy that used to come round with the half time draw on a blackboard and everyone used to throw pies at it?

Or the half time scoreboard with the shaky numbers?

3pm
09-09-2018, 08:21 PM
Kenny MacAskill and Charlie Reid standing down as directors.

Lago
09-09-2018, 09:21 PM
Kenny MacAskill and Charlie Reid standing down as directors.
Why?

BSEJVT
10-09-2018, 07:26 AM
Why?

Done their time

HSL now require folk who will get their hands dirty and push it forward rather than figureheads.

I am sure both will remain available for soundbites when required and both have helped greatly in giving HSL some badly needed profile over their term, especially at the outset.

HSL has its critics but what it requires now more than anything are Hibs supporters with the time, commitment and skill set to make a difference in some of the areas highlighted as being deficient in the many HSL threads.

Only through getting the right people on board with the right skills can we drive it forward to where many of us want it to be.

Whether that involves buying shares or not, I think we can all agree that putting more monies in the managers budget is both desirable and essential if we are to compete with our peers going forward.

mutley
11-09-2018, 02:17 PM
Well, that's my first payment cleared out of my account, no turning back now!

I'm curious to how many others have signed up just because of this thread?

Franck Le God
11-09-2018, 04:40 PM
Well, that's my first payment cleared out of my account, no turning back now!

I'm curious to how many others have signed up just because of this thread?

I'll be signing up come pay day so that's at least two!

BILLYHIBS
11-09-2018, 04:48 PM
Well, that's my first payment cleared out of my account, no turning back now!

I'm curious to how many others have signed up just because of this thread?

:thumbsup:

tamig
11-09-2018, 06:19 PM
:thumbsup:

You do love a thumbs up Billy.

murray26
11-09-2018, 06:20 PM
I think it needs relaunched and fans opinions and ideas should be taken on board.. we have 1700 members ( I think) as usual with Hibs not a lot of transparency.. we have the potential to have a lot more than that so questions need answered as to why we haven’t..

BILLYHIBS
11-09-2018, 06:21 PM
You do love a thumbs up Billy.

:thumbsup:

Lemonade
11-09-2018, 08:18 PM
Well, that's my first payment cleared out of my account, no turning back now!

I'm curious to how many others have signed up just because of this thread?

Me.

Hibbyradge
11-09-2018, 09:01 PM
You do love a thumbs up Billy.

I've known a good few girls like that.

CropleyWasGod
11-09-2018, 09:22 PM
I've known a good few girls like that.I've known a bad few.

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Hibbyradge
11-09-2018, 09:38 PM
I've known a bad few.

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Semantics.

oldbutdim
11-09-2018, 09:54 PM
Semantics.

A bit of a sweeping statement.

Some of the catholic girls would make you blush, but I've never highlighted that until now.

HibsNibs
12-09-2018, 11:53 AM
Hi OfficialHSL,

Can you clear some space in your private messages folder so I can contact you.
I've tried the Contact form (a month ago) on your website & direct email (last week) and received no response.

(apologies for thread hijack)

spikey66
12-09-2018, 12:41 PM
That's me joined today, another member.

hibbydad
12-09-2018, 03:58 PM
That is good Spikey hopefully we can persuade many more

OfficialHSL
13-09-2018, 12:29 PM
Well, that's my first payment cleared out of my account, no turning back now!

I'm curious to how many others have signed up just because of this thread?


Me.


That's me joined today, another member.


Brilliant, welcome to the Evolution :wink:

Many of you may be interested in listening to the Podcast below from Scottish Supporters Network (Supporters Direct). It is very informative and may explain some of the questions/concerns that you may have with fan ownership.

There are a couple of points that have changed since March,

1 - To date, we have handed over almost £650,000 to the club.
2 - We are heading towards 17% shareholding.


Grab a cuppa and have a listen - http://www.scottishsupporters.net/3443-2/

21228

hibbydad
13-09-2018, 03:09 PM
Roughly how much is your monthly contribution official HSL

Lemonade
14-09-2018, 07:52 AM
Roughly how much is your monthly contribution official HSL

You can pay whatever you like.

hibbydad
14-09-2018, 09:15 AM
I meant monthly contribution to Hibs I am already contributing to HSL

happiehibbie
17-09-2018, 09:28 AM
just made a donation to HSL #GGTTH

Pagan Hibernia
17-09-2018, 03:34 PM
just made a donation to HSL #GGTTH

Great stuff :thumbsup:

Leithenhibby
17-09-2018, 06:15 PM
just made a donation to HSL #GGTTH

Excellent, it's the way to go.👍

NYHibby
18-10-2018, 10:35 AM
To update a previous post of mine, there are now 95.0m shares outstanding. "Others" now own a total of 35.4%. Of that, HSL owns around 12.5 percentage points (assuming all of the shares issued in 2017 were to HSL).


To update this old November 2017 post of mine, as of 27 September 2018, there are 98.6m shares outstanding. "Others" now own a total of 37.8%. Of that, HSL owns 15.7 percentage points.